I remember him in an interview stating something like he was there at the beginning working with them but they didn't wanna go in the direction he wanted to go in, then they parted ways and started from scratch? I got that correct?

So what you think or how you think the Stakes Is High woulda sounded with Prince Paul on the boards? Would Dilla have produced any tracks? Would Mos Def been on there? How you think it woulda sounded?

probably have more skits/jokes/satire.

Stakes is High might still have the Dilla beat, but there would be a skit in front of it lightly poking fun at the absurdity of the whole champagne sippin, Versace-wearing, Italian mob boss imagery of rap at the time.

I think PP has even said (maybe it was during his season of What Had Happened Was) that he was looking to continue on with the more light hearted approach they'd taken on those first 3 albums, but that De La had kinda moved past that. They were fed up with label politics etc. and not feeling playful lol.

I also think they wanted to take more control on the production side in terms of just creating the beats, so Paul stepped aside. From what I understand, there was no animosity; he said he thought it made sense and that they were "ready" to take the reigns completely.

And while I love love love all the work they've done since, I do think that Paul's input and light-hearted approach is exactly what made De La so damn unique on those first 3 albums. For as great as they are, everything that came after Buhloone was more "traditional" boom bap and stripped away what made them so singular on those first 3 albums.

And what's so interesting to me is that, it's not like Paul's more lighthearted approach to his production took away DLS' ability to hit on darker topics, quite the opposite. That's what made it all the more impressive. Millie, Basehead, Say No Go, etc. ... all songs with heavy subject matters but beats that sounded almost playful. Yet somehow the songs never came across as tone deaf or insensitive. Incredible balancing act they were able to pull off there.

Anywya, just an observation re: w/Paul vs. after Paul. Not a complaint at all, I want to make that very clear. I love all their music. And I think they did bring back some of the lightheartedness on AOI: MT. But I do wish they did more work together and hope they have some in the vault they can release at some point. They just had such perfect synergy.

fsho

I listened to that whole season of WHHW as well (all of the seasons actually). Per Paul, De La was very involved and proactive in crate digging, finding samples, and conceptualizing the sound. If he was the primary producer of Stakes, beyond the skits/humor/lightheartedness, he'd be taking those same samples and ideas used by De La but flipping them in his own unique Prince Paul style. His production with them is notably whimsical, dusty, eclectic. He inspired them to experiment with their deliveries and styles.

Remember, this is when De La settled into their more monotonous, serious flow. Less playfulness and exploration with cadences. Stylistically, Stakes felt more in line with albums like The Score, Illadelph Halflife, Labcabin, Soul Food, or ATLiens whereas their first 3 albums were all on the vanguard and ahead of the times. As dope as Stakes was, it was very much of the times. I call it the post-Wu hangover of the mid-90's: less back and forths and more individual verses, more monotonous flows, punchier/harder sonics, more minimalistic usage of samples (less layering and sonic wall of sound a la the Bomb Squad).

Although Paul was only a little older, he was from the old school.. He came up under Stet. De La not only had the vision for their own sound, they now had the skills and means to present it as they hear it. It wasn't just a shift in the group dynamic. The whole landscape was shifting.

>fsho
>
>I listened to that whole season of WHHW as well (all of the
>seasons actually). Per Paul, De La was very involved and
>proactive in crate digging, finding samples, and
>conceptualizing the sound. If he was the primary producer of
>Stakes, beyond the skits/humor/lightheartedness, he'd be
>taking those same samples and ideas used by De La but flipping
>them in his own unique Prince Paul style. His production with
>them is notably whimsical, dusty, eclectic. He inspired them
>to experiment with their deliveries and styles.
>
>Remember, this is when De La settled into their more
>monotonous, serious flow. Less playfulness and exploration
>with cadences. Stylistically, Stakes felt more in line with
>albums like The Score, Illadelph Halflife, Labcabin, Soul
>Food, or ATLiens whereas their first 3 albums were all on the
>vanguard and ahead of the times. As dope as Stakes was, it was
>very much of the times. I call it the post-Wu hangover of the
>mid-90's: less back and forths and more individual verses,
>more monotonous flows, punchier/harder sonics, more
>minimalistic usage of samples (less layering and sonic wall of
>sound a la the Bomb Squad).
>
>Although Paul was only a little older, he was from the old
>school.. He came up under Stet. De La not only had the vision
>for their own sound, they now had the skills and means to
>present it as they hear it. It wasn't just a shift in the
>group dynamic. The whole landscape was shifting.

...Stakes dropped in 96, but Paul also dropped his solo debut LP in 96 ...Combine the two and thats what A Paul Co-Produced "Stakes" would sound like ..and of course the Popmaster

"That" being that Stakes would've sounded just like Psychoanalysis. IIRC, during his season of What Had Happened Was he said that his mental state during the making of Psycho.. was poor because he was fed up with the industry and he was also low because he had no idea where his career was headed, he felt like that may be his only chance/last album.

I think if he were still intimately involved with Stakes/De La as a whole he may not have felt that low and therefore his production may have struck a less somber tone.

All speculation, of course. But again IIRC that's what he's said about that album and his mental state while creating it.

>"That" being that Stakes would've sounded just like
>Psychoanalysis. IIRC, during his season of What Had
>Happened Was he said that his mental state during the
>making of Psycho.. was poor because he was fed up with
>the industry and he was also low because he had no idea
>where his career was headed.

Yeah "Psychoanalysis" was the sound he was into, even if Maseo & Posdnuos contributed to the production as well, it would've had a not so hard but dark; De La Soul needed to catch up to the late 90's commerical boom-bap sound to stay relevant instead of going the indie underground direction.

2 albums

That could be amazing.

I feel like Price Among Thieves sounds like a De La album with other rappers, this came later though so probably not what Stakes would have sounded like.

I think Psychoanalysis were some of the beats originally intended for SIH

Oh..someone already said that. I'm always late..