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Forum nameThe Lesson
Topic subjecti've reached the point of feeling guilty for illegally downloading
Topic URLhttp://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=5&topic_id=2662871
2662871, i've reached the point of feeling guilty for illegally downloading
Posted by philpot, Thu Feb-16-12 08:37 AM
took me a while, but im realizing im not entitled to this music if the artist didnt make it free

this is a good development, and posters un the lesson have helped this realization
2662873, i reached that phase a year or so ago
Posted by GumDrops, Thu Feb-16-12 08:41 AM
plus my ipod broke and i havent bothered to get it fixed, which has something to do with it (i think ive missed out on quite a lot of stuff)
2662879, well that makes one of us.
Posted by Tiger Woods, Thu Feb-16-12 09:00 AM
2662881, right. only 2343043432423 to go!
Posted by GumDrops, Thu Feb-16-12 09:04 AM
2662880, how did this happen?
Posted by AFKAP_of_Darkness, Thu Feb-16-12 09:00 AM
2662971, maybe just maturation...
Posted by philpot, Thu Feb-16-12 12:39 PM
idk for sure

but points that you, discodj and others have made on here (that at the time i vehemently disagreed with as i was in denial re: my attitude of entitlement) have stuck with me
2662882, did anyone use rnbxclusive.com
Posted by rjc27, Thu Feb-16-12 09:07 AM
shit got shut down yesterday... huge story all over the internet... i went there on the regular
2662913, i hate downloading music from illegal sources.
Posted by Joe Corn Mo, Thu Feb-16-12 10:34 AM
it's not a moral thing, either.
although i don't neccessarily feel great about stealing.

i just miss the aspect of browsing.

like... i can browse iTunes.
and i get pretty cover art and liner notes.

blog searches are ugly.
googles searches are ugly.

iTunes is pretty,
and it reminds me of buying 45s from the record store.

all the files are downloaded and properly tagged.
it just makes the music library look nice on my computer.

it's just nice to have everythign look pretty on my computer.
and the iTunes store is decent simulation
of looking around in a record shop.
2662932, last night i noticed my iTunes library tags or whatever have no space
Posted by SoWhat, Thu Feb-16-12 11:09 AM
to indicate record label. or at least i couldn't find it.

i wondered how the various labels have worked so closely w/Apple even though iTunes isn't in the business of promoting the record labels via those tags.

this thought wasn't presented coherently. lol
Posted by imcvspl, Thu Feb-16-12 11:35 AM
there is information for all of that stuff Label, producer, songwriter, musicians, etc. in the ID3 tagging system. All of that shit is there. You can get another program and put the information in there yourself. But iTunes won't show it so nobody does. fucking idiotic.
Big PEMFin H & z's
Mo'Nium - http://monium.tumblr.com/

"When the music stops he falls back into this abyss."
2662946, LOL
Posted by SoWhat, Thu Feb-16-12 11:41 AM
it struck me that i have no idea what label released many of the files in my iTunes library.
2662950, Yeah, MP3tag (the software) opened my eyes to a lot of that
Posted by Dr Claw, Thu Feb-16-12 11:49 AM
>But iTunes won't show it so nobody does. fucking idiotic.

2662957, lack of labels is one of the things that makes mp3's so eh to me.
Posted by Joe Corn Mo, Thu Feb-16-12 12:03 PM
i don't care what nobody says...
MJ don't sound the same
when you can't see the epic logo spinning on the record.

so i don't even bother w/ label tags for mp3s.
it's not the same anyway.

and most of the iTunes files for old shit
wouldn't even be right, anyway.

marvin gaye came out on tamla.
not motown, and certainly not universal...
which i'm sure is what the labels would make it say anyway.

fucking bullshit.

2663221, Grouping is where I put this
Posted by Nodima, Thu Feb-16-12 08:33 PM
What else would you put there?

"This is the streets, and I am the trap." © Jay Bilas

2663453, i don't.
Posted by SoWhat, Fri Feb-17-12 11:25 AM
i have way too many mp3s to be bothered w/that now. i just didn't notice until this week that iTunes doesn't have a space identifying the label that released the mp3s in my library.
2662953, Browsing iTunes makes you think of digging through 45s? Really?
Posted by third_i_vision, Thu Feb-16-12 11:51 AM
Cover art the size of a thumbnail?

To each his own, but wow. I've never seen someone compare buying MP3s online to actually going to a record store.
2662959, in a way, yeah.
Posted by Joe Corn Mo, Thu Feb-16-12 12:08 PM
of course it's not perfect,
but when is the last time i was able to buy singles? lol

i just like the layout of the iTunes store.

it ain't perfect,
but in this digital age... it's about all you could ask for.

2662966, Fam, nothing against you personally but...
Posted by stone_phalanges, Thu Feb-16-12 12:28 PM
I hate you. Like, on the real for supporting apple.

Amazon cloud or google music ALL DAY (gunshot sounds)
2663052, fuck apple.
Posted by Joe Corn Mo, Thu Feb-16-12 02:01 PM
but i love apple products.
they let me use computers w/o having to know anything about them.

i plug my iPod or iPhone my iPad into my mac book
and i can drag the purchases i made from iTunes
from one device to another, and it comes w/ all of the beautiful cover art and liner notes.

no hassle. no problem.
one click.

no real worries about viruses.

it's technology for folks
that don't dig technology. lol
2663160, i've actually bought more since they implimented iCloud
Posted by hardware, Thu Feb-16-12 04:59 PM
shit is impulsive now
2663283, CO. SIGN.
Posted by samgar, Fri Feb-17-12 01:39 AM

>all the files are downloaded and properly tagged.
>it just makes the music library look nice on my computer.

>it's just nice to have everythign look pretty on my computer.
>and the iTunes store is decent simulation
>of looking around in a record shop.




2662917, I'm surprised
Posted by dalecooper, Thu Feb-16-12 10:38 AM
I figured people had their feelings on this pretty well sorted out already, and it seemed like both sides of the argument were only getting more entrenched every day. But I'm glad to have someone else on my side.
2662927, good for you, guy!
Posted by SoWhat, Thu Feb-16-12 10:57 AM
2662935, How come the arguments defending it stopped working for you?
Posted by Ishwip, Thu Feb-16-12 11:21 AM

I don't like the beat anymore because its just a loop. ALC didn't FLIP IT ENOUGH!

Flip it enough? Flip these. Flip off. Go flip some f*cking burgers.(c)Kno

Allied State of the National Electric Beat Treaty Organization (NEBTO)
2662969, they just started feeling hollow and selfish...
Posted by philpot, Thu Feb-16-12 12:35 PM
and i started thinking, like i said above, that im just not entitled to steal someone's product they are selling bc i can and want to

cats are putting in time and work to make these tunes, if i like the music and they need to get paid off it who am i to just steal it? how can i enjoy "owning" this artist's work if i havent invested a few bucks in the artist themself and helped them out the same way they provide me joy and entertainment w/ their tunes?

ESPECIALLY since most of the artists i love are indie grinders who need fan support to keep from stopping and having to get a 9-5?

AND so much legit free shit anyway, seems petty to take the shit that they are askin $ dor too

2662939, The good news is there's a ridiculous amount of free heat
Posted by stylez dainty, Thu Feb-16-12 11:30 AM
2662972, yep, plus lots of stuff is so reasonably priced...
Posted by philpot, Thu Feb-16-12 12:43 PM
$8 on bandcamp for a whole album, $5 mp3 albums on amazon

dope beattapes and stuff like this for $5, "name your price" downloads, etc

between the free shit and cheap shit u can get a lot more dope music bang 4 ur buck than back in the days, and still fully support the music u listen to
2662942, At this point, I'm a nihilist
Posted by Amritsar, Thu Feb-16-12 11:36 AM
2662968, I never felt bad about it ever.
Posted by stone_phalanges, Thu Feb-16-12 12:32 PM
All the artists I have downloaded have come out on top in the end. I know it isn't the case with most people but I just happen to buy a ton of music so even when I download, if i like it I purchase either that same album, or their releases from then on. Otherwise I would have not listened to them at all. (speaking about non hip-hop, hip hop releases I just download to hear sooner then I buy them).
2662973, does it count as stealing if I check the music out at the library???
Posted by Crash85, Thu Feb-16-12 12:50 PM
Thats where the majority of my music comes from now...
2663048, i think you are violating a liscensing agreement somewhere.
Posted by Joe Corn Mo, Thu Feb-16-12 01:58 PM
i think.


probablly. lol
2663057, HaHa... I'm sure I am too...
Posted by Crash85, Thu Feb-16-12 02:16 PM
I turn libraries upside down...
2663061, only if you retain an unauthorized copy of it after you return it
Posted by lonesome_d, Thu Feb-16-12 02:22 PM
2663067, I retain songs in my iTunes...
Posted by Crash85, Thu Feb-16-12 02:37 PM
so... yes...
2663212, hahaha i'm sure that *feels* less dirty... but it still is
Posted by DonWonJusuton, Thu Feb-16-12 08:02 PM
don't worry.. no judgment from me... you're just keeping the files for historical purposes - it's from the library
2663041, tell me more about this *paying* for *music* concept...
Posted by Benedict the Moor, Thu Feb-16-12 01:49 PM
2663060, That's great. I'm the download then buy if i really like it type.
Posted by DolphinTeef, Thu Feb-16-12 02:19 PM
I feel really guilty if I DON'T buy it.

I have a friend who shamelessly downloads everything and gives me the side-eye when I told him I bought something. So, I do feel music will be "free" eventually because buyers are a dying breed. Another route must be made.
2663069, i only download OOP stuff so me no feel guilty
Posted by Nick Has a Problem...Seriously, Thu Feb-16-12 02:40 PM
i refuse to get ass raped at ebay or any similar site.
2663094, Spotify has changed a lot for me
Posted by spew120, Thu Feb-16-12 03:23 PM
especially when they linked with Last.Fm.
2663141, i feel guilty for taping Stretch & Bobbito all those years....
Posted by My_SP1200_Broken_Again, Thu Feb-16-12 04:32 PM
2663235, lol
Posted by mwasi kitoko, Thu Feb-16-12 09:30 PM
2663149, no.
Posted by smoothcriminal12, Thu Feb-16-12 04:39 PM
I call it a "loan".

I am getting their album indefinitely, and I will pay them back when I get the chance too. That way I don't feel so bad about it.
2663745, lol
Posted by judono, Fri Feb-17-12 11:00 PM
This dude said loan. Hahaaa
2663155, with over 300 original cds in my collection i feel authorized to
Posted by Hellyeah, Thu Feb-16-12 04:48 PM
download as much as i want...plus i'll never pay for mp3s (at least not at the current prices)
2663819, RE: with over 300 original cds in my collection i feel authorized to
Posted by stone_phalanges, Sat Feb-18-12 07:58 AM
Mp3s aren't such a bad value now. If you buy with amazon they will back up your music indefinitely AND you have online access to the music from any browser. And to that the fact that you don't need to rip CDs and that MP3s are already cheap than CDs and I think that's a pretty good value.
2663204, I reached that point about a year ago myself.
Posted by lakai336, Thu Feb-16-12 07:23 PM
Generation entitled is still lying to themselves and pretending they hurt major, sell-out, materialistic artists. They don't, even when it flips to a new system, trust me they'll get way more caked off the usual mainstream shit than any of your present favorite rappers (who by now have given up anyway and just give away shit for free, especially the newer rappers). If you think the internet is the great equalizer, you're in denial, small labels will go way before any majors and as soon as profitable alternative outlets spring up, you know who's buying them.

Anyways I don't know if your intensely loyal to apple and iTunes, I'm not, thus I use Rhapsody. Rhapsody and Zune subscription services are ridiculously underrated. Basically, I get the best of both worlds and can access everything I used to as an illegal downloader. The only thing I download anymore is unreleased shit/bootlegs, which I don't consider illegal considering it's obviously unreleased and was never put for sale.

With Rhapsody, for only about 15 bucks a month (if you do the math that's less than 5 dollars a week), I can add any album I want to my music library. I can also transfer any of these albums to my Sansa mp3 player and thus take my music anywhere I go. What I like a lot, eventually gets bought on CD and ripped to .Flac. What I don't feel is worth buying (like a couple of tracks but nothing essential) I keep in the music library.

The only downside to all of this is that you can only do it with specific mp3 players. Zune is obviously for Microsoft mp3 players, Rhapsody rolls with the SanDisk Sansa line and a couple others. Ipods offer much more space than any Sansas, but in truth I don't miss the space. I'd rather pay 15 a month and take the time to switch out albums every once in awhile (as you get tired and want to hear something different anyway) then wait until I can afford a massive music library to put on my Ipod.

I'm yet to buy any digital music though. I still only purchase what I can find on CD. The rest stays on Rhapsody. I'd purchase MP3's if I could find somewhere to buy them in lossless format, though the more good albums that are released digitally, the closer I am to saying fuck it and buying the mp3 versions.

So basically, I have equal access to the music I like as I did during my illegal days and the artists get some compensation too.
2663214, ok, i don't even know why i'm about to say this, cuz i know ppl aren't
Posted by DonWonJusuton, Thu Feb-16-12 08:14 PM
gonna be happy... buuuut...

would y'all consider it fair to trade your social media "likes" and "follows" and "retweets" and website "hits" and youtube "views," etc. for feeling ok about illegally downloading?

i know that sounds bad at first, but considering the fact that a lot of the money that artists receive (if not most of the money) comes from other ventures outside of albums sales.. marketing clout is measured in vastly different ways now and 4M twitter followers probably means more to most advertising agencies than a platinum record... that drives up asking prices for appearances, commercials, record deals, performance fees, etc. etc.... we give tokens of our fandom away for free and artists can and DO use that to make money... w/o giving us anything other than the chance to see them selling another (unrelated) product to us... now, that doesn't work for all artists... but all of that stuff could be just as helpful to struggling artists who need more exposure - maybe to get signed, maybe to book a gig across the country or overseas... and there was a time when marketing yourself used to cost money... our appreciation and tangible support actually makes money.. it's actually *heavily* involved in commerce...

i'm not even agreeing or disagreeing w/ what i just said - i don't even know if i've made up my mind on that... but it was just something i was thinking about and wanted to throw out for discussion..
2663724, this is an underratted reply
Posted by Perception, Fri Feb-17-12 09:55 PM
Everything you said, plus more, will be part of the future.

You should still find a way to support the stuff you like monetarily though...
2663217, RE: i've reached the point of feeling guilty for illegally downloading
Posted by Getyohandouttamypocket, Thu Feb-16-12 08:21 PM
I will say this.

Since the plantation owners had 400-500 years of complimentary free labor from my ancestors.

Not mention, Jim Crow, unreported lynchings, current negative assumptions of black folk, etc...

This is a small level of get back...
2663281, are you fuckin serious?
Posted by shygurl, Fri Feb-17-12 01:34 AM
2663524, right? these dudes is killing me here
Posted by Errol Walton Barrow, Fri Feb-17-12 01:20 PM
people using slavery to justify pirating now? fuh real?
2663593, I can honestly say I haven't seen that argument yet lol
Posted by Ishwip, Fri Feb-17-12 03:36 PM
>people using slavery to justify pirating now? fuh real?

I don't like the beat anymore because its just a loop. ALC didn't FLIP IT ENOUGH!

Flip it enough? Flip these. Flip off. Go flip some f*cking burgers.(c)Kno

Allied State of the National Electric Beat Treaty Organization (NEBTO)
2663621, Hopefully you're trolling.
Posted by lakai336, Fri Feb-17-12 04:19 PM
Otherwise, this is just ridiculous to begin with. As previously stated, you ain't strictly hurting "the man", your actually much more directly and much more effectively hurting your favorite independent rappers (many of whom happen to be Black, making this whole argument that much more out of it's mind).

So really you're helping ensure said rapper doesn't get the chance to speak his or her mind and instead goes 9-5ing it for the system.

2663227, yeah
Posted by forgivenphoenix, Thu Feb-16-12 09:00 PM
i used to illegally download (i'm kinda surprised no one's came up with a catchier name that 'download', but anyway) but i kinda reached the same conclusion.

plus i find that when i just download the album, i get entitled and don't really try to enjoy the music for what it is. when i buy an album, i'm more committed to try and like it or appreciate some aspect to it.
2663412, there's always the very catchy 'pirate'
Posted by lonesome_d, Fri Feb-17-12 10:24 AM
>i used to illegally download (i'm kinda surprised no one's
>came up with a catchier name that 'download', but anyway)
2663233, Guilt is a useless emotion imo but
Posted by SP1200, Thu Feb-16-12 09:22 PM
do what u feel is right for you definitely. Support will always > downloading. Downloading isn't illegal btw (as in from sites like megaupload, not yet) unless u get it from P2P applications. But morally, it's an issue for some.
2663236, meh.
Posted by mwasi kitoko, Thu Feb-16-12 09:32 PM
2663239, I mainly download free music, OOP, and hard to find.
Posted by The Wordsmith, Thu Feb-16-12 09:46 PM
Occasionally I'll download something new but I typically buy the stuff that I like. For instance, I downloaded Janell Monet's Archandroid, liked it, and ended up buying a physical copy. If it's wack with exception to a couple of songs, I don't buy.
2663280, Only time I don't feel guilty is when
Posted by cbk, Fri Feb-17-12 01:22 AM
it's some rare ass bootleg that's not commercially available.

Other than that I'm buying the shit. The CD or LP. Fuck mp3s.
2663293, i dont feel bad if i get stones throw
Posted by AlBundy, Fri Feb-17-12 01:56 AM
them niggas fight back too vigorously

“The other dude after me didn’t help my case. It was just like…crazy nigga factory going on.”
Dre makes no apologies for his own eccentricities. “I was young, and searching, trying to find myself,” he says. “Never did.”-- Andre B
2663615, Those guys must hire blog assassins
Posted by spew120, Fri Feb-17-12 04:06 PM
2663393, My spotify account absolves me of all my sin.
Posted by Buddy_Gilapagos, Fri Feb-17-12 09:34 AM
I am paying monthly for music so I don't worry much about where I get it (spotify or not. But I am able to get it mostly through spotify).

Peace to the Gods.
2663438, I hope I never reach this point
Posted by CMcMurtry, Fri Feb-17-12 11:08 AM
2663448, Why?
Posted by Ishwip, Fri Feb-17-12 11:18 AM

I don't like the beat anymore because its just a loop. ALC didn't FLIP IT ENOUGH!

Flip it enough? Flip these. Flip off. Go flip some f*cking burgers.(c)Kno

Allied State of the National Electric Beat Treaty Organization (NEBTO)
2663451, I enjoy listening to shit without guilt
Posted by CMcMurtry, Fri Feb-17-12 11:22 AM
2663449, When these artist reach the point of feeling guilty for putting out crap
Posted by OldPro, Fri Feb-17-12 11:18 AM
I'll follow suit
Reunion Radio Podcasts
Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

2663590, Since Spotify, I barely download anything anymore
Posted by buhnanas, Fri Feb-17-12 03:35 PM
It's kind of made me slow down and digest albums better. I realize that I have so much stuff I downloaded just to download that I have probably listened to 1% of it all. I download a lot of stuff thinking I am going to have a need for it one day and it just sits on my hard drive
2663625, This describes the entirety of the illegal downloading
Posted by lakai336, Fri Feb-17-12 04:24 PM
set. Props to you for admitting it. They'll say they listen to all of it, but their definition of listen pales in comparison to pre-internet listeners. Their listens means maybe a front to back one time, a couple of songs about 10-15 times for the next two weeks, then on to the next one.

That was a huge influence in choosing to stop for me. I got tired of dealing with disposable music and having an ever diminishing attention span coupled with an ever increasing desire for new music. My standards are higher now, if I can't listen to it on and off for 3-5 months, don't even bother with it.
2663654, I stopped downloading a long time ago.
Posted by BarTek, Fri Feb-17-12 05:15 PM
2663721, Did anyone ever feel guilty about buyin used CDs?
Posted by Abstract_TheEclectic_Nubian, Fri Feb-17-12 09:42 PM
because that's not going to the artist either. I swear music heads is pussified nowadays.
2663744, Here's how i REALLY feel about it
Posted by Abstract_TheEclectic_Nubian, Fri Feb-17-12 10:58 PM
I've been buying tapes and CDs for almost 20 yrs. So that means I have supported literally THOUSANDS of artist with my own money. If I were to add up all the money I have spent on CDs, Tapes, concerts DVDs, not to mention the frequent Itunes downloads, I'm sure It would be enough to put my ass in a decent little house. Matter of fact, I'm quite sure I've helped pay off some of these niggas mortgages and I ain't even got a house myself! Now do I regret supporting those artists? Absolutely not! IMO there is no better way to throw money away than to support your favorite artist. Am I gonna feel sorry for downloading your shit though? Nope! I been supporting yall niggas and will continue to do so...if it is convineint, meaning if your shit is accesible and if I have the money to pay for it. There are no record shops were I live anymore...only BEST BUY and artist I like or could be remotely interested in seldomn come to my neck of the woods. AND I ain't runnin' up my damn credit card bill for a cd that I have to wait for 2 weeks, when I can get it for free in 2 min. I dare any motherfucker to tell me I ain't do my part!