http://america.aljazeera.com/opinions/2015/1/mindy-project-racetv.html?utm_content=opinion&utm_campaign=ajam&utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=SocialFlow

Mindy Kaling is not your pioneer
The star of '˜The Mindy Project'™ buys into the racial and class aspirations of the romantic comedy
January 11, 2015 2:00AM ET
by E. Alex Jung @e_alexjung

In October comedian and actress Mindy Kaling sat for an interview for NPR’s “Morning Edition” with Rachel Martin, who asked her how it felt to be “a woman who’s been the first at something,” a “pioneer.” When “The Mindy Project” premiered on Fox in the fall of 2012, Kaling became the first Asian-American woman on broadcast television to star in and run her own show. “Is it still a lonely club?” Martin asked. “I know why people want me to speak about it,” Kaling responded, “But I sort of refuse to be an outsider, even though I know that I very much look like one to a lot of people. And I refuse to view myself in such terms.”

In that sense, she’s right: She’s not a pioneer. For one, what excited many people was that Kaling was, in her own words, “an Indian-American woman who is not pencil thin.” But to call her a trailblazer of representation simply because she is an Indian-American woman conflates her identity with her work. It buys into the very tokenism that plagues conversations about diversity by suggesting that representation is simply a matter of starring on TV.

But what of the work itself? Kaling has chosen to express herself through the lens of romantic comedies from the 1990s. You know, Meg Ryan movies. It’s a genre we’ve come to associate with upwardly mobile white Americans whose aspirations are to find love; its women tend to find belonging by marrying the right man. At first, “The Mindy Project” appeared as though it would be a clever reworking of the genre, but after three and a half seasons, it’s clear that Kaling isn’t interested in subversion. She has reproduced the same story of romance that has already been told countless times — and just made herself the star.

It is no accident that Dr. Mindy Lahiri, the character Kaling plays on the show, dates white, upper-middle-class men — Wall Street bankers, NYU Latin professors, lawyers and Web designers. This recurrence is not a question of fate running into you but the perpetuation of the great lie of romance, which suggests that love and marriage are not somehow informed by class, race and gender conventions. Lahiri’s project of finding Mr. Right, in other words, holds the ultimate promise of assimilation.

Not one of the others

The bulk of criticism of “The Mindy Project” has rightly focused on the optics of diversity. In the show’s run so far, Lahiri has dated 19 white men — an exclusive cohort she herself has joked is a string of “tall white men to short white men.” On Jezebel, Dodai Stewart gently chastised Kaling for her excessive attention to white men, hoping that after the first season, Lahiri could “mix it up and try dating Mexican, Korean, black, Navajo or Moroccan men.” (She didn’t.)

But the problem here is not that Lahiri exclusively dates white men. It’s that there is never any confrontation of race within these relationships. It’s aggressively naive to suggest that none of her tall white boyfriends has ever said that he has a proclivity for Indian women, clumsily attempted to prove his familiarity with Indian culture or dismissed her for her race. Neither does Lahiri show any anxiety, glee or resentment about being the sole Indian woman in a mostly white male environment. There is not even the barest acknowledgment that her desire might be shaped by the expectations of a white male establishment. “The Mindy Project” perpetuates a white power structure by masking how racial fantasies operate on an interpersonal level. Race is ornamental, like a Kate Spade purse.

Additionally, Lahiri’s choices are sadly unremarkable. She has dated men played by Seth Rogen, Seth Meyers and Anders Holm, among others. During a Buzzfeed roundtable, Ayesha Siddiqi called this Kaling’s “nebbish white guy fetish” and said, “What bothers me is these guys don’t have to be/never are anything special. They’re just white and available.” In fact, if Kaling chose to have her character date a hot pinup such as “Captain America” actor Chris Evans — for whom Lahiri says she pines — the show could exaggerate the cartoonish elements of romantic comedy as a way of acknowledging its conceit — as Lena Dunham (arguably) does in a surrealist episode of “Girls” in which her character dates an impossibly suave Patrick Wilson. Instead, Kaling’s vision of romance normalizes her choice of relationships, as though only by doing so can she believe her participation in them.

Kaling, it seems, thinks any serious considerations of race would detract from rather than enrich the rom-com framework.
When race does enter the frame, it is always an imposition. In the latest episode, “Stanford,” Lahiri meets another Indian doctor at a fellowship program, where the only point of commonality she is able to muster is that she knows “how to do a kind of offensive Indian accent.” In the same episode, she ignores another doctor's assumptions that she's Latina. It isn’t dissimilar to Kaling’s experience at a New Yorker after-party where a drunk man mistook her for Nobel Prize laureate Malala Yousafzai. She predictably laughed it off, saying, “That’s the best thing that’s happened all night.” In “The Mindy Project” too, almost any exchange Lahiri has about race appears meant to prove that she is not one of the others but a full-blooded American. As she says to the Indian doctor, she’s “from Boston, baby.”

This is what makes her declarations on the show that she aspires to be blonde even more unsettling. Lahiri’s desire to exclusively date white men is a choice that Kaling makes. But in cloaking that choice as incidental rather than intentional, she perpetuates a greater untruth: that race, especially in the context of interracial dating, would vanish if only people of color stopped talking about it.

A character is born

The most fully realized character on “The Mindy Project” is Danny Castellano, Lahiri’s colleague-turned-boyfriend, played by Chris Messina. A grouchy Italian-American doctor who grew up in a rough part of Staten Island (you know, "Port Dogkill"), he wears reading glasses on a lanyard, makes a good pasta sauce, hates the new pope and loves his ma. He has daddy issues because his father left his family when he was young, and the show has devoted a considerable amount of time to dealing with the father’s specter. We eventually meet Castellano’s dad, his half-sister, his louse of a brother and his overbearing mom (the wonderful Rhea Perlman). Castellano is a great character in part because we know where he comes from. It’s telling that we know more about his family and roots than we do about Lahiri’s.

Her parents, meanwhile, have no presence on the show; they are indistinct shapes that appear in the background of her memory. Her brother Rishi, played by Utkarsh Ambudkar, has appeared on a couple of episodes. But just as quickly as the show establishes that she has a family, Rishi disappears. This is why even though the show is about her, it feels curiously ahistorical. Lahiri appears to be a woman without any family or community; she is a character simply born of the imagined community of lovelorn career women whose identities are defined purely by what they buy.

The implicit question behind “What does it feel like to be the first?” is “What does it feel like to be the only one?” Lahiri is the only doctor of color in the office and the only woman with any significant storyline. And yet we have very little sense of what that feels like; Kaling, it seems, thinks any serious considerations of race would detract from rather than enrich the rom-com framework she has set up for Lahiri. In the interview with Martin, Kaling said, “I think that it’s insidious to be spending more of your time reflecting … in smart ways about your otherness rather than doing the hard work of your job.”

Racism is not just some paranoid fever dream. Kaling, however, would rather have us believe that the best thing to do as a woman of color is to lean into the bounty of American romance with trips to the Empire State Building, VIP-room canoodling and horse-drawn carriages. But that forecloses the breadth of possibilities, both funny and painful, of what it means to be American — and maybe more saliently, what it means to fall in love.

it's not good.

when the series started, i was one of those dudes posting to the IMDB message board about this and getting shouted down by fans, but i kept watching, and she addresses it in the show, so i really don't have any issues with it. it's a show about an indian woman whose type is white guys. i accepted it in season 1 along with the romcom tropes. some episodes are better than others, but it's been continuously funny and enjoyable.

its up there with New Girl, Mod Fam and Blackish.


____

TWITTER : Heinz21st

IG : H_N_Z

>its up there with New Girl, Mod Fam and Blackish.
>
>
>____
>
>TWITTER : Heinz21st
>
>IG : H_N_Z

To write and star I her own show

i even cribbed jokes from an episode to make some really inappropriate porno video references in a 6th grade class project

~~~~
When you are born, you cry, and the world rejoices. Live so that when you die, you rejoice, and the world cries.
~~~~
You cannot hate people for their own good.

that skit was wild racist.

Why can't non-white characters just act like regular characters?
Is it absolutely necessary to play up the fact that she is Indian and acknowledge it at every story point?

Unless the show wants to go that route, okay (see Blackish). But it is perfectly fine to have a non white character that could just as easily be played by a white actor.
New Girl is a good example. Winston and Coach don't need to constantly assert and acknowledge their blackness. They just need to be funny characters.

where she's goes to standford and it was like she was trying too hard to be this hopeless dopey young cute chick and it was cringe-worthy.

like she walked into a lecture full of other practicing doctors late in a super short tight bright pink dress and the professor asks her why she's not sitting and she's like i can't. he's like why. she's like oh because i'm not wearing any panties with this dress.

if she acted like normal person, it'd be okay. but she doesn't act like any doctor i know and the show revolves around stupid boyfriend problems - dod he accidentally put it in ner butt.

i enjoyed the first shows but its getting cringeworthy.

>where she's goes to standford and it was like she was trying
>too hard to be this hopeless dopey young cute chick and it was
>cringe-worthy.
>
>like she walked into a lecture full of other practicing
>doctors late in a super short tight bright pink dress and the
>professor asks her why she's not sitting and she's like i
>can't. he's like why. she's like oh because i'm not wearing
>any panties with this dress.
>
>if she acted like normal person, it'd be okay. but she
>doesn't act like any doctor i know and the show revolves
>around stupid boyfriend problems - dod he accidentally put it
>in ner butt.
>
>i enjoyed the first shows but its getting cringeworthy.

that her character is supposed to be a jackass, ie, like michael scott or kenny powers.

i still havent watched the show
~~~~
When you are born, you cry, and the world rejoices. Live so that when you die, you rejoice, and the world cries.
~~~~
You cannot hate people for their own good.

>Why can't non-white characters just act like regular
>characters?
>Is it absolutely necessary to play up the fact that she is
>Indian and acknowledge it at every story point?


It's pretty weird that the titular character's white boyfriend is more fleshed out than the titular character herself...

I mean regular in the sense that they have normal issues, not necessarily racial issues.
For example, a black character and coworker go to lunch together. A normal issue would be like the waiter getting the order wrong, and then hijinks ensue.
A racial issue would be the waiter assuming he wants the chicken.


I'm basically going off this quote. The author says:

"Lahiri is the only doctor of color in the office and the only woman with any significant storyline. And yet we have very little sense of what that feels like; Kaling, it seems, thinks any serious considerations of race would detract from rather than enrich the rom-com framework she has set up for Lahiri"

Is it absolutely necessary to have considerations of race? Will that make the show better or funnier.

does that make the show better or funnier?


We clearly haven't ignored race in the context of WHO Mindy dates but then race is completely ignored in any meaningful way after?

Check these quotes from the article:
"Lahiri’s desire to exclusively date white men is a choice that Kaling makes. But in cloaking that choice as incidental rather than intentional, she perpetuates a greater untruth: that race, especially in the context of interracial dating, would vanish if only people of color stopped talking about it."

"The most fully realized character on “The Mindy Project” is Danny Castellano, Lahiri’s colleague-turned-boyfriend, played by Chris Messina. A grouchy Italian-American doctor who grew up in a rough part of Staten Island (you know, "Port Dogkill"), he wears reading glasses on a lanyard, makes a good pasta sauce, hates the new pope and loves his ma. He has daddy issues because his father left his family when he was young, and the show has devoted a considerable amount of time to dealing with the father’s specter. We eventually meet Castellano’s dad, his half-sister, his louse of a brother and his overbearing mom (the wonderful Rhea Perlman). Castellano is a great character in part because we know where he comes from. It’s telling that we know more about his family and roots than we do about Lahiri’s."


I don't watch the show, but It probably is a safe bet that the show would be better off if the titular character was more fleshed out than her love interests who are very consciously white guys...

I'm just talking in general terms.

A barrier is really broken when a non-white actor can just play "characters" on a regular basis instead of "ethnic characters"

a character isn't any less "regular" or "normal" because they don't fit comfortably into white standards...


being ethnic doesn't make a character any less "regular"

No shots to dude, but yeah that shit is LOUD naive type
blastin out the subwoofers.

Realize that

>Realize that
It is not a triumphant milestone when a character has to be completely deracialised in order to be considered "regular".

It's amusing how hard people of color have to work to pretend like their color is a non factor. I knew a few indian and asian people like this character. It got tedious walking around that big pink (brown?) elephant in the room. The family denial or avoidance thing is kinda sad. Assimilation is not as painless or as unconcious as some would have you believe.

But does it have to be played out in TV/Movies?
I mean, it can, if that is what the show writers are going for. But it is not necessary.

Look at the controversy with Annie. People were freaking out because Annie is black in the new version.
But you'll notice that Annie's race is absolutely meaningless in the movie. She could be replaced by a white girl and it would be exactly the same.
Would you argue that in order for Annie to be done right, the script would have to change to incorporate the fact that the character is now black?

My favorite sitcom at the moment is New Girl. They have two black guys in the main cast.
Every once in a while they will make an allusion to their race (One ep Schmidt felt that Winston couldn't be his true black self, so they went out to buy crack lol).
But for the most part, they just do dumb, goofy shit like the rest of the cast.

Shit now that I think about it, I think the Jamie Foxx Show could be redone with an all-white cast with almost no script changes and it would run without a hitch.
In the Jamie Foxx Show color was a non factor. Probably other black sitcoms have this feature as well

>
>It's amusing how hard people of color have to work to pretend
>like their color is a non factor. I knew a few indian and
>asian people like this character. It got tedious walking
>around that big pink (brown?) elephant in the room. The family
>denial or avoidance thing is kinda sad. Assimilation is not as
>painless or as unconcious as some would have you believe.
>

It doesn't have to be "Indian-ish". But you have to try very hard for race to NOT come up ever if you do as much dating as she does.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

It suggests that white is the norm and everyone else is some aberration or deviation of white. When in reality white people are something like less than 20% of the worlds population.

criticize mindy in front of some indian women tho, and they react like #BeyHive lol

This nigga is hammering a fucking romantic comedy for being a fucking romantic comedy

What kind of bitter dickhead "intellectual" gets mad at who the fuck a woman dates on a fucking romantic comedy? Even worse, who makes the mistake of confusing the character Mindy Lahiri with the actual person Mindy Kaling? The person has said repeatedly that Lahiri is not supposed to be her stand-in. Once again, we have some smart-dumb motherfucker confusing fiction with reality, and getting mad enough to write some thinkpiece bullshit about it.

Fuck this dude, and anyone who agrees with him.

________________________________________________________________________________
Your typing ain't as "incendiary" as you think it is.

there is plenty of room for comedy with some cultural context involved.
it would just require smarter (and more true-to-life) writing than is apparently offered by the show.

Not sure why she has to bring in the minority of the week to date and fuck in order to prove how "down" she really is.

The real problem here is that this dude has written some condescending bullshit about how who she dates should define her.

And anyone who has watched the show knows how fully realized the character is, and how she's actually not that defined by the men she dates.

Sounds like some sour grapes bullshit to me.

________________________________________________________________________________
Your typing ain't as "incendiary" as you think it is.

2) she's entirely entitled to write whatever type of show she wants
3) but people are entitled to call her out for opting not to paint a more accurate picture of south asian women/women of color in the field of medicine

it's just a rom com
it's just a movie
it's just a _____

if one takes that attitude, then there is no point in thinking critically about anything we watch at all.

She's writing the fucking show she wants to write

The shit ain't gonna change because Mr. Al Jazeera wrote some "thoughtful" shit on how she's "not representing." I can tell you off-break that she clearly doesn't give a flying fuck about anybody's criticism, and good for her.

And I'm "getting hype" because it appears that, unlike most of the niggas cosigning this dumb shit, I actually watch the show. Occasionally.

________________________________________________________________________________
Your typing ain't as "incendiary" as you think it is.

especially as someone who spends the majority of his internet time on okp talking about/critiquing other films/shows.

dude is annoyed by an aspect of the show, and stated his POV (as is his right)
she will probably ignore him (as is her right).

you completely dismissing him as if there is no merit to what he is saying is puzzling to me.
obviously she can write what she wants to write.
it makes me curious about whether you take a similar laissez-fair attitude to all other shows/films.

as an example, you cool with all the white dudes in exodus? after all, that's the film oliver stone wanted to make.

and if you are, that's okay too.

as "constructive criticism." It's no different than when mofos go at Shonda Rhimes for having philandering black women in her shows. "Why they gotta be cheating and fucking white men?"

Really?

But hey, if y'all would rather sit up and read this tripe and nod your heads to it while going "it seems fair"/"valid" - or even worse, deflect by talking about my behavior regarding this topic - then I honestly don't know what else to tell you.

________________________________________________________________________________
Your typing ain't as "incendiary" as you think it is.

Are you seriously saying Rhimes and Kaling are above having their work critiqued? Are you unfamiliar with how art is consumed?

You disagree with someone's critique and that's cool, but you're acting like this guy copy and pasted "Date an Indian guy!" For 5 paragraphs. This isn't new criticism of her work, and it's obvious the man watched the show instead of just making shit up.

"All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players:
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts..." -The Bard

Completely, bro.

________________________________________________________________________________
It takes two.

criticizing people for not being "*****" enough as if they have to be representatives for an entire group is always ridiculous.

He said that her show projects a certain type of racial politics. There is merit to that.

"All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players:
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts..." -The Bard

>2) she's entirely entitled to write whatever type of show she
>wants
>3) but people are entitled to call her out for opting not to
>paint a more accurate picture of south asian women/women of
>color in the field of medicine
>
>it's just a rom com
>it's just a movie
>it's just a _____
>
>if one takes that attitude, then there is no point in thinking
>critically about anything we watch at all.

I could care less if she "won" Danny over every other girl. They just don't fit. I liked the holy preacher because he was weird too and the show wasn't so focused on Danny's life.

I don't believe that this is how she wanted the show to go because in her book she talks A LOT about growing up Indian and the cultural nuances she faced.

I think the show has only lasted this long because it got into some crass Bro-humor and Italian American stereotypes.

>
>I think the show has only lasted this long because it got into
>some crass Bro-humor and Italian American stereotypes.
>


im trying to figure out why i havent gotten to this show
this might be why


~~~~
When you are born, you cry, and the world rejoices. Live so that when you die, you rejoice, and the world cries.
~~~~
You cannot hate people for their own good.

I could care less if she "won" Danny over every other girl. They just don't fit. I liked the holy preacher because he was weird too and the show wasn't so focused on Danny's life.

I don't believe that this is how she wanted the show to go because in her book she talks A LOT about growing up Indian and the cultural nuances she faced.

I think the show has only lasted this long because it got into some crass Bro-humor and Italian American stereotypes.

Kaling clearly has some issues with identity, race, and what it means to be beautiful. Those things bleed into her work, and that's why even though she's a funny writer, her racial politics can be cringe worthy.

I don't like rom coms generally speaking so this show isn't for me anyway. I think the black nurse is cute, but Kaling doesn't know how to write for minorities without her weird world view seeping in so I'm just gonna let her be.


"All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players:
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts..." -The Bard

Like she watched when she was younger. And she's made it, with pure Friends(c)-sitcome esque whitewashing of colored people outside of her like those shows too, LOL.

Maybe she doesn't feel that she's gotta carry the torch and include more cerebral topics. Maybe she thinks her presense is charity (c) Jiggaman.

Now, funny enough, if she did it wade into the waters it would probably be a stronger show because thats alot of comedic material she's leaving on the shelf.

But maybe she doesn't feel like she's gotta represent and make it easier for anyone behind her (or east asian girls watching at home) and who can blame her; thats alot to carry.

She has every right to make a show her way, and the consumer has a right to their opinion.

I only said what I said because I do think she's a funny writer, but my own politics keep me from really loving her work. Same thing with Tarantino.

She doesn't owe any of us anything. But I also don't have to give her a pass when I think her work is problematic.

i think she was aiming for the kind of stuff she grew up consuming
except w/ a brown girl as the center role, which, sadly, is still rare so it is significant

and i think there's a reason her guys are always white. and not necessarily because of her hangups but because of the viewers or the perceived attitudes of the viewers. like they can't relate if the people on the screen don't look like them even if they are experiencing something that resonates with all.

but the show been stupid. i was enjoying it but pairing her w/ danny was something i saw coming a mile away and hoped they wouldn't do.

the writer totally has a point and i understand people defending her because other writers aren't necessarily critiqued in the same way and it's a bit harsh to heap this all on her but she is subject to criticism.

I think her romantic politics and insecurities are evident even in The Office. She has said in interviews before that the show character and her do share romantic preferences.

Now I'm not saying this to be like, "See! It's a pattern. You're all wrong!",

It's just that people don't realize that this critique of her writing isn't just being pulled out of thin air, even if you disagree with it.

Also, I'm concerned because colorism among South Asians makes black people look downright well adjusted and I think Kaling might be, if not exacerbating the problem, at least perpetuating it.

"All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players:
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts..." -The Bard

then taking into account what would draw viewers is important and something taken into consideration as a writer

which is why i mentioned it
im not disagreeing with you necessarily

I think she was aiming for the kind of stuff she grew up and her ideal of what HER life would be like as a rom com.

I don't think she sees it as a rom com with a brown girl at the center of it, I think she sees it as a rom com with HER at the center to it.

She is one of those, happens to be brown types.

I wish she was more attune to issues or race and I think there would be alot to mine from a comedy perspective but that apparently really isn't who she is or her worldview.

I kind of want to be mad at her but I am still a fan of her personally.

She reminds me of one of my favorite cousins who is constantly falling for these super average white boys. What ya going to do?



>i think she was aiming for the kind of stuff she grew up
>consuming
>except w/ a brown girl as the center role, which, sadly, is
>still rare so it is significant
>
>and i think there's a reason her guys are always white. and
>not necessarily because of her hangups but because of the
>viewers or the perceived attitudes of the viewers. like they
>can't relate if the people on the screen don't look like them
>even if they are experiencing something that resonates with
>all.
>
>but the show been stupid. i was enjoying it but pairing her w/
>danny was something i saw coming a mile away and hoped they
>wouldn't do.
>
>the writer totally has a point and i understand people
>defending her because other writers aren't necessarily
>critiqued in the same way and it's a bit harsh to heap this
>all on her but she is subject to criticism.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

It's like my boy who obsesses over white women. It's almost sycophantic.

He's still my boy though. I'd still have his back in a fist fight.

I just think he's got some warped views on race.

I think Kaling is funny as hell. I just think she has some warped views on race.


"All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players:
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts..." -The Bard

with having cultural elements though?
no one is saying it has to be even remotely militant.

she is a super bright and hilarious writer so I was looking forward a rom com from her POV. Even if she mainly dated white guys I thought it would be funny to see her perspective on what it's like for a brown girl to date white guys.

Aside from a few fat jokes though she generally plays though like she is kate hudson.

The one memorable joke that touched was in one scene Chloe Sevigny was harassing her on the street and when the cops approached they automatically assumed Mindy was bothering Chloe.

It was funny, made a point and didn't beat anyone over the head with militancy.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

Issues suggests that she is conflicted or is struggling with something. She seems pretty content with her worldview.

Now I have issues with her worldview but that is a different discussion.

**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

"All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players:
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts..." -The Bard

This (her character) actually fits right in with the narrative floating around the Internet that some Asian-American women mainly date white guys, and don't date Asian-American men.

Just a coincidence that her show is written like that tho, lol.


Edit: Never watched this show, nor do I plan to. Just responding to comments here.

they seem to have a lot of fans and I cant seem to sort it out

Anyone of any race could be jacked in an ad for exercise equipment and energy drinks, but it was mostly white guys and black guys.

On the other hand, all the ads for consumer goods, insurance, clothes, cars, etc. Were run of the mill white guys.

Black guys can be ripped, but they don't take their kids to the park.
Asian dudes can be martial arts experts, but they don't like nice watches.
Latinos can look like a tatted up inmate who can bench press a tank, but they don't like whole foods.

I think that's my biggest problem with representation. Black guys read the New York times too. Shit, sometimes we even discuss it with other black people. The only way a black guy gets into an ad for trader joes is if he has a white girlfriend to go shopping with. Shit is fucking weird.


"All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players:
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts..." -The Bard

and the only people in it are cartoons.

... all I can think is that it must suck to be a writer that has to accurately represent every facet of your racial or gender demographic, lest you incur the wrath of the outrage media/blogosphere.

Hopefully the entertainment world can continue to change to the point at which minority writers/directors/performers won't carry that heightened load and can simply tell the stories they want to tell.

and i don't say that to be insulting, but your seeming inability to appreciate why people may take some umbrage to a creative actively burying his/her cultural identity is telling.

this likely isn't something that affects your reality on a daily basis as it does most other people on this board.

holla back when you've been the only minority female doctor or only minority male lawyer in a work place, then tell us there is nothing humorous to mine from there.

again, mindy can make whatever show she wants, but people are also free to comment on what she is avoiding.

I realized my initial post was too curt and quickly added clarification.

I understand why people take umbrage. I also understand that it's not fair to the creative person responsible for the art. It's a result of the marketplace and the years of a lack of proper demographic representation in TV/movies, which is also not fair.

Being told that authentically writing about your experience is pointless because "general audiences" can't relate by which they mean white men.

I'm a nerd with a useless degree, a hyper-successful brother, overbearing parents, and a tragic love life.

Sounds pretty standard sitcom right? But I'm certain that my life would need to be altered in order for it to become a show because on a day to day basis I'm not around a lot of white people. Other than that one fact my life is pretty typical for the average American, but we both know I'd need to shoehorn in some white people to make it seem less "ethnic" if it were a sitcom.

An Irish-American story is just an American story and no one suggests that Non-Irish Americans will struggle to bridge that cultural gap. The same isn't true for black stories. We have to qualify them as if they're an addendum to the American narrative and not a part of it.


"All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players:
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts..." -The Bard

And I also get that it's not fair.

It may be reality, and some may deem it a necessity-- I can't argue against those people.

But it's also not fair. It is what it is, and what it is is... not fair.

Pretty much the only thing I'm sure everyone can agree on in the post is that it's not fair. The marketplace puts her in an unfair position, the critics put her in an unfair position as a result of the marketplace, and even if she tried to placate everyone and all sides, she'll miss something and be criticized.

It's like the Selma post in PTP, where the one poster thinks the movie is a joke because they included James Reeb's story and not the story of some of the more radical figures involved in the march. It's not enough that Ava DuVernay is a black woman director of a major motion picture, it's not enough that the story was nearly impossible to get to the screen, and it's not enough that the film is brilliantly executed... because something was left out. It's never enough. And it's not fair.

represented and then when folks try to represent them in media people mad at the inaccurate representation.

I hate that Serial, Marco Polo and Django caught heat when the alternative, the projects not get made at all, is far worse.

people
**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

>I hate that Serial, Marco Polo and Django caught heat when the
>alternative, the projects not get made at all, is far worse.

and we had ten years of almost nothing
i'm not trying to go back to it

let it all live
all of it

so far i've got two shonda rhymes shows
a blackish, an empire, power, show about the ball player,
three latino shows
three asian
they are about to give kalinda her own show

keep this rolling folks
yes more
there are more stories out there

will i watch all of it
hell nawl its not all for me
and i'm fine with that
i picked one latino show...and i picked right for me
same for scandal
caught empire doubt i'll keep up
its not for me
i'm fine with that

i need yall to start being fine and let these show live
~~~~
When you are born, you cry, and the world rejoices. Live so that when you die, you rejoice, and the world cries.
~~~~
You cannot hate people for their own good.

>three latino shows

which ones? Jane the Virgin is one for sure, right? We had The Bridge, but it got cancelled

>three asian

I'm clueless

>keep this rolling folks
>yes more
>there are more stories out there

yup, i was about to say this in the Empire post. I'm watching because I was entertained, but also because a show like that should be on TV in 2014.

>
>>three latino shows
>
>which ones? Jane the Virgin is one for sure, right? We had The
>Bridge, but it got cancelled


Devious Maids
And Cristela are the other two

>>three asian

Sullivan and Sons and Fresh off the Boat are the other two

>I'm clueless
>
>>keep this rolling folks
>>yes more
>>there are more stories out there
>
>yup, i was about to say this in the Empire post. I'm watching
>because I was entertained, but also because a show like that
>should be on TV in 2014.



~~~~
When you are born, you cry, and the world rejoices. Live so that when you die, you rejoice, and the world cries.
~~~~
You cannot hate people for their own good.

It's the Last Samurai all over again. You don't need a white guy to tell a story set in Ancient China or Japan. The Yuan Dynasty was interesting enough without the apocryphal bullshit of some Italian trader.

Make a TV show about journey to the west or Odu Nobunaga. I'm positive enough wanna be asian white guys will make up the difference in viewership.


"All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players:
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts..." -The Bard

That's why so many tv shows start with a new character joining the scene so that he can asks all the questions that the audience would ask.

It's kind of why Orange is the New Black needed Piper to begin with.

I doubt I would have checked with a show called..., dang I tried to think of one of the asians character names and couldn't do it, which kind of proves my point.

**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

Because I've seen mafia movies before.

Are you telling me Americans know so little about China that we have to have a white guy explain shit?

If this were Ancient Mali I'd understand. Americans don't know shit about Africa.

But Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon was fucking huge here.

I'll concede that an outsider is helpful but it is far from necessary.


"All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players:
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts..." -The Bard

So much so that reviewers are mad at how it's not "really" about him.

Weird that they still felt the need to use his name and story. It's not like people enjoy Chinese epics.

~~~~
When you are born, you cry, and the world rejoices. Live so that when you die, you rejoice, and the world cries.
~~~~
You cannot hate people for their own good.

...to draw in middle americans scared of it not being about mighty whitey.

BUT the show is really about Genghis Khan and his court of multi-ethnic asians from all the lands he's conquered.

His son's identity issues being raised both Mongol and Chinese.

Yeah there's a lot of sexposition BUT the women are bad ass for the most part and often, when push comes to shove, pull for each other when it's clearly better to do so.

They keep teasing about eventually finding out Hundred Eyes back story. Dude is the shit.

Is it perfect? No. They need to tighten up the writing an pacing but when it's on, ESPECIALLY when Benedict Wong is carrying the show, it's pretty damn good.

and the guys on there aren't particularly hot either.

and Mindy is Hollywood plus-size and is a romantic lead and even has tasteful sex scenes.

she's working politics on the show, just not race politics. she's more focused on challenging body politics.

Like she always came across as the girl Mindy wished she could be.

I didn't watch past episode 3 of season 2 so I might be off.

"All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players:
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts..." -The Bard

She's self absorbed, delusional and aspires, after being a successful doctor, to still be that high school queen.

The show spends half the time making fun of her because of that and her glacial growth into self awareness.

They haven't had her friend since season 1 I think.

I mean, the season premier has her interacting with a struggling Indian woman in college and they DO NOT hit it off because she's so inappropriate and embarrassing.

You saw how her brother hasn't been on since either. And he was dumb funny. I'm positive they got notes from on high about him not being Aziz enough and didn't "work" in the demographic they were going for.

I dunno, but maybe dudes from Genghis Kah-er Marco Polo on Netflix will get a guest episode or something.

My favorite joke before I stopped watching was when she was narrating some romcom trope only to have it pull back and reveal she was talking to a black UPS driver and both of them acknowledge that he has no interest in anything she's said for the past 2 minutes.

I almost want to believe she wrote that joke just for me.

"All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players:
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts..." -The Bard

But, if I remember right, the reception here was that she was making fun of black dudes trying to mack on her as opposed to Lahiri being self absorbed and overselling herself.

the group of girls from season 1 are gone with no explanation

i haven't seen her, at least.

as far as i can tell the show has none of the typical eye candy for the str8 male viewer. i assume that's by design.

>and the guys on there aren't particularly hot either.
>
>and Mindy is Hollywood plus-size and is a romantic lead and
>even has tasteful sex scenes.
>
>she's working politics on the show, just not race politics.
>she's more focused on challenging body politics.

interesting
~~~~
When you are born, you cry, and the world rejoices. Live so that when you die, you rejoice, and the world cries.
~~~~
You cannot hate people for their own good.

Yeah I put it in this post because I didn't want to do a new post about it and they both Indian.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

I tried to get into the show but it wasn't funny to me. However if her show is successful in her eyes then... *shrug*

that happened

Make that nebbish white guy jealous.

Craig T. Robinson did get a few laughs out of that arc.


"All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players:
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts..." -The Bard

> “The Mindy Project” perpetuates a white power structure by masking how >racial fantasies operate on an interpersonal level.
>Race is ornamental, like a Kate Spade purse.

That's at the heart of my issue with the show.

I think it's fascinating that Mindy desires certain White traits and characteristics (as defined and prized by Mindy). She has all but said as much on the show. Not a problem; admire and desire away. My problem? *She* makes Whiteness an issue in the sense of viewing it as a map to judge what/where she *lacks*. Totally intrigued by the ways Mindy frames White folks in super stereotypical ways. It would be kind of offensive except for the fact that the framing is all about how she feels about herself.

And yes, I suppose it's a desirable outlook and orientation for some people of color: to never have to think about or drag around the issue of race, to put race or gender or size in its proper place as not a big deal, to live in a world where identity doesn't matter much, and where one can choose to simply be who one is in the world--

But sounding those wholesome truths in tone deaf ways strikes me as a viewpoint trotted out by the White power structure the Mindy shows masks, denies, and re-frames as "Brown girls just wanna have fun."

Of course Mindy knows she isn't White. So hardy har har let's tell jokes about that and have the characters on the show joke about it. And while she's cracking those jokes, when the implied question of who or what "not-White" may be crops up, Mindy on the show can just be Mindy because she doesn't really identify with all the non-White stuff about herself. And isn't that funny?

It's not funny to me, because I feel like I'm watching a show where not being White has caused the character Mindy a lot of pain. Not being White makes her different and the big point, in part, is that she's not. Not funny to me, either because I see a character who wants to be included, wants to belong. Wants acceptance. But she's chubby and Brown. And it breaks my heart when Mindy gets upset about not being whatever she thinks White is. But she's lucky; she's living in the fantasy world of rom-coms where she will be loved and accepted by Whites. She will feel good enough.

So, I guess. I guess let Mindy be Mindy, from Boston. She seems happy, right? She's just a girl trying to find love. Let her write cute, shallow, rom coms that don't have to be about anything other than what she wants it to be.

>Racism is not just some paranoid fever dream. Kaling, however,
>would rather have us believe that the best thing to do as a
>woman of color is to lean into the bounty of American romance
>with trips to the Empire State Building, VIP-room canoodling
>and horse-drawn carriages. But that forecloses the breadth of
>possibilities, both funny and painful, of what it means to be
>American — and maybe more saliently, what it means to fall
>in love.

I love this insight.

The show offers nothing interesting about the rom-com drama which does lean toward particular conventions, and much of the portrayals of those conventions have been critiqued. The show is status quo, even in it's treatment of stock diversity.

If the Mindy show manages to do anything, it may be showing a "new" way to be White. She's daring to re-define Whiteness: good ol' Dr. Lahiri. Not so daring at all. It's just normal, regular, status-quo, right?

that her desires are ridiculous and ill-formed is kind of a thing within the show, it's not an ideal

www.engadgethd.com - the other stuff i'm looking at

The Dr. Kaling character is written as a vapid, 2nd generation of immigrant family, Republican who is a Trash TV addicted, narcissist. The other characters recognize this and still care about her anyway because not all people who are like this, are all bad. She's a regular idiot girl. She went to med school because she was smart enough to get decent grades and it was expected of her by her family.

That all said, Mindy Kaling the writer constantly calls her character out on her bullshit. In the last episode, she had another student Indian med student , new immigrant call Mindy out on the fact she doesn't speak Hindu and is sick of all the 2nd generation self absorption.

Kaling knows exactly what she's doing, and in my eyes there is nothing wrong with it. It's refreshing.

The depiction of ML is problematic but she's tolerable for an accomplished "cute" Brown chubby chick that so clearly covets the life of "pretty" White
thin girls. I know various non-white women like Lahiri & they're actually ok to be around on ocassion.

Mindy Kaling is kinda insufferable in interviews & soundbites (as are most writers tho, probably maybe??). She ducks criticism of how she portrays Black (women) characters on her show & seems willfully stupid (especially on intersectional questions/critiques). And b/c I'm petty, she went to Dartmouth which speaks for itself LoL.

I defy anyone to find me an episode of 30 Rock where a black woman doesn't play a stripper/ho or is loud and obnoxious.

I'm not counting the Oprah episode, because we all know white women's fascination with Oprah is...unsettling in the least.

And yeah...this is pretty much where I left off with it.

Rom-Com conceits mixed in with a workplace sitcom. It doesn't feel nearly as daring as New Girl in terms of putting their ensembles in interesting situations. I do think the actors are all on point...but yeah, this show just doesn't feel like it's living up to the promise of Kaling's talent. Her airheadedness as a running joke...well it doesn't feel stale, it's just that it seems like a weaker mine for comedy than say Michael Scott's obliviousness.


Also, once again...that black nurse is so goddamn cute it's fucking distracting.


"All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players:
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts..." -The Bard

I too share your frustations when you have good comedic actors/writers & it's like a supposed hilarious reveal is fine ass Tamra's boo RayRay Ron is white & it's like Kaling has to be willfully stupid to think that's funny. "Black guys love me" & "it's no like I'm Precious (in reference to her chubbiness);" she (& her staff) really need to jump in the air, stay there, & write a funny episode w/out the bullshit.

Also, like every love interest minus Schmidt & British doc have been so average-below average. Like sis, go for the finest pink cobra if you gonna do it!! I wish I might executive produce, write & star in my own sitcom + lust after white dudes & write a scene where Seth Rogen or Anders Holm are baes I kiss in the mouth LoL. She's willfully stupid & Dartmouth is a lot responsible, I'm sure of it.

neb·bish
ˈnebiSH/Submit
nounNORTH AMERICANinformal
a person, especially a man, who is regarded as pitifully ineffectual, timid, or submissive.

**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson


"One of the most important things in life is what Judge Learned Hand described as 'that ever-gnawing inner doubt as to whether you're

but yea, cancelled from tv. good!

________________________________________________________________________________
It takes two.

**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson


"One of the most important things in life is what Judge Learned Hand described as 'that ever-gnawing inner doubt as to whether you're

i loved the last half of the last season, but i was ready to accept it if it got canceled as much as i was ready for new episodes because it ended in a way that you can draw your own conclusion without needing to see more. i thought she did a great job on that just in case it was the series finale. having to watch on hulu is inconvenient, but this show is worth it.

her to be.

Tiny Fey's Kimmy Schmidt and Amy Schumer do far more to shake up the status quo.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson


"One of the most important things in life is what Judge Learned Hand described as 'that ever-gnawing inner doubt as to whether you're

i thought she was funny on the office so i watched her new show. that it was an indian american woman starring, producing, and writing her own show was not lost on me, but i didn't expect particularly subversive storylines. i was pleasantly surprised with what i got. her brand of subversiveness is a more subtle takedown from within (the romcom and network sitcom formats). i was shocked (but not offended) sometimes by the subject matter and language used in her show. i also liked a lot of the ideas presented that weren't hammered over the viewers' heads necessarily but offered fresh takes and contrasting views on life situations. mostly i just thought the show was very funny, and i grew to like her character more each season as it became more nuanced.

But i just didn't see it. Maybe with regards to romcom tropes, but she didn't seem to have anything to say about race.

The one time she did I thought she nailed it. There was a scene were chloe sevigny was harassing her on the street and the cops approached them and ask chloe sevigny was MK bothering her. Perfect without beating anyone over the head.

I just wanted more of that.


>i thought she was funny on the office so i watched her new
>show. that it was an indian american woman starring,
>producing, and writing her own show was not lost on me, but i
>didn't expect particularly subversive storylines. i was
>pleasantly surprised with what i got. her brand of
>subversiveness is a more subtle takedown from within (the
>romcom and network sitcom formats). i was shocked (but not
>offended) sometimes by the subject matter and language used in
>her show. i also liked a lot of the ideas presented that
>weren't hammered over the viewers' heads necessarily but
>offered fresh takes and contrasting views on life situations.
>mostly i just thought the show was very funny, and i grew to
>like her character more each season as it became more
>nuanced.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson


"One of the most important things in life is what Judge Learned Hand described as 'that ever-gnawing inner doubt as to whether you're

race was always (and i assume will continue to be) a complicated issue on the show. on the one hand, you have to applaud her for having her own show and it lasting 3 seasons on fox. people like mindy are woefully underrepresented on u.s. network tv especially as lead characters. i don't think she ever really wanted a show "about" race. one of my initial beefs as i said upthread was that the show seemed whitewashed to me in its first season. for being set in NYC there were hardly other people of color. i think she took a lot of steps to correct that and address race more in the show. a lot of the subversion on the show did tie to racial and cultural differences, but a lot of it addressed other issues like body image, growing older, and relationships. i remember thinking back especially in the last dozen episodes that there was a lot of truth expressed that i just didn't hear much elsewhere. i really give her kudos for her writing and performance. since the character was written as an aloof ditz, overly obsessed with pop culture, and with a deep longing to be loved, the joke (written or at least overseen by the real mindy) was usually on her, but i really grew to appreciate how she wore her heart on her sleeve and stayed true to herself while allowing herself to mature. some of the subversion was reflected on her realizing when something is not right even if it's normal and standing up for herself. it's not always about being the loudest voice, and finger pointing/wagging is not always the most effective way to reach people.

"the joke (written or at least overseen by the real mindy) was usually on her."


Like I don't think she intended it, but every interaction had a racial subtext that usually didn't sit well with me.

For example, her going crazy for that other doctor and him being resistant to marriage and her family not approving took on a whole different meaning to me because she was POC. And I don't think they ever addressed that racial element in her dating.



**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson


"One of the most important things in life is what Judge Learned Hand described as 'that ever-gnawing inner doubt as to whether you're

i want to say there was a joke that acknowledged it but can't remember the details. i just remember at some point accepting it. you're right, sometimes there was a probably unintended racial element of her being the person making the most mistakes or is seen, maybe even by herself, as unworthy of the great white man. like i said, i don't think this show was really meant to be about race, and in a way we were challenged to look past her being asian even though it was a plot point or brought up at any given moment.

really i just learned to see her performance in the show as brave because she played the fool but a fool that held a mirror up to our own prejudices and preoccupations. to me that's a lot more interesting and subversive than a character admonishing another or the viewer for being a certain way.

Don't buy into mainstream white women's feminism bruh.

White women in comedy getting all the hype for being potty-mouthed & adequate is not shaking up shit dude & they BEEN getting these checks just more visibly now.

I loathe Mindy Kaling for the most part BUT her being a dark-skinned chubby Indian-American woman that runs her own (albeit terrible imo lol) show is doing more to move beyond the status quo than ANYTHING two white women (Tina & Amy in particular) in comedy are doing.

..Mmisfits and Quickdraw ALONE are worth it....