I remember being a hardcore fan buying albums the first day of being released all the way to the Love Symbol Album. I think after that there were a lot of compilations, vault material (I didn't really consider Come a proper release) and label problems for Prince so the next studio album I bought immediately after release was the Gold Album in 1995 and I remember feeling like what the fcuk is this corny ish!?!?!

Is the Gold Album generally regarded as when Prince fell off?


**********
"naive as the dry leaves on the ground looking past the trees to the blue sky asking 'why me?'" -Blu

love symbol also.

the gold album was a disappointment to me.

and it's been a case of diminishing returns ever since.

that said, the last truly great prince album in my opinion was 'the truth'. too bad it was hidden away on crystal ball.

i agree about The Truth though.

Musicology was the last album i bought and it was a LOT more miss than hit, IMO. it was also probably the last one i had any interest in hearing.

Graffiti Bridge.

and been fighting sleep to various degrees since.

His good/decent output has been like turret's outburts since.

I liked Come, a handful of Emancipation, Rainbow Children was inspired... but yeah, everything after Rainbow Children has been sort of painful.

s.blak
Come home, Skipper

At least not the way I saw signs of things to come with Diamond and Pearl. I was a fan of the album but by Diamond and Pearls it was clear to me that dude just didn't get the hip-hop aesthetic (Jug head y'all) which put him behind the music curve instead of in front of it.


**********
"naive as the dry leaves on the ground looking past the trees to the blue sky asking 'why me?'" -Blu

then I listened again...the production was largely what betrayed that album.

The album version of "Joy In Repetition" and "We Can Funk" paled in comparison to the boots.

"Theives In the Temple" was a "When Doves Cry" hail mary...that didn't work.

"Shake" is the last thing I want to be the 1st official meeting of (*rolls eyes*) Prince & the Time.

"Still Would Stand All Time" is just a clunker.

and "Graffiti Bridge" & "New Power Generation pt.1 & 2" are just spread-eagle ass.

I liked "Can't Stop This Feeling I Got" and "Elephants & Flowers"...but by this time, the over stacked choir backing vocals, the "I can get on Black Radio" QD3 sounding synth bass, the lack of rhythm guitar, and tepid drum programming just didn't do it for me.

The Symbol album is everything he wanted "Grafitti Bridge" to be musically.

But add on the fact that G.B. is also tied to that atrocious movie, and yeah...naw.

s.blak
Release It

That shit is crack. You're buggin'.


http://twitter.com/collazo
http://www.reverbnation.com/livesociety

s.blak
At All

Never heard the song the same after this:

https://www.podomatic.com/podcasts/mandell020170/episodes/2014-03-22T11_05_46-07_00

and that album has two of my favorite prince songs in 'the question of u' and 'joy in repetition'.

>
>Graffiti Bridge.
>
>and been fighting sleep to various degrees since.
>
>His good/decent output has been like turret's outburts since.
>
>I liked Come, a handful of Emancipation, Rainbow Children was
>inspired... but yeah, everything after Rainbow Children has
>been sort of painful.
>
>s.blak
>Come home, Skipper

who is Cody "Chestnutt"?


Get back under your bridge, you inbred troll

s.blak
and...laydown ur funky weapon

>
>who is Cody "Chestnutt"?
>
>
>Get back under your bridge, you inbred troll
>
>s.blak
>and...laydown ur funky weapon
>

________
Big PEMFin H & z's
█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am one thing, a musician." © Miles Davis

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

**********
"naive as the dry leaves on the ground looking past the trees to the blue sky asking 'why me?'" -Blu

I'll never forget seeing him at the Apollo and he brought out Mayte. But rather than just bring her out to dance there was this whole theater shit about stealing this exotic beauty away from shieks or some shit, like she weren't a puerto rican hoodrat.
________
Big PEMFin H & z's
█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am one thing, a musician." © Miles Davis

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

**********
"naive as the dry leaves on the ground looking past the trees to the blue sky asking 'why me?'" -Blu

What the blood claaat ???

It wasn't *that* far off.

It wasn't *that* far off.

>, like she weren't a puerto rican
>hoodrat.

*spits out drink* BWAH HAHAHAHAHAHA!

he had quality work after Lovesexy though.

in terms of the decline from top-tier material & no full album since has rivaled the work that came before it.

I really can't see any other more obvious line of demarcation.

all of his albums after that have had a few gems here and there. some of the albums have more than others.

That's the worst Prince album imo shits torture.

>That's the worst Prince album imo shits torture.

therefore it's pretty much the perfect 'sign' of the decline coming right on the heels of his last classic album.

As for 'Come', that was the first P album I didn't buy when it dropped. I couldn't really tell you much about it but it seemed obvious at the time he wasn't even really endorsing it & was just trying to get out of the Warner Brothers contract.

Take out the "Beautiful Experience" interludes and "We March", and you got yourself a solid album.

ALSO, you might wanna include 'Interactive' and the original version of 'Endorphin Machine' and you got yourself his BEST since SOTT.

would've been his best since SOTT. it was still a decent album as it ended up, but it would've been better if released in the version he wanted in late 1994 after 'TMBGITW'.

When he moved into PAISLeY PARK...safe to say.

A genius left to his own devices is mayhem

_______________________________________There’s a storm coming. You and your friends better batten down the hatches cause when it hits you’re all gonna wonder how you ever thought you could live so large and leave so little for the rest of us"-Selina Kyle

_______________________________________There’s a storm coming. You and your friends better batten down the hatches cause when it hits you’re all gonna wonder how you ever thought you could live so large and leave so little for the rest of us"-Selina Kyle

at the very least in how it was received

>at the very least in how it was received
>
>


I was going to say that but he did the tour with the album which is heralded as one of the great ones by some fans..and Positivity and Anna Stesia were the Master Blasters of the album imo but actually it is Plants because it was way off the radar beaten path as SOTT/SITKOL

That's when he lost the plot. There were moments of weakness in Batman. Grafitti Bridge has some stinkers(and lot of great stuff)but all of it was still "Prince"....Diamonds and Pearls was some kind of reinvention into "Cool Uncle Prince" and he straight up looked over his shoulder...The Game Boyz? Get The Fuck Outta Here With That Bullshit....still some very worthwhile music afterward but in SPOTS

The Rainbow Children convinced me that his modern day music is just a ruse...that he intentionally waters down the formula for mass consumption...he and his ego need the trappings of superstardom and being an indie artist is definitely not his bag...he tried it and he wasnt diggin it too tough...he can pull the rabbit out the hat whenever he wants to but he's not convinced that anyone will appreciate it...shit, people are still deciphering the shit he was doing in 1985...his quiet retirement from recording is a testament to that (yes, Prince is done putting out new music. I would google the interview but I dont feel like it...matter of fact 20Ten was never OFFICIALLY released...)

i'm surprised you're into it, actually.

People(casual listeners or non-fans) are not aware of this album, and the ones that are, tarnish it so bad for the messages it conveyed.

Its even pointless to marvel at how solid it is production-wise, because all the crying about Prince being a "separatist" will soon emerge into the conversation.

i don't like it very much lyrically but i could give a fuck ultimately

speaking strictly musically, it's a solid meh.

what do you like about it?

Which made me pause, but thats another subject for another day. However, from a production point of view, it served the purpose.

Great guitar work, and if you're familiar with his instrumental bootlegs from the pre-WB era, you might think its a reach of me to think that he has been listening to them(some of the fender rhodes playing in TRC remind me strongly of those instrumentals). Segued decently(minus The Work and the obvious comic relief) in fact, I'd think this album is better sequenced-wise than Lovesexy. Not to mention the funk!(I mean that bassline from Family Name is just outlandish).

Take that annoying "Bob George" narrative, and you got yourself a perfectly produced album. But overall, it was the LAST album where you really felt he was into the materials(hence why he performed the entire album in concerts).

Suspect lyrical content and Bob George aside. You can tell he was not phoning it in on that album. Prince is over 50 now. He can't just turn it on at will like he used to. He needs to be inspired to create good music. Whether he's inspired God (TRC) or desire to top the charts (Musicology). Those seem to be times lately where he really puts in work.
>
>Take that annoying "Bob George" narrative, and you got
>yourself a perfectly produced album. But overall, it was the
>LAST album where you really felt he was into the
>materials(hence why he performed the entire album in
>concerts).

>i'm surprised you're into it, actually.
>

The first one was Dirty Mind where he became Prince as we know him. Freaknasty punkfunk.

1999-the culmination of his technolgy and songwriting with synths and geetar. PR is an extension of this.


SOTT, the grand statement on musical past. A master at all of them and major turning point. After the synthfried guitar heavyness of Controversy, 1999 and Rain, a more warmth to the music that was started with Parade but completed on SOTT.


TRC, a return to form and musicianship. This was his Achtung Baby or All That You Cant Leave Behind.

********************************************************************************
Why does Matthew Perry continue to get television projects?

>
>TRC, a return to form and musicianship. This was his Achtung
>Baby or All That You Cant Leave Behind.

>>
>>TRC, a return to form and musicianship. This was his Achtung
>>Baby or All That You Cant Leave Behind.
>


********************************************************************************
Why does Matthew Perry continue to get television projects?

only desperate fans do.

clutching at straws.

>only desperate fans do.
>
>clutching at straws.


Really dog? Really?

It's not that serious....

********************************************************************************
Why does Matthew Perry continue to get television projects?

your taste is broke.

>he and his ego need the trappings of
>superstardom and being an indie artist is definitely not his
>bag...he tried it and he wasnt diggin it too tough...he can
>pull the rabbit out the hat whenever he wants to but he's not
>convinced that anyone will appreciate it...

I feel he's an indie artist in a Superstar's clothes. He can go "indie" and produce strong, passionate music that will go lead on the charts. See: TRC. But he likes being "Prince". He likes the sold out arenas. He likes the money. He likes the attention. He likes all that stuff that comes from being Prince. He's used to it. So he can't drop TRC's every year. He has to keep trying for that mainstream success. He loves it too much.

>I feel he's an indie artist in a Superstar's clothes. He can
>go "indie" and produce strong, passionate music that will go
>lead on the charts. See: TRC. But he likes being "Prince". He
>likes the sold out arenas. He likes the money. He likes the
>attention. He likes all that stuff that comes from being
>Prince. He's used to it. So he can't drop TRC's every year. He
>has to keep trying for that mainstream success. He loves it
>too much.

What's interesting about "Prince"

is that once upon a time, big business (i.e. Warners) was willing to invest in a "Prince". It's messed up that that relationship soured the way it did, but it is a sign of how much things have changed over the years.

Eye No
Anna Stesia
Alphabet St.
Dance On
When 2 R In Love
I Wish U Heaven
the title track
even Positivity

the only real clunker is Glam Slam

I think you guys are put off by conventional wisdom and the cover art, there aint SHIT wrong with the music...and IMO, Lovesexy is a high water mark for him as a producer similar to his best work, Parade...

if you've only heard the single version of Alphabet St, youre missing out...

*******
allwedoiswindimoto.tumblr.com
www.windimoto.com

>Eye No
>Anna Stesia
>Alphabet St.
>Dance On
>When 2 R In Love
>I Wish U Heaven
>the title track
>even Positivity
>
>the only real clunker is Glam Slam
>
>I think you guys are put off by conventional wisdom and the
>cover art, there aint SHIT wrong with the music...and IMO,
>Lovesexy is a high water mark for him as a producer similar to
>his best work, Parade...
>
>if you've only heard the single version of Alphabet St, youre
>missing out...


Eye No, Alph St., Glam Slam and W2RIL, are clunkers

>Eye No, Alph St., Glam Slam and W2RIL, are clunkers

When 2 R In Love, too? Pass whatever you got rolled in that paper!

>>Eye No, Alph St., Glam Slam and W2RIL, are clunkers
>
>When 2 R In Love, too? Pass whatever you got rolled in that
>paper!


********************************************************************************
Why does Matthew Perry continue to get television projects?

THAT SHIT KNOCKS!
______________________________________________________________________________

"To Each His Reach"

but.....

Fuck aliens.

I think he "lost" it after Diamonds & Pearls...The thing is, as wack as say "Jughead" or Tony M was, P still had the "goods" as evident by "Money Don't Matter" and the like...

After that it was hit or miss for P...Sometimes he knocked it out the park (The Truth, Emancipation) and other times he struck out epically (Chaos & Disorder, Rave Un2 The Joy Fantastic)...

Prince is my favorite artist

When people ask me for recommendations, I tell them the run of albums from Dirty Mind to SOTT is uncontestable.

I personally dig the run from For You to Diamonds and Pearls, but Lovesexy is a pompous way to release an album (forced to sit through one track?!?!). GB isn't really a 'Prince' album like the others, and while the highs on D&P are outstanding, the lows are extremely looooow.

He shoulda realized his limits and left rap alone. Also he should have admitted to himself that Wendy & Lisa were integral to what the Prince brand had become, which is why the train began to lose steam after SOTT

>He shoulda realized his limits and left rap alone. Also he
>should have admitted to himself that Wendy & Lisa were
>integral to what the Prince brand had become, which is why the
>train began to lose steam after SOTT


First part, I agree with...Second part? Not so much...

I never minded him "talk-rhyming" on songs like "Irresistible Bitch"...But he should have chilled with including the wackness that is Tony M in the early 90s...Shit was terrible...

But Wendy & Lisa? I love the work they did with Prince...And I REALLY dig that era from 85 to 86...I mean, "In All My Dreams" is worth the hype alone...

But I think their impact on Prince has been way over-inflated...Before W&L's impact dude was making classics...So that was never the issue...

Prince's biggest problem has always been his obsessive need to release 100 songs a year during those prime years...Dude was nuts in that way...Basically he needed quantity-control...He needed someone to tell him to chill and smell the roses...

Prince simply burnt himself out...

As much as we fans loved his album per year steez, it created a shorter reign for dude...I always imagined what would have happened if Prince took two years off after Purple Rain...Or if he spaced out his albums and outside projects...

Sometimes you have to give the public a chance to miss you....But that's another thread...

as "somewhat" peers in the studio, as songwriters, editors, arrangers, and contributors.

Levi Seacer Jr. was more of an amalgamation of Jimmy & Terry, he pushed off of him. Then shelved him callously.

Then who came after that...motherfucking Kirky J.? ->http://youtu.be/gX3wGWHRlXQ

then less see...John Blackwell is just the best drummer he's ever had, hands down. He created a lot of space for Prince to get back to what he does best. But he's still just treated like a bad ass motherfucker on call. Which is cool.

Wendy and Lisa challenged that dudes comfort zone just by being who they were...bad ass chicks that wouldn't fuck him and had him doing his musical homework in his free time.

He couldn't take all that slow simmering ether knowing they were really taking it some place he wasn't invited...and it wasn't just some fey ass eyelash batting gimmicks.

Ain't nobody talked back or told that fool something sucked since...maybe Sheila, but I doubt that seriously.

s.blak
pretend all my opinions and fake insights on this subject are factual knowledge based on expertise...then it's your turn...then I'll say something, or somebody else will. o.k.? o.k.

>pretend all my opinions and fake insights on this subject are
>factual knowledge based on expertise...then it's your
>turn...then I'll say something, or somebody else will. o.k.?
>o.k.

I just think there were more important factors that contributed to P's reign ending....

Again, as much as the fans loved it, he released way too much music...

And SoWhat made a strong point as well...Hip-Hop and New Jack Swing also played a huge part in dude no longer being that can't miss artist...

But I just think the whole W&L angle has gotten a bit too much play...As others have said, dude would have taken a fall just by the laws of music and the new sounds that started to upstage Prince culturally...

this almost empty bottle of glue don't hardly make you think of the dead horse at all no more.

But, here goes 10 bullet points of forensic speculation:

•he'd pushed "quirky elfin pop/funk sex weirdo" ass far as he could and radio changed right up under his feet.

•a guy who would implode the Time and put Paul Peterson in the spotlight to get "that Duran Duran" money ,says what?

•He was shook. He wanted to appeal to Black radio, prove he was down.

•Also factor in the execs at Warner's that championed Prince weren't there anymore or being phased out or moved around (Mo Ostin, Lenny Waronker). So his superstar bullying tactics didn't have the same effect...he looked more like an asshole than a genius pulling the Black Album after it had shipped. The labels were like...'fuck this guy...let's push Ice T. in the 3rd & 4th quarter'.

•...pulling The Black album was the point he really started schitting the bed decision wise. "Lovesexy" follows the same constructs that went into "The Rainbow Children" minus going overboard with the religious dogma, stylistically & quality wise. He could have easily re-tooled schitt like "Dream Factory", "Welcome 2 the Rat Race" & "Crystal Ball" and coupled it with "Positivity", "Dance On", "Eye Know/Crystal Ball", "When 2 R In Love", "Rebirth of the Flesh" & "Joy In Repitition" and had a ridiculously awesome "band" oriented "Prince" album that fans and critics couldn'tve ignored if they tried, in spite of Teddy Riley's matinee funk sound that was really starting to permeate Black radio. Why all of a sudden did this fool wanna be a "Black" act, when his sound appealed to more than just the Black radio audience

•There was just some master self-sabotage schitt going down cause he was used to getting his way with Warner Bros., and they firmly & immediately put the kybosh on that triple album idea after UTCM.

•Musically his strengths at the time were, the material & the people that helped foster the material (Eric Leeds, Wendy, Lisa, Sheila, Levi, Matt Blistan, as well as the engineers who believed in the helping him capture all of that round the clock)...not Wally Safford, Greg Brooks and Jerome hanging around. He tried to make S.O.T.T.'s feel like a one man show, but it wasn't. He wanted to be in a band...but all of a sudden he wanted it to be a fey/quasi religious version of Sly & the Family Stone and P-Funk...AND dominate black radio?

•Dude, FUCKED UP...and would have to pay for it, with 10+ years of really confusing material, Hit & Run Tours galore, playing catch up on the radio, Tony M, that embarrassing G.B. movie flopping harder than Vlade Divac, lame publicity stunts (the name change, Kamasutra), turmoil with Warner Bros., to free agency and even more confusing career calamities as well as musical missteps.

•Whoever (in this post) said "Paisley Park", was too much freedom, was on to something.

•and mind you...dude still managed to have one glimpse or another of having some vapors in the tank on each terrible project...which was really the hardest thing to bare for older fans.

s.blak
What Is & What Will Never Be

>this almost empty bottle of glue don't hardly make you think
>of the dead horse at all no more.
>
>But, here goes 10 bullet points of forensic speculation:
>
>•he'd pushed "quirky elfin pop/funk sex weirdo" ass far as he
>could and radio changed right up under his feet.
>
>•a guy who would implode the Time and put Paul Peterson in the
>spotlight to get "that Duran Duran" money ,says what?
>
>•He was shook. He wanted to appeal to Black radio, prove he
>was down.
>
>•Also factor in the execs at Warner's that championed Prince
>weren't there anymore or being phased out or moved around (Mo
>Ostin, Lenny Waronker). So his superstar bullying tactics
>didn't have the same effect...he looked more like an asshole
>than a genius pulling the Black Album after it had shipped.
>The labels were like...'fuck this guy...let's push Ice T. in
>the 3rd & 4th quarter'.
>
>•...pulling The Black album was the point he really started
>schitting the bed decision wise. "Lovesexy" follows the same
>constructs that went into "The Rainbow Children" minus going
>overboard with the religious dogma, stylistically & quality
>wise. He could have easily re-tooled schitt like "Dream
>Factory", "Welcome 2 the Rat Race" & "Crystal Ball" and
>coupled it with "Positivity", "Dance On", "Eye Know/Crystal
>Ball", "When 2 R In Love", "Rebirth of the Flesh" & "Joy In
>Repitition" and had a ridiculously awesome "band" oriented
>"Prince" album that fans and critics couldn'tve ignored if
>they tried, in spite of Teddy Riley's matinee funk sound that
>was really starting to permeate Black radio. Why all of a
>sudden did this fool wanna be a "Black" act, when his sound
>appealed to more than just the Black radio audience
>
>•There was just some master self-sabotage schitt going down
>cause he was used to getting his way with Warner Bros., and
>they firmly & immediately put the kybosh on that triple album
>idea after UTCM.
>
>•Musically his strengths at the time were, the material & the
>people that helped foster the material (Eric Leeds, Wendy,
>Lisa, Sheila, Levi, Matt Blistan, as well as the engineers who
>believed in the helping him capture all of that round the
>clock)...not Wally Safford, Greg Brooks and Jerome hanging
>around. He tried to make S.O.T.T.'s feel like a one man show,
>but it wasn't. He wanted to be in a band...but all of a sudden
>he wanted it to be a fey/quasi religious version of Sly & the
>Family Stone and P-Funk...AND dominate black radio?
>
>•Dude, FUCKED UP...and would have to pay for it, with 10+
>years of really confusing material, Hit & Run Tours galore,
>playing catch up on the radio, Tony M, that embarrassing G.B.
>movie flopping harder than Vlade Divac, lame publicity stunts
>(the name change, Kamasutra), turmoil with Warner Bros., to
>free agency and even more confusing career calamities as well
>as musical missteps.
>
>•Whoever (in this post) said "Paisley Park", was too much
>freedom, was on to something.
>
>•and mind you...dude still managed to have one glimpse or
>another of having some vapors in the tank on each terrible
>project...which was really the hardest thing to bare for older
>fans.
>
>s.blak
>What Is & What Will Never Be
>


********************************************************************************
Why does Matthew Perry continue to get television projects?

>this almost empty bottle of glue don't hardly make you think
>of the dead horse at all no more.
>
>But, here goes 10 bullet points of forensic speculation:
>
>•he'd pushed "quirky elfin pop/funk sex weirdo" ass far as he
>could and radio changed right up under his feet.

POINT 1....This is not exactly dropping science, here....This^^^ goes with SoWhat's point about hip-hop and New Jack hijacking black music....And what happened as a result of this? Black radio followed...Prince's image just didn't fix the new mix...


>•a guy who would implode the Time and put Paul Peterson in the
>spotlight to get "that Duran Duran" money ,says what?

There his babies...he could have put a puppy as a front man for those groups...All this says is Prince was trying to make money like everyone else...This is has NOTHING to do with dude's "fall"...

>•He was shook. He wanted to appeal to Black radio, prove he
>was down.

See point no. 1....


>•Also factor in the execs at Warner's that championed Prince
>weren't there anymore or being phased out or moved around (Mo
>Ostin, Lenny Waronker). So his superstar bullying tactics
>didn't have the same effect...he looked more like an asshole
>than a genius pulling the Black Album after it had shipped.
>The labels were like...'fuck this guy...let's push Ice T. in
>the 3rd & 4th quarter'.


See point no. 1....


>•...pulling The Black album was the point he really started
>schitting the bed decision wise. "Lovesexy" follows the same
>constructs that went into "The Rainbow Children" minus going
>overboard with the religious dogma, stylistically & quality
>wise. He could have easily re-tooled schitt like "Dream
>Factory", "Welcome 2 the Rat Race" & "Crystal Ball" and
>coupled it with "Positivity", "Dance On", "Eye Know/Crystal
>Ball", "When 2 R In Love", "Rebirth of the Flesh" & "Joy In
>Repitition" and had a ridiculously awesome "band" oriented
>"Prince" album that fans and critics couldn'tve ignored if
>they tried, in spite of Teddy Riley's matinee funk sound that
>was really starting to permeate Black radio. Why all of a
>sudden did this fool wanna be a "Black" act, when his sound
>appealed to more than just the Black radio audience


Again...you could have made this all shorter by simply saying that Prince wanted was getting beat out culturally by Teddy, NWA and the new generation of black music...When you are a guy that plays guitar in high heels, how does this look next to Ice Cube?

>•There was just some master self-sabotage schitt going down
>cause he was used to getting his way with Warner Bros., and
>they firmly & immediately put the kybosh on that triple album
>idea after UTCM.




Now this^^^^^^^^^ IS FUCKING TRUE...Some of Prince's decision making was HORRIBLE...


>•Musically his strengths at the time were, the material & the
>people that helped foster the material (Eric Leeds, Wendy,
>Lisa, Sheila, Levi, Matt Blistan, as well as the engineers who
>believed in the helping him capture all of that round the
>clock)...not Wally Safford, Greg Brooks and Jerome hanging
>around. He tried to make S.O.T.T.'s feel like a one man show,
>but it wasn't. He wanted to be in a band...but all of a sudden
>he wanted it to be a fey/quasi religious version of Sly & the
>Family Stone and P-Funk...AND dominate black radio?


I'm not buying any of this ^^^^...lol


>•Dude, FUCKED UP...and would have to pay for it, with 10+
>years of really confusing material, Hit & Run Tours galore,
>playing catch up on the radio, Tony M, that embarrassing G.B.
>movie flopping harder than Vlade Divac, lame publicity stunts
>(the name change, Kamasutra), turmoil with Warner Bros., to
>free agency and even more confusing career calamities as well
>as musical missteps.

He fucked up for two reasons that basically is the thesis of this thread: Too much music released...And the rise of hip-hop and R&B...The latter pushed Prince to chase the hip-hop dragon....We all know what happened after that....


>•Whoever (in this post) said "Paisley Park", was too much
>freedom, was on to something.

This could be the case...He needed someone to tell him to slow down...I agree...But I guess Prince wouldn't be Prince without the Park....


>•and mind you...dude still managed to have one glimpse or
>another of having some vapors in the tank on each terrible
>project...which was really the hardest thing to bare for older
>fans.


To me it's simple...Prince shot his wad...He did waaaay too much on the music tip...Released too many albums and songs back-to-back,,,Now we fans are not really complaining about this NOW because that's part of dude's mythology...But back then, it was evident that he needed to take a rest and pace himself...

But more importantly, again, it has to be said SoWhat nailed and YOU nailed as well...Prince's "fall" can be connected to the rise of hip-hop/New Jack Swing...P's image didn't fit in with the new generation....

LoveSexy said as much...Nigga naked on the cover....Meanwhile, Guy is in silk suits on their album cover getting young black kids to the clubs to dance their cares away...And Cube and crew is dropping the real about White America's and Black Middle Class America's worst nightmare....

And there it is.....


As usual, good talk, homie...

I'm not buying that as the cut and dry "answer" to what was going on in his camp.

Hell...the m.f. was naked on the back of a winged horse on his second album. Prince had zero problem challenging Black people/Black radio up until he truly felt the Pop audience was beginning to move on.

Prince lost confidence in Prince.

He didn't need to chase Black radio, get religious & moralistic in the face of Hip Hop.

He'd always blazed his own trail. And that's what he did best in that initial run.

The bug in his ear to go 'back to' "Black" was put in his ear after "Purple Rain".

I remember his initial hardcore Black audience (and as a Detroiter, I'm well aware of how he was received by Black people back then) being indifferent about "Around the World In A Day", and was personally in shock towards that indifference. He still had singles, but his fanbase had shifted more towards a pop audience, i.e., "white(r)". Yes, the diehards were digging deeper for extended mixes & b-sides. But a lot of the conventional Black audiences were already put off by "Sexy Dancer"/"Do Me Baby" Prince, taking a backseat to "Let's Go Crazy"/"Raspberry Beret" Prince.

Of course he wanted to milk that cow as much as possible.

So by the time he'd committed totally to Blackening up (which he actually really didn't fully achieve until "Diamonds & Pearls") YES...Hip Hop was pretty much almost in full effect as the sound of young (Black) America. Hell, he's taking shots at rappers on "Bob George" and giving Tony M. a whole damn song ("Jughead") between 87-91.

Imagine what would've happened without the success of piggybacking himself onto the Batman franchise in 1989?

He would've been better off ignoring all of that and sticking to his guns, but being the competitive fame/money whore that Prince is he blew a hole in the bottom of his boat when people started telling him "NO", when singles didn't connect on Black charts OR on Pop charts. He threw the Revolution under the bus...as if...those musicians didn't have an influence on his sound (i.e., W&L). The sound that actually connected him with his largest audience.

No musicians he's worked with since have approached the authentic "Prince" sound he pioneered for himself and perfected in the studio with that core of W&L, Sheila, Levi, Fink, Eric Leeds (and let's not forget Alan Leeds as tour manager/historian guru) since they've have been out of the picture. Maybe Blackwell, because he can do on the drums what Prince can't technically...which is 'expand upon Prince's ideas for the better'.
W&L were very involved in that is all I'm saying.

Everything else, he's been competing with his heroes, or trying to be the keeper of the Black music flame as a ruse to keep forcing the "own your masters" issue.

Hell yeah, he shot his wad. He ran off all the people that really helped elevate him.
I mean the ego is AMAZING...but not equal to his actual abilities.

Yeah, Hip Hop/New Jack Swing claimed his spot on the radio, but he'd seriously done himself in by believing his own hype by the time "Efil4Zaggin" dropped in the new soundscan watchdog music business.

He couldn't ride on bluster & mythology much longer.

Prince can be so fascinating 27 yrs ago.

s.blak
I'll Live My Life In Taxicabs

if he'd 'stuck to his guns' then Black Radio would've ignored him and his guns in favor of New Jack Swing and Hip-Hop.

>if he'd 'stuck to his guns' then Black Radio would've ignored
>him and his guns in favor of New Jack Swing and Hip-Hop.




And we have a winner^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Hmmmm....

They probably would have fronted on him too....

different genres, sure. but still the same result.

even they switched up their sound dramatically in the early 90s. b/c they wanted to stay current.

Duran Duran was all but over and in need of a comeback by the late 80s/early 90s.

Bruce Springsteen was not really a Pop factor anymore. he was still around and still respected and all that, but it wasn't 1984/85 for him anymore. the 'Glory Days'. LOL.

Madonna was approaching her commercial peak. her biggest hit in the late 80s/early 90s was basically a House track ('Vogue'), not a 'Like a Virgin' re-tread.

ironically, Sinead O'Connor had a massive hit w/a remade Prince-written song. it sounded little like the original and nothing like Prince's own arrangement heard in his cover version a couple yrs later.

Janet was all over the place w/her Rhythm Nation singles. they were made in Mpls, but w/o sounding like they were cut live at First Avenue in 1983. they were very Hip-Hop and NJS influenced.

i think the story is the same for Prince @ non-Black radio if he'd kept on w/his early 80s sound. he would've been ignored. his sound was no longer the hot, current thing. ppl had moved on.

>i think the story is the same for Prince @ non-Black radio if
>he'd kept on w/his early 80s sound. he would've been ignored.
> his sound was no longer the hot, current thing. ppl had
>moved on.

I know I had!

>

If he would've slowly eeked out the material in the vault (or similar quality) he would've stayed a critics darling, which would've gotten him radio play in some format.
Instead he tried to piggyback/glom onto/into whichever current gimmick R&B radio programmers were gobbling up, or trying to plant the Purple flag on Nona Gaye for some dap, or that stupid gun microphone, or the the bitten Rakim flow rapping, or trying to become a one-man new jack swing Temptations, or the tired ass James Brown schtick...

The 90's weren't hard on Prince because of Hip Hop, the 90's were hard on Prince cause his schitt wasn't "Prince" no more, and it was all his fault.

He imploded personally, creatively, and professionally.

s.blak
My sister didn't give a goddamn.

yes, radio would've ignored him. b/c by then the public had moved on to newer sounds.

i know the GB album contained some songs whose origins dated back to the early 80s - and they're among my faves on that album. but they weren't singles. i doubt 'Joy In Repetition' or 'We Can Funk' would've been radio hits. not when they were stacked next to hits like these: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_number-one_R%26B_singles_of_1990_%28U.S.%29. Prince was still able to score a number 1 hit w/'Thieves in the Temple', btw. which sounded like an updated version of 'When Doves Cry'. keyword: updated.

even MJ had a little trouble scoring radio hits w/the Dangerous singles. at least he had trouble relative to the success he'd had @ radio and on the singles charts w/the Bad and Thriller singles. how many Dangerous singles hit the top of the various charts? compared to the singles from Bad? or the singles from Thriller?

>The 90's weren't hard on Prince because of Hip Hop, the 90's
>were hard on Prince cause his schitt wasn't "Prince" no more,
>and it was all his fault.

I think, judging on some of the songs he had parted to other people that sounded very 1990s, but also "Prince" (Tevin Campbell comes to mind) ...he didn't not know how to make 1990s "Prince" music

but obviously, I think the issue is that he tried to assimilate rather than to follow his muse as he always had. even if it wasn't '80s Prince it would have been "Prince" in some way

I think post # 59 sums it up nicely...If P would have continued to do "Prince," radio and the younger black music market would have still steadily fronted on him...

The irony is dude is now viewed as an icon who has one of those unimpeachable legacies after some major ups and downs...That's really all you can ask for...

>
>as "somewhat" peers in the studio, as songwriters, editors,
>arrangers, and contributors.
>
>Levi Seacer Jr. was more of an amalgamation of Jimmy & Terry,
>he pushed off of him. Then shelved him callously.
>
>Then who came after that...motherfucking Kirky J.?
>->http://youtu.be/gX3wGWHRlXQ
>
>then less see...John Blackwell is just the best drummer he's
>ever had, hands down. He created a lot of space for Prince to
>get back to what he does best. But he's still just treated
>like a bad ass motherfucker on call. Which is cool.
>
>Wendy and Lisa challenged that dudes comfort zone just by
>being who they were...bad ass chicks that wouldn't fuck him
>and had him doing his musical homework in his free time.
>
>He couldn't take all that slow simmering ether knowing they
>were really taking it some place he wasn't invited...and it
>wasn't just some fey ass eyelash batting gimmicks.
>
>Ain't nobody talked back or told that fool something sucked
>since...maybe Sheila, but I doubt that seriously.
>
>s.blak
>pretend all my opinions and fake insights on this subject are
>factual knowledge based on expertise...then it's your
>turn...then I'll say something, or somebody else will. o.k.?
>o.k.

b/c Hip-Hop was looming for him in 1988, no matter what.

New Jack Swing was looming.

he would've felt the need to respond to them...as he did.

Prince won't have an Unsung episode to tell us that Hip-Hop and NJS killed his career. but it seems most of us agree his incorporation of those musics resulted in a dip in overall quality of his work. i think he would've gone there even if he'd released albums more slowly.

kinda like MJ did. most of us here seem to agree that OTW >/= Thriller > Bad >/= Dangerous > HIStory >> Blood on the Dancefloor >/= Invincible.

^ see that overall decline even though the albums were released several yrs apart?

maybe the 'decline' was inevitable. a run can like that can only last so long. his was 7 yrs. that's about how long the Greats have that kind of peak run. how many had one longer than that?

Prince owned the better part of the 80s the same way Stevie & Bowie did the 70s.

I'd give Bowie about 6/7 years for Hunky Dory up through Heroes.

Stevie is more like 5/6 years for Music Of My Mind thru SITKOL but he's got more great songs/hits outside his 'classic' window than Prince or Bowie.

P definitely has a full 7 with a ridiculous amount of output in addition to his actual album work thru production/writing for side projects along with a b-side collection better than many artists' greatest hits.

That trumps and/or can hang with anybody which is really about all you can ask for.

that despite hip hop and all of that, they would've just continued to make incredible music together. He cited W&L's post-Prince albums as an example. I didn't agree with him at first, but now I think I'm starting to see his point.

Before W&L's impact dude was making
>classics

No doubt albums like Controversy, 1999, and Dirty Mind were creations of his genius, but the offerings of W&L (Mountains, 17 days, most of ATIAD,etc) signaled a growth in him that he didn't really dive into anymore after they left. Instead, we got the 'Glam Slam' era where he had nothing but yes men around him and no quality control.

As far as the quantity of output, if I'm not mistaken didn't the Beatles do the same thing? Some say they just got better. Eventually everybody loses steam. Prince was able to live off his name when he did...

I agree with SoWhat in many respects. HIP HOP destroyed almost everyone and every genre of music in the 90's.

Metal bands pretty much died.

Rock music was on life support.

R&B singers weren't going to be played unless there was a feature rapper on the song. No hip hop, no airplay.

The CLIMATE of MUSIC changed.

Prince is actually one of the few lone survivors to make it through the HIP HOP era's ONSLAUGHT. Hip HOP came in like the biggest BEAST you could imagine and just moved EVERYTHING else to the side with a bitchslap.

What some call "fall off" was the period where Prince was pushed aside and looked out of place compared to the then current era of hip hop, but I believe he's pretty much the last man standing and he survived through the ass kickin. The Tony M and Kirky J shit was pretty much him trying to hang on for dear life in the era and climate of Hip Hop's hardcore culture. His attempt sound-wise, was a FAIL.

It was more of a Hip Hop ass kicking than anything else. While hip hop culture was in full steam, you weren't gonna like shit from say a Graffiti Bridge, because all the energy and "bumpthatshitness" was in Hip Hop. Subwoofers in cars made you never wanna pop in a LoveSexy CD during that era. You couldn't rideout with the homies and play Glam Slam. The CLIMATE changed.

Prince and his music in the Hip Hop climate, was vaginal drip and wasn't to be fucked with by the NEW young generation who was heavily into "Boomin in Yo Jeep", "Hear a nigga sounds coming from down the street" type shit. To this new generation, Prince was an old nigga with a perm that looked gay. Even if they actually liked some of his music, THEY could never actually admit to it. It would have been "nigga you gay" guilt by association.

The hard and confusing part was that I believe Prince personally ACTUALLY LIKED a lot of the hip hop that was on at that time. But he was, is, and always will be....a MUSICIAN, and hip hop didn't embrace musicianship. Hip hop was electronic beat machine driven and real instrumentation sounds made many young hip hoppas cringe.

I can understand why some people frame it in a way that makes it about a declination of Prince's music, but I think there are many variables that changed, not necessarily his ability to come up with good melodies and songs, but that there were of course larger variables that Prince couldn't control and neither could anyone else. THE OVERALL MUSIC CLIMATE.

HIP HOP was simply a FUCKING BEAST. It killed many genres of music, and with that, made many artists who were established before hip hop's life cycle, look like they just fell the fuck off. Prince included, but I believe the dude actually survived it all because 30 years later we still debate this dude's career over and over again, and then even though we say we don't....we check for the dude's new shit, we like some of it, dislike some of it, but the dude is still making new music and selling out arenas on moments notice.

Every album he has has gems.
TRC is a classic, and had plenty of the Prince touch all over it.
30 years in and people still buy his music, and he still has a fan base
what touch are you talking about?

and you don't.

>and you don't.

and it hasn't been for a long time.

you disagree and that's your prerogative

but you're in a very small minority

an org of prince fans, if you will.

>and it hasn't been for a long time.
>
>you disagree and that's your prerogative
>
>but you're in a very small minority
>
>an org of prince fans, if you will.

>

>l

He's pretty much been putting out great music off and on for decades.

Even the worst albums have a couple of good songs on them.


I don't think it's really possible for an artist that puts out nearly as much as Prince does to be great constantly.

He's either gonna get lazy.
A new sound will take over.
He won't be as good of a songwriter just due to age.


If I was to point out what exactly he didn't rule the world anymore, I'm gonna say the fight with Warner's.



-The Breakup of The Revolution was bad, but he got a better band soon after in the Lovesexy Band.

-The Lovesexy album was at least an interesting experiment.

-He was at least smart enough not to feature Tony M. on his big singles with the exception of Gett Off


With the Warner's battle, he was doing everything he could to get out that contract.

Including releasing just about anything be it good or bad.

At least we got the Gold Experience out of it which was a great album.

til death

I mean, the dude single-handedly dictated a particular strain of popular music for a few years and sold a shitload of records. few people can even do that much. even now, if someone plays a song a certain way, you might be inclined to say, "oh, that sounds like Prince".

i used to wonder if he was in a capsule not knowing what was current or hip in contemporary culture. but after studying the PR/UTCM rehearsal tapes i realize he was extremely aware of what was going on in contemporary music (demos are where you can always tell where the hearts lie: you can hear jackie jackson at the tail end of the "shake your body down to the ground" demo tell mike "that's BAD man, i can't WAIT til the bee gee's hear THIS shit!!!")---so in playful "let's take it to the stage" mode i see that during 1999 rehearsals kool & the gang were often on his mind. my assumption with the purple rain rehearsals is that warners often sent him promo items by his label mates of which i assume he had a special place in his heart often quoting talking heads during songs when he got bored.

however come "dead on it" we saw the beginning of "the end" although it took a while for it to settle in.

i mean i would find occasional indifference in some prince songs: i might skip "jack u off" or maybe "paisley park" or "venus de milo" but i still respected where they fit in the grand scheme of things its just maybe sometimes im not in the mood to hear THAT particular song at that moment.

but "Dead On It" was the first time i was like "hmmmm....i dunno man"---ignored it for a couple of years but then i started to notice that my blind faith wasn't what it used to be.....

"lemon crush" was the song that i remember saying "i HATE THIS SONG" so when i would make comp cassettes i would leave that off....and because tapes were 90-100 mins....then i would leave off "trust" and "arms of orion".....and the next thing you know "the future" & "vicki waiting" was the only songs i'd include off batman in my "prince jams"

gotta admit i let rolling stones highly lauded @@@@1/2 star review sway me when Bridge came out. and i got the feeling that if the movie were halfway decent (i consider cherry moon halfway decent kinda like an inside joke that "real folk" dont get....i mean i know its a bad film, but since i get that minneapolis humor its cult status with me---and parade kicks ass)---so if the movie was decent i woulda gave it a chance or at least expanded the parenthesis in my mind that his streak was from 78-90---but the movie left such a bad taste in my mouth i can't even consider Pandemonium a worth Time album even though there were awesome moments on both those soundtracks. i just rode the denial train like i didn't know the difference tween the 1986 songs and the 1989 songs. so i feel like if there wasn't a leak and i didn't know any better i coulda etched in my mind that "can't stop this feeling", "question of you" (although he really shoulda fleshed that song out with 3 verses) "we can funk", & "joy" were just as awesome----instead i see them as reminders and confirmation that this train is about to stop rolling....

the day diamonds and pearls came out (the same day PE's Apocalypse 91 came out i remember that being an EXTREMELY heartbreaking day in which i felt both acts gave me diminished returns on their product. at least with PE they gave me an intro song ("Lost At Birth" that i felt rivaled their best work as a nice parting gift ---and there were gems--) but man...i know Prince was on his "on to the next one" steeze and it hurt to hear the results: i did not like his texture/tone/patches on ANY of the songs: prince's greatest gift was he created his own SOUND.

so i often hear that album (and the subsequent albums after) in a WWPD state of mind---like man. what if "Money Don't Matter" (the ONLY song i loved the way i loved the magic streak period) was recorded by Susan Rodgers in 84 with the same mix given "Take Me With U"---but given that he made 500 songs during this period i can see how he got bored but of course we know the hip hop issues (im sure it burned him that Hammer was the new king in town) and the "im still black" issues harmed his decision making.

i mean i know this whole post is full of the same ideology so i wont get redundant---

it is kinda weird though that he went back to "the sound" for 20ten and i was like "yeah but now the songs aren't there!!!!!"

im cool with it now: i mean of ALL the artists in the world he is one of the rare cats whose unreleased ish rivals his released ish and there are at LEAST 50 gems in that pile that will keep me satisfied for life....so this isnt a dig written in jest like "SMH, what happened to THAT mofo"---i understand that an artist or NO human being can swish 300 3 point shots in a row.

so that said i say had he just stayed the course and let hip hop be he coulda extended the streak a lil longer. cause truth be told? i consider "The Truth" his last perfect album (all acoustic!) so i don't have doubt that he still has fire in him. but im not holding breath either.

not enough people know how epic that joint is.

the 1st new/current Prince songs i'd flat-out hated.

See that's what's so interesting about Prince's music. One person will hate a song, and another will LOVE it.

Trust was my shit, and I hated Lemon Crush, but my girl LOVED Lemon Crush and she wasn't a big fan of Prince like that at all.

And I LOVED The Future especially since it has a Chicago House sound to it, but she hated that one.

Arms of Orion has a good melody, but it sounds too unfinished and too big.

Prince's new song called "RNR Affair" is being debuted on Clear Channel stations every hour on the hour.

You can listen via iHeart Radio to V103 Chicago, and other Clear Channel stations also.

FYI.

You ain't never lied. I am going bonkers that people (including 15) are fans of "Can't stop this feeling" which I always skipped and hated for reminded me to much of "footloose".



**********
"naive as the dry leaves on the ground looking past the trees to the blue sky asking 'why me?'" -Blu

the reason why i liked the OG version was because i always seen

"girl of my dreams"/"can't stop this feeling i got"/"we can funk" as a suite that i liked.


its like "girl" was an impending alley oop that almost got shaky with "can't stop" and with 4 secs left here comes a jordan of a "funk" to win the ring.


so i guess me giving the bridge version a pass was based on its previous history.


and i guess now i can say the same for bridge version of "funk"

s'what I'm saying

funny how I JUST heard a new son from dude...."RnR Affair", and it sounding like "Take Me With U 10.30".

I don't expect the swishes anymore...but curiosity gets the best of me because I guess I still HOPE he can reconnect with the side of himself that was just so zoned out for SOOOO long.
Motherfucker had an album streak that kept ME on the edge of my seat like watching a "The Wire" marathon. That schitt was awesome.

The drop off was SO drastic and sudden, man, that schitt made me a little extra cynical. lol

s.blak
Spirit Is Calling...Oops,Wrong Number

Especially that first listen to Diamonds And Pearls being a disheartening experience, BUT:

I love Lemon Crush! To this day, still one of my faves from the record.

>i used to wonder if he was in a capsule not knowing what was
>current or hip in contemporary culture. but after studying the
>PR/UTCM rehearsal tapes i realize he was extremely aware of
>what was going on in contemporary music (demos are where you
>can always tell where the hearts lie: you can hear jackie
>jackson at the tail end of the "shake your body down to the
>ground" demo tell mike "that's BAD man, i can't WAIT til the
>bee gee's hear THIS shit!!!")---so in playful "let's take it
>to the stage" mode i see that during 1999 rehearsals kool &
>the gang were often on his mind. my assumption with the purple
>rain rehearsals is that warners often sent him promo items by
>his label mates of which i assume he had a special place in
>his heart often quoting talking heads during songs when he got
>bored.
>
>however come "dead on it" we saw the beginning of "the end"
>although it took a while for it to settle in.
>
>i mean i would find occasional indifference in some prince
>songs: i might skip "jack u off" or maybe "paisley park" or
>"venus de milo" but i still respected where they fit in the
>grand scheme of things its just maybe sometimes im not in the
>mood to hear THAT particular song at that moment.
>
>but "Dead On It" was the first time i was like "hmmmm....i
>dunno man"---ignored it for a couple of years but then i
>started to notice that my blind faith wasn't what it used to
>be.....
>
>"lemon crush" was the song that i remember saying "i HATE THIS
>SONG" so when i would make comp cassettes i would leave that
>off....and because tapes were 90-100 mins....then i would
>leave off "trust" and "arms of orion".....and the next thing
>you know "the future" & "vicki waiting" was the only songs i'd
>include off batman in my "prince jams"
>
>gotta admit i let rolling stones highly lauded @@@@1/2 star
>review sway me when Bridge came out. and i got the feeling
>that if the movie were halfway decent (i consider cherry moon
>halfway decent kinda like an inside joke that "real folk" dont
>get....i mean i know its a bad film, but since i get that
>minneapolis humor its cult status with me---and parade kicks
>ass)---so if the movie was decent i woulda gave it a chance or
>at least expanded the parenthesis in my mind that his streak
>was from 78-90---but the movie left such a bad taste in my
>mouth i can't even consider Pandemonium a worth Time album
>even though there were awesome moments on both those
>soundtracks. i just rode the denial train like i didn't know
>the difference tween the 1986 songs and the 1989 songs. so i
>feel like if there wasn't a leak and i didn't know any better
>i coulda etched in my mind that "can't stop this feeling",
>"question of you" (although he really shoulda fleshed that
>song out with 3 verses) "we can funk", & "joy" were just as
>awesome----instead i see them as reminders and confirmation
>that this train is about to stop rolling....
>
>the day diamonds and pearls came out (the same day PE's
>Apocalypse 91 came out i remember that being an EXTREMELY
>heartbreaking day in which i felt both acts gave me diminished
>returns on their product. at least with PE they gave me an
>intro song ("Lost At Birth" that i felt rivaled their best
>work as a nice parting gift ---and there were gems--) but
>man...i know Prince was on his "on to the next one" steeze and
>it hurt to hear the results: i did not like his
>texture/tone/patches on ANY of the songs: prince's greatest
>gift was he created his own SOUND.
>
>so i often hear that album (and the subsequent albums after)
>in a WWPD state of mind---like man. what if "Money Don't
>Matter" (the ONLY song i loved the way i loved the magic
>streak period) was recorded by Susan Rodgers in 84 with the
>same mix given "Take Me With U"---but given that he made 500
>songs during this period i can see how he got bored but of
>course we know the hip hop issues (im sure it burned him that
>Hammer was the new king in town) and the "im still black"
>issues harmed his decision making.
>
>i mean i know this whole post is full of the same ideology so
>i wont get redundant---
>
>it is kinda weird though that he went back to "the sound" for
>20ten and i was like "yeah but now the songs aren't
>there!!!!!"
>
>im cool with it now: i mean of ALL the artists in the world he
>is one of the rare cats whose unreleased ish rivals his
>released ish and there are at LEAST 50 gems in that pile that
>will keep me satisfied for life....so this isnt a dig written
>in jest like "SMH, what happened to THAT mofo"---i understand
>that an artist or NO human being can swish 300 3 point shots
>in a row.
>
>so that said i say had he just stayed the course and let hip
>hop be he coulda extended the streak a lil longer. cause truth
>be told? i consider "The Truth" his last perfect album (all
>acoustic!) so i don't have doubt that he still has fire in
>him. but im not holding breath either.

I kind of agree with what you said.
I was glad that "the sound" was back (might as well, since too many nowadays are bringing it back into vogue), but the lyrics on many songs left something to be desired.

I've got "Beginning Endlessly" on now... and I can't tell you why. Oh yeah, it's the drums (and a nice shout out to "When Doves Cry" at its climax) as long as I hear that "Prince" I'm tuned in.

but I almost feel as if this album had an "in the store" release it would be another attempt to grab the masses, instead of grabbin' asses

is still being done today by a LOT of artists, both known and unknown.

His influence is really far reaching, and even I didn't realize it until a couple years ago.

So for me, that kinda made me forgive him for falling off so much. Because in a way it doesn't matter. The music he created in that ten year period between 1979-1989 will be studied, emulated and copied for years to come.

bottom line, Prince won even during his cooling off period because he is that good at this music thing

the fact that folks can't decide when he "fell off" is even more interesting

and yet the same people up in here talking about how awful Prince was during the 90's, sit up there calling lauding the current crop of homo star search contestants




3-20 from the 3-point line, and then told everyone that nigga shooting like Larry Bird









>is still being done today by a LOT of artists, both known and
>unknown.
>
>His influence is really far reaching, and even I didn't
>realize it until a couple years ago.
>
>So for me, that kinda made me forgive him for falling off so
>much. Because in a way it doesn't matter. The music he created
>in that ten year period between 1979-1989 will be studied,
>emulated and copied for years to come.

>
>the fact that folks can't decide when he "fell off" is even
>more interesting
>
the fact that a few 'true believer' types wanna continue pretend it didn't happen in 88/89 isn't evidence of anything anymore than a few Nas fans trying to pretend Hip-Hop Is Dead was a good album.

>>
>>the fact that folks can't decide when he "fell off" is even
>>more interesting
>>
>the fact that a few 'true believer' types wanna continue
>pretend it didn't happen in 88/89 isn't evidence of anything
>anymore than a few Nas fans trying to pretend Hip-Hop Is Dead
>was a good album.

http://i.imgur.com/8KwMV.gif

there's no argument about that whatsoever. The point I am making is that it no longer matters (to me at least) that he fell off so badly after that because the 80s Minneapolis Sound is timeless and it's been recreated repeatedly through the years by many different artists. It never sounds dated.

I agree that he started getting wobbly around the Diamonds and Pearls era. There were a couple of unlistenable songs and some filler on that record. The Love Symbol album was even more uneven. Newpowersoul and Chaos&Disorder were the lowest points of his recorded output...

...but that being said, he always has at least a couple of good songs on every album. And I've enjoyed the all of the albums since the Rainbow Children. Nothing's equaled his 80's input but they've been pretty solid albums. The first half of 3121 is probably the highlight of his recent recorded stuff for me.

>I agree that he started getting wobbly around the Diamonds
>and Pearls era. There were a couple of unlistenable songs and
>some filler on that record. The Love Symbol album was even
>more uneven. Newpowersoul and Chaos&Disorder were the lowest
>points of his recorded output...
>
>...but that being said, he always has at least a couple of
>good songs on every album. And I've enjoyed the all of the
>albums since the Rainbow Children. Nothing's equaled his 80's
>input but they've been pretty solid albums. The first half of
>3121 is probably the highlight of his recent recorded stuff
>for me.

I don't know if any artists -Prince included-can maintain a decade-long run of top shelf output.

But the question was when did Prince lose his touch.

So I'm assuming most people think it was sometime after his 80's output.

Unless someone is going to argue that he hit his peak with Chaos & Disorder

It's interesting that there seems to be a consensus that the cause of the drop off is the change in music taste created by hip-hop music.

I wonder why Prince couldn't get with it all? Even Madonna and MJJ learned o appreciate it.



For the record, it's stating that everyone here seems to believe in the Purple Ones GOAT status and dude has earned the right to rest on his laurels. It's just interesting that someone sound can go from ahead to behind the curve so quickly.

**********
"naive as the dry leaves on the ground looking past the trees to the blue sky asking 'why me?'" -Blu

>It's interesting that there seems to be a consensus that the
>cause of the drop off is the change in music taste created by
>hip-hop music.
>
>I wonder why Prince couldn't get with it all? Even Madonna and
>MJJ learned o appreciate it.


That's because MJ was a GENIUS pop star and performer who aimed to please...

Madonna was a savvy and VERY INTELLIGENT pop star who aimed to please...

Prince was a GENIUS underground, independent artist/performer masquerading as a pop star...

And he didn't care much for pleasing...

>Prince was a GENIUS underground, independent artist/performer
>masquerading as a pop star...
>
>And he didn't care much for pleasing...

he was a rat in the proverbial cheese factory up until the cheese factory switched over to bubblegum.

which is why I refuse to argue w/ turd brains like 'Tim The Troll' who was probably in diapers when Prince was synthesizing Punk/Post-Punk & New Wave elements into R&B/Funk/Post-Disco grooves...that schitt was exhilarating.

People change,yes...BUT!!!

"Compromised Microphone Gun Prince" horrifyingly flew back in de face of everyone who championed "Trench Coat Bikini Brief Prince", just as much as "Jehovah's Witness Protection Program Prince" mocks "Rude Boy Musical Zeitgeist Prince".

s.blak
Blame Hip Hop? #naw

Yet dude made lame attempts at hip-hop which seems to me like an attempt to crowd please.

I always chucked it up to the idea that Prince is uncompromising in the notion that all music must come from him.

If dude wanted an album that could chart the tops today, he could invite Raphael Saadiq, Questlove, Jermaine Dupri or a couple of other producers/musician and let them guide him to some sounds that would attract modern audience. I just see no chance of Prince turning over control to someone else.


Madonna and Prince had no problems with seeking out the hottest producers of the moment and letting them craft the sound (Madonna more than MJJ but yeah).


**********
"naive as the dry leaves on the ground looking past the trees to the blue sky asking 'why me?'" -Blu

>If dude wanted an album that could chart the tops today, he
>could invite Raphael Saadiq, Questlove, Jermaine Dupri

full stop for LOL @ the notion that any of those 3 could help Prince deliver a chart-topping album in 2012, when none of those 3 have offered significant help on a chart-topper in several yrs.

>Madonna and Prince had no problems with seeking out the
>hottest producers of the moment and letting them craft the
>sound (Madonna more than MJJ but yeah).

and how'd that work out for them?

MJ chased trends on Dangerous, HIStory, and Invincible. w/significantly diminishing results each time. (i ignored BOTD).

Madge also chased trends through the 90s and also had diminishing results. Erotica was a disappointment. so was Bedtime Stories. she came back w/Ray of Light though. a few yrs later she was back in the bargain bin thanks to American Life.

point: working w/'hot' producers didn't really extend either of their peaks. MJ's peak period ended around 1992 w/Dangerous and those molestation allegations. the album made a big splash but it wasn't as big as Bad's or Thriller's (in the USA). largely b/c of Hip-Hop and NJS. yes, it had some hits on it ('Black or White' and 'Remember the Time'), but there wasn't the sort of mania around those songs as we'd seen w/some of his previous singles. ppl were moving on.

Madge's lasted until 1992 when she hit that backlash w/the Erotica/Sex project. same thing w/her...w/each album her sound was a bit more uninteresting. her thing wasn't as compelling as it had been in the mid to late 80s. ppl were moving on.

>Madge's lasted until 1992 when she hit that backlash w/the
>Erotica/Sex project. same thing w/her...w/each album her
>sound was a bit more uninteresting. her thing wasn't as
>compelling as it had been in the mid to late 80s. ppl were
>moving on.

I don't know about that, homie...That old broad found her second wind with those Ray of Light and Music albums....Both of those albums sold a shit load of albums...Multi-platinum almost 20 years in her career....And those albums had a shit load of hit singles...So maybe you moved on...lol...But A LOT of other fans clearly didn't...

if not, why not?

there's my point.

love 'em too.

and i'm a cocksucking size queen.

>if not, why not?
>
>there's my point.



That's a lackluster point though homie....

One should never compare 80's record sales with sales in the late 90s and '00's....

Different eras, different time....Music was KING in the 80's...The decline in sales since 1998 has been well documented...

Like a Virgin was certified diamond (10 million in the US)....and over 20 million worldwide...

Like A Prayer? 15 million worldwide...

Ray of Light has sold over 20 million worldwide...

Music? 4 to 5 million in the US, 14 million worldwide....

Any 80's act would KILL to have those numbers....

I'll say it again...

Madonna was still KILLING it in her "twilight" years...And this is coming from someone that is at best a very respectful, moderate Madge fan...

Now? Not so much...She now comes off as too desperate for hits...

fine.

>full stop for LOL @ the notion that any of those 3 could help
>Prince deliver a chart-topping album in 2012, when none of
>those 3 have offered significant help on a chart-topper in
>several yrs.


Fine. Swap out those names (though in certain instances 1+1 = 3 through senergy) and pair Prince up with Mark Ronson or who ever you think is a skilled hit making producer today. You don't think that combo could produce some chart topping music?


And I do think Madonna and MJJ managed to extend their shelf like working with hot producers. There would be no matching Thriller and Bad but Dangerous is a strong album. (didn't MJJ work with hot producers of the day for Bad and Thriller?)



**********
"naive as the dry leaves on the ground looking past the trees to the blue sky asking 'why me?'" -Blu

previously his popular music productions were kinda lacking for hits. he'd hit w/Off the Wall and a single here and there. but before Thriller he was more known for tv and movie scores and soundtracks and Jazz production than for his work in popular music.

as for Bad...MJ stayed w/Quincy, probably b/c he was hot. LOL. so, on that 1 i'd say yes.

oh hell, i forget that Q had just come off a 10 million seller (OTW) when he worked on Thriller. OTW sold more copies than any other R&B album to that point. so, a'ight. he was at least kinda hot then.

anyway, the main point: could Prince have a hit if he worked w/RedOne or LMFAO or David Guetta or Dr. Luke? sure.

>Yet dude made lame attempts at hip-hop which seems to me like
>an attempt to crowd please.


That was Prince's attempt to prove he could do it ALL...

Prince's EGO was and still is MAMMOTH...But if Prince truly cared about pleasing the younger music fans he would have hooked up with real MC's that were killing it at the time...He would have hooked up with happening producers that were killing it...

MJ wanted to please music fans...even if that meant getting the younger heads...So he hooked up with Teddy...He got Heavy to rap on his track...He got Biggie to rap on his track...

Madonna got the biggest cutting edge dance producers to collaborate on her music...William Orbit and the like...

Prince?

Dude was so arrogant that he thought he could tackle hip-hop by himself...Nigga tried to rap HIMSELF...lol...And he got some wack ass MC's instead of doing what MJ did....And he never was able to swallow his pride to at the very least collaborate with another producer in the way Madonna did...

By the time P finally hooked up with "real" rappers (Chuck D...Q-Tip, Eve...ect...) it was too late...

So again, this takes me back to my underlining point...

The only time Prince attempted to "please" the public was on HIS terms...lol

But as a whole, P didn't give a fuck...

>Dude was so arrogant that he thought he could tackle hip-hop
>by himself...Nigga tried to rap HIMSELF...lol...

exactly. he didn't respect it musically, nor as an art form. the first obvious result of this was Dead On It.

>And he got
>some wack ass MC's instead of doing what MJ did....

good Lort, yes.

>By the time P finally hooked up with "real" rappers (Chuck
>D...Q-Tip, Eve...ect...) it was too late...

AMEN. waaaay too late.

>So again, this takes me back to my underlining point...
>
>The only time Prince attempted to "please" the public was on
>HIS terms...lol
>
>But as a whole, P didn't give a fuck...

pretty much!

and desperate.

it didn't make him cool. he gained 0 points w/the kids doing that shit.

let's not be brand new.

or maybe i misremember HIStory?

that Heavy D verse on 'Jam' was a'ight, but was also naked pandering. it didn't light the hood/streets on fire either. again, maybe i misremember....

oh and Madge's thing worked w/her core audience. Madge's core audience is much larger than Prince's. no shock there. she could sell at least a million or 2 copies of her albums, no matter what. look at American Life. LOL.

>and desperate.
>
>it didn't make him cool. he gained 0 points w/the kids doing
>that shit.
>
>let's not be brand new.
>
>or maybe i misremember HIStory?
>
>that Heavy D verse on 'Jam' was a'ight, but was also naked
>pandering. it didn't light the hood/streets on fire either.
>again, maybe i misremember....


I have to say this though...

MJ got away with A LOT....

That Dangerous album? MJ WON BIG TIME with the hood....

Mike won with the very same crowd that P was half-heartedly trying to court with the D&P's album (ironically, that album was a favorite by his black fanbase...More than most of his "classic" albums ironically...5 million copies in the US alone....)...As much as we hardcore P fans tend to down that album, the general public dug it...

But back to MJ...Pandering charges didn't stick to Mike in the 90s...

Mike was viewed as GIANT pop icon...And as such, he could do whatever he wanted to in terms of collaborations...There was no shame in Mike when it came to selling albums...Because he always made it known he was 'Bout it...He was still trying to crush Thriller...

No one shook their heads when Heavy showed up on a track...No one gave dude the screw face when he hooked up with Teddy...

*Though Blood on the Dance was horrible*

The screw face came later starting with History (Child abuse claims and pairing up new songs with classic songs hurt that release)...

By the time Invincible hit, MJ was seen largely as being a desperate artist who was merely a singer looking for the next hot producer...

sure.

>>Yet dude made lame attempts at hip-hop which seems to me
>like
>>an attempt to crowd please.
>
>
>That was Prince's attempt to prove he could do it ALL...
>
>Prince's EGO was and still is MAMMOTH...But if Prince truly
>cared about pleasing the younger music fans he would have
>hooked up with real MC's that were killing it at the time...He
>would have hooked up with happening producers that were
>killing it...
>
>MJ wanted to please music fans...even if that meant getting
>the younger heads...So he hooked up with Teddy...He got Heavy
>to rap on his track...He got Biggie to rap on his track...
>
>Madonna got the biggest cutting edge dance producers to
>collaborate on her music...William Orbit and the like...
>
>Prince?
>
>Dude was so arrogant that he thought he could tackle hip-hop
>by himself...Nigga tried to rap HIMSELF...lol...And he got
>some wack ass MC's instead of doing what MJ did....And he
>never was able to swallow his pride to at the very least
>collaborate with another producer in the way Madonna did...
>
>By the time P finally hooked up with "real" rappers (Chuck
>D...Q-Tip, Eve...ect...) it was too late...
>
>So again, this takes me back to my underlining point...
>
>The only time Prince attempted to "please" the public was on
>HIS terms...lol
>
>But as a whole, P didn't give a fuck...

than it had any right to be.

Props to everybody and please don't let it miss the archive.

Prince claimed that it was merely a collection of vault material meant to kill off "Prince" before being reborn as the "love symbol" but that was BS. Most of Come was recorded at Paisley Park in mid-to-late 1993 and was definitely meant to be released together. Matter of fact, a few of the tracks from The Gold Experience were originally meant to be on Come but Warner Bros. rejected them.

>Prince claimed that it was merely a collection of vault
>material meant to kill off "Prince" before being reborn as the
>"love symbol" but that was BS. Most of Come was recorded at
>Paisley Park in mid-to-late 1993 and was definitely meant to
>be released together. Matter of fact, a few of the tracks from
>The Gold Experience were originally meant to be on Come but
>Warner Bros. rejected them.


********************************************************************************
Why does Matthew Perry continue to get television projects?

I don't think him running from Hip Hop as an influence is the answer..
Pharrel, Q Tip, Dilla,Outkast and countless other Hip Hop acts have counted as Prince as an influence..

If Prince was willing to do him but allow someone to oversee the project to make sure the sound was up to date and modern (like Dr. Dre) I think it could work.

>If Prince was willing to do him but allow someone to oversee
>the project to make sure the sound was up to date and modern
>(like Dr. Dre) I think it could work.

that's just it, though...he's not willing. Never was...never will be.

What are your thoughts on Prince and his management team splitting up and the impact that had on his career?

When he started managing/controlling everything, things just got worse - especially shortly after the name change.

However, the name change era was fantastic and is severly underrated. All of those single word song title songs were dope and fresh as could be at the time.

>What are your thoughts on Prince and his management team
>splitting up and the impact that had on his career?
>
>When he started managing/controlling everything, things just
>got worse - especially shortly after the name change.
>
>However, the name change era was fantastic and is severly
>underrated. All of those single word song title songs were
>dope and fresh as could be at the time.
>

Cavallo, Ruffallo & Fargnoli were integral to his success.

When I heard they were out I shook my head.

I hear you - the name change to a symbol was cool but absolute career suicide.

That wouldn't have happened if he had someone or people who would look at him sideways when the idea came up.

The dude needs a critical eye... Not his own.

When people talk career suicide it means an artist is over. Lets's see in the last week he was on the view, had the roots and Maya cover Darlin Nikki, from all new's reports he and Mary stole the show at the Iheart concerts in Vegas last night and has 3 sold out shows in Chicago starting tomorrow.

Sucks to be dead!

I still like his music - some of it but the fact is, Prince is living off of his legacy these days.

While I certainly look forward to new music from him, I don't think he'll be releasing anything that makes me yearn to hear it.

His last hit was in 1993... things dried up for the guy very soon after the name change.

>I still like his music - some of it but the fact is, Prince
>is living off of his legacy these days.

so?

>
>While I certainly look forward to new music from him, I don't
>think he'll be releasing anything that makes me yearn to hear
>it.

ok


>His last hit was in 1993... things dried up for the guy very
>soon after the name change.

2004 Rolling Stone magazine named Prince as the highest-earning musician in the world, with an annual income of $56.5 million.


3121 gave Prince his first No.1 debut on the Billboard 200 with the album

broke records in London tour

lflower No.2 on the Billboard 200

won some grammy awards


yeah, that's really dried up

>>I still like his music - some of it but the fact is, Prince
>>is living off of his legacy these days.
>
>so?
>
>>
>>While I certainly look forward to new music from him, I
>don't
>>think he'll be releasing anything that makes me yearn to
>hear
>>it.
>
>ok
>
>
>>His last hit was in 1993... things dried up for the guy very
>>soon after the name change.
>
>2004 Rolling Stone magazine named Prince as the
>highest-earning musician in the world, with an annual income
>of $56.5 million.
>
>
>3121 gave Prince his first No.1 debut on the Billboard 200
>with the album
>
>broke records in London tour
>
>lflower No.2 on the Billboard 200
>
>won some grammy awards
>
>
>yeah, that's really dried up


Listen man - I'm a major Prince fan as well but these stats that you've pulled out here need to be looked at in more detail.

Sure Prince had a number 1 record with 3121 but did the record have any songs that really captured the attention of the music buying public that he was attempting to capture? How long after selling a 168,000 copies of the record in its first week or so did the record fall off the charts?

The Grammy award wins don't say much considering he was shunned by them during his artistic and commercial peak - a run of records that will forever be remembered and idiolized. The Grammy's are no longer a legitimate artistic board - it's a corporate party for corporate artists and executives.

While I'm happy to see that Prince continues to play arenas, I saw him three times on the Welcome 2 Canada tour and all I can say is that my wife and I both agreed that he looked like he was bored. It was neat to see him play the venue but the Lovesexy era or Gold era Prince would wipe the floor with this guy.

Now, Prince in a tiny club (2500 people) in Montreal is another story!

But enough with the little stats - us fans going out and buying a record in its first week and getting a number one is hardly a success. Had the sales continued over a longer amount of time as a result of having a legitimate song on radio that captured the people's attention, well then you'd have a leg to stand on but right now, this argument is weak.

>>>I still like his music - some of it but the fact is,
>Prince
>>>is living off of his legacy these days.
>>
>>so?
>>
>>>
>>>While I certainly look forward to new music from him, I
>>don't
>>>think he'll be releasing anything that makes me yearn to
>>hear
>>>it.
>>
>>ok
>>
>>
>>>His last hit was in 1993... things dried up for the guy
>very
>>>soon after the name change.
>>
>>2004 Rolling Stone magazine named Prince as the
>>highest-earning musician in the world, with an annual income
>>of $56.5 million.
>>
>>
>>3121 gave Prince his first No.1 debut on the Billboard 200
>>with the album
>>
>>broke records in London tour
>>
>>lflower No.2 on the Billboard 200
>>
>>won some grammy awards
>>
>>
>>yeah, that's really dried up
>
>
>Listen man - I'm a major Prince fan as well but these stats
>that you've pulled out here need to be looked at in more
>detail.
>
>Sure Prince had a number 1 record with 3121 but did the record
>have any songs that really captured the attention of the music
>buying public that he was attempting to capture? How long
>after selling a 168,000 copies of the record in its first week
>or so did the record fall off the charts?


Sounds like the norm for most artist during that time period. Fact: It was a #1.

>
>The Grammy award wins don't say much considering he was
>shunned by them during his artistic and commercial peak - a
>run of records that will forever be remembered and idiolized.
>The Grammy's are no longer a legitimate artistic board - it's
>a corporate party for corporate artists and executives.


A win is a win.


>While I'm happy to see that Prince continues to play arenas, I
>saw him three times on the Welcome 2 Canada tour and all I can
>say is that my wife and I both agreed that he looked like he
>was bored. It was neat to see him play the venue but the
>Lovesexy era or Gold era Prince would wipe the floor with this
>guy.


Yet you know Prince was bored because he told you that?



>Now, Prince in a tiny club (2500 people) in Montreal is
>another story!

Again, far from "dried up."

>
>But enough with the little stats - us fans going out and
>buying a record in its first week and getting a number one is
>hardly a success. Had the sales continued over a longer
>amount of time as a result of having a legitimate song on
>radio that captured the people's attention, well then you'd
>have a leg to stand on but right now, this argument is weak.


Far from "dried up."

Every other artist can live off a legacy, but the minute Prince does it, he is "dried up"
lost his touch, etc, yet you same dried up posters will be in chicago dressing like the lost member of The Time screaming like a bitch when you hear the intro chords to Purple Rain, or even tour as a prince cover band, yet Prince is dried up.

Prince is doing what he wants to do, the same Prince you old folks grew up on. He just doing things you don't like or disagree with later in his life, but yet you old fuckers complain complain, yet you are still drawn in by anything he records.

still buying the albums, still debating everything, still showing up @ his shows, still wishing to be a member of his band, still checking for his new stuff, and still wanting

yet he is "dried up, or lost his touch"



"It's a driving song," Prince says. "The world is so jagged, I like smooth waves. It's the way I live now. When Larry (Graham) first came around here (in the '90s) we had a lot of crazy people in here. Now, no one argues, no one swears, no one smokes, no one talks harsh. We all enjoy each other. You don't know what that's like till you start living like that, because for a long time I didn't. It was affecting me up here (points to his head), which in turn affected me here (points to throat). I changed the way I operate. A lot of my contemporaries didn't. That's the reason I'm still here, and a lot of them aren't."

and bottom line that is all that matters.

>>>>I still like his music - some of it but the fact is,
>>Prince
>>>>is living off of his legacy these days.
>>>
>>>so?
>>>
>>>>
>>>>While I certainly look forward to new music from him, I
>>>don't
>>>>think he'll be releasing anything that makes me yearn to
>>>hear
>>>>it.
>>>
>>>ok
>>>
>>>
>>>>His last hit was in 1993... things dried up for the guy
>>very
>>>>soon after the name change.
>>>
>>>2004 Rolling Stone magazine named Prince as the
>>>highest-earning musician in the world, with an annual
>income
>>>of $56.5 million.
>>>
>>>
>>>3121 gave Prince his first No.1 debut on the Billboard 200
>>>with the album
>>>
>>>broke records in London tour
>>>
>>>lflower No.2 on the Billboard 200
>>>
>>>won some grammy awards
>>>
>>>
>>>yeah, that's really dried up
>>
>>
>>Listen man - I'm a major Prince fan as well but these stats
>>that you've pulled out here need to be looked at in more
>>detail.
>>
>>Sure Prince had a number 1 record with 3121 but did the
>record
>>have any songs that really captured the attention of the
>music
>>buying public that he was attempting to capture? How long
>>after selling a 168,000 copies of the record in its first
>week
>>or so did the record fall off the charts?
>
>
>Sounds like the norm for most artist during that time period.
>Fact: It was a #1.
>
>>
>>The Grammy award wins don't say much considering he was
>>shunned by them during his artistic and commercial peak - a
>>run of records that will forever be remembered and idiolized.
>
>>The Grammy's are no longer a legitimate artistic board -
>it's
>>a corporate party for corporate artists and executives.
>
>
>A win is a win.
>
>
>>While I'm happy to see that Prince continues to play arenas,
>I
>>saw him three times on the Welcome 2 Canada tour and all I
>can
>>say is that my wife and I both agreed that he looked like he
>>was bored. It was neat to see him play the venue but the
>>Lovesexy era or Gold era Prince would wipe the floor with
>this
>>guy.
>
>
>Yet you know Prince was bored because he told you that?
>
>
>
>>Now, Prince in a tiny club (2500 people) in Montreal is
>>another story!
>
>Again, far from "dried up."
>
>>
>>But enough with the little stats - us fans going out and
>>buying a record in its first week and getting a number one
>is
>>hardly a success. Had the sales continued over a longer
>>amount of time as a result of having a legitimate song on
>>radio that captured the people's attention, well then you'd
>>have a leg to stand on but right now, this argument is weak.
>
>
>Far from "dried up."
>
>Every other artist can live off a legacy, but the minute
>Prince does it, he is "dried up"
>lost his touch, etc, yet you same dried up posters will be in
>chicago dressing like the lost member of The Time screaming
>like a bitch when you hear the intro chords to Purple Rain, or
>even tour as a prince cover band, yet Prince is dried up.
>
>Prince is doing what he wants to do, the same Prince you old
>folks grew up on. He just doing things you don't like or
>disagree with later in his life, but yet you old fuckers
>complain complain, yet you are still drawn in by anything he
>records.
>
>still buying the albums, still debating everything, still
>showing up @ his shows, still wishing to be a member of his
>band, still checking for his new stuff, and still wanting
>
>yet he is "dried up, or lost his touch"


These are the things fans do - however, I'm getting the impression you don't know what it was like to discover She's Always In My Hair or to hear the screams of La la la He He Hee after finding them on the b-side of an album track.

Prince was far more clever and sonically interesting back during his golden era which in my opinion lasted from 78 - 95. He was the baddest rockstar and songwriter for a very long time.

However, I still look foward to new music from Prince. I also applaud his need to continue searching for new sounds. The guy is still so much bigger than today's artists. He just appears to lack the motivation to do something big.

>>>>>I still like his music - some of it but the fact is,
>>>Prince
>>>>>is living off of his legacy these days.
>>>>
>>>>so?
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>While I certainly look forward to new music from him, I
>>>>don't
>>>>>think he'll be releasing anything that makes me yearn to
>>>>hear
>>>>>it.
>>>>
>>>>ok
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>His last hit was in 1993... things dried up for the guy
>>>very
>>>>>soon after the name change.
>>>>
>>>>2004 Rolling Stone magazine named Prince as the
>>>>highest-earning musician in the world, with an annual
>>income
>>>>of $56.5 million.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>3121 gave Prince his first No.1 debut on the Billboard 200
>>>>with the album
>>>>
>>>>broke records in London tour
>>>>
>>>>lflower No.2 on the Billboard 200
>>>>
>>>>won some grammy awards
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>yeah, that's really dried up
>>>
>>>
>>>Listen man - I'm a major Prince fan as well but these stats
>>>that you've pulled out here need to be looked at in more
>>>detail.
>>>
>>>Sure Prince had a number 1 record with 3121 but did the
>>record
>>>have any songs that really captured the attention of the
>>music
>>>buying public that he was attempting to capture? How long
>>>after selling a 168,000 copies of the record in its first
>>week
>>>or so did the record fall off the charts?
>>
>>
>>Sounds like the norm for most artist during that time
>period.
>>Fact: It was a #1.
>>
>>>
>>>The Grammy award wins don't say much considering he was
>>>shunned by them during his artistic and commercial peak - a
>>>run of records that will forever be remembered and
>idiolized.
>>
>>>The Grammy's are no longer a legitimate artistic board -
>>it's
>>>a corporate party for corporate artists and executives.
>>
>>
>>A win is a win.
>>
>>
>>>While I'm happy to see that Prince continues to play
>arenas,
>>I
>>>saw him three times on the Welcome 2 Canada tour and all I
>>can
>>>say is that my wife and I both agreed that he looked like
>he
>>>was bored. It was neat to see him play the venue but the
>>>Lovesexy era or Gold era Prince would wipe the floor with
>>this
>>>guy.
>>
>>
>>Yet you know Prince was bored because he told you that?
>>
>>
>>
>>>Now, Prince in a tiny club (2500 people) in Montreal is
>>>another story!
>>
>>Again, far from "dried up."
>>
>>>
>>>But enough with the little stats - us fans going out and
>>>buying a record in its first week and getting a number one
>>is
>>>hardly a success. Had the sales continued over a longer
>>>amount of time as a result of having a legitimate song on
>>>radio that captured the people's attention, well then you'd
>>>have a leg to stand on but right now, this argument is
>weak.
>>
>>
>>Far from "dried up."
>>
>>Every other artist can live off a legacy, but the minute
>>Prince does it, he is "dried up"
>>lost his touch, etc, yet you same dried up posters will be
>in
>>chicago dressing like the lost member of The Time screaming
>>like a bitch when you hear the intro chords to Purple Rain,
>or
>>even tour as a prince cover band, yet Prince is dried up.
>>
>>Prince is doing what he wants to do, the same Prince you old
>>folks grew up on. He just doing things you don't like or
>>disagree with later in his life, but yet you old fuckers
>>complain complain, yet you are still drawn in by anything he
>>records.
>>
>>still buying the albums, still debating everything, still
>>showing up @ his shows, still wishing to be a member of his
>>band, still checking for his new stuff, and still wanting
>>
>>yet he is "dried up, or lost his touch"
>
>
>These are the things fans do - however, I'm getting the
>impression you don't know what it was like to discover She's
>Always In My Hair or to hear the screams of La la la He He Hee
>after finding them on the b-side of an album track.
>
>Prince was far more clever and sonically interesting back
>during his golden era which in my opinion lasted from 78 - 95.
> He was the baddest rockstar and songwriter for a very long
>time.
>
>However, I still look foward to new music from Prince. I also
>applaud his need to continue searching for new sounds. The
>guy is still so much bigger than today's artists. He just
>appears to lack the motivation to do something big.

Music is art - this isn't an athletic competition where he needs to be in tip top physical shape to write music people care about.

Joni Mitchell put out a record in 2007 called Shine - it was fantastic. Her age didn't keep her from recording a great record. In fact, she was singing about the world in a way most socially liberal adults could comprehend. That same year Prince was singing about working about a black sweat.

I don't think Prince's age has much to do with his inability to record an album's worth of music that people can get with. He appears to need someone to say, "Hey man, you're great and all that but Compassion and Beginning Endlessly kinda suck. Why don't you come back later and we'll try it all again?"

>I still like his music - some of it but the fact is, Prince
>is living off of his legacy these days.
>
>While I certainly look forward to new music from him, I don't
>think he'll be releasing anything that makes me yearn to hear
>it.
>
>His last hit was in 1993... things dried up for the guy very
>soon after the name change.

Seems like YOURE the one living off his legacy.Pining like it's 1989.

He regained the Lovesexy drop off with G Bridge....the Come/Chaos drop off with The Gold Experience..the NPS drop off with The Rainbow Children.....

>


********************************************************************************
Why does Matthew Perry continue to get television projects?

the bob george voice throughout is annoying as fuck
the lyrics are clunky as hell.
the grooves never click, despite the so-called 'musicianship'.

basically, the shit just sucks.

>the bob george voice throughout is annoying as fuck
>the lyrics are clunky as hell.

I'll give you these complaints....

>the grooves never click, despite the so-called
>'musicianship'.

Cmon nah...
She Love Me 4 Me
Everywhere
The Sensual Everafter
Last December
The Everlasting Now

you tellin me the music on those tracks is bunk????




*******
allwedoiswindimoto.tumblr.com
www.windimoto.com

AND HISTORY HAS PROVEN ME RIGHT.

no consistency and very few jewels in that trifecta of album releases. That's pretty much when he lost my ear.

Just about everything before that, I was cool with.
______________________________________________________________________________

"There's a fine line between persistence and foolishness..."
-unknown

"To Each His Reach"
-George Clinton

I tackle listening thru Prince's entire discography

Im more than half way thru now and some thoughts on a couple of his 90's albums:

I think The Truth is overrated on here anyway. Its good but really only love 3 songs, title track, Dont Play Me and Fascination. The rest kind of bores me and don't really understand how anyone likes Animal Kingdom, that makes me just smh but maybe its cuz Im a meat eating mothafucka. lol

The Vault: Old Friends for Sale is quite good for a supposed throwaway contract obligation album, I forgot about this one kind of and might like it better than Chaos and Disorder and Come, not sure if thats saying much.

Rave is probably my least favorite Prince album, even worse than New Power Soul, say it ain't so, I say so. lol At least NPS has Come On and Wasted Kisses.

Well, maybe not as underrated as the Rainbow Children, The Chocolate Invasion, Slaughterhouse, N.E.W.S., but those weren't major releases.

Mad jewels & knowledge being kicked in here.

>Well, maybe not as underrated as the Rainbow Children, The
>Chocolate Invasion, Slaughterhouse, N.E.W.S., but those
>weren't major releases.

**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

Me and the old lady have this conversation everytime we pull out the Prince albums. She jumped off the boat at Graffiti Bridge, I stayed until "The Gold Experience".

I hate "Graffiti Bridge" and "Diamonds and Pearls" with a passion uncontested (lol), but the good parts outweigh the bad ones to me. Gold Experience has (for me), "Dolphin", "Billy Jack"...hmm..."Shhh" (even though it's hard for me to hear him sing "do you after school like some homework" and not roll my eyes HARD), oh yeah..."I Hate You" was cool.





*************************************

Fuck aliens

-Warriorpoet415




http://soundcloud.com/rayandersonjr

now that he has passed and want to show nothing but appreciation, but these were still good convos.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

Prince is God, I totally get that, but that don't make "Chaos and Disorder" a good album, ya know?



*respectfully



*************************************

Fuck aliens

-Warriorpoet415




http://soundcloud.com/rayandersonjr

and thats not how you spell ihop

well played...

�
have you listened to
her stuff?
v
https://www.facebook.com/officialmeshell?fref=ts
http://www.meshell.com/site/
http://www.freemyheart.com


RIP David Williams:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Williams_(guitarist)

for me the FIRST time i noticed that 'somethin's up' would be Lovesexy. And for me, the 'side-eye' or 'side-ear' may have been more on the Production side of things. i remember back then when it came out i often found myself saying things like..."you know, UNDERNEATH some of that heavy and sometimes cheesy production, there's actually what COULD be a great jam."

to be clear, there are songs on Lovesexy that i LOVE and are genuine worthy classic Prince cuts, but on the whole, if you're asking where i started noticing a crack in the overall purple quality control, that album was the first sign of it for me....



�
have you listened to
her stuff?
v
https://www.facebook.com/officialmeshell?fref=ts
http://www.meshell.com/site/
http://www.freemyheart.com


RIP David Williams:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Williams_(guitarist)

It sounded waaay too...iono...clean, too slick, nah mean?

I knew the rawness was gone...then a couple years later we got Diamonds and Pearls...smh




*************************************

Fuck aliens

-Warriorpoet415




http://soundcloud.com/rayandersonjr

I forced myself to listen to it more than I wanted to... Money Don't Matter is the jam.

Also think rap fucked Prince up. He wasn't ready and tried to tight rope instead of staying in his lane.

after that he was sporadic. RU2TJF and Emancipation had some jams, but C&D was when I really, really felt him just getting 'eh'
______________________________________________________________________________

"To Each His Reach"

but.....

Fuck aliens.