>>Well, then I guess I've been dealt a bum hand. But that's
>>what I was born with, and though it isn't much, I yam what I
>>yam and I'm sticking with it.
>>
>>If I were God, I would have given us something better than
>>human rationality (like, maybe, whatever God has).
>
>lol... that was funny.

We aim to please!

>however, is it really rational to give a human
>characteristic to GOD? I mean, it's GOD... I believe God
>rests eternally outside the universe, so there is no
>rationalizing Him while we are finite . . .

Wow, we're in complete agreement on that first sentence! But - if He/She/It/They are beyond description, comprehension, etc. then I also don't comprehend why He/She/It/They would be overly concerned with, for example, what the two guys who live down the street are up to right now.

>>Oh man, that's just screwy. Wouldn't it be simpler (and
>>less painful) just to put all of us in Heaven to begin with?
>
>This would do away with morality and free will.

I don't really have a problem with that. Why should we have to "earn" our way in to Heaven? (Actually I think the Protestant work ethic is tied into this - in a more general sense, that one must suffer before receiving a reward.) Why couldn't we just be there to begin with?

(We could get into a whole thing about the meaning of "free will" - Doesn't free will mean I can teleport myself to Hawaii, if I will it? This could just be a limitation of language, but hey, that's what we've got available to work with here.)

(And then there's the whole thing, without suffering, could we have Heaven? Wouldn't you have to know suffering to know what Paradise would be like without suffering? Well hey, it's God, He/She/It/They makes the rules, I say put us all in Heaven from the get-go.)

>> (And please don't tell me we can simply blame this on Eve
>>eating an apple.) And along the same lines, should we stop
>>trying to alleviate poverty, because to do so might delay
>>billions of souls from reaching Heaven that much faster?
>
>no. morality doesn't exist without heaven or hell, IMO.
>otherwise it is useless.

Perhaps an interesting side note - I've read various descriptions of Judaism that say it does not really include a belief in hell. Sin, yes, but not hell. Not sure where/when the punishment would come in.

>i dig your humor. hope i communicate rationally. peace,

Cool!

--I'm Joe Castleman

Have , will