Poll question: Best boxer of the last 20 years?

Poll result (34 votes) Floyd (16 votes) Vote B-hop (3 votes) Vote Roy (6 votes) Vote Manny (8 votes) Vote other (1 votes) Vote

Followed closely by Manny

I change it

1 Floyd
2 Bhop
3 manny
4 Roy

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but he did not fight the level of competition Floyd has fought, and certainly
did not have the sustained dominance and body of work that Floyd has produced,
and fell off tragically after his first loss to Tarver.

Great fighter, but Floyd is the only one of his peers to accomplish what he's accomplished.




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Roy did beat and embarrass James Toney and a young BHop...and he moved up in weight to beat a heavyweight

Roy was faster
Roy had more punching power
Roy was just as good a boxer as Floyd at his peak


>but he did not fight the level of competition Floyd has
>fought, and certainly
>did not have the sustained dominance and body of work that
>Floyd has produced,
>and fell off tragically after his first loss to Tarver.

Most of the great fighters do, though, from Joe Lewis, to Ali, to Ray Robinson, Ray Leonard, Holmes, Tyson and the list goes on and on...but when I look at these 2 fighters at their best, I can't say Floyd was a better fighter than Roy

Burt Sugar regarded Roy Jones as one of the top 10 fighters of al-time

I know other fights have said Roy was the most gifted fighter they've ever seen
>
>Great fighter, but Floyd is the only one of his peers to
>accomplish what he's accomplished.

Yes, Floyd is w/o question the more accomplished fighter of the two but that doesn't necessarily mean he was a better fighter
>
>
>
>
>-->

>Roy did beat and embarrass James Toney and a young BHop...and
>he moved up in weight to beat a heavyweight

And he moved up to face the softest heavyweight champ of all time.

Floyd beat prime: Canelo, Hatton, Castillo, Coralles

turned pro one year before BHop

Roy = 1990
BHop = 1989


>>Roy did beat and embarrass James Toney and a young
>BHop...and
>>he moved up in weight to beat a heavyweight
>
>And he moved up to face the softest heavyweight champ of all
>time.

Dude, that is still a heavyweight vs a middleweight...Sugar Ray Robinson lost to what you would call a C-list heavyweight when he tried to become the 1st middleweight to beat a heavyweight...and he lost too because that weight much of a weight difference matters (plus Ray Robinson was extremely fatigued because of the temperature in the ring)

Wasn't like he was going to make his 1st heavyweight appearance against Lennox Lewis lmao

>Floyd beat prime: Canelo, Hatton, Castillo, Coralles

I said an all-time great fighter lol - the only one on this list who qualifies as great is maybe Castillo who many feel beat Floyd in their first fight...Corralles was still *green* when he fought Floyd and so was Canelo...and Hatton was barely a 'good' fighter lol

BHop was 21-0 w/16 KOs when he fought Roy

>Dude, that is still a heavyweight vs a middleweight...Sugar
>Ray Robinson lost to what you would call a C-list heavyweight
>when he tried to become the 1st middleweight to beat a
>heavyweight...and he lost too because that weight much of a
>weight difference matters (plus Ray Robinson was extremely
>fatigued because of the temperature in the ring)


He had fought his previous FIFTEEN FIGHTS at light heavyweight. Going up to face a soft-punching 220 lb Heavyweight is not that big of a deal.

>Wasn't like he was going to make his 1st heavyweight
>appearance against Lennox Lewis lmao
>
>>Floyd beat prime: Canelo, Hatton, Castillo, Coralles
>
>I said an all-time great fighter lol - the only one on this
>list who qualifies as great is maybe Castillo who many feel
>beat Floyd in their first fight...Corralles was still *green*
>when he fought Floyd and so was Canelo...and Hatton was barely
>a 'good' fighter lol

Hatton was an undefeated champ. I'd argue that the "slightly past their prime" dudes Floyd faced are better than the guys Roy beat. Cotto, DLH and Mosley >>> 90% of RJJ's resume.

>
>>Dude, that is still a heavyweight vs a middleweight...Sugar
>>Ray Robinson lost to what you would call a C-list
>heavyweight
>>when he tried to become the 1st middleweight to beat a
>>heavyweight...and he lost too because that weight much of a
>>weight difference matters (plus Ray Robinson was extremely
>>fatigued because of the temperature in the ring)
>
>
>He had fought his previous FIFTEEN FIGHTS at light
>heavyweight. Going up to face a soft-punching 220 lb
>Heavyweight is not that big of a deal.

Dude, do you realize the weight difference between a light HW and a HW (175-200+).,,

And you keep saying it's no big deal then explain why you can count on one hand the fighters who started out as a middleweight and moved up and won a fight against a HW...ppl have said that all the sudden weight gain and rapid weight loss to make weight in the other divisions contributed to Roy's decline
>
>>Wasn't like he was going to make his 1st heavyweight
>>appearance against Lennox Lewis lmao
>>
>>>Floyd beat prime: Canelo, Hatton, Castillo, Coralles
>>
>>I said an all-time great fighter lol - the only one on this
>>list who qualifies as great is maybe Castillo who many feel
>>beat Floyd in their first fight...Corralles was still
>*green*
>>when he fought Floyd and so was Canelo...and Hatton was
>barely
>>a 'good' fighter lol
>
>Hatton was an undefeated champ. I'd argue that the "slightly
>past their prime" dudes Floyd faced are better than the guys
>Roy beat. Cotto, DLH and Mosley >>> 90% of RJJ's resume.

Hatton was always overrated and he never fought outside of England (because they allowed him to use dirty fight tactics that he knew he couldn't get away with in the US) until he fought Floyd and he was never that good to begin with...he was knocked out for crying out loud by a *sparring partner* leading up to his fight w/Pacquiao who knocked him out cold w/one punch

Hell, Hatton was the last fighter Floyd knocked out (cleanly)...so that should tell you just how suspect his chin was

A young undefeated BHop was more of a test for a young Roy Jones than any of those fighters Floyd fought...DLH was 35 yrs old and Floyd only fought him because he was still the "cash cow" of the sport at that time...and Shane was damn near 40 yrs old when he fought Floyd lol...

And to be honest, most ppl were very surprised that Cotto still had something in the tank because before Roach starting training him he looked like a shot fighter stemming from the brutal beating he took from Margarito who had concrete in his gloves...everyone was saying why was he fighting Cotto instead of Manny because no one thought it would be much of a fight at that time
>

You're fixating on the Middleweight thing, but Roy was light heavy for FIFTEEN FIGHTS before stepping up. Michael Spinks stepped up and beat Larry Fucking Holmes. Forgive me if I'm less impressed with RJJ's win over Ruiz.

to light HW because he was planning on fighting at HW all along...but he had to do it gradually...because Roy was only abt 5-11 and that was a lot of weight to pack on his frame even for a light HW and he didn't want to sacrifice his speed and relfexes w/a sudden weight gain

And even when he did fight at HW, he was only abt 195-198...not quite 200

And that eventually took a toll on his body


>You're fixating on the Middleweight thing, but Roy was light
>heavy for FIFTEEN FIGHTS before stepping up. Michael Spinks
>stepped up and beat Larry Fucking Holmes. Forgive me if I'm
>less impressed with RJJ's win over Ruiz.

And Michael Spinks always fought at Light HW...and he was 6-2 and even though he beat an over the hill Larry Holmes who was damn near 40 yrs old, he still was never regarded as a *true* HW

You're not impressed because of the lack of name recognition...but he was at once upon a time the 2x WBA HW champion...

Like I said, that was a solid test for Roy at the time who was fighting for the 1st time at HW

>And to be honest, most ppl were very surprised that Cotto
>still had something in the tank because before Roach starting
>training him he looked like a shot fighter stemming from the
>brutal beating he took from Margarito who had concrete in his
>gloves...everyone was saying why was he fighting Cotto instead
>of Manny because no one thought it would be much of a fight at
>that time
>>
>


Floyd vs. Cotto being propped up as some great fight is pure hindsight bias

great fighters either but he is still regarded as an all-time great HW

And like I said, Floyd's resume isn't that impressive either tbh

to ppl feeling he was done moreso than the fight against Margarito...

Anyhoo, no one expected much from him vs Floyd...I don't think Floyd did either which is probably why he took that fight

>>And to be honest, most ppl were very surprised that Cotto
>>still had something in the tank because before Roach
>starting
>>training him he looked like a shot fighter stemming from the
>>brutal beating he took from Margarito who had concrete in
>his
>>gloves...everyone was saying why was he fighting Cotto
>instead
>>of Manny because no one thought it would be much of a fight
>at
>>that time
>>>
>>
>
>
>Floyd vs. Cotto being propped up as some great fight is pure
>hindsight bias

naturally gifted pugilists to come along in a long while...but that's also why he didn't have the longevity like BHop, for instance, who was much more fundamentally sound than Roy, because Roy relied too much on natural talent and not enough on technique

Floyd is naturally gifted also but he's more of a tactician than most ppl give him credit far...he's also one of the best defensive fighters to come along in the sport (right along wBHop, of course, and James Toney, Sweet Pea, and the greatest defensive fighter of all-time, the great Willie Pep who is rumored to have won a round *w/o* throwing a single punch)

Pacquiao is actually probably last of these choices...

1. Roy
2. Floyd
3. BHop
4. Pac

***
I'm tryna be better off, not better than...

Just playing devil's advocate, because I'd vote Floyd. However, Manny's fights are some of the most entertaining fights to watch...win or lose.

Roy was Floyd's defense with Manny's punching power.

.
.
.
"Today is your day to have a better life -- it's your right."

Floyd has had the better career, and is the 2nd most talented.

GOAT argument because of his lack of comp or some shit

B-Hop's resume is interesting, because no one seems to hold his losses against him.

Historically speaking, I can see why people are reluctant to put Floyd above the likes of Leonard, Hagler and Duran (another fighter whose losses don't seem to count).

.

.

point out that he never beat any of those fighters when they were in their prime

They were either still not experienced enough (Corrales/Canelo) or past their prime (Mosley)


>B-Hop's resume is interesting, because no one seems to hold
>his losses against him.
>
>Historically speaking, I can see why people are reluctant to
>put Floyd above the likes of Leonard, Hagler and Duran
>(another fighter whose losses don't seem to count).

Because boxing aficionados KNOW two Floyd Mayweathers couldn't beat Leoanrd/Hagler/Duran lol - He doesn't have their resume nor do I think he could beat any of those great fighters from the 80s...losses don't mean as much in boxing as it does in other sports - Rocky Marciano is the ONLY heavyweight champion/fighter to retire undefeated, yet NO ONE ever ranks him as thee GOAT...certainly not over fighters like Ali or Joe Louis who both had several losses on their record

Floyd has had the better career, and is the 2nd most talented.

I've probably seen...but Floyd is the best at boxing than any of these guys if that makes sense.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWIqZKhNY90

Roy!!

>Roy!!
>
>

http://cdn.meme.am/instances/500x/57858351.jpg


***
I'm tryna be better off, not better than...

I mean, Floyd going w/out a loss is impressive and is hard to ignore.

But Roy was better and the only reason for anyone to think otherwise is that Roy stuck around too long and tarnished his own legacy. He also took way more risks than Floyd which left him open to losses, etc.

But as a FIGHTER, Roy.

right today though the professional organizations point to Manny

RingMag: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ring_magazine_Fighter_of_the_Year#2000s

Sugar Ray Robinson Award winners from Boxing Writers Association: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sugar_Ray_Robinson_Award
http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/boxing/news/story?id=4875455

obviously if floyd wins May 2nd it has to go to him
according to the voters from the two major orgs it's Manny>Roy>Floyd>Bhop

out of these choices in this poll

Manny was never a really good boxer per se, he just overwhelms you with his non-stop assault and ability to throw punches from the oddest angles

He has terrible footwork, and his defense has always been horrible

And I still contend he was on them PEDS


>right today though the professional organizations point to
>Manny
>
>RingMag:
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ring_magazine_Fighter_of_the_Year#2000s
>
>Sugar Ray Robinson Award winners from Boxing Writers
>Association:
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sugar_Ray_Robinson_Award
>http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/boxing/news/story?id=4875455
>
>obviously if floyd wins May 2nd it has to go to him
>according to the voters from the two major orgs it's
>Manny>Roy>Floyd>Bhop

neither did the voters/writers who elected him
just wanted to bring some non biased non messageboard qualifications to what's going be a subjective discussion
these results are the closest thing that there is to MVP/All star achievements in the sport of boxing
wins and losses and increasingly meaningless belts are less important in these discussions for obvious reasons

of the 2000s it was in 2009...when he was expected of juicing...so it may not be important to you but anybody paying close attention to Pacquiao's career in the last 6-8 yrs it's worth pointing out




>neither did the voters/writers who elected him
>just wanted to bring some non biased non messageboard
>qualifications to what's going be a subjective discussion

How can you say those voters don't have their bias towards certain fighters?...some of these same boxing experts HATE Floyd and think he's bad for the sport...and when it comes to he and Pacquiao, you can't tell me that doesn't factor in their opinions when it comes to polls like fighter of the year...

>these results are the closest thing that there is to MVP/All
>star achievements in the sport of boxing
>wins and losses and increasingly meaningless belts are less
>important in these discussions for obvious reasons

Only if you've never seen these fighters fight then yeah a poll might mean something to you...

manny was never "expected" of using PEDs
that was an indictment given by floyd mayweather and floyd mayweather only
and was quickly settled in their defamation suit

the PED angle is especially weird to bring up now
since Mayweather has hired the trainer he accused of juicing Manny, hired another trainer who was involved in a balco case, and has had fighters fighting under Mayweather promotions and in his personal gym get caught for cheating
smh

and the writers hating mayweather thing is unsubstantiated and not even worth trying to argue against since we don't even know the list of voters much less whether or not they hate mayweather

fighter who is no longer on PEDS when it was asked why Pacquiao wasn't running over fighters in the ring like he was in 2009...

Shane Mosley told Floyd make sure he demands random blood testing in their fight because it was uncharacteristic for a fighter who started out fighting at 112 lbs to move up in weight and knock out much bigger men than him

WTF would I have a bias against Pacquiao, this is my opinion just like I suspect Marquez was on PEDS when he beat Pacquiao...which is why Manny said if they fought for a 5th time that there would have to be random blood testing for the fight lol



>manny was never "expected" of using PEDs
>that was an indictment given by floyd mayweather and floyd
>mayweather only
>and was quickly settled in their defamation suit
>
>the PED angle is especially weird to bring up now
>since Mayweather has hired the trainer he accused of juicing
>Manny, hired another trainer who was involved in a balco case,
>and has had fighters fighting under Mayweather promotions and
>in his personal gym get caught for cheating
>smh

And that too makes Floyd suspect too then...but to act like Manny couldn't have been juicin in a sport where PEDS use is rampant is being willfully naive
>
>and the writers hating mayweather thing is unsubstantiated and
>not even worth trying to argue against since we don't even
>know the list of voters much less whether or not they hate
>mayweather

I've heard many analysts criticize. Floyd for his style of fighting, and how there's little action or risk involves on his part in any of his fights, now contras that w/Pacquiao whose fighting style is something even the most casual boxing fan would enjoy because he brings the fight to his opponents ...

Even if we don't know if they "hate" Floyd which I believe many in the sport do, we do know that most ppl fans/experts prefer Manny's relentless, non-stop style to Floyd's tactical and strategic counter-punching style

That's why Bob Arum (who was promoting/exaggerating of course for his fighter) said Pacquiao was the GOAT because he actually fights and is more entertaining in the ring that anyone else

Shit sounded like a gunshot

http://youtu.be/-CkAZiorNCk

^^^^it was voted KO of the year in 88 by ring magazine

That was definitely a jaw drop moment.

BHop and DLH became business partners

Just saying

>^^^^it was voted KO of the year in 88 by ring magazine

that was such a fucking crushing blow...

Fuck your fort!

______________________________________________________________________________

cscpov.blogspot.com

"There's a fine line between persistence and foolishness..."
-unknown

"To Each His Reach"

It has to be Floyd for sustained dominance. At his peak, I believe Roy was better but the end came abruptly. He was literally the Jordan of his sport. Roy's style was based on his athleticism and as you get older something has to give. For all of the talk regarding him not always fighting the best opposition he fought Toney when they arguably were the best pound for pound fighters in the sport in their prime of their careers. He outclassed Toney. This should not go unnoticed. I still give the edge to Floyd for longevity.

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