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Forum namePass The Popcorn
Topic subjectbatman vs. ironman - which is >?
Topic URLhttp://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=6&topic_id=387283
387283, batman vs. ironman - which is >?
Posted by GQ, Sat Jul-19-08 12:32 AM
a'ight, just saw bats and am takin' some time to absorb it. 4 those that have, which is betta - bats or iron man? ledger or downey jr.?
387336, They shouldn't be compared.
Posted by IhsanAmin, Sat Jul-19-08 08:20 AM
TDK is a follow-up to a hit movie, where IM is just starting off.
The better comparison would be "Batman Begins" to "Iron Man", but even then... Batman had been attempted 5 times before and kinda had a head start on fine tuning.

Prep time, if you will.

As fara as box office, TDK will murder everything this Summer.
As far as fresh out the box stories, I say Iron Man takes it.
As far as a fun movie to watch, Iron Man takes it.
As far as gritty drama, TDK wins.
As far as performances go, Ledger's Joker takes it.
Not taking away from Downey, but we haven't even scratched the surface of the Tony Stark character.

And frankly, it'd be quite foolish to think that any follow-up to Iron Man would be able to compete on TDK's level.
I don't think Marvel would even take it that dark with Stark and 'nem.
387338, I think that after DK though, Marvel needs to focus on...
Posted by phenompyrus, Sat Jul-19-08 08:24 AM
Tony Stark's alcoholism for the sequel. Downey played an incredible Stark, and it can really only be icing on the cake from here on out.
387345, No more needs to be said after the opening line.
Posted by Frank Longo, Sat Jul-19-08 08:59 AM
It's far easier to make an entertaining, action-packed, and incredible sequel, since you don't have to deal with the origin story.

Iron Man > Batman Begins tho.
387737, I disagree
Posted by DrNO, Sun Jul-20-08 01:46 PM
once the first is finished you've gone through the character's best storyline more often than not. Nolan exhausted his version of Batman in the first film.

I guess X-Men doesn't count because origin isn't a factor. Spider-Man II and Blade II are superior sequels but I can't think of any others.
393216, RE: No more needs to be said after the opening line.
Posted by ChuckNeal, Fri Aug-08-08 11:13 AM
>Iron Man > Batman Begins tho.

disagree.
387354, I don't even bother to break it down like that.
Posted by James Peach, Sat Jul-19-08 09:24 AM
I just do it like this: which one will I pop in first if I have to choose?

Batman Begins.

Here's the thing with Iron Man. #1 it's very fun, but the fun leads to a lot of predictability. Also, once he's IRON MAN, Tony's mistakes aren't really moral, they're technical.

Batman's character is so much more interesting to me because I identify with it more. He spends his whole life trying to fix something that he blames himself for, that was never his fault in the first place. Most of us deal with that on some level.

As far as TDK, it's just incredible what they have the characters showing us. I was talking with a guy at work yesterday about the movie (he hadn't seen it yet) and he said, "Well, at least I know going in that the Joker loses, Batman wins." I told him that's all a matter of perspective. Because, really, to me, Joker won. It's a stalemate at best.

No other superhero movie has given us that depth. I don't NEED a movie do be "deep" to enjoy it, but if I'm pitting two movies against each other, the depth is gonna be a factor in which I prefer.

It's like if Harry Potter were just about kids using magic, it just wouldn't be as good as it is.

387716, Ironman > Batman Begins >>>>>>>>>>>>>> TDK
Posted by Orbit_Established, Sun Jul-20-08 12:20 PM

When the hype dies down and everyone stops the
fanboy bullshit and realizes that TDK had a terrible
storyline with too many goddamn characters and the
entire shitty Two Face situation, we'll be able to
fairly give it a grade





----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop"
387759, i know that ether is burning in your soul right now
Posted by gluvnast, Sun Jul-20-08 03:10 PM
387774, But why you mad? Cuz your favorite movie not that good?
Posted by Orbit_Established, Sun Jul-20-08 04:06 PM

It making paper, so who cares? Good for Nolan and them.

Its just not the best superhero movie of this SUMMER,
let alone ever.

Its slightly better than the Hulk.

Slightly.

And serious - bad movies stay making paper.

Look at 'Titanic'. No hate. Make that paper.

'Titanic' too long and silly.

'The Dark Knight' too long and silly.

All goo.


----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop"
387780, dude said the Rachel Dawes character was
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jul-20-08 04:27 PM
*supposed* to be boring and dull...genius writing!

lmao
387787, nah, i'm glad that this movie is breakin' records
Posted by gluvnast, Sun Jul-20-08 05:07 PM
you're the one in the smmmmmmmall minority that wants to hate

but if being a troll is in your nature, then you do you
387807, Well, when you're rational, you're always in the minority, fam
Posted by Orbit_Established, Sun Jul-20-08 05:44 PM
>you're the one in the smmmmmmmall minority that wants to
>hate

My problem is that I think for myself

You in here saying that Maggie' Gyllenhall's
character was supposed to be bland

LOL

GTFOH

She was not

She just sucked, and so did her character



----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop"
387842, RE: Well, when you're rational, you're always in the minority, fam
Posted by Nieman5, Sun Jul-20-08 07:46 PM
You are all over every DK post but you hate the movie.


Why even read the posts much less keep posting. over and over
387844, these posts would be REAL boring if everyone in them loved the movie
Posted by Deebot, Sun Jul-20-08 07:48 PM
and didn't point out the shortcomings
387968, Yeah, I never understood that argument.
Posted by Orbit_Established, Mon Jul-21-08 06:48 AM

So, these posts are supposed to be exclusive
dick sucking fests

GTFOH

I paid the same money as everyone else did, TWICE
for this movie

I've earned the right to comment



----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop"
392752, actually alot of people don't like it.
Posted by xbenzive, Wed Aug-06-08 06:20 PM
my work alone, I and 2 others like the movie, the rest...no even close. They rather perfer Jack's Joker than Heath. I would too when I'm in the mood.

:)

we pray for dollars and we work for change Slug of Atmosphere
393218, TDK> Batman Begins >Ironman
Posted by ChuckNeal, Fri Aug-08-08 11:14 AM
>
>When the hype dies down and everyone stops the
>fanboy bullshit and realizes that TDK had a terrible
>storyline with too many goddamn characters and the
>entire shitty Two Face situation, we'll be able to
>fairly give it a grade
>
>
>
>
>
>----------------------------
>
>
>O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.
>
>
>
>"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."
>
>(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop"
388050, definitely a stalemate
Posted by buckshot defunct, Mon Jul-21-08 11:36 AM
Joker's little speech there at the end pretty much breaks it down and completely nails the relationship. Out of all the speeches in that flick (and there were so, so many) I think that one might have been my favorite.
387653, Ironman! Are you on crack?
Posted by Yadgyu, Sun Jul-20-08 02:59 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3927l9eRcE4
387684, Batman is a lot better
Posted by chillinCHiEF, Sun Jul-20-08 09:39 AM
Iron Man was still really good.

/Life's ill. Sometimes life might kill./
387702, Ironman: no hype, no dead actors, no fanboys
Posted by Orbit_Established, Sun Jul-20-08 11:06 AM

Was faaar better imo

Batman can't hold a candle to it when you
correct for those things
387717, Even including those factors, I believe Iron Man is still better.
Posted by Frank Longo, Sun Jul-20-08 12:22 PM
It's a little too soon for me to tell... but I saw Iron Man 3 times in theaters, and while I'll see TDK to watch Ledger again, I'm not as eager to jump back into that theater for another 2 hours and 40 minutes.

Even if you think Ledger was super-great (which I do), I still don't think that necessitates TDK being a better flick.

But like I said, I'll give each of em time, watch em both on DVD in the future, and then decide.

Neither's dethroning X2 tho.
387719, TDK is your standard "Average film, great performance"
Posted by Orbit_Established, Sun Jul-20-08 12:28 PM

Happens all the time.

I see no reason why people need to be screaming about
me being a hater and all.

I just saw TDK again, and admit to the greatness of
Ledger, but the overall movie is even worse the second
time.

With Ironman, my appreciation for the entire film
GREW

Not with TDK


>Neither's dethroning X2 tho.

Hmm. I think Iroman is giving it a legi
run, personally. But I feel you.

----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop"
387721, lol, cracks in the armor
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jul-20-08 12:31 PM
>I just saw TDK again, and admit to the greatness of
>Ledger
387726, I dont get where this "X2 is the GOAT" stuff is coming from
Posted by HighVoltage, Sun Jul-20-08 12:48 PM
It was a solid movie, but its not even in my top 3 for comic movies.
387754, it's one of those "Only on Okp" opinions
Posted by TheRealBillyOcean, Sun Jul-20-08 03:01 PM
...
387824, it's not, really
Posted by James Peach, Sun Jul-20-08 06:30 PM
387825, Longo's the only person i've ever heard say X2 is the GOAT
Posted by BrooklynWHAT, Sun Jul-20-08 06:31 PM
387762, that's HIS personal fav,
Posted by gluvnast, Sun Jul-20-08 03:13 PM
even though he's wrong....
387778, yes it is
Posted by will_5198, Sun Jul-20-08 04:25 PM
better action and more tightly constructed than almost every other comic book movie
387829, X2 is almost flawless
Posted by Deebot, Sun Jul-20-08 06:43 PM
387771, and an attached TDK trailer.
Posted by Luge Skywalker, Sun Jul-20-08 03:40 PM
387738, Ironman by miles
Posted by DrNO, Sun Jul-20-08 01:49 PM
387766, nah...without RDJ the movie sucked
Posted by gluvnast, Sun Jul-20-08 03:23 PM
lets be real, if we can...i personally LOVE ironman, but we all know that it lacked action (only 3 three action sequences, and all of them being subpar in comparison to the average action flick), the performances of everybody else NOT named robert downey jr, were basic at best, even though paltrow's chemistry with RDJ was rather good, and it pretty much ran like a typical origin superhero movie...whut made it good close to superb was RDJ as stark...that's ALL

whereas, the dark knight was truely an epic movie...even if you scrap ledger's performance which was the tipping of the iceberg it was STILL an epic movie...but the score, the intelligent script, the performances of the costars of eckhart, oldman, freeman, caine, the perfect chemistry between batman & joker, and the uncomfortable feeling that ANYTHING could happen...that movie easily exceeds ironman


it's better to compare ironman to batman begins....in which i would of said it was a tie
387805, LOL. And without the Joker, The Dark Knight Sucked.
Posted by Orbit_Established, Sun Jul-20-08 05:38 PM

Just saw TDK again, and everything in that
movie except the Joker, Alfred and maybe
Morgan Freeman sucked

Everything

Batman was boring and weak

Bruce Wayne? Meh

The bitch? Ugly and uninteresting

Harvey Dent was straight, but ruined
with the two face bullshit

The crime bosses were silly, cept Eric
Roberts and shit

Not very impressive

----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop"
387838, Those 3 action scenes are fantastic
Posted by DrNO, Sun Jul-20-08 07:29 PM
like, the best I've seen since Spider-Man 3. Nothing in The Dark Knight comes at all close to them.

You're forgetting that Ironman also had a brilliant supporting cast and they were given more to work with. Their characters had personalities instead of ideologies like those in The Dark Knight.

And yes RDJ was great in it but that was only a part of it (and it was part of it, why postulate what it would have been without him? Can we presume what it would be if Daniel Day Lewis was the star?). The Dark Knight would be an utter mess without Ledger.

Ironman might lack charm without RDJ but Favreau knows how to work with actors and the script is much tighter than that of DK, which is an epic but being an epic isn't a signifier of quality (watch Alexander).
392792, it's the supporting cast's i dislike the most
Posted by gluvnast, Wed Aug-06-08 10:05 PM
with the exception of paltrow, i felt her chemistry with RDJ was cool, but people like terrence howard, jeff bridges..i wasn't too impressed

whereas freeman, eckhart, oldman, caine all have some damn memorable performaces..hell even DEEBO's small cameo role was fuckin' memorable

387775, TDK easily
Posted by BrooklynWHAT, Sun Jul-20-08 04:18 PM
387786, TDK, because I don't care about TONY STARK without that armor
Posted by Torez the Judge, Sun Jul-20-08 04:50 PM
Offbreak, the main idea that BRUCE WAYNE is just the mask that BATMAN wears is doper than TONY STARK's character.

Two, BATMAN'S family - and the eventual danger we know they will all get pulled into - adds a more compelling element to that story.

Three, BATMAN'S relationship to GOTHAM adds another.

Four, his rogue's gallery is so much doper to me than Iron Man's. Besides THE MANDARIN, everybody else that remains seems like a basic 2-D marvel hero of the week (firebrand, titanium man, living dynamo, etc.)

Really, the only thing left that compels me about IRONMAN is his relationship to the AVENGERS and CAPTAIN AMERICA. But that's a ways off.

In the meantime, a shallow, swashbuckling playboy rocking a cross between THE GUYVER and miniature MACROSS armor just doesn't move me.

(But then, IRONMAN never did)
387796, TDK by miles
Posted by icecold21, Sun Jul-20-08 05:17 PM
It is the best comic book movie ever, IMO.

1. TDK
2. Batman Begins
3. Iron Man
4. Sin City

ain't nothing else on those levels
387830, Dick Tracy >>>> everything on your list
Posted by Deebot, Sun Jul-20-08 06:46 PM
387967, Dick Tracy was the SHIT
Posted by Orbit_Established, Mon Jul-21-08 06:45 AM

And when you throw in the fact that Warren Beatty
pretty much made it to fuck Madonna, its even better

----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop"
388048, LOL
Posted by Deebot, Mon Jul-21-08 11:29 AM
I really don't know why it never gets mentioned among the best. I suppose alot of people will say "because it has Madonna in it" but the funny thing is that she does a fine job with her character.

Dick Tracy has the best visuals/cinematography of any comicbook movie, Pacino is AT LEAST as good as any other villain ever, the score is outstanding, and Warren Beatty is Warren Beatty. And it's the best at mixing in comedy.
387797, THE PUNISHER*, BITCH!
Posted by ZooTown74, Sun Jul-20-08 05:18 PM
*the Dolph Lundgren version
________________________________________________________________________
*by request*

(note to the usual tUoOS debaters, this will most likely be my final appearance in this post, so there's no use trying to start an argument... thnx)
387803, HOWARD THE DUCK >>>> The Punisher
Posted by Orbit_Established, Sun Jul-20-08 05:32 PM

n/m


----------------------------


O_E: Your Super-Ego's Favorite Poster.



"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "Cosmic Slop"
387839, AMBUSH BUG >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> HOWARD THE DUCK
Posted by jetblack, Sun Jul-20-08 07:33 PM
387971, ^^Aka the biggest body count of all time
Posted by JAESCOTT777, Mon Jul-21-08 07:00 AM
387908, RE: batman vs. ironman - which is >?
Posted by davepstein, Sun Jul-20-08 11:26 PM
Batman, although the lead performance of RDJ > Bale. As far as supporting villains, Batman wins by a landslide. Both have dope effects, though Batman trumps Iron Man because it is a non-stop thrill ride.

David - http://playcrayon.blogspot.com
388053, You know a Batman movie has failed in some way
Posted by buckshot defunct, Mon Jul-21-08 11:45 AM
When the villains get all the memorable scenes, and the title character gets in a fight with some dogs. Twice.

I'm not calling TDK a failure by any means... but I do feel like Nolan's approach isn't quite the bullseye many make it out to be. Making Gotham City, as opposed to Bruce Wayne, to be the core of the mythos is a unique way of going about things but in my opinion it hasn't made for a great film just yet. Batman continues to be the least compelling thing in this franchise.

But all things considered, my GOD have these flicks come a long way. I caught a few minutes of Batman Forever while channel surfing Sunday afternoon... shameful.
392744, Dark Knight > Iron Man > Batman Begins
Posted by SoulHonky, Wed Aug-06-08 06:07 PM
I loved the tone of the Dark Knight and Ledger was great.

Iron Man was a good origin story but the villain was weak. Top to bottom it was a steadier film than The Dark Knight but the great moments didn't come close to the best moments in TDK.

I liked Batman Begins but wasn't really blown away by it.
392895, Dark Knight < Iron Man < Batman Begins
Posted by DawgEatah, Thu Aug-07-08 09:26 AM
I'm not being snarky either. I rewatched Batman Begins this past weekend and seen both TDK and IM twice in the theater. My rank goes in the total opposite order than yours.


Don't get me wrong. I loved all 3 movies. Best comic movies ever.




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392755, I like both...
Posted by xbenzive, Wed Aug-06-08 06:22 PM

but I guess I was hyped with The Dark Knight then Ironman. Either way, I think both movies are great on there own. But for repeated value as an entire movie, I'll say...

*batteries not included.

:)

we pray for dollars and we work for change Slug of Atmosphere
392775, ^
Posted by Okayplayer Search Engine, Wed Aug-06-08 07:26 PM
393117, all i know is maggie gyllenhaal almost ruined TDK for me
Posted by Vizionz28, Thu Aug-07-08 10:02 PM
i never want to see her face that large again