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Forum nameOkay Sports
Topic subjectNFL Draft 2015
Topic URLhttp://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=8&topic_id=2398536
2398536, NFL Draft 2015
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 10:51 AM
I'm back to write a whole bunch of words about male anatomy. Round grades are not predictions; most of these players will be bumped up dozens of slots because this is a weaker draft.
2398538, Quarterback
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 10:53 AM
Assuming size and arm strength hit the NFL's baseline limits, I believe there are three traits a prospect needs to sustain success at this position: anticipation, pocket presence and the ability to manipulate. If you're not throwing to a window before the defense knows it's open, you're already too late against NFL speed. If you can't feel 270-pounders with the worst intentions closing around you, and don't know how to take three steps in any direction to avoid them, while keeping your eyes downfield at all times, you're in a world of trouble. And if you can't understand how to use your eyes to hold or move defenders on all three levels of coverage, you can't execute elite-level NFL passing concepts.

Decision-making and reading defenses can be improved. Mechanics can be improved. Even arm strength can be improved. But I think it's incredibly rare for even the most talented prospects to improve their manipulation/anticipation/pocket awareness if they've never shown it at the college level.

I'm on the side that believes those are instincts you have or don't have. You can be schemed away from your weaknesses, you can be on a great team and DLTG, you can even have a run of high-level play, but nobody breaks into the upper tier of quarterbacks without what I've mentioned.

Of course, as historically bad as my quarterback evaluations have been, feel free to disregard this section entirely.
2398552, Marcus Mariota, Oregon (6'4, 219)
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 11:01 AM
I'm in. Only half the league's teams have a franchise quarterback, and I see him being in that tier. I don't care about the offense he ran in college because of two things: he can move defenders with his eyes, and he shows pocket presence on the occasions it breaks down. A lot of these "system" quarterbacks make one read against an easy-to-identify coverage shell with no pressure -- and that does happen a lot for him -- but when he has to look off a safety and hit the third progression, or step up in a collapsing pocket and squeeze the dig route in there, he's got the ability to handle it.

His arm plays fine in the NFL, at times looking very good. Smooth release, quick enough, and he makes it easy on his guys to play catch. However, he's got a consistent issue hitting deep routes, and really anything to the corner. It's usually a mechanics hitch with how he plants his front foot, although sometimes he fades away on those throws too. He's probably left 10 touchdowns on the field the past two seasons due to that.

The other flaw I've seen is how often secondary blitzes can fool him. Send a nickel corner or delayed safety runner at him, and he can be on the unsure side. That's where his mobility helps, because even if he botches the read, once he's out of the pocket he kills defenses throwing on the run.

Not perfect, but he checks off the most important boxes on the NFL signal caller list. High first rounder in any draft, and top three in this one.

+ Throws with NFL timing and accuracy to most of the field, resetting quickly when the pressure comes
+ Scramble drill master who looks to pass first, and will make a defense look wrong even if they do everything right
+ If he does tuck it, he's fast enough to beat linebacker angles and will make every defensive back work to catch him
+ Rarely makes a game-losing decision with his arm
- Deep ball is erratic, especially to the sideline
- He can get stuck on a read and rely on his legs to bail him out
- Takes way too many hits in the open field, and a soft fumbler (latter may improve when he gets away from a mesh point read every snap)
2398576, who's the best spread option QB in the NFL?
Posted by KosherSam, Thu Dec-11-14 11:41 AM
maybe my brain isn't fully working, but who from a spread system has had any real level of NFL success?
2398719, you scared?
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 07:30 PM
Cam Newton or Alex Smith, I guess. although "spread option" encompasses a lot.
2398723, terrified
Posted by KosherSam, Thu Dec-11-14 07:50 PM
I'd rather see the Jets take Cooper or Scherff in the first, and steal Gurley in the second.

For QB, they can either try one later on, sign a FA, or maybe trade for RG3 on the cheap.

Jameis in NYC is a terrible combination, and I know that if the Jets get Mariota it will guarantee that he's a bust.
2402505, RE: terrified
Posted by COOLEHMAGAZINE, Tue Dec-23-14 01:45 PM
Jets definitely should take that tackle, Scherff, he will be a beast.

No point buying a Ferrari like Mariota when your crib is miles away from paved road.
2398616, we desperately need to get him.
Posted by BrooklynWHAT, Thu Dec-11-14 01:55 PM
Titans need a lot of things but we need to start with the QB.
2398760, The touchdowns seem too easy with him
Posted by Orbit_Established, Thu Dec-11-14 10:01 PM

I remember that with Bradford too

And we all thought it was just because he was that
good...he wasn't

I have to see some suffer and struggle in a QB

Luck had a bunch of struggle

Cam had a bunch of struggle

I like to see someone overcome something

When its too easy, makes me think its the system +

O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"

"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2409396, I'm already sacrificing cute cuddly animals in evil ritual efforts to get him
Posted by mtbatol, Sun Jan-11-15 04:48 PM
2398553, Jameis Winston, Florida State (6'4, 230)
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 11:04 AM
When he's at his best, he's better than Mariota's best, and better than anybody else that's played quarterback in college over the last three years. That's why his scuffling is so painful to watch.

Yes, the senior offensive line looked like they'd never seen a stunt before (the center Cameron Irving replaced was a sieve) and the inexperienced receivers ran some interesting "routes" at times, but that's football, and he simply made too many bad decisions. The first halves against Florida and Louisville, the second half against NC State, the entire Miami and Wake Forest games...a collection of back foot throws, getting fooled by fire zone blitzes and mix coverage, along with plain WTF decisions that had Jimbo Fisher putting on his Clemson pregame face.

I'm still buying though, because his pocket instincts and arm talent are elite. Not elite for college, but elite for anybody who can spin a football. Every bad game he's had -- and I've watched them all -- he still makes a half-dozen only-in-the-NFL plays.

Double A-gap blitz that nobody picks up, deep in his own end-zone? Quick side-step, and he throws a laser that splits a tiny zone window and is on his receiver's numbers the second he turns around. Blindside tackle gets beat on a play-action? Despite having his back turned to execute the ball fake, he feels the defensive end on him without dropping his eyes, ducks under him and pops back up to calmly hit a 30-yard strike to the corner. Excellent coverage, pass rush pending and nowhere to go with the ball? He'll head fake the safety and find the defender who is the slightest step behind, then throw it past him with impeccable, indefensible placement.

There are successful NFL quarterbacks right now who wish they could make those throws under that kind of pressure. While another dozen college starts would be wondrous for him, as he'll be only 21 when next season begins, first round quarterbacks stopped getting redshirted about a decade ago. Inconsistency will be part of the deal in the early years, and the gamble is that he elevates above it. But you have to take a risk on rare skills, especially at a position where the demarcation between haves and have-nots is so punishing. Top ten.

+ Makes throws against pressure that only a few people in the world are capable of
+ Ideal frame and arm strength, plus he fixed his long release from freshman year
+ No matter what's happened, you want him to have the ball at the end
- The peak and valley aspect of his game may not be inexperience, but an actual career-long problem
- Rough in a lot of areas, from bad habits in his drops to simplistic coverage reads
- Needs a serious off-field vetting, as immaturity doesn't play well when they give you the keys
2398570, he needs to go to the right organization, and he won't
Posted by bshelly, Thu Dec-11-14 11:33 AM
dude definitely needs a mature environment that can nurture him but not put up with his bullshit. otherwise, i can absolutely see him going the vince young route. the problem is, he's getting drafted early by shitty orgs.
2398630, I know just the place
Posted by Dr Claw, Thu Dec-11-14 02:41 PM
If he's lucky though, it's Tennessee or Tampa. I think they fit the bill.
2398701, nah, not tampa.
Posted by dillinjah, Thu Dec-11-14 06:16 PM
>If he's lucky though, it's Tennessee or Tampa. I think they
>fit the bill.
2398825, Yeah...Lovie would ruin him...last place he should go...
Posted by ChampD1012, Fri Dec-12-14 08:13 AM
I like Lovie as a coach...but he wants a veteran QB...not a rookie QB...he'll ruin him...
2398949, Lulllz. What QB did Lovie "ruin?"
Posted by Orbit_Established, Fri Dec-12-14 03:00 PM

You guys really hate black people

2398954, It's not about Lovie, I just don't want him on my favourite team.
Posted by dillinjah, Fri Dec-12-14 03:21 PM
>I like Lovie as a coach...but he wants a veteran QB...not a
>rookie QB...he'll ruin him...

He needs to get away from Florida to be honest
2398969, he most definitely need out of FL
Posted by cgonz00cc, Fri Dec-12-14 04:21 PM
Just like the Lions picking Charles Rogers in 04 or whatever
2398759, The better beware comparison is Ryan Leaf
Posted by Orbit_Established, Thu Dec-11-14 09:56 PM

Vince didn't have criminal behavior at Texas...was
basically a saint

Vince Young never recovered from a benching from his
coach, in part because he didn't have the pure talent
to compensate...he was a pure mental toughness and
instincts player

The better Jameis comparison is Ryan Leaf. Both had/have
prodigious arm talent. Jameis is much better neck up
than Ryan Leaf, though
2398892, a pure mental toughness player who couldn't recover from a benching
Posted by bshelly, Fri Dec-12-14 12:32 PM
2398950, That's the exact point
Posted by Orbit_Established, Fri Dec-12-14 03:01 PM

No reason to be mad, breh


O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"

"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2398621, we also need him.
Posted by BrooklynWHAT, Thu Dec-11-14 02:09 PM
2398888, Jameis will end up between Jay Cutler and Tom Brady
Posted by Orbit_Established, Fri Dec-12-14 12:26 PM

Hopefully closer to Brady

Those are his two skill sets


O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"

"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2398891, LMAO bold prediction
Posted by cgonz00cc, Fri Dec-12-14 12:29 PM
2398965, I could be like white people, and say b/w Vince Young and McNabb.
Posted by Orbit_Established, Fri Dec-12-14 04:08 PM

But I actually watch the games, make proper comparisons.


O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"

"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2398967, first of all, you dont watch games so dont lie
Posted by cgonz00cc, Fri Dec-12-14 04:18 PM
Second of all, doesnt every QB fall somewhere between rocket armed moron and average arm field general?

Thats like guessing someones age by saying "somewhere between 1 and 90"

Well no shit lol

2399129, Jameis Winston might be better than Tavaris Jackson.
Posted by Orbit_Established, Sat Dec-13-14 11:50 AM

Any other good comparisons?
2399135, actually reminds me of what i remember Jim Kelly to be
Posted by cgonz00cc, Sat Dec-13-14 12:58 PM
Penchant for weird INTs included

I actually thought of that while he was directing FSU to their TD right before halftime of the ACCCG.
2399181, Has natural athletic talent, like Andre Ware
Posted by Orbit_Established, Sat Dec-13-14 07:57 PM

That sounds better
2399185, Andre Ware had no talent. im a Lions fan bro.
Posted by cgonz00cc, Sat Dec-13-14 08:10 PM
2402553, I still get that McNair feel, despite the dumb shit...he's a winner
Posted by Ralo13, Tue Dec-23-14 03:36 PM
2406806, Far more conventional a pocket passer at the same stage. n/m
Posted by Orbit_Established, Mon Jan-05-15 01:35 AM


O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"

"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2398555, Brett Hundley, UCLA (6'3, 227)
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 11:07 AM
The snooze button of this year's quarterback class. I think he's trying, and I think that offense may be shackling him to a degree (the swing pass is their favorite play, and their routes against pressure look more like clear-outs than real options), but I have never seen him being a comfortable passer from the pocket.

There are glimpses: he can do well with blitz-beaters, standing in the pocket and hitting late crosses or rub routes if he knows the extra pressure is coming. And he executes the short game well enough, throwing accurately and letting his receivers run after the catch (which is usually how all his long touchdowns happen).

But most defenses are content to drop seven into coverage against him, take their chances against a running play and spy him underneath. He doesn't threaten the deep part of the field, and works his progressions short to deep instead of vice-versa. Even when he makes the right read against single coverage, his downfield passing is "sporadic", if we're being optimistic.

Big arm, dynamic and bullish runner, but overall his game is mechanical and plainly boring. Late second round, but I don't see the huge potential as a starter.

+ Executes the horizontal passing game solidly
+ You have to commit an extra defender to him as a runner, he can break down a defense with power or speed
- Hasn't been "on the same page" as his receivers on deep routes for three years
- Too often skittish in the pocket, and gives up on receivers quickly when he scrambles
- Not much progression to his game after three years starting
2398728, See: Tannehill, Ryan re: Hundley
Posted by Orbit_Established, Thu Dec-11-14 08:20 PM

Can chuck, run and loves football.

In Tannenhill's case, all of the mechanics seemed to
have worked themselves out (jury is still sorta out
on him, but he's at least "decent" as an NFL QB) because
he loves to play football.

Hundley is that kind of kid.

2398813, Love the guy personally but agree with the above two posts
Posted by MothershipConnection, Fri Dec-12-14 02:43 AM
Dude's lead the best UCLA run of my adult life and I love him for it but the two assessments above are pretty much spot on. Dude checks off everything in the physical checkbox but there's just something mechanical about his game. For a guy who is a mobile QB there just really isn't anything improvisational about his game, it's almost sort of strange. If his first option is there or that first outlet is there, he's fantastically efficient, but if anything goes out of schedule he basically only relies on the run to beat you.

UCLA's line wasn't great (and was absolutely abysmal the first half of the season) and the skill players weren't all world but still there were times you expected him to bail out inferior teammates like great QBs do and it never really happened.
2398887, I think the Tannenhill comparison is a compliment, though
Posted by Orbit_Established, Fri Dec-12-14 12:25 PM

I think Tannenhill, while far from great, is a legit

And he was FULL of flaws coming out

Like I said, Tannehill could throw, run and loved football

That's all he had going for him


O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"

"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2409551, My take on Brett....
Posted by Warren Coolidge, Sun Jan-11-15 11:21 PM
he's my guy and all...

but a couple things concern me...

sometimes it doesn't seem like making decisions as quickly as I'd like him to...

the 10 sacks he took against Utah I thought a lot of them were him just holding the ball too long or not thinking quickly to get out of the pocket or get rid of the ball..

he's an accurate passer....

he's got a very strong arm..

and when he does make the play...he's a play maker..

some of what I want to give him a pass for is that I'm not the biggest fan of Mazone's play calling.... I actually kind of wish we would go in another direction with another spread option type coordinator... We had the top running back in the pac 12 and sometimes Mazone forced Bret to make a play ..when the run could have set up a more advantageous look for him... the games we played poorly we were in 3rd and long too much... and they just tee'd off on Bret...

he got a little Jason Campbell in him.... who still has a job...but wasn't really a star you know..
2409556, I agree.
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jan-11-15 11:36 PM
the Utah game had breakdowns (and Nate Orchard is a grown man, more on him later) but Hundley mostly sacked himself. ditto for Mazzone, who ran a lot of vanilla stuff and made awkward calls on third down (long developing routes on third and eight with no check-down...I think Hundley was told to make one read and then tuck it).
2412891, big mistake skipping the Senior Bowl
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-19-15 02:34 PM
unless you're hurt or already considered a top 15 lock, quarterbacks should go to the Senior Bowl. EJ Manuel was out impressing scouts and personnel men in a practice environment, while Geno Smith and AJ McCarron did nothing and paid for it.
2398559, Connor Cook, Michigan State (6'4, 218)
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 11:09 AM
Do not be fooled by the prototypical size and melanin level for a franchise quarterback. Do not look at the highlights, and only observe the gorgeous throws and placement he makes to all sections of the field. Forget about the long lineage of amazing Spartan quarterbacks, from Stanton to Hoyer to Cousins. This guy is a mirage. He makes decisions that will get people fired.

That innate sense of pocket presence I mentioned before? He doesn't have it at all. He's danced into more sacks than he's actually been pressured into. If he can't scramble out of a clean pocket, or those tricky progression reads hit the number two, then he'll just pull the trigger on the worst throw imaginable, down and distance be damned.

It's possible he can become a caretaker, since that's basically been his role on a run-heavy, defense-first Michigan State team the past two seasons. But even at that level of responsibility, he has to improve his decision-making a ton. Third round if he declares.

+ Fits passes into NFL-sized windows, with great touch and timing...if the pocket is nice and clean
+ Especially dominant throwing between the hashes, even beating bracket coverage with his accuracy
+ Not scared to let them hang, he plays with a Favre-like amnesia
- Not scared to stick his head up his own ass, making some of the dumbest situational throws possible (even without pressure)
- Defines a scramble opportunity as anytime a defender breaks into the six-yard radius around him
- Never saw an incoming sack he couldn't turn into a fumble or interception
2398560, Bryce Petty, Baylor (6'3, 230)
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 11:11 AM
I've really come to appreciate Art Briles. He does this old-timey Texan routine at press conferences, but behind the façade is a stone-cold killer when it comes to offensive strategy. His simple to execute but devastating play-design got Kevin Kolb drafted in the top 40, had the Shanahans copying him during RG3's immaculate rookie season, and now has Petty looking like one of the elite college quarterbacks of the past two years.

Petty is just another cog in Southwest Chip Kelly's system, however, which is apparent when he has to make a progression read (he can't) or gets pressured (zero awareness). I'd say 90 percent of his completions come off the same formula: play-action > no pressure > wide-open first read due to a combo route or linebacker biting up. If that initial option is covered, he's completely lost. And even his accuracy is come-and-go despite so many open looks.

So basically, I'm not a fan. Fifth or sixth rounder as an emergency back-up on a talented team.

+ Good arm talent, and makes some great deep throws down the sideline
- Definition of a system quarterback, needs his hand held to manipulate defenses or dissect morphing coverages
- Stares down routes while triple pump-faking, which surprisingly doesn't move most defenders
- Shaky accuracy to all levels of the field, great pocket or not
2409554, I like him...
Posted by Warren Coolidge, Sun Jan-11-15 11:34 PM
He gets rid of the ball...he's pretty accurate...a bit of a chunker but I think he has the pocket tools to be a solid passer down the field...

he's a gritty ball player too... he'll run it on you..

I like the kid...wouldn't mind the Rams getting him..

if he balls in the all star game and the combine I think he's going in the first round..

he's got a chance to press Hundley for the #3 QB...
2398712, Which one of these QBs has instinctive vision?
Posted by Kira, Thu Dec-11-14 07:06 PM
Which one of these guys is a gym rat and cerebral leader?

Who's the Jake Locker of this draft class?
2398720, 1. Winston 2. Mariota 3. Cook
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 07:30 PM
(if we're being serious)
2398729, Winston is the best QB since Luck, my only issue with Winston
Posted by isaaaa, Thu Dec-11-14 08:22 PM
is that he sometimes has a Favre way about him, which leads to turnovers. He'll go for the big play over the simple 8 - 12 yarder.

Anti-gentrification, cheap alcohol & trying to look pretty in our twilight posting years (c) Big Reg

Get 25% off www.karmaloop.com w/ rep code JR9103 |
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2398951, That's Andrew Luck too, though
Posted by Orbit_Established, Fri Dec-12-14 03:02 PM
>is that he sometimes has a Favre way about him, which leads
>to turnovers. He'll go for the big play over the simple 8 - 12


O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"

"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2398960, Luck is Favre 2.0. The New Fun
Posted by Dr Claw, Fri Dec-12-14 03:43 PM
(Romo is Favre 1.5 BTW)
2398989, True indeed, but Winston has been Brett Favre Jr. this season,
Posted by isaaaa, Fri Dec-12-14 05:38 PM
most of his turnovers weren't the classic "bad reads" this year, it was just plain ol over trusting in his arm.

Favre, Luck, Cutler, Jeff George and a few other QB's have had this issue.

Anti-gentrification, cheap alcohol & trying to look pretty in our twilight posting years (c) Big Reg

Get 25% off www.karmaloop.com w/ rep code JR9103 |
Nike, G-Star, Herschel, Adidas (Men's & Women's clothing)
2409506, Brandon Bridge, South Alabama (6'5, 235)
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jan-11-15 09:33 PM
He's got interesting tools...but is a long, long way from ever seeing a NFL field. When he steps between the lines he looks like a pro quarterback, with great size and the mobility to make things happen off scrambles. It's his arm, however, that's most intriguing -- he's got an absolute cannon attached to his shoulder. He can shoot lasers into NFL-sized windows (which his receivers often dropped). Even with his legs being taken out from him, I've seen him fall backwards and throw a 25-yard deep out, to the opposite hash, with smoke on it.

He has to be built from the ground up, though. Mechanics are more like ideas with him at this point, whether it's the insane elbow drop on his deliver or the footwork that is jacked up in nearly every way possible. Coverage traps and zone in general confuse him, and he'll start feeling pressure in the pocket that isn't there. He might need more time and reps than any team could possibly give to a third-string quarterback. A time capsule project for the end of the draft.

+ Big-time NFL arm talent, and on the higher scale
- Starting from the bottom in nearly every facet of basic quarterbacking
- Even if he mastered all the fundamentals, there's serious questions as to whether he'll be anything more than an impressive camp arm
2409514, This sounds like your Cardale Jones report next year
Posted by Orbit_Established, Sun Jan-11-15 09:44 PM

Though Cardale's mechanics don't look very bad at all

Apparently his best is the best of the 3, and worst is
worst of the 3

2409516, man...Cardale is miles ahead of Bridge
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jan-11-15 09:48 PM
lots of quarterbacks have shaky mechanics, but Bridge does shit that you'd cringe at in 5A high school ball. Feet pointed all sorts of directions and his release makes Tebow look like Dan Marino on certain snaps.

Ohio State is so loaded for 2015 though. They could have four first rounders (including the top overall pick) in the 2016 draft.
2409552, Who is the top overall?
Posted by Orbit_Established, Sun Jan-11-15 11:23 PM

>Ohio State is so loaded for 2015 though. They could have four
>first rounders (including the top overall pick) in the 2016

Who is this top overall pick on OSU? And who are the other
four first rounders?


O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"

"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2409553, Bosa will be in the mix for top billing
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jan-11-15 11:31 PM
especially since no quarterbacks have emerged so far with #1 potential. Ezekiel Elliott will be draft eligible, so will Darron Lee. Taylor Decker would've been a second or third rounder this season in a deep tackle class; he could be a late first in 2016.
2412854, surprised u think Lee can be a first rounder as a RS soph
Posted by 3xKrazy, Mon Jan-19-15 12:57 PM
>especially since no quarterbacks have emerged so far with #1
>potential. Ezekiel Elliott will be draft eligible, so will
>Darron Lee. Taylor Decker would've been a second or third
>rounder this season in a deep tackle class; he could be a late
>first in 2016.

how does his NFL potential compare to someone like Brian Rolle?

Lee is prob a touch faster and more fluid but their game seems similar.
2412857, Lee is a bit of a projection
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-19-15 01:18 PM
honestly I haven't watched Lee too much outside his splash plays, and right now I doubt he comes out after just two years on the field.

as for comps, Rolle played like an old-school ILB, which hurt him the most (NFL is looking for guys with Lee's skillset). and even if Lee is only 6'1 instead of 6'2, that's still a big difference than Rolle's 5'10.

either way, a ton of Ohio State players will be on the radar for 2016. should be interesting.
2410671, Cardale Jones - Ohio St (6'5", 249 lbs)
Posted by PROMO, Tue Jan-13-15 06:54 PM
2412831, Rakeem Cato, Marshall (6'1, 176)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-19-15 12:16 PM
Great college player who probably won't get much more than a camp invite. His arm is below-average, as deep outs die on arrival, and he’s a frail-looking 6'1. Perhaps his biggest issue is the way he falls apart when he has to move in the pocket. He'll stand in and throw slants on the money all day, but anytime he has to step off his drop, the ball could end up anywhere. And for being in an offense that took so many downfield shots, his long-range accuracy isn't anything special. Seventh round, or more likely, a UDFA.

+ Big balls in clutch situations
- Barely meets the most minimum physical requirements to play in the NFL
2429879, Sean Mannion, Oregon State (6'5, 238)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Mar-16-15 12:27 AM
You may hear about him over the next six weeks as a "rising prospect" with a "NFL arm" and "valuable experience in a pro system", but don't be fooled by the white quarterback code-speak. He sucks.

His whole throwing process is agonizing to watch. He's one of those awkward tall guys with sloppy footwork (drops are rarely on time with his throws), only uses his upper body when passing and has zero pocket presence. A classic fade-into-pressure-and-sack-myself quarterback.

And whatever "pro-style concepts" he was taught, he didn't pick up very well. Coverage reads are consistently terrible and he never made a bad decision he didn't want to repeat. Loved seeing him throw to his plodding tight end over and over with Shaq Thompson in coverage; it took two deflections and a pick-six before the "cerebral part of his game" kicked in.

Desperate search for a third-best quarterback prospect + height + whiteness + nice arm for uncontested passing drills = ridiculous public overvaluation.

+ Will definitely raise your post-draft grade from Peter King by a letter
- Guessing-game accuracy on intermediate throws
- Every moving part from the snap to his release needs an overhaul
- Has a lot of experience being a terrible pro-style quarterback
2398539, Running back
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 10:53 AM
Should be an easy position to evaluate, because great running backs are almost always born and rarely made. They might have stone hands, they might have atrocious technique in pass protection, but running around and through people is an innate skill.

That said, it *is* tougher these days because of how college offenses dominate. A lot of backs get huge running lanes every snap, ones they might see once or twice a game in the NFL, due to play-design and just the overall lesser talent level in college. So seeing instances where they have to succeed against NFL-type fronts is rarer.
2398561, Todd Gurley, Georgia (6'1, 231)
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 11:13 AM
Not much to say, since I love everything about this guy. He can run out of any formation. NFL vision to wait or attack blocks, with the quick feet and burst to get through the narrowest creases. Stack the box with run blitzes and he'll leg drive his way into a dozen broken tackles (see: South Carolina). And once he's in the second level, he can run past or over anybody to turn 12-yard gains into 50-yard touchdowns.

The most overlooked part of his game is that he's also one of the best third down backs in the draft. He was deciphering Saban's blitz packages to perfection as a true freshman, and he's got great hands when it comes to off-target throws. He was stuck with occasional screens and dump-offs in college, but I see him doing so much more as a NFL receiving threat on the right offense.

Running backs don't get drafted high anymore because very few of them can dominate a game themselves. He can, and his future team is getting a top ten talent at an ACL discount.

+ Literally can do everything you look for out of a feature back
+ Untapped potential in the passing game
+ Monster at the goal-line
- Tore his ACL late in the season and could be an IR luxury for a team who can burn a 2015 pick
2398635, I kind of hope the Jaguars go this route.
Posted by Frank Longo, Thu Dec-11-14 02:49 PM
Bortles realistically needs another year, as do the WRs. Draft Gurley, IR him, give coach another year to work on the defense, aim for the following season playoff run.
2398827, I would LOVE Carolina to get this guy...
Posted by ChampD1012, Fri Dec-12-14 08:14 AM
put him on IR for a season...Deangelo and Stewarts contracts should be gone...perfect...
2398586, Melvin Gordon, Wisconsin (6'1, 207)
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 12:07 PM
He's not a lead back you want to send up the middle too often, or handle it 25 times every game, but what he does best is extremely valuable: being able to score from anywhere on the field. Once he can clear into the second level -- and he does this consistently, with or without perfect blocking -- he can beat anybody to the house.

His patience and vision improved a lot this year, as he waits on inside blocking to develop, but can also see a backside edge coming open at the same time. All he needs is one reach block or seal, because he's got the best 10-yard acceleration in this draft.

The one big hole in his game is as a receiver, though. Wisconsin has never given a shit about throwing to their backs and teaches them high school level pass protection, so he's rawer than most. He doesn't look natural running his two routes, quitting at the end of swings and getting softly hooked on slip out screens, but maybe repetitions will level him up. If he could become reliable in the passing game, that'd make him *really* dangerous. First rounder anyway.

+ Quick cutter that can leave linebackers whiffing in their proper gaps
+ NFL offenses block nine and leave the other two to the runner...he's got the elite burst and long speed to beat both
+ Yes, he often got great blocking, but he also faced loaded fronts; NFL defenses will never line up like Ohio State did against him
- Improved to an adequate blocker, but a complete unknown as a receiver
- Pad level is not consistent, but when he decides to square up he can bounce off tackles
- He'll go down to a lot of leg tackles inside and rarely gets push after first impact
2398711, Gordon in Miami would be nice
Posted by LBs Finest, Thu Dec-11-14 06:50 PM
2398739, I honestly think Tevin Coleman will be the best of the bunch...
Posted by Mignight Maruder, Thu Dec-11-14 09:09 PM
Good combination of size (6'0/210lbs) and speed (former standout sprinter - 10.6 in the 100 in high school). He flashed big play potential all year with his exceptional burst and breakaway speed. Great vision. Low mileage. And let's not forget he put up monster numbers on Indiana. He was a marked man every game and still was highly productive. He kind of reminds me of Demarco Murray.
2398745, he's good. I liked him more than I thought, even with some flaws.
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 09:16 PM
2398805, Tevin Coleman, Indiana (6'1, 210)
Posted by will_5198, Fri Dec-12-14 01:57 AM
He's the type of back that'll have 40 yards through the third quarter, then bust one open and finish with 120. Just keep running zone plays with him, because once he gets a cutback lane, he drives his foot in the ground and is gone. He's not that shifty outside of the first cut, and he runs too tall, but the long speed and explosion are real. Like Gordon, there's premium on a runner who can turn an average gain into points. High second round.

+ Home run hitter on the stretch play or inside zone, he splits safety angles from a dozen yards away
+ Surprisingly efficient as a receiver and in pass protection despite a limited offense
- Misses a lot of lanes with his vision
- Pad level is consistently bad and the lower leg tackles are frequent
2398807, Duke Johnson, Miami-FL (5'9, 206)
Posted by will_5198, Fri Dec-12-14 01:59 AM
Built and plays like a complementary back. He's not going to get much going inside, although he tries his best and will break poor tackle attempts with how hard he cuts. He'll be best as a change of pace and third-down weapon, since he can hit a long one if he can clear the line of scrimmage and is a smooth route-runner. Third or fourth round.

+ Fast, pinball runner who can make a defense look bad if given an alley
+ Asset in the outlet game, and can run intermediate-to-advanced level routes from the backfield
- Undersized for number one duties, struggles in pass protection
- No power in his leg drive, if he can't cut around you he’s going to the ground
- Fast...but not as fast as Gordon and Coleman
2399168, Ameer Abdullah 5'9" 195 lbs.
Posted by DeepAztheRoot, Sat Dec-13-14 05:21 PM
this was the opinion on him as a recruit, pretty spot on I thought


Positives: Exceptionally nimble in space. Runs with a very low center of gravity, has excellent short area burst. Completely ignores contact, seems like he's made of rubber (He's got a little bit of Barry in him). Good, not great, long speed (I'd say he's probably in low 4.5's, might hit high 4.4's on a good day). Exceptional vision to find a hole or cutback lane. Very good receiver for a RB on both short and medium routes, catches with his hands and can high point the ball to make catches against taller defenders.

Negatives: Doesn't have that 2nd gear to totally blow past defenders. Lacks bulk, very small bodied. Has a tendency to keep moving laterally, rather than vertically, which may lead to problems against faster college defenses.
2399170, Very spot-on
Posted by will_5198, Sat Dec-13-14 05:31 PM
He's not going to get much going inside without good blocking, although he shows solid pad level and forward lean. I think his vision gets a little cloudy in tight spaces as well.

I see him as a change-of-pace on passing downs. He's creative in space and looks like a plus-receiver and adequate blocker. Third or fourth round (this is a deep running back class).

+ A dart in space and finishes runs despite a smaller build
+ Smooth receiver and aware enough in pass protection to keep the quarterback alive
- Lacks the strength and elite vision to emerge from a crowd near the box, he hits the opening if it's there but doesn't read blocks a second into the future like the great ones
2399188, Looked like Ray Rice at Rutgers. Huge compliment, obviously. n/m
Posted by Orbit_Established, Sat Dec-13-14 08:16 PM


O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"

"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2423290, That Ameer guy might be pretty good
Posted by DeepAztheRoot, Sun Feb-22-15 03:45 PM

2399171, Karlos Williams, Florida State (6'1, 225)
Posted by will_5198, Sat Dec-13-14 05:34 PM
Hyped by the amateur scouting community before the season, and promptly busted once the games started. He averaged 8.0 yards per carry on 100 touches in 2013, but this past fall he's been severely outplayed by both backs behind him and generally looked like NFL Trent Richardson's cousin.

He's fast in a straight line and quick for his size to the corner, but needs a lot of things to go right for him to utilize those strengths, since he can't break a tackle and his vision is worse than atrocious. Not a bad receiver and he could learn to pass protect well with that size. Seventh round or UDFA.

+ Valuable on special teams as a coverage guy (back-up safety for two years) and kick returner
+ If a toss sweep is perfectly blocked by everybody, he will at least get the first down
- Runs like he's wearing a diaper
- No pad level, can't break shoelace tackles, cuts like he's got nice shoes on in the mud
- Disturbing domestic violence allegations this season that aren't worth the risk given his ability
2412877, I Agreed on ALL OF THIS until the Rose Bowl,
Posted by isaaaa, Mon Jan-19-15 02:19 PM
I don't know if I've ever seen a player improve so much in less than 4 weeks.

His pad level was lower, he looked EVEN FASTER and his blocking was great. I have no idea where he'll go until his pro-day.

>Hyped by the amateur scouting community before the season,
>and promptly busted once the games started. He averaged 8.0
>yards per carry on 100 touches in 2013, but this past fall
>he's been severely outplayed by both backs behind him and
>generally looked like NFL Trent Richardson's cousin.
>He's fast in a straight line and quick for his size to the
>corner, but needs a lot of things to go right for him to
>utilize those strengths, since he can't break a tackle and his
>vision is worse than atrocious. Not a bad receiver and he
>could learn to pass protect well with that size. Seventh round
>or UDFA.
>+ Valuable on special teams as a coverage guy (back-up safety
>for two years) and kick returner
>+ If a toss sweep is perfectly blocked by everybody, he will
>at least get the first down
>- Runs like he's wearing a diaper
>- No pad level, can't break shoelace tackles, cuts like he's
>got nice shoes on in the mud
>- Disturbing domestic violence allegations this season that
>aren't worth the risk given his ability

Anti-gentrification, cheap alcohol & trying to look pretty in our twilight posting years (c) Big Reg

Get 25% off www.karmaloop.com w/ rep code JR9103 |
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2406802, T.J. Yeldon, Alabama (6'2, 221)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-05-15 01:32 AM
Some dumbass on OKS wrote he could've played in the NFL as a freshman...probably the same person who thought Trent Richardson would be a faster Maurice Jones-Drew. Anyway, he'd still be a solid option for a zone team, but the shine has dulled on him and the dent marks a lot more obvious. I can't stand his running style, with his chest out and tap-dancing, but he gets away with it because his line lets him find the corner untouched. When he *has* to make somebody miss, he can do it, and once he picks a lane he runs decisively and tough. But his pad level is still bad and he doesn't run away from people.

Well-sized cutback runner who plays smaller than his numbers and needs to learn how to run at the NFL level. Third or fourth round.

+ Quick feet and initial burst for his size...when he wants to
+ Doesn't get many chances, but shows natural ability as a receiver
- Small hands and makes some of the dumbest fumbles ever (blindly stretching the ball out while being hit, 10 yards past the marker)
- Sucks at pass protection
2406812, Thank you. I just don't see it with this dude. n/m
Posted by Orbit_Established, Mon Jan-05-15 02:24 AM


O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"

"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2406803, Mike Davis, South Carolina (5'9, 223)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-05-15 01:33 AM
He's a speed back who's merely average in the passing game. Although he's not the big-play hitter that Gordon and Coleman are, he can outrun angles and has impressive acceleration. Too bad he's addicted to making a dozen cuts on every run. He jukes himself into so many tackles when a single, hard cut would've been much better -- in the NFL you get the one chance to make your move past the line of scrimmage. It's annoying to watch, especially since he doesn't break a ton of tackles once he's corralled.

His profile screams out third-down back, but he's got to improve his consistency as a receiver (drops easy swing passes and his routes could be tighter). The strength of his position class is going to knock him into the fourth or fifth round, although I can see a team over-drafting him if he runs well.

+ Darting, hard-to-target runner with a burst
- Dancing, hard-to-find-a-straight line runner too often
2406804, Javorius Allen, USC (6'1, 220)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-05-15 01:34 AM
He's old for a prospect (24 to start next season) and plays the most money-draining position in football, so he might declare...but there's nothing much to get the excited about. A tight-hipped plodder that barely gets what's blocked. The one redeeming value is he has fantastic hands; a real natural at catching the ball from all angles. Seventh round or UDFA.

+ Could be useful as a back-up third down back
- Runs with his chest out and has the acceleration of LenDale White
2408897, apparently this is a thing now: Synjyn Days, Georgia Tech (6'2, 231)
Posted by cgonz00cc, Sat Jan-10-15 12:18 PM
After running for 835 yards on 141 carries (120 ypg, 6 ypc) with 8 TDS in the final 7 games of the season, Synjyn is drawing some attention at the Medal of Honor game.


He's a big body with quick and experience both behind the QB and in the slot. Im not really even sure what his potential is, as he played QB and then A Back (wing) his first three years, and then mostly backed up a guy who had been biding his time. But after the two losses they really unleashed him.

He hits the hole with authority, and tho he isnt a bruiser like Jon Dwyer was, he wont be arm tackled either and he has a great stiff arm. His receiving ability is kind of an unknown, as he has more completions than receptions for his career, but he is a good pass blocker. Also showed against Miss St that while he isnt a burner, he can peel off a big play against fast defenses. Transitioning from the placement of a fullback to a traditional halfback will be a step to climb, but should be small given that hes already been shuffled around.

Could be a nice 3rd down/short yardage back. Incidentally reminds me of Joique Bell a little, with less hammer and more wiggle.
2412832, Jay Ajayi, Boise State (6'0, 216)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-19-15 12:17 PM
He's fast and cuts at that speed, which is always worth something in the NFL. I like his burst – he can stick his foot in the ground and explode past a free backer -- and his hands are good enough to play on third downs. What I don't like is his vision against overmatched competition (bounces entirely too many runs outside) or upright form (especially with a skinny lower body). He's also a habitually soft fumbler.

I see him as a tandem back, a slasher you bring to create a big play, but he does having potential as a mid-range starter. Second round.

+ Quick through the line of scrimmage, with the feet to get past penetration or second level defenders
+ Has a tall, shoulders-squared running style, but not a stiff and avoids the bigger hits
+ Makes his catches, although not always in the textbook way
- Gets overconfident with his speed, running past open lanes to get the corner…NFL will shut that down
- Weak leg drive and an easy tackle when going low
- Needs anchoring strength as a pass blocker
2412833, David Cobb, Minnesota (5'11, 220)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-19-15 12:18 PM
Just a guy, gets what's blocked, not special in the open field, blah blah blah...you've read it all before. He's an on-and-off the roster type, mostly because he lacks NFL burst when he has to get through a tight lane or turn the corner. Hands and protection are decent, and he shows a bit of usefulness in both regards (he's the only back *or* lineman I can remember getting a clean, on the ground cut block against Randy Gregory in two years). Seventh round.

+ At his best I'd qualify his running as "slippery"
+ Assignment-reliable in blitz pick-up and general protection
- Gets trapped in space against quick linebackers and safeties...doesn't make the last guy miss
- Slow to the hole and often messes around too much with cuts
2413044, Josh Robinson, Mississippi State (5'9, 215)
Posted by will_5198, Tue Jan-20-15 12:04 AM
Stepfan Taylor, is that you? He's nearly the exact same churner inside, whose best attributes are his low pad level and stocky build. But once defenses see him on tape, they'll just pinch inside because he has zero speed to the corner. He shows something as a lead blocker on Prescott runs, however -- a conversion to fullback could be his best chance of sticking on a roster. Sixth or seventh round.

+ All shoulder pads and thighs when he runs inside, usually falling forward after contact
- Short-arms passes and offers little in the receiving game
2398540, Wide receiver
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 10:54 AM
The most system reliant position in football, I go with hard to quantify qualities that can be hard to judge against varied competition. Explosion off the line and through routes, late separation, hand placement, route-running (this one is hard with broadcast views) and how they compete for the ball in contested situations.

This class is a come down from last year, and even the guys I like have serious flaws. Many of them max out at "number two option, closer to third" upside.
2398562, Amari Cooper, Alabama (6'1, 210)
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 11:16 AM
The cleanest prospect in this draft, meaning there's nothing about him that stands out as a negative when moving up to the NFL. Even the best players have an issue with something -- "OK, you can't play him in that alignment, or he needs work on this technique" -- but those moments never really crop up with him.

He should be studying every snap of Reggie Wayne's career, because that's the style he can emulate in the NFL. Neither of them are big vertical burners (bet Cooper measures in at the same 6'0 as Wayne) and both lack the elite burst that smaller guys have, but they still take apart defenses as precise route-runners who line up anywhere, are smoother than dynamic after the catch, and have an answer against every coverage.

Kiffin did a masterful job force-feeding him touches this past season: lots of motion, stacked releases, slot duties and timed deep shots. They could've just left him on the outside (defenses still played off-coverage and dropped a safety out of the box, a tactic I'm sure every coordinator loathed against Alabama's running game), but it was a great showcase for the depth of his skills. There have been bigger and faster prospects to go as high as he will, but only a select few with his intuition at the position. Top ten.

+ Absolute natural at route running and adjusting to passes
+ History of production while playing all three receiver positions, with two different quarterbacks and against the best defenses
+ Not one thing he's less than very good at
- Concentration drops here and there
- While he's excellent on inside routes against press, he becomes a bit more ordinary when trying to release outside and get vertical
2398740, Silver and Black please. Keep losing.
Posted by TheRealBillyOcean, Thu Dec-11-14 09:11 PM
2399183, Taller, but I need to be convinced that he isn't Peter Warrick
Posted by Orbit_Established, Sat Dec-13-14 07:59 PM

As in, a guy who peaked real early and is just way, way
ahead of the curve because of it

The "polish" gets me

Something seems oddly Warrick-like about dude's game


O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"

"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2398565, DeVante Parker, Louisville (6'3, 209)
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 11:18 AM
He's got a narrow skill-set but I'm a big fan of his game. He lines up all over the field, but he does almost all of his damage on slant routes out of the slot. Corners know it's coming, but they can't stop it.

He's a great press-beater (P.J. Williams repeatedly got burned on an inside release in their match-up) and even if he doesn't get the best separation, his wingspan and strong hands are good enough equalizers to make any catch over the middle. He also piles up YAC, not because he's particularly explosive but more due to his great body control and field awareness to run through tackles and bad angles.

However. I'd be shocked if he ran anything better than a high 4.5 (maybe even 4.6 or worse), because he's extremely sluggish downfield. All those deceptive release tricks he has against press won't make up for the fact he rarely gets any breathing room on deep routes. So you have to accept he's not going to be a big part of the vertical game. I love him on anything intermediate though, as he's a Boldin-esque third down converter. Second round.

+ First down machine who dominates the middle of the field
+ Not perfect but a natural hands-catcher who converts bad passes into receptions and never lets anything into his body
+ Excellent after the catch, often breaks one or two tackles
- Painful to watch on go routes, has a chance on double moves or running seams out of the slot like Marques Colston
- Not a true number one receiver
2398585, i'm a big fan. even with bridgewater their offense looked
Posted by veritas, Thu Dec-11-14 11:55 AM
much better when he was in the game, from what i saw.

other side of that coin is it does seem he gets injured a lot.
2398612, Devin Funchess, Michigan (6'5, 236)
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 01:50 PM
Fairly certain he moved from tight end just so everyone could stop pretending he blocks. I don't love him on the outside, since he's not going to blow past any decent corner in press and his winning percentage on jump balls is startlingly low. He tracks the pass, he elevates, he extends with his hands...it's all perfect, he just doesn't catch the fucking ball. I'm sure there were a dozen "almost-catches" this season where the ball slipped out once he hit the ground, or got jostled by the corner, or whatever.

He's really fluid for his size though, and can make hard cuts. So he ended up looking best running the same routes, from the same slot position, as he did last year as a tight end. Corner routes, slants, anything down the seam, pivot routes -- with a free release inside and against safeties or linebackers, he's a winning match-up on offense. That's worth something, and there's potential on the outside if he learns how to release better and gets more technical in his routes. Inconsistent but intriguing tweener who at worst will be a difficult package player to defend. Second round.

+ Gliding, tall and dangerous on all intermediate throws
+ Soft hands (yet not consistent) and great body adjustments to the lottery-based accuracy of Devin Gardner
- Has skills to win 50/50 deep passes, but lacks concentration and toughness
- Still a marginal blocker despite his size, although improving
2398614, watch Belicheat snatch him up and use him like they used killerboy
Posted by ThaTruth, Thu Dec-11-14 01:55 PM
2398721, there is no point in evaluating him based on this yr
Posted by cgonz00cc, Thu Dec-11-14 07:36 PM
Hes phoned it in since ND. Just shameful indifference to everything all year. Blocking, catching, routes...the only time he gabe real effort was for RAC

He will dominate the combine and go in the 1st
2398613, Ty Montgomery, Stanford (6'2, 216)
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 01:53 PM
Looks the part, but I have trouble seeing him as even a number two receiver in the NFL. His route-running is often bad, and he's got a very robotic look to his game until he actually has the ball in his hands. Once that happens he's first-round dangerous, but it's tiring to watch him not stem routes properly and never make tough catches.

I'd run go routes, comebacks, and double-moves with him; he's good at those right now and corners respect his straight line acceleration and deep speed. Anything else with nuance needs a lot more coaching and don't expect him to be a reliable chain-mover. Third round as a package player on offense with game-breaking return ability.

+ Very well-built, lots of strength without being heavy or losing agility
+ Elite kickoff returner, capable punt returner, and he can dominate second level defenders with his power-speed combo as a ball-carrier
- Poor route-runner who decelerates through his breaks and doesn't get great separation
- Hands are inconsistent at best, and contested throws are hardly ever brought down by him
2398816, Some of the worst hands I've ever seen of a WR
Posted by MothershipConnection, Fri Dec-12-14 02:55 AM
You could basically say he's the Cordarrelle Patterson package without the hands or catching skills that make you think he'll ever be an actual WR, so you can spend the appropriate price and give him the appropriate amount of touches if you're smart.
2398923, dude's a physical freak, I remember when I first saw him as a freshman...
Posted by ThaTruth, Fri Dec-12-14 01:58 PM
I think and he was wearing #88 and looked HUGE like a big ass tight end but he was fast as hell and blowing by people, I think he'll be a great kick returner in the league if nothing else.
2398937, one more concussion and his career is over.
Posted by PROMO, Fri Dec-12-14 02:22 PM
i'd take him in the 6th round.

dude took MONSTER hits in the college.
2398615, Sammie Coates, Auburn (6'2, 201)
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 01:55 PM
He's got some rare tools as a deep threat and short-game YAC monster. But he's missing some damn important ones.

Well-sized and built like a truck, he'll destroy off-coverage with his speed and not a lot of defensive backs want to tackle him in the open. But despite playing fast and strong, he lacks all nuance when it comes to being a receiver. Routes are rugged. Anything not thrown into his chest is an adventure (he's definitely dropped more touchdowns than he's caught). Half the time he'll wait on a deep pass without even extending his arms or jumping. These are all scary habits that become permanent traits with certain players. So it's a dice roll on measurables, to see if he can be coached into a better version. Third round for me at the highest.

+ Undeveloped potential in a run-based offense with a route "twig" of about three options
+ Fantastic downfield blocker who can even dominate linebackers
- Inconsistent hands, he can make strong catches and play hot potato on consecutive plays
- Not a natural; plays slower and smaller than his listed numbers because of bad technique
2402513, Devin Smith, *The* Ohio State University (6'1, 198)
Posted by guru0509, Tue Dec-23-14 01:50 PM
2409414, ^^
Posted by guru0509, Sun Jan-11-15 05:28 PM
2409427, A faster and more fluid Terrance Williams.
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jan-11-15 05:56 PM
He's not going to sustain a passing game himself, but the one thing he does well -- get vertical -- will make everyone else a little more open. Safeties will drop deeper, corners will give more cushion, and coverages will stretch to his side. If he's outside he'll draw someone over the top, and he really gets scary in the slot; defensive coordinators who normally put a safety on an inside receiver will be shitting themselves.

He's not very strong and doesn't have much of a route tree right now, but he's not one of those stiff deep threats that can't move laterally. So I see him adding on to his speed game (comebacks and drags could be killer) in the future. Second round.

+ Touchdown threat on any snap
+ Gets to top speed before most defensive backs can get out of their pedal
+ Very good body adjustments to deep passes; he finds the ball out of the air naturally
- He'll go up and get it with his hands when needed, but lots of body traps
- Needs some bulk and better release technique on the outside against NFL press
- Might have a longer learning curve than most, as far as route adjustments and reading coverages
2423135, 4.47, and then a 4.42
Posted by guru0509, Sat Feb-21-15 04:11 PM
seems about right

now he's gotta show he can run diff types of routes

id say bottom of the first as of right now.
2406780, Kevin White, West Virginia (6'3, 210)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-05-15 01:08 AM
Pure production. He doesn't blow you away with any individual skill, but the composite is great and he stays filling up the box score. He's got instincts for the position -- the body control, his balance along the sideline, the little jab steps that get big separation -- and his hands are huge. Seriously, he can one-palm anything near him (although they're not perfect; he does drop a few). Versatile, too...the whole field and route tree is open to him. He lines up at all three receiver positions and works the screen game just as well as he gets loose downfield.

Well-rounded target who has better upside than most twos, although not quite a true number one. Late first round, early second.

+ Hands-catcher and press-beater no matter where he lines up
+ Quicker than fast, but enough speed to threaten safety help and great tracking ability
- Needs to play through contact better on 50/50 passes
- Gets open plenty but can improve his routes; gives away tells and lets corners jump his break
2423122, Ran a 4.35... welcome to the Raiders!
Posted by MothershipConnection, Sat Feb-21-15 02:04 PM
Actually I'd be pretty happy with him or Amari but cmon SPEED.

EDIT: If Al were still around I'd be 100% convinced he'd be the Raider pick, with McKenzie drafting I could see him favoring the more polished Amari or hoping for Leonard Williams to fall.
2423131, yeah, he crushed the testing part
Posted by will_5198, Sat Feb-21-15 03:34 PM
although I'd be scared after DGB's excellent combine....
2423292, Yep if Williams ain't there at 4 or the Eagles don't do a Godfather..
Posted by TheRealBillyOcean, Sun Feb-22-15 03:54 PM
offer for Mariota, We getting him or Cooper.
2423299, Hoping they draft White and sign Randall Cobb
Posted by MothershipConnection, Sun Feb-22-15 04:19 PM
Put Streater as the #3 he was meant to be and go from one of the worst receiving corps in the league to one of the best.
2423312, James Jones is still on the team.
Posted by cereffusion, Sun Feb-22-15 05:13 PM
As is Thompkins, who Carr seemed to love.
2423311, Al's dead.
Posted by cereffusion, Sun Feb-22-15 05:12 PM
2406805, DeAndre Smelter, Georgia Tech (6'3, 225)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-05-15 01:35 AM
Intriguing is the best label I can put on him, as passing game opportunities are extremely limited in that offense. What's shown is promising: he has some finesse to his routes, and is really excellent at winning contested throws. He can get separation deep and will make back-shoulder catches all day. Physically he's NFL sized all the way, and carries the weight like a tall running back without being sluggish.

He would've risen as a prospect after the season, but with his ACL injury against Georgia I'd bump him down to the fifth or sixth round as a 2016 layaway player.

+ When he gets the chances, shows NFL talent on long throws and 50/50 situations
- Reading coverages may be a struggle, coming from an option offense that caught secondaries with their pants down
2408683, he really gave Kendall Fuller the business
Posted by cgonz00cc, Fri Jan-09-15 04:37 PM
2408684, Darren Waller has NFL ability too
Posted by will_5198, Fri Jan-09-15 04:41 PM
he looked good at the end of the season.
2408895, his ability to take the top off a defense was a ?
Posted by cgonz00cc, Sat Jan-10-15 11:53 AM
But he's fast enough and he really attacks the ball. Strong hands too.

He had a glaring coverage misread in the ACCCG that really hurt us, but in the OB, he and Thomas were locked in.
2408898, and both are very good blockers
Posted by cgonz00cc, Sat Jan-10-15 12:20 PM
2408926, yup, really good downfield blockers
Posted by will_5198, Sat Jan-10-15 03:57 PM
that's one thing Johnson and Malzahn make sure their receivers always do. Smelter and Waller got visibly upset when they didn't hold a block for as long as they wanted.
2408673, Dorial Green-Beckham, Oklahoma (6'6, 225)
Posted by will_5198, Fri Jan-09-15 04:13 PM
Bust. He's tall and can run fade routes, otherwise I dislike nearly everything else about his game. Hands are extremely inconsistent, with a ton of body catches and flubs mixed in with good snares. He can run well in a line, but his change of direction is sluggish. Routes are average to borderline terrible, as he routinely gets jammed by 5'10 corners. Could barely find his way into the lineup as a freshman, and never had a significant performance against an elite SEC defense (Auburn doesn't count...and he was dropping touchdowns in that one anyway). Oh yeah, he also smoked himself out of his first school and dragged his girlfriend outside by her hair.

He's an unfinished, going-through-the-motions prospect with more baggage than you want and less talent than people say. Fourth round.

+ Excellent range and indefensible height on fade routes; a touchdown-maker inside the 10
- Can play small and soft when challenged by press or downfield contact
- Way, way behind as a technician; just ran go routes, fades and screens in college (and not perfectly)
- Apathetic blocker
- Not explosive with his first step and needs space to get up to speed
2412879, Gentleman's bet he goes before 3rd round.
Posted by isaaaa, Mon Jan-19-15 02:22 PM

Too much potential to be a 4th rounder, you literally could of plugged him in the Hawks game yesterday and he'd of done at least as good as Kearse & Baldwin.

>Bust. He's tall and can run fade routes, otherwise I dislike
>nearly everything else about his game. Hands are extremely
>inconsistent, with a ton of body catches and flubs mixed in
>with good snares. He can run well in a line, but his change of
>direction is sluggish. Routes are average to borderline
>terrible, as he routinely gets jammed by 5'10 corners. Could
>barely find his way into the lineup as a freshman, and never
>had a significant performance against an elite SEC defense
>(Auburn doesn't count...and he was dropping touchdowns in that
>one anyway). Oh yeah, he also smoked himself out of his first
>school and dragged his girlfriend outside by her hair.
>He's an unfinished, going-through-the-motions prospect with
>more baggage than you want and less talent than people say.
>Fourth round.
>+ Excellent range and indefensible height on fade routes; a
>touchdown-maker inside the 10
>- Can play small and soft when challenged by press or
>downfield contact
>- Way, way behind as a technician; just ran go routes, fades
>and screens in college (and not perfectly)
>- Apathetic blocker
>- Not explosive with his first step and needs space to get up
>to speed

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2412885, oh, I'll bet most of these guys go rounds ahead of what I put down
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-19-15 02:32 PM
I'm eternally pessimistic. round numbers are my own grades -- *I* think he's a fourth round player, but would guess he goes higher.
2413057, I would be kinda surprised 1st round, but I get it. He has 1st round
Posted by isaaaa, Tue Jan-20-15 01:46 AM
talent. He's a huge target, and he's fast...off the field issues are big though.

I can't think of a draft in NFL history where he'd go 4th round, that's kinda petty lol.

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2409507, Nelson Agholor, USC (6'0, 190)
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jan-11-15 09:34 PM
So clutch on third down. Defenses know it's coming to him, USC doesn't do much to hide it, and he still finds a way to get open. Out of his break, he has some of the cleanest and quickest cuts in the country – hitches, pivot routes, short outs and drags are all automatic with him. He'll run those all day, and bleed defenses to death from the slot. Try and overplay the short game, and he's got enough speed to get vertical on an out-and-up or sluggo.

Size is an issue, not so much with his height but his scrawny build. UCLA pressed him with Myles Jack and he had a hell of a time getting off it (although that says more about Jack than him). Still, he needs to get stronger. He'll also drop some gimmies now and again. Overall though, he's a stick-moving inside receiver who I'd want him on my team for the right value. Third round.

+ Slices up zone coverage and too quick for most underneath defenders in man
+ Excellent at the scramble drill and works himself open when improvising
+ Plays much tougher than he looks (taken big hits and not scared to get a ball between the hashes)
- Lightweight, skinny physique and the more athletic, NFL-sized defenders will knock him around some
- Strictly a slot weapon that'll look ordinary as a number two, outside receiver
2409508, Rashad Greene, Florida State (6'0, 180)
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jan-11-15 09:36 PM
I wrote him off in 2013 as an unremarkable system player. He still is, but does enough things well to make me at least appreciate him. Most importantly, his awareness is incredibly high -- he always knows where the nearest three defenders are, and how to adjust his body or turn to run a certain way when they close in. That Spider-Sense kept him from taking many hits, even though he worked over the middle a ton. Polished route-runner and he catches nearly everything that gets close to him. Plus, he basically carried the offense during the first half of the season when the younger receivers weren't ready and Karlos Williams was running into the back of Tre Jackson every other play.

It was the end of the season that was more of a highlight of his drawbacks. I'll bet he's not his listed size unless he has pads on, which shows up against better corners. We all saw the Oregon disappearance, and Vernon Hargreaves III wore him out in the Florida game...aside from a first-half back-shoulder throw, Winston stopped looking his way. He just doesn't have the skills to stand out in those cases. Still worth a look as a rotational receiver in the fifth round.

+ Controls his speed very well, setting up defenders with smooth acceleration and throttle-downs in zone
+ Decent punt returner
- Is going to be less talented than most corners he sees in the pros
- Rail thin, he's got a JV build at the NFL level
2412834, Antwan Goodley, Baylor (5'10, 220)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-19-15 12:19 PM
There's a shoddiness to his game that'll be exposed in the NFL, but he's fun as hell to watch and fills the highlights. Lots of inconsistency: he makes circus catches and flies down the sideline, mixed with a crazy amount of drops and sluggish breaks. If he has space and gets the ball in stride, he's a TD waiting to happen, but he can also get shutdown with fundamental corner technique.

Baylor toyed with the idea of him at running back this season, and honestly it's intriguing -- he's got the build to bang inside and his average traits at receiver become above-average out of the backfield. Late third, fourth round.

+ Big-time 50/50 winner who can either get over the top or kill corners on back-shoulder adjustments
+ Plenty of YAC; he runs through defensive backs
+ Incredible catches
- Drops are an every game occurrence
- Athleticism is confined to straight lines
- Routes are often half-assed or just plain bad
- Weight fluctuates and he looks like he lives at Whataburger
2413043, Jaelen Strong, Arizona State (6'3, 215)
Posted by will_5198, Tue Jan-20-15 12:03 AM
He's fine. Nothing about his skillset gets me excited, although I won't get irate if you think he's a top 50 prospect, either. Strike that -- I *will* get the pitchfork sharpened if Grigson takes him the first round.

Anyway...he's an inside receiver without much wiggle or long speed, but will get his catches using his frame and hands. The questioning of his separation ability is correct, because he doesn't pull away from anybody in his breaks, and split wide he's a hitch/dig/back-shoulder fade player only. He has a tight end's game in an outside receiver's body.

A solid chain-mover over the middle of the field, but without the upside of explosive plays. Third round.

+ Uses his size and aggressive hands to create throwing windows
+ Big enough to handle the bruising between the hashes and eats up safeties and linebackers in the intermediate game
+ Solid-to-impressive adjustments on jump balls and back-shoulder throws; a red-zone weapon for sure
- Non-factor after the catch...he secures it and the play is usually done with
- Genuinely sluggish for a receiver; he can beat press but still has to fight for every bit of position after that
- Will only get open downfield off double moves
2398541, Tight end
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 10:54 AM
This year's class is terrible. Nearly all of these guys are either super H-back types or do just enough to make a NFL roster. Nobody that can change an offense, and barely anybody that I would consider with the potential to be a strong starter.
2402516, where do you see O'Leary going?
Posted by guru0509, Tue Dec-23-14 01:53 PM
2402522, Nick O'Leary, Florida State (6'3, 247)
Posted by will_5198, Tue Dec-23-14 01:57 PM
An All-American in Brent Musburger's heart, he's an end of the roster H-back type who blocks decently and can slip out for a checkdown. Extremely limited as a route-runner because he's not explosive enough to pull away or big enough to box out; linebackers were just sitting on his route tree and jumping everything this season. Probably a third of Winston's interceptions came from trying to force the ball late to this guy. Seventh round or UDFA.

+ Soft hands and makes proper adjustments to off-target throws
- Not very athletic, separation is a struggle and his catch radius is really small
2409420, No Maxx Wiliiams?
Posted by DeepAztheRoot, Sun Jan-11-15 05:49 PM
I suppose he hadn't declared when you made this post though.
2409428, I got a bunch of notes sitting in Word. on everybody.
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jan-11-15 05:58 PM
he's up soon. easily the number one tight end, but a second rounder in a good year. he was smart to capitalize on the market.
2412835, Maxx Williams, Minnesota (6'4, 250)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-19-15 12:20 PM
The crown rhinestone of a disastrous position group. I like the fact he played plenty of snaps in-line and as a motion blocker; he can handle himself against defensive ends and the like. He stands out this year as a receiver, though – he's really the only guy with size who can get down the seam and beat safeties. Smooth hands, often great. A little angular and straight-line in his movements, but he runs well enough for separation and his adjustments to crappy passes are excellent.

I think he's a second rounder in any year, but this spring he'll probably go in the first due to position scarcity. Not an elite NFL tight end, but will battle to be in that crowded second tier of "very good" options.

+ Consistently strong hands with impressive reach…you can throw him an off-target pass on third down with confidence
+ Blocks well enough in space and with a hand down; knows the tricks to compete against bigger and faster defenders
- Solid, not spectacular athlete
- Not NFL elite at any one trait
2413058, Ben Koyack, Notre Dame (6'5, 260)
Posted by will_5198, Tue Jan-20-15 01:55 AM
Where in the fuck is Notre Dame breeding these tall, athletic, white tight ends? Every time they send one off to the NFL, there's a carbon copy starting for them the next fall, and this has been going on for the better part of a decade now.

This year’s version isn't exactly breaking any molds, and more of an "above-average blocker who can run out for a pass" than anything else. His routes are sort of methodical/awkward, but he's aware of it -- he'll use box out skills and throw inside elbows to get free. Good tracking and hands, too.

He's not going to have many plays drawn up for him, but he can attack the short areas, win a big catch downfield occasionally, and hold up his end of blocking assignments. Third or fourth round.

+ Decent run blocker (he should sustain better) and very smooth drops in pass protection
+ Lined up in slot and bunch formations, but really looks best releasing from in-line
+ Adjusts to bad passes well; smooth hands even in traffic
- Doesn't fly down the seam or have plus-athleticism
- Routes can be choppy or amateurish (running directly into a zone defender instead of stemming)
2398542, Offensive tackle
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 10:55 AM
Super talented bunch, too bad a lot of them didn't play up to it this season. Still one of the deeper spots in the draft if all the juniors come out.
2398606, TJ Clemmings, Pitt (6'6, 315)
Posted by Y2Flound, Thu Dec-11-14 01:28 PM
Moved from DE to RT this year and started all 13 games as a monster. Huge reason for James Connor's success this year. Only o-lineman to make all ACC team that wasn't on the preseason all ACC team since lineman is usually just about name recognition.

I don't know how scouts really rate people, but I hear lots of good things about him being 1st round pick.
2402489, Cedric Ogbuehi, Texas A&M (6'5, 300)
Posted by will_5198, Tue Dec-23-14 01:36 PM
I'll make a lot of excuses for him because I still believe in his talent. In fact, he was probably too talented for college -- he got away with sloppy habits his entire career because most defenders couldn't beat his natural ability.

The one glaring issue is his passive punch. His wingspan is so good, and his hands so quick, he can usually keep them holstered near his waist and wait to strike. I've routinely seen him stop an inside rush using just one arm. However, defensive ends started to pick up on that and went right for his chest, and nobody is good enough to hold their ground once a defender has a latch on your numbers. That led to some walk-back pressure and lunging (although the sacks allowed number is inflated by Kenny Hill and Kyle Allen lacking much pocket presence).

To me, all that is correctable. The uncoachable stuff is what's appealing: he's an excellent run blocker for left tackle, his movement range is crazy (he runs downfield like a receiving tight end, sealing off linebackers eight yards away) and he's got the most agile big man feet in the draft. Even with his struggles this season, when everything comes together he's the kind of prospect that can be an offensive cornerstone starter for a decade. A top five talent that I'd gladly take in the top 15.

+ Create-a-player body type and athleticism for left tackle: elite wingspan, feet to mirror the quickest of inside or outside rushes and no bad weight
+ Smart enough to change positions three times in three years, with the upside of inexperience at any one spot
+ Most teams are happy enough if you can keep the quarterback clean, but he can be just as dominant as a run blocker
- Game is almost too easy for him and lures him into mistakes, will need better focus as a pro
2402492, Ronnie Stanley, Notre Dame (6'5, 315)
Posted by will_5198, Tue Dec-23-14 01:36 PM
He can do it all. First year at left tackle and he was a natural, showing elite balance against all the tricky parts of the position (inside counter moves, outside speed, second level blocks). He started out a little shaky, and had a couple bad series after that, but he was the best player on the field against Florida State, Stanford and arguably USC.

One of the few college tackles that have the feet to mirror the fastest rushers (I'd say only him and Ogbuehi qualify in this draft). He's just as good drive blocking, and makes some amazing downfield blocks on screens (not many tackles can snipe a safety 15 yards away). First round with the best yet to come.

+ Great natural build for left tackle and excellent arm length
+ Controlled athleticism; he can jump out against blitzing defensive backs and gets to the second level with purpose
+ Huge improvement this season and will only get better with more experience at the position
- Has a few bad snaps where he forgets his technique, either bending too much or stopping his feet
2402495, Brandon Scherff, Iowa (6'5, 320)
Posted by will_5198, Tue Dec-23-14 01:38 PM
Keep him at left tackle and he'll be a bust. Depending on how your line is set-up, he should play right tackle or guard, although he has a nasty habit of giving up pressure/penetration to his inside shoulder (even when he's flanked to the outside and doesn't have to worry about the speed rush). So shifting him next to center is not going to be a slam dunk fix to his protection issues.

What you're paying for is the most dominant zone blocker in the country -- once he releases downhill, he wipes out the second level. Defensive ends get carried into the sideline. Linebackers have no chance. He can even reach safeties playing out of the box. His 10-yard split must be crazy, because he fires off the snap better than anybody. Super strong too (he'll probably put up huge bench numbers).

In the passing game the news is not so good. His athleticism is all straight-ahead; when he has to dance around he's clunky. His technique also needs to be perfect every snap, because he can't recover if his feet get a step too far outside. Even at right tackle he's going to have some long Sundays. I'm not down with burning a top ten pick on a guard, especially since his value is tied into run blocking and this is a deep class at tackle. He'll go in the first, but I'd skip him myself.

+ Instant running game upgrade
+ Rare lineman who can pancake NFL defenders while on the move
- Short arms; gets overpowered by smaller linebackers with wingspan
- Scheme-hidden and faced a bunch of weak defensive fronts this season
2402497, La'el Collins, LSU (6'5, 322)
Posted by will_5198, Tue Dec-23-14 01:39 PM
I'm absolutely sure he'd be an excellent guard, but for now I'd give him a try at either tackle spot (which are more valuable starting positions). He's got adequate potential in protection; hardly graceful but with enough quickness and technique to get the job done. He will get caught in a bad position now and then, although unlike a lot of former interior linemen, his recovery is surprisingly good.

As a run blocker he hurts people. He's a better man-blocking lineman than Scherff, since he's got a stronger latch and is more dominant in tight spaces. The best part is how he finishes blocks, since he's not satisfied until you're half buried into the ground. That good mean streak.

His junior year ended in a freefall, so it was good to see him sustain and improve this season as a senior. Late first round.

+ Elite run mauler who can relocate defenders five to ten yards downfield
+ If tackle doesn't work out, he'll be an All-Pro guard
- It's not all the time, but he does lunge and miss blocks enough to notice
- Will never be a lockdown tackle against the best defensive ends
2406784, Andrus Peat, Stanford (6'7, 313)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-05-15 01:11 AM
In a perfect world he comes back for an injury-free senior year, because he has a lot to work on. He's pro-ready right today as a run blocker; he destroys defensive linemen as well as anybody in the draft. He can also move -- I've seen him pull across the formation and bury Myles Jack running in space.

In protection there are issues. Mainly, he lays his hands on rushers instead of attacking them with his punch. The better college players can swipe them away or power right through; God help him when an elite NFL defensive end sees him trying to slap at his numbers. Even now there's a lot of bending and lunging and falling backwards against guys that weigh 60 pounds less. His feet are solid though, and he's nimble for his size, so if he can learn to hit people while moving backwards, he'll be fine (though not spectacular).

With his skill-set I think he's a great fit at right tackle. Late first this year; could be top 12 next season (well, he could go top 15 this draft too...but these are my grades).

+ Takedown run blocker who can reach anybody on the field
+ As good on screens downfield as he is in short yardage; really punishes people and is agile for his size
- On the ground way too much as a pass blocker, gets bullied due to a soft first strike
- I wonder about his wingspan sometimes...doesn't seem to match his height
2413045, D.J. Humphries, Florida (6'4, 290)
Posted by will_5198, Tue Jan-20-15 12:08 AM
He has games where he looks like a NFL starting left tackle, and games where he looks like a back-up at right tackle. The talent's all there, however. Ideally I see him at right tackle, where he can rely on his excellent run blocking while he gets coached up on protection technique. The latter part is the key -- if he cleans up the dead feet and over-extension, he's got the movement and wingspan to play either side.

Fuck it, I'm in...boom or bust second rounder that I'm gambling on.

+ Fluid athlete who gets upfield like a man 70 pounds lighter, with plenty of room to bulk up
+ An edge clearer in the run game, against some of the best defensive ends in the country no less
+ Untapped potential after being freed from Jeff Driskel
- Plenty of "what the hell..." lapses in fundamentals
- Never played a full season due to injuries
- Might always be a tease
2413046, Jake Fisher, Oregon (6'6, 300)
Posted by will_5198, Tue Jan-20-15 12:09 AM
I like that you know what you're getting with him. He shoots his hands quickly, and once he gets a latch, the play is essentially over for the defender. If he doesn't strike first, and can't get his hands inside, he's going to hold or look like a tackling dummy. He relies on that punch and his wingspan a lot, because his feet aren't swift enough to slide in the pocket against top-end speed.

He's got the run-blocking down pat, though. Quick to the second level, with the same punch aggression and he finishes blocks like an asshole. Oregon's offense gives them some advantages with running game numbers, but he was legitimately driving guys off the ball. A solid right tackle prospect (he played left this past season partly due to injury, but he's a two-year starter on the right side and that's his pro fit) who I'd take late in the second round.

+ Mean and fast in the run game; he can make all the blocks and do them well
+ Great wingspan with a lockdown latch
- Doesn't have much margin for error in protection, due to athletic limits
- Gets into a guessing game with elite rushers, since he has to overplay speed or punch too early
2429884, Ereck Flowers, Miami-FL (6'6, 324)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Mar-16-15 12:32 AM
I'm not a fan, and frankly, a little confused as to why he's so well-regarded. I suppose he's a strong run blocker, since he can drive with plenty of power, but he also lunges a bunch and doesn't get to linebackers very well. In fact, his whole movement is sloppy, with a "drunk dancing bear" look. The wingspan and size are there in protection, but I've seen him burnt up by speed and he over-commits against counter moves.

Despite all the ugliness he still manages to have shut-out quarters and even whole games. I'm just not sure how he does it. Third round.

+ Brutish run blocker that was usually leading the way on Duke Johnson's bigger plays
+ Great length and size; succeeds in spite of his technique awkwardness
- Horrible at bending at the waist and his kick-slide is vulnerable
- Has more ugly snaps than most potential starters at offensive tackle
2398543, Offensive guard
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 10:55 AM
2406786, Jarvis Harrison, Texas A&M (6'4, 330)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-05-15 01:11 AM
He's the best guard in this class. He played left tackle for a couple of games while Ogbuehi was figuring his shit out, and actually did well -- held his own against Shane Ray, which is more than most conference tackles can say. I love his discipline in protection (he keeps his feet light against counters, seeing twists before they happen) and he drive blocks with an awesome latch. Rarely has a bad snap...it was criminal some of the names that got All-SEC ahead of him. High third round.

+ Once he gets his hands on you, you're not going anywhere until the whistle blows
+ He can start at either guard spot and be a swing tackle back-up
- Athletic but not elite in that department; there are better downfield blockers
2406788, Josue Matias, Florida State (6'6, 325)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-05-15 01:13 AM
When he gets behind his pads and squares up defenders, he's special. He's got an immense latch and can get on the move and elbow drop the middle linebacker in space. When he puts his head down and starts lunging though, he's horrible. It's about 60/40 which version you'll see of him in every game, and his bad plays are spectacularly bad, but he was still Florida State's best linemen before Cameron Irving moved to center.

I like his athleticism and run blocking; I think he can become good enough in protection. Third round, maybe closer to the fourth.

+ Long arms and powerful in space or tight quarters
+ Does well on combination blocks and can play in zone or man
- Technique can disintegrate from snap to snap
- Overall athletic but feet aren't the greatest when mirroring
2406789, Donovan Smith, Penn State (6'5, 335)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-05-15 01:14 AM
A career tackle who'll move inside as a pro, preferably at right guard. He's a player that doesn't look graceful, but gets the job done and even has some snaps that make you say "whoa." Like when he manhandles Joey Bosa on a run play, and tosses him to the ground like a small child. Or obliterates Randy Gregory for an entire game. Or blocks Shilique Calhoun's pass rush with one arm.

He's not making those plays every snap, or he'd be a low first-rounder, but there's upside here as a short-area blocker. Put him in a man scheme (he doesn't move that well) and I'm betting he has plenty more good days than bad. Third or fourth round.

+ A brute on running plays with a punch that can knock anybody on their ass
+ Can dominate the most elite defenders from time to time
+ Good enough feet on initial moves and first contact
- Squatty, fat look and slowly chugs around the line on pulls
- Dreaded "waist-bender"
2406790, Ty Sambrailo, Colorado State (6'5, 315)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-05-15 01:15 AM
He was a left tackle in college, but isn't going to stick there (or even on the right). Which is fine; he's got an ugly, guard's body and a nasty attitude -- he plays to the echo of the whistle when run-blocking. He's got a good initial drop in protection, but all his problems came on inside moves he couldn't counter or NFL speed that beat his kick-slide. Those issues are mitigated at guard. However, he did get away with a lot of technique flaws due to the level of competition. Annoying "tough guy" that teams love to have and opponents hate. Fourth or fifth round.

+ Bully as a run blocker; he'll shove a defender 10 yards downfield just because he can
- Drops his head a ton after his initial strike; can end up on his knees too much
- Arms aren't positively proportionate to his height and overall his physique looks sloppy
2406791, A.J. Cann, South Carolina (6'4, 311)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-05-15 01:16 AM
I've seen this guy hyped up as the best guard in the country and a sleeper pick to sneak into the first round. Not sure what the hell they're watching. At his very best he's solid, without any elite traits.

For someone who's started nearly every game since his redshirt freshman season, you wouldn't expect as many fundamental lapses like poor cut blocks and high leverage in short yardage. And he needs his technique to be perfect, because his arms are short and he's not very mobile (even on short-side pulls he misses linebackers). Sixth or seventh round.

+ Can make some nice seal and drive blocks; mostly plays with very good leverage in the running game
- Not a strong NFL fit for zone blocking and ducks his head a lot
- If he's actually 6'4 I'll name my first child Steve Spurrier
2406792, Arie Kouandjio, Alabama (6'5, 315)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-05-15 01:17 AM
He's got the wingspan thing going for him and has his moments as a straight-ahead run blocker. Everything else is shaky. He's off-balance way too much, and it's a coin flip whether he'll fall down or crush his man on a reach block. In protection he can hold up against that initial rush, but after that he'll give up his shoulder and look bad doing it. Sixth round.

+ Makes some impressive run blocks
- Not reliable on pulls or as a pass-blocker
2406793, Vadal Alexander, LSU (6'6, 340)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-05-15 01:18 AM
Put him on a team that runs a power, man-blocking scheme, and he'll do alright. Face up against a tackle or end, and he can drive block almost anybody in college. But that's it. Anything on the second level, he's not getting to without scraping a knee first. Pulling is a success if he clears the line of scrimmage. Zone blocks are out of the question. Pass-blocking is fine as long as defensive fronts never stunt or the ball gets out before his man can do something dangerous like a swim move. Sixth or seventh round.

+ He'll clear the way on inside runs, or at least obstruct to the point where it's hard to get around him
+ *Salute* to the highest leg whip of the 2014 season; a full-on karate kick to the midsection
- Most NFL linemen can move faster backwards than he does forward
- His defender in pass protection should always be read by the quarterback as a double-gap blitz
- Out to lunch on approximately 62 percent of his snaps; a threat to block nobody on any given play
2398544, Center
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 10:56 AM
Eight rookies are starting at center right now in the NFL, which says more about the state of the league's inside line play than an amazing 2014 class.

I see a few more potential starters emerging this year, a couple with the ability to become very good. Which is rare at this position.
2398545, Defensive end
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 10:56 AM
A few rushing threats, but the most impressive plays I saw from this group were against the run.
2399178, Leonard Williams, USC (6'5, 291)
Posted by will_5198, Sat Dec-13-14 07:18 PM
He's a game-changer…on run defense. You can't single block him, because his leverage and strength are so freakish that he sled drives all linemen into the backfield. Doubles are no problem, he'll sink and anchor both gaps at worst, or just straight slice through them with his athleticism. Nose, one-tech, end...he's going to give every other defender a better match-up.

Thing is, he can't rush the passer. At least not now. He's last-guy-in-motion slow when rushing from end, and only a little faster when they kick him inside. Once he gets going he'll try and bully his way into the backfield with power, but the difference in protection is the linemen just have to stay in front of you, not move you anywhere. His pure strength breaks them down eventually, but that takes too long against NFL quarterbacks. Maybe he learns some moves that he can play off his punch, maybe not. It's the one (big) thing keeping him from being a top three player, since it's hard to justify taking any defender that high who doesn't change the passing game. Top ten though.

+ Perfect size and wingspan for the five technique, his measurables would bring a tear down Belichick's haggard, deviled face
+ You cannot set an edge against his side, he basically takes out half the run plays from your playbook
+ Fits in any front and can two-gap while everyone else plays one
+ Even when he's stalling as a rusher, he can still draw two blockers
- Mediocre burst off the snap
- No pass rush moves or set-ups
2402500, Shilique Calhoun, Michigan State (6'5, 256)
Posted by will_5198, Tue Dec-23-14 01:42 PM
An eye-test player that doesn't match his reputation. He's got an imposing, NFL-ready frame, looking like he's going to step on the field and crack heads open. Then the game starts...and a whole lot of nothing happens.

There's plenty of snaps where it's obvious he's holding gaps and letting the backers clean-up, which is fine, but he also gets single-blocked by tight ends on runs. Once he's "unleashed" on passing downs, the majority of his rushes are just him leaning into the tackle. Sometimes he breaks out a spin move, where he usually ends up falling down before he completes the 360. His biggest issue is his patty cake hands -- he doesn't use them to get off blocks at all. You can be rangy and fast and athletic, but if you're not punching off linemen you're not going to be a threat. Sadly it's a two-year trend from last season that he never corrected.

Now occasionally he goes for inside-outside fakes when he rushes, and is actually damn good at those when he uses them. Because he's quick off the snap and can get linemen unbalanced. He's also an excellent pursuit player. That still gives him a long way to go as an every-down impact defender, though. If he stays in school he has top 50 potential. He comes out now and I'd put him in the fourth round.

+ Great size and reach, if he could harness those powers for good
+ Surprising jump off the line and has his moments as a run defender
- Doesn't have great closing speed and his balance sucks...a ton of whiffs in the backfield
- Some of the worst hands I've seen from a well-regarded defensive linemen, he gets glued onto blocks
- Whole series go by where an H-back is handling him with no help
2409855, ...staying in school. smart.
Posted by guru0509, Mon Jan-12-15 03:03 PM
2402502, Mario Edwards Jr., Florida State (6'3, 294)
Posted by will_5198, Tue Dec-23-14 01:43 PM
Above-average run stopper but I don't see much more potential than that. He sets a hell of an edge, and I've seen him blow up two linemen, a fullback, and *still* make the tackle on the same run play. He's got a burst and compact build that's really hard to hit a gap against. Plus he can play any position across the line.

Nothing doing as a pass rusher, however. He has one move -- the bull rush -- and hasn't shown the talent to develop more. OK, sometimes he'll show a swim or rip, but it's so rare I barely count it. He's slow around the corner, doesn't have the dip and burst to get NFL pressure and hand usage is minimal. Sad part is he'll keep doing the same thing for the entire game no matter how ineffective it is. You're conceding a rusher by keeping him on the field for passing downs.

He'd be helpful for any NFL front, but won't elicit much enthusiasm to grab high. Someone will probably bite in the third round.

+ Athletic run defender who can take on multiple blocks or get penetration
+ Versatile enough to play any gap or technique...
- ...But also sort of a tweener
- Less than ideal wingspan with a remedial grasp of pass rushing skills (no counters, plans, etc.)
2406794, Arik Armstead, Oregon (6'8, 290)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-05-15 01:20 AM
He got a lot better this year, but he's still just a run defender. He carries his size extremely well -- he looks like a ripped, bulked up linebacker – and can be dominating against single run-blocking. His punch is vicious, so once he gets his arms extended he can move linemen however he wants. There are a ton of plays where he blows up a tight end or guard and doesn't get any stat credit for ruining the run.

Too bad "methodical" is the most flattering I can be when it comes to his pass rushing. It's usually just straight power, which can get a pressure here and there, but he's not a closer and his jump isn't good. In 37 games against FBS opponents, he has...2.5 career sacks. Maybe NFL coaching can get a little more out of him, but I see his career as a multi-front, hand-down, two-down player. Third round (although I'm excited about his teammate DeForest Buckner, who is reportedly staying in school but does all the same things better).

+ Great size and gap flexibility against the run
+ Big body agility to chase down the line or split gaps for TFLs
- Still gets upright at times
- Not an edge threat and lacks quickness at the start and end of rushes
2406795, Markus Golden, Missouri (6'3, 260)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-05-15 01:21 AM
I can see him carving a role as a Pernell McPhee-type if his pass rush arsenal gets a little deeper. He's fast off the line for his size (once he was healthy, his jumps were as good as, or even better than Ray's) and a little bull once he gets going. Big-time pain in the ass on run plays, since he's stocky enough to anchor down but has the quickness to blow past pulls and lead blockers.

Doesn't have many pass rush moves right now, and the ones he tries are undeveloped (huge arm arc to his swim move that leaves him vulnerable). He's good with his hands but takes long, circular routes to the quarterback and gets a bit one-dimensional. Also, his lack of arm length is going to be a sizable issue to plenty of times.

All that keeps him out of the top 45 to me, but his ability to stack and shed from lots of starting points is worth something. Very solid get in the third round.

+ Great leverage, a bowling ball that's hard to block and more athletic than he looks
+ Plus run defender for his size and high, high effort
- Short arms and linear rusher...NFL tackles are going to lock him out
2409509, Alvin Dupree, Kentucky (6'4, 264)
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jan-11-15 09:37 PM
I can't figure out what he does, or is supposed to be doing, that's so impressive. He has a good-to-very-good jump for his size, but doesn't convert it into pressure (few secondary moves and he overruns the pocket often). The majority of his sacks came against bad offensive tackles or on complete protection busts. He's flexible enough to drop into short coverage (where he does nothing most of the time), but not a great athlete in the NFL sense. Average run defender. Basically, it's one big shrug watching him play.

If my team took him in the top three rounds, I'd have preferred someone else.

+ Consistent swipe move with his hands to keep offensive tackles off him
+ Played both defensive end and outside linebacker spots
- Doesn't show strength in his hands and gets engulfed on power rushes or better drive blocking
- Not awful at anything, just a boring, average prospect
2412837, Preston Smith, Mississippi State (6'6, 270)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-19-15 12:23 PM
On the outside he's solid. When he moves inside, though, he's special. A sly athlete -- his break down technique and ability to move is surprisingly good -- with tons of power. On the edge he's more of a gate-keeper against the run, since his jump is very average and he doesn't turn the corner quick enough. Slide him over a guard or center, however, and he starts making things happen.

Way too quick for interior linemen to handle, with a developing swim move (lifts it too high at times and exposes his side) and bull rush combo that's overwhelming. He's got bulk, tackles quick targets in space, and can line up from the five-technique to nose shade. I'm a big fan. Late first, early second.

+ Long arms and he uses them well
+ Functionally strong but much more agile than you'd think
+ Blows shit up when he lines up at tackle
- Typical tall man leverage problems
- Has to work hard and deceptively to get outside pressures, since he's not a natural dip-and-rip rusher
2412838, Nate Orchard, Utah (6'4, 255)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-19-15 12:25 PM
A certified beast. He has a *great* get-off, and he's a terror with his hands -- all season he made offensive tackles like Peat, Fisher and Sambrailo look really bad. He can walk you back with his punch, he can fake a direction and toss you like a small child, or he can just rip outside and beat you with speed. Even if you absorb his first blow, he'll get all the coverage and second-effort sacks with his persistence.

Unfortunately he looks like he studied under Shane Ray in run defense, dice rolling on what gap the back will choose. When he keeps his leverage and attacks the man in front of him, he has enough strength to do well, but it's something he'll need to learn.

I don't think the Combine will be too kind to him, but give me the guy who's a monster on the field. Late first, early second round.

+ Rushes with speed, power and varied technique
+ Relentless with his rush and always in pursuit
+ Super productive when it mattered (7.5 of his sacks were against ranked opponents, and 6.5 more were against bowl teams)
- Not an elite athlete and has issues in space
2412847, Brett Hundley still has this guy's number imprinted on his jersey
Posted by MothershipConnection, Mon Jan-19-15 12:41 PM
Dude is fucking relentless, he terrorized the Pac-12 this year. I don't know if he's big enough to be a every down full time star DE but I imagine at some point in his career he ends up on a team with a good DL and becomes a Cliff Avril or Willie Young type that's an absolute pain in the pass to block for 30 snaps a game.
2412840, Owamagbe Odighizuwa, UCLA (6'3, 270)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-19-15 12:27 PM
Within two yards of the line of scrimmage, he's one of the best in the class. It's extremely difficult to run on him, because he might have the strongest punch of any defender -- he crumples blockers with his hands. Once he's off the block, he has weakside linebacker quickness, which is obviously a good thing at 270 pounds.

Too bad he's completely undeveloped as a pass rusher. Heavy hands are a great start, and a dozen times per game he has a great punch, but he doesn't know how to convert that into a pressure. Linemen just recover and lock him out. He has no real moves, he's very straight-line in his rushes (no counter or inside-outside threats), and gets stuck on blocks far longer than he ever should. I think his arm length could also be part of it, because he doesn't look to have a great wingspan, which is an issue that NFL tackles will only exacerbate.

It's understandable he's behind with technique, since he missed the entire 2013 season with an injury, but long-term you have to wonder if he's going to reach even an intermediate level. Regardless, I like him enough as a catlike run defender who's already mastered the most critical tool (strong hands) in the trenches. Early third.

+ Stone-laying hands that jolt the biggest and strongest linemen
+ Run disruptor that can defend sideline to sideline
+ Crazy physique for his weight; he's a star without pads
- Extremely raw as a pass rusher and doesn't disengage when attacking the quarterback
- On the shorter side and might have an arm length problem
- Has a lot of "almost" moments on the field
2412850, He could max out as Michael Bennett
Posted by MothershipConnection, Mon Jan-19-15 12:48 PM
Unfortunately like you said he doesn't really have a clue what to do on a pass rush. He sort of reminds me of Datone Jones' first three years at UCLA where we had this DL who should be just way too strong and fast for college OL to block but didn't really get the results you'd expect rushing the passer. Except Jones put it all together his senior year and has been a relative disappointment in the NFL so that's not working in his favor.

Owa does defend the run like a guy who's 20 pounds heavier and there's some upside there... even if his floor is a run down DE that only flashes at rushing the passer that's not a bad 2nd or 3rd round pick.
2412852, yeah, he's got the toolkit but no instructions
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-19-15 12:53 PM
I was impressed early on, figuring the pressures would come, but he stalled out all season (not including the Zach Banner fiasco). of the sacks he *did* get, more than a few were on straight protection busts.

he'll probably run and jump fast enough to be top 50, like you said. and an athletic run defending DE isn't the worst floor imaginable.
2398546, Defensive tackle
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 10:56 AM
2398895, Danny Shelton, U of Washington
Posted by PROMO, Fri Dec-12-14 12:50 PM
Best DT in the draft, period.

Should be a top 5 pick.
2399145, one of the weirder prospects I watched this season.
Posted by will_5198, Sat Dec-13-14 02:16 PM
He's got the mindset of Warren Sapp in the body of Gilbert Brown. Most of the time he's not even playing two gaps, but single-blocked and trying to get into the backfield in a really awkward way.

They ran a bunch of stunts with him, which were a waste of time...until he would bizarrely make a big TFL after plodding around the corner. He's strong -- really strong -- and usually tries to walk back or throw off linemen (although he shows a developing rip move). Often though, he stands up doing that, and despite his nose tackle size he can lose against doubles or get blown back by a smaller player when forgets leverage.

He dominated in college with an unorthodox style, but I don't think he'll get away with the same tricks in the NFL. Still valuable as a relentless two-gap nose tackle. Second round valuable.

+ Rare size for a NFL that's getting leaner defensively
+ Incredible stamina; most of his plays are second-effort despite a high number of snaps
+ Makes an inordinate number of solo tackles for a tackle his size
- Inconsistent doing what he'd be best at...occupying double teams
- Not the freak athlete his counting stats suggest; seven of his nine sacks were against Hawaii, Eastern Washington and Georgia State
2399146, Eddie Goldman, Florida State (6'4, 313)
Posted by will_5198, Sat Dec-13-14 02:18 PM
I like him a lot. The rare three-down lineman who can sit down against double-team run blocks and also get pressure up the middle. Really athletic chasing to the sideline; if you try to single-block him on outside runs you are in for a world of pain. On passing downs he's got a quick jump and great swim move, although his hands are strong enough to walk back plenty of interior linemen with the old power rush. There were games where was dominating every other play, and he was probably the team's best defender (along with Jalen Ramsey).

There were also games where he wasn't as consistent. He *can* play double teams well, but he can also get high and run off the line of scrimmage. His pass rushing comes and goes, for a quarter he'll be the slowest guy off the snap and completely locked out by the center. I wonder about his true wingspan, since guards who absorb his first punch have an easy time keeping a latch on him.

It's worth noting he did play a ton of snaps this year, mostly due to the fact Florida State nearly lost every game and the coaches were scared to rest him for a series. Versatile defender who should go in the higher part of the first round.

+ Annihilates the stretch play and feel free to inside trap him if you want to see him steal the hand-off
+ Can shift to nose tackle, three technique or end
+ Breaks down the middle of the pocket as a rusher with technique, athleticism and leverage
- Stretches of inconsistency and bad leverage
2399149, Michael Bennett, Ohio State (6'2, 288)
Posted by will_5198, Sat Dec-13-14 02:19 PM
I always want to throw in the towel on him as a prospect, but at least once a game he'll make the perfect three-technique play -- instant penetration to blow up a run, or an incredibly athletic swim move that beats the center *and* the running back -- to keep me invested. It's the other 50 snaps where he does absolutely nothing against single blocking, gets dismantled by double teams or looks like he's running a twist in slow motion that make me crazy.

He's got the quickness and shows some pass rush how-to, but often he's a defensive place-holder. Too bad he couldn't play Wisconsin every week, because he looked like a top 10 pick against them the last couple of seasons. As is, I'd wait until the third round.

+ He has the athleticism and movement to get into a backfield...sometimes
+ Chases well down the line, he can disrupt zone runs and blocks that move laterally
- Real problems against guards with NFL wingspan
- Not your best man when it comes to defending the interior against a power run
- Magically disappears for 3/4ths the game
2412841, Malcolm Brown, Texas (6'2, 320)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-19-15 12:28 PM
Love this guy. He's the best in the class at sitting down against run doubles, coupled with a stealthy (for 320 pounds, I guess) burst to get into the backfield. He holds gaps, can play sideline to sideline *and* makes tackles…most defensive tackles fail at one of those. As a pass-rusher he's mostly brute strength, with a swim here and a spin there, but he can collapse the pocket just with his hand power and quickness.

Wore down in games because Texas relied on him so much (playing him at end on passing downs), but that won't be an issue in a proper NFL rotation. Not as explosive as other prospects but a steady, disruptive force that can defend three downs. First round.

+ Equally great run-stuffer against straight doubles or zoning
+ Has a burst for his size and finishes plays
+ Strong as fuck
- Gets lackadaisical with his rush moves, ends up leaning on blockers instead of disengaging
2398547, Outside linebacker
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 10:57 AM
I'll list the rush linebackers who basically play as ends here, because I hate the idea of using the ubiquitous "edge player" definition that's cropping up.
2398898, Hau'oli Kikaha, U of Washington
Posted by PROMO, Fri Dec-12-14 12:55 PM
Led CFB in sacks in 2014. Plus speed and is very good edge setter.

At UW he was mostly used in a rush end type style using his speed and good technique to get around left tackle. A bit small to be a true DE in the NFL (at least right now) but he could be a combo LB/DE similar to Bruce Irvin for the Seahawks...but I think he's more talented and fundamental than Irvin.

Don't recall how he did in coverage off top but he did have some picks in his career which leads me to believe he's decent.
2406796, Vic Beasley, Clemson (6'3, 235)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-05-15 01:22 AM
He's going to be really good. Instant pass rush to any defense you add him to. I'm not too worried about his size; his arms look long enough and he does a great job with his hands to keep tackles off his chest. Ridiculous first step. What makes him better than any other edge rusher in this draft are his inside moves; he already had grab and rip options, but then he perfected a spin move this year that undressed some really good tackles. One of his inside counters against Florida State split the tackle and guard in about 1.5 seconds…I haven't seen a double beat that fast since Von Miller.

Best pass rusher in the draft. Top ten.

+ Fast, locks out bigger tackles with great hand strength and wingspan
+ Smart, technical rusher who comes with a plan of attack and adapts to tendencies
- Lacks height and thin frame that's close to maxed out (he'll be 23 when the season starts)
- Not used to dropping in coverage at all, if that's what your defense calls for at times
2423307, crushed it
Posted by will_5198, Sun Feb-22-15 04:56 PM
- came in 15 pounds heavier than listed weight and wingspan measured fine
- still ran a 4.5, with 35 bench reps, a sick 10'10" broad jump, plus a receiver/running back 3-cone (6.91) and short shuttle (4.15) times
2423368, Exactly
Posted by DeepAztheRoot, Sun Feb-22-15 09:22 PM
Would love him for the Saints in the first round

He's the best of Beasley, Gregory, Ray, and Fowler to me
2406797, Randy Gregory, Nebraska (6'6, 240)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-05-15 01:24 AM
He's probably the most talented defensive player in the draft. Also one of the more underdeveloped. Last season I was really down on him, since there were whole games where he looked like shit, but he's progressed to the point where his awful moments are rare. When he's on, he does crazy things like get pressure on a three-step drop in shotgun, chase down receivers from the backside and force triple-team blocks.

One thing I'm semi-concerned with is his balance. He falls down a lot. Not completely to the ground, but it's enough lunging and slipping to stop his own rush -- that's a killer for his position. He also seems to drift through games, to the point you forget he's on the field for a quarter. However, his improvement from sophomore to junior year was massive (even though his stats fell off), which is a good sign for more progress to come.

He's going to tear up the Combine and go in the top five. It just may take a couple of years to get the player you expect.

+ Incredible jump, closing burst and arm length, plus his hand strength is elite
+ The best A-gap blitzer in the country and impossible to cut block
+ Only played two years of FBS football, and missed 2012 with a leg injury, so a ton of room to grow
+ High level pursuit player
- Getting better, but can go for long rides against run blocking
- Sizable stretches where he doesn't play up to his potential
2406807, RE: Randy Gregory, Nebraska (6'6, 240)
Posted by DeepAztheRoot, Mon Jan-05-15 01:45 AM
He gets lost at times defending the run, some of that is frame. It seemed opponents this year were more willing to take a few chop blocks and do whatever they could to keep him out of the backfield. He needs to not let that get into his head. He was battling an assortment of injuries post the Miami game this year and like most coaches Bo was less than forthcoming other than DTD. When he was healthy though, virtually impossible to block one-on-one. Maliek Collins will be the one to watch for Nebraska next year.
2406798, Shane Ray, Missouri (6'3, 245)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-05-15 01:26 AM
He's nearly as good as Beasley rushing the passer. Comparable first step and he's got the same depth of counters and moves. Fantastic hands and side-to-side movement – he just doesn't let linemen get a hold of him when going after the quarterback. He's smart, too; he has a plan of attack and set-ups against any tackle that starts to overplay one thing.

He'll have to stand up though, because he's atrocious against the run. No gap discipline at all; maybe he's slanting sometimes but all the double-gapping he does can't be designed. He does the dancing because straight-up he gets mauled...he can barely hold an edge with his hand down. His rare coverage drops are decent though, so no worries there. Top half of the first round.

+ Already mastered the three most important parts of pass rushing: hands, quickness and technique
+ Incredible lateral speed; he never gets neutral in one position and eventually finds a crease
- Just guessing versus the run
2406799, Dante Fowler Jr., Florida (6'3, 261)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-05-15 01:27 AM
Hustle player with highly athletic tools. He's an amorphous defender who can line up at six different positions, and give you disruption from each of those spots. I like him standing up and coming at offenses from different angles, since he's a real slippery blitzer and uses his hands well against blockers. That said, he lacks a defined "go-to" spot -- he's quick but not a superior speed rusher, and he shoots gaps well against the run but is a victim against stronger linemen. The whole "good at everything, not great at one thing" ordeal.

Relentless, though, and he's got a deep array of pass-rushing moves that can only get better. He's talented enough to move around from snap to snap and get the best match-up, which is how a smart defensive coordinator will use him. First round.

+ He can rush from either side, up the middle (might be best at that) and even blow up *running* plays from a three-tech spot (he started his career at defensive tackle)
+ Strong hands that he utilizes perfectly, plus a solid arsenal of spins/rips/swims
+ Deadly on twists and stunts, but has the ability to drop into man coverage on checkdown options
- Causes all sorts of problems against pulls and the like, but direct drive-blocking gives him issues
- Bad habit of coming in high and not breaking down, missed a handful of sacks this season because of that
2409510, Eli Harold, Virginia (6'4, 250)
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jan-11-15 09:39 PM
"The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again expecting a different result." That's this guy. He has a great inside move, which he uses way too often and to declining effect every game. If it's a run play, he tries to slant hard and split the guard and tackle. If it's a pass, he outside fakes and steps hard inside with the counter (very athletically, I'll add). Once in a while he'll beat the defense and look great doing it. The rest of the series he's either a non-factor or getting abused.

However, when he does rush outside, I've never seen him look that great. He's long and has a quick first step, but he's very angular in his movements and doesn't bend around the corner naturally. It shows up in his open field tackling as well, where he can struggle to break down properly. If he ever could use his hands regularly, it might be enough of a feint to make that inside move dangerous, but right now college linemen aren't respecting it.

More of an athlete than football player at this point. He's got enough tools worth sharpening, though, to be taken in the third round.

+ Rangy frame with the hands and straight-line burst to have Bruce Irvin upside
+ Occasionally shows hand strength and technique to make you think he'd be a viable rusher
+ High-motor character guy
- Pass rush strategy and adjustments are non-existent for long, long periods of time
- Has plenty of ugly moments trying to get off run blocks
- Disappears in games, a lot
2409511, Lorenzo Mauldin, Louisville (6'4, 252)
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jan-11-15 09:40 PM
If you're expecting an edge-setter and run-stopper, you'll be good to go. He eats up stretch plays, and has the heavy hands to get off the big boys when he doesn't beat them to the spot. Strong enough to anchor an inside gap as well.

If you need a pass rusher, he's not that guy. He rushes upright as hell, and I don't think he can bend the corner in the NFL. His pressures are going to be manufactured from twists and overloads, since he shoots gaps well and has the strength in his hands to walk back linemen. Late third, early fourth round.

+ Very good punch to dominate outside runs and collapse the pocket
+ Plays with a little extra meanness and experienced at LDE/RDE/ROLB
- Stiff-hipped and a straight-line, non-creative pass rusher
2409512, James Vaughters, Stanford (6'2, 258)
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jan-11-15 09:41 PM
Poor man's homage to James Harrison. He's a stocky bunch of muscles with mallets for hands -- he dominates the edge against run, because he can get under anybody's pads and make them look very, very bad. As a pass rusher he's one-speed and lacks a great first-step, but again, he uses his insane hand strength to overpower blockers and he's relentless. He also shows some game-planning ability, mixing in a half decent spin move or counter, and his bend around the corner is underrated. He'll be a sneaky threat on passing downs and a great weapon on stunts.

A bit of a sleeper in the fourth round or later. I'd be more than happy to have him on my team.

+ Controls the area from the C gap to the sideline against the run; uses tight ends as blocking sleds
+ Great punch that puts much bigger linemen on their heels
+ Moved around all over the place, even at defensive tackle occasionally
- Lacks ideal length and speed
- Not a very good player in space
2398548, Inside linebacker
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 10:57 AM
It's rare to find an inside backer worth taking in the top 50. Size to attack interior linemen and awareness to play the vortex of intermediate passing routes are a tough combo. When choosing, I skew to prospects that have the latter.
2398894, Shaq Thompson, U of Washington
Posted by PROMO, Fri Dec-12-14 12:49 PM
Just won the Paul Hornung Award for most versatile player in CFB.

Will be a 1st round pick. Size, speed and strength to attack the line but also was a HS safety and can cover not just TE's but slot WRs.

Also has first 3 round talent at RB so who knows if someone drafts him to play RB in the NFL.
2408705, Thomas Davis 2.0 (I like him on the outside)
Posted by will_5198, Fri Jan-09-15 05:46 PM
He covers the slot better than any safety in this draft, and there wasn't a tight end in the country this season that he wouldn't have handled man-up. He's a little light in the ass but it's a non-issue to me; Ryan Shazier played under 230 in college and Thompson will be around the same size as him, C.J. Mosley and DeAndre Levy (i.e., three of the better linebackers in the league). Right now he fights through/around blockers well enough and he closes down the sideline quickly. Mid-first round and a longtime, effective starter.

+ Natural coverage ability: reads routes, has patient feet and great ball skills
+ Playmaker (four defensive touchdowns last season) and solid open field tackler who even dominates on coverage teams
+ Stacks and sheds interior linemen better than you’d think
+ Might be better than your back-up running back too
- Gets pushed around inside against quick guards who can get a hold of him
2423573, ^^^^^YEP...this is Carolina's pick in the 1st Round if he's there
Posted by ChampD1012, Mon Feb-23-15 01:47 PM
They aren't going to let Thomas Davis' replacement pass them by...and he could probably play Safety until Thomas Davis hangs it up...

By 25...the top WR and OL will be gone...Landon Collins will be gone too...so this will be BPA for them...
2441490, You called it.... hilarious they had Thomas Davis announce the pick
Posted by MothershipConnection, Fri May-01-15 11:44 PM
I'm like... is he OK this dude is his replacement?
2441845, Buffalo nickel was our primary defense in the final month of the season
Posted by ChampD1012, Sun May-03-15 04:53 PM
through the playoffs...so he'll be playing LB with Luke and Thomas Davis...which will make us fast and he can cover Tight Ends and RBs...

So until Thomas hangs it up...that's the plan...when Thomas hangs it up...he'll move over to his spot...

Our LBs are going to VICIOUS next season...
2409513, Eric Kendricks, UCLA (6'0, 230)
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jan-11-15 09:42 PM
One of the most improved defenders from 2013 to last season. He was an active, hustle player as a junior, but really rounded out the flaws in his game as a senior. He gives you all he can in run defense -- he crashes through gaps without regard for his size and his movement is surgical in traffic. A tackling machine, although he'll whiff once or twice a game due to over aggression. The biggest surprise this fall was his coverage. Much better diagnostics on screens and underneath routes, plus he showed off some ball skills (one-handed pick against USC was nice).

Upside is short of a star, but it's easy to see him becoming a solid NFL starter. Second round.

+ Fearless, sideline to sideline run defender
+ Extremely high field awareness...sees run and pass plays before they develop
+ Defensive QB and team captain; made all the calls and played through significant injuries over his career
- Not the greatest size for his aggressive style (although you could slide him to the outside) and gets put on skates by linemen from time to time
- Makes plenty of good plays, but few great ones
2409515, Benardrick McKinney, Mississippi State (6'5, 249)
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jan-11-15 09:45 PM
He's great at what he does, but his game is a bit antiquated for the modern NFL. Probably the best tackler in the draft -- he always wraps up and when he hits you, it's violent and abrupt. Very much like Dont'a Hightower as a tackler. He's no stiff, either; he can move to the edge and shut it down against fast, elusive backs. Great instincts when shown motion and counters, too.

Pass defense is his limiter, though. He's one of those robots in zone coverage -- tell him to drop to a spot, and he drops *exactly* to that spot, without any feel for the routes being run around him -- and is going to lose battles in man coverage after five yards. He'll get moved hard on play-action flow too. Probably worst of all, he gets panicky when a pass is in his area code and will mug the nearest body.

He'd be a late first-rounder 15 years ago. But I can't really see spending a top-64 selection on a guy who'll see fewer snaps than your nickel corner. A bigger Brandon Spikes-type. Third round, sub-package defender.

+ Rarely, if ever, blocked out of a gap and punishes linemen with his wingspan and strength
+ Sure tackler that drops runners like they hit a wall (even if he doesn't have a perfect angle)
- He'll have to be hidden in pass coverage and limited to flat route assignments
- Not a good pass rusher, so viability is only on first and second down
2409518, Paul Dawson, TCU (6'2, 230)
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jan-11-15 09:53 PM
He's all-around solid. He'll give you some pop in run support, although he's one of those guys that tends to duck and slide around blockers when he can. Where he really flashes is zone coverage: he's smart (sees through decoy routes that cross his face), stays calm in his drop and his ball skills are definitely above average. He tied for the national lead in interceptions (four) this season among non-defensive backs, a couple of which were impressive snags that plenty safeties couldn't make.

He's limited athletically, but will make all the plays within his ability. Fourth round.

+ Solid tackler who gets his man down once he's squared up
+ Smooth, smart zone defender
- Lacks pursuit speed and top athleticism
- His knack in zone doesn't apply at all to man coverage; he mauls guys and gets run away from down the seams
2409519, Denzel Perryman, Miami-FL (6'1, 242)
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jan-11-15 09:55 PM
A lot of fun to watch in college. He was always flying around and making big hits; one of those fast, old-school enforcer linebackers The U is known for. I don't think he'll make a great transition to the pros, however.

He's stout, has a burst and *really* good moving forward...great run stuffer, right? Well, not consistently. For stretches he slips off blocks like they're nothing, then he gets mauled at the second level on three straight runs. I've seen him pancake an offensive tackle, and a few plays later, get run over by a slot receiver. Same goes for his tackling, which is an even mix of highlight-reel hits and air tackles. That unevenness is a big problem, because his coverage isn't good at all. Big splash plays against the run, but you can't rely on him from series to series. Fourth round.

+ Cuts through gaps with anticipation and overwhelming quickness
+ Instinctive at the LOS and plays fast against the run
- His coverage drops against crossing routes is like an infant doing a Rubik's cube
- Short arms that give him problems as a blitzer, getting off blocks and especially contesting passes
- Inconsistent tackler that goes for death blows instead of wrap-ups
2409520, Hayes Pullard, USC (6'1, 235)
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jan-11-15 09:56 PM
I'll be lazy here, but the similarities to Malcolm Smith (former Trojan) are too evident. Not the biggest guy, especially with how active he is around the LOS, but instincts for days against the run and always making tackles. Just like Smith, he's a more dangerous blitzer than you'd expect and does some OK work in the short passing game (although Smith was better at the latter part in college).

A very good back-up type who can step in for a series, quarter or game and be the next man up without a huge drop-off. Fourth or fifth round.

+ Attacks downhill and will make an impact on special teams
+ The one-man, running back screen killer
- Gets a lot of passes completed right past his head
- Tweener between replacement-level starter and above-average depth
2398549, Cornerback
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 10:58 AM
My favorite position and one of the hardest to watch closely without full field angles. You can still see those hips move though.
2398604, Trae Waynes, Michigan State (6'1, 182)
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 01:25 PM
The best corner in the country. Narduzzi leaves him in press man coverage with zero help nearly the entire game, and he's got almost the perfect frame to handle that -- a little skinny, but long arms and fluid enough to play any route. Unlike a lot of college press corners who get away with opening up their hips and making up space with downfield contact, he stays completely balanced through the initial route stem. He usually lines up at left corner, but he can play either side (field or boundary), slot, blitzes, does off-coverage very well, and has great awareness in zone against combination routes.

The one route that consistently gets him is the comeback, as he gets too far downfield once he thinks it's vertical. But he has a margin for error with that wingspan, and plays through the back of receivers for break-ups without having to interfere. I like him a ton. First round.

+ Height, length and elite hip turn
+ Left on an island all game and excels
+ Actually a very solid run defender, given his weight
+ Disciplined, smart
- Needs a little more bulk against NFL size
- High level technique in college but can clean up some tendencies
2423509, 4.35 for him... see you in the 1st round
Posted by MothershipConnection, Mon Feb-23-15 12:18 PM
2398605, Ifo Ekpre-Olomu, Oregon (5'10, 185)
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 01:27 PM
Everybody is saying he can just move to slot corner in the NFL (which is a starting position), but I'm not sure on that. He's been successful in college by playing to the boundary, jamming route breaks downfield, and ripping through catches with some of the strongest hands I've seen. Move him inside permanently and he loses the sideline as defense, the NFL won't let him make near as much contact, and his hip flip is not great against a two-way go. Oregon has played him at slot over the past two years and you see all these flaws crop up.

Staying on the outside, his height comes into play, and he's really not that fast. Now it's possible I'm missing something here, because he has several similarities to Tyrann Mathieu as an all-around football player (and moving him to safety is *very* intriguing, since he has ball skills and is an even better tackler than Honey Badger). If you like him that much, second round is fine. For me, he's a third-rounder.

+ Solid awareness and always has a chance because he rips out more catches than anybody
+ One of the best run-defending *players* in this class, regardless of position
+ Asset on special teams, he can cover and return punts or kicks
- Relies heavily on the downfield contact rule in college to mask his weaknesses
- Put on a spit and roasted by double moves, since he guesses on so many route breaks
- Taller receivers win against him even when his technique and positioning are perfect
2398815, IEO is such a tweener to me
Posted by MothershipConnection, Fri Dec-12-14 02:52 AM
He's just not as freakishly athletic as you need to play CB in today's NFL at his size these days, and he doesn't have the length to make up for it. He's just gotten beaten a lot this year in Pac-12 play but has like a preternatural feel for making huge plays to make up for it too. Good call with the move to safety, I hate making school to school comparison but I can see a bit of Jarius Byrd in his game there too, a guy who wasn't athletic enough to play outside without keeping his hands off people and wasn't a huge safety but had enough instincts and cover skills to thrive over the top.
2402508, P.J. Williams, Florida State (6'0, 184)
Posted by will_5198, Tue Dec-23-14 01:46 PM
I was all-in on this guy watching him as a sophomore, but he leveled off badly this season. He would get worked at least a few times every game, even on routes he used to be great at. Technique-wise he seemed to completely regress: backpedal was terrible, he'd throw out jabs in press without moving his feet first, didn't play to his leverage...and so on. Florida State tried to have him "follow" certain receivers into the slot, which turned out to be a horrible idea since he can't defend a free release. It got ugly in a few games, and if his schedule had better quarterbacks he would've been undressed even more.

He still had his moments in press coverage, mainly against go routes and fades. At his best, he can throttle any receiver off the line (much longer arms than his height would indicate) and make the throwing window impossibly small downfield. He's strictly a boundary corner though, and lacks the new-age size the NFL likes from those types. Add on his struggles from this year and with all optimism I think he could sneak into round two. That's based on his 2013 performance, though, since he played like a fifth rounder this past fall. No longer much of a fan.

+ The best fade defender in college football and can disrupt anybody running a nine route
+ Solid awareness in off-coverage, saw some route combos before they happened
- I doubt he's as tall as his listed height, may even be in 5'10 territory
- Waist-grabber downfield and gave up too much late separation
- Zero on-field improvement and got away with a drunk hit-and-run during the season....might be full of himself after early success
2434565, wouldn't touch him now
Posted by will_5198, Mon Apr-06-15 11:58 AM
>Zero on-field improvement and got away with a drunk
>hit-and-run during the season....might be full of himself
>after early success

popped for another DUI last week, with all eyes on him, and found out that Tallahassee police stop giving a fuck once there's no reason to keep you eligible.

"I explained to Williams that I would have to make my decision about his impairment based on what I had seen so far, and that a refusal could be used against him in court. Williams stated that he played football for FSU and just wanted to go home." -- police report
2402509, Eric Rowe, Utah (6'1, 201)
Posted by will_5198, Tue Dec-23-14 01:48 PM
Hugely impressed by him this year. He was in press coverage a ton, and held up beautifully. Most college corners play for contact first, but he's got great feet and stays balanced in his pedal during the release (rarely opens his hips too early). Shuts down slants and he's got make-up speed when playing off. He's smart, too, not letting himself get picked on rubs and super disciplined against double moves. He started at LCB, but you can put him over slot and showed no drop-off when pressing on the field side.

Every game he was making plays, against offenses that spread out and forced the issue. Great pick in the second round.

+ Much better press technique than Ekpre-Olomu or Williams
+ Long arms and active hands, he breaks up plenty of would-be completions by ripping through the catch or going around the back
- Needs strength and waist is a little high, although it shows up more when he's in run support
2402511, Marcus Peters, N/A (5'11, 189)
Posted by will_5198, Tue Dec-23-14 01:49 PM
Chris Peterson put up with Titus Young for four years, so it makes you wonder when this guy is gone after a half season. On the field he's a hyper-aggressive corner -- at times too much so -- with elite body control and make-up speed. He loves to get in the face of a receiver and bully him, although he's overzealous with his jam and can forget his footwork. I like him better in press bail, because he shows really good instincts downfield. Baited Mariota more than a few times over his career (not into picks, but had him fooled on his read).

Still, I'm fine with skipping him entirely based on what teams found out about him. The fact he was kicked off the team for insubordination isn't necessarily better than something criminal, since clubs care about the team dynamic more than if you've gotten caught with weed a few times. He's a first round talent, but could have an Alfonzo Dennard type drop once the clock starts.

+ Does well at either corner spot and multiple techniques
+ Top-level ball skills and long arms; he'll make highlight interceptions
- Plenty of lowlight-reel tackling attempts
- Not the biggest guy for the way he likes to play; NFL size will put him in bad positions and he’s often grabby
- Might need a full-time babysitter
2406800, Jalen Collins, LSU (6'2, 198)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-05-15 01:29 AM
He's everything you want for from a big, boundary press corner -- long arms, big jab, speed -- except for one significant flaw: he can't find the ball. When he gets a break on a pass, it looks like his palms are on backwards trying to make an interception. When he's in trail coverage or has to recover, he just stares at the sky and waves his arms in prayer.

First five yards though, he makes it tough on anybody with his length and jam. He put a lid on Amari Cooper's vertical routes, and also handled Laquon Treadwell this season. After five yards it can be tough on him, since he's a little high-waisted and takes false steps.

Very, very system specific (he'll get whipped covering the slot or even the field side) with second round physical tools. Inability to track the most important object in the game drops him to a third rounder for me.

+ Fits the tall corner mold that the NFL is leaning towards
+ Big-time press ability; he can stun the big boy receivers with one punch
- Hips open up too often and he forgets his feet
- Fast (he caught Melvin Gordon from behind) but sometimes plays slower than that due to awareness/technique
2406801, Alex Carter, Stanford (6'0, 202)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Jan-05-15 01:30 AM
I watched a ton of Stanford this season and struggle to think of anything remarkable about him. Sometimes he makes a play in coverage, although rarely a great one. Sometimes he gets beat, but never too badly. His measurables are fine. His awareness inconsistent (he made a sick read against Mariota this year, nearly picking him off in an impossible situation...then a game later he's giving up slants with inside leverage). It's all very unexciting.

No severe flaws, so at least you can put him on the field and expect a strong baseline performance of mediocrity. Right now he's got ability, but plays like the definition of "just a guy." Third round.

+ Has all the height/weight/speed/athleticism numbers to start in the NFL
+ Started at LCB, but can play anywhere and switched between off-coverage and press frequently in college
+ Will only be 20 years old when the NFL season starts, so I could be underestimating his growth potential
- Boring as hell...and not because he's on complete lockdown, he's still getting beat here and there
- Capable of incredibly smart plays, but also makes freshman-age undisciplined errors
2413059, Senquez Golson, Ole Miss (5'9, 176)
Posted by will_5198, Tue Jan-20-15 01:57 AM
He's a first rounder in coverage, with the only flaw keeping him out of the top 32 is his size. It's not a negligible issue, as plenty of NFL receivers are going to beat him with size, but he competes for the ball in the air as well as anybody in the class.

At everything else he's a natural, and his interception total this past season (10) was no fluke -- most of those were picks he earned with his great hands and breaks on the ball. He was excellent in off-coverage at left corner, but he can be moved to slot and has the feet to play press. Damn good fundamental tackler and edge-holder for his size, too.

Regardless of his height and weight, I'm finding a spot for him on my team. Second round.

+ Smart, controlled reads of the quarterback; knows when to jump routes and when to stay back
+ Playmaker (16 career interceptions) who out-leaps and out-fights bigger opponents for the ball
+ Thrived on the outside in different types of coverage and not just a nickel corner
- Short and lacks strength, even when he's in perfect position he will lose to size
2413060, Doran Grant, Ohio State (5'11, 193)
Posted by will_5198, Tue Jan-20-15 01:58 AM
I thought he was undraftable based on his junior season, so major credit to him for improving since then. At this point he's got a NFL future as a back-up boundary corner, since he uses the sideline well and can disrupt routes a little in press. His hips are tight, though, especially for a sub-six-footer, and his balance down the field against route breaks isn't always there (I'm sure you could make a long cut-up video of him falling down chasing a comeback route). If he proves he can run decently, fifth or sixth round.

+ Had some great defensive moments against quality receivers (Amari Cooper, Tony Lippett)
+ Improved his coverage awareness and break-up skills tenfold since his junior season
- Not the most fluid guy, and lacks a burst when breaking down
- A career depth and special teams player
2429882, Ronald Darby, Florida State (5'11, 195)
Posted by will_5198, Mon Mar-16-15 12:30 AM
I've never been too impressed by him. He's hit-or-miss in his primary off-coverage assignments, with the ability to drive hard on the shorter stuff but turned around often on deeper routes.

Even though he's fast, he gets bumped aside downfield -- other corners can compensate for this with ball skills, but he's terrible at locating the throw or playing through the receiver's hands. Didn't look much better the few times a game they press with him, either. Fourth or fifth corner type that'll mark the least dangerous inside receiver against spread formations. Fifth round.

+ Track fast and can run downfield with most anybody
+ Valuable special teams gunner who could also return (former HS running back)
- Doesn't have the size or break-up ability to compete with bigger receivers
- Takes too many bad steps and his press technique is bad (opens up too early)
- Panicky when the ball is in the air
2398550, Safety
Posted by will_5198, Thu Dec-11-14 10:59 AM
There Will Be Reaches. It's difficult to find players to back in this safety class, because it's a thin one. And the guys at the top are hardly perfect. Good year to be a NFL free agent at this position.
2398800, Landon Collins, Alabama (6'0, 222)
Posted by will_5198, Fri Dec-12-14 01:44 AM
I thought he came into the season overrated, but his coverage has progressed *just* enough to where he's not getting killed on the back end. That good Saban defensive back coaching has him in a lot better position, especially against high-low concepts that try and trap him. He's not instinctive though, especially when he plays single-high, and those ball skills...not the greatest. He doesn't finish; when he has a chance to make a play on the ball he's often late or drops the interception. You also want to keep him out of man coverage.

However, all that tentativeness turns into disciplined aggression when he can fly around in run support. His instincts mirror the best running backs, as far as seeing the blocking schemes before they happen and what angles to take. Elite closing burst, and once he's there, he can bring down anyone one-on-one.

A more athletic Deone Bucannon-type that's going to make plenty of plays moving forward, and give up his share when he has to go backwards. Late first round.

+ Fills running lanes as fast as anybody in college; a killer in the box
+ Fast and fluid athlete, on the shorter side but bulked up well
+ Very good against the screen game, any routes to the flat, and underneath robber
- Lots of false steps in man coverage, gets beat by much less athletic receivers
- Stares into the backfield, and can get moved out of position by head fakes
2398802, Gerod Holliman, Louisville (6'1, 206)
Posted by will_5198, Fri Dec-12-14 01:47 AM
The most one-dimensional player in the draft. When the ball's in the air and he's playing single-high coverage, he's a top 15 prospect. When he has to do literally anything else, he's an undrafted free agent.

Bar none the worst tackler I've watched this season -- he's allergic to contact and looks like he's point-shaving on run defense. I cannot exaggerate how bad he is at this; he probably hit double-digit whiffs in a few games, and that's not including all the yards he gave up by jogging away from blockers. He also floats around in man coverage, biting hard on first moves and play-action, or just staring into the backfield while a tight end runs a 4.8 past him to the corner.

That said. Piling up the most interceptions in nearly 50 years is not an accident. He's a magician when playing over the top or underneath zones, his breaks on the ball are like teleports and he's a natural at securing the pick. Anybody who can cover that kind of ground and force turnovers will be schemed into a fit, but this guy is pushing the absolute limit as to how much blood you're willing to lose before he makes his next interception. I wouldn't want him on my team before the third round at the earliest, but he'll probably go much higher than that.

+ True centerfielder with unteachable turnover instincts
- Thinks man coverage is more of a suggested 10-yard vicinity near the receiver
- He's not a bad tackler...he's fucking abysmal
- No, seriously, he makes Asante Samuel look like Ronnie Lott in run support
2398818, I'm surprised this dude weighs in at 206
Posted by MothershipConnection, Fri Dec-12-14 02:58 AM
Cause honestly from the Lousiville games I've seen he plays like a dude who's 6-2 170... great nose for the ball though.
2399151, UL actually lists him at 213
Posted by will_5198, Sat Dec-13-14 02:26 PM
even Petrino should know he can't get away with that much lying.
2410667, you don't think petrino thinks he can get away with lying, huh
Posted by bshelly, Tue Jan-13-15 06:43 PM
2410784, *that* much lying
Posted by will_5198, Tue Jan-13-15 11:13 PM
I believe Petrino hasn't had an affair in a year more than I believe Gerard Holliman is over 210 pounds.
2406813, Merton Hanks? n/m
Posted by Orbit_Established, Mon Jan-05-15 03:36 AM


O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"

"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2398803, Cody Prewitt, Ole Miss (6'2, 217)
Posted by will_5198, Fri Dec-12-14 01:49 AM
If you're not dynamic you better be reliable, and he's neither. He's improved a bit in coverage since last year, and can be assigned underneath zones or man against the fourth option, but anything else and he goes into hero mode. That is, freelance into a play he *thinks* he can make (although he can't), while abandoning all discipline and throwing his teammates into compromising positions. Alabama and Auburn really exploited him there: once a quarterback starts looking in a certain direction, he will flat out leave his man and try to get to the other side of the field.

But hey, not everybody is Ed Reed, what about his reputation a big hitter? Well, the big hits are there, but the problem with that is he goes exclusively for those. His actual technique is poor, rarely wrapping up unless he's getting run over or run past. Most of the time he tries to knock runners out, which is the surest way to get embarrassed at the NFL level. Still, he looks a lot more natural near the line of scrimmage in run support and moving forward than he does trying to play up high. In summary, a box safety with bad tackling habits. Not the endorsement I want before the fifth round.

+ Gets into position against the run quickly, often shooting gaps and fighting through weak blocks with his rangy frame
+ Has a knack for stumbling into the right spot and playing through the whistle (15 career forced turnovers)
- Way too aggressive on coverage, running play-action at him is like playing against 10 defenders
- His specialty is the up-high shove tackle, which works best in college
- Legally blind when playing deep passes
2398804, Anthony Harris, Virginia (6'1, 190)
Posted by will_5198, Fri Dec-12-14 01:51 AM
He's improved a good deal from last season, although there remain some killer flaws that take him out of starting contention. His coverage technique especially -- he plays mostly over slot and in underneath zones, usually sitting flat-footed and trying to jam the receiver as he breaks his route. Downfield contact doesn't fly in the NFL. Against the run he makes the right reads; he's much better at taking on blockers and a solid tackler. His form isn't great, however, and he gets away with tackling up high. Solidly unspectacular fringe depth in the fifth or sixth round.

+ Long arms give him a chance for late break-ups, he might be better playing more coverages over the top
+ Assignment-sound
- High waist and tight hips, once he opens up in coverage he gets turned around badly
- Long speed is questionable and he's not very strong
2409521, Kurtis Drummond, Michigan State (6'1, 202)
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jan-11-15 09:57 PM
One of those savvy veterans who played tough and masked his limitations with guile. Unfortunately, he was already behind the curve athletically *in college*; you can't bring an old man's game into the NFL as a rookie without falling even further behind.

In the box he's more than solid, providing plenty of run support and he's quick to snuff out anything to the flat. In coverage, it's his lack of speed that really shows up. Michigan State puts their safeties in plenty of man coverage and he had some brutal games: Nebraska's slot receiver Jordan Westerkamp had a career day against him; they just picked on him mercilessly (100 receiving yards solely against Drummond in the second half alone). Over the top he's limited too, as he can't reach vertical routes against elite speedsters (Devon Smith, Baylor's entire group, Oregon game).

He'll be a last day pick for depth – although considering some of the abysmal safeties starting right now, he might get more playing time than I expect.

+ Experienced guy who'll give you a presence on run defense and solid pass defense on underneath and flat routes
- Not fast enough to run with verticals and misses tackles against athletic players in space
- Generally a smart player, but for whatever reason a part of numerous, horrific coverage busts this year
2409575, he's a 4-3 OLB waiting to happen if he can put on 25-30 lbs
Posted by cgonz00cc, Mon Jan-12-15 12:52 AM
2409522, Jordan Richards, Stanford (5'11, 210)
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jan-11-15 09:59 PM
I don't have anything positive to say; just want to be on record that he's a terrible prospect. Nearly as bad a tackler as Holliman (at least Richards gives effort), as he's guaranteed to get dusted several times per game. Not any better in coverage, where he has a tight backpedal and taking bad angles is his philosophy.

Even the plays he does make are of the idiot savant variety (wildly overruns the receiver on an open field tackle, but his flailing arms happen to knock the ball out on the way past). How in the hell did he make All-Pac-12 this season? Undraftable.

+ Has his Stanford education
- Spastic, out-of-control player who has some of the worst breakdown technique in the country
- A big play machine for offenses
- Not even worth a coverage team investment because of his horrible tackling
2398817, Love this post, can't wait to see the rest
Posted by MothershipConnection, Fri Dec-12-14 02:57 AM
I don't know if Will has watched as much or just plain knows more than every other NFL draft guy on the internet but he's a lot more honest in his opinions and I dig that.
2399150, I know I watched *way* too much
Posted by will_5198, Sat Dec-13-14 02:25 PM
I like several of the prominent NFL internet "gurus", but try not to read too much of their stuff. it's usually for news and to see if I vehemently agree or not (Dorial Green-Beckham is just like A.J. Green? no, hell no). but after awhile their opinions start to cause bias.
2399153, LOL...someone said that? no fucking way...
Posted by Dstl1, Sat Dec-13-14 02:44 PM
and this is from a Mizzou stan who saw ALL his games.
2399155, DGB has reached Neo status among draft junkies
Posted by will_5198, Sat Dec-13-14 02:55 PM
the less you play, the fewer chances people have to dissect your game. so now everyone just rewatches the Kentucky game over and over, and he's become a mythical, unicorn prospect that'd be at the top of everyone's board if not for escaping a domestic assault case. "we can steal him in the second round and have a top five NFL wideout!"

I've yet to become a big fan. he's very talented, but plays soft. he could use another year.
2402504, I've seen some mocks with the Rams taking him in the first round...
Posted by ThaTruth, Tue Dec-23-14 01:45 PM
that would be interesting
2402515, Fisher and Snead do love rehabbing "character flag" prospects...
Posted by will_5198, Tue Dec-23-14 01:52 PM
Green-Beckham beats on women though, so probably will have the shortest of leashes post-Ray Rice
2410670, walterfootball "appreciation" post
Posted by bshelly, Tue Jan-13-15 06:49 PM
he is racist, and he is consistently, spectacularly wrong in the same ways every year. for example, i would bet a significant amount of money hundley ends up going in the first round, because QBs always get over drafted. he's wrong about that every year.

that said, however, after a few years of reading i've come to relish his terribleness. it's like a yearly ritual. oh, walter is saying bad things about a black qb? spring must be right around the corner.
2421919, Jameis looking smooth and fat (link)
Posted by PimpTrickGangstaClik, Tue Feb-17-15 07:06 PM

2431643, Deron Smith, Safety
Posted by Bill Nye, Mon Mar-23-15 12:03 PM
Fresno State 5'10", 200lbs

2431673, I tried watching him four times over the last two years
Posted by will_5198, Mon Mar-23-15 12:45 PM
and just got bored. either Fresno was getting blown out or he wasn't near the play. I'll say he didn't look good in the first half of the Las Vegas Bowl, and that's all I got.
2441145, He had a pick six in the LV bowl
Posted by Wonderl33t, Thu Apr-30-15 09:39 PM

http://i.imgur.com/81XSukd.jpg <-- Happy trails
2441144, 2013 was his beast year...he disappeared a bit last year.
Posted by Wonderl33t, Thu Apr-30-15 09:38 PM
Still good and he made plays and tackles, but he didn't rack up the stats.
http://i.imgur.com/81XSukd.jpg <-- Happy trails