https://twitter.com/wojespn/status/900121788876824576

I mean, they'd essentially end up with Wade, IT, and Crowder and lose just Kyrie who didn't want to be there anyway. For the C's it's not even a ton to get rid of and for Rie I like it. Ainges best move since...

Plus they have more picks then they need and c'mon, they were putting up more for PG no?

IT is a UFA so he's gone next season w Lebron leaving, Crowder is a solid role-player but won't move the needle for a rebuilding team.

But if I can have Kyrie and Tatum on a Brad-coached team? I'd go to church every Sunday.

but there are clear reasons why each side would want this deal.

www.engadgethd.com - the other stuff i'm looking at

https://twitter.com/mcten/status/900134744553385989

CLE will receive BKN 2018 1st round pick - unprotected - from BOS in the trade that is currently being discussed, league source tells ESPN

I'd argue it only makes sense if it's that pick + another. Like I said above, IT is a 1 year rental and Crowder doesn't move the needle for a rebuild...so you have to get multiple long-term assets in exchange for a star entering his prime who is on a cost controlled deal.

Clearly Ainge wanted Kyrie and his cost controlled deal badly. Regardless, good compromise with Zizic.

SOMETHING to sweeten the deal.

I get the reasoning behind it but I don't know if that's the case. Either way they get a replacement, another player for their rotation and a high pick here. Pretty good haul all things considered. I think George/Bledsoe or Booker/Bledsoe were better potential hauls but those were just rumors, I don't think the other parties ever went for them.

I get this deal from Boston's perspective but it's a lot to give up to basically stabilize production. Irving is going to give them what Thomas did last year more or less, but he is more reliable to keep doing it from both a talent perspective and a consistency perspective.

Lol cmon, this one is pretty obvious. It's a 1 year rental for contention, you get good to great future assets, and then significant cap relief as you rebuild...checks all the boxes for Cleveland.

LeBron or no LeBron, can they clear other contracts, etc.

>https://twitter.com/mcten/status/900134744553385989
>
>CLE will receive BKN 2018 1st round pick - unprotected - from
>BOS in the trade that is currently being discussed, league
>source tells ESPN

Wow...That's a BIG pick......Getting that for Kyrie is a coup.....

If so, I don't know if I'd do that trade if I were the Celts.

I'd be kinda iffy on including the '18 Brooklyn pick.

-----------
you think we playing chess, but i'm playing mad-making. Basaglia

I cannot WAIT to see Bron complaining about what fucking trash he's dealing with then tham games get tight and he can't depend on another scorer. CANNOT FUCKING WAIT.

cannot to see that goomba pout about not having the fuckin ball all the time. let's see how that works.

-----------
you think we playing chess, but i'm playing mad-making. Basaglia

let's see IT do all that 4th quarter shit with bron.

oh.

So if Lebron passes up the big shot you're mad but if Kyrie doesn't get the ball you're mad.

Make up your mind.

You really are dumb as fuck just to push your agenda huh?

when BRON *decides* IT ain't scoring all them damn points in the 4th this year, then what?

Cuz KYRIE *deciding* who gettin the ball in Boston and when he leads the league in 4th quarter scoring, then what?

and you keep fucking losing and you don't have the fucking integrity or good sense to jump off the fucking train.

he mo williams

he not an all-star type

he won't show in the playoffs

he won't mesh with Bron

he'll be third option behind Bron and Love

then, you REALLY showed your asses and reset shit, like "But he couldn't do all that before Bron got there"

fuckin hoes.

or pulling from one-off opinions.

this exchange was a bad look in fact the whole approach to this trade has been unusual other than a couple not-so-slick attempts to lower the bar considerably for kyrie and raise it slightly for the cavs.

Like, you are so blinded by unhealthy stannery you can't even process facts and logical arguments.

It is really weird. It is especially weird because Kyrie is good enough that you really don't have to do all this flailing about, deflection, and goal-post moving.

Yet, you do. Every time. Without fail.

It will never not be weird how emotionally invested you are in another man's perceived success.

You can't even process facts because of it.

you emotionally invested in my posting. THAT shit is weird to me.

and there's no fallacy in Bron decided who was doing what with the ball in the 4th, champ. trotting FGA attemps, which occur in ALL quarters, and STILL doesn't quantify touches and time of possession, was a useless exercise.

dumb ass.

4th quarter field goal attempts:

https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/shot_finder.cgi?request=1&match=single&year_id=2017&game_num_min=0&game_num_max=99&is_playoffs=N&q4=Y&q5=Y&time_remain_minutes=12&time_remain_seconds=0&time_remain_comp=le&order_by=fga

and Bron DECIDED who did what with the ball in the 4th was never more evident than when he hogged away the lead in the last 3 minutes of game 3, when he passed to korver and short-armed jumpers on 3 straight possessions.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afPxnbxYfWY

"oh, let me pull up with my same lame ass tight buttcheek jumper i been showing everytime there's a tight game in the finals"

"i can do this! i'mma try again."

"oh shit...lemme calculate...who our best shooter? boo beep bop beep...oh yeah...KORVER...here kyle...OH NO!!!"

"DAMN KD CAME THROUGHT....I'm SCARED...give it to kyrie now...fuck that shit. nobody ain't blaming me for this shit"

maybe he shoulda had 4 tries, instead of a nigga coming up empty tryna outsmart muhfuckas instead of just getting a FUCKING BUCKET.

fuck outta here, dogg!

Act like he didn't shoot that dumb ass step back 3 down 1 with 30 seconds left in game 3.

http://youtu.be/mDQ-nrH0H7E

and he was hurt in game 5 on a drive and came lame. wasn't effective after. but we covered that. melo shoulder mattered when he HOED up empty in the 4th MULTIPLE times against Indy in 2013, but THIS...this different.

i know.

He went 0-6. Maybe that would've been the time to pass the fuckin ball?

That stepback in game 3 wasn't a good shot either.

you'll be aight.

Bron decided who got the ball because Bron better with the ball. They both came up short in some key spots. Better team was going to win, regardless.

i knew when bron came back, BLAME was gon be a big part of the deal. it is deadass NEVER bron fault. never.

i swear if kyrie every averaged 17 in a finals like bron dude and came up THAT small, i would seriously leave the board. i'd be disgusted. i wouldn't deserve to say a word.

Kyrie needed to own the last 3-4 minutes of a game. Bron was supposed to do his all-around thing during that time to compliment it. Rebound, play D, pass the ball. When he did it in 2016, he held the warriors in check and Kyrie finished them off.

He completely changed the program this year cuz of KD. He took that matchup personal. But KD wasn't having it. He matched Bron play for play all game and then outplayed him at the end by making better decisions and clutch shots.

I laughed hard at your post because ALL of that happened and I was thinking exactly what you typed when it happened. I was telling the wifey Bron was shook after KD dropped a few buckets in his grill. We laughed.

Rie got his shot now man. Sit back, watch, enjoy and fight the good fight. My Bulls are tanking for Bagley/Porter so all I can do is hope Lauri looks something like Dirk and enjoy this epic drama y'all gonna have all season. lol

>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afPxnbxYfWY
>
>"oh, let me pull up with my same lame ass tight buttcheek
>jumper i been showing everytime there's a tight game in the
>finals"
>
>"i can do this! i'mma try again."
>
>"oh shit...lemme calculate...who our best shooter? boo beep
>bop beep...oh yeah...KORVER...here kyle...OH NO!!!"
>
>"DAMN KD CAME THROUGHT....I'm SCARED...give it to kyrie
>now...fuck that shit. nobody ain't blaming me for this shit"
>
>maybe he shoulda had 4 tries, instead of a nigga coming up
>empty tryna outsmart muhfuckas instead of just getting a
>FUCKING BUCKET.
>
>fuck outta here, dogg!

http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=8&topic_id=2552413&mesg_id=2552413&listing_type=search

^^^ couldn't stand the reign

after this year, Finals or not.

Not mad at either team.

Allows them to be competitive for 1 more year while getting 2 future assets and clearing their books (IT and Bron both UFA)

wow. really wish they had been able to give up the lakers/sac pick instead.

kyrie/hayward/jaylen/morris/horford

really resolves the problem next year when IT was up for a max contract but damn. damn.
-----------
you think we playing chess, but i'm playing mad-making. Basaglia

It's a deep deep draft.

I was impressed with some of their games last year.
They won't be worse than any of these teams:

Chicago
Orlando
Indiana
Dallas
Phoenix

in lottery odds --not actual lottery results

They are WAY better than BK.

And BK is still pretty terrible.

in that draft. so ready.
-----------
you think we playing chess, but i'm playing mad-making. Basaglia

>wow. really wish they had been able to give up the lakers/sac
>pick instead.
>
>kyrie/hayward/jaylen/morris/horford
>
>really resolves the problem next year when IT was up for a max
>contract but damn. damn.

You have to give up something to get something

maybe will supplant jaylen, but that year of nba play matters. by midseason he'll be getting 25-30 minutes. starter or not kinda irrelevant.

unless boston goes small and puts Tatum at the 4. but i don't think that's a smart move there.

-----------
you think we playing chess, but i'm playing mad-making. Basaglia

Will play off the bench and establish himself as a starter.

I'm pretty positive that after a year of contending again, he re-signs there.

we'll see how it all shakes out, we are talking about non-playoff teams. no idea how hard they will compete or if an injury will take them from a 30 to 20 win season or vice versa.

This makes the East less boring though. Cavs-Celtics in the playoffs will be a lot of fun.

they can get injuries and/or slumps like anyone else

and that mouse ain't gone do shit but get abused on D.. Even Steph gonna post his midget ass... lol
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<---- 5....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlgiritpmfo

=======================================

Well, I'll always have 2016

Not sweating it otherwise.

Raps will beat Celtics in the secound round.

Lol

Celtics lost

Even assuming Bron leaves, they get a likely high pick in 2018 and the chance to either build around that & IT or let IT go. All for a guy who made no secret of wanting out and it doesn't even hurt then for this year?

Great job by Dilbert's pool guy or whoever Cleveland's GM is now.

>Even assuming Bron leaves, they get a likely high pick in
>2018 and the chance to either build around that & IT or let IT
>go. All for a guy who made no secret of wanting out and it
>doesn't even hurt then for this year?
>
>Great job by Dilbert's pool guy or whoever Cleveland's GM is
>now.

It's a total rebuild at that point may as with let IT walk and trade Love

While Boston needed to get Crowder out of Brown and Tatum's way, he should be a great addition for Cleveland.

Kyrie is a better option long term for multiple reasons, but he wanted out anyway. Him and Thomas were basically on the same level last year. If Thomas is healthy and can come close to doing that again, Cleveland should still have a great chance to win the East.

Once LeBron leaves, it's a complete rebuild and they better hope Brooklyn doesn't show some life.

All for a guy who HAD to go this year

If it's #1? Win for Cavs.
If it's lower than, say, 7? Or if it's lower than the Celtics' highest pick? Win for Celtics.

the homie (c)Bomani

https://twitter.com/Steve_R_Walker/status/900143695600680960?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet

Celtics don't have Avery, Crowder, or I.T.?

They're kinda creampuffs now.

http://www.newnownext.com/wp-content/uploads/backlot/2012/12/tumblr_lz8qwgLE5w1qfoe0po1_500.gif

just shut up. he gettin 40+ for the whole series. Period.

He putting up 35/18/8/5 all series man. And B.B. getting 40.

https://twitter.com/HotFiyaStarter/status/883383452816560128

Stop reaching.

They'd of course get an amazing return even with Bron on a rental and next year should be a deep draft.

He's likely to walk for nothing and they're evidently prepared for that.

The risk is willingly trading a top 3 all time player and the guy that brought a chip to CLEVELAND(!) when there is still a chance he could stay, meanwhile facing tremendous backlash from fans and putting incredible pressure on whoever the rerun ends up being...

...but if you take the emotion out of it, it makes sense.

It would take HUGE balls by this new GM plus Gilbert would never sign off on it, so there's no way it happens outside of Bron telling the Cavs privately he's out, which he'd never do.

But imagine the assets they'd get, plus dumping Love too.

If a rebuild is looking inevitable and the odds of another chip looking slim to none in the next few years, its a logical risk to take.

Ball size is irrelevant

they'd be better off

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<---- 5....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlgiritpmfo

=======================================

said it won't be looong
how bout robin lopez
we all know wade is gone

HOLYSHITTTT

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<---- 5....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlgiritpmfo

=======================================

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<---- 5....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlgiritpmfo

=======================================

Anyone who doesn't drift to sleep staring at his Kyrie ceiling poster knows the Cavs won this deal.

They gave up their heart & soul, Jae, and a prized "asset" for...a-slightly-more-talented-than-IT-chucker?


Oh, and I guess Hayward won't sweat any hair gel in his eyes as he watches Irving go for 40 every night.

Dude is going to f*ck around and put up lower numbers than in Utah.


LOL Ainge LOL


Where is McHale when you need him to bend over?

When the Cavs looking at drafting fucking Nick Richard at #8 or some shit (because Brooklyn not gon be worse than like 10 teams...watch...that's what Ainge weight...Brooklyn pick or Lakers pick...East or West trash team), then we gon see.

the end game is BUILDING to compete with the Warriors. Celtics got better. Cavs made a lateral move...AT BEST....for one measly ass season, because Bron is out.

it's clear you niggas ain't considered shit and just ran up in here flapping your fuckin teeth padders. check the draft assets. boston is SET, with a 25 year-old PG that Stevens can mold and help reach another level.

oh, i know...he win't reach another level. only steph, lowry, russ, wall, IT, Conley can get better after 25.

y'all so fuckin mad.

Either way...

My point (and others, I'm sure) the Celts could have put together a much BETTER contender than this.

They had all these pieces...all this cap room...and blew it all on Hayward and Irving.

L O L

Who are they going to guard?


Oh wait, your goal is second place and you stan harder for a pretty good career more than anyone we have ever seen.

too much in the world to be mad at other than sports, dog.


But, we can all see you shook.

No hiding behind Bron now. No deflecting.


None of that.


Your man crush is the man on a legit contender now.

He was traded for someone you consider vastly inferior, correct?


So the Celts should run it. Right up until the finals. No moving your goal post.

This is what I'm saying.

You are so emotionally wrapped up in how folks perceive Kyrie, you talk straight nonsense and this board lets you get away with it.

You predicting finals right today or no?

OR


Is losing to Bron, who then loses to GSW, is a W for you?


Oh wait, you're banking on a Horford/Hayward future? hahahahaha


And you are in here big upping the GM???


Is McHale around to fold for him and I don't know about it?


Ainge just blew his summer on walking hair gel and your chucking young legend.


Unless there are other ex-Celts out there I don't know about waiting to hook this weasel up, ya'll ain't going further.

Congratulations...?

"Chess" lol lol

Enjoy your new Celts gear.

WHY in the blue fuck did we have to trade Ky to Boston?

*looks at haul*

Fuck this trade because IT is a rental, that center is redundant given our roster, Crowder is cool, and that first round pick is a given who we gave up.

I'd rather have Jayson Tatum, Crowder, and the 1. We got fucked and Boston is now coming out of the east. I have zero confidence in contract year Bron doing his best to remain in Cleveland. These are the type of BS decisions your team makes when your owner is a Trump supporter.

All he had to do was keep Griff and none of this shit would've happened. Keep Griff, Ky stays, and we get PG or someone else. Instead we fire Griff, trade Ky, sign DRose, and get a bag of flashlights for Ky.

It wasn't supposed to end like this. I am not overreacting because y'all don't realize how bad Ky about to wreck shit with Brad Stevens. The criteria for Ky's success without Bron still stands.

all these fuckin teams tanking. bulls, pacers, orlando, hawks, knicks, pistons...

that's just the east.

that pick will be low lottery.

except they not....they wont win hardly any...they got NOBODY...are u freaking serious?

given our roster". You mean the great, Walter Tavares? Dude, they list Love, TT and Channing as centers. Why you think they were so hurt about Bogut's leg exploding...and worked out Larry Sanders??? Who gives a shit if IT is a rental? You pick up Wade sometime around January like everyone knows they will. You got Rose coming off the bench. Crowder is a big, physical wing that can hit threes. Cleveland is winning the East...stop it with this shit, man. They can now throw more dudes at Golden State...and that's what it's all about.

I think there are a lot of assumptions in here about Cleveland's end of the deal. Boston got the concrete chip but they paid a pretty steep price for stability. Then again they had too many assets if anything, plus they got an extra pick that made this one potentially expendable. Overall their offseason has been great. Cleveland needed a way to get deeper and restock a future asset, they did it, also at a high price. I think they got what they needed here. Bigger picture though, Boston wins this summer because net draft picks they are even (and potentially ahead in terms of position), they got Hayward who is an even better signing than he appears IMHO and now they get a guy who can do what Thomas did last year for several years.

now, everybody sittin here tryna cyse a pick that's gon be colin sexton or some shit.

that said if they had to make a move, given this situation, this one is OK. i wasn't really referring to you with the mad comment, but thanks for lumping yourself in.

Great trade for everyone except the other teams in the east.

www.engadgethd.com - the other stuff i'm looking at

sometimes we see trades where one side wins the trade in a strict sense. like they get more out of the deal, but the other team gets exactly what they need and they win the trade bigger picture.

that is probably what will happen here. if this was a fantasy trade last season, makes zero sense for boston, but IRL they solidify themselves now and going forward. they had such an accumulation of assets that they could pay a lot to tailor things to their need.

if cleveland loses IT in a year it will be a huge win for boston.

that's their win/loss situation.

if LeBron leaves I assume they cut IT loose anyway and go into full teardown mode.

www.engadgethd.com - the other stuff i'm looking at

the pick is a wild card, who knows if the nets will suck as bad this year and they also have some suck competition still. sixers and lakers may not tank as hard but teams like indy went into rebuilds.

(assuming he wanted to stay)

but a year from now, is he really pulling much extra over the (decent first rounder) pick that outweighs having crowder now

www.engadgethd.com - the other stuff i'm looking at

..lol.


*skatin' the rings of saturn*


..and miles to go before i sleep...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<---- 5....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlgiritpmfo

=======================================

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0t5meTghXog

that "mamba man" part is kinda funny

just random and outta nowhere

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DH6I1Q-WsAA34-f.jpg:large

And it might start this year.

Kyrie/Smart/Rozier
Hayward/Bird/Nader (though I'd bet Rozier is the backup PG and Smart as the back up SG)
Brown/Tatum
Morris/Yabusele
Horford/Baynes

Lakers pick, Kings pick

Lakers pick will probably be top 5-7 so they are probably going big with one of the young C's coming out unless they luck up with 1-2. That will set them up for the future well. You're probably looking at Kyrie/Hayward/Tatum/Horford/Bamba or Ayton or Bagley if they're lucky. And they 3-4 years before they have to make a hard financial decision but even then, Horford is 30+, so they'll have some wiggle room.

The Cavs on the other hand should just go all in on 2017/18 and then prepare (well) for the dumpster fire of it's aftermath.

IT/Rose
Wade (picked up after buy out)/JR/Korver
Bron/Shumpert/RJ
Love/Crowder/Jeff Green(lol)
Tristan/Zizic/Frye

This team is deeper than last years and probably get along better with Wade+Bron. They probably edge the C's in 6-7 games and lose to the Warriors in 5-6 games.

Next season:
PG?!?!?!
JR/!?!?!
Crowder/!?!??!?!
Love/?!?!?!
Tristan/Zizic

Maybe you move Tristan for picks and draft a PG in next summer's draft? My assumption is, if the BK pick is top 5 they are going big anyway.

big improvement better after 25...

Lowry
Steph
Conley
Wall
Russ


I could go one. Kyrie been giving ALL of them the business and already got a ring and had his championship mettle tested repeatedly and SHOWED every time.

and now he gets to be coached by a top 3 coach.

they sooooooo mad.

Rie gonna hit his prime, we know. Barring injury, he coming.

The scary part to me is Tatum+Brown+Lakers pick.

If they get Bagley...maaaan, listen.

And even if they don't, the kings might still suck in 2019 so Ainge get another shot at it. Or don't let something stupid happen like NO suck, Cuz leave and they blow it up and trade Brow to the C's for future assets.

Bruh.

So first class org with keen/smart front office, top young coach (top 3 by your assertion) and tons of talent around him.

Rie got his shot. Now he gotta deliver. But you know, if he don't blow by the time he 29...they coming for you B.

he better than mo williams

he become a perennial all-star when MOST dudes on here said he'd make about TWO.

be became one of the best playoff performers when MOST dudes laughed and said he wasn't ready for that level.

why would i worry about how good he'll become under such a great coach?

another year.

Instead of have to make a decision on giving a talented but flawed guard a max deal next summer they get to do it a year later. When Horford's deal is up also. They'll already have an overpaid Heyward about to turn 30. Tatum will be ready to bounce.

when Hayward is 30, the cap will have risen and horford will be a great 1 year trade option if needed. or he'll still be a valuable contributor.

but by then, hayward and horford should be options 4 and 5 on a team w/ Rie, Tatum, Brown as their core three + whoever they get with that pick.

fuego indeed

at least we can all rest easy knowing Boston fans will react coolly and calmly when Horford's numbers crater further and Stephen A. starts calling Tatum a bust cuz he can't get more than 6 shots a game.

you mad. and dame never winning anything.

He didn't show any offensive skill expansion of his game and reverted to relying on his athleticism. It's not going to matter much in the next 2 years bc playing for Boston allows him to play to his strengths (defensive focus, transition and cutting offensively plus set jumpers) but if he's asked to expand his offensive game, he hasn't shown much in that regard.

the defender part is pretty much a given. as long as he's not creating his own shot too often--and he wouldnt with kyrie + tatum there with him, he should be quality.

-----------
you think we playing chess, but i'm playing mad-making. Basaglia

Boston's "big 3" with Heyward and Horford as 4th and 5th options is kind of comical lol

.

To say IT and Kyrie are both "talented but flawed guards," eh, i mean it's true in a threshold sense but given the choice between the two anyone would take irving. and i say that as a guy who isn't a huge fan of his and really likes IT, nothing sentimental or agendafied there

>And it might start this year.
>
>Kyrie/Smart/Rozier
>Hayward/Bird/Nader (though I'd bet Rozier is the backup PG and
>Smart as the back up SG)
>Brown/Tatum
>Morris/Yabusele
>Horford/Baynes
The Celtics have a FORMIDABLE starting lineup. However, their bench is weak. I wouldn't start Brown over Tatum, because I think Brown's pretty garbage. At best, he'll be an athletic wing that can't do anything but drive.
The Celtics lost most of their defensive players, so I don't think they'll be as tough as they were last year.

>Lakers pick, Kings pick
>
>Lakers pick will probably be top 5-7 so they are probably
>going big with one of the young C's coming out unless they
>luck up with 1-2. That will set them up for the future well.
>You're probably looking at Kyrie/Hayward/Tatum/Horford/Bamba
>or Ayton or Bagley if they're lucky. And they 3-4 years
>before they have to make a hard financial decision but even
>then, Horford is 30+, so they'll have some wiggle room.
If that's the case and the Lakers pick is that high, then I'll concede the first point. If not, I think Boston can be challenged.


>The Cavs on the other hand should just go all in on 2017/18
>and then prepare (well) for the dumpster fire of it's
>aftermath.
The Cavs are in win now mode. There's no excuse for Lebron (especially considering if Wade signs on). Dude has IT AND Rose (who had a solid year, eff the pundits), along with Kevin Love. At the very least, the roster he has now along with Wade should push GS to 6 games in a Finals matchup.


>IT/Rose
>Wade (picked up after buy out)/JR/Korver
>Bron/Shumpert/RJ
>Love/Crowder/Jeff Green(lol)
>Tristan/Zizic/Frye
>
>This team is deeper than last years and probably get along
>better with Wade+Bron. They probably edge the C's in 6-7
>games and lose to the Warriors in 5-6 games.
Agree

>Next season:
>PG?!?!?!
>JR/!?!?!
>Crowder/!?!??!?!
>Love/?!?!?!
>Tristan/Zizic
The good part of the trade is that the team can legit blow it up and rebuild very fast, and still have the 2018 pick.

>Maybe you move Tristan for picks and draft a PG in next
>summer's draft? My assumption is, if the BK pick is top 5
>they are going big anyway.
Agreed

>The Celtics have a FORMIDABLE starting lineup. However, their
>bench is weak. I wouldn't start Brown over Tatum, because I
>think Brown's pretty garbage. At best, he'll be an athletic
>wing that can't do anything but drive.

he can defend. that's what he can do right now in a roster that just needs him to defend and drive.

>The Celtics lost most of their defensive players, so I don't
>think they'll be as tough as they were last year.

^why the brown start makes sense. Brown and Smart are their two lockdown defenders now. And the Cs generally only had two lockdown defenders on the court at any one time. That can still be the case (Rozier has potential) and Theis is a better backup defender, probably, than any other C they had last year. Plus, Rie's a bad defender, but IT is 5'8 and a bad defender.

Yabusele and Ojeyele can be defensive specialists also.



-----------
you think we playing chess, but i'm playing mad-making. Basaglia

That's Jaylen's strength right now.

And when they wanna go heavy on O, Tatum is right there behind him.

Smh

On top of alladat, we still don't know what those other two (especially Yabusele) are going to be. If they do ANYTHING...ugh.

Damn Danny Ainge.

Only Philly has a chance of catching up IMO

But he C's have a head start on Philly and less injury concerns.

I do think both are going in the right direction now but the Bucks have been known to reverse course, get cheap, etc. Sixers' main concern is the health of their players

Top 10 players change everything. Let Giannis get a little better and Bari come back strong, and they'll be a handful for anybody.

I do agree Boston looks most likely to win the East in 2 years, and that if brown and Tatum develop, they match up as well with the Dubs as anyone.

Marcus Smart's a role player and can come off the bench. Play Gordo at 2 and teach the two young bols, and you can switch everything 2-4

Rie/Brown/Hayward/Morris/Horford

or, if the other team is big

Rie/Brown/Hayward/Horford/Baynes

smart first guard off the bench, tatum first wing off the bench.

Dudes gotta play to get better. That's going to be difficult with Hayward getting 34 or so, and it's much easier to manage if you get both out there at the beginning of the game.

Me personally, I'd rather bring a vet like Morris off the bench, because their egos handle it better. If you want to switch it up in the playoffs because he gives you the best starting 5, cool, but for the regular season I'm playing the young guys

brother

Hayward and Stephens will be the face of the franchise

After going full diva in CLE, 'Rie will be the scapegoat for any wrongs

...and if he ends up sitting out big chunks of the season...

Yeah, I don't think this works out well for 'Rie in BOS

Just my opinion

Watching Bron defend him will be fun

'Rie will be in Ainge's office crying about...why they don't like me...soon enough.

>Hayward and Stephens will be the face of the franchise

you mad, dogg.

man, people really trying to spin this like it's bad for Boston after years of yelling at us to trade our picks. If he doesn't reup in a couple years you can come back and yell at me, until then this is a win.

>Watching Bron defend him will be fun

like he defended Steph?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ClLAQVNFxQ8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Wdi1c5noDs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPsTOwkU_8k

Kyrie is gonna try to All-Star Game out-dribble dude, and if he sinks that shot after all that dribbling? Boston Garden would go absolutely fucking bananas.

THIS IS GONNA BE SO GOOD.

the EC Finals.


Anti-gentrification, cheap alcohol & trying to look pretty in our twilight posting years (c) Big Reg


Just trying to share the world - www.JySbr.net

Finals.

It will explode again whether the EC Finals team wins or loses against GS.

This is great for the boards.

Anti-gentrification, cheap alcohol & trying to look pretty in our twilight posting years (c) Big Reg


Just trying to share the world - www.JySbr.net

but with this trade and the fact Avery Bradley isn't on the Celts anymore, does this kill the little rivalry Boston had brewing with the Wizards? I'm far to lazy to look at the Boston roster right now, but I have the feeling a good majority of the Boston players that had problems with the Wizards aren't on the roster anymore.

new team, not something you see often from a *edit* regular season conference champion. I wouldn't be surprised at all if they took a step back.

you won't find another team as half-decent as the Wizards so content with just staying pat at every turn. They don't even seem to care that they're pseudo-close to going to the Finals. I'd bet they didn't even inquire about Paul George. They're cheap. They're uninspired. Their only competition is Atlanta for the "how well we can we appear to try hard while treading water" crown.

morris twin.

I'm not a Wizards fan, but the little rivalry they had with the Celts provided some level of interest in the playoffs last year when things were otherwise dead and boring in the East.

so yeah they there waas dislike, but i don't think alot of people cared bc the wizards just aren't that good. People ain't tuning in bc something might pop off.

& try to convince yourself that Tim Hardaway Jr is somebody.

Lol 'you mad'exhibit A

interesting to see the Morris twins go at each other on contenders

Especially if the rumors of Dwayne Wade joining the Cavaliers turn out the be true. LeBron, D-Wade, Isiah Thomas, Derrick Rose, and JR Smith to round things out. What can do wrong?

I almost wish it was possible for Ray Allen to re-join the Celtics for a veteran's minimum contract towards the end of the season just to make things completely insane. Now THAT would be lit, as the kids say.

with dudes that are retired like him lol

>I almost wish it was possible for Ray Allen to re-join the
>Celtics for a veteran's minimum contract towards the end of
>the season just to make things completely insane. Now THAT
>would be lit, as the kids say.

A rivalry between them has always been overshadowed by Bib Brother Bron but I think it will now bloom since they're both the best players on their respective team and they're jockeying for near to mid-term dominance in the east.

I don't make that trade if I'm the Warriors either.

No need to mess with a winning formula.

Kyrie is better off in Boston.

>I don't make that trade if I'm the Warriors either.
>
>No need to mess with a winning formula.
>
>Kyrie is better off in Boston.

This trade makes me sad
But that trade would make me PISSED.

anywhere but to there or Miami, FOH.

they lost 2 starters & a lotto pick.

I guess Ainge really didn't believe in IT...but at least IT has been to the playoffs sans LeBron.



Anti-gentrification, cheap alcohol & trying to look pretty in our twilight posting years (c) Big Reg


Just trying to share the world - www.JySbr.net

and that pick better be top 2. or they better flip it for a star.

on having to not give I.T. that bread. Dude wasn't taking no hometown discount. Any ideas of that got deaded when he showed up to the building rocking slides with a Brink's truck on them.

Kyrie is at least as good as IT (I say better, but not important) + below market value for extra time on contract + Jae was actually a logjam starter in the way of two top 5 picks from getting their minutes and was going to be disgrunted + the Cs really couldn't re-sign IT but they will easily be able to re-sign Kyrie while he's still in his prime + Kyrie's better than IT and less likely to have a serious injury problem in the future.

-----------
you think we playing chess, but i'm playing mad-making. Basaglia

they got a better player here and they got him for a minimum of two seasons, probably longer. crowder was going to see less minutes with the arrival of hayward and tatum. ultimately he needed to go in order for salaries to match. the pick may bite them but they have been playing with house money there, two lotto picks following playoff seasons, potentially a high pick this year or the following year with the swap down this year. this is an ainge move, stockpile by dicking teams over in small deals (or making the occasional fair one, like with philly) and then turn something loose for the big prize. for them to have kyrie and hayward instead of IT and crowder? plus expand brown's role and add tatum? that's an upgrade.

into his lap.

There was no way he was giving IT a $200+mil max deal he just had to figure out how to move the best player and heart & soul of a first place team and not have the fans completely revolt. Kyrie was the perfect solution, another similar star guard just as good if not better than IT, but 3 years younger and cost controlled for an extra year. If they believe in Jaylen and Tatum then Crowder had to go too. Cleveland was pushing hard for Tatum to be included in the deal so he had to throw in the pick as well.

So Danny was basically able to do something almost unheard of which was reboot and rebuilt a first place(but flawed) conference team on the fly. The Celtics may take small step back for a year or so but are better suited for the long haul. The consensus thinking among GM's around the league seems to be to basically punt for the next year or 2 while the Golden State juggernaut runs its course. The Boston fans will be patient because they have an exciting young player in Kyrie to go along with Heyward, the white star they've been thirsting for since Bird blew his back out 25 years.

>into his lap.

Ainge is a good GM, he has a clear but flexible approach. I don't get the backlash toward him, any other GM that could put together the big 3, hose the Nyets, make a great outside the box coaching hire and now land the top FA by a mile and an all-star point guard in the same offseason is a good GM, period.

>There was no way he was giving IT a $200+mil max deal he just
>had to figure out how to move the best player and heart & soul
>of a first place team and not have the fans completely revolt.
>Kyrie was the perfect solution, another similar star guard
>just as good if not better than IT, but 3 years younger and
>cost controlled for an extra year. If they believe in Jaylen
>and Tatum then Crowder had to go too. Cleveland was pushing
>hard for Tatum to be included in the deal so he had to throw
>in the pick as well.

Yup, exactly, where were Crowder's minutes? A 15-20 minute a night guy now with diminishing prospects in the future. I think had this deal not come up, they would have ridden out IT and probably moved him after he signed his next deal. Great timing for them for Kyrie to tell Cleveland to fuck off though, that part was certainly fortunate, and their newfound depth at the three (wouldn't have happened if they didn't trade down, which also made this pick expendable) let them match contracts without losing anything significant from their rotation.

>So Danny was basically able to do something almost unheard of
>which was reboot and rebuilt a first place(but flawed)
>conference team on the fly. The Celtics may take small step
>back for a year or so but are better suited for the long haul.
>The consensus thinking among GM's around the league seems to
>be to basically punt for the next year or 2 while the Golden
>State juggernaut runs its course. The Boston fans will be
>patient because they have an exciting young player in Kyrie to
>go along with Heyward, the white star they've been thirsting
>for since Bird blew his back out 25 years.

That's the thing, too, they managed to get two lotto picks who don't have any real pressure on them thanks to this situation and the two stars they added don't have a ton of mileage and are arguably still improving. Pretty impressive. I think Hayward is underrated if anything, he is not a Kevin Love stat-stuffer type, he is efficient and still improving because he was a relative late-comer to basketball. Irving will need to make some adjustments but he has more than enough talent to thrive here. Nobody ever accused him of a lack of confidence. The only issue I see with Boston in their bigs, giving Horford another contract would probably be a mistake and they don't have a ton of talent there. Then again they have Brown and Tatum in the fold and if both pan out they could move one for a big.

alladat.

>they lost 2 starters & a lotto pick.

after all, they are replacing one of those guys with the guy they got back, who's younger and better.

and the other guy plays the same position as the all star that they just gave $128m, and the two guys that they took with back to back #3 picks in the last 2 drafts.

so they upgraded both of those positions, at essentially the cost of zizic and the unprotected 1st. which prolly isn't going to fall as high as some ppl seem to think it will.

ainge did give up a lot, but he's moving IT and the bklyn pick both at the peak of their respective values. this trade makes a lot of sense, for both sides.

they didn't "lose" IT/Bradley/Crowder, they reconfigured with Kyrie/Hayward/Tatum. Also they had gained a lotto pick (likely) with the trade down for Tatum. I still think Fultz will be better but having had IT and now having Kyrie that seems moot. It'll only really burn them if Jackson or some other guy taken below 3 turns out to be significantly better than Tatum. A+ offseason for Ainge, no way around it.

i don't deny his flaws and i've talked about them here plenty, but dude's been one of the very best execs in the L for a decade plus. inarguably.

i mean, all he did this offseason was nail the draft, nail free agency, and nail the trade market. what more do muhfuckas want?

How do you read it?

1) Nothing to do with it, acquiescing Kyrie's trade demand

2) Desperate stab to get deeper and keep LeBron

3) Move looking toward the future either by cutting salary and adding a pick or losing LeBron but keeping IT

1. Kyrie wasn't happy, so trading him before the season starts and it becomes an "issue" in the locker room was imperative.

2. Hope that adding IT and Crowder puts them in a strong position to get back to the Finals. Even if they lose, the front office and Gilbert go to 'Bron after the season is over and say, "Hey, we made it this far AGAIN but with IT instead of Irving, and we're bring in (potentially) a top 2 pick next year (Obviously they gotta hope the Nets are trash this season). Come on back and we can do this."

3. If 'Bron does decide to leave, then they still have IT's Bird rights and a potential top pick. That's something to build around.

as far as indicating lebron's future

Love and everyone else goes on the trade block.


as far as whether or not he's leaving, I don't think they know so they tried to prepare for either situation, which is really all they can do.

www.engadgethd.com - the other stuff i'm looking at

Ideally if LeBron left they would have had Kyrie to build around or to trade in the final year of his deal to kickstart a rebuild. I think if LeBron leaves and Thomas is still willing to re-sign, they have to sign him and then probably trade him early in the contract. They can't lose him for nothing here, especially with cap relief being kind of marginal ($12M or whatever). I don't think they can prepare but yeah if LeBron or both guys leave then I think a total teardown would be in order.

LeBron lost a little leverage with this trade because the fear of life after LeBron is what's motivating Gilbert to pay these luxury taxes.

Now, if the Nets are as bad as expected, Gilbert has a decent contingency plan if he doesn't feel like bending to LeBron's will anymore.

I guess I just think Irving is overrated. He's never been on a winning team without Lebron. I think this is an absolute disaster for Boston. Having one of the best coaches might prevent this from completely falling apart....but their overall situation and future prospects this time last year were WAY more promising than now imo. They'll look back on this as setting the franchise back half a decade. They should have kept all the picks and set their sights on 3 to 4 years from now instead of cashing in prematurely.

Cleveland gets another year with Lebron and now is in a great position to rebuild next summer with picks and prospects and tons of cap room. My guess is this will go down as one of the most lopsided trades in the modern era. And they got this much return with no leveredge...having a player publically demand a trade usually never gets this much return.

Not as good pg, fringe starter, 1st rounder.

https://t.co/TahUQgH74r

IT helped recruit Horford + Heyward and brought y'all to the brink of the ECF.

Shout out to the organization for the proper smear campaign:

https://nesn.com/2017/08/nba-rumors-some-celtics-players-werent-that-fond-of-isaiah-thomas/

they can/should be better. regardless of its truth, no need to let that get out. dude played for the team right after his sister died. FOH.

-----------
you think we playing chess, but i'm playing mad-making. Basaglia

>https://t.co/TahUQgH74r
>
>IT helped recruit Horford + Heyward and brought y'all to the
>brink of the ECF.
>
>Shout out to the organization for the proper smear campaign:
>
>https://nesn.com/2017/08/nba-rumors-some-celtics-players-werent-that-fond-of-isaiah-thomas/

Evan Turner an others are saying that's BS...:
https://www.celticsblog.com/2017/8/24/16195532/evan-turner-isaiah-thomas-jae-crowder-nba-blockbuster-trade-kyrie-irving-cleveland-cavs-lebron-james

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2729195-jared-sullinger-kelly-olynyk-deny-isaiah-thomas-disliked-by-celtics-teammates


also doubt many fans are burning jerseys. They are stupid if they are, probably just one idiot going viral. He got traded ffs

>also doubt many fans are burning jerseys. They are stupid if
>they are, probably just one idiot going viral. He got traded
>ffs

Boston fans are plenty classless for other reasons, but they're also sad IT is leaving.

Rivals as in they are currently both competing for the same thing, and nobody is rebuilding. As opposed to the Clippers-Rockets trade because the Clippers are clearly trying to rebuild for the long term.

The only way this makes sense to me is if both sides really feel like they are getting one over on the other team. I can't imagine doing a trade with a rival that you feel in your mind is a fair trade.

I think Boston won this trade, if I were to pick. I am big on Kyrie, and I also don't like giving big money to diminutive players, which I imagine Cleveland is prepared to give to Isaiah, especially if Lebron sticks around (in order to keep the unit together).
______________________________
http://i.imgur.com/v2ye7l2.jpg

tough spot and had what each other needed.

Cleveland didn't want an ugly situation to drag into the season. Kyrie made his demand AFTER other star players that were on the market like Jimmy Butler and Paul George had already been moved.

Boston was most likely going to let IT walk in free-agency next year and piss off a lot of their fans. Landing Kyrie was the perfect solution for them.

______________________________
http://i.imgur.com/v2ye7l2.jpg

www.engadgethd.com - the other stuff i'm looking at

https://www.boston.com/sports/boston-celtics/2017/08/22/just-4-celtics-remain-from-the-eastern-conference-finals-team-heres-where-the-others-are-now

Just 4 Celtics remain from the Eastern Conference finals team. Here’s where the others are now.

By John Waller August 22, 2017
The Celtics may want to play the name game — and perhaps a few icebreakers — before the start of the 2017-2018 season.

As Boston Globe reporter Adam Himmelsbach pointed out, only four players remain from the team’s Eastern Conference finals team three months ago, and 11 are now gone after Tuesday night’s blockbuster deal.

The latest trade sent Isaiah Thomas, Jae Crowder, Ante Zizic, and the Nets’ 2018 first-round pick to the Cavaliers for Kyrie Irving.

The deal left center-forward Al Horford, forward Jaylen Brown, and guards Marcus Smart and Terry Rozier as the only current Celtics to have experienced the Game 5 loss to Cleveland.

Here’s where the other 11 went (Zizic wasn’t on the roster):

Isaiah Thomas and Jae Crowder: Traded to the Cavaliers.
Avery Bradley: Traded to the Pistons.
Gerald Green: Free agent.
Jonas Jerebko: Signed with the Jazz.
Amir Johnson: Signed with the 76ers.
Jordan Mickey: Signed with the Heat.
Kelly Olynyk: Signed with the Heat.
James Young: Free agent.
Tyler Zeller: Free agent.
Demetrius Jackson: Signed a two-way contract with the Rockets.

season

They won an emaciated East in spite of themselves and were nearly embarrassed, then summarily humbled, in the playoffs. That roster wasn't doing shit ever.

>They won an emaciated East in spite of themselves and were
>nearly embarrassed, then summarily humbled, in the playoffs.
>That roster wasn't doing shit ever.

that by definition is a contender.

>>They won an emaciated East in spite of themselves and were
>nearly embarrassed, then summarily humbled, in the playoffs.
>That roster wasn't doing shit ever.

many people picked the Cavs. This isn't difficult dude.

"Best" is a pretty unflexible word.


~~~~~~~~~
"This is the streets, and I am the trap." � Jay Bilas
http://www.popmatters.com/pm/archive/contributor/517
Hip Hop Handbook: http://tinyurl.com/ll4kzz

Majority of folks had cleveland as being better than Boston even though boston had a better record so no, best in east doesn't necessarily mean contender.

that team was just "pretty good".

that about it © hov

By definition it does.....Adding "equal" is the catch....U can be a contender and be a lesser team....

there were 5 better teams out west, along with cleveland and imo toronto.

all teams with 2+ all-star/all-league caliber guys. celts had 1, and he's the same height as gwyneth paltrow.

team wasn't winning / contending for shit, breh. they should've lost in round 1.

best in the east meant they had the best regular season record.
Contender is in reference to the playoffs.

So best of the east does not mean they are a contender. It means they were the best team in the regular season.

you know that murph

and now they're acting brand new. Even Celts fans weren't bold enough to predict anything out of them come playoff time.

You're all over the place. You keep hemming and hawing about the chemistry of a team that you agree overachieved. They needed more talent and they got it, end of story.

and were beaten pretty badly in the ECF, how do you see them overachieving MORE with the same squad the next season? You see how that doesn't add up, right?

>and were beaten pretty badly in the ECF, how do you see them
>overachieving MORE with the same squad the next season? You
>see how that doesn't add up, right?


mf's wanna argue with me so bad they're making shit up lol

You're bad at logic, it's ok.

He don't even know what he believes at this point.

you are calling them contenders bc they had the best record and bc they made the ECF and then saying they had the best record bc the east was garbage.

So which one is it?

and favorite and are arguing just to argue like usual.

statistically they were the 7th or 8th best team in the league last year, and arguably the weakest #1 seed ever. they completely overachieved and prolly lose in round 1 if rondo doesn't get hurt.

absolutely no reason whatsoever for their higher-ups to be hesitant about tearing that team down and reshuffling the roster.

than if they got knocked out in round 1. That is NOT a contender lol

>statistically they were the 7th or 8th best team in the
>league last year, and arguably the weakest #1 seed ever. they
>completely overachieved and prolly lose in round 1 if rondo
>doesn't get hurt.
>
>absolutely no reason whatsoever for their higher-ups to be
>hesitant about tearing that team down and reshuffling the
>roster.

I agree with all that and at no point am I knocking what Danny did I have already said they are set up great for the future. I'm just pointing out the fact that it's rare for a playoff team to make wholesale changes like that. Throw out the word "contender" since y'all wanna get wrapped around the axle about such a subjective word lol.

Only a handful of GM's in the league have the balls and clout and job security to try something like this and Danny does.

And even still his ass was going to be over the barrel with the IT contract situation and Kyrie literally bailed him out lol.

most gms just wouldn't be in the position do.

they've been building for this for years. All that was missing was the superstar.

>most gms just wouldn't be in the position do.
>
>they've been building for this for years. All that was missing
>was the superstar.

Every GM doesn't have the job security to build something for years.

Not many are able to say, we have a playoff team but I'm going to blow it up so we can be good 2 or 3 years down the road.

>Not many are able to say, we have a playoff team but I'm going
>to blow it up so we can be good 2 or 3 years down the road.

Lol at blow it up. They have a better team today than they did last season

what's your point?
-----------
you think we playing chess, but i'm playing mad-making. Basaglia

if boston won last season it would be completely shocking. Hence they weren't contenders.

There was only 1 favorite last season GS
There were 2 other contenders San AN and Cle

Boston was the best of the rest with Houston aka good but not contenders.


you seem to be the only one confused lol

to your logic?

Ok thanks for another long ass drawn out argument over semantics lol.

I don't believe in Houston nor San an.

I don't think Bos is quite there yet, but maybe they are.

I'd still consider cle a contender bc of bron but who knows how that's gonna shake out.

But last season there was 3, and Boston wasn't one of them

they upgraded at 2 positions (PG, SF) at worst a wash at pf and let Bradley go to give minutes to Jaylen Brown lost a few role players but added a top 3 rookie.

They are def closer to a chip today then they were last season.

If you gave anyone the choice between the Celtics roster going into last year and what they have going into this one, everyone would pick the one with 'Rie, Hayward, Morris and Tatum. The one with the better, you know, TALENT.

They have upgraded MAJORLY. I think people are a little scared.

ppl saying they "took a step back" are smoking dust.

for the short term but are better set up for the future.

But this will be almost a completely different team with a completely different identity with people in new roles.

Kyrie will be without the great security blanket that is Lebron that makes up for so many shortcomings on both ends of the floor.

Heyward will be coming from the bleak NBA outpost of Utah to one of the storied franchises in the NBA under tremendously more fan & media scrutiny. Can he handle it?

I'm a huge Tatum fan but he's 19, its going to take a minute.

Is Marcus Morris really a starting PF on a contender averaging 5rpg and shooting 42% for his career?

IT, AB, and Crowder were their top 3 scorers last year, the points might be easy to replace but AB and Crowder were also their top 2 perimeter defenders, that won't be easy to replace.

There will be a ton of pressure on Stevens to pull this thing together.

sure.

they have a much better roster this year than last year. Will it work who knows? Time will tell. But are they better on paper...absolutely.

The GM did his job.

>sure.
>
>they have a much better roster this year than last year. Will
>it work who knows? Time will tell. But are they better on
>paper...absolutely.
>
>The GM did his job.

"on paper" they had no business winning the east and going to the conference finals but they did. Mainly because the top 3 guys that they got rid of overachieved.

the point is to construct a better team with pieces that fit together. they constructed a better team, but only time will tell will they fit together. If you scared to improve your squad bc of 'fit' then you'll never improve.

Like you said, players overachieved last season but they had no shot at winning a chip. They would still have no shot unless those players overachieved more than last year which is extremely unlikely.

defensive guards in the league, Crowder was one of the best 3&D guys in the league.

Who's their perimeter stopper now? Jaylen Brown? Who's defending opposing point guards? They have Smart off the bench but those starters are suspect...

much better than pointing out that there are only 4 guys left lol

>much better than pointing out that there are only 4 guys left
>lol


apparently not lol

they only have 4 people from last season like that general point means something. It doesn't.

Talking about how they may have taken a step back defensively or rebounding is actual analysis, not that dumb article you linked that everyone is clowning.

If you just stated that losing crowder/bradley makes them worse defensively there wouldn't be much of a reaction.

basketball people if you make that many changes to a team there's going to be a significant affect on how they play.

People that understand that real basketball is different from video games don't necessarily need a full scouting report breakdown to understand that.

You disagree.

But they aren't going to be worse just bc they only kept 4 people lol

>basketball people if you make that many changes to a team
>there's going to be a significant affect on how they

>for the short term but are better set up for the future.
>
>But this will be almost a completely different team with a
>completely different identity with people in new roles.
>
>Kyrie will be without the great security blanket that is
>Lebron that makes up for so many shortcomings on both ends of
>the floor.
>
>Heyward will be coming from the bleak NBA outpost of Utah to
>one of the storied franchises in the NBA under tremendously
>more fan & media scrutiny. Can he handle it?
>
>I'm a huge Tatum fan but he's 19, its going to take a minute.
>
>Is Marcus Morris really a starting PF on a contender averaging
>5rpg and shooting 42% for his career?
>
>IT, AB, and Crowder were their top 3 scorers last year, the
>points might be easy to replace but AB and Crowder were also
>their top 2 perimeter defenders, that won't be easy to
>replace.
>
>There will be a ton of pressure on Stevens to pull this thing
>together.


I agree with this^^^^

I find it funny cause people have been yelling that we should use our assets to acquire better talent and suddenly we do it and "WHOA too much change!" Only reasons for skepticism I can see is A) they lost some good leaders and B) still haven't improved rebounding. Since they're not exactly aiming to win THIS season, I can live with that. We got better.

-----------
you think we playing chess, but i'm playing mad-making. Basaglia

Losing Bradley might hurt but they needed another big anyway and it was necessary to sign Hayward. I think the big question is how much you believe in Hayward and personally I believe in him big time. Irving is a known commodity, super talented player who hopefully will continue to mature in a setting where he is closer to being "the guy" or whatever.

Thomas, they upgraded, so who cares?

Crowder/Bradley they replaced with Hayward/Tatum, I think most people would have jumped at that.

That they turned over a bunch of bench warmers means little, maybe Olynyk will hurt them a little but he's hardly irreplaceable and they couldn't pay him what Miami did. Look at that list, two guys unsigned, a two-way contract, etc.

>Jonas Jerebko: Signed with the Jazz.
>Amir Johnson: Signed with the 76ers.
>Jordan Mickey: Signed with the Heat.
>Kelly Olynyk: Signed with the Heat.
>James Young: Free agent.
>Tyler Zeller: Free agent.
>Demetrius Jackson: Signed a two-way contract with the
>Rockets.

2 top 20 guys? I have Kyrie in my top 20...That about it.....

so say 25 or 30, if you like. takes nothing away from my point.

>so say 25 or 30, if you like. takes nothing away from my
>point.


I guess I'm not a believer in the white boy yet....He looked pretty normal at times in the playoffs last season....Good thing Boston is in the East....

And he was THE man in Utah and he's the right hand here.

I like the roster set up honestly.

Kyrie is the Alpha...most talented, title tested, gonna get buckets
Hayward is the Pippen-lite...all around, good passer, decent rebounder, decent shooter, decent defender, can score and will get the 2nd most shots on the team
Jaylen is the Defender...will guard tough assignments, will catch lobs and drive. Hit an occasional 3. Won't require tons of shots. Any production is a bonus.
Morris is the enforcer...angst filled twin with decent offensive skills, avg 3 point shooter
Horford is the do it all big...primary rebounder, good post game, good mid range and decent 3pt shooter and passer.

Smart is the tenacious back up PG/SG that plays D and can get 15-20 points some nights.
Dozier is the high energy back up PG that can be an offensive spark plug
Tatum is the silky smooth rookie wing with the mature offensive game

These pieces fit well to me.

play the Wizards who's defending Wall? When they play the Bucks who's guarding Giannis? We're not even going to talk about the West lol...

>And he was THE man in Utah and he's the right hand here.
>
>I like the roster set up honestly.
>
>Kyrie is the Alpha...most talented, title tested, gonna get
>buckets
>Hayward is the Pippen-lite...all around, good passer, decent
>rebounder, decent shooter, decent defender, can score and will
>get the 2nd most shots on the team
>Jaylen is the Defender...will guard tough assignments, will
>catch lobs and drive. Hit an occasional 3. Won't require
>tons of shots. Any production is a bonus.
>Morris is the enforcer...angst filled twin with decent
>offensive skills, avg 3 point shooter
>Horford is the do it all big...primary rebounder, good post
>game, good mid range and decent 3pt shooter and passer.
>
>Smart is the tenacious back up PG/SG that plays D and can get
>15-20 points some nights.
>Dozier is the high energy back up PG that can be an offensive
>spark plug
>Tatum is the silky smooth rookie wing with the mature
>offensive game
>
>These pieces fit well to me.

-----------
you think we playing chess, but i'm playing mad-making. Basaglia

>play the Wizards who's defending Wall? When they play the
>Bucks who's guarding Giannis? We're not even going to talk
>about the West lol...


Right...You look at the Celtics' starting lineup and defensively they look kind of anemic. They will def. win some games because the East is basically a 4 team race with Cleveland looking down at the other three...But on the perimeter (at least on paper) that team ain't stopping no one....They are going to have to depend on their offensive firepower....And that's basically a two man-team situation (Ky/Heyward)...

Like u said...this ain't a layup....

>Hayward is the Pippen-lite...all around, good passer, decent
>rebounder, decent shooter, decent defender, can score and will
>get the 2nd most shots on the team

If Gordon Hayward is your second best player, you aren't winning sh!t.

And you should be extremely grateful you are in the east.

Wait, did ya'll really buy the white savior thing in OkaySports?

It was UTAH and BOSTON.


Dude is just what you said..."decent"

Point to another contender who's second best player is "decent"?

Point to another "top 20 or 25 or 30" player who is "decent"?


It's okay if there aren't any really good white players in the league at the moment.

We definitely don't need to judge dude on curve.


LOL "top 25" player who is "decent"


** Oh, and he wasn't the best player in Utah dog. They marketed him as the man I'm sure, but did you watch them?

Cmon

And his numbers were: 22/5/3/1stl with minimal TO's (1.9) while playing the most minutes on the team.

He got his points while shooting 47% from the field and 40% from 3 (he took 5 per game mind you) on 16 shots per game. And his team won the same number of games as the Cavs did last season. All of that would have made him EASILY the second best player on LAST seasons Celtics. And mind you, he did all of this while playing most of his games in the West.

And his usage rate was similar to Kevin Love's on the Cavs last year so I think he can easily duplicate or improve on last years numbers playing in the East. Also, his defensive +/- was similar to Crowders and his defensive WS were better than Crowder and Bradley.

He was by FAR the best player in Utah. It damn sure wasn't Gobert's limited offensive skilled a**.

I mean, you can be as bigoted as you want but Gordon is legit and him and Kyrie will work well together in Stevens' system (mind you Gordon played 3 years under dude in college too so there's that).

his defensive WS is boosted by playing with Gobert behind him. he's not better than Bradley or Crowder. He's not bad by any stretch, but that just demonstrates the problem w/ that stat.

-----------
you think we playing chess, but i'm playing mad-making. Basaglia

...except that, you know, he wasn't.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/UTA/2017.html#playoffs_per_game::none
https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/UTA/2017.html#playoffs_advanced::none

>Also, his defensive
>+/- was similar to Crowders and his defensive WS were better
>than Crowder and Bradley.

even if he ain't better than them, he can hold his own.

Morris and Horford are decent defenders, Brown has the tools to be an elite defender (he was guarding Bron in the ECF), and Hayward is decent/good on D as well.

They not gonna be THAT bad as a defensive team. Smart offsets anything Kyrie lacks too. The only area I see them suffering at is rebounding. But last year's C's weren't that great at rebounding either.

>Brown has the tools
>to be an elite defender (he was guarding Bron in the ECF),

You mean the series where Bron averaged 30 shooting almost 60%?

huh Boxscore Bobby?

>>Brown has the tools
>>to be an elite defender (he was guarding Bron in the ECF),
>
>You mean the series where Bron averaged 30 shooting almost
>60%?
>

Now tell me who actually DID stop lebron from averaging 30 and shooting almost 60%? FOH with these strawmen. He got the same stats on G-State. That's just LEBRON.

But if the coach trusted Brown to guard him in the most important series of the season, he must have confidence in his defensive skills. And I actually watched the series. He played decent enough D on the best player in the game to warrant it.

DPOY runner-up behind him lol

he is a legit No. 2 option and i am convinced that very few people here actually watched him play on a regular basis. he has also gotten better every season of his career.

>i am convinced that very few people here actually watched him play on a regular basis.

nope! bad defender who can't create his own shot.

>so say 25 or 30, if you like. takes nothing away from my
>point.

You said small price for 2 top 20 players.

Then you moved it to 30- on you own, you invalidated your original point. Even at that...

It is debatable if Irving is top 20, if so, he's low on the list.

Hayward??

LOL LOL

Okayplayer loves white people.


So the Celts gave up a bunch for lets say the 20th best player in the league, and when we leave behind the white boy curve, MAYBE a top 40 player? 45?

Cmon man.


The great Danny Ainge isn't really making a ton of sense this summer. Not so easy when he doesn't get hooked up, I guess.


Boston is very lucky to be out east.

And Hayward just made his first all star team, though he was borderline at that level the previous couple years. That's what he is....a borderline all star.

Kyrie is solidly an all star. He's not really an all NBA guy though, to this point.

Hard to compare across positions when creating a "top 20 list". But they've got 3 all star or close to it type guys and several other promising young players. With another high pick coming. They're in good shape, but they don't have an elite superstar on the roster yet. Will be interesting to see where it goes from here in terms of their roster.

2014-2015 third team, and there was a fairly strong case for him last year but obviously you had some lock guards at the top of the MVP race and what not.

hayward had his bumps along the way but i'd say his last two seasons at a minimum have been linear. i watched him quite a bit last year and was very impressed. been a stockholder from the jump but even i would admit his second contract was paid on potential and he had some growing pains. he will keep improving in boston, this was a better signing than just the best guy available.

i think he's a back-end top 20 guy.

statistical (15th in total win shares, 17th in per-minute win shares, 20th in BPM and VORP: http://bkref.com/tiny/IhxlO) and anecdotal (21st in all-nba voting: http://official.nba.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/4/2017/06/2016-17-All-NBA-Team-Votes.pdf) evidence support that.

we disagree. it's cool.

there is so much "skinny white guy in utah" opinion here that it's hilarious. almost as funny are the people poo-pooing the irving pickup. it's so key to consolidate talent and get consistency in the NBA, more so than in the other major sports. this deal was definitely worth it and i say that as someone who recognizes irving's flaws more than his stans do.

...and rebounding....Their best perimeter defensive players are gone....They will have to outscore teams. And getting balls off the glass is going to be tough for them....I see them taking a step back this coming season....I think it's more about the future with that team.....

The point guard.

Time to see how legendary this "system" is, because if Irving is off or sitting they are also going to struggle to score.

Unless Tatum comes out the gate ready.


That walking white supremacist haircut isn't getting his own shot...especially in the 'offs.

Ask Joe Johnson.

For some reason you think very little of the dude and it's comments like these that make me wonder just how much you've seen him play

hayward can't get his own shot? it's not like smart, brown and tatum are hurting for offensive ability. thomas was maybe the only guy who could get it consistently last year and they still won a shitload of games and went to the ECF. they have a good system and now they have better players. the defense thing is valid, they lost some of their better defenders for sure with bradley, crowder and kelly o, we'll see how they put it together with this group

like top 10 points per possession good

the floor

He filled in at the 2 for Bradley last season when he missed like 20 games and that's when he showed the Cs he really had some tools.

but were waiting for the ky trade to go down..but i guess not.


*by good i mean better than having to take on ryan anderson

Follow wojs timeline

https://mobile.twitter.com/wojespn/status/901279114623102976

https://basketball.realgm.com/nba/draft/future_drafts/detailed

*looks at Celtics draft picks*

Either of these work for me, Cavs fan:

The Lakers 2018 first round pick + The Clippers first round pick

OR

Jaysum Tatum + Jaylen Brown

This trade goes through if one of these concessions are made. If they aren't then Ainge has a lot of explaining to do. IT is mad as fuck with them. Jae Crowder doesn't trust Ainge and now that team's chemistry is fucked. We have to deal with an upset Ky but that's cool as he's under contract for a few more years.

Adam Silver has to step in and mediate giving us a proper trade package.

this ain't gonna get CLE more than a throw in second rounder or a super-protected 2025 pick. FOH cleveland.
-----------
you think we playing chess, but i'm playing mad-making. Basaglia

>this ain't gonna get CLE more than a throw in second rounder
>or a super-protected 2025 pick. FOH cleveland.

Celts fans have to stop being so damn stingy. Y'all got all these picks and quality young assets. You pulled a fast one and now have to come off more picks, assets, or both to get the deal done. Fuck your second round picks and super-protected 2025 pick. We want Tatum and/or the Lakers pick.

If that's too much then we'll gladly take Ky back and let you deal with IT and Jae.

it's really win-win unless IT4's injury actually is worse than thought.

-----------
you think we playing chess, but i'm playing mad-making. Basaglia

as a Cs fan...i wasn't a fan of giving up the Brooklyn pick...

Kyrie doesn't want to be in Cleveland and he has a no trade clause...good luck if this deal gets voided...

if it does...

Celtics potentially have a Bagley coming to the door in 2018...

And they are still a threat to the east...Cleveland won't get a better deal from anybody else...

Or that Clipper lottery-protected pick. That's probably the best thing I'd offer, really.

I wouldn't come off the Laker picks or the Grizzlies pick. If they want one of those or another asset like Tatum or Brown, I'd tell them to fuck off.

>
>The Lakers 2018 first round pick + The Clippers first round
>pick
>
>OR
>
>Jaysum Tatum + Jaylen Brown
>

Are you out of your goddamn mind?

>
>>
>>The Lakers 2018 first round pick + The Clippers first round
>>pick
>>
>>OR
>>
>>Jaysum Tatum + Jaylen Brown
>>
>
>Are you out of your goddamn mind?
>

^^ This is more than fair from my perspective.

The Celts misrepresented the full extent of IT's injury to the point that this trade is in danger. If the Celts want Ky then we need a minimum of Tatum. Ky is a franchise player we're talking about here. In order to get a franchise player you have to give up multiple assets and players. Ky isn't a bum so the Celts need to play ball and give up more. Otherwise you can take back IT and Crowder.

^^ This is more than fair from my perspective

He sat out of playoff games for christ's sake.

Ky is a franchise player we're
>talking about here.

A franchise player who doesn't want to be there anymore. You understand how that takes away value, right? We're not giving you every valuable young asset we have, foh. We gave you almost equal production at the same position plus a role player and a high lottery pick. The original trade was absolutely fair for both sides.

But they didn't know IT's injury was this serious.....This is a new ballgame.....

"One of them" serious......

IT will probably still play his heart out but just won't resign there...and I think Ainge can accept that...

Kyrie has all the leverage in Cleveland...he could straight up make it a disaster this season...

They know Cleveland *has* to make a trade. Boston does not. IT is an expiring deal anyway-- better to get something for him, but they have Hayward, Tatum, Brown, Nets pick, Lakers pick, Grizzlies pick-- there are some really nice options going forward there. The Nets pick, which has the possibility to land the Cavs a franchise player, along with the other immediate assets, should be enough for the franchise player they are being forced to deal.

Cleveland is the much more desperate team here and I doubt they get a better deal

just wanna be clear on exactly how outrageous your post was.

Looks like the Cavs are pointing to that direction....

Woj: Story posting soon on ESPN: After Thomas physical, Cavs planning to seek further compensation before finalizing Irving trade to Boston."

link: https://twitter.com/wojespn/status/901577881158950912

>Follow wojs timeline
>
>https://mobile.twitter.com/wojespn/status/901279114623102976


Oh...

Real dumb on whoever the fuck Cleveland's GM is now's part.

Sounding like a real possibility that this thing gets vetoed. In which case, it seems Milwaukee has the next best offer.

Giannis, Kyrie, and Parker could be a hell of a trio, especially offensively if they click.....but will they have enough help? That would be a top heavy roster. Of course with that youth and potential, solid veteran role players might wanna go there to ring chase(more like ECF champion chase but whatever). Will be interesting.

if you just added kyrie to the bucks' roster they would be fucking nasty but if they are giving like brogdon, maker, etc then yeah they become pretty top heavy.

long term for the Cavs really..

Brogdon can play point, but 3s and play D. Jabari can flat out score, and you clear 18 million with Monroe's deal.

For the Bucks, you get Kyries shooting to go with Giannis everything else, while still keeping Maker and Middleton
____________________

<================== Learn the name now before everyone gets dunked on

you guys would have to take back some shitty contract(s)

And some end of bench guys.


Really opens up a lot of cash for Cleveland, while adding a chance to win now.



____________________

<================== Learn the name now before everyone gets dunked on

____________________

<================== Learn the name now before everyone gets dunked on

I can't believe Koby agreed to this BS deal. This is what we get for hiring a rookie GM. Griff would've gotten another first at minimum.

He is so over the top with being wrong, I thought it was satire.

I still would've come off a first rounder of their own if Cleveland had really pushed, but Ainge clearly knew he had the upper hand and was willing to walk. Glad they got the deal done, for both parties.

this holdup was nothing but dan gilbert posturing and saving face.

neither side went into this blind. isaiah's injury risk was already factored into the original price. you could take him out of the deal completely and the package (solid rotation vet on the league's best value contract, promising 7 footer, unprotected first with #1 overall potential) is still more than fair for cleveland and consistent with the current market on superstars. see: the cousins/butler/PG returns.

angling for brown, tatum or a first as additional compensation would've been an absurd ask. altman knew that full and well. it was always going to be a 2nd rounder. anything more, on top of an already stacked package, would have been a dealbreaker.

...well I know it's not news to all the NBA Insider OKposters...

But it always had more of a personal feel than 'Rie would ever want us to believe to me

Anybody think, ironically, this was about IT?

'Rie sees an undersized shoot first PG in the MVP race and gets the me toos...?

Shouts to IT though

Small sample size, but homie looked extremely comfortable and happy

He's going to treasure those wide open looks

Just kicking off the armchair banter that we'll be enduring for the rest of the year