>>my argument is making samplin' more cost effective
>>for the samplers
>>by treating the sample as a "session musician"
>>if possible
>
>originality because your attempt to treat a finished work with
>a copyright as a session musicians playing something won't
>work because the record you're sampling is an original
>finished work witha copyright...not an individual playing
>someting specificlly for the work related to the "session.
>
>
>>i'm not saying the record is produced, or the maker is a
>>producer
>>or any of the old splittin' hair arguments
>>i'm proposin' a new way to look at the copyright law
>>so that samplin' can thrive
>
>we are all very clear what you're saying. The response to what
>you are saying is that the fact that you want sampling to
>thrive in this manner is a sign of something very detrimental
>to music. People lack the originality, and ability to make
>those original records so they want to simply utilize the work
>of people who did have the ability and cretitivity and
>compensate them in a way that classifies the sample based
>product as being more original than it is.
>
>That mentality manifests a regression in music as an art form,
>and displays a lack of creativity and ability. You or anyone
>else who feels that to be unfair are entitled to their
>opinion...and I understand why they would want to avoid this
>subject or having to defend their point of view...I totally
>get that. But if your views cant stand up to contrary points
>of view...you may need to rethink them.
>
>
>>and not fall under the heavy costs
>>attributed it do the antiquated copyright laws
>>and whatnot
>
>The records are dope...they are often classic, groundbreaking
>records made by artists of great ability..
>
>do something original to stand up to that and stop trying to
>leach off of what other made...
>
>study how they did it...and do it your way....

All of this is simply your idea of what counts as creative, your own thinking as to what counts as creative or original.

Nobody is avoiding the subject, you're just choosing to ignore counter-arguments and examples (Joe all up and down this thread) and going through the standard "sampling is theft" talking points. I'm not sure why "regression in music as an art form" or "detrimental to music" gets to be a fact, but everyone else who feels differently is only entitled to their opinion (i.e. - ya'll are free to be wrong, peace).

Using words like "leach", referring constantly to Puffy and looping previously popular hits as THE example of what sampling is.....it's dishonest and stubborn, imo. There are countless examples of samples being layered, edited, chopped, of being molded into something else during the mixing process, to where it's something entirely different from the source material in feel, tone, and in the emotion it may provoke.

But you and others go the cheap route and right it off as "simply utilizing" someone's else's work for........I don't know, actually. Since sampling nowadays is largely relegated to the underground and is wildly cost prohibitive, it seems to me (my bias here) that the majority of those who create music this way do it because they enjoy the challenge and reward of reshaping previously existing material into something else. THAT'S part of the fun for them, that triggers the reward center in their brains.

You say they should play an instrument to make music but what if what gets them going creatively doesn't come from that?

To you, someone who "Wants To Make Music" should then play an instrument for maximum legitimacy. And that any efforts to change current copyright law to make sampling less litigious leads to the downfall of music. I don't buy that at all. Some people DO derive great joy from playing a trumpet or piano. That gets THEM going and is fun. And that's awesome! I don't see why someone who makes music that doesn't follow that dogmatic approach is a leach, unoriginal, and lazy?
__
I don't like the beat anymore because its just a loop. ALC didn't FLIP IT ENOUGH!

Flip it enough? Flip these. Flip off. Go flip some f*cking burgers.(c)Kno

Allied State of the National Electric Beat Treaty Organization (NEBTO)