it's been said to me that she's just being herself at all times (LA girl, not removed from the hood) and Im fine with that

but how long before white people are laughing too hard at her for the wrong reasons? (please dont ask me to expound)

I guess Im wondering if explicit blackness should be closed off to outsiders (Martin, To Pimp A Butterfly, Voodoo etc)

it's a slippery slope before you're Tracy Morgan who's very funny despite his white audience seeing him as a buffoon compared to Chris Rock or Dave Chappelle

>it's been said to me that she's just being herself at all
>times (LA girl, not removed from the hood) and Im fine with
>that
>
>but how long before white people are laughing too hard at her
>for the wrong reasons? (please dont ask me to expound)
>
>I guess Im wondering if explicit blackness should be closed
>off to outsiders (Martin, To Pimp A Butterfly, Voodoo etc)
>
>it's a slippery slope before you're Tracy Morgan who's very
>funny despite his white audience seeing him as a buffoon
>compared to Chris Rock or Dave Chappelle

if not...she will get a few crossovers look and be good with her core audience forever (Wanda)

either way her talent will keep her above the fray

http://www.cbs.com/shows/the-late-show-with-stephen-colbert/video/EH4eyLWey6auo7UNZ04YIlePuJFE6X66/tiffany-haddish-played-white-phoebe-in-jay-z-s-friends-parody/

if that was the Varnel Hill show I would have felt more comfortable
the audience who I couldn't see was probably amused and confused at the same time

>http://www.cbs.com/shows/the-late-show-with-stephen-colbert/video/EH4eyLWey6auo7UNZ04YIlePuJFE6X66/tiffany-haddish-played-white-phoebe-in-jay-z-s-friends-parody/
>
>if that was the Varnel Hill show I would have felt more
>comfortable
>the audience who I couldn't see was probably amused and
>confused at the same time

https://media.giphy.com/media/LRVnPYqM8DLag/giphy.gif

She's basically every girl from the hood I crushed on from 14-24 in one adult sized package.

Her whole vibe is hella crush worthy

>it's a slippery slope before you're Tracy Morgan who's very
>funny despite his white audience seeing him as a buffoon
>compared to Chris Rock or Dave Chappelle

but I think TM plays to that, he knows what he's doing, trust. You see it in all his interviews on late night...that lil sly look in his eyes.

and real talk, she is pretty much the gate keeper for crossover Black comedians these days.

>but I think TM plays to that, he knows what he's doing, trust.
>You see it in all his interviews on late night...that lil sly
>look in his eyes.

I saw him live in Vegas for my birthday last year. the whole room was in stitches, I just wonder if white people underestimate his intelligence

> I just wonder if white people
>underestimate his intelligence


I mean, that's for TM to care about and he probably doesn't care very much as long as he feels he's being true to himself and the checks are coming in.

that that's really him

d

I hope she gets PAID and doesn't worry about what we think.

Version of her.

like. i watched some of girls trip but couldn't finish it all.

hopefully she has a good mentor.

... :-)

I've heard of that didn't love the movie. Not saying that's bad, I'm just surprised.

+1

Oh well.

the culture away.

She didn't say she walked out of the theater. She turned it off. HMMMM

Oh noez!!!!!!!

How are we supposed to evolve in America if we keep getting caught up in the "you schuckin' and jivin' fo' whie folk" mentality. Comedy in and of itself is clownish with a touch of buffoonery. If you're afraid of being laughed at for the wrong reasons, you shouldn't be in the business.

I think the BEST thing she can do is just be who she is, comfortable in her skin and grow from that. THAT'S what's going to make her career (and has done so to this point).

Let's just hope she has good representation and the right people in her corner so that she can navigate the pitfalls intelligently.

>How are we supposed to evolve in America if we keep getting
>caught up in the "you schuckin' and jivin' fo' whie folk"
>mentality. Comedy in and of itself is clownish with a touch
>of buffoonery. If you're afraid of being laughed at for the
>wrong reasons, you shouldn't be in the business.

that said, I dont take issue with her because she's being herself and it's not an act. my concern is how it will come to be consumed and by who

>>How are we supposed to evolve in America if we keep getting
>>caught up in the "you schuckin' and jivin' fo' whie folk"
>>mentality. Comedy in and of itself is clownish with a touch
>>of buffoonery. If you're afraid of being laughed at for the
>>wrong reasons, you shouldn't be in the business.

It's fine if you don't agree but we are talking about comedy. Some people are gonna laugh for reasons you might not like but unless they tell her directly or she feels uncomfortable about it (a la Chappelle) I don't see what the issue is. We can't be worried about social standards if we expect to escape them.

When Ellen waltz's out to her audience and does the whip nae nae or grooves with her audience, no one says "well, how will Black people view her?". Why we have to do so with Tiff.

Let her break barriers, be the female Kevin Hart and pave a way for more talented black female comedians. They have to accept us as who we are and we can't be afraid to be who we are.

>that said, I dont take issue with her because she's being
>herself and it's not an act. my concern is how it will come to
>be consumed and by who

Entertainment is to be consumed and you can't control by whom once it's for sale/publicly released. If it gets to the point where it's being viewed as something racially derogatory (like the Leslie Jones stuff a few months back) then it can be addressed head on (as it was with Leslie). That's their problem, not hers/ours. To me, that's easy to deal with and better to see it coming than to hide.

>It's fine if you don't agree but we are talking about comedy.
>Some people are gonna laugh for reasons you might not like but
>unless they tell her directly or she feels uncomfortable about
>it (a la Chappelle) I don't see what the issue is. We can't
>be worried about social standards if we expect to escape
>them.

it works different when it's universal humor (The Cosby Show/My Wife And Kids/Blackish) vs. black shit (Martin/Sanford & Son/Good Times and What's Happening where JJ and Rerun could have been like minstrel acts if white people embraced those shows)


>When Ellen waltz's out to her audience and does the whip nae
>nae or grooves with her audience, no one says "well, how will
>Black people view her?". Why we have to do so with Tiff.

Ellen is white.


>Let her break barriers, be the female Kevin Hart and pave a
>way for more talented black female comedians. They have to
>accept us as who we are and we can't be afraid to be who we
>are.

white people laughing at a spectacle that reinforces black entertainers as caricatures in their mind (as opposed to talented humans) is not "accepting us". The same white people who love Savion Glover tap dancing arent there for the social commentary in his work

>it works different when it's universal humor (The Cosby
>Show/My Wife And Kids/Blackish) vs. black shit (Martin/Sanford
>& Son/Good Times and What's Happening where JJ and Rerun could
>have been like minstrel acts if white people embraced those
>shows)

Those shows are staples of black entertainment. You mean to tell me you'd be ashamed of them if white people embraced them and laughed at the shows for reasons different than yours? Those shows ran for seasons and opened hella doors for more shows. Look at what we're discussing:

-chronicles a business owner and his son trying to make it from lower class to something better. A business owner.

-A poor project family, avoiding the pitfalls of poverty to still raise a strong 2 parent family.

-A teenager and his group of friends navigating life with his single mother trying to work toward something better in life.

JJ and Rerun were part of black America fam. Natural swag through all that adversity and talent to groove at any size. If some bigot a**wipe wants to diminish that by viewing it as anything but...that's their problem. Not ours.

I'm not for the pandering and the house negro rules man.

>Ellen is white.

And Tiff is black and should have the same freedom to do what Ellen does without us going *gasp* 'the white folx might see her as a buffoon if she keeps dancing!'

True equality is being able to do what they do without any negative connotation to it. And that's what we should be focusing on.

>white people laughing at a spectacle that reinforces black
>entertainers as caricatures in their mind (as opposed to
>talented humans) is not "accepting us". The same white people
>who love Savion Glover tap dancing arent there for the social
>commentary in his work

Fam, we don't need their acceptance. We just need equal footing. Cut the check, expose everyone to the talent, let it kick down doors for more opportunity and normalize us as the talent we display.

Bigots will never go away but the way we deal with them is the key. We should never diminish for the sake of a bigot.

if DYNOMITE and pop-locking were all that got a great response from whites, it would sort of dehumanize the roles and take away from the overall beauty of black people being on TV in the 70s and 80s

If it gets to the point
>where it's being viewed as something racially derogatory (like
>the Leslie Jones stuff a few months back) then it can be
>addressed head on (as it was with Leslie).

Be more specific so I know what I'm googling about "the Leslie Jones stuff a few months back"

her role in ghostbusters. She got some off-hand and direct racial slander as part of the critique. But social media came to her rescue and she got hella support to combat it.

https://www.theguardian.com/culture/2016/jul/18/leslie-jones-racist-tweets-ghostbusters

Now I remember.

Good grief.

explicit blackness to be exclusive. that sounds separatist to to me.

white people cant sing along to Solange's F.U.B.U

it's fine for some things to be purely black

white people didn't get? lol

Kendrick been all over white media for a while now. whether you think they get something doesn't mean they didn't buy it.

none of your examples show exclusivity.

she paid her dues, and I dare say Tiffany is just more palatable because she's conventionally attractive.

Leslie is a LOT of black woman for some people.


that's a LOT of marginalization, and I'm sure those SNL writing rooms are cringe-worthy.

Leslie Jones is in not one but multiple Allstate commercials where the punchline is "scary black woman intimidates white guy". I dont know why she felt obligated to do that, but hey.

I havent seen Ghostbusters but Im sure 'extra blackness' wasnt a necessary plot device

to them

I hope not anyways

im sure tiff can handle it

some folks get mad anytime their pride and joy crosses over.

tif cant evolve? taraji wasnt even doin comedy... she was serious from the start.. so i dont see your point yet

she is accepted/respected/embraced reasons that Tiffany Haddish has not come to be yet

so calling her a funny version of Taraji is not accurate

it aint no puzzle chief

It felt very "We are laughing at you not with you."

I think when white folks fall in love she's gonna make more and more money if she has the right folks behind her but she might risk black folks thinking she's coon-ing it up a lil too much and they might turn.

she was trying to get a laugh and it worked.

sheez

it's just funny.

i remember Will used to do it on the Fresh Prince.

he been out the gate, ran the race, won, took a flick and posted.

b/c it lightens the mood.

ppl got it way before Tiffany H.

TPAB didnt go platinum with black people buying it ... you been to a kendrick show?

Shit will be fine...

How many products made for black people are actually only consumed exclusively by black people?

Insecure's audience is majority white... as is Atlanta's

I'm asking ...not being smart

but then again, I think someone said BET was mostly watched by white dudes back in the day.

too many black in-jokes on Insecure. my white friends hardly cracked a smile when i tried to get them to watch it.

meanwhile they rave about Atlanta because it reminds them of their white sitcoms.

*somebody is paying for it. it just aint me. bless whoever is tho lol
hbonow is the shit.

they wouldn't be broadcast on HBO or FX.

aired


which means the networks were willing to try/take a chance


as far as to KEEPING them on the air, then (maybe) those other audiences factor in

right.

as if white ppl didn't see the marketing.

unless they exclusively marketed via billboards in the hood there was no marketing that white ppl didn't also see.

have we not learned yet?

since motherfucking JAZZ in motherfucking Harlem in the 20s....

WHITE PPL ARE UP ON WHAT ENTERTAINS US. they are interested in anything that we dig 'for ourselves'.

hello?

this ain't new.

marketing to 'us' is the way they market to themselves.

nothing mainstream that's for 'us' survives unless THEY get on it.

how many examples must i list?

surely you see this.

interesting pt


I wasn't saying it along the lines of:
'this is ours...and they can't/won't'


I disagree that we can't sustain w/o them...especially these days

maybe the big 3 but cable....I disagree

that's just for 'us'.

neither is FX.

not unless it crosses over to THEM.

how many tv networks and cable channels started out w/shows for 'us' that crossed over to them 'them'?

run the list.

you already see it.

again - nothing in mainstream American entertainment survives unless THEY get on it.

so yeah, it might start out as an 'us' thing. but if it survives beyond the first year or 2...it's gotta become a 'them' thing too. or else it dies.

Insecure and Power(which *I* don't think 'they' gaf abt), Queen Sugar, Survivors Remorse, etc...


I personally think we are witnessing the page turn

yeah.

Power?

Starz.

sure.

-

yeah.

Centric. TVOne.

FX? naw.

HBO? hell naw.

Cats being extra.

but the numbers are still pretty low IMO so I think it's mostly Black folk watching.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/browbeat/2017/02/16/a_recent_nielsen_report_reveals_non_black_audiences_are_really_loving_shows.html

and she will triple down on the buffoonery.

I re-read...

I thought about what makes uncomfortable. it's the nigga shit she does. I feel like it feeds the stereotypes about black women. So yeah, something should be closed off to white folks...

y'all talk all that shit and still won't support tidal

niggas lol

.

half her post are prolly Jay Z lyrics

.

I dont think Kevin Hart or Chris Rock are the same around their homeboys as they are in professional settings, meanwhile Corey Holcomb and Katt Williams' careers have low ceilings for a reason. as opposed to Tiffany who is being groomed for A list stardom while being something that doesnt translate well to whites

We can't tell.

Are you worried that blacks who act niggerish in mainstream entertainment will have short careers?

Are you worried that they will be made to unniggafy to be successful? That we will lose them to selling out?

Are you worried that we will lose the chance to be entertained by niggerdom bc white ppl will snap them up?

my original sentiment is asking what happens if she ends up in Dave Chappelle's predicament where he walked away because white people treated him like step n fetch it

I thought you were asking about how we will handle it.

Hopefully she doesn't get turned out by the industry and end up waving a gun in traffic like Martin or end up on TMZ.

Maya Rudolph aside (who was former cast), Tiffany is the first black woman comedian to do so

to be clear, I don't have an issue with her rising up on the A-list. I just hope she's prepared for what comes with the white gaze outside of fame and money

Maya Rudolph
Gabourey Sidibe
Oprah
Queen Latifah
Cicely Tyson
Taraji
Halle Berry
Kerry Washington
Octavia Spencer
Rosario Dawson
Janet Jackson

nm

I glossed over "comedian".

Truth be told what Black female comedian has been big enough to host SNL...Whoopi maybe.

She was on Watch What Happens Live and Andy Cohen was doing "hood girl" shtick (neck rolling etc), it rubbed me wrong

Also Trevor Noah and his white audience couldnt laugh harder at her stories of underprivileged struggle

Im here for her, I just wish white (oriented) media wouldnt treat her like a zoo animal. I also wish there were more (black) outlets that understood who she is so that interviews wouldnt feel like National Geographic

she reminds me of cooning

And that one trick involves that dance she does every time.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

Like it was 2015 again

and did his talk show the second time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGQ5vMuuSgw


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ae1vLTOdDoo

even they were laughing at how outlandish her stories are.

I'm not even sure how to feel about her "cooning," but I do know she hasn't shown much range yet. The non-stop "girl from the hood keepin' it real" schtick is gonna grow old pretty quick.

That's her come-up, though. I mean... at least she's in on the joke.

I was surprised no one went in on her for making fun of disabled folks and I just didn't find her story about someone poor trying to take her out funny.

**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

She is very attractive. But I don't find anything she says or does funny. Her few minutes on Kimmel talking about Jada propelled her pretty far.

Her comedy skits are stupid and her poor black ghetto girl theme rising from the flame makes people (black and white) feel good.

BUT she is making money adn making other black people money. So fuck it. This is America.

Circa Singled Out.

What are the "wrong" reasons to laugh at her comedy?

Most comedians get by on creating an absurdly outlandish, self deprecating version of themselves. Eddie Murphy was one of the VERY few to pull off a rock star sense of cool in the process, but he's such an outlier it's barely worth mentioning....which is why it's worth mentioning.

Sure, she'll have some of the same horrible folks in the crowd who watch Blazing Saddles and jerk off everytime an n-bomb drops.

But most people will rock with her. If she's bringing an authentic brand of her own blackness in such a way that America at large identifies and connects with her, more power to her. There is no downside to that. She has very endearing endearing and relatable qualities that extend beyond mere racial voyeurism.

To me there's a wide line gap between Amos and Andy and the general silly self deprecating schtick that comedians have done forever.

the buffoonery is on 20


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JgByDCdtNE8



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dPj_DYk1XrQ

when it was just us it was fine but now its an issue

she seems always on. as in this is who she is right now, tv or no tv.

she'll have to grow a bit to keep folks engaged, but I don't see any real issues with who she is currently.

Just like how Jim Carrey or Robin Williams (RIP) is/was in most interviews, always on. Sit down and shut the fuck up.

I just don’t like her brand of comedy
it makes me uncomfortable
because it doesn’t seem polished.

her jokes aren't thought out? her transitions aren't fluid? her diction ain't up to par? she's too crass to be that fine? lol

I don't think folks are going at you for saying coon. this post reads like blackness should keep within our people and that white folks laffing at the same thing we're laffing at is inherently problematic. in some cases, I can see that, but I don't feel that with Tiffany.

side bar:
Is Tiffany Black or black? what's the distintion? who makes the call? is the ruling based on the physical or based on the black american asthetic? a combo?

but I get that.

>I just don’t like her brand of comedy
>it makes me uncomfortable
>because it doesn’t seem polished.

Folks just got a different filter when we're assessing our own.

I just dont care for the consumers. it feels very much like the plot of Bamboozled minus the blackface

**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

OKPs will hate on ANYTHING...smh..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ae1vLTOdDoo

When she started calling her "LISA...LIISAA" .... LMAO...

"Get ready....for your blessing....."

.

iono mayne. just seeing how those white people laughed at her at the oscars. shit aint sit well with me.

At some point people were going to hate her for it or love her for it but she's been doing it forever. I mean you hadtm to have been prepared for either or


----------

IG @h_n_z

Watching her on the Oscars was painful, and pretty much sealed her fate.




Bottoms up....and the devil laughs..




http://soundcloud.com/rayandersonjr

cause that "woke-ish" shit....

all that eye-buckin and re-inforcing stereotypes...

does he get a pass?

I saw her 'Oscars so Black' comment, and I just scrolled on. I didn't care for it at all...but that's who she is.

Also I'd like to smash, so I'm not going on record with any slander...


but f'real tho.

I haven’t seen the clip but she has always been a Martin type comedian. She is going to make faces, dance and heeeey!!!! for a few laughs.

We can’t like these types of comedians but call them coons as soon as their act crosses over.

That being said, I don’t know how far she went with it but more than likely it’s the same shit she BEEN doing.

love you tho :-)

https://goo.gl/images/1g3E6T

Trin doesn't like anyone that's darker than Bey and Jay..

except for Kanye and that dude crazy and talks weird now.

later for you and ambient1

stray bullet :-)

Who's as dark as, or darker, than Tiffany Haddish

lol...

gotta be honest

that aint no shit you can just TURN into... lol

with all this "coon" talk....

Bottoms up....and the devil laughs..




http://soundcloud.com/rayandersonjr

from the jump

Every comedian ain't Rock, Chapelle status...

some of them are physical comedians like Martin or Jim Carey

In a fair & just world, it would be alright for comedians to make faces, act silly and do dumb stuff.

But in America, all of those things were used to stereotype us and keep us down. So black comedians have to be careful about how they do that type of comedy.

It's unfair and it impedes the kinds of comedy that black folks can do. But I understand.

like, Whoopi told Monique....”you should have called me”
Tiffany might need to do the same.

My white cousin-in-law sent me a clip of the "Video Game" skit and thought it was hilarious. I thought it was type coonish. Didnt see her again until the trailer for the Tracy Morgan show on TBS, then the Groupon commercial, then last night. Have since seen her on Colbert (didnt watch past the dancing...smmfh), so yeah...I guess this is who she is...but are we cool with that?

I'm not...but thats just me





Bottoms up....and the devil laughs..




http://soundcloud.com/rayandersonjr

was the Eric Jerome Dickey book club.

I guess its like...the "danger" of "Hide ya kids/hide ya wife" going viral...

Or the reason Chappelle stopped doing the show. Ya know?

The whole "sister girl" shit aint for everybody.





Bottoms up....and the devil laughs..




http://soundcloud.com/rayandersonjr

Early Mantan is still Mantan

Stuck in the same place is not a good look.

Cause being herself got her an 800K deal.

Y’all niggas out here “evolving” on a 50K salary.

She’s fine until her time is up and then she can either broaden her talents or retire with a few mill and chill.

Step n Fetchit got paid good too.

It's always plenty of money for that.

>Step n Fetchit got paid good too.
>

they were ACTING OUT A PERSONA SPECIFICALLY FOR THE ENTERTAINMENT OF WHITES.

that is NOT the same thing as Tiffany Haddish being HERSELF no matter how much you disapprove of her lack of education or "decorum" (as defined by white western culture)...NONE of that makes her a coon because she is AUTHENTIC.

cookery is FAKE and i'm tired of y'all dumbasses using words and phrases you don't understand.


d

Don't complain about misongy and use Katt Williams as an example of anything.

>>Step n Fetchit got paid good too.
>>
>
>they were ACTING OUT A PERSONA SPECIFICALLY FOR THE
>ENTERTAINMENT OF WHITES.
>
>that is NOT the same thing as Tiffany Haddish being HERSELF no
>matter how much you disapprove of her lack of education or
>"decorum" (as defined by white western culture)...NONE of that
>makes her a coon because she is AUTHENTIC.
>

It is the same thing. Give her a little credit and stop trying to excuse buffoonery by calling her stupid. You do know that black folk lived during some of the worse times and still had self respect, dignity and didn't use lack of education as an excuse.

>cookery is FAKE and i'm tired of y'all dumbasses using words
>and phrases you don't understand.
>
>
>d

The only thing dumb is the backwards logic that makes excuses for shuffling.

d

who are you to tell somebody else what growth looks like for them?

mind your business and fix yourself.

judgmental asses all up in here pretending you give two shits about her growth and evolution...please

d

>who are you to tell somebody else what growth looks like for
>them?
>
>mind your business and fix yourself.
>
>judgmental asses all up in here pretending you give two shits
>about her growth and evolution...please
>
>d

Take off the cape and put down the shield. Making excuses for her is not helping.

i dont think it's fair to switch up on her just because white folks are hip to her now.

Kevin Hart is funny without being a caricature around them

They definitely have Tiff on some blackface shit

but I don't think her stand up is that good.

she can tell a funny story and she is great as an actress but I think she is terrible at stand up.

that's just my personal opinion.

>but I don't think her stand up is that good.

and that's cool. doesn't make her not a real comedian.

>she can tell a funny story and she is great as an actress but
>I think she is terrible at stand up.
>
>that's just my personal opinion.
>

fair enough.

d

I think you have to dive a little deeper.

I’ve never seen a full hour from her but from what I seen her comedy is mostly being loud, dancing and physical type comedy which there is a word for but I can’t think of it right now.

When your comedy is screaming or tripping over stuff like Jack Tripper it’s not fair to say “but look at one of the best out right now, he doesn’t come across like that to white folks”

>I think you have to dive a little deeper.
>
>I’ve never seen a full hour from her but from what I seen
>her comedy is mostly being loud, dancing and physical type
>comedy which there is a word for but I can’t think of it
>right now.
>
>When your comedy is screaming or tripping over stuff like Jack
>Tripper it’s not fair to say “but look at one of the best
>out right now, he doesn’t come across like that to white
>folks”

and that's called slapstick. its a form of comedy that white people are allowed to do.

or dancing and being loud.

I think the term I’m looking for is physical humor. The majority of her stand up that I watched was dancing, screaming ayyye and giving a hand job with her feet.

When she was performing to mostly black audiences, this was her act. Literally this same act.

Why is she supposed to change up because a new group joined her fan base?

My only issue with her is that she's still doing the nae nae like it's the summer of 2015

now she is great as an actress but she is always going to be the crazy Black girl or hood Black girl from the PJ's.

folks need to stop with this coon talk

I've been a fan of hers since 2014 and I really really got on the train when I heard her interview on The Champs and then The Crab Feast

shes the most real public person at the moment. what you see is what you get.

How would you react if I went to your job and told you to stop being you?

I'm not saying she needs some media training or some more training...she definitely does.

Her audiobook was not good but it was very much authentic.

She just needs a polish. FOH with this "cooning" shit.

I would argue Lil Pump is coon over Tiffany

now if she wants to have a legit career she may try to branch out and do a serious role to show she has some chops but nah.. she should be who she is, that's what got her famous.

Lil pump cant be a coon

lol.. He's one of them Marco Rubio's

>I'm not saying she needs some media training or some more
>training...she definitely does.

so why?

i dont even care. by all accounts, she's being herself and if the only issue is respectability politics related or adjacent, f*ck it.

I understand why it makes us uncomfortable sometimes but that's *our* shit to deal with.. not hers. She's a comedian and has been the same type of comedian, irrespective of audience, since she started. That we're OK with her brand of comedy -- which, btw, is just slapstick -- until it's in front of white people is some shit we need to fix about *us* not *her*.

considering the stereotypes that are prone to black women.
ghetto and loud

funny. we're discussing "code switching" -because often when we're imitated it's like Tiffany. not Oprah, Michelle O or Beyonce...

and no disrespect but Beyonce was Tiff when she first made it.

Hell, she still struggles saying her own name.

Remember when Popeyes was her favorite food for dressing rooms?

and I love Popeyes.

I just hate how WE can't let OUR people be Black as fuck.

some will have class and some will be loud and ignant.

... and it's stupid. I understand, I do. But it's stupid. We need to let her live and stop assigning labels to her particular brand of comedy and shit.

I find her more silly than funny, but I really don't think she puts extras on it for white people. She was exactly the same on the Def Comedy Jam celebration in front of a crowd of Black people.

There *are* certain things that are meant for in-group interactions, and that goes for pretty much all groups. As mentioned above, we have a certain set of things that were used to stereotype us and make fun of us, so it makes sense that we'd have issues with those things on some level. I don't have the answers to how we should deal with that as a collective, but I can say that I don't get "coon" vibes from her. With her, I think this would become a historical/societal conversation about why the "ghetto girl/guy" humor is the go-to for so many Black comedians, our position in society etc. I do think that's a conversation worth having and being put on front street. Despite the fact that Tiffany's humor might stem from some deeper level of Black deprivation, I think she's pretty innocent overall. Don't get me wrong, people can innocently "coon" so to speak, but I can't even say she's doing that, b/c as was also mentioned, she doesn't throw us under the bus to make white folks laugh or over-value white folks or anything like that. She's just a silly Black woman. I can't be mad at a Black woman who feels like she plays on negative stereotypes of Black woman either tho... especially when I see that ex-girlfriend skit. That was a little much for me. The Oscars wasn't tho.

I find her more silly than funny, but I really don't think she puts extras on it for white people. She was exactly the same on the Def Comedy Jam celebration in front of a crowd of Black people.

There *are* certain things that are meant for in-group interactions, and that goes for pretty much all groups. As mentioned above, we have a certain set of things that were used to stereotype us and make fun of us, so it makes sense that we'd have issues with those things on some level. I don't have the answers to how we should deal with that as a collective, but I can say that I don't get "coon" vibes from her. With her, I think this would become a historical/societal conversation about why the "ghetto girl/guy" humor is the go-to for so many Black comedians, our position in society etc. I do think that's a conversation worth having and being put on front street. Despite the fact that Tiffany's humor might stem from some deeper level of Black deprivation, I think she's pretty innocent overall. Don't get me wrong, people can innocently "coon" so to speak, but I can't even say she's doing that, b/c as was also mentioned, she doesn't throw us under the bus to make white folks laugh or over-value white folks or anything like that. She's just a silly Black woman. I can't be mad at a Black woman who feels like she plays on negative stereotypes of Black woman either tho... especially when I see that ex-girlfriend skit. That was a little much for me. The Oscars wasn't tho.

women who are prospering and in the spotlight, so I think it takes the pressure off of her. She is the "funny Black lady who I see every day in the break room, who teases me for my unseasoned leftovers, and heats up Gumbo on lunch break" and hey, nothing wrong with it to me.

fugg all that other bs...

to remember the type of black comedy that was everywhere in the '90s.

whenever I see her I remember Martin and Bill Bellamy and Chris Tucker and Jamie Foxx on TV and making movies like How to Be a Player.

she's doing a thing and it's kind of wild how against it her own people are; I'd probably be overwhelmed by her in person and put off but she's great for the screen.

~~~~~~~~~
"This is the streets, and I am the trap." � Jay Bilas
http://www.popmatters.com/pm/archive/contributor/517
Hip Hop Handbook: http://tinyurl.com/ll4kzz

doesn't mean it was a good thing.

when they did that Def Jam special damn near every comedian thanked Martin for giving them a shot.

There is room for all.

There will always be slapstick.

We just need to get over ourselves when they go mainstream.

they was going to blow up anyway.

>when they did that Def Jam special damn near every comedian
>thanked Martin for giving them a shot.
>

Def Jam and Martin did a lot but it also did damage.

>There is room for all.
>
>There will always be slapstick.
>
>We just need to get over ourselves when they go mainstream.
>
>

It's not just slapstick, Marlon and Shawn used that same excuse they came for them. The whole we just doing what Jim Carey do. If it stopped at slapstick that would be one thing but they go from that to doing anything. We don't need Mantan and Step n fetch it.

it's like yall just going to the worst words possible to say you don't like her brand of comedy...

hell, EYE don't like her stand up and don't find her that funny unless she is acting in a movie.

but I don't see mantan or think coonery. Just someone who hustled to get ehr 15 minutes and won't fuck it up by listening to Monique and the internets trying to bash her success.

>it's like yall just going to the worst words possible to say
>you don't like her brand of comedy...
>

I could tolerate her if it wasn't limited to that.

>hell, EYE don't like her stand up and don't find her that
>funny unless she is acting in a movie.
>
>but I don't see mantan or think coonery. Just someone who
>hustled to get ehr 15 minutes and won't fuck it up by
>listening to Monique and the internets trying to bash her
>success.
>
>

Monique bashed her ?

like her words got Haddish more money.

Tiff was like "I made this deal before you tried that boycott"

Monique gave her props and said keep shining.

The desensitized don't recognize that they've successfully been desensitized. The subsequent residual-self-blindness allows the cooning to continue unchallenged as a result. Such a sad cycle.

An abnormal normality.

cause that dude always been loud and Black as fuck in interviews

now you got Ryan Coogler out here NOT CODE SWITCHING WITH HIS BLACK ASS OAKLAND ACCENT TALKING

the whole Black American diaspora is valid...from the high rise, to the suburbs, to the ghetto

fuck anyone who uses the word coon in 2018 because you have no clue what that word means....

you should really be asking yourself why are you still so concerned about the white gaze? get over that shit.


d

>now you got Ryan Coogler out here NOT CODE SWITCHING WITH HIS
>BLACK ASS OAKLAND ACCENT TALKING
>

This is more than that.

>the whole Black American diaspora is valid...from the high
>rise, to the suburbs, to the ghetto
>

Sheriff Clarke and Clarence Thomas are valid ?

>fuck anyone who uses the word coon in 2018 because you have no
>clue what that word means....
>

I never used that or the racial slur of endearment.

>you should really be asking yourself why are you still so
>concerned about the white gaze? get over that shit.
>
>

Has nothing to do with the white gaze, we don't need to go backwards.

>>the whole Black American diaspora is valid...from the high
>>rise, to the suburbs, to the ghetto
>>
>
>Sheriff Clarke and Clarence Thomas are valid ?

now you've moved the goalposts. We aren't talking about Tiffany's ideas or political beliefs, so that doesn't fit.

We talking about Black comedians or celebs who act "ghetto" and aren't polished and how other blacks look down on them

Sherriff Clarke and Clarence Thomas are simply in the sunken place. that's a whole other post.


>I never used that or the racial slur of endearment.

great..therefore i wasn't talking about you.

>
>>you should really be asking yourself why are you still so
>>concerned about the white gaze? get over that shit.

>Has nothing to do with the white gaze, we don't need to go
>backwards.
>

actually it does because multiple people have already said that her being her for a black audience is different now that white people see her and are also laughing...folks are uncomfortable with and/or read into that white laughter as ridicule...even though they have no actual facts to back that up...therefore that sensitivity around white laughter is pretty much sensitivity to "white gaze" on unapologetic blackness...which all blackness is by default but we only use that term for black folks who are doing "embarrassingly black" things

d

>
>>>the whole Black American diaspora is valid...from the high
>>>rise, to the suburbs, to the ghetto
>>>
>>
>>Sheriff Clarke and Clarence Thomas are valid ?
>
>now you've moved the goalposts. We aren't talking about
>Tiffany's ideas or political beliefs, so that doesn't fit.

Not at all, goalpost in the same place. You said and I quote

"the whole Black American diaspora is valid...from the high
>>>rise, to the suburbs, to the ghetto"

You didn't say just comedy or comedians.

>We talking about Black comedians or celebs who act "ghetto"
>and aren't polished and how other blacks look down on them

"the whole Black American diaspora" Can't expand it and shrink it to make your point.

>Sherriff Clarke and Clarence Thomas are simply in the sunken
>place. that's a whole other post.
>

It's the same thing Clarke, Thomas and Tiffany are doing it for money and the extras that come with it.

Calling her acting ghetto and unpolished is just a way to justify it.

>>I never used that or the racial slur of endearment.
>
>great..therefore i wasn't talking about you.
>

lol ok

>>>you should really be asking yourself why are you still so
>>>concerned about the white gaze? get over that shit.
>
>>Has nothing to do with the white gaze, we don't need to go
>>backwards.
>>
>
>actually it does because multiple people have already said
>that her being her for a black audience is different now that
>white people see her and are also laughing...folks are
>uncomfortable with and/or read into that white laughter as
>ridicule...even though they have no actual facts to back that
>up...therefore that sensitivity around white laughter is
>pretty much sensitivity to "white gaze" on unapologetic
>blackness...which all blackness is by default but we only use
>that term for black folks who are doing "embarrassingly black"
>things
>
>d

I'm not multiple people and I said none of that. The problem is when the standard is that low and it's accepted, promoted and defended you get garbage coming up behind it. Cardi B, Tiffany Haddish, Marlon Wayans laying the foundation for garbage.

*hoping this doesn't go left....*

>Sherriff Clarke and Clarence Thomas are simply in the sunken
>place. that's a whole other post.

so Haddish gets the "do you" and it should be acceptable. cool

stop calling "folks" coons. straight

how do you not see what you are doing here (in reference to clarke and thomas) not as the same thing but just from the opposite direction?

you're going hard for "just be who you are". fine

we gotta get past that? sure.

but at the exact same time you're stopping *just short* of calling these folks sell-outs (yes, you didn't use those words, but lets not act like at the core, you might as well be)

you go hard for women. cool

lest this be considered a gender thing, is condoleeza rice in the "sunken place" too?

how come the other folk (who i'm not advocating for, but just using as examples) don't get fed with same spoon?

to act like ofays don't have a softer spot for one of us who is considered "safe" (be it because they are funny, or willing to vote for some b%$^&*, or whatever) is a bit disingenuous, no?

so, if they see Haddish just being her and they make her famous because that fits their sense of allowable, and the impact on the rest of us is reinforcement of "be more like *this*".

why are we acting like we shouldn't see some level of "danger" (in quotes, for lack of a better term) in that

note: I'm not trying to start a fight, I'm legit trying to see what (how) you think. earlier in this thing you questioned someone's logic, and i'm left wondering if consistency isn't worth considering too

Clarke and Thomas are pandering for "white" political acceptance which resides in 'slave mentality/dependence' and turn their backs on overtly accepted black belief systems. They aren't just 'doing them'. They are actively trying to be 'house negroes'.

Haddish has been her since day one. Black audiences are where she started and her act has always been who she is today. It has not changed.

The key difference here is that as she's gotten more notoriety, and mind you, this notoriety was from doing HER in a BLACK film, mainstream (white) audiences have gravitated toward her. She's not doing it for them or their acceptance.

It's like saying, "be hood until you blow then do 'dignified' black comedy so bigoted white folx won't judge you". Which is the key argument here. She shouldn't have to change because a handful of people NOW care how bigoted white people might digest her act.

And let's not act like we don't recognize that some white people aren't bigoted and actual get her comedy. This is like somebody telling Gary Owens to switch up because of his race. Why for? He's always be afro-friendly. No need to white-wash.

Let Tiff do Tiff...it's working.

>Clarke and Thomas are pandering for "white" political
>acceptance which resides in 'slave mentality/dependence' and
>turn their backs on overtly accepted black belief systems.
>They aren't just 'doing them'. They are actively trying to be
>'house negroes'.

look at what you typed

- they are pandering for acceptance
- turning their backs on overtly accepted Black (capitalize that mayne)
- actively trying

okay....

that's straight up judgement that could easily be flipped on ANYBODY

literally anyone

its an assertion with no back-up

you don't like 'em or their ways, fine

but we are defending Haddish who made a movie where she pees while on a zipline and gives instructions on how to give BJs using fruit

other than stay paid, what is *she* trying to do that makes her LESS pandering and destructive to "overtly accepted belief systems"?

(note: that's a crazy thing to read on a board where folks take pride in THEIR rejection of everything from the concepts of manhood, to femininity, to child discipline, to God, to.... you name it. US - as a generation - rejecting "old ways" and "being progressive" is fine, but its "respectability politics" if you imply that there is such a thing a personal culpability even in the face of systematic racism. but I completely digress....)

i keep saying this - it isn't about Haddish, or "uncle thomas" or any of them other folks per se

(except Larry Elder...F%^& him and every oxygen molecule that doesn't choke him to death when he breathes)

it IS about these ill sliding scales we have for who is cool/genuine and not

>Haddish has been her since day one.

this keeps getting repeated, so it has become the a narrative we've accepted.

but who here has known her since "Day One" (or truly knows her at all)? IS she not simply a comedienne we are wrapping a story around, followed by emotional attachment?

We don't *know* this whole deal isn't her character she is committed to.

We relate because, hell, who doesn't like a good Groupon? who doesn't empathize with the stories of her being homeless and in abusive relationships? WE (I included) want her to succeed cuz SHE IS US on a few levels.

But past that, lets assume someone here DOES know her or HAS followed her entire career. Note: I actually DO know a filmmaker dude out here in LA who has known her for years. he mentioned knowing her around the time right before girls trip, but we didn't get into anything about her. Observance doesn't mean she didn't simply find the character/voice she's rolling with pre-blow-up, and is committed to it.

Hell, even if it's 100% authentic that begs the point of whether authenticity inherently gets you a pass.

Back to Clarke, Thomas et. al, if - somewhere along the line - something in them shaped them to be all-in relative to THEIR thing, why is it cool to reject them out the "Black Club" even thought THEY might be being just as 100% authentic to "their truth"

>She's not doing it for them or their acceptance.

She was on the oscars

THAT is Black now?

it's cool though, you seem to be saying (if I may summarize)
- stay the way you were before you blew up
- don't hate congratulate - she's just doing what she gotta do

to me, there are holes in that. again: should there NOT be some awareness, or sense of responsibility to "us", that plays into HOW you represent in "mixed company"

if you say no, then be mindful it may not always be someone you LIKE "doing them" and its hypocritical to get salty when that goes down

>Let Tiff do Tiff...it's working.

No doubt. But if we are gonna do "end justifies the means" its still not clear why don't we say: "Let Clarence Thomas be Clarence Thomas...it got him on the supreme court" or "let Rice be Rice, it got her to Secretary of State"

Ok, here goes...

>>Clarke and Thomas are pandering for "white" political
>>acceptance which resides in 'slave mentality/dependence' and
>>turn their backs on overtly accepted black belief systems.
>>They aren't just 'doing them'. They are actively trying to
>be
>>'house negroes'.
>
>look at what you typed
>
>- they are pandering for acceptance
>- turning their backs on overtly accepted Black (capitalize
>that mayne)
>- actively trying
>
>okay....
>
>that's straight up judgement that could easily be flipped on
>ANYBODY
>
>literally anyone
>
>its an assertion with no back-up

Here's my back up: http://www.ontheissues.org/Court/Clarence_Thomas_Civil_Rights.htm

For Clarence at least. He's always discounted the effects of systemic racism on Black people. And as someone who can influence how things fall in that realm, he's extremely short sighted and seems to undervalue bigotry when looking at law. Now granted, his motives are to him alone but my assumption is, he's a product of the world he wants to live in, which to me is 'white acceptance'.

Affirmative Action is stigmatizing? Yeah, maybe to people who don't need the opportunity due to bigoted policy and practices.

>but we are defending Haddish who made a movie where she pees
>while on a zipline and gives instructions on how to give BJs
>using fruit

Actually, Jada was the one who pee'd. Jussayin'. Also, that's what the script called for. We didn't do this for Bride's Maids or The Hangover or Bad Moms. Again, equality means we can do the same as you sans judgement or different judgement.

>other than stay paid, what is *she* trying to do that makes
>her LESS pandering and destructive to "overtly accepted belief
>systems"?

I really don't see Tiffany Haddish saying Blacks in America should be accountable for their own success regardless of the social constructs limiting their opportunities to succeed.

I don't see Tiffany Haddish on TV saying things like this:

"In 2015, Clarke received criticism for his statement on his podcast: "Let me tell you why blacks sell drugs and involve themselves in criminal behavior instead of a more socially acceptable lifestyle: because they're uneducated, they're lazy and they're morally bankrupt. That's why."

Instead, I see Haddish telling comical stories about hanging with Black celebrities she admires and the funny quirks of class (how Jada not know what a Groupon is?).

HUGE difference there don't ya think?

>(note: that's a crazy thing to read on a board where folks
>take pride in THEIR rejection of everything from the concepts
>of manhood, to femininity, to child discipline, to God, to....
>you name it. US - as a generation - rejecting "old ways" and
>"being progressive" is fine, but its "respectability politics"
>if you imply that there is such a thing a personal culpability
>even in the face of systematic racism. but I completely
>digress....)

Yeah we do all those things but the common denominator here is that America isn't good to Black people and we should continually fight for our right to be equal, respected and given the same opportunities. Tiffany Haddish is an example of that belief. Clarke and Thomas are not.

>i keep saying this - it isn't about Haddish, or "uncle thomas"
>or any of them other folks per se
>
>(except Larry Elder...F%^& him and every oxygen molecule that
>doesn't choke him to death when he breathes)
>
>it IS about these ill sliding scales we have for who is
>cool/genuine and not
>
>>Haddish has been her since day one.
>
>this keeps getting repeated, so it has become the a narrative
>we've accepted.
>
>but who here has known her since "Day One" (or truly knows her
>at all)? IS she not simply a comedienne we are wrapping a
>story around, followed by emotional attachment?
>
>We don't *know* this whole deal isn't her character she is
>committed to.
>
>We relate because, hell, who doesn't like a good Groupon? who
>doesn't empathize with the stories of her being homeless and
>in abusive relationships? WE (I included) want her to succeed
>cuz SHE IS US on a few levels.
>
>But past that, lets assume someone here DOES know her or HAS
>followed her entire career. Note: I actually DO know a
>filmmaker dude out here in LA who has known her for years. he
>mentioned knowing her around the time right before girls trip,
>but we didn't get into anything about her. Observance doesn't
>mean she didn't simply find the character/voice she's rolling
>with pre-blow-up, and is committed to it.
>
>Hell, even if it's 100% authentic that begs the point of
>whether authenticity inherently gets you a pass.

Yes, it does...if that authenticity is rooted in genuine Blackness. I mean, people are getting mad because she celebrates by doing the Na-Na, wore the same dress to different award shows and won't code switch at the Oscars.

C'mon.

And let me be clear, everything Black isn't 'good' but neither is everything of any other race. There is no 'perfect Negro'. We need to be accepted and more importantly, accept ourselves...flaws and all.

>Back to Clarke, Thomas et. al, if - somewhere along the line -
>something in them shaped them to be all-in relative to THEIR
>thing, why is it cool to reject them out the "Black Club" even
>thought THEY might be being just as 100% authentic to "their
>truth"

Yes, as their views are detriments to the "Black Club" and fuels the same type of mentalities that provoke 'respectability' politics.

>She was on the oscars

As press, not so she could "get in good with the white folx" and once there, she didn't sound like Bryant Gumble either.

>THAT is Black now?

Black people can't do the Oscars? lol

>it's cool though, you seem to be saying (if I may summarize)
>- stay the way you were before you blew up
>- don't hate congratulate - she's just doing what she gotta
>do
>
>to me, there are holes in that. again: should there NOT be
>some awareness, or sense of responsibility to "us", that plays
>into HOW you represent in "mixed company"

What I'm saying is, grow from your roots and be authentically you in that. Let no perceived misrepresentation of 'the group' dissuade you from your path if you are indeed not intently pandering for others and denigrating Blacks.

And secondly, that 'what happens when white america falls in love with Tiffany Haddish?' is a BS question rooted in self hate and diminishes the hard work she put into her career to be who she is today.

>if you say no, then be mindful it may not always be someone
>you LIKE "doing them" and its hypocritical to get salty when
>that goes down
>
>>Let Tiff do Tiff...it's working.
>
>No doubt. But if we are gonna do "end justifies the means" its
>still not clear why don't we say: "Let Clarence Thomas be
>Clarence Thomas...it got him on the supreme court" or "let
>Rice be Rice, it got her to Secretary of State"

It's funny how on one hand, we don't want other races to lump us into one category and stereotype us (Black people have lower IQ's, Blacks are hypersexual, Blacks are violent and savage) but the first time someone tries to be authentically Black (per their environment and life as a Black person) the first thing we say is "but remember, you represent the group!".

We can't 'shame' white people about Trump or Weinstein or Charles Manson or Charlie Sheen because they have the freedom to confidently spout...one does not represent the whole. Why is it that we can't have that same comfort, ignore the bigots and celebrate Tiffany's success...even if you don't find her comedy funny?

And yet, most of us code switch in professional environments...

thanks for the discourse

you said some things that indicate a misunderstanding of the point(s) I was making (e.g. "black people can't do the oscars..) but that stuff is minor

FINAL SAY FROM ME:

I'm not picking a side

I like Haddish, and I ain't mad at her, or anything she has done (so far)

I am MUCH more interested in how we "get through this thing called life" (c) prince

its hard navigating through all this externally and internally imposed stuff

yet, while a lot of it IS messed up, I don't think "everybody dowhatchalike" works... there has to be SOME kind of standard or else chaos reigns

i don't like a whole bunch of specific folks. Truth be told, I think if we are gonna use the terms then thomas, clarke, freakin-steve-harvey, child-molester-a$$-r-kelly, and larry i-hate-that-bastid-for-real elder are bigger "coons" (sellouts, uncle toms) than haddish has been PRIMARLY because of the widespread detriment their behavior causes

haddish tells raunchy jokes in a loud-a$$ hoodcat way (pretty much all of us have at least one of those directly related to us, or at worst have seen it)

I'm not shamed of/by that - and I really don't care what ofays do with it because they gone foe regardless

but there gotta be a line

you modeling some self-destructive behavior? ... cant fade you

likewise, for those who do inverted "respectability politics" but then INVOKE "respectability politics" as a weapon against the ones OF US you don't like: I legit think you (holla hitdog) are part of the problem

now i'm off the soapbox. thanks again for helping move the needle of (my) understanding forward

>thanks for the discourse

thank you as well

>I'm not picking a side
>
>I like Haddish, and I ain't mad at her, or anything she has
>done (so far)
>
>I am MUCH more interested in how we "get through this thing
>called life" (c) prince
>
>its hard navigating through all this externally and internally
>imposed stuff
>
>yet, while a lot of it IS messed up, I don't think "everybody
>dowhatchalike" works... there has to be SOME kind of standard
>or else chaos reigns
>
>i don't like a whole bunch of specific folks. Truth be told, I
>think if we are gonna use the terms then thomas, clarke,
>freakin-steve-harvey, child-molester-a$$-r-kelly, and larry
>i-hate-that-bastid-for-real elder are bigger "coons"
>(sellouts, uncle toms) than haddish has been PRIMARLY because
>of the widespread detriment their behavior causes
>
>haddish tells raunchy jokes in a loud-a$$ hoodcat way (pretty
>much all of us have at least one of those directly related to
>us, or at worst have seen it)
>
>I'm not shamed of/by that - and I really don't care what ofays
>do with it because they gone foe regardless
>
>but there gotta be a line
>
>you modeling some self-destructive behavior? ... cant fade
>you
>
>likewise, for those who do inverted "respectability politics"
>but then INVOKE "respectability politics" as a weapon against
>the ones OF US you don't like: I legit think you (holla
>hitdog) are part of the problem
>
>now i'm off the soapbox. thanks again for helping move the
>needle of (my) understanding forward


I think trying to draw a line in the sand that all Black people measure is a bit of a slippery slope. Let's just say, morality and social acceptance is so subjective and fluid, what's good today, might not be good tomorrow and no one will agree on what's 'over the line'.

For that reason, 'do you' has to kind of be the stance. So long as the person isn't denigrating Black folx and cow-towing for (bigoted) white acceptance, we have to look at it on a case by case basis.

Otherwise, I agree with pretty much everything you said.

there are too many variables and gray areas for lines to be drawn.

and as Selah stated, there are far worse messages coming from people that don't tell jokes vs Haddish's over the top hood antics.

but yeah. That white wash or whatever you call it...

I’m left to explain (sometimes reprimand) my white friends/colleagues that we’re not all her. While you may not give a f:$k. I do! It’s uncomfortable to hear them talk about some shit they heard on tv.

>but yeah. That white wash or whatever you call it...
>
>I’m left to explain (sometimes reprimand) my white
>friends/colleagues that we’re not all her. While you may
>not give a f:$k. I do! It’s uncomfortable to hear them
>talk about some shit they heard on tv.

so let's talk about why its uncomfortable...because i've felt that too, but in 2018, i'm pushing past it.

it's uncomfortable because we are concerned and sensitive about what white people think about us.

and that's what i'm saying needs to end. the best behaved black person is still Black, period. there is no amount of respectable behavior that changes that. Barack and Michelle Obama proved that...racists and well meaning whites still put Trump in office.

our "image" is irrelevant.

so we all need to just be ourselves, while we upend and undo this white supremacist patriarchy cuz acceptance ain't the way.

d

I’m not watching her like, “oh no what are the white folks gonna think”. I don’t find her brand of humor funny.

I do know white folks tend to stereotype us based on what they see. By way of example, during a business meeting with a white lady - for whatever reason she thought it was cool to talk ghetto. I couldn’t help wondering why she thought it was ok. More than likely she’s mimicking a behavior....be it tv or who she knows. It’s things of this nature that make me uncomfortable!

like, Tiffany, you and everyone else I have every right to be who I am too.

>I’m not watching her like, “oh no what are the white
>folks gonna think”. I don’t find her brand of humor
>funny.

and that's cool.

>I do know white folks tend to stereotype us based on what they
>see. By way of example, during a business meeting with a white
>lady - for whatever reason she thought it was cool to talk
>ghetto. I couldn’t help wondering why she thought it was ok.
> More than likely she’s mimicking a behavior....be it tv or
>who she knows. It’s things of this nature that make me
>uncomfortable!

that woman is basic, ignorant and insecure and that isn't the fault of any Black person. Therefore you have no need to feel uncomfortable for her lack of decorum. So the person that needs to change is her and not Tiffany.

White America purposely created and continues to encourage (via discriminatory laws) Black poverty and miseducation. So when someone breaks outta that shit and makes it, I LOVE it when white people gotta face what the fuck they created and refuse to undo. I need the Tiffanys and the Cardis of the world to keep rubbing their face in it.


>like, Tiffany, you and everyone else I have every right to be
>who I am too.
>

and we 100% agree there, sister. I'm just wishing and wanting for you to let go of caring about what white people think of any of us.

I thought about more and concluded that I just don’t like ghetto people. I find no humor in it and to see the world laughing at makes it even sicker.

we good tho :-)

instead, she made you uncomfortable because you are still worried about what they think of us.

It’s hard not to cause it’s America but like Damali said, we have to get over that type of thinking.

no one believe that when you’re acting a fool...

some of us come from the jesters too.

but unless you out here mentoring in the hood and holding etiquette classes for our people it’s just fantasy talk.

I was thinking "how oakland can he sound?"

I got the video up and running so I had a visual going before I plugged in my headphones

Yo, homeboys interview steez was hoard'n a mug.


He is. Oakland/California. As fuck. Goddamn.

i LOVE that he's out here being Oakland.

d

for example https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOhKrL5DB1Y

he just never got that mainstream white people push outside of 30 Rock (on that and SNL he was more of a backup role) so it doesnt feel as bad

she's too big to be the supporting role like she was on Carmichael

but a Martin/Bernie Mac show type of thing centered around her would be cool, both of those (especially Martin) made it okay to still be black without white people paying attention

but I think it's too late now that Hollywood cant get enough of her, I just hope she doesnt get typecast

Whatever she does she is going to be that type of character that will make some Black folks cringe when they think about white folk laughing at her.

It’s the reason we over tip sometimes. Just to prove we aren’t the stereotype.

The reason we spend to much on fancy shit.

The reason we pay a shit load of money for the “best” schools which means the whitest schools most times.

Ain’t no reason to worry about what white folks think of us cause regardless we just niggas to them until we “prove” we belong even tho half the time we are cleaner and more refined than them. They just white.

Now she's saying Brad Pitt told her to call him if they are both still single...

I don't care if she made it up to be funny or he really did say that to be funny but first the Jada and Will story, then Beyonce, now Brad.

It isn't funny anymore it's just an annoying schtick that is making her look bad and desperate.

https://twitter.com/tmz/status/971030412154867714?s=21

Y’all take this shit way too serious.

See out here having fun and y’all all “shh gurl, we’s gonna be in trouble if you keep talkin”

Maybe you should stop paying attention to what she says? Lol

we (us...black folks) got a whole lot to navigate

just to get by

my experience isn't yours

yours isn't mine

despite the skin we in

its funny how we are quick to turn on one another despite knowing damn well "we all we got"

one one hand "don't take it too serious" the other hand it is "stay woke"

on one hand "don't knock someone else's hustle" and on the other "each one, teach one"

the tension between all those? THAT is why we sick (spiritually, mentally, physically, familiarly, culturally, etc)

typing that just made me pause at how many black people catchphrases i've lived though

with the rhythm it takes to dance... indeed

Every move is scrutinized and everyone is trying to trend on Twitter

So now Tiff has to shut up because Beyoncé dropped a song and some folks say she was talking about Tiff.

But here is the thing, when they stop talking about you... ????

She is hot in the streets so I get it but damn, can she enjoy it or does she have to act right cause white folks listening?

one of the many things stressed by professors (people who lived though the dog years of civil rights and the integration of corporate spaces) was:

never forget you represent

you represent yourself

you represent your family

you represent this school and any and everyone who pours into you directly or indirectly

you represent all the people who went through hell so you could get a shot

you represent as the next link in the chain, making a way for whoever has to follow you

you gotta not just be good, but be the best...so they won't have an excuse BUT to deal with you as you are (not as they assume you to be)

is it fair? nope

is it a lot of pressure? yup

do "I" (whomever the individual is) owe "we" - anything? especially if the "them" in us is who GOT you that look in the 1st place pr at least sustained you in your early grind (like a parent who says, i took care of you when you were little, now don't forget where you came from"

on one hand we laud everyone involved with Black Panther for making something that makes us look good, give us a couple of hours escape to a world where our greatness wasn't stunted and gives us something we can point to that is worth being aspirational.

maybe they just wanted to make a cool movie and not have to worry about "saving" us on some level Every indication from anyone involved I've seen is that they embraced the challenge - but should they have had to?

this thing with haddish is the dark underbelly of that kinda pressure. you ain't ask for it - but you got it none the less

the "you shaming us, cut that out" check

and it ain't new.....hell "a soldier story" (play 1981, movie 1984) has this very thing as its context

in one way its bucket crabbing - on the other is it not the expectation of "he ain't heavy, he's my brother" on a low level and considering what you do that might make it hard from someone else?

its a heck of a thing (the underlying pathology of the whole topic)

not knocking your take bro...but yeah

f**k all that respectability bs...respectfully

they gon do what they gon do regardless (as you say)

respectability politics is a cute buzzword and all

one for the cynical (and in some ways entitled)

but buzzwords aside, what is the option

DIS-respectability politics (i.e. everybody do what they want)?

the core question is:

do I have any culpability to other Black folks relative to how I present myself?

?

>do I have any culpability to other Black folks relative to how
>I present myself?
>
>

you seem to imply (by the question) that the only reason to be accountable to one another is to make sure we don't look bad to others?

and, by inference you seem to be saying

that, if so, isn't a good enough reason

am I off base with what my interpretation of what you are saying?

so i don't understand the culpability question's relevance

I say this:

> do I have any culpability to other Black folks relative to how
> I present myself?

i think that's clear, but restated...

as I go about my day to day life, should I limit myself in any way based on a perceived responsibility to any collective to which I may be considered a part?

way based on a perceived responsibility to any collective to
which I may be considered a part?

As a human as I go about my day to day life, should I limit myself in any way based on a perceived responsibility to any collective to which I may be considered a part?

As an employee as I go about my day to day life, should I limit myself in any way based on a perceived responsibility to any collective to which I may be considered a part?

As a person over 6ft tall as I go about my day to day life, should I limit myself in any way based on a perceived responsibility to any collective to which I may be considered a part?


Logically....I would have no choice but to answer....possibly/it depends/is circumstantial/subjective

*sometimes* its yes

in those cases

what are the boundaries? can you pick and choose? and if so, at what point have you watered it down to a level where you have become part of the problem?

being a little philosophical....

the one which created the need for boundaries/rules/standards in the first place

you said "sometimes"

why?

...:-)

- re: this place

I remember when we use to have DISCOURSE, rather than trying to be quippy and one up one another with snark ALL the time (jokes? sure...but balance mos(t) def)

- viewpoint wise

sometimes it seems like we only want there to be an "us" when its convenient... and only within the boundaries the individual sets (which means there really isn't a standard)

i don't pretend to have any/all answers, but this whole tl/dr mindset bugs me

Maybe someone edited some snark out.

even in this post the ratio skews

on the board as a whole?

the proof is in the pudding

collectively, we don't "build" here (that used to be the whole point), now we just shooting the giff til its time to get off work or whatever

pretty much all this is disposable

It doesn’t matter how we “act” to them.

Now I definitely feel you on doing it for “us” but everyone ain’t on that jack and jill shit.

It’s like some folks only want the refined and upstanding blacks to get on and that’s not how it works. She hustled her way into a nice little career. I’m not even a fan of her stand up but I ain’t going to knock or call her a coon.

That’s just... that’s wrong man.

again, I'm not hating on haddish

she funny sometimes

she extra sometimes

she "loud sister/auntie"

*shrug*

my personal perspective on her is a general sense of happy that she's doign well (I cheer for Black success, cuz this world is a #$%^&*()

but at the same time

I *DO* believe there has to be a WE

I believe completely in everything in the "represent" mantra

**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

the person who is hood but just does not give a fuck and will put everything on blast.

I had friends I grew up who when I would take them to other spots I went would just call shit out

"that man is looking at me funny. Hey white man, why you looking at me funny? Alright. We got a problem? Alright."

My complaint was one trick pony. This "she's a coon" talk is doing too much.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

you late :-)

most of us have friends or family like her, so *we* arent turned off

she isnt embarrassing, ignorant or trashy, her routine is just playing up blackness (I recently saw something where she alluded to spending time around some manner of privilege) to a world ready to secretly make her the butt of the joke

I had issues with Spike Lee's Bamboozled, but it really predicted a lot of popular black culture we've seen since.

so yeah she's laughing to the bank, but America dictates that white people have the greater say on what constitutes cooning i.e. Soul Plane flew under their radar, Friday is too classic to be labeled cooning and Tiffany Haddish may never be respected for her abilities unless she pulls a Marlon Wayans in Requiem For A Dream

we have family members like this so *WE* aren't embarrassed until white folk are around. We can have uncle Willy dancing at the BBQ all day long but if Uncle Willy was in the lobby at our gig looking for us?

White folk see us as entertainment/comic relief in most roles but they would never call it cooning or even think of it as such. I doubt they even know the word. Black folk who worry about the white gaze are quick to call it cooning or fear that it looks like cooning cause we care what white folks think.

Cooning is some shit WE label each other with when we see white folks watching.

Lil Young Thug or whoever can be on stage in front of 10K people and it's just performing... might not be good but it's just called a show.

But put him in a room at Apple or Facebook with 10 white execs doing the same exact thing and OKP says it's cooning.


..and yes, Tiff is the butt of the joke and I think she knows this. This is why most of her act is about herself and how broke she is or how she is about to turn up wearing the same dress.

That these people don't get it. They've been tricked.

Cooning = Doing it FOR them. FOR their acceptance.

Code switching (which we've all done at some point) is more cooning than anything.

Tiffany has a CHOICE and she chooses to be authentic to HER people which is the realest thing anyone can do. I don't expect Sarah Silverman to throw some popular black culture in her show to prove she's not racist. I'm not gonna expect Tiffany Haddish to white wash herself so I don't think she jiving.

Because I don't. And THAT is equality. Being accepted for who you are, unapologetically.

If I was in a room with 10 white folx and a black guy walked in, loud, pants sagging, eating watermelon and asking where the fried chicken at. I'm not gonna shrink and if those white folx look at me, I'm cussing THEM out.

Because if I was in a room with 10 black folx and one white guy and a loud, 'southern' white guy walked in wearing overalls, talking broken southern speak, biting a corn stalk, yelling "yeehaww" with a confederate flag belt on asking where's the 'moonshine'...we aren't going to look at him like 'get your boy'. At least I wouldn't lol.

Jerry Lewis was the butt of the joke...Haddish can be too.

She told a story about groupon with Will and Jada and got a Groupon endorsement check. C'mon man.

We need to stop this self hate.

Up is down, left is right

Ionno, folks got it all wrong.

Giving white folks way too much credit. I get it though, I’m still trying to get to that place where I give zero fucks at all about these white folks when going in interviews. I need to be on some “you are making a huge mistake of you don’t hire me because I’m that nigga”

>That these people don't get it. They've been tricked.

>Cooning = Doing it FOR them. FOR their acceptance.

yes I think there's a certain style of black comedy that white Hollywood loves where the worst stereotypes of blacks get played up


>Code switching (which we've all done at some point) is more
>cooning than anything.

it's very possible to straighten up your act and keep your black integrity intact in America


>Tiffany has a CHOICE and she chooses to be authentic to HER
>people which is the realest thing anyone can do.

the crux of this post started last August asked "what happens when white America makes her routine the new *it* thing?"

I'm not gonna expect
>Tiffany Haddish to white wash herself so I don't think she
>jiving.

I dont think I've implied that this should happen

And THAT is equality. Being accepted for
>who you are, unapologetically.

you define equality as racist America embracing hood authenticity when it's marketable. I define equality as Tiffany Haddish being considered for the same roles as Jennifer Lawrence


>If I was in a room with 10 white folx and a black guy walked
>in, loud, pants sagging, eating watermelon and asking where
>the fried chicken at. I'm not gonna shrink and if those white
>folx look at me, I'm cussing THEM out.

you described someone who would make white folks raise their eyebrows in person, but if said white folks would laugh watching your scenario on a screen or on stage at an awards ceremony, then you've made my point for me

>She told a story about groupon with Will and Jada and got a
>Groupon endorsement check. C'mon man.

where have I been opposed to any of this?

>We need to stop this self hate.

throwing a term like "self-hate" around all willy nilly with nothing to back it up doesnt make for productive discourse

>yes I think there's a certain style of black comedy that white
>Hollywood loves where the worst stereotypes of blacks get
>played up

This is implying Tiffany Haddish is 'the worst stereotype of blacks' and she's not. Not even close. This is where your whole stance is off-base. She's just not "golly gee sir, how are ya?" and more "Yaaasss, girlfriend, heeeeeey." They have their way of communicating driven by the life they've lived and we have ours. Nothing wrong with either.

>it's very possible to straighten up your act and keep your
>black integrity intact in America

Again, 'straighten up your act'? What type of BS is that? So because she doesn't act the way you see appropriate for mixed audiences, NOW her act is a problem? This is rooted in respectability politics. Your statement implies that Haddish doesn't have black integrity because her act isn't as straightened up as you think it should be because she has a growing 'white' fan base. Your stance is problematic for equality.

>the crux of this post started last August asked "what happens
>when white America makes her routine the new *it* thing?"

Yes, it's her act, started before white America's mass influx of interest. It wasn't cultivate FOR white America. They have to love her as she is. Some of them will caricature her (and let's be real, her act is part caricature) but they'll do it for bigoted reasons. That's fine. Some people are bigots. That won't change. Tiffany shouldn't unless that's what she chooses to grow towards. Not because their eyes are on her and it makes some insecure about how authentic they can be at all times (i.e. code switching).

Jerry Lewis was a caricature and no white person called him a coon and wondered how his act would translate to Black audiences.

>I dont think I've implied that this should happen

LMAO and you say I'm all over the place. Sooo she should clean up her act (which is code for 'white wash' aka making it more digestable for bigoted whites) yet you don't think you've implied it. Which is it famo? Oh, wait, let me 'clean that up'...which is it sir?

>you define equality as racist America embracing hood
>authenticity when it's marketable. I define equality as
>Tiffany Haddish being considered for the same roles as
>Jennifer Lawrence

I define equality as embracing all forms of culture, entertainment, dialogue, etc as valid and respectable. Larry the Cable Guy can be a hick, Haddish can be hood. Love 'em both, or don't but don't diminish the sister for doing her while allowing Larry undiminished space for doing him. And Tiffany Haddish isn't Jennifer Lawrence. To my knowledge, Lawrence isn't and has never been a comedian.

Bad comparison there. More appropriate would be seeing Haddish get similar opportunities to Amy Schumer. Which I believe is plausible and already on its way to happening.

>you described someone who would make white folks raise their
>eyebrows in person, but if said white folks would laugh
>watching your scenario on a screen or on stage at an awards
>ceremony, then you've made my point for me

And you've made my point for me. Soooooo you don't eat fried chicken and watermelon or know any Black folx who do? You don't know any Black folx who sag their pants? You don't know any loud and animated Black folx? Well I know all of that, several times over. And I don't look down on any of that behavior. Yes, some people don't understand behavioral appropriation in different settings (i.e. when not to be loud) but that's not specific to ANY race.

Why would I be ashamed of Black folx or as a Black person for that indiscretion?

If those same White folx laugh at the second guy with the confederate belt asking for moonshine, they've shown equality.

See you're thoughts are rooted in shame and insecurity. It reeks of seeking approval from others.

>where have I been opposed to any of this?

Cool.

>>We need to stop this self hate.
>
>throwing a term like "self-hate" around all willy nilly with
>nothing to back it up doesnt make for productive discourse

I've displayed many examples of why it's self-hate. I just hadn't labeled it. Funny how you took offense to self-hate but didn't call out the many lobs of 'coon' toward Haddish though.

Hmmm...

And lastly, for discussion to prosper, you can't simply be rooted in your stance. There has to be a dive into the other person's stance. I know exactly where you're coming from because when I was younger, I held on to the same insecurities and truth be told, I still hold on to some of them. But I actively try to fight against trying to live my life to be seen 'equal' by imitation. I've grown to be who I am through my background. If I say "ain't" on occasion, people shouldn't think less of me. But I also know, I'll be me as authentic as I can be and if I choose to adjust my behavior for a situation (business event) it won't be disingenuous.

She's in entertainment and her act/who she is has garnered her the success she has to date ("it's a bootyhole"). The act IS her career. She should be her, appropriately applied to every situation.

>>yes I think there's a certain style of black comedy that
>white
>>Hollywood loves where the worst stereotypes of blacks get
>>played up
>
>This is implying Tiffany Haddish is 'the worst stereotype of
>blacks' and she's not. Not even close. This is where your
>whole stance is off-base. She's just not "golly gee sir, how
>are ya?" and more "Yaaasss, girlfriend, heeeeeey."

I didn't imply anything about her. I said what Hollywood tries to turn A-list black comedians into. We have yet to see her career's trajectory but we've seen how they box us in

>>it's very possible to straighten up your act and keep your
>>black integrity intact in America
>
>Again, 'straighten up your act'? What type of BS is that? So
>because she doesn't act the way you see appropriate for mixed
>audiences, NOW her act is a problem? This is rooted in
>respectability politics. Your statement implies that Haddish
>doesn't have black integrity because her act isn't as
>straightened up as you think it should be because she has a
>growing 'white' fan base. Your stance is problematic for
>equality.

You brought up code switching, saying it's worse than anything else. By straightening up your act I meant I dont talk to work colleagues the same way I talk with my homeboys


>>the crux of this post started last August asked "what
>happens
>>when white America makes her routine the new *it* thing?"
>
>Yes, it's her act, started before white America's mass influx
>of interest. It wasn't cultivate FOR white America. They have
>to love her as she is. Some of them will caricature her (and
>let's be real, her act is part caricature) but they'll do it
>for bigoted reasons. That's fine. Some people are bigots.
>That won't change. Tiffany shouldn't unless that's what she
>chooses to grow towards. Not because their eyes are on her
>and it makes some insecure about how authentic they can be at
>all times (i.e. code switching).

I dont have faith that the (white) system will continue to embrace her respectfully without expecting her to be a "ghetto" (in quotes meaning not my thoughts) circus act


>>I dont think I've implied that this should happen
>
>LMAO and you say I'm all over the place. Sooo she should
>clean up her act (which is code for 'white wash' aka making it
>more digestable for bigoted whites) yet you don't think you've
>implied it. Which is it famo? Oh, wait, let me 'clean that
>up'...which is it sir?

Again, you brought up code switching. I think she should express interest in roles with more depth than what she did in Girl's Trip. Great movie, she stole the show, where do we go from here?


>>you define equality as racist America embracing hood
>>authenticity when it's marketable. I define equality as
>>Tiffany Haddish being considered for the same roles as
>>Jennifer Lawrence
>
>I define equality as embracing all forms of culture,
>entertainment, dialogue, etc as valid and respectable. Larry
>the Cable Guy can be a hick, Haddish can be hood. Love 'em
>both, or don't but don't diminish the sister for doing her
>while allowing Larry undiminished space for doing him.

I think equating hicks and "ghetto" people is an inaccurate argument. One person is white and still has a leg up in America's eyes. If you define embracing her as lining her pockets for performing, sure. Getting paid doesn't mean they respect you past being a hot item

And
>Tiffany Haddish isn't Jennifer Lawrence. To my knowledge,
>Lawrence isn't and has never been a comedian

Equality to me is giving her a greater platform as a black actress period, if they truly embrace her like you think they do


>Bad comparison there. More appropriate would be seeing
>Haddish get similar opportunities to Amy Schumer. Which I
>believe is plausible and already on its way to happening.

I dont even see that as a possibility

>And you've made my point for me. Soooooo you don't eat fried
>chicken and watermelon or know any Black folx who do? You
>don't know any Black folx who sag their pants? You don't know
>any loud and animated Black folx? Well I know all of that,
>several times over. And I don't look down on any of that
>behavior. Yes, some people don't understand behavioral
>appropriation in different settings (i.e. when not to be loud)
>but that's not specific to ANY race.

I dont look down on anyone who's a product of their environment. My upbringing in New York was relatively privileged, but Im pretty in touch with my people

>If those same White folx laugh at the second guy with the
>confederate belt asking for moonshine, they've shown
>equality.

You seem to be implying this country has made a lot of progress in regards to race relations. Let me know if I'm wrong

>See you're thoughts are rooted in shame and insecurity. It
>reeks of seeking approval from others.

It's actually the exact opposite. I want Tiffany Haddish to be paid and successful without having to shuck and jive. It hasn't happened yet, but it doesnt seem far off




>>throwing a term like "self-hate" around all willy nilly with
>>nothing to back it up doesnt make for productive discourse
>
>I've displayed many examples of why it's self-hate. I just
>hadn't labeled it. Funny how you took offense to self-hate
>but didn't call out the many lobs of 'coon' toward Haddish
>though.

I'm neither offended by you accusing me of self-hate nor here to shout down anyone else's opinion on her.

you still all over the place

But you can't have it both ways. Or maybe you're not expressing it succinctly enough but:

>I didn't imply anything about her. I said what Hollywood tries
>to turn A-list black comedians into. We have yet to see her
>career's trajectory but we've seen how they box us in

If you say "yes I think there's a certain style of black comedy that white Hollywood loves where the worst stereotypes of blacks get played up" in a discussion about what happens when White America falls in love with Haddish...is this not an implication that you think Haddish is of the ilk of Black comedy style that White Hollywood loves which feeds off the worst stereotypes of Blacks? Or am I missing something. I thought I was connecting the dots.

>You brought up code switching, saying it's worse than anything
>else. By straightening up your act I meant I dont talk to work
>colleagues the same way I talk with my homeboys

Are your work colleagues white (or mostly)? Are your homeboys Black (or mostly)? Psst...that's called 'code switching' fam. Granted some language (swearing, excessive slang) is typically not workplace appropriate but inflection, enunciation aren't part of that equation. And you are forgetting that Haddish is in entertainment where there's less 'corporate' structure to what's said.

Now...how do you feel about Haddish's Ad work?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_vBWKCUMcxQ

She seems 'toned down' there and seems to understand how 'on' she can be in certain environments but her dialogue is still authentically Tiffany. Like "wash yo hands" not "wash your hands".

>I dont have faith that the (white) system will continue to
>embrace her respectfully without expecting her to be a
>"ghetto" (in quotes meaning not my thoughts) circus act

Who cares what the (white) system embraces? If they abandon her because she grows, her core audience shouldn't. But the bigger point here is...that whole sentence you just typed = she needs white acceptance and since she's ghetto, that's what they'll embrace as bigots and won't let her grow.

So, she needs to do better to be respected by them initially so later they don't throw her away OR if she continues to be herself, "ghetto" as you described it, they'll drop her if she changes to be more 'white washed'.

I'm exhausted typing all those hoops you want us to jump through for (bigoted) white acceptance.

>Again, you brought up code switching. I think she should
>express interest in roles with more depth than what she did in
>Girl's Trip. Great movie, she stole the show, where do we go
>from here?

*Clears throat* Homie, she is a comedian! Everything she does initially is going to be about comedy. Ain't nobody clamoring for Kevin Hart in a serious role. I don't want to see serious Schumer. Nobody wanted Eddie Murphy to be serious in Beverly Hills Cop. He was HIM as an officer. It took Chris Tucker 15 yrs to do anything where he wasn't cracking a joke. You know what's after Girls Trip (which grossed $140M on a $27M budget)...Girls Trip 2, a sitcom with Tracy Morgan and Cedric the Entertainer, A netflix animated series, gang of endorsements and these movies:

All Between Us - http://www.imdb.com/title/tt5150228/?ref_=nm_flmg_act_8
Uncle Drew - http://www.imdb.com/title/tt7334528/?ref_=nm_flmg_act_3
The Oath - http://www.imdb.com/title/tt7461200/?ref_=nm_flmg_act_7
The Kitchen - http://www.imdb.com/title/tt5822564/?ref_=nm_flmg_act_6
Limited Partners - http://humormillmag.com/tiffany-haddish-lands-new-film-limited-partners-paramount-will-executive-produce/
Night School - http://www.imdb.com/title/tt6781982/?ref_=nm_flmg_act_2
The List - http://www.imdb.com/title/tt8097306/?ref_=nm_flmg_act_1

^^^This is all 2018 work fam.

>I think equating hicks and "ghetto" people is an inaccurate
>argument. One person is white and still has a leg up in
>America's eyes. If you define embracing her as lining her
>pockets for performing, sure. Getting paid doesn't mean they
>respect you past being a hot item

Who's respect does she need? (Bigoted) White America? hahaha don't hold your breath waiting on that one.

>Equality to me is giving her a greater platform as a black
>actress period, if they truly embrace her like you think they
>do

Look at her movies slate. Mostly comedies with a few dramadies thrown in. She's in her lane and looking to expand from what I see and Hollywood is accommodating...for now.

>>Bad comparison there. More appropriate would be seeing
>>Haddish get similar opportunities to Amy Schumer. Which I
>>believe is plausible and already on its way to happening.
>
>I dont even see that as a possibility

Yet she just got her own film as the lead with "Limited Partners"

>I dont look down on anyone who's a product of their
>environment. My upbringing in New York was relatively
>privileged, but Im pretty in touch with my people

Then don't expect the person who's a product of their environment to clamor for (bigoted) white acceptance.

>You seem to be implying this country has made a lot of
>progress in regards to race relations. Let me know if I'm
>wrong

Nah, I'm saying, we can't be hyper-sensitive to anyone of a different race laughing at a comedian. Mexican-American comedians/people don't get mad if Black people laugh at their jokes...even if we don't always get the context.

I watched Hasan Minhaj’s Comedy Special on netflix and didn't get all the context as I'm not Indian but I laughed at a lot of the things he said because they were just...funny. *Shrug*

>>See you're thoughts are rooted in shame and insecurity. It
>>reeks of seeking approval from others.
>
>It's actually the exact opposite. I want Tiffany Haddish to be
>paid and successful without having to shuck and jive. It
>hasn't happened yet, but it doesnt seem far off

Soooo, you think she's shucking and jiving...again, all over the place. lol So you DO think she's 'ghetto' and you DO look down on her being her in her act and you DO think she needs to tone it down or it'll send the wrong message to (bigoted) white America.

Or am I missing something?

>>>throwing a term like "self-hate" around all willy nilly
>with
>>>nothing to back it up doesnt make for productive discourse
>>
>>I've displayed many examples of why it's self-hate. I just
>>hadn't labeled it. Funny how you took offense to self-hate
>>but didn't call out the many lobs of 'coon' toward Haddish
>>though.
>
>I'm neither offended by you accusing me of self-hate nor here
>to shout down anyone else's opinion on her.

But you made a point to check my vernacular. I'm happy in my skin, you should be too. No one in the world should be able to make you feel less than. And as hard as that might seem at times...that's the truth. Don't buy into the lie.

>we have family members like this so *WE* aren't embarrassed
>until white folk are around. We can have uncle Willy dancing
>at the BBQ all day long but if Uncle Willy was in the lobby at
>our gig looking for us?
>
>White folk see us as entertainment/comic relief in most roles
>but they would never call it cooning or even think of it as
>such. I doubt they even know the word. Black folk who worry
>about the white gaze are quick to call it cooning or fear that
>it looks like cooning cause we care what white folks think.
>
>Cooning is some shit WE label each other with when we see
>white folks watching.
>
>Lil Young Thug or whoever can be on stage in front of 10K
>people and it's just performing... might not be good but it's
>just called a show.
>
>But put him in a room at Apple or Facebook with 10 white execs
>doing the same exact thing and OKP says it's cooning.
>
>
>..and yes, Tiff is the butt of the joke and I think she knows
>this. This is why most of her act is about herself and how
>broke she is or how she is about to turn up wearing the same
>dress.
>
>
>
>
>


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

Niggas giving them alllll the credit.

Amos n Andy never happened in your world
Spike Lee didnt make a whole movie about an epidemic where white audiences consume black entertainment for all of the wrong reasons
Gucci Mane doesnt have white hipster fans
a white dude from Noisey didnt go to a trap house to find out how crack is cooked

none of this ever happened

... considering you're the one that made this post.

Clearly *you* have issues with her brand of comedy and white people "not acting right." Whatever that means. The idea of 'cooning' is purely a black thing and has nothing to do with white people.

Let's not act new.

The idea of
>'cooning' is purely a black thing and has nothing to do with
>white people.

Im loosely defining cooning as a lively comedic act that white Hollywood props up as a hot item

i.e. if JJ "DYNOMITE" Evans or Madea became household names amongst everyone everywhere, we'd have to look closer at why white people were laughing at the loud black kid and the black guy in the dress, if we're to take America's history into account. Some of the rumors about Dave Chappelle quitting his show surround him being uncomfortable with how his work was being received and by who

Tiffany Haddish doesnt embarrass me, but I would be more comfortable seeing her perform in front of us who truly understand her. she's a black woman, not a zoo animal

>The idea of
>>'cooning' is purely a black thing and has nothing to do
>with
>>white people.
>
>Im loosely defining cooning as a lively comedic act that white Hollywood props up as a hot item<

Then you would be defining it incorrectly. You can't just arbitrarily assign such a loaded term to suit your argument. That is 100% *not* what cooning is. Keep those goalposts where you put them, sir. Stepin Fetchit? I'll accept that argument. Tiffany Haddish? Have a fucking seat.

>i.e. if JJ "DYNOMITE" Evans or Madea became household names amongst everyone everywhere, we'd have to look closer at why white people were laughing at the loud black kid and the black guy in the dress<

There is so much to unpack that I'd do it a disservice by trying to address it here. I'll just say... while I might concede JJ aligns more with the Stephin Fechits, the Madea argument is soooooo wrapped up in black masculinity bullshit that I won't entertain it here. ALSO... Madea/Tyler Perry is fully white people certified... so I'm not sure what you think we need to look at/examine. And you keep saying this is not about white people but keep talking about them here.

Again. This is not about white people. And for the record, That is 100% what happened with both JJ if and Madea. we're to take America's history into
>account.

Some of the rumors about Dave Chappelle quitting his
>show surround him being uncomfortable with how his work was
>being received and by who

What does Dave Chappelle leaving his show and feeling uncomfortable with how the white folks in the writers' room reacted to his primarily political/satirical material have to do with this? Huh? So Dave Chappelle was 'cooning' too, now? Learn me, Cleetus.
>
>Tiffany Haddish doesnt embarrass me,

Yeah she does. It's 100% why you made this post. Don't walk it back now.

>but I would be more comfortable seeing her perform in front of us who truly
understand her. she's a black woman, not a zoo animal<

Which. Means. She. Embarrasses. You. WTF? C'mon love. You're legit in here speaking with forked tongue. I myself admit that she makes me uncomfortable sometimes. But I own it, and understand why.

More importantly, though, you're speaking as though she doesn't have agency, here. She is fully and completely present and - for lack of a better description - in on the joke. Not only is she in on the joke, she's the writing the joke and steering it. So what's your beef? She's not hurting anybody. Not shooting up schools, or even Stacey Dash-ing or Omarosa-ing or Ben Carson-ing it. What's your issue?

but we all see it.

It's so fucking weird.

one remark said they (whites) treat her like it's a blackface routine, that was it

you're kee-keeing it up with one of the shittiest people (if not the shittiest) posting here, take that for what it's worth

Keep those goalposts where
>you put them, sir. Stepin Fetchit? I'll accept that argument.
>Tiffany Haddish? Have a fucking seat.

I've repeatedly said my only issue is white people laughing for the wrong reasons



>>i.e. if JJ "DYNOMITE" Evans or Madea became household names
>amongst everyone everywhere, we'd have to look closer at why
>white people were laughing at the loud black kid and the black
>guy in the dress<
>
>There is so much to unpack that I'd do it a disservice by
>trying to address it here. I'll just say... while I might
>concede JJ aligns more with the Stephin Fechits, the Madea
>argument is soooooo wrapped up in black masculinity bullshit
>that I won't entertain it here. ALSO... Madea/Tyler Perry is
>fully white people certified... so I'm not sure what you think
>we need to look at/examine. And you keep saying this is not
>about white people but keep talking about them here.

Tyler Perry's audience is definitely not white. There's a reason his shows come on OWN



>Some of the rumors about Dave Chappelle quitting his
>>show surround him being uncomfortable with how his work was
>>being received and by who
>
>What does Dave Chappelle leaving his show and feeling
>uncomfortable with how the white folks in the writers' room
>reacted to his primarily political/satirical material have to
>do with this? Huh? So Dave Chappelle was 'cooning' too, now?
>Learn me, Cleetus.

no. Dave Chappelle left because he didnt want to cross that line




>>Tiffany Haddish doesnt embarrass me,
>
>Yeah she does. It's 100% why you made this post. Don't walk it
>back now.

good luck telling me how and what I feel

>>but I would be more comfortable seeing her perform in front
>of us who truly
>understand her. she's a black woman, not a zoo animal<
>
>Which. Means. She. Embarrasses. You. WTF? C'mon love. You're
>legit in here speaking with forked tongue. I myself admit that
>she makes me uncomfortable sometimes. But I own it, and
>understand why.

nope, Martin is my favorite show because it was purely designed for black consumption. they cut a fool every week and it hit home. the only thing Im "guilty" of is feeling like white people are ill equipped to understand/humanize who we are, even if someone like Tiffany does a good job representing our full spectrum to them



>More importantly, though, you're speaking as though she
>doesn't have agency, here. She is fully and completely present
>and - for lack of a better description - in on the joke. Not
>only is she in on the joke, she's the writing the joke and
>steering it. So what's your beef? She's not hurting anybody.
>Not shooting up schools, or even Stacey Dash-ing or
>Omarosa-ing or Ben Carson-ing it. What's your issue?

I can go back and check my replies, but I dont think I've expressed or implied an "issue". 5 1/2 months ago I simply asked "what happens then?" and then is now

my initial thoughts at the top of this post said I was okay with her routine

http://www.khodarji.com/riyadh/en/fruits-n-vegetables/fresh-fruits/watermelon.html

Ya'll new 'theres no such thing as a coon'-azz ninjaz, ...Ima needjall ta take a look at a ninja like dis:

https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/778569891641110528/mg-O96xI.jpg&imgrefurl=https://twitter.com/sheriffclarke&h=400&w=400&tbnid=o6OPTaN6pOEqdM:&tbnh=186&tbnw=186&usg=__yCdcjOKsc1NBGLDgBfDgodDT9Qo%3D&vet=10ahUKEwiZjrG-ud7ZAhVN2mMKHeqnD3UQ_B0IpwEwEQ..i&docid=udorMq-L1oXq5M&itg=1&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiZjrG-ud7ZAhVN2mMKHeqnD3UQ_B0IpwEwEQ#h=400&imgdii=bnB2GrM8cdfbgM:&tbnh=186&tbnw=186&vet=10ahUKEwiZjrG-ud7ZAhVN2mMKHeqnD3UQ_B0IpwEwEQ..i&w=400





...and DEN come holla at me about how 'there ain't no such thing as a coon no more' bullshit. Later fa dat.

It doesn’t bother me but since we got white folks in here... it prolly makes them uncomfortable.

Think about DAT

Now think about DIS

————————-> Sheriff Clark is over here

Tiff is over here <—————

They have nothing in common. Nothing at all. If someone asked Tiff about Clarke she would say “who dat is?” and then go in on his ass once she saw a clip.

We comparing this fucker to Tiffany Haddish?!!

https://t.co/oNTNT0SCtF

She’s dead to me

Gotdammit woman

that woman is a fucking comedian and is HERSELF EVERYWHERE SHE GOES. She is allowed to be silly and funny and playful without y'all judging her every step of the way

she's ghetto and Black EVERYWHERE SHE GOES and i truly hope she stays exactly that way because she is fucking PERFECT...fuck y'all

She disrupts white comfort. i LOVE THAT. and don't give two fucks if they are laughing at her and neither does she.

yall only want to see "Black Excellence" on display in a form that gets the respect of whites.

She is BLACK EXCELLENCE. She came from the fucking bottom..was not supposed to make it out of the foster care system and be successful..most don't. but she survived that shit and is sane and isn't ever trying to hurt anyone.

yall corny as fuck i swear

d

Oh.. and

>that woman is a fucking comedian and is HERSELF EVERYWHERE
>SHE GOES. She is allowed to be silly and funny and playful
>without y'all judging her every step of the way
>
>she's ghetto and Black EVERYWHERE SHE GOES and i truly hope
>she stays exactly that way because she is fucking
>PERFECT...fuck y'all
>
>She disrupts white comfort. i LOVE THAT. and don't give two
>fucks if they are laughing at her and neither does she.
>
>yall only want to see "Black Excellence" on display in a form
>that gets the respect of whites.
>
>She is BLACK EXCELLENCE. She came from the fucking bottom..was
>not supposed to make it out of the foster care system and be
>successful..most don't. but she survived that shit and is sane
>and isn't ever trying to hurt anyone.
>
> yall corny as fuck i swear
>
>d

>

Haha... she brought fried chicken, I KNEW IT WUZ TRUE!!!

everyone at the event interpreted the theme in their own way. she gets to do the same thing

just say you don't understand the Met Gala and move on.

d

I dont think you or Tif know what CAMP means (its not parody)..heres a hint..its not about chicken and white discomfort lol



>everyone at the event interpreted the theme in their own way.
>she gets to do the same thing
>
>just say you don't understand the Met Gala and move on.
>
>d

I dont think you or Tif know what CAMP means (its not parody)..heres a hint..its not about chicken and white discomfort lol

>>everyone at the event interpreted the theme in their own
>way.
>>she gets to do the same thing
>>
>>just say you don't understand the Met Gala and move on.
>>
>>d
>

"Get ready....for your blessing....."
"Bury me by my Grand-Grand and when you can come follow me"

don’t make excuses for that bullshit.

Bringing samples and shit

she did that shit.

as did Lupita.

as did so many others.

the shit is supposed to be over the top and not serious.

I just think she is a hack who isn't THAT funny.

Funny to see someone rise, peak and fall w/r/t OKP Opinion all in one post.

Legs went from defender to "dead to me" in the span of one post. LOL.

edit: on second thought: Oh yeah, handing out fried chicken to white people at the Met Gala is definitely coon-ish.




**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

I do think she's intelligent and possibly trapped in an archetype that she's been convinced works best for her career

it's just going to be sad if this is all white people come to want/expect from her

lol she is not trapped.

and her team is telling her "this is what's working for you, stick to that", she could in fact be trapped

She became successful being exactly who she is.

What possible reason does she have to change?

"being taken seriously" is some assimilation, white gaze bullshit that you've clearly wholly bought into

as usual, your conditioning is conditioned.

she IS BLACK EXCELLENCE PERSONIFIED.

y'all need to get the fuck over yourselves.

d

>She became successful being exactly who she is.

money and fame isn't progress to me, respect on top of that is

>What possible reason does she have to change?

>"being taken seriously" is some assimilation, white gaze
>bullshit that you've clearly wholly bought into

there arent many of us who don't get out of bed to answer to white people for money. so respectfully, that's kind of a moot point

>she IS BLACK EXCELLENCE PERSONIFIED.

she's a comedic actress that specializes in hood shtick, never turning it off places her in a position where she's performing for white people restricting her to this one dimensional routine

we don't live in some parallel universe where blackface never happened and white audiences respect our depth by and large

my initial question was "what happens when they love her?" now we're here and the latest thing that's happened is her serving them fried chicken at a posh gala

**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

>**********
>"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then
>they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson
>
>"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

>https://t.co/oNTNT0SCtF

her, cardi b, city girls.... fucking christ. when will the 15 end already.

"Get ready....for your blessing....."
"Bury me by my Grand-Grand and when you can come follow me"

Gotta be something personal lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CFIVgUBVMh0

CIty Girls is a rap group

City Girls - Twerk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QryoOF5jEbc

"Get ready....for your blessing....."
"Bury me by my Grand-Grand and when you can come follow me"

and i'm not really a fan either, i was expecting worse. that's who she is, why should
she change that? she's living, seemingly doing whatever the f*ck she wants. y'all
livin in a white man's world.

>and i'm not really a fan either, i was expecting worse.
>that's who she is, why should
> she change that? she's living, seemingly doing whatever the
>f*ck she wants. y'all
> livin in a white man's world.

Cardi drugging dudes? That’s the man’s fault for trying to holla.

whites eat fried chicken and watermelon too and she tried
to show that.

it was more like "let me do some blackety black shit because that's what these people want from me"

who knows but, that's not quite the way i interpreted it. could have
been worse, she could have been eating it.

This would be entirely different if they caught her on the low pulling out some fried chicken from her purse and eating it on the low on that Russel Westbrook:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHN5GL0iFwc

But this was her performing for the Cameras what she thought the White People would find funny.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

cause I can’t see any Black folk like “yooo, that would kill at the MET”

...inside joke shit.

Not like this.

but it's pretty wild to see anyone caping for this

.
.

"I cannot see how nature could have created itself. Only a supernatural force that is outside of space and time could have done that. ~ Francis Collins

"Whatever you do, do it enthusiastically, as something done for the Lord and not for men..."~ Co

Looks at my life and then looks at yours. Nah. You're Fake News.


.
.

"I cannot see how nature could have created itself. Only a supernatural force that is outside of space and time could have done that. ~ Francis Collins

"Whatever you do, do it enthusiastically, as something done for the Lord and not for men..."~ Co

We have to stop shaming folks for the lives they live.

Now this lil dude stay's capping in my ear about every little things, like a lil brother. I give him a nuggie and you jump in like an old uncle.

But now I'm shaming him? How? I don't know what his life is like, we're just in her playing the dozens.



.
.

"I cannot see how nature could have created itself. Only a supernatural force that is outside of space and time could have done that. ~ Francis Collins

"Whatever you do, do it enthusiastically, as something done for the Lord and not for men..."~ Co

.

Now, if I molly wop this dude with facts, you'd think I was wrong.
.
.

"I cannot see how nature could have created itself. Only a supernatural force that is outside of space and time could have done that. ~ Francis Collins

"Whatever you do, do it enthusiastically, as something done for the Lord and not for men..."~ Co

.
.

"I cannot see how nature could have created itself. Only a supernatural force that is outside of space and time could have done that. ~ Francis Collins

"Whatever you do, do it enthusiastically, as something done for the Lord and not for men..."~ Co

Dude been trying to turn the corner for 20 years.

Namaste my nigga

.

https://shop.mccormick.com/all-sets/lawry-sr-limited-edition-tiffany-haddish-seasoned-salt-2-pack

this might be my favorite randumb-for-no-reason-thing since:

http://www.murrayspomade.com/barbershop/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=53

like this.

That's pretty dope.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

Soap, hair grease, wine coolers

Some Black Ricky Bobby shit

.