With all the complaints about QT's use of the n-word, this is the only one I always find disturbing.

I'm not sure if it's because chose himself for that scene, or because he can't act for shit, but it always comes off really unnatural.

Yes, we know he's saying it to piss off Jules because he can, but that's what's disturbing about it. This guy being in this power position to repeatedly drop the n-word in Jackson's face, may seem clever to some people, and it is in a way, but for the most part, it's not much more than some silly white boy fantasy.

Other than that scene, I can't say I find his use of the word all that gratuitous. Most of it is natural dialogue when white criminals talk amongst themselves.

What are your thoughts on that scene? What are you thoughts on Tarantino and the word in general? Do you think he has some issues? Do you think he gets off on saying it? Do you think critics of it are just looking for something to bitch about? Do you think he thinks he's black?

Discuss

And I realize this is a dead horse, but it just didn't fit in with anything else the movie had shown us about Jules', that he'd let this guy talk to him like that, even if he was in a real bind. You could feel Tarantino changing Jule's character for that one scene, so QT could come across the way he wanted to.

besides "the bad motherfucker" image.

He recites Biblical passages before he kills you, he remains calm and in control during a diner robbery, he just says cool shit and makes complete sense.

QT then comes in as some suburban husband in a bathrobe, chewing Jules out with the n-word and Jules is taking it. It shows that even this "anti-hero type bad motherfucker" knows when to shut up.

QT never really utilizes archtypes the way other people do.

Look at Mr. Pink in "Reservouir Dogs". He was the one whining, freaking out, and all that throughout the whole movie, but in reality, when you think about it, his idea to split WAS the good idea. You had Madson over here being the psycho, Keitel over there being the loyal, bad guy-with-a-heart-of-gold, and then you had Tim Roth, who was the good guy who caught a bad break. Amidst all the chaos going on, Mr. Pink was telling'em "Look, we need to go. We robbed a bank, cops got shot...we need to fuckin go".

In the end, who was the only one who lived? Mr. Pink. He broke out...because he was the one in the whole movie TELLING them to break out lol It's not complicated or plot twisty.

Jules stopped being the archtype bad motherfucker anti-hero that everyone loved, shut up, and took it. He started being appologetic even. There was a hole...a contradcition in the archtype.

There were a lot of ways to establish that element of Jules's character without dropping the N-bomb. I might be able to go with you on this but when this scene is just one of many in QT's history, it's hard to really buy that it was for the character rather than for laughs.

there is NO reason why jules can't murk QT and leave that body right in QT's living room.

for that reason alone, that scene was wild unbelievable.
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are you forgetting mr wolf?

the fact tarantino took that part seems more like a redeeming quaility to me

if he wrote it so he would have the satisfaction of saying that to a black person... that's extremely fucked up. how could you think that and still respect his work

>the fact tarantino took that part seems more like a redeeming
>quaility to me

Why though? I could understand if he didn't want his actors playing this guy, but his actors are dropping that word all up and down his movies. Thing is if Eric Stoltz's character did this scene It probably wouldn't have seemed as out of place.

>if he wrote it so he would have the satisfaction of saying
>that to a black person... that's extremely fucked up. how
>could you think that and still respect his work

Obviously I don't know what's in the guys head. But I can't help but believe there's a part of him that gets off on saying it. And I don't really think it has anything to do with hating black people. I just think it makes him feel like a bad ass. Plus I agree with jigga in that I believe he thinks he's so down he can do what he wants. Didn't he once tell Spike Lee he was blacker than he was?

>>the fact tarantino took that part seems more like a
>redeeming
>>quaility to me
>
>Why though? I could understand if he didn't want his actors
>playing this guy, but his actors are dropping that word all up
>and down his movies.

yes but by casting himself for the part he was answering critics of Reservoir Dogs and his other screenplays which accuse him of casually and cowardly writing 'nigger' into his scripts. If someone doesn't have the guts to say something in person, then their integrity is questionable. It's a way of standing by his decision and showing he sees no fault in it. If you're willing to portray racists in your films... it shows something if you have the balls to act the parts yourself

Thing is if Eric Stoltz's character did
>this scene It probably wouldn't have seemed as out of place.
>

maybe... it's not like Tarantino made a complete hash of it though. in fact i don't think i knew it was him the first time i saw it... it certainly didn't stand out to me

the motives for the character saying that are a bit unclear
maybe Tarantino wanted that character to appear pretty gangsta in contrast to his suburban home
maybe he wanted to show how mixed up all the American values become in dealing with this section of society
maybe Tarantino just wanted to parody white boys who want to be down
maybe Tarantino wanted to make a black audience laugh at a racist joke (like how he tricked audiences into enjoying torture scenes by playing Stuck in the Middle With You, or laughing at people getting accidently shot in the face)
or just break down a taboo (by having Jules not react)
maybe he figures a character like Jimmy, a self-reformed criminal, would adopt theories like 'niggers are only the bad ones' even though he's dealing with a hitman, so saying that line would be symptomatic of that whole type of person

i don't know i'd need to watch it again. maybe a stronger actor would have made it clearer

but basically by casting himself he was either
1. attempting to be more earnest about the moral dimensions of using words like that (willing to put his own neck on the line) and hence you can then ignore who acts the part and look at the character only
2. relishing the words, abusing his power


>>if he wrote it so he would have the satisfaction of saying
>>that to a black person... that's extremely fucked up. how
>>could you think that and still respect his work
>
>Obviously I don't know what's in the guys head. But I can't
>help but believe there's a part of him that gets off on saying
>it. And I don't really think it has anything to do with hating
>black people. I just think it makes him feel like a bad ass.
>Plus I agree with jigga in that I believe he thinks he's so
>down he can do what he wants. Didn't he once tell Spike Lee he
>was blacker than he was?
>

i think he said 'i understand black people better than you do'
if he really thought he was so down though, he would have said 'i understand black people better than you do, nigga'

>yes but by casting himself for the part he was answering
>critics of Reservoir Dogs and his other screenplays which
>accuse him of casually and cowardly writing 'nigger' into his
>scripts. If someone doesn't have the guts to say something in
>person, then their integrity is questionable. It's a way of
>standing by his decision and showing he sees no fault in it.
>If you're willing to portray racists in your films... it shows
>something if you have the balls to act the parts yourself

I see your point, but as far as his critics, did anyone even know who QT was then? I know he had RD and the True Romance script but before Pulp Fiction he was pretty far under the radar for there to be any notable controversy for him to address

>>yes but by casting himself for the part he was answering
>>critics of Reservoir Dogs and his other screenplays which
>>accuse him of casually and cowardly writing 'nigger' into
>his
>>scripts. If someone doesn't have the guts to say something
>in
>>person, then their integrity is questionable. It's a way of
>>standing by his decision and showing he sees no fault in it.
>>If you're willing to portray racists in your films... it
>shows
>>something if you have the balls to act the parts yourself
>
>I see your point, but as far as his critics, did anyone even
>know who QT was then? I know he had RD and the True Romance
>script but before Pulp Fiction he was pretty far under the
>radar for there to be any notable controversy for him to
>address
>


well, authors who sell less than 10 000 books feel the need to answer their critics (historically anyway), the dialogue established becomes one of the major features of their career, i don't see why someone with an international smash in the independent film industry wouldn't. Even if he didn't have much to answer to at that stage, i think the point still stands, he could be answering future critics (which is even better, if you move against the criticism before it's even levelled at you), or his own conscience.

julie delpy gets naked in that one!

:)

rick

And while I wouldn't go so far as to call him a 'racist'... I do think his perceptions are slightly...distorted.

>I'm not sure if it's because chose himself for that scene, or
>because he can't act for shit, but it always comes off really
>unnatural.

For some odd reason which I have never been able to explain, this actually makes it slightly less offensive to me.

>Yes, we know he's saying it to piss off Jules because he can,
>but that's what's disturbing about it. This guy being in this
>power position to repeatedly drop the n-word in Jackson's
>face, may seem clever to some people, and it is in a way, but
>for the most part, it's not much more than some silly white
>boy fantasy.

Good points... But let's look at the bigger picture here. Isn't Pulp all about silly white boy fantasies?

>Other than that scene, I can't say I find his use of the word
>all that gratuitous. Most of it is natural dialogue when white
>criminals talk amongst themselves.

Criminals, police, families, ministers, politicians, etc.

>What are your thoughts on that scene? What are you thoughts on
>Tarantino and the word in general? Do you think he has some
>issues? Do you think he gets off on saying it? Do you think
>critics of it are just looking for something to bitch about?
>Do you think he thinks he's black?

This is only halfway related, but I was thinking about Quentin Tarantino as being possibly the most heavily hip hop influenced Director we've ever seen. To me, the way he draws on past influences is not unlike sampling. Looking at the Kill Bill movies in this context, I almost feel like those are the equivalent to a producer's beat CD. No real content to speak of, but just a nice showcase of what he can do, what's in his crates, and how he was able to flip, chop, interpolate, etc.

Then there's all the criminal underworld elements, the language, the style over substance (or the style *being* the substance), the nihilism... Not to mention the fact that he has RZA on speed dial.

I think, in some ways, the N-word issue comes into play here. But I'm not sure how just yet. It's the ugliest word in the English language, but I still say its real power lies in the context. And to this day I'm still not sure how to take this particular instance. There's a pretty good case to be made for either side of the argument.

>>I'm not sure if it's because chose himself for that scene,
>or
>>because he can't act for shit, but it always comes off
>really
>>unnatural.

>For some odd reason which I have never been able to explain,
>this actually makes it slightly less offensive to me.

I'd be interested in hearing your explanation for this. If you ever figure it out lol


>Good points... But let's look at the bigger picture here.
>Isn't Pulp all about silly white boy fantasies?

haha

>This is only halfway related, but I was thinking about Quentin
>Tarantino as being possibly the most heavily hip hop
>influenced Director we've ever seen. To me, the way he draws
>on past influences is not unlike sampling. Looking at the Kill
>Bill movies in this context, I almost feel like those are the
>equivalent to a producer's beat CD. No real content to speak
>of, but just a nice showcase of what he can do, what's in his
>crates, and how he was able to flip, chop, interpolate, etc.

this is an interesting point. someone else had mentioned this a while back how the cut and paste way he structures his films are similar to a hip hop producer constructing beats. and just like in music, purists will say he he's a hack and claim it's not 'real' filmmaking. but in a sense he's very original. especially since the filmmakers influenced by him are copying his movies, but not the method in which he puts them together.

>I'd be interested in hearing your explanation for this. If you
>ever figure it out lol

Like, the first time I saw it, I was just sort of tickled by the novelty of it all. He'd cast himself in roles prior to this, but I didn't see this particular twist coming. So there was sort of like this wink, wink, nudge, nudge thing going on and as a result I never took it too seriously.

There's more to it than that but I'm not feeling very articulate today.

And let's not rule out the possibility that QT is doing a self-parody here, or possibly just a general commentary on "down" white dudes. Hey, I'm just giving us some options here.

>>This is only halfway related, but I was thinking about
>Quentin
>>Tarantino as being possibly the most heavily hip hop
>>influenced Director we've ever seen.

IMHO Ghost Dog is more "hip-hop" than any of Tarrantino's films.

And honestly I don't know enough about Jarmusch to speak on such things.

But besides an obvious Wu fascination that pops up every now and then, I'm not sure how else hip hop really extends into his filmography as a whole.

certain scenes were cut 'on-beat'. it was pretty sweet.
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and it seemed to fit perfectly
i was always in two minds about that

>Good points... But let's look at the bigger picture here.
>Isn't Pulp all about silly white boy fantasies?

nah i thought it was young black male fantasies. drug lording, carjacking, murder, rape, hard drug abuse, white sex kitten wives, shoot outs, stick ups, obscure religious codes
(gtfoohwtbs)

*cracks knuckles*

>With all the complaints about QT's use of the n-word, this is
>the only one I always find disturbing.

Anytime anyone who isnt black says it I'm disturbed by it. As a black man it's just uncomfortable 2 hear no matter what the connotation.

>I'm not sure if it's because chose himself for that scene, or
>because he can't act for shit, but it always comes off really
>unnatural.
>
>Yes, we know he's saying it to piss off Jules because he can,
>but that's what's disturbing about it. This guy being in this
>power position to repeatedly drop the n-word in Jackson's
>face, may seem clever to some people, and it is in a way, but
>for the most part, it's not much more than some silly white
>boy fantasy.
>
>Other than that scene, I can't say I find his use of the word
>all that gratuitous. Most of it is natural dialogue when white
>criminals talk amongst themselves.

Or 2 the black crimnals? The gay hillbillies refer 2 Marsellus as a nigger

>What are your thoughts on that scene?

I've learned I have 2 take the bad w/ the good. The scene as a whole still came off pretty funny.

What are you thoughts on
>Tarantino and the word in general? Do you think he has some
>issues? Do you think he gets off on saying it?

Yes. It's used several times in Reservoir Dogs as well.

Do you think
>critics of it are just looking for something to bitch about?

No. It's a legit gripe

>Do you think he thinks he's black?

Not necessairly but he does come off as a guy whose tryin a little 2 hard 2 be "down"

if I'm quoting something, and everyone knows what i'm saying anyway. I don't see much of a difference. *shrug*

neighborhood gives him a pass and the right to use the word. There are a lot of brothers (self included) and sisters who would disagree. But it doesn't take away from my enjoyment of his films, and I honestly don't hold it against him. But then again I'm really trying to hang out with the dude on a personal level.

I think it's worth mentioning that during that sequence of Pulp Fiction, we see that Quentin's character (I believe his name was Sid) is married to a black woman. So that may play into the "I get a pass" deal, almost as if Tarantino is, in a sense, justifying his use of the word. And I'm not necessarily sure that it's about it being a power position for him. I think it's simply Sid trying to "relate" to Jules by "speaking his language." So, Sid is, by extension, Tarantino believing he's "relating to the brothers" by speaking our slanguage.

I always suspected that he was trying way too hard to be "down," then when I read about his background (born in Knoxville, TN, moved to Torrance when he was kid and lived with his mom) I figured that's how he came to be who he is. Of course, someone should have warned him that not everyone is comfortable with him using that word...

I didn't think much of it after that, but then I was reminded of his background when I read Owen Gleiberman's review of Jackie Brown back when it came out. It featured the usual complaints about the movie ("it's too long, nothing happens," blah blah blah), and I really didn't care... until I got to the last paragraph of the review:

>In Jackie Brown, Grier is the matriarch of Tarantino's I-wanna-be-black dream party... Tarantino has recontextualized Rum Punch as a tale of African-American desperation. He sprinkles the word nigger around as if it were the verbal equivalent of cayenne pepper, and he has Jackson play Ordell as a ruthless badass stud. But this may all mean more to the filmmaker than it does to us. In Jackie Brown, blackness becomes the signifier of Quentin Tarantino's integrity, his artistic cool. He was cooler when he wasn't trying so hard to be.

Which I think summed him up perfectly. And again, I didn't hold it against him then, and still don't now. I believe that between Spike and Denzel, he's been checked enough, lol...
________________________________________________________________________________________
*no essay required*

>I think it's worth mentioning that during that sequence of
>Pulp Fiction, we see that Quentin's character (I believe his
>name was Sid) is married to a black woman. So that may play
>into the "I get a pass" deal, almost as if Tarantino is, in a
>sense, justifying his use of the word.

Yeah, I thought about this. Just works to make his character even worse, but it does work to make his character believe he has a pass to say it.

And I'm not
>necessarily sure that it's about it being a power position for
>him. I think it's simply Sid trying to "relate" to Jules by
>"speaking his language." So, Sid is, by extension, Tarantino
>believing he's "relating to the brothers" by speaking our
>slanguage.

This I don't see. Plus he emphasizes the word every time he says it. he's obviously trying to piss off Jules

>Which I think summed him up perfectly. And again, I didn't
>hold it against him then, and still don't now. I believe that
>between Spike and Denzel, he's been checked enough, lol...

Late pass: what happened with Denzel?

Apparently he was on the set one day and Denzel ran into him and proceeded to check him about the use of nigger in Pulp Fiction.
___________________________________________________________________________________________
*no essay required*

That's kind of become the accepted story, but the truth is far less glamorous.

From the time he was 5 or 6, he was raised in an upper middle class setting.

This "poor white trash" persona is all manufactured.

he was a father figure for a time.

Which was the point I was disputing.

He came from a pretty privledged, upper middle class background. His mom was an executive. He went to private school until he asked to go to public school instead.

This goes again the perception he's spun about being poor. I recall him saying something to the effect of "I don't think race is a big issue. To me, what's bigger is poor and rich, and so I think a poor white guy has more in common with a black guy who's likely poor as well than the rich white guy", as his way of sort of alligning himself with blacks.

His mom came from a shitty background, but he did not. QT might be white trash, but it's by choice.

>Which was the point I was disputing.
>
>He came from a pretty privledged, upper middle class
>background. His mom was an executive. He went to private
>school until he asked to go to public school instead.
>
>This goes again the perception he's spun about being poor. I
>recall him saying something to the effect of "I don't think
>race is a big issue. To me, what's bigger is poor and rich,
>and so I think a poor white guy has more in common with a
>black guy who's likely poor as well than the rich white guy",
>as his way of sort of alligning himself with blacks.
>

did he actually say he was poor though?
the only time i've actually heard this 'grew up in a poor black neighbourhood' story is on Okayplayer in discussions like these

>His mom came from a shitty background, but he did not. QT
>might be white trash

such a disgusting expression

Wasn't his name Jimmy in the flick?


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>Yes, we know he's saying it to piss off Jules because he can,
>but that's what's disturbing about it. This guy being in this
>power position to repeatedly drop the n-word in Jackson's
>face, may seem clever to some people, and it is in a way, but
>for the most part, it's not much more than some silly white
>boy fantasy.

See, I don't know how you can start that paragraph teh way you do and then end it with that conclusion. I guess we have to establish first:

you are saying (and I agree with) that him saying DNS to Jules' face is his power play
you are saying that it is the character's, and NOT Tarantino's, silly white boy fantasy to say DNS to Jules' face.

If you are saying that, then I agree on the first part, and then by that established POV I disagree on the second part. This isn't a deep seated fantasy this man has, this is just the position he finds himself in on a random morning. He ha sbeen backed into an overwhelmingly impossible corner on this morning by two uninvited people, one he knows and one he doesn't, who HE KNOWS would kill him without hesitation if they feel they need to. He's desparate. He's cornered. He power trips the only way he knows he can, ESPECIALLY with having a black wife and (presumably) knowing her brother's/father's/uncle's disdain for white men uttering **THAT** word, and not only asserts himself to Jules but chooses to puncuate it with a vile epithet he knows Jules will pay attention to. Cocksucker and motherfucker just wouldn't do justice in this situation. Whether it was that concious of a decision or not I'm undecided on, but I am positive that the character hasn't dreamt of this moment for years and years.

>
>What are your thoughts on that scene?
I think its a fantastic film, top to bottom, start to finish. That whole vignette is one of the better pieces of the film and I enjoy that scene very much. The phrase "DNS" is just perfect. Its one of those little tiny things that make Tarantino dialogue so good. Its got a beat and a rhythm and a certain catchiness to it that makes it stick with you. Evidence by this being atpoic of discussion 12 years after the film was released.

What are you thoughts on
>Tarantino and the word in general?
None really, I only think about it when this topic gets brought up. As you yourself stated, I think he captures perfectly the white crims dialogue. Nobody shits themselves because Chris Penn says "spic" or they toss around "Faggot". These are not educated and enlightened people, they're career bad guys who've all done time and developed certain POVs that wouldn't fly with most of us.

Do you think he has some
>issues?
He doesn't make enough movies.

Do you think he gets off on saying it?
No

Do you think
>critics of it are just looking for something to bitch about?
No, I don't believe their opinions are any less valid than mine.

>Do you think he thinks he's black?
No.

>you are saying that it is the character's, and NOT
>Tarantino's, silly white boy fantasy to say DNS to Jules'
>face.

no, i'm saying it's Tarantino's silly white boy fantasy manifested through the character he chose to play. and like I said I don't think it has anything to do with hatred. I just think he thinks it would be cool.

Honestly, I think the part was originally written with a Black person in mind, and QT being QT, decided to just cast himself because a) he thought he could pull it off, b) he wanted to be controversial, or c) he's clueless that people might find it offensive. I also think he figured he could justify it, because the character's wife was Black, and therefore Jimmy couldn't be racist. Not that that makes any sense.

I've always found it the most offensive line of dialouge in his movies, and it annoys me that line is in a film a REALLY like.

Always hated that part of the movie. And Bruce Willis' cab ride, and Willis' scenes with the French girl.
But the D.N.S. part the most.

that scene...i find it hilarious....not a problem with me at all.

he uses it sever times and much more maliciously in that movie.
Picking on Quentin for that line is just a convenient way of bringing him down for those who dislike him.

In Taxi Driver, the people who say it are supposed to be malicious and generally rotten people. In "Pulp Fiction," Jimmy is portrayed as more or less a sympathetic figure. So the person who says "n@#$er" isn't a bad person, even after they say it.

yep

that's the general point of the film
a world of evil, made sympathetic
and how the sympathizing (or the disinterest) perpetuates the evil

and presumably an unemployed loser. And I'd say using the word, as wrong as it is, doesn't exactly make you an irredemably bad person. But it certainly isn't advocating the usage of the word.

..between the two scenes? Do you think he wrote that scene with Taxi Driver in mind at all? Marty wasn't originally intended to be in that scene right?

>he uses it sever times and much more maliciously in that
>movie.

I think Marty says it 2 or 3 times, and I don't see how it's any more malicious. He's also not saying it directly to a black man.

>Picking on Quentin for that line is just a convenient way of
>bringing him down for those who dislike him.

lol @ "picking on Quentin"/"bringing him down" come on doc.

and how his wife's adultery is even worse because she's with a black man. Marty wasn't supposed to be in the scene but he could have had somebody else do it no doubt, there are loads of actors in NY who would have done it for free.
And really, you've seen enough QT debates on here to know that critiscism tends to be focused on his usage of the N word and an apparent foot fetish than the actual qualities of his movies.

about killing the guy.. as opposed to a guy who knows a man is dead a few feet away from him and still refers to him as the n-word in front of a black man just because he knows he's in a unique position to get away with it. but the bottom line is neither scene is any more malicious than the other.

>And really, you've seen enough QT debates on here to know that
>critiscism tends to be focused on his usage of the N word and
>an apparent foot fetish than the actual qualities of his
>movies.

Of course, which is part of the reason I thought it would be good to have a more focused discussion on just that. Normally it's a Tarantino post about whatever followed by "fuck him he uses the n-bomb too much" replies. I agree it gets annoying but it doesn't mean it's not a topic worthy of discussion.

and the only person i've ever seen focus on the foot fetish thing is Mr Mech.

was i the only one in the theater frustrated because there was NO reason why jules 'had to take it'? jules could have shot QT and dumped the dead body right in QT's living room, planted his gun in QT's hand + the other corpse's hand and it would be a double homicide the cops would never figure out.

nothing would lead to jules at all.

why wouldn't a cold blooded killer just shoot QT in the face and leave the corpse there. i mean, even forget planting the guns, just kill that smug fucker on the spot?

i don't have any white friends that can call me n---r. and if i was a cold blooded killer, i imagine id shoot them over it.

that scene was totally unrealistic to me. i cant believe so many people accept that idea that for some reason jules 'couldn't' have shot QT there. or pistol whipped him into unconsciousness for that matter, tied him up, gagged him, and threw him into a closet until the wolf showed up.
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as in under normal circumstances he would be offended by such language but, given the situation they had just presented to Jimmy, the reaction was understandable/predictable even if it was bizarre


>was i the only one in the theater frustrated because there
>was NO reason why jules 'had to take it'? jules could have
>shot QT and dumped the dead body right in QT's living room,
>planted his gun in QT's hand + the other corpse's hand and it
>would be a double homicide the cops would never figure out.
>
>nothing would lead to jules at all.
>
>why wouldn't a cold blooded killer just shoot QT in the face
>and leave the corpse there. i mean, even forget planting the
>guns, just kill that smug fucker on the spot?
>
>i don't have any white friends that can call me n---r. and if
>i was a cold blooded killer, i imagine id shoot them over it.
>
>that scene was totally unrealistic to me. i cant believe so
>many people accept that idea that for some reason jules
>'couldn't' have shot QT there. or pistol whipped him into
>unconsciousness for that matter, tied him up, gagged him, and
>threw him into a closet until the wolf showed up.
>___
>
>myspace.com/spiritequality
>
>lonegunmanmedia.blogpsot.com - my comic book, the liberators,
>is available now at crooked beat records (2318 18th St NW,
>adams morgan, dc). join the movement!

killing was business that he did at the orders of his boss. doesn't mean he killed people indiscriminately, or shot anyone who pissed him off. jimmy was a friend of his. in fact he was obviously a very good friend if jules thought he could bring a dead body to his house in the first place. jimmy took it as the ultimate disrespect, and countered with what he knew would be the ultimate disrespect to jules.

my issue isn't really with character motivation, which i get. the scene itself is clever in it's own way. i'm more disturbed by qt's motivation to put this scene there in the first place. i don't believe he was trying to tackle any racial/societal theme. i just think he thought it would be cool. kinda the same way bill maher always acts like he has a pass with some of the shit he says.

plus, it isn't simple to just simply cast a person and have them ready in no time. He'd have to postpone and delay production as well. IMo he had to go ahead and just do that part.

>he uses it sever times and much more maliciously in that
>movie.
>Picking on Quentin for that line is just a convenient way of
>bringing him down for those who dislike him.


His wife is getting fucked by another guy he is talking to another white man about it. That scene rings true as shit in that taxi cab(and yes I have had a convo with SPIKE LEE why that scene works).

In PULP FICTION that "dead nigger" shit damn near stops the movie, nothing about JULES says he would let someone talk to him that way(does VINCENT use the term when talking to JULES at any other point, no) not only that he tried to get over by having a black wife. The shit didnt even sound right coming out of his mouth so it didnt even give you the idea that he had even used that work before.

Face it QT just thought it would be "gangsta" to write himself into that scene. Nobody complained about the use in DOGS cause it was in the correct context, it after PULP FICTION and then the scene in TRUE ROMANCE that folks started looking at QT sideways.

He tried to slide that shit into "CRIMSON TIDE" and DENZEL set his ass straight on that set about it.

>His wife is getting fucked by another guy he is talking to
>another white man about it. That scene rings true as shit in
>that taxi cab(and yes I have had a convo with SPIKE LEE why
>that scene works).
>
>In PULP FICTION that "dead nigger" shit damn near stops the
>movie, nothing about JULES says he would let someone talk to
>him that way(does VINCENT use the term when talking to JULES
>at any other point, no) not only that he tried to get over by
>having a black wife. The shit didnt even sound right coming
>out of his mouth so it didnt even give you the idea that he
>had even used that work before.
>
>Face it QT just thought it would be "gangsta" to write himself
>into that scene. Nobody complained about the use in DOGS cause
>it was in the correct context, it after PULP FICTION and then
>the scene in TRUE ROMANCE that folks started looking at QT
>sideways.

http://www.playboy.com/arts-entertainment/features/quentintarantino/

Tarentino hates black men. He does not wish to be black, he wishes to circumvent what ever power he assumes the black male has.

After reading an interview of his in Playboy he says that he was used to seeing his mother and her friend bring home men of all colors to fuck. Her friend was black so I wonder if a large section of the spots these two hung out at were black and if the majority of the men they brought home were in turn black. Considering that Tarantino grew up without a father and the importance America media places on a male presence in a family, I wonder if Tarantino grew to resent the men of color his mother slept with that looked nothing like whatever the images of his white father may be. Unfortunately, his anecdote about his mother seems to be excluded from the online copy.

Quote: "How much do I want to whip this guy's ass? He was a big black guy, and they're used to white guys backing down. I don't back down, especially to big black guys. That gives me a psychological advantage": even though not directly related, I feel this supports my argument. And this line just confuses me: "It's very hard to talk a black man into doing anything where he's being raped". I'd imagine any male actor would be hesitant.

Now, correct me if I'm wrong here, but generally in Tarentino's films, Tarentino finds some way to humiliate a black male and whenever a black female is mentioned or shown, she's praised. It could be argued that this is evidence of Tarentino's comfort and celebration of black culture but I take it as evidence of him dividing the race by sexes in his mind; one he hates, the other he loves. This may also relate to his cherished memories of his mother's black friend; he may have even experienced sexual fantasies of her at his dawn of puberty since she is like his mother but not.

Mech

PS - read the final page of the article to hear what he has to say directly to his use of the word "nigger".

>Quote: "How much do I want to whip this guy's ass? He was a
>big black guy, and they're used to white guys backing down. I
>don't back down, especially to big black guys. That gives me a
>psychological advantage":

>the importance America media places on a male presence in
>a family

I think you're looking waaaaaayyyyy 4 much into the whole QT/N-word "pandemic" personally, but this line threw me. I would like to hear more on your opinion of this.

The nuclear (sp?) family was prevelant and there's no room for the concept of single parenting. Basically, television told QT that his family is wrong and imablanced.

Mech

Is like saying "He's racist...not that there's anything wrong with that." That guy is racist as I'll get out.

Only not really

QT was playing a character in a movie. and it was a funny line.

i mean, if he had said it in an interview, i could see why somebody
would be offended.
but i think he just wrote a comical line. i just thought it was funny.



and in case anybody wanted to know this, i'm black.

>and in case anybody wanted to know this, i'm black.

That's fine but most of the Black folks I know would never be okay with a white guy using the word. In fact, we were not allowed to use it growing up. I could say fuck, shit, whatever but nigger would earn me a pop in the mouth...even today and I'm grown.

In Tarrantino's world (and so many other people) the playing field is equal but in the real world...that is why it was so disturbing on screen. Jules may not have popped the guy in the film but a lot of people would have.

good convo starter

then its uproarious

first time I was the movie was on tape
i rewound that shit like 10 times
almost fell outta my chair when i geard that shit

i mean, the shit was kinda real to me. i grew up in wisconsin and his accent reminded me of people i was around. dude had no time to be PC. his home was invaded and he coulda got a divorce for christ sakes.

seriously tho, shit was funny. i still laugh. i'm even saying 'dead nigger storage' to myself RIGHT NOW so i can giggle my ass off

>i'm even saying
>'dead nigger storage' to myself RIGHT NOW so i can giggle my
>ass off

that cracked me up hard

is.his.wife.black?
i still wondered that

didn't know this was still around

only part of the money i disliked. It irked me too much.

That's kind of deranged, but mostly it's pathetic.

....direct the majority of the ethnic slur/racist commentary towards black people?

why aren't there anti-semitic scenes? anti-asian scenes? anti-latino scenes? homophobic scenes? intra-white racism (italians calling irish people micks, etc...like seriously talking shit about other white ethnic groups). ALL that shit goes down, but the vast majority of the ethnic slur usage is anti-black in these gangsta flicks directed by guys like QT and scorcese. FUCK THAT.

my beef with scorcese and tarantino is they display 'realism' at the expense of black people. and because it's selective, it comes off fake and, well, racist towards black people.

does scorcese spotlight black crooks talking shit about white people? not that i can remember. fuck those guys, man.
___

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Scorsese has had his characters say tons of slurs towards every single race and ethnicity, Mean Streets is an incredibly anti-Semitic film. I know, so what, right? Again not a defense or a pass on the uses of language but I'm pretty sure Scorsese has had every ethnic slur that exists and maybe some new ones in his films.

so i don't know what to tell you there.

and most of the times he's used it, it works within context. he's going off experience with the type of italians he grew up around. sometimes he's going for social commentary. Goodfellas/"two niggers just stole my truck" to use one example.

in the departed it stands out too much because it's about the first line in the movie. i guess it was his way of saying "welcome to southie" but it probably wasn't needed.

and there are plenty of anti-semitic lines in goodfellas, casino, and mean streets... but really, is he supposed to go at everybody to balance things out? lol.