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Topic subjectEmbracing and condoning...
Topic URLhttp://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=22&topic_id=2753&mesg_id=2804
2804, Embracing and condoning...
Posted by Nettrice, Sat Dec-13-03 04:07 AM
...are different things, sort of like "if you are not striving for a solution...". Being aware and acting on principles is something every individual and group can choose to do. Let's say that 20 European countries did not support imperialism (even 44) but, yet, it still spreads to take over the globe and cause all kinds of suffering for natives and folks of color. What to do? Close ranks, close your eyes and act as if it has nothing to do with you? Sounds like post-WWI Germany to me.

I don't buy it. Global domination of European OR Western culture happened and people accepted it all over Europe and elsewhere.

In high school I was concerned with origins but now I am in the present: What can I do in the present? That means not just looking backwards or carrying other people's baggage. It's my own manifest destiny, of sorts.

>The concept of the great chain was used improperly first and
>foremost for the feudal system, and its SIMILAR (not the
>concept itself) ideologies were used to justify racism.

This concept, regardless of its origins, spread throughout the world. It's this fact that matters to me and if you think that this system is not linked to caplitalism, racism, etc. then you may not see the flow of the universe like I do. To me, it's all connected.

>It was the expansion of the concept
>(similarly to American slave owners using the Bible to
>justify their actions) that leads to such an illusion.

Slavery, specifically chattel slavery, was justified by many institutions and it was supported by the system itself. You have to view oneself as over all others to justify the domination and destruction of others. Conceptually, this is a idea/illusion that spread from Europe, throughout the world. It led to the Middle Passage that stands out in my mind (as well as the Trail of Tears). We are talking about mass enslavement (or destruction) of a people, not individuals...based on the color of their skin. Whole groups or tribes of white people were never enslaved, taking from their families, stripped of their language, their culture, religion, etc.

>Civilizations conquered other
>civilizations all the time, each one trying to implement
>their own imperialist standards.

Sometime ago tribes were surviving and then, suddenly, civilizations were conquering others? When did this happen and where? Why? It's start with an idea, a seed that is planted and grows. In order for the growth to spread it has to have a foundation and lots of nurturing (like hundreds of years). In order to remove the growth you have to kill the root(s). Where those roots are is open for interpretation but necessary if discussing alternatives.

>It just so happens that
>western whites found the right formula, bastardizing a
>number of fixations, including religion, patrioticism, and

But this is not arbitrary, some unplanned happening that took place over hundreds of years. Again, a seed was planted...took root and spread.