Did y’all already talk about this?

If not, I’ma just leave this here:

Billboard: What did you think of Bruno that night at the Grammys?

Me’Shell: What he’s doing is karaoke, basically. With “Finesse,” in particular, I think he was simply copying Bell Biv DeVoe. I think he was copying Babyface. And definitely there were some elements of Jimmy Jam & Terry Lewis back when they worked with Human League. I feel like there’s just all these threads running through there but not in a genuine way.
From Billboard: Meshell Ndegeocello Talks Revisiting R&B Gems for Covers Album & Why Bruno Mars Is 'Karaoke' https://www.billboard.com/articles/news/8232751/meshell-ndegeocello-ventriloquism

Here’s a fun take from The Root:
https://www.theroot.com/meshell-ndegeocello-is-right-about-bruno-mars-being-kar-1823615904

I love Me’Shell but I don’t agree with the implication that Bruno is not sincere. Obviously, he is taking A LOT from the people she mentioned. It pains me that Mint Condition, who were not mentioned in the article but still came to mind, haven’t received their props but is that Bruno’s fault?

I’m not a Bruno stan, by the way. Still haven’t listened to his albums.

Side note: I’d love to get Questlove’s take on this. What has he said about Bruno in the past? Did he weigh in on the Thicke and Gaye situation?

Covering songs, especially in a non-predictable manner, is not comparable to creating new songs that aren’t nuanced in how they reveal musical influences

>Covering songs, especially in a non-predictable manner, is
>not comparable to creating new songs that aren’t nuanced in
>how they reveal musical influences

>>Covering songs, especially in a non-predictable manner, is
>>not comparable to creating new songs that aren’t nuanced
>in
>>how they reveal musical influences
>

Dah well. I only heard her cover of "Waterfalls," which is the TLC song I dislike the most. It was overplayed when it debuted and I haven't recovered.

When I watched the video of Me'Shell's cover on YouTube, I immediately thought that it was a non-predictable cover in the sense that she was not trying to mimic the production of Organized Noize. It's a completely different vibe.

I wasn't in love with it but the production clearly deviates from the original...

The same old coffee bar routine that every person with a youtube channel does. Two ingredients required.

1. Acoustic Guitar
2. Slow down the tempo

Examples:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pjRzCjbROPM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEo4wyiRZzQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKYeWm_j71I
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5NHQUTewquQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J0NybPDEQxg

Need more?

>The same old coffee bar routine that every person with a
>youtube channel does. Two ingredients required.
>
>1. Acoustic Guitar
>2. Slow down the tempo
>
>Examples:
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pjRzCjbROPM
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEo4wyiRZzQ
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKYeWm_j71I
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5NHQUTewquQ
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J0NybPDEQxg
>
>Need more?

I don’t watch or listen to covers of “Waterfalls” so I wouldn’t know how her cover compares to others. Also, I don’t listen to much acoustic coffee house type of music*.
Finally, my comment was speaking to the genre from which her cover derives. Her version, like I said, does not borrow from the 1990s R&B/pop sound Organized Noize used for “Waterfalls.”

*Hmmmm. Maybe this is why I disliked Lauryn Hill’s MTV Unplugged joint

Oops. I just realized I may have misinterpreted your comment.

If you’re pointing to the fact that she’s trying to gain publicity: yep, your point is well taken.

If not, and you were noting irony: see my original response.

These covers are really interesting and executed really well...but at the end of the day, IMO, writing your own music (no matter how derivative) is still more artistic than just doing covers (unless your Nina Simone).

i agree with Meshell but I don't think its a lack of sincerity or talent. Bruno is kind of like the r&b version of Lenny Kravitz.

I remember one critic saying that Lenny seemed to be someone who was overwhelmed by his influences.

All artists borrow and steal but when a song comes on and you first think of the artist they are stealing from its ventures into karaoke land.

and for the record I can appreciate Lenny and Bruno for what they are but no one is confusing them for the real deal.

https://i.imgur.com/MfCgb1F.jpg

Well done.

That's what folks don't understand. There may be black artists out there making new jack swing, but how many writing songs as catchy as Finesse ?

Same thing with any winehouse. People like Rehab because it was a good ass song, not just because it was some fake Motown shit.

At the end of the day, you got SONGS or you don't and if you don't being white won't save you (see: Iggy azalea)

So he ain’t Stevie or Prince.

That’s ok.

He took out his drum machine/keyboard and it said Bank 470:New Jack Swing and he didn't change a damn thing.

I mean I'm not an asshole. I'll dance to him at a wedding. But I'd rather hear the real shit he's biting so hard.

that this site is just about fucking DEAD.



Anti-gentrification, cheap alcohol & trying to look pretty in our twilight posting years (c) Big Reg
http://Tupreme.com

The fact people are regurgitating this crap means they are washed. Me'Shell barely has or ever had a listenable project lol one of the most over hyped shit ever talked on this board just cause she was an OK Artist.


----------

IG @h_n_z

Anti-gentrification, cheap alcohol & trying to look pretty in our twilight posting years (c) Big Reg
http://Tupreme.com

She barely had a listenable project?!

One of the worst of ?uest’s suggestions lol


----------

IG @h_n_z

Oh look the dude who desperately needs a psychitrist.

Good music is good music. I don't care who or what culture it's from please stop trying to bait me or my opinion into a race issue I'm not the one.

The only stupid shit about race being said is anyone's expectation of what type of music an artist SHOULD make based on the race or culture they are. Grow the fuck up.

----------

IG @h_n_z

>Oh look the dude who desperately needs a psychitrist.
>
>Good music is good music. I don't care who or what culture
>it's from please stop trying to bait me or my opinion into a
>race issue I'm not the one.

most people who appreciate all genres of black music wouldnt say "Me'Shell barely has or ever had a listenable project"



>The only stupid shit about race being said is anyone's
>expectation of what type of music an artist SHOULD make based
>on the race or culture they are. Grow the fuck up.
>
>----------
>
>IG @h_n_z

What because I think her overall fucking albums kinda suck that means I don't like black music?!? Bwahahaha

Other than her love and basketball joint I never liked her music. So that means I automatically don't appreciate black music? LMAO what are you a crazy ass Lefty or Righty? If I dont like one thing I'm against all of your beliefs? Get your Mean Girls mentality ass away from me fucking loser. Aren't you a music journalist? No wonder you are so sensitive about your opinions on music. What a loser.




----------

IG @h_n_z

>What because I think her overall fucking albums kinda suck
>that means I don't like black music?!? Bwahahaha
>
>Other than her love and basketball joint I never liked her
>music. So that means I automatically don't appreciate black
>music? LMAO what are you a crazy ass Lefty or Righty? If I
>dont like one thing I'm against all of your beliefs? Get your
>Mean Girls mentality ass away from me fucking loser. Aren't
>you a music journalist? No wonder you are so sensitive about
>your opinions on music. What a loser.

*shrugs*

I'll just be over here unappreciating black music via some Bruno Mars songs in your honour. Bwahahaha. You are a special, special, special kind of loser. I DO appreciate THAT.




----------

IG @h_n_z

you dissed an artist who gets a lot of respect from music lovers, I asked how much you were into black music outside of rap

then it got really weird on your end. keep at it though

Cool. Love this logic.

Another typical move by you LOL Your weird victim issues explain a lot. A. Lot.



----------

IG @h_n_z

I never said or implied anything about you and enjoying Bruno Mars' music

you just brought him back up above between name calling, cursing, and taking personal shots that dont bother me in the least

none of this exchange paints you in a good light, but dont let me stop you while you're ahead

Pretending your follow up questions are just random general questions. Nobody beleives you when you do that. I dont get how you dont see that. Either you are admitting your general questions dont mean anything about the convo or that you are insinuating a new point in your argument LOL you cant have it both ways just because you get called out on it. And we all know what you are doing becasue you do it in every post. Name calling and cursing LOL again playing victim again. Grow a set.
----------

IG @h_n_z

people who appreciate black music are generally into this artist that you arent into

you seem pretty offended by my line of questioning

If you liked that song you would enjoy her album, Bitter, that the song is from. Are you familiar with her music?

Like 1 song like the whole album. Usually how it works lol



----------

IG @h_n_z

She got some really good songs.

First album was fiyah but Bitter, whew...

and live? She is a beast.

She wrong as fuck tho when it comes to Bruno.

human jukebox ass mf'er but he won't own it. he cuts the checks and calls it original. it's not. even if she is totally washed (which she isn't), that doesn't mean he isn't slickly packaged, glorified karaoke

it was floundering and then it got swallowed whole by hip hop. most r n b today is either "adult contemporary" type shit, obscure, or both.

i am not saying dude is unlistenable but he is background music for a shitty TV presentation or the cereal aisle at the supermarket, just like most pop music today

tired of once very good acts turning into bitter ole windbags and she ain't had a hit since Blues Clues was bumping.

she been on the down slide since the 00's. Bruno is a better songwriter than her and he can play and if she was half as hip as she pretends to be then she would know he started out as a elvis Presley Impersonator.


she needs to do stop doing cornball tyler Perry covers of 'Tender Love".

she still bitter that Brian Mcknight took her song
and made it a hit and legit.

drops the mic. and for the record and I do respect her talent,however she takes a "L" on this

she can play bass and she plays that better than he does guitar and Piano on a whole to me. however she got nothing else over him
and she knows it.

she just madd because while she has had songs that i dug and those first two albums that i liked, she is for the most part a never was.


Bruno got jewelry and stats and also got respect from respected artists from various eras.

>Bruno got jewelry and stats and also got respect from
>respected artists from various eras.

turkey you can't get fingerhut half off to co sign you

This dude said a Finger Hut half off! SMH

.
.

"I cannot see how nature could have created itself. Only a supernatural force that is outside of space and time could have done that. ~ Francis Collins

.
.

"I cannot see how nature could have created itself. Only a supernatural force that is outside of space and time could have done that. ~ Francis Collins

You're not being a nice person
.
.

"I cannot see how nature could have created itself. Only a supernatural force that is outside of space and time could have done that. ~ Francis Collins

Bruno done did 2 Super Bowls, she be lucky to pack a backyard Pot Luck Bowl Party

Eh, in D.C., New York, LA, ATL, etc. I bet she could.

A few years ago, she had a show with the now-defunct duo, Chargaux, in D.C. I think that was sold out.

As an aside, she doesn't strike me as the type of artist that would want to perform at the Superbowl. Like, the fuck would she perform?

That's more of a pop stage, and she's not a pop artist...

she was signed to Madonna's Maverick records a major label for a decade

and she had a hit with john Cougar mellencamp which would have worked on a Episode of "Friends"

she wanted it, and she is doing that drunk whiskey cover album she got out now.

she can play and I liked her first few records however she wanted to hit
and she failed and badly. she would rock a S Curl if Bruno Mars get on this stage with me in a New York Minute.

why is she so pressed over him?

nobody in the real world knows 5 of her songs. she is like that drunk aunt who can play and yet got stories from 1998 and can't tell you a story past 2001. anybody can pack them places she played at.

she taken a Major "L" on this one

>nobody in the real world knows 5 of her songs. she is like
>that drunk aunt who can play and yet got stories from 1998 and
>can't tell you a story past 2001. anybody can pack them places
>she played at.
>


ROTLF


.
.

"I cannot see how nature could have created itself. Only a supernatural force that is outside of space and time could have done that. ~ Francis Collins

defend dude on his own merit. he is a great entertainer but he is also a swag jacker. he does to dozens of artists what you've claimed prince did to rick james and well beyond.

and Meshall Nedecello can't talk because her new album is all covers.

bruno never pretended to be all original.then again how many are?

>he does to dozens of artists what
>you've claimed prince did to rick james and well beyond.

>he does to dozens of artists what
>you've claimed prince did to rick james and well beyond.

>he does to dozens of artists what
>you've claimed prince did to rick james and well beyond.

prince was a opening act for Rick James and aside from i wanna be your lover he didn't have any other half coin piece hits. Bruno was a songwriter who hit off the gate before his solo career took off.

Prince on his first couple of albums aside from his image was like a Broke MJ, Steve, Brothers Johnson, Sylvers,ray parker jr,Smokey Robinson,etc.. basically a dime a dozen act with a Broke Nod to Sly stone and Shuggie Ottis. truth is "Dirty Mind" forever changed Prince's career and even that didn't connect all the way as what Controversy and 1999 did. remember it took Prince longer to get his voice, music and sound all done. Bruno is held to a different standard however he didn't come into the business as the Next MJ, Stevie or Jim Hendrix, Sly as Prince. big difference and Prince was jocking a whole bunch of folks.

nothing to be ethered there about.

All you're doing is talking about how their eras differ. Major labels could afford for artists to release a grip of moderately successful albums and keep those artists around before the download era. Now we have all these cookie cutter, copycat artists, because those labels need hits out the gate and don't wanna take chances. Essentially, you're just describing WHY Bruno is doing karaoke. You say it took longer for Prince to "get his voice, music and sound all done" but how do you know when Bruno hasn't gotten his own done yet and just copies others like the Jay Pharoah of music? Like I said elsewhere in the post, holla at me when he finds his own sound. I look forward to him being great.

as a songwriter because he wrote hit songs and was turned away big time.
Prince was average at first and he wasn't the songwriter that he would become. Bruno was a better writer at first on others.

then his thing hit. vocally Bruno got his thing,musically he is still searching. however he ain't no karoke at all, because He can play and sing. you up here listening to a Act who ain't counted since the mid 90's a and is bitter and is now hawking a Cover Album on QVC without anybody wanting to buy it.

if Bruno covered "tender love" it would hit, Me'shall singing "Tender Love" and that mess might make a Cerio Killer come out of hiding and turn themselves in.

>
>if Bruno covered "tender love" it would hit, Me'shall singing
>"Tender Love" and that mess might make a Cerio Killer come out
>of hiding and turn themselves in.

i laughed.. not sure if the misspelling was intentional

I mean look at the Finesse video. He's purposely telling us that this is taken from another era and unoriginal. I know alotta people here loved it purely due to nostalgia, but that doesn't mean it was creative. I actually thought the whole thing was a cheap gimmick. We know he's a pop artist doing this for hits. Finesse wasn't the best song, but throw in some nostalgia for old folks and you have built-in support. I don't think all his music is garbage, but the old school feel + marketing is a very important part of getting a bigger audience for him. It's not like he's making older people like and respect newer styles of music like true geniuses have done in the past. I definitely don't think he's trash as a singer or writer, but the critique of his approach as a cheap gimmick is very valid at this point.

hit since 1992, arguably 1993. That's an era that is rarely ever sampled or covered, when you think about it. Even Uptown Funk wasn't a shocker because the early 80's Jheri Curl sound has been around all decade.

But NOBODY seems to acknowledge NJS as a whole...aside from 8-10 songs, you rarely hear NJS on the radio...when's the last time most folks heard Dreamin, Here we go, Honey dip, Don't wanna fall in love remix, etc. etc. on radio?

For Bruno to even love that era enough to make a song in the exact vein of it....like. The last time I can even remember a moderately big song sampling NJS was Nick Cannon taking "Poison," and that was 12 years ago. I don't count "Piece of my love" which is sampled a lot, because it's more of a slow jam/midtempo track. But yeah...to make a single with actual swinging drums is bold as hell, and he pulled it off. If it wasn't as well written and produced, it's no way a single person woulda cared about it. The execution was flawless overall.

Teddy Riley never gets his due.

New Jack Swing wasn't easy,however any sleepy time turkey can do neo soul and trap.

the only time you get a New Jack Reference is mainly off Bobby brown, Keith Sweat and MJ with remember the time.

New Jack Swing required movement and swing. when was the last time aside from R.Kelly that somebody until bruno came along that somebody had you moving in the modern era with a cut at the family Bar B Que?

>Teddy Riley never gets his due.
>
>New Jack Swing wasn't easy,however any sleepy time turkey can
>do neo soul and trap.
>
>the only time you get a New Jack Reference is mainly off Bobby
>brown, Keith Sweat and MJ with remember the time.
>
>New Jack Swing required movement and swing. when was the last
>time aside from R.Kelly that somebody until bruno came along
>that somebody had you moving in the modern era with a cut at
>the family Bar B Que?

yall are really weird on here

however he is versatile and talented enough to draw from various eras and connect to what is happening today. that is a gift in itself.

As for him making a radio NJS song, I don't see it as much of a risk in light of all the 90s worship going on currently (alotta sampling of 90s music, drake's love of Aaliyah, Big Sean's last video being a Martin parody, etc... granted this isn't all musical, but it's culturally relevant) AND the fact that the song features the biggest female rapper in the country right now. Not to diminish him having the "credit" so to speak, to take a minor chance, but he does have that due not only to his most recent songs being throwbacks, but also the machine behind him. I also don't see it as a huge risk to release music that you already know has a built-in audience. He's essentially filling a void, giving alotta people what they complain about missing in today's music... but he's doing it in the least creative way possible imo.

i mean if she could be straight doing the watered down Nikki Manji thing and have the Migos keep her supplied style then why she leaning toward Bruno?

she is all happy to be working with Bruno and lets remember finesse was long done before the Powers that be forced the duet.

the 90's is back in a visual and sample manner however nobody else is pushing that 90's envelope though.

drake makes that sleep time enya meets PM dawn music and it works, however he would have been lucky to be a gopher for digital Planets back in the 90's back then you still had to bring it to last.

Bruno is a songwriter, producer,performer and far from a holiday inn 2 or 3 in the morning lounge singer. he ain't no adam sandler rent a karooke moment for old times sake.

and lets be real how many truly original artists have you seen? at most somewhere between 20-30.most of them were way back in the day

If not, I don't know what your point is.

I never said Bruno isn't talented. I said he's doing some of the least creative music imaginable. This is why Me'Shell said he's doing karaoke. You're arguing everything else lol.

Pop music is more like the curation of a particular and recognizable style or calling card. He makes songs that evoke very particular feelings, and he is very good at evoking the ones in his lane. He wants to make people feel like they are dripping with finesse or whatever when they show up in the club or to party.

Most artist would kill to be able to evoke something that specific and immediately recognizable. Maxx is kinda right about the sleepy turkey thing.

You and maxxx are responding very emotionally to something that's not even arguable.

Point: He's derivative to the point of sounding like karaoke.

Yall's response: He's the top pop artist right now and great at what he does!!!!!

I get it, yall think he's great. I have nothing against that.
But that's not a counter argument to him being derivative.
It's also fine if you think there's nothing wrong with him being so derivative. I like some rather derivative artists myself, but it doesn't bother me when it's pointed out, so I'm having a hard time understanding why yall are responding the way you are.

whereas i own a few of Me'shell's albums. And she comes off bitter as hell and has been for a while. Like what's more gross to do as an artist--making derivative pop music well or acting holier than thou to some artist more successful than you (esp so you have some clickbait to promote your new record)?

It's like youre out here doing interviews because you have to promote your new album. The only reason we are really talking about her is not due to any song of her new cover album, though she tried it with the waterfalls cover...its because she is talking shit about someone else. I'm sure she's just being honest, but the end result is just as gross: she looks like one of those people that attacks others for attention plain and simple. It's been a pattern and it's really not a good look.

And at the end of the day, the artists that Bruno is doing a karaoke version are way more likely to get caked off of their work than any of the vending machine hostess snack cake money they would have got from Me'shell doing a cover of their work.

I've been a Meshell fan and followed her career and yes many times in her interviews and her music she can come off as being bitter, but i think this is just more her calling it as she sees it.

it is what it is,

i can appreciate both artists though, everyone doesn't have to have the same goals.

i mean this ain't like we came along to seeing Duke Ellington, Louis Armstrong, Miles Davis, John Coltrane, Jimi Hendrix, Sly Stone,Charlie Chaplin,Bessie Smith,Ella Fitzgerald,Nat King Cole, at the start of there careers.

over 80% of music acts are Derivitive. I mean take Ray Charles he was jacking nat King cole at the start of his career and look at what Ray Charles Morphed into? not comparing Bruno Mars to Ray Charles however in order to be great you do take.

>I mean take Ray Charles
>he was jacking nat King cole at the start of his career and
>look at what Ray Charles Morphed into? not comparing Bruno
>Mars to Ray Charles however in order to be great you do take.
>
>


Cool, well holla at me when Bruno finds his own voice.
I look forward to him being great.

as a singer he doesn't sound like his influences. musically you can throw shade however not on his voice IMO

holla at me when he finds it like you're saying Ray Charles and others did.

>musically you can throw shade however not on his voice IMO

This is what I mean. He doesn't have his own style. I know you're looking for a new angle, but you know what I'm saying.
Hence back to the original post and why he was accused of singing karaoke. His musical style (or "voice") is that of imitating other artists. I like some of his music and it's fun... but it's also derivative karaoke. I don't know why you're acting like both of those things can't be true simultaneously.

Yall's response is consistently that you like him.
That ain't even her point.
It's that he's doing karaoke/mimicry.
Love it all day. It's still the same thing.

that’s it, that’s all.

since when has he had to have a fellow hot act jump on his hit songs per se? and Cardi been sparked like a Pitcher of Kool aid was stirred and served to her with a Big Ole Kool aid smile.

the song was a hit regardless in truth the "In Living color" thing helped as much as anything. on the low J Lo was about to bench A Rod for Bruno for that kind of Hit, however he turned it down.

they are cool together more about style than substance. bruno is chasing the past greats and he ain't even gonna tell the real on her part.

>As for him making a radio NJS song, I don't see it as much of
>a risk in light of all the 90s worship going on currently
>(alotta sampling of 90s music, drake's love of Aaliyah, Big
>Sean's last video being a Martin parody, etc...

Yep. No risk AT ALL.

This is a bit of an aside, but I'm adding Teyana Taylor to your list of 90s worship examples. Her last EP, a 5-song project from 2015 titled, "1994 Cassette Tape," featured samples or excerpts of Boomerang; Tony! Toni Tone's "Anniversary" and BBD's "Poison." And, of course, she played an early 1990s rapper on VH1's (now-canceled)The Breaks.

Homegirl also just opened up a 1990s-themed nail salon in her old hood (Harlem): https://www.billboard.com/articles/columns/hip-hop/8100169/missy-elliott-lil-kim-teyana-taylor-nail-salon-opening-twitter
https://www.vogue.com/article/teyana-taylor-harlem-nail-salon-junie-bee-90s-acrylic-airbrushing-gel-kanye-west-fade-video

Low-key, I'm looking forward to the 90s nostalgia thing falling by the wayside.

Oh, and this is not a dig to Teyana, cuz I actually like her. I love her sultry alto and she's incredibly talented. She KILLED her homage to pre-plastic surgery Lil Kim at the 2016 VHI Hip Hop Honors.

>>As for him making a radio NJS song, I don't see it as much
>of
>>a risk in light of all the 90s worship going on currently
>>(alotta sampling of 90s music, drake's love of Aaliyah, Big
>>Sean's last video being a Martin parody, etc...
>
>Yep. No risk AT ALL.
>
>This is a bit of an aside, but I'm adding Teyana Taylor to
>your list of 90s worship examples. Her last EP, a 5-song
>project from 2015 titled, "1994 Cassette Tape," featured
>samples or excerpts of Boomerang; Tony! Toni Tone's
>"Anniversary" and BBD's "Poison." And, of course, she played
>an early 1990s rapper on VH1's (now-canceled)The Breaks.
>
>Homegirl also just opened up a 1990s-themed nail salon in her
>old hood (Harlem):
>https://www.billboard.com/articles/columns/hip-hop/8100169/missy-elliott-lil-kim-teyana-taylor-nail-salon-opening-twitter
>https://www.vogue.com/article/teyana-taylor-harlem-nail-salon-junie-bee-90s-acrylic-airbrushing-gel-kanye-west-fade-video
>
>Low-key, I'm looking forward to the 90s nostalgia thing
>falling by the wayside.
>
>Oh, and this is not a dig to Teyana, cuz I actually like her.
>I love her sultry alto and she's incredibly talented. She
>KILLED her homage to pre-plastic surgery Lil Kim at the 2016
>VHI Hip Hop Honors.



I feel you. I posted about her last album on here and upped the post hella times to the point that I asked why I kept upping it lol. I love the direction she's gone with her music.

i don't see how a sound being overlooked makes this any less contrived though, i mean we are talking about originality, right? then again i guess since the sample era, being original in one's unoriginality counts for points. i had the convo with my barber once, basically i argued that using a sample someone else used was totally acceptable since they were lifting someone else's work in the first place. so in a sense that moved the goalposts forward for originality, but ehhhhh, i dunno, it's still not something that i feel. overall there is also a real lack of emotion in his stuff. very timberlake-ish in that regard, just with a little more soul.

Like....every year, there's hits that are made to sound like they came from another era. That's certainly what "Happy" and even "Blurred lines" were, even though they had a modern polish. A lot of these young singers making songs in the vein of mid 90's R&B, same way a lot of 90's artists made songs to sound like the 70's. So what makes it wrong for him to do this with "Finesse?" It's not like there was only one NJS song ever created, and he stole the exact formula....there were hundreds of NJS songs at the time, and he just created another one, 25 years later...what's the harm?

"Finesse" bites? Closest to me is "Remember the time," but it's still it's own song.

"24K Magic" uses the "Cutie pie" drums, but it's it's own song.

"Uptown funk" sounds similar to 3-4 songs at once, but there's no one exact song that it sounds like.

"Versace on the floor" sounds like the son and nephew of "Shake you down" and "Caravan of love," for sure, but it's still a completely diff song overall.

"Chunky" flips the bassline from "Ain't no fun," but it's certainly it's own song.

"Callin all my lovelies" doesn't sound too much like any specific song.

"Perm" surely sounds like a watered James Brown song, but....the melody, hook, all else is just like "this sounds like a JB song," not "this sounds like 'I'm Black and I'm proud'" or any specific song.

"Straight up and down" samples the drums from "Baby I'm yours," and gives the credit to it, but it's not similar besides that.

the sounds, even the same melodies, tweaks them a little bit, and jumbles it all together. It is an extremely skillful job they do. But they bite. It's like they know to change it juuuuuuuuuuussstt enough....

"Or you might say, “But his **** don’t sound all that original, he just sounds like he’s trying to be Prince or some ****.” And I’d say, maybe you’re right. At times he does. We often study the breathing techniques of our inspirations (inspire means to breathe in or to make breath, inhale). And that’s also true for most of you, emcees. I mean, don’t ¾ of y’all niggas sound like NAS? The difference is that D’Angelo has allowed influence to simply take its place among his own intuitive artistry. He works to find his own voice within his many influences"

Can we say the same of Bruno Mars? That he has allowed influence to simply take its place among his own intuitive artistry? That he works to find his own voice within his many influences?

Fuck. No.

Karaoke.

I mean that quote came from Saul Williams, and he makes some of the most unique-sounding music ever heard, yet he's talking about studying his idols. I know maxxx gonna come talking about "but he ain't got no grammys and jewelry" which is neither here nor there to me... but Kate Bush does, and she definitely wasn't a copycat artist. Artists don't have to make copycat music of their influences. That "everybody is derivative/no idea is original" defense easily becomes a way of defending pure biters and copycats.


>"Or you might say, “But his **** don’t sound all that
>original, he just sounds like he’s trying to be Prince or
>some ****.” And I’d say, maybe you’re right. At times he
>does. We often study the breathing techniques of our
>inspirations (inspire means to breathe in or to make breath,
>inhale). And that’s also true for most of you, emcees. I
>mean, don’t ¾ of y’all niggas sound like NAS? The
>difference is that D’Angelo has allowed influence to simply
>take its place among his own intuitive artistry. He works to
>find his own voice within his many influences"
>
>Can we say the same of Bruno Mars? That he has allowed
>influence to simply take its place among his own intuitive
>artistry? That he works to find his own voice within his many
>influences?
>
>Fuck. No.
>
>Karaoke.

a R&B After school special of hype and myth and while he is talented and got skills he was too scurred to run with it and make it happen in the big picture. yeah D'angelo was channeling alot of cats and he did have something under there, however his biggest problem is that he never worked on his craft and to expand it.

D'angelo should have been the R&B version of Kendrick Lamar

"Brown Sugar" was a Money track and still is a banger.

problem with D'angelo was he was a Legend in the hype machine and in time before he had a chance to ride various valleys.

truth is the game was set up for him because he came out with hype and had respect and the cat did co write "u will know" the Modern day Black Man's anthem and other things,problem was he was a Untapped Donny hathaway situation and sad to say that Aingie Stone wasn't his roberta flack in the bigger picture.

the cat had a chance to even give R.kelly a run for the crown at one time however he choked and couldn't bring the goods. he is better than what we got in all honesty.

I had no idea who the nigga was but when I heard the hook to BOB’s nothing on you it was a wrap.

Dude got it whether y’all like it or not.

Can't pretend "Finesse" is Bruno's own style.
This recent album and "Uptown Funk" is extremely derivative whether yall like or not.

or some other established artist.

That's his gift, he knows how to craft/sing songs that pop.

and the main reason I like Bruno is because he looks like he is having fun while doing it.

That dude's live shows look fun as hell.

All that other shit yall talking is just bitterness because he knows how to take what's good and doesn't over think it.

He also takes chances. I'm not mad at him.

Bruno Mars is the Steph Curry of music and he got the goods period.

versatility and he can switch lanes. the constipated Weekend wishes he had such going on.

Miquel another exlax nassal half singing turkey.

Bruno is peerless with what is out here.

>and the main reason I like Bruno is because he looks like he
>is having fun while doing it.


Legs... that's great. You like him b/c he looks like he's having fun while singing karaoke. He makes fun music. You can like the karaoke. I have nothing against you or anyone else liking it, my friend. I like some of it too. That doesn't make it any less karaoke. Lol, why is that such a hard pill to swallow?

not sure what folks want from him.

Maybe an acoustic album that doesn't sell to prove he is a real artist.

It's him sounding like karaoke.
That's not a right or wrong argument.
Not about whether or not anyone likes his music.
This seems to be really difficult for yall.

i don't have strong feelings either way about Bruno or meshell.

Y'all sound funny arguing. That is THE music trope of all time. And that last sentence was hyperbolic.

Anyhoo....

http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=4&topic_id=13173487&mesg_id=13173487&listing_type=search

this too:

http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=4&topic_id=13241081&mesg_id=13241081&listing_type=search

go to 9th Wonder's timeline and get yourself an education.

muthafuckas actin like bruno is some talentless hack. smh.

dude could be doing next-level shit, instead he is doing some over-produced old-is-new thing.

everyone is like "well he's talented but when is he gonna put his stamp on the music?"

can his stamp on music not be making really, really good retro-leaning pop that makes people have a great time?

i dunno. i'm asking because it feels like that's what he's been doing for 4 years now.

>go to 9th Wonder's timeline and get yourself an education.


9th didn't say anything we don't already know. He's just protecting his 'good negro' status with white people (hence you patting him on the head) and making sure he doesn't lose his white fans. He brought up white people, and this isn't even about yall. I see it worked like a charm tho... puffed your chest up and whatnot.


>muthafuckas actin like bruno is some talentless hack. smh.


Which muthafuckas are you talking about? What did these muthafuckas say that led you to this conclusion?

This is the great depression in music right now. Bruno is a talented cat. Y'all mad he bringing that Michael flavor to the game. He's not original but its quality.

I mean I enjoy his songs and I’m happy he’s keeping live showmanship alive

But I don’t hear Bruno

Yeah R Kelly, Prince, Michael , Teddy Riley or whoever took a lot from others , but they had their own sound. I just don’t hear that with Bruno, maybe I’m missing something a, and it doesn’t stop me from appreciating Bruno I just can’t put him in their category but maybe I’m just old.

say he sounded a lot like Charlie Wilson, who got a lot from Stevie. And early on, we all said R. Kelly sounded like Aaron, and even his production sounded like Teddy.

With Bruno...vocally, it's not a single artist you can say he really sounds similar to. He uses bits and pieces of diff artists, when it comes to runs, adlibs, harmonies, etc...but it's rare that you can hear a full song and say "he sounds just like ______ on it," and you can do that with most artists. Even Raphael Saadiq had songs where he emulated Steve Arringon (Faithful) and Al Green (Thinkin of you).

On "Finesse," the first line does sound like a Bobby Brown melody & cadence, and some of the melodies on there do remind you of Bobby and a few others in that era, but it's still not like "oh he sounds just like Bobby on there!" you know?

I even made a joke a long time ago with my friends

2017:

"if you hear a song on the radio and you think "thats my jam" there is a good 100% chance its Bruno"

Yes IMO...

Bruno is a true singer/songwriter he writes extremely well crafted songs with no fat. Then they are steeped in nostalgia to provide context and allow for high energy performances.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-7O6TyA_mo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GYHK-6ARxE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0R5hNCLh8Y

These songs sit at the core of the bruno sound... The music is just dressing

I can honestly say I am looking forward to Bruno's next project just to see if he will veer left and do something different.

not anyone here specifically

BUT

on one hand:

"Where is the live instrumentation? What happened to real music? Why everything gotta be about sex? What happened to the time when music was music? MJ, Prince, all-a-them was the REAL deal!"


and on the other hand:

"GAH! How dare he bring back those old sounds? SOMEONE STOP HIM! This is derivative garbage. Make something new!"



To quote Tyler the Creator in this case;

"Hahahahahahahaha How The Fuck Is Cyber Bullying Real Hahahaha Nigga Just Walk Away From The Screen Like Nigga Close Your Eyes Haha"


TONS of good music is being made. Ya know what I'm doing? Fucking turning on spotify and DISCOVERING new shit.

man, I'm always discovering new shit

what you want? something in the vein of what? right now I'm geeking over this new Steve Reich album that just dropped.

looking of my list of most recent added shit...its all over the place


Princess Nokia
Kutiman
Washed out
Duval Timoth
A fucking acoustic version of 'Possum Kingdom'
Wayne Shorter
Hypnotic Brass Ensemble
Bacao Rythym & Stell Band (great cover of 'Love like this')
Mono/Poly
Keifer
Hector Plimmer
Motherfucking Jethro goddamn Tull
The Avalanches
Norman Connors
Don Leisure (ok, fuck it, CHECK THIS SHIT OUT. New Album fire if you like madlib)

salute for fucking with norman connors. lots of gems.

So stupid.

If you enojoy his music, go ahead, don't lie to yourselves about it tho. this is embarrassing

you gotta reevaluate yourself if you're so on his dick that you'll go against a legend like Me'shell. She was asked about him, and answered the question, and it was the truth.

Smh... okayplayer haters yo.

now... boiling her innovation down to one single cover song.
Even u must see how ridiculous that is.

For someone who has been innovative for decades, she sure did fail when she had a chance to continue to do so, then turns around and calls someone else out for lack of originality. Is Bruno original? Nope, but don’t call him out while you’re promoting the same thing a million white kids with a YouTube channel are doing.

At this point, her resume speaks for itself, and she's made more innovative music than Bruno ever will. If she wants to make 1000 so-called coffee bar albums, she's earned that and paid her dues. Plus you're talking about ONE song on the album.

art house coffee bar. Maybe the rest of the album will show the decades of innovation. We'll see.

sheesh.

however when is the last time she dropped something memorable?

you up here acting like she is Patrice Rushen, brenda Russell or Roberta Flack or somebody?

Me Shall is a talented artist more closer to Cindy Blackmon Santana better served as musician than as a solo act.

are you saying he is a rapist?

>If you enojoy his music, go ahead, don't lie to yourselves
>about it tho. this is embarrassing
>
>you gotta reevaluate yourself if you're so on his dick that
>you'll go against a legend like Me'shell. She was asked about
>him, and answered the question, and it was the truth.

Since his joint just dropped..

Is Leon Bridges doing Karaoke?

http://2dopeboyz.com/2018/03/13/leon-bridges-good-thing/?utm_campaign=419149&utm_medium=twitter&utm_source=twitter

Shit do any black people even listen to Leon Bridges? Like we KNOW the majority his fans are white... but why? Do Black people not like Black people doing nostalgia driven Black music?

Its a nice soulful song.

"What's this derivative of?"

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

dawg.

whuh... just a nice derivative soulful song.. whats the problem?

and yeah, Black folk will swear they want that old thing back but have no interest in looking or pushing these type of artist on their FB or social media.

Folks just like sitting back and complaining when someone pops, it happens every.dam.time.

The conundrum also is that white people LOVE these kinds of artists...

so they support from early..

It really puts the artist in an extremely weird scenario

and yes that second song is him tryna step out the old soul man box for sure...

I will rinse it a couple a times

I mean if Black people just don't like throwback soul, why play Bruno on Black stations? These niggers would never dig it, right?

Yall can blame Black folks all day, but these decisions what entertainment is marketed to whom is very conscious, and it just doesn't have as much to do with money as yall think it does. The signs are too clear. Control of Black culture is *extremely* important to this society and always has been. That includes every area of activity. I know we disagree on that, but fuck it, I'm saying it anyway.

Bruno gets played on rhythmic because the people choose to.

What happens is he reverse crosses over.

There is an issue in general that black people regardless of genre can only break via rhythmic radio.

They dont play leon bridges though. Leon breaks via the internet by white taste-makers and npr. Black radio wont touch him.

this is like what I was saying with Sharon Jones and Charles Bradley. They were doing throwback stuff and yet....white audiences, white venues

See also: https://www.hotnewhiphop.com/9th-wonder-goes-on-powerful-twitter-rant-exploring-race-influence-and-bruno-mars-news.45542.html

around that time...errybody was going with the retro sound

was OKP shouting them down too?

I thought about Raphael while reading this thread and I came to the conclusion that it’s not a good comparison. He made They Way I See It after he had already proven he had his own style. He had already acheived veteran status when he rode that retro soul bandwagon...

>I thought about Raphael while reading this thread and I came
>to the conclusion that it’s not a good comparison. He made
>They Way I See It after he had already proven he had his own
>style. He had already acheived veteran status when he rode
>that retro soul bandwagon...

Oops. I was thinking of The Way I See It, not Stone Rollin, but it’s the same difference.

he can play sing, write and if we are honesty Tony TOni Tone did the same thing as what Bruno is getting grilled over when you think about it.

"Oh, I don’t think that guy’s appropriating. I think people use the word incorrectly."

https://themuse.jezebel.com/meshell-ndegeocello-on-prince-her-new-covers-album-an-1823829265

https://media.giphy.com/media/4pMX5rJ4PYAEM/giphy.gif

which is a desperate act at a lounge at the Super 8. she takes "L"

when I read through the parts relating to queer theory and power dynamics I realized she was speaking from a deep pool which unfortunately does not translate at all in the age of tmz-esque headlines

I wonder why?

and yeah, I think she played herself with the Bruno diss. Even if it was only meant for 2 songs she had to know they would run with it.

Can you put your finger on what didn’t jell?

I don’t know. I can’t say. I’m one of those people who has respect for the dead. But I loved him and I learned a lot from those interactions. He was the guiding light that gave me the confidence that, yes, I can do this.

^^ Just makes me love her even more

Sometimes people just don't have chemistry and all, but her saying "he's one of the reasons I'm like 'don't ever meet your heroes" makes me think she wasn't feeling his arrogance or treatment of her or something, but she had too much respect to say "he was mad arrogant" since he's gone... but I'm just speculating. "Don't ever meet your heroes" usually means a person was let down by their idol tho.

that song they hit with back in 94 which sounded like a poor man's friends theme.

Prince being arrogant what artist who has ever made a dent in the music business wasn't arrogant on some levels?

she can play that is what she does best. hit and miss songwriter and her real peak and prime was at best from 93-96.

Prince read Billboard magazine with Purple glasses and pen to see where you were on the charts. don't think he didn't.

was that she wanted to do a song with him and he refused on principle cuz she own her masters and he was fighting for his.

I may be remembering wrong.

http://www.factmag.com/2014/06/14/meteor-shower-the-universe-according-to-funk-shapeshifter-meshell-ndegeocello/

It’s funny that you mention Prince. You recently tweeted: “in 2002 Prince called me a “house nigga” for making a record for Warner Bros. Past is prelude ain’t it.” But you’ve always praised his music, and you’ve often covered him live. How do you reconcile your personal history with him as an influence?

Oh yeah, he’s not a nice person. But I just have to accept that. It’s just something between he and I that I try to rise above. Maybe one day we will have a good experience, I don’t know. Everyone’s not meant to be friends. But I have no doubt in my mind that the reason I play music is because of him. And I really appreciate all his works.

I felt bad for tweeting, and it taught me a lesson – I can’t let my hurt override my sanity. I asked him to play the guitar solo on ‘Trust’, and that’s when we had that fated phone call. But it’s OK. I try to have empathy. I don’t know what his life is like; I don’t know what made him the person he is.

kept it mad respectful even when he was alive.



>Oh yeah, he’s not a nice person. But I just have to accept
>that. It’s just something between he and I that I try to
>rise above. Maybe one day we will have a good experience, I
>don’t know. Everyone’s not meant to be friends. But I have
>no doubt in my mind that the reason I play music is because of
>him. And I really appreciate all his works.
>
>I felt bad for tweeting, and it taught me a lesson – I
>can’t let my hurt override my sanity. I asked him to play
>the guitar solo on ‘Trust’, and that’s when we had that
>fated phone call. But it’s OK. I try to have empathy. I
>don’t know what his life is like; I don’t know what made
>him the person he is.
>
>
>

>http://www.factmag.com/2014/06/14/meteor-shower-the-universe-according-to-funk-shapeshifter-meshell-ndegeocello/
>
>It’s funny that you mention Prince. You recently tweeted:
>“in 2002 Prince called me a “house nigga” for making a
>record for Warner Bros. Past is prelude ain’t it.” But
>you’ve always praised his music, and you’ve often covered
>him live. How do you reconcile your personal history with him
>as an influence?
>
>Oh yeah, he’s not a nice person. But I just have to accept
>that. It’s just something between he and I that I try to
>rise above. Maybe one day we will have a good experience, I
>don’t know. Everyone’s not meant to be friends. But I have
>no doubt in my mind that the reason I play music is because of
>him. And I really appreciate all his works.
>
>I felt bad for tweeting, and it taught me a lesson – I
>can’t let my hurt override my sanity. I asked him to play
>the guitar solo on ‘Trust’, and that’s when we had that
>fated phone call. But it’s OK. I try to have empathy. I
>don’t know what his life is like; I don’t know what made
>him the person he is.
>
>
>

One of my favorite songs from her

the thing with Prince is simple he had Hits, stats,Jewelry and he could do the artsy stuff and got away with it for a minute.

Me'Shall has had what i call 50 cent piece hits and close to 75 cent type of hits. Problem with her she tends to be all preachy and musically self entitled and bottom line she never understood a balance as a artist.


Prince Probably thought she was trying to hard and comes across a bit hurt from not just making music for music sakes and getting into a Political aspect.

its a business

that's not likely at all. she's had other albums no one knew was coming and didn't go the route of talking up other folks to get some some.

truth is she's fallin off the radar even with folks, like me, that really dug her first several albums.

musically and commercially, she aint where she once was. I don't think she's of the mindset that doing this as a stunt will cause anyone to buy/listen to her new album.

This story is only taking off because the target is Bruno. Not because its Me'shell saying it.

>This story is only taking off because the target is Bruno. Not
>because its Me'shell saying it.

when you drop a cover album

but those two things are totally unrelated. she's proven herself to be her own artist.

she's not the first to think Bruno is playing dress up. hell, I thought that. playing dress up doesn't mean he lacks talent.

he's clearly good at making pop tunes that lots of people vibe with. I like a few of his songs too.

cause regardless of how you feel about Bruno it’s a weird time to call him karaoke.

I mean.. it’s comical to me. That’s some ole “Hollywood shuffle” comedy right there

and I’m a fan of her work.

he doing what you suppose to do as a artist. he got a career and the man paid his dues and i don't know how she can hate on a artist who truly paid dues and was rejected over his skin color? also he can play,sing and entertain. he ain't no overnight sensation.

she would go after him and yet tap dance for taylor swift or katy perry whatever

In that case, you're the most jealous person of Prince I've ever seen. I can't understand it, maxxx... why you so jealous of that man? You actually do "hate" on Prince.

Does she have to have a positive opinion of his music just because she's also an artist?

And regarding that Taylor Swift comment you made, you hate on Prince but over there in the Lesson bigging up Olivia Newton John, so you ain't no better if it's some of negative to lift up a white artist while bashing a black one. You're just as guilty.

i don't hate Prince i just liked other artists more like MJ.lionel and Rick back in the day. if you bothered to read what i said about Prince
i was a huge fan from early 80's til late 80's and I always said His Live on stage was still on point. I just didn't drink the purple Kool aid with his hit and alot of miss studio mess from 89 until he passed. i liked some things, however his peak and Prime were better than what he put out 90 til 16.

Meshall is a Musician is in a business and she calls out a fellow artist and she is calling somebody a Karoke act when she is doing an album of covers and none of those songs she covered are said artists best songs except maybe 'Waterfalls" with tlc however it would be one thing if that was Beyonce dissing Bruno, however who is gonna pay a 90's has been act dissing an act who is happening?

and really you are lame because Olivia Newton John was good and had some tight cuts back in the day and she was versatile.

taylor swift is average

you just madd because I murked your weak garbage arguments against Bruno Mars and the Jive turkeys who refuse to give him his due.

the Kid paid his dues and I know what happen to him behind the scenes in the industry and lets just say he has earned his keep.
i know He is the baddest going now because nobody else is Polorizing.

and i refuse to hear a Black Person diss him because he writes, plays and sings and produces his music and can perform, meanwhile trap music and dime a dozen rappers who have no catelog of merit are rewarded. please.

i'm Old school about Music and Bruno is one of the few acts doing something period. He doing New Jack Swing alone. the guy can play and sing. naw He he needs work to ever see the days of Michael Jackson however he got talent.

you think I'm gonna listen to a Boring Snub has been act who is in the same business as dude? she bitter. as a Music consumer i can say whatever i want who cares or trips?

So back to the point...

>and i refuse to hear a Black Person diss him because he
>writes, plays and sings and produces his music and can
>perform

So you can understand why someone would "refuse to hear you diss" Prince then right? Now you backtracking when you've called dude all kinds of names worse than anything Meshell said about Bruno lol. Everything else you're talking is more emotional hypocrisy and joke attempts.

i have always said that I liked Prince for a particular time and point and said that he is a strong live act, however I didn't sip the Purple Kool aid and said he fell off after 88 and I dug other acts more than him period.

and Bruno Mars wasn't Pushed as the next Stevie Wonder and he just does what he does and it works. Meshall is just bitter because her wack albums are going "Reynolds wrap" and aside from a Live performance of her old material,nobody is checking for her.

Me shall is envious because Bruno Mars had Cardi B on a Hook, i doubt that Me shall can afford to get Skee Lo on a hook

just sayin...

----------

IG @h_n_z

Bruno Mars Packs Stadiums and she can barely pack a sardine can.

Everyone has their commercial peak.
She's had hers.

however as a artist she ain't no Patrice Rushen. she never had that Money track despite being on Madonna's label, despite working with John Cougar Mellencamp and also with Chaka Khan.

she never got next level.i liked her first 2-3 albums and then it was strickly live shows for me.

however she never had a peak or a prime. she had a promise.

i liked her first 2-3 records in parts, however she is a never was.

For example:

EXID - Lady (90s new jack swing): https://youtu.be/Q1JiptOTxno

Red Velvet - Bad Boy (maybe late 90s or early 00s R&B? This was produced by The Stereotypes who also produced "Finesse"): https://youtu.be/J_CFBjAyPWE

Red Velvet - Kingdom Come (also produced by The Stereotypes): https://youtu.be/vJEAMow2A4o

one is a Hall of Famer and the other one was a few time all star
and just forgotten.