>I agree with you. I do think people know the difference
>between right and wrong. But it is their own version of
>right and wrong, I do not think there is an oppotunity for
>an all unifying set of codes to emerge in our current
>infrastructure.

I think about this, and it IS logical, but I still believe moral law is universal. I mean, can you name something that you would think of as a "right" moral action that I would think is "wrong"? It's ridiculously difficult when you actually TRY and apply it. The examples, throughout all cultures, are so few and far between that they might as well be disregarded.

I have been thinking about what Lao Tzu said
>about cultures. He said, that cultures and races should not
>mix, because if you can hear the pots and pans of your
>neighbours, that is enough to know that they are there.

You know, coming from my backround (1/2 white, 1/4 cherokee, 1/4 chilean, and my outside family is so visually mixed it's ridiculous), I would have to totally disagree with Tzu. The cultural diversity of my family is what makes me feel the need to understand cultural differences and break them down. If my family was pure white, native, or hispanic, I would probably be less inclined to concern myself with the world around me.

>Would it be possible to solve, many of our problems, if we
>simply seperated from eachother.

This would certainly work, but like pure moral virtue, the achievement is impossible. I mean, we could have pure moral virtue and many of our problems would be solved as well. The continuous truth is that power always oversteps its boundaries, hence your notion of war, namean?

I think morality is a good
>practice if you are able to practice it objectively. I
>can't. It is very difficult for me to filter my moral views
>out of various ideas, and observations. Sometimes, I do not
>want moral or various codes of behaviour to emerge in me
>becuase it creates judgement about myself and the people
>around me.

This is funny. You are pondering morality with your natural morality :) Just read it. I think the whole trick is to keep it extremely simple... when you do something, check your gut: Is it right, or is it wrong? The trick with judgement is "judge the sin, not the sinner".

I suppose, this is one of the problems I found
>with this kind of belief system. It eventually, turns into a
>moral practice of ALL things.

True. It certainly isn't easy, but the attempt is incredibly fulfilling, and much more meaningful than the choice to ignore it.

I do not think morality as a
>practice of virtue is possible. The thought process, can
>apply to any ridiculous notion or view and when you start
>accepting it, into your heart, as i said above..you start
>living in self deception.

But even with this phrasing you admit it is self-deception. To me, that means you have a good understanding of your own morality and know that it is entirely possible to slip away from it. It's the gut thing man... that's where God puts it, in my opinion. The outside influences are there to either a) remind you of it, or b) distract you from it. But when it comes down the choice, I will put all I have in saying you KNOW, truly KNOW, the difference.

This has troubled me a lot as
>well. Basically, how is it possible, to leave morality out
>of everyday life, and only apply it objectively to
>situations that are larger, than the small things our lives
>that can cause us to break down.

It isn't, because we all truly know we should be applying it to all things.

I would say I am a moral
>person, I will not even kiill a bug in my home, i'd rather
>throw it outside and let nature deal with it. The illusion
>that can come up is...if I do kill it, or if I do hurt
>someone, mentally, or emotionally...how do I tell myself,
>that it was okay, when my moral construct tells me it's not.

The first thing every person has to accept is that we are NOT moral people. All fall short of the glory of God. With this notion, judgement of anyone's moral character should be completely thrown out the window. At the same time, this also means that forgiveness should be given to ANY sin that someone may commit against you (which is the one I struggle consistantly with).

As far as sin, you shouldn't tell yourself that sin is okay. It isn't. For me, this is where prayer comes in. That is where my sin is lifted in forgiveness, and my heart is made pure again. The acknowledgement of the sins we commit are almost as important as making the effort not to commit the sin again. You cannot have one without the other.

>Does morality allow for forgiveness? I don't think so. I
>think that is the point where we start to turn to GOD.

On point, but morality does allow for forgiveness when it is God who forgives.

Or
>the idea of GOD. Since, the last time we debated, I have
>found god. But not in the way, that most people believe in
>god. I suppose, my belief can be labeled as
>"rent-a-god"....hehe. So you see, I had to develop GOD, in
>order to compensate for the failed attempts at morality.

It's tough, impossible actually, to know how people "believe" in God. Perhaps, and this is just a thought, you are discovering God rather than developing Him with your realization of failed morality. Keep in mind, at the same time, that a failed morality is not a failure, but an inevitability. It is the attempt at moral virtue that makes us do amazing things for those around us.

I
>can't say that it has helped all that much but it has on a
>small level. That is the dilemna I face everyday. What is
>the right way to live life, and how can I do it, with
>effortless effort with love, and with correct choices, while
>accepting wrong choices and not beating myself over them
>after the fact. Find me a key to unlock that, and I will be
>impressed. Whatever you propose, I will adopt and practice,
>even if it is christianity.

I would suggest prayer. Get on your knees, beside your bed, and find God. Ask for forgiveness for the things you know you've done wrong. As for things you are unsure of, ask for asnwers.

I have lately been fascinated
>with the idea of "sweet jesus"...and that is the only way I
>can identify christians and christianity, or at least, the
>ones that i thoroughly respect like you. I don't think Jesus
>was a moral being. I think he, had both a very powerful evil
>character, and a very powerful virtous character. I think he
>used 1 and the other to fuel himself as a balanced
>indibidual capable of...well...whatever he did, I don't
>know, but people remember him thousands of years after the
>fact, so he must have been able to accomplish something.

First of all, if you allow me to place the notion that Jesus of Nazareth was, in fact, God of Abraham in the flesh, you must know that He couldn't have sinned. This fact alone is why most people remember Him. No one ever saw the man do wrong, no one was more educated on the Scriptures, no one was more compassionate to the poor, uneducated, disabled outcasts of society than Jesus. The man lived amongst them. Jesus owned nothing, but still earned money as a carpenter to give away. Jesus led by example, and his faith was perfect, hence his remarkable feats. It is my belief that Jesus was murdered out of the insufferable guilt of others after witnessing His perfect, unselfish actions. He came to show us what is was to live this life.

What you view as "evil" is what I would perceive as His incredibly passionate love for doing right. There is the notion of "sweet Jesus". However, Jesus was not soft spoken, but a fiery revolutionary. I believe Che is the one who said the biggest tool for a revolution should be love. Dr. King was remarkably Christ-like in his fiery love... there are countless examples.

Also, as far as Christianity is concerned, I am a Christian, but perhaps not in the pop culture sense of the word. A lot of right wingers are considered conservatives, but I believe it is the left wingers who follow the ideals of Judeo-Christian ethic more closely. We are the conservatives. When the Bible is followed closely, this life has meaning. I have studied other religions, thoroughly, and I find either empty answers or, with religions such as Islam, false prophesy (antisemetism). There is God, and there is void, and God is at the heart of our moral being. I cannot physically rationalize this, but I can feel it. I know it. I'll discuss this with you as long as you like, because nothing else in this life is as important.

Peace,