If some of you are determined to correct BET's broadcast schedule then there are several things in and among yourself that you will need to organzie.

It is not enough to be discontented with BET and proceed with anti BET rhetoric. If you want this company to change you must admit to yourself first that you are willing to appreciate the role that BET plays in the advancement of our people and you are willing to support the entity not as something that should comply to your particular demands but for the sake of communicating and sharing information throughout all our communities.

As such ask yourself a few questions and allow someone who is reallys erious about these issues to calculate that information.

I understand that all of you are passionate about this- but passion doesnt make for good ammunition.

ask yourself who you are- and why should BET care- if the answer is cuz Im Black; then consider the fact that BET offers plenty of Black people jobs and airtime to the delight and entertainment of even more Blacks- and you still dont appreciate them no matter how Black they may be. You may hope for BET to answer to your Blackness but seeing as you're not very appreciate of other portrayals of Blackness you're dimishing your own argument.

The solution is this- assess what it is that each of you are looking for in BET and what it is that you are already getting.

Simple questions.

How much BET do you watch- daily, weekly, etc.
When do you typically watch BET?
What do you watch on BET?
What are you looking for on BET?
Do you watch the commercials on BET?
How long have you been watching BET?
What is your favorite BET show and why?
What is your least favorite BET show?
What other television media do you watch regularly?

finally- name 10 BET shows.

give it a try please- the road to change doesnt always have to start off with opposing the status quo.

K

A Week at BET (Courtesy of BET.com). I want evryone to look CLOSELY and tell me if there is anything at all wrong with this picture. I'll be back later with a quiz.... (Note: When showing a program more than once per day, often one of the shows will be a repeat of an earlier broadcast or both shows will be the same episode. Rarely, if ever, will two original episodes air)

NETWORK PROGRAMMING SCHEDULE (5.15.00 to 5.21.00)

MONDAY through THURSDAY
9:00am-10:00am ALL
10:00am-12:00pm Morning Moves (Music Videos)
12:00pm-1:00pm BET Videolink
1:00pm-2:00pm
2:00pm-4:00pm JamZone Music Videos
4:00pm-5:00pm ALL
5:00pm-7:00pm Rap City
7:00pm-8:00pm Hits from the Streets
8:00pm-8:30pm Sparks
8:30pm-9:00pm AMEN
10:00pm-11:00pm Live From LA
11:00pm-12:00am BET Tonight
12:00am-1:00am Midnight Love
1:00-2:00 Comic View
2:00am-3:00am Live From LA
3:00am-4:00am BET on Jazz

FRIDAY
9:00am-10:00am ALL
10:00am-12:00pm Morning Moves (Music Videos)
12:00pm-1:00pm BET Videolink
1:00pm-2:00pm Hits from the Streets
2:00pm-4:00pm JamZone Music Videos
4:00pm-5:00pm ALL
5:00pm-7:00pm Rap City
7:00pm-8:00pm Hits from the Streets
8:00pm-8:30pm Good News
8:30pm-9:00pm AMEN
10:00pm-12:00am BET MOVIE
12:00am-1:00am Midnight Love
1:00-2:00 Comic View
2:00am-3:00am Live From LA
3:00am-4:00am Latin Beat

SATURDAY
9:00am-11:00am JamZone Music Videos
11:00am-12:00pm ALL Top 10 (Music Videos)
12:00pm-1:00pm Hits from the Streets
1:00pm-2:00pm Teen Summit
2:00pm-2:30pm Madd Sports
2:30pm-3:00pm Heat and Soul
3:00pm-3:30pm Lift Every Voice
3:30pm -4:00pm INFOMERCIAL
4:00pm-5:00pm BET Videolink Rerun
5:00pm - 6:00pm Teen Summit
6:00pm-7:00pm Rap City
7:00pm-7:30pm Madd Sports
7:30pm-8:00pm Sparks
8:00pm-9:00pm Out the Box
9:00-10:00 Comic View
10:00pm-11:00am Live From LA
11:00pm-12:00pm BET Tonight
12:00am-1:00am ----NOT SCHEDULED----
1:00-2:00 Best ofComic View
2:00am-3:00am Rap City Top 10
3:00am-4:00am Future Wave (Govt. Encryption)

SUNDAY
9:00am-10:00am Bobby Jones Gospel
10:00am-10:30am Video Gospel
10:30am-11:00am Lead Story
11:00am-11:30am Heart and Soul
11:30am-12:00pm Madd Sports
12:00pm-12:30pm Fannie Maye Home Ownership
12:30pm-9:00pm INFOMERCIALS
9:00pm-9:30pm Lead Story
9:30pm-10:30pm Docugroove
10:30pm-4:00am INFOMERCIALS

------QUOTE STARTS HERE------
Help BooDaah STAY the Moderator for the OkayActivism Board....

Fill Angiee's Mailbox full of requests for me (HAHA she'll LOOOOVE THAT!!!)

How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

Other BET stations and holdings for those of you who seem to think BET is "struggling"

BET on Jazz: a Premuim 24 Hour a Day Jazz Channel

BET Action Pay Per View: Sporting Events (highlights for this month include: wrestling events, softcore porn, grade C (in terms of their quality) movies, and such stimulating fare as: Luke's Freakfest 2000)

BET International: International Cable Feeds

BET Movies/Stars: A joint venture with Encore Media (ownver of Starts, Encore and other premium movie cable channels) which shows blaxploitation flix and low budget black movies. In order to get it your cable provider has to offer the Encore Media Package (includes approx 4 other channels for a nice hefty monthly fee)

Emerge and Heart and Soul Magazines

Arabesque Books: Black Romance Novels

BET Restaurants (BET on Jazz SupperClub, Bet Soundstage and Club, Tres Jazz)


More to Come....




------QUOTE STARTS HERE------
Help BooDaah STAY the Moderator for the OkayActivism Board....

Fill Angiee's Mailbox full of requests for me (HAHA she'll LOOOOVE THAT!!!)

How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

You cant qualify that BET is not struggling with a list of its holdings you have to represent each of those hodlings earnings and BET's subsequent costs of operations.

If BET was not struggling then they wouldnt need to show infomercials during the day and there wouldnt be one moment where BET programming wasnt shown. That is not the case. Do you think those BET movies are low budget just cuz they dont feel like spending money?

K

Check this article about #67 company of the Top 100 Public Companys to see just how broke BET Holding is (poor guys)

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/business/longterm/post200/bfty067.htm


More to come....
------QUOTE STARTS HERE------
Help BooDaah STAY the Moderator for the OkayActivism Board....

Fill Angiee's Mailbox full of requests for me (HAHA she'll LOOOOVE THAT!!!)

How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

First these statistics only go up to 96 and still only site revenues of $132,000 nothing about expense of operation or budget.

How does this compare to holding companies for the likes of Viacom and Disney? Since Mtv is BET's competetion the comparison of both their revnues and the revenues of their holding companies will be an additional measure of their struggle.

Im willing to be Viacom has almost twice as much in revenues- that means BET is struggling.

K

that's 132,000,000. you can read better than that. i know you're smarter than to think that the 67th most profitable country at the time of that survey was only bringing in revenues of 132,000. as far as those being 'old' statistics, those are the most recent I had on hand. keep trying though.

------QUOTE STARTS HERE------
Help BooDaah STAY the Moderator for the OkayActivism Board....

Fill Angiee's Mailbox full of requests for me (HAHA she'll LOOOOVE THAT!!!)

How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

How much do its competitors make?

BET is a privately owned company (no longer traded publicly sice 1999 according to yahoo.com). Any company with revenues of 132 million (ok that was 4 years ago, but believe me their revenues haven't fallen since then with the advent of all the new business ventures including bet.com wich is a joint venture with microsoft.com) just ain't broke enough to only give 10 houses of quality shows a week. period. look at their programming. I DO, and I can tell you they ain't spendding a lot of money on the shows they present. LOOK at them.

you know so much, YOU tell me how much their competitors make. and then explain what that has to do with my points. 132million in one year ain'tnothing to sneee at I don't care WHO your competitors are. #67 out of all the companies in the US isn't anything to sneeze at either. you're one for being a stickler, and you started with how much do you watch, they have plenty of good shows. i'm saying I watch enough to say that's bull. you say 10 hours (which IF YOU WATCH) you know isn't really 10 hours cause they run the same episodes into the ground, is cool. I say, not compared to their entire scheddule. You say name 10 -- i showed you the whole damn schedula and showed you go jacked up it is. if what they present is cool for you then cool. just understnd that some of us would like more (or at least something different).

------QUOTE STARTS HERE------
Help BooDaah STAY the Moderator for the OkayActivism Board....

Fill Angiee's Mailbox full of requests for me (HAHA she'll LOOOOVE THAT!!!)

How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

My point is not that they cant show more quality shows- my point is the viewers give them no reason to put those shows on. The viewers that actually watch BET and write in- send in either favorable letters are letters that are so unreasonably demeaning that thre's no way to answer their needs.

As for their competetitors. If i have a business that makes 10 million but my competitor makes 50 million- that means Im struggling. Your point was that BET aint struggling- but thats only of you allow thier revenues to be viewed in and of themselves- but they dont exist in and of themselves; they must compete with people who make more money and can subsequently spend more money- you act as if competition doesnt matter- thats nonsense.

The 10 hours of good programming exists as an example of what BET has to offer- my point is, if you're not watching that ten hours- THATS WHY YOU"RE COMPLAINING. But before you can actually make something happen youll have to answer to your own complaints.

If you want to see more positive programming then why arent you watching it. let the people speak- let em tell quite clearly that all their watching is Rap City and Comic View and then you justify that.

Why else would someone persist to demand that BET be taken off the air- i dont even think you can support that idea- cuz its preposterous.

The point you're arguing is that we should change BET before we even validate our own complaints and thats just not practical.

Answer the question.

Are the people that want positive programming watching the 10 hours that are available currently?

You act as if its not much (and ill tell you again that that 10 hours represents a concise and daily fucntion of positive BET viewing- no reruns)- but if its not much then why arent people doing it?

K

Even being stingy I still count 10 hours of "quality" programming

weekday nights at 11- BET Tonight
Saturdays at 1 - teen summit
Saturdays at 8 - Out the Box
Sunday at 9 - Gospel
Sunday 10-10:30 Video Gospel
10:30 - 11 Lead Story
11- 11:30 Heart and Soul
1130- 12 Madd Sports

is there anything wrong with that picture? Positive programming every day of the week- and a big chunk of it on Sunday.

K

Monday through thursday:
18 hours of programming per day
15 hours of music related shows (some reruns)
1 hour of old sitcoms
1 hour of BET Tonight (have you watched by the way, i do pretty much everyday, and hard as he tries Tavis rarely gets much good dialog going because of commercial interruptions)
1 hour of retread comedy

Friday
18 hours of programming total
14 music related (some repeats)
2 hours for a grade b or worse movie
1 hour of old sitcoms
1 hour of retread comedy

Saturday
17 hours accounted for (1 not)
9.5 music relatred
2 hours of teen shows (one which is a repeat)
1 of sports (.5 repeated)
.5 health
.5 financial related
.5 retread sitcom
2 comedy (BOTH reruns from earlier in the week)
1 hour of tavis (at 11pm)
1 hour of miscellaneous (at 3am)

Sunday
18 hours scheduled
2.5 music related (1.5 gospel, 1 music news)
1 of Lead Story (.5 is a rerun, and again how much real news can you fit in .5 of an hour?)
.5 health (rerun from Saturday)
.5 sports (rerun from Sat)
.5 home buying related (in the middle of Sunday when quite a few of us aren't quite home from chuch yet)
14 hours of infomercials

Even using your numbers we have 10 hours out of 126 per week of "quality programming" (using your words) and that's cool with you huh? interesting.
Still more to come....

------QUOTE STARTS HERE------
Help BooDaah STAY the Moderator for the OkayActivism Board....

Fill Angiee's Mailbox full of requests for me (HAHA she'll LOOOOVE THAT!!!)

How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

and of that 10 hours, how much is reruns?

------QUOTE STARTS HERE------
Help BooDaah STAY the Moderator for the OkayActivism Board....

Fill Angiee's Mailbox full of requests for me (HAHA she'll LOOOOVE THAT!!!)

How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

You providing a broad spectrum of viewing opportunities available and diminishing the importance of Quality programming all together-

are you suggesting I should watch 126 hours of televesion per week? Are you suggesting 10 hours is not enough (none of it is reruns i counted only one instance of each show and I even surmised that count from eliminating all video shows which is not fair at all).

10 hours Boodah- thats 10 whole hours. All Im saying is that if the people behind all this discontent arent watching that 10 hours then they have no business asking for more. They quite obviously cant support what theyve got- why on earth would BET make more.

The problem with your schedule posturing is that it belabors my point. Is BET programming filled with videos cuz everybody is calling in asking them for positive programming? Is Lead Story in an 11:00 time slot because the people who actually watch BET tonight want to stay up a little later than everybody else? Bullshit.

BET is the way it is- cuz the people that want more out of BET customarily dont support the positivity thats already there. I can watch BET Tonight all I want- but if peers dont bother watching with me and writing their own letters then my suggestions will be swallowed up.

BET tonight is in a fucked up time slot cuz nobody's got its back- certainly not enough to move it to a time slot where a great number of people already enjoy the programming that is already there.

K

I'm only going to continue, because I know how much you like to be the one to get the final word in so you can have it.

>are you suggesting I should watch
>126 hours of televesion per
>week?

try again. i never said that. red herring koala.

>Are you suggesting 10
>hours is not enough (none
>of it is reruns i
>counted only one instance of
>each show and I even
>surmised that count from eliminating
>all video shows which is
>not fair at all).

get the hell outta here. watch BET and tell me they don't run repeats. tell me they don't show THE SAME DAMN THING several times a day/week. tell me how oftn on tavis or lead story you see that little "previously recorded" message. tell me they don't show the same lead story twice on sunday.

>10 hours Boodah- thats 10 whole
>hours.

No it's not, because a lot of it is RERUNS. And even if it were 10 hours of new stuff a week, they have more hours of infomercials on jusy one day (sunday) than they do of what you call quality shows all week. again, if that's cool with you, then may God bless you and send you a juice-o-matic for your loyalty.

>All Im saying is
>that if the people behind
>all this discontent arent watching
>that 10 hours then they
>have no business asking for
>more.

Says who? YOU? Who exactly are you to tell folk what they "have no business" doing?

>They quite obviously cant
>support what theyve got- why
>on earth would BET make
>more.

Doesn't 132 million sound like support? I don't care if I supply only 1 penny to that, I think my 1 penny should count for something.

>The problem with your schedule posturing
>is that it belabors my
>point.

No it doesn't. It shows straight up what they show. by your estimate 10 hours out of 132. belabor my a$$. it proves that you're talking about of your behind.


>Is BET programming filled
>with videos cuz everybody is
>calling in asking them for
>positive programming? Is Lead Story
>in an 11:00 time slot
>because the people who actually
>watch BET tonight want to
>stay up a little later
>than everybody else? Bullshit.

If all it's about is them making $$ then don't fake it like you have "our" best interests at heart. You wanna know why they show videos and rereuns so much? Cause it's cheap. C'mon Koala, game recognize game. They gotta pay Tavis. If they show him at the crack of dawn he can't demand more. You ain't stupid. The cast of friends demand so much (and get it) because their show generates revenue. Same thing with them damn videos 18-24.

>BET is the way it is-
>cuz the people that want
>more out of BET customarily
>dont support the positivity thats
>already there.

Bull. BET is the way it is because the powers that be there know how to make $$$. I don't begrudge them that, thy have a right to eat too. But if we as a people are going to support them, do we really have to take WHATEVER they choose to offer.
This may seem like a crab in a bucket, but you're not realizzing that I have no problem with Black success as long as it doesn't come at my expense. If folk have beef. Then dammit let them express themselves however they have to.

>I can watch
>BET Tonight all I want-
>but if peers dont bother
>watching with me and writing
>their own letters then my
>suggestions will be swallowed up.

Again you're making an assumption about what somebody else is doing. You really don't know WHAT these folk are doing.

>BET tonight is in a fucked
>up time slot cuz nobody's
>got its back-

Says who? Did YOU schedule it there? Do you know it's ratings? Again you're acting like you know when you really don't. Koala I really do respect your opinions, but you're not coming correct this time player.

>certainly not
>enough to move it to
>a time slot where a
>great number of people already
>enjoy the programming that is
>already there.

see previous comment.
------QUOTE STARTS HERE------
Help BooDaah STAY the Moderator for the OkayActivism Board....

Fill Angiee's Mailbox full of requests for me (HAHA she'll LOOOOVE THAT!!!)

How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

I provided a survey to get these so-called activists to organize their ideas and their roles in an illbegotten boycott.

You came with subsequent disputes and Ive answered them summarily- you still havent answered the survey questions- but Im the one who's blowing smoke!?

In the interest of being on topic here are my answers.....

How much BET do you watch- daily, weekly, etc.

When do you typically watch BET?
Mon-Sun while I'm at the computer I flip back and forth.

Q:What do you watch on BET?
A:Tavis almost everyday its on (except when it a RERUN that I've seen already the same applies for the other programs also), Lead Story, Teen Summit, Madd Sports occasionally, I'll flip past Live from LA till I get sick of it, I watch an occasional video (but I don't like they way they cut them so I prefer the BOX for videos), for jokes I might even watch the movie. I also subscribed to the Encore channels (which I rarely watch) so I could get BET Movies. Sadly the quality of programmin there is lacking also. Meaning. Out of over a hundred years of Black filmmaking I fid their choices to be a bit anemic in terms of quality and diversity. I love "Let's Do It Again" but I don't need to see it offered several times a week. I MISS seeing: Black College Spors, historical documentaries (which never really existed on this network), and Donnie Simpson who was the best host they ever had.

Q: What are you looking for on BET?
A:Entertainment that refelcts the diaspora. News, sports, and historical shows that I can't get on "Mainstream" channels, original programming which gives opportunities to Black people who cannot recieve such opporutinities from mainstream media outlets (writers, directors, actors, etc). I got more but those would be a decent start.

Q:Do you watch the commercials on BET?
A: Yup. "Coon Commercials" crack me up. You know the ones I'm talking about. Those commercials you only see on other networks during Black History month, a Bill Cosby/WB/Fox black show or during sould train. THAT IS A WHOLE OTHER SUBJECT I HAVE BEEFS WITH.

Q:How long have you been watching BET?
A:1984, I rememmber the first thing I ever saw being Rebbie Jackson's "Centipede" video.

Q:What is your favorite BET show and why?
A:Tavis probably (closely followed by Lead Story) because they try really hard to provide an alternative to the rest of the programming. and because even though they have very little time, they do bring up what i feel are newsworthy issues.

Q:What is your least favorite BET show?
A:ALL closely followed by Live from LA. T

Q: What other television media do you watch regularly?
A:Too many to list. I pay for cable so I watch it. I'm also an avid reader, lover of various musical styles, and a learnign junky.

Q:finally- name 10 BET shows.
A:I already named all of them, as well as when they're on and which are reruns from previously shown shows.



------QUOTE STARTS HERE------
Help BooDaah STAY the Moderator for the OkayActivism Board....

Fill Angiee's Mailbox full of requests for me (HAHA she'll LOOOOVE THAT!!!)

How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

Nonsense- all based on your own suppositions- and to determoined to be "right" to even manage compromise.

If you want solutions then youll have to work on your diplomacy- all this "Im right BET is wrong" stuff is cool for a good rant but its not gonna help you one bit when you bring it up to BET- they've heard it all before.

I can help you all- if you're willing to help yourselves. but obviously you dont want or need help- because you're "Right"


be my guest take it BET and I wish you luck.

K

>Nonsense- all based on your own
>suppositions- and to determoined to
>be "right" to even manage
>compromise.

Be specific. Koala you can do better than this.

>If you want solutions then youll
>have to work on your
>diplomacy-

Who said I was trying to be a diplomat? Diplomacy is fine for certain situations, others require a swift kick in the a$$. Others require a clear dissection of baseless arguements. Game recognize game. I do appreciate the critique of my style though. :-)

> all this "Im right
>BET is wrong" stuff is
>cool for a good rant
>but its not gonna help
>you one bit when you
>bring it up to BET-
>they've heard it all before.

You fight your way, I'll fight mine.

>I can help you all- if
>you're willing to help yourselves.
>but obviously you dont want
>or need help- because you're
>"Right"

Now you sound a bit wounded. Your help is welcomed of course. You and I have danced this little dance by ourselves and it's been amusing to say the least. And frankly your determination of my desire to be "rightness" is relative, and a bit judgemental. I may very well be the "wrongest" mofo west of the Mississippi (I really never said I wasn't), but hasn't this at least been fun?

>be my guest take it BET
>and I wish you luck.

thanks K. seriously :-)
------QUOTE STARTS HERE------
Help BooDaah STAY the Moderator for the OkayActivism Board....

Fill Angiee's Mailbox full of requests for me (HAHA she'll LOOOOVE THAT!!!)

How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

>Be specific. Koala you can do
>better than this.

Im presuming that your discontent and the discontent of others with BET is that you feel that certain depictions of our people are fundamentally demeaning and derisive of our dignity and undermine our entitlement to disrespect.

I disagree

I think you have a problem respecting those who apparently have a different moral standard than you, those who conduct themselves through materialism, thuggery, lustful behavior, misogeny.

I think you presume that those people dont even respect themselves and that they cause a detriment to the advancement of our people.

Quite simply and frankly- i dont agree with you. as such this is not the place for this discussion. If you want to engage in action- I have only suggested that you organize and qualify your ranks before you go trotting off into battle thinking righteousness will save you- or even save them. It occurs to me that this particular endeavor is not a boycott- but a crusade- but many of the supporters of this supposed boycott will not admit that under the auspices that they are determined that hey are right.

again- I dont agree.

If you want to debate the matter- we should probably take this somewhere else cuz if I wanted to argue i would have stayed in the lesson- these lines should be kept clean and concise for the purpose of finding and relaying pertinent information; not necessarily opinions that challenge one another.


Im not wounded at all- im in a perpetual state of healing, okplayer?

K

>Im presuming that your discontent and
>the discontent of others with
>BET is that you feel
>that certain depictions of our
>people are fundamentally demeaning and
>derisive of our dignity and
>undermine our entitlement to disrespect....BLAH >BLAH BLAH

First of all let me state that you've COMPLETELY missed my point of dissention with BET (and I volunteer the others as well, but as usual I won't answer for them. I'll do my best to stick with my own arguements).

A little chronology:

Over in general, there have been several threads about the lack of "quality" programming on BET. There have also been several discussing certian "shady" business practices. I don't know if you saw any of these. But they did happen. After a particularly verbose discussion, one of the other OkayPlayers brought up the fact that in their opinion it was odd that the NAACP chose to boycott the "major" networks for the images of minorities they choose to portray, the lack of minorities behind the cameras and such. It was the opinion of this player that BET also shows a poor representation of th diaspora. While they DO emplo more blacks, she pointed out that their turnover rate is pretty bad and referred to the stories of some former BET employeesa about the "unfair" way they were treated (Ananda, DL Hughley, and Cedric the Entertainer as well as the aforementioned ComicView Comics). She stated that if the other networks did THOSE things we (Black folk) would have a fit. The player also pointed out that many BET viewers have problems and aside from several ignored spatterings of letter writing there was never a unified body who brough forth any arguements to the BET powers in an effort to have change made. So this player said "Lets DO something. Lets not wait on the NAACP or anybody else, lets get it started. So this player sounded the call to arms and solicited ideas. At this point things got weird.

Fast forward to NOW:

All those other OkayPlayers who previously vented suddenly got lockjaw and had nothing to say or contribute. I noticed this, and not wanting the players energy to be wasted or squashed offered encouragement and a little suggestion for direction. I too have problems with BET (which have been outlined in this and the other BET post currently posted) and because I'm just that type of brother was fully down to support te idea of getting changes implemented. I'm fully aware that my idea of quality might very well be different than the diaspora, but I've heard enough viewpoints similiar to mine that wonder why BET is comfortable with not realizing the potential of what they could be. I hear folks say, "you gotta support" and in my own ways I do, but I also think they could tighten up and am willing to address those specific issues. "Quality" is a relative term. "Diverse programming scope" is not. I don't hink BET needs to go away, it IS valuable, but they can simply do better period. I have a few suggestions that could help, and so do some others here. I'm truly not one of those folk who think that just because someone Black is pumping it out, that I have to accept whatever is given to me if I feel the service provided is subpar. Not just related to BET, but ANY Black business I support (which I go WAY out of my way to do, not just sometimes but ALL the time). If that makes me an elitist (which I have been called elsewhere), self-righteous, a crusader or whatever I don't care. I'll be that.

See Koala, you and I are actually quite similar in our belief that there is a certain amount of dignity/self-reliance and self determination exhibited by those things some folk call "ghetto" or demeaning. In all my discussions with you and others, I've never acted like I'm better, more knowledgeable or whatever. But I AM smart enough to have valid points which I can back up.

So all that trying to label/pigenhole me via your "presumptions" about my intentions, methods or ideas won't work. In the Lesson you may be able to rile folks with that. But it amuses me to no end. I enjoy discussing things with you because you are good at finding holes in people's arguements. I also respect your viewpoints without judgement. I respect your ability to disagree (which you do quite well). I have no idea what you do BESIDES talk a good game, but over here some of us are about action to go with the rhetoric. Not action without direction and clear focus. We realize THOSE things take time to build (and were in the middle of taking thst time when you jumped in with your patented KoalaLove indignation). You're correct that this may not be the avenue for this discussion betwen you and I, just let me know where and I'll be happy to continue it elsewhere (it really IS kinda fun).

But back on topic. To the individuals who have decided to do something BESIDES run their mouths and cute little fingers over keyboards I say this:

Keep fighting. You know where your hearts are and I believe your intentions are pure. I got your back.


------QUOTE STARTS HERE------
Help BooDaah STAY the Moderator for the OkayActivism Board....

Fill Angiee's Mailbox full of requests for me (HAHA she'll LOOOOVE THAT!!!)

How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

All Im telling you is that all this action and energy that you are fond of- needs to be validated and organized if you are to proceed to bring it to the attention of any corporate entity.

Where is this energy when people have a few simple questions to answer in order to establish what their current appreciation of the netwrok? Where are they when they are asked what their concise goal is or when they're asked to take steps to find that goal. I provided what i fell is a good step- no response, only debate.

Its hard to imagine that these guys are off to a good start when they havent done anything differently from all those guys that were just talking three months ago.

You must qualify and validate your role in BET's viewership in order to gain respect and recognition for your suggestions. Otherwise you are still just a bunch of people talking. Not even the NAACP could approach BET in that fashion- and they shouldnt have approached the netwroks like that (look where it got them- i digress it was more or less a publicity stunt anyway so it got them just as far as they wanted to go).

If you want things to change you'll have to represent what is in it for them- not just what is in it for us or subsequently your suppositions of it being good for Blacks.

This is a business- treat it as such and you will find positive and effective results. Dont expect BET to just do things cuz you say its right- demonstrate how doing what you think is right will ammount to something better for all of us.

The first step is to find out for yourself what the people you are vouching for are actually drawing their complaints from.


Sure there could be more positive programming on televison- but BET is not gonna change anything for the sake of a bunch of guys who will just continue to watch nothing but the video shows and expect to see something thoroughly enlightening- thats just not reasonable.

If more of these people are like you- and actually watch BET tonight and Lead Story and Heart and Soul- then you might have a case. If these guys are just hoping to see more Common videos and less Comic View- thats just not gonna cut it.

K

Boo, K, I grow weary of your exchanges. Can a common "checked" playa get some??? :)

Survey Answers:
>How much BET do you watch-
>daily, weekly, etc.
About 7 hours

>When do you typically watch BET?
At night and a little of Sat. I'm busy buying shoes; don't have time for TV

>What do you watch on BET?
BET Tonight & Heart & Soul

>What are you looking for on
BET?
More shows that make a difference. I am aware that this is an overused phrase. So, to qualify let me share this: I saw EYES ON THE PRIZE in college. This peice of cinema changed & made a difference in my life.

>Do you watch the commercials on
BET? It's impossible for me to watch any show without commercials

How long have you been watching
>BET?
Since 1985

>What is your favorite BET show
>and why?
Heart & Sould - Positive Sistahs speaking intelligently about somethings that interests me AND BET Tonight with Tavis - Tavis is an Action Brother and I like that

>What is your least favorite BET
show? LA Tonight

>What other television media do you
>watch regularly? HBO
>
>finally- name 10 BET shows.
Heart & Soul, BET Tonight, Video Soul, Hits from the Street, Amen, Sparks, LA Tonight, The Sports Show with Coolio, Bobby Jones Gospel, Midnight Love, AND the George Foreman Grill Commerical :)
>
Koala, are you going to quantify, analyze, etc. this info and share?

I,I, I Can't Wait!

"Koala, are you going to quantify, analyze, etc. this info and share?"

No- but this information is important to this cause. Its actually not a cause I can propogate but Im willing to help any of you proceed correctly. What Im hoping you guys will organize is a substantial and demonstrative example of what you guys are to BET's audience.

with you claiming to be a viewer since 85 and Boodah and all he claims- you guys are on your way to establishing a very reasonable and effective letter campaign.

conversely letters that only amount to- "BET sucks, get rid of comic view" arent sufficient- theyve heard it all before.

What BET needs to act on your requests is assurance that when they make those changes- people will be watching; you cant really do that without establishing that you are already watching na'mean.

Im not trying to tear your endeavors down- Im sharing with you the more positive and effective ways that his might work.

Truth be told BET directors are old- and soon enough they'll need to be passing their torches to people likeyou who are ready to take it into the next millenium. They are currently in a very precarious position- do we cater to all the Black folk that have supported us all along or try to reach this new crowd of Blacks who totally defy everything we are; the answer is unfortunately obvious.

What needs to be demonstrated is that you want to wrok with BET and that you appreciate what they are capable of and the issues they have to deal with- otherwise you get nowhere. How far are you gonna get telling they should go off the air?

You can do this okayplayer? But you have to do it right.

K

Well then :P to you!
K, you are right. Some of us are fond of BET - especially after watching their 20 year celebration and seeing all those MUSICAL artist show appreciation and express their love for BET. I concur in their assertions that BET is "home" for them...alot of them were proprelled into success as a result of BET being there for them when others weren't. That's is AHHH-RIGHT with me.

However, I still stand on my original premise of BET owing US -Black Folk - a little more than we're getting.

Shut BET down? No!
Let them know that there are some of us that want more? Yes!

And you know what, K? I still have nothing but OK Playa Love for you. It's folk like you that call people to the rug regarding what they think they beleive... providing intellectual challenge as opposed to colloquial rhetoric.

Smooches any damn way!
Live from the Shoe Sto'
Nushooz
I,I, I Can't Wait!

"Let them know that there are some of us that want more? Yes!"

What Im trying to get you guy to realize is that you're only settling for wanting more and thats what causes this disappointment.

You could actually be PRODUCING what it is that you want to see- and in that case BET would have material and everyone would be happy.

Have any of you ever heard of SankofaII (future filmmaker over here) there are resources available that many arent realizing cuz they're too busy holding BEt accountable.

If you think BET is coming up short- then YOU need to develop that shit you want them to show.

If you dont know already

YOU CAN DO IT.


-Im doing it, but Im not at liberty to talk about that.

People please- if you dont like the programming, make better programming. IT IS that simple.

K

That's not my forte', my flava', my bag of tricks.
Although I hear what you're saying. (i saw sankofa) But....
I don't wanna be like Matty Rich and producing films and bragging that he had no training. I think ish like that tears down legitimate producers and playwrites. I'm not a dabbler. I like to do things well.

Take shoe shopping....
I don't design shoes but I can tell you about well designed shoes, who design the better shoes, which designers are trendy, which are mane stream, where to buy them, how much you should be prepared to spend, etc. I KNOW GOOD SHOES when I see them.
But produce some stuff???
I'll wait on you

Live from the Shoe Sto'
NuShooz

I,I, I Can't Wait!

If you want to wait on me- then be patient.

As far as BET is concerned if you guys want some shit it would happen alot quicker if you organized into something productive and not just something bent on tearing something dwon.

Y'all know full well that you aint taking BET down.

What you dont know is that BET needs producers- they need shows and show ideas. I see a whole lot of passion but its coming from people who arent apparently putting their feelings towards actually making BET a better network.

Maybe y'all dont realize that you have this opportunity but you do- and if you pass it up then you'll have a good idea why BET doesnt have many good shows.

Its cuz nobody is making them.


K

>If you want to wait on
>me- then be patient.

Patience is one thing while COMPLACENCY is another. I go out and actively find the shoe that makes me happy. I don't wait on the shoe to come to me.

>As far as BET is concerned
>if you guys want some
>shit it would happen alot
>quicker if you organized into
>something productive and not just
>something bent on tearing something
>dwon.

I think you misunderstood us. I don't remember anybody saying anything about tearing ish down. These threads were about ORGANIZATION. And I apologize for misleading you. It was not done on purpose.

>What you dont know is that
>BET needs producers- they need
>shows and show ideas. I
>see a whole lot of
>passion but its coming from
>people who arent apparently putting
>their feelings towards actually making
>BET a better network.

INVITATION to the table -even if its a result of protest - is one of the things that will make BET better.

K, if writing, producing is your thing, then do it without requirement of JUSTIFication or quantification your work. DO what you do!

You speak to us as if you're addressing Branch Davidians who plan to storm BET with guns and grenades and hold Donnie Simpson hostage. But maybe we have some method and have devised some way of organizing the masses that may not be evident to YOU right now. But why does it have to be? This is obviosly not your battle. Rather you offer signage or not, it will go on. I will still be disgruntled with the programming at BET and looking to join with other people who are disgruntled as well and interested in SAYING so - in a way that might not be pleasing to you.

Nu
I,I, I Can't Wait!

>Patience is one thing while COMPLACENCY
>is another. I go
>out and actively find the
>shoe that makes me happy.
> I don't wait on
>the shoe to come to
>me.

well part of the shoe will be coming to you at the reunion- maybe not a whoel shoe. More like a shoestring.


>I think you misunderstood us.
>I don't remember anybody saying
>anything about tearing ish down.
> These threads were about
>ORGANIZATION. And I apologize
>for misleading you. It was
>not done on purpose.

The original post made this comment- "5) Is preparation to contact Cable Providers to ask for the removal of B.E.T. in the proposal for action?"

I dont think anybody answered this concisely but the suggestion is that this wouldnt be avoided if the option was available.

>You speak to us as if
>you're addressing Branch Davidians who
>plan to storm BET with
>guns and grenades and hold
>Donnie Simpson hostage. But
>maybe we have some method
>and have devised some way
>of organizing the masses that
>may not be evident to
>YOU right now.

I dont see how organized it can be if you havent made it evident to me- subsequently anyone who's reading the same thread. My ideas were about organizing- providing a succint account of who your constituents are. If your methods of organizing arent evident to the people that you're trying to organize then youve got a big problem.

Donnie Simpson- when was the last time you saw Donnie Simpson on BET!? ;-)

But
>why does it have to
>be? This is obviosly
>not your battle. Rather
>you offer signage or not,
>it will go on.
>I will still be disgruntled
>with the programming at BET
>and looking to join with
>other people who are disgruntled
>as well and interested in
>SAYING so - in a
>way that might not be
>pleasing to you.

Thi isnt about pleasing me- this isnt about discontent- you're welcome to all that. i thought the poin of OkayActivist was to be effective i told you all quite clearly how to be effective your answer is pretty much- Who needs to be effective?

If you dont want to follow my suggestions fine- if you want to conduct yourself in a fashion thats been done over and over and over again go right ahead. But talk is still cheap and you could just as easily dig in the Lesson archives for all that.

If you want to take action- take inventory of who's on your side and who you're up against. thats all i suggested. Ranting is sure to persuade- but it will only persuade those who agree with you to find more ways to agree. Y'all need to be concentrating on the points of contention that arent unified...

What good is a piece of armor if you just keep reinforcing the strongest part- its the weak links in your own attack that you need to find and correct- but some of you are too defensive to admit the own weakness in your argument- what will you do when BET points it out to you.

Qualify your concerns- substantiate them. I dont see how or why you would oppose that idea.

K

Is that a theat?????
I ain' skerd a' you!! I've been wanting some Koala hair shoes to add to my collection!
Send it on!!! Bring it on!!!!

Maybe we (okay-activist) can have our first round table discussion at the re-union. That way I can reach across the table smack yo a$$ AND pull your hair :)

I,I, I Can't Wait!

typos!!!! foiled again!
The word should be THREAT!!!

IS THAT A DAMN THREAT, K?????

I,I, I Can't Wait!

Ill have my newest comic book delivered to the reunion- Ill be here in Detroit for the Detroit Electronic Music festival DEMF.org

That comic book will soon become a series of web animations and if a certain cable broadcast company knows whats good for them they'll sponsor a animated series.

we'll see

K

I do not watch BET very frequently for many reasons. They are the only Black channel on TV, which would lead me to beleive that they are the place where I would find the most realistic portrayal of my people and the our experience.
What I see on BET is what appears to be the Black sex channel. Nearly everything that I have seen on BET has been needlessly sexual in content. Sex is a very real, and hopefully enjoyable part of nearly everyones lives, but that is not all there is in the lives of African Americans. I just can't help but to feel like a joke is being played on the masses through BET. Nearly everything on BET lives up to the negative stereotypes white people have believed about black people for hundreds of years, but this is supposed to be for black people, by black people? I don't want to be represented like that. An organized boycott can be a poweful thing. A boycott in conjunction with a letter writing campaign could be even more powerful. I've never done anything like this before so I can't pretend to be an expert on the subject. I know that I am an intelligent person, and so are all of you. If we know what we want, we should be able to unite and see the results that we NEED. If you think BET needs to be acted on let's act ....NOW

P.S. if there are Chicagoans who want to speak or plan in person let me know.

There is more on BET than sex.

Try Bet Tonight, Lead Story, Heart and Soul, and Out the Box.

Before you proceed what I want you to come to terms with is that Black people can no longer judge their lives on the basis of what White people think about them. White people believe in stereotypes primarily cuz they are a living example of stereotypes. Just because they have a limited perception of us in no way mitigates that we should seek their approval or even comply to their so-called standards.


Ill pose this question to you.

If I took one aspect of your life and blew it of proportion, convinced the world that fucking was the only thing you were good at- would you stop fucking to keep ignorant people from believing the stereotype?

Stereotypes are not fabricated- they are incomplete characterizations of Black lifestyles. Yes Black people are often lazy, sex crazed, and materialistic- thats called being human; to try to not be those things is admirable but to act like we shouldnt be those things cuz its makes us look bad is silly.

None of that makes us look bad- it makes us look real. The mitigating circumstances are that we are implicity deemed in negative fashions so no matter what we do only a fraction of our integrity will be acknowledged. That is not necessarily our fault and i dont even think its our problem.

Please just answer the survey questions and think about these things- this is not necessarily the arena for debat this is the organizational process for a letter writing campaign or whatever else might be effective.

K

>.
>
>
>>>
>How much BET do you watch-
>daily, weekly, etc.

5-7 hours a week


>When do you typically watch BET?

in the late evening
>
>What do you watch on BET?

BET talk w/ Tavis Smiley, Lead Story, Heart & Soul, and Out the Box-sometimes Teen Summit and Hits (that dude is a fool!!)
>
>What are you looking for on
>BET?

more informative shows-maybe like a black 60 minutes, documentaries-various kinds, comedy specials, a variety of tv dramas and sitcoms done by BET, and maybe some game shows


>Do you watch the commercials on
>BET?

I guess so, but not intentionally.


>How long have you been watching
>BET?

Ever since it started in 1980.


>What is your favorite BET show
>and why?

BET Talk because I like the topics they choose and Tavis Smiley's commentary-he doesn't sugarcoat that much, and I admire that.


>What is your least favorite BET
>show?

A tie between Live from LA and the one with the cyber-thingy




>What other television media do you
>watch regularly?

I'm unclear on this question. Do you mean television shows or networks??


>
>finally- name 10 BET shows.

Teen Summit
Comic View
BET Talk
Hits
Out the Box
Heart & Soul
Lead Story
Bobby Jones Gospel
Live in LA
BET Movie of the Week

yeah i mean network and prgramming.


Do you guys see how this provides a much easier means of expressing your concerns?

I mean I read these reports and im like- ok these people are actually fond of BET. Thats the attitude that works.

Please keep it up


K

in that case:

fox-ally mcbeal, family guy, that 70s show

WB-steve hardy show, popular, a bunch of rerun shows (seinfeld, living single, friends, simpsons, etc.)

TBS-a bunch of reruns, again, and some movies

NBC-3rd rock from the sun, friends, ER, law and order

CBS-touched by an angel, 60 minutes, 60 minutes II, everybody loves raymond

HBO-Chris Rock, some of their comedy specials, some of their mini-series like the corner or laurel avenue (y'all remember that??, Dennis Miller show, happily ever after (is that what it's called or is it just ever after, i don't know), and movies

A&E-Biography, Quincy reruns, beretta reruns,

Lifetime-any day now, reruns (i.e. golden girls, designing women), lifetime portrait, some of their movies

comedy central-south park, win ben stein's money, pulp comics (i think that's what it's called), various comedy specials and movies

mtv-biorhythms, news, documentaries

vh-1-behind the music, where are they now, picture show

cartoon network-space ghost coast to coast, the power puff girls, dexter's laboratory, johnny bravo, japanimation cartoons, oh canada

oxygen-nearly everything on that channel

http://www.soulpurpose.com/index.cfm?config_id=186&top_type=config&chan_name=Film&chanID=62

an article on what could be a new day at BET...
if that link doesn't work....you find the article from the main page www.soulpurpose.com





"Here's another speech you wish I'd swallow. Another cue for you to hold your ears. Another train of thought too hard to follow." - Fiona Apple

"I'm going to save R&B" - Sisqo

"Questioning why you should listen to my words, the way I say them, my flow.
Ignoring the fact that my spoken word will make your mind glow." - jose3030

A very optimistic article indeed. Hopefully for those who didn't know all the good info there this will serve as a means to better understand the financial and historical place that BET holds. But until the quality DOES change, or until the other fledgling networks provide an alternative, I honestly think that those of us who wish to see BET become "better" and not just more valueable still have a cause to fight for.

------QUOTE STARTS HERE------
Help BooDaah STAY the Moderator for the OkayActivism Board....

Fill Angiee's Mailbox full of requests for me (HAHA she'll LOOOOVE THAT!!!)

How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

Im trying to tell you that BET is not as opposed to your suggestions as you may think they are.

Now is not the time to fight them- it is the time to work with them for better programming and more reasonable viewers.

They're getting ramped up for new developments- but they need productions not just people who demand better shows.

Some of you have the passion- but you havent quite realized that YOU have the power not just to make them show things but to actually make those shows.

But to do this or anything- YOU NEED TO BE ORGANIZED.

K

i only want them to be areal channel try some programs that enlighten us as to the present state of things today cause comicview is only so keep from crying.for example why did hbo show slam instead of it being the movie of the week you feel me man they have not heard our requests as of yet so we cant honestly boycott untill we are shuned aside.put some real cats in the feild to show what really happening .by the way all these cats with doe...(i mean real doe)why cant the take over distribution cause that seems to be a very big strong hold that they have over us...freedom ...total..they cant make us spend thier money economy is power to me ya know?

Broadcasting contemporary motion pictures on basic cable is a very expensive process- consider the fact that no basic cable station shows films that would be as recent as Slam- unless they make they're own films and even then those films are extremely low budget (just like the ones that BET makes currently)- Network broadcast companies do it but even then- they are few and far between. Furthermore Slam has several content issues that dont comply with FCC standards for broadcats and as such the film would either have to be edited or censored and i dont think the producers are the film would allow or appreciate that- I wouldnt.

K

Watch Knowing and Understanding your credit on BET Saturdays at 12:30.

Hows that for enlightening?

K

You're arguement is faulty in Slam. BET has the rights to show it, it was on BET movies last night (5.22.00). Why the couldn't show it on "regular" BET isn't because of what your said. Besides, even a censored verson of Slam would be better than nothing. Shoot, USA does it all the time.

------QUOTE STARTS HERE------
Help BooDaah STAY the Moderator for the OkayActivism Board....

Fill Angiee's Mailbox full of requests for me (HAHA she'll LOOOOVE THAT!!!)

How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

BET movies- is a not basic - its pay per view right? As such they cover teh cost of broadcasting with those who actually subscribe to watch that feature. As far as censoring or editting i really doubt the producers of the film would allow that; alot of the profanity is in the very poetry thats being used- its one thing to swap out a "fuck" here and there but when thats the point of them poem you'll lose all of the films integrity.

Not to mention with all that drug dealing- you know there gonna be okplayers talkin that "all they show is drug dealers" ish.

K

>BET movies- is a not basic
>- its pay per view
>right?

No, it's not basic, it's a premuim channel (like HBO). But from what I understand (I have friends who work in the cable industry), the company will buy the rights to show a movie X amount of times. Where (meaning which of their channels)/when they show it is up to thepurchaser of the rights. The decision not to show it on regular BET boils down to $$$. If you wanna see it, you gotta pay for it. Supply and demand.

>As far
>as censoring or editting i
>really doubt the producers of
>the film would allow that;

THe producers/editors don't have jack to say about it though. The studio owns that movie and once it's in the can they can pretty much do whatever they like to it (this is why all those "director's cuts" exist. so that the original visionary can show they movie the way they intended).

>alot of the profanity is
>in the very poetry thats
>being used- its one thing
>to swap out a "fuck"
>here and there but when
>thats the point of them
>poem you'll lose all of
>the films integrity.

If they could edit "Do the Right thing" and "Harlem Nights" tey could edit Slam. Whether the integrity of the film would be comromised or not is subjective.

>Not to mention with all that
>drug dealing- you know there
>gonna be okplayers talkin that
>"all they show is drug
>dealers" ish.

Now THAT is funny. True, yet still funny. And while were sort of on that subject (drug dealers and such), does anyone wonder why BET couldn't make a program like "The Corner"?

------QUOTE STARTS HERE------
Help BooDaah STAY the Moderator for the OkayActivism Board....

Fill Angiee's Mailbox full of requests for me (HAHA she'll LOOOOVE THAT!!!)

How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

the company
>will buy the rights to
>show a movie X amount
>of times. Where (meaning which
>of their channels)/when they show
>it is up to thepurchaser
>of the rights. The decision
>not to show it on
>regular BET boils down to
>$$$. If you wanna see
>it, you gotta pay for
>it. Supply and demand.

The problem is BET networks is not the same company as BET Movies- or BET action- same way with BET.com They are all sepearate corporate entities all held by BET holdings. My company does the website for BET .com and while BET holdings has some interest in our endeavors it has no jurisdiction- if i sell my web toons to BET.com that doesnt mean they can show them on BET.

When BET movies buys the rights they can show it as much as they want but BET network would have to arrange for an entirely different deal.


>THe producers/editors don't have jack to
>say about it though. The
>studio owns that movie and
>once it's in the can
>they can pretty much do
>whatever they like to it
>(this is why all those
>"director's cuts" exist. so that
>the original visionary can show
>they movie the way they
>intended).

I dont know if the producers of Slam have such an intrusive deal- their shit was released by Trimark not any major studio i doubt they have much of a hold on the rights to the actual film. They're still trying to the most out Leprauchan in teh Hood (starring Ice T)


>If they could edit "Do the
>Right thing" and "Harlem Nights"
>tey could edit Slam. Whether
>the integrity of the film
>would be comromised or not
>is subjective.

I disagree- neither of those movies involve poetic content. the poems in this film contain profanity- like i said its one thing to change a random curse but to try and overdub a poetic verse is too much trouble- not to mention the lyrics of th songs in the soundtrack and several instances of illegal drug sales and vioence that arent really accepted on basic cable (especially in the capacity that slam depicts them). When was the last time you saw such a vivd depiction of prison and urban life portrayed on basic cable?

>Now THAT is funny. True, yet
>still funny. And while were
>sort of on that subject
>(drug dealers and such), does
>anyone wonder why BET couldn't
>make a program like "The
>Corner"?

Thats whats fucked about all this discontent- we paint ourselves into a corner.

K

>Thats whats fucked about all this
>discontent- we paint ourselves into
>a corner.

Yuck. That was wack. Boooooo. :-)

------QUOTE STARTS HERE------
Help BooDaah STAY the Moderator for the OkayActivism Board....

Fill Angiee's Mailbox full of requests for me (HAHA she'll LOOOOVE THAT!!!)

How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

>>Thats whats fucked about all this
>>discontent- we paint ourselves into
>>a corner.
>
>Yuck. That was wack. Boooooo. :-)

Its the truth:

Complaint: Aw there's too much talk of materialism and drug dealing on BET.

Response: But what about documentaries on drug problems?

C: well those are ok...

Response: What about commercials?

C: well I guess those are ok too...

Response: Then whats the problem?

C: well i just dont want to see stuff that i dont like...

Response: Ok we'll get right on that.

K

>>Yuck. That was wack. Boooooo. :-)

I was talking about the way you flipped the corner thing. it was kinda trite. whatever.


>Response: But what about documentaries on
>drug problems?

Did I miss something? When did this come on? Too bad that can't/won't rerun it like they do comic view.

>Response: What about commercials?

I totally missed this one. The majority of the commercials I see on BET have Black folk dancing for burgers and sodas. What commercials are you referring to and what is the relevance as to why BET couldn't have invested he money to make "The Corner" or something similar?


------QUOTE STARTS HERE------
Help BooDaah STAY the Moderator for the OkayActivism Board....

Fill Angiee's Mailbox full of requests for me (HAHA she'll LOOOOVE THAT!!!)

How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

>Did I miss something? When did
>this come on? Too bad
>that can't/won't rerun it like
>they do comic view.

You know why it wont- cuz people dont want to see that type of stuff. Hey that guy is hooked on crack- thats not very entertaining.

Maybe if thy had a 3d crackhead eh?

>>Response: What about commercials?
>
>I totally missed this one. The
>majority of the commercials I
>see on BET have Black
>folk dancing for burgers and
>sodas. What commercials are you
>referring to and what is
>the relevance as to why
>BET couldn't have invested he
>money to make "The Corner"
>or something similar?

The complaint was in reference to materialism. My point is materialism only bothers people when it is people they dont like showing things that the viewer doesnt have (or doesnt think the emcee in question shoould have). Are all those car commercials not an invitation to materialism? yeah so why arent we dissing the ROOTs for promoting VW...ummm.. ummm... or Sprite...ummmmm.


As far as the corner- without the capability of using profanity and a great deal of items like guns and or drugs and or drug use (these are not things that are accustomed for basic cable) the only way such a program could be fostered by BET channel is if it were a documentary and in that case documentaries arent considered "Entertaining." Besides we've already admitted that alot of people are opposed to seeing blacks depicted in such a fashion- we demand that BET stop showing it in one instance but applaud other instances. Its a good idea but whats BEt gonna do when they get hated on again for showing Black people on the corner?


K

>Maybe if thy had a 3d
>crackhead eh?

Please don't give them any ideas.

>The complaint was in reference to
>materialism. My point is materialism
>only bothers people when it
>is people they dont like
>showing things that the viewer
>doesnt have (or doesnt think
>the emcee in question shoould
>have). Are all those car
>commercials not an invitation to
>materialism? yeah so why arent
>we dissing the ROOTs for
>promoting VW...ummm.. ummm... or Sprite...ummmmm.

This is an interesting point. Yes commercials by their nature promote materialism/commercialism. I also agree that folks pick and choose which messages are palatable and who they will recieve that message from. One thing I wonder if you see is the PERVASIVENESS of these ideas (commercialism/materialism) on BET and in the pop culture society in which we live. Did BET invent it? No. Do they foster it? Hell yeah. Is that bad/too much? Depends on ones perspective I guess. the point remains in all this that if BET is merely about promoting pop culture and the status quo of what is "popular" at the time, they should be careful not to promote themselves in such a way that people will say "you're not holding up to what you say you are". Folks will still fuss (as is their want to do), but the old arguement that BET is just for "enterainment" would hold up a lot better then.

>As far as the corner- without
>the capability of using profanity
>and a great deal of
>items like guns and or
>drugs and or drug use
>(these are not things that
>are accustomed for basic cable)...

Again I say, does BET show documentaries? Remember a few years ago when NBC showed the full uncut, noncommercial interrupted version of Schindler's List? Full frontal nudity and all. That was on network primetime TV. If they can do it, BET can too (if they really wanted too). You ever watch South Park on Comedy Central? The language there is much more blue than anything I saw on "The Corner". I dunno K. They could throw a TV-MA and a warnig on it and show it.

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How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

>Please don't give them any ideas.

Dude thats my JOB!

>Again I say, does BET show
>documentaries? Remember a few years
>ago when NBC showed the
>full uncut, noncommercial interrupted version
>of Schindler's List? Full frontal
>nudity and all. That was
>on network primetime TV. If
>they can do it, BET
>can too (if they really
>wanted too).

BWAHAHA HAAA- thats hilarious. NBC is a much larger corporation thats like saying if NBC can pay the cast of friends several millions of dollars so can BET- the response is simple... NO THEY CANT! BET is not network and BET has not been around as long as NBC- you had a previous argument about the amount of money BET has and now I understand where you're coming from- you were calculating BET holding's net worth not the BET channel on cable- two totally different entities.

You ever watch
>South Park on Comedy Central?
>The language there is much
>more blue than anything I
>saw on "The Corner". I
>dunno K. They could throw
>a TV-MA and a warnig
>on it and show it.

You still havent addressed the issues of cost and compliance with federal regulations. South Park is blue- they dont say anything that is against FCC regulations the movie Slam does. Furthermore- the corner is also on HBO and all that they show and depict is not at all what would be acceptable for basic cable. In order to show Slam or any other questionable (by FCC standards) material they'll be paying a hefty price- a price that this point they just cant afford. Its not about not wanting to spend the money- its about not having the money to spend.

The difference between BET and BET movies is that BET would have to apply corporate sponsorship to make this profitable or even reasonable in terms of diminished returns. Can you imagine Coke sponsoring this film? This film challenges the entire structure and reason for corporate America I doubt theyd be all that sparked to fill up commercial space for it. as such airing the movie would be a great idea but it would fail miserably; theyd have no money to support it, theyd pay for the liscensing out of pocket, and then nobody would watch it cuz most people are determined that BET sucks, the people that did watch it would front cuz half the dialogue had been muted out or editted. This would be a pervasively no win situation for BET.

K

>Dude thats my JOB!

when you say "job" are you implying that you're an employee/contractor/benefiter of BET? If so, I believe this entire discussion has taken on a different color....

>BWAHAHA HAAA- thats hilarious. NBC is
>a much larger corporation thats
>like saying if NBC can
>pay the cast of friends
>several millions of dollars so
>can BET- the response is
>simple... NO THEY CANT!

This is a very big leap. I said nothing of the sort. I said that if NBC can find a way to bend/bypass FCC regulations then so can BET. Period. i didn't say it would be easy or cheap. I simply said they could do it if they wanted too. All that putting words in my keyboard. K you know better. :-(

>two totally different entities.

if you say so. i disagree. all the money goes into one pocket. it's a privately held company so again he can do whatever he pleases. but this is a non-issue anyway actually because I think the movie Slam sucks and I'm glad it hasn't shown on BET, frankly. This whole thing was yet another red herring.

>You still havent addressed the issues
>of cost and compliance with
>federal regulations.

Yeah I did. You just ignored it. Again I say, if BET wanted to show WHATEVER they had the rights to, they would find a way to do it. Disagree (which I'm sure you will)? Unless you show me why not then I won't change my opinion.

>all that they
>show and depict is not
>at all what would be
>acceptable for basic cable.

You're missing my point about "the Corner". BET could have done a program of this quality, if they chose to. Could they cut out the injection scenes and some of the cursing? If they wanted too. Hill Street Blues was gritty and very real and they never said cursewords. Roots was powerful without cursewords. It's all in the presentation.


In
>order to show Slam or
>any other questionable (by FCC
>standards) material they'll be paying
>a hefty price- a price
>that this point they just
>cant afford. Its not about
>not wanting to spend the
>money- its about not having
>the money to spend.

Remember the Soul Purpose article that was posted a couple of days ago (it's still here)?

Remember this quote from it:
(Start Snip here)
But regardless of what the future brings, there is much to admire about BET's 20years. Who could imagine 20 years ago that BET Holdings, Inc., would be a $2 billion empire of five cable networks (BET, BET on Jazz, BET Movies/Starz, BET Action Pay Per View, and BET International), a magazine division, a book imprint,four themed restaurants, an Internet service (www.BET.com) and a film division?
(End Snip Here)

Did you see the part about 2 BILLION? Tell me again how they ain't be gotten no money? They have enough money to get a place, hire all the performers/set designers/makup/camera folk/etc for their 20th anniversary special (I hope you saw it) but they can't find the time nor money to get the rights to show say "Roots"? Get outta here K.

As for the rest of your post, I with some of it (can you tell I don't feel like pickin those parts out). But regardless, for some reason your arguements seem to be slipping of late. You OK buddy? Seriously. You're the resident eloquator, I'd hate for folk to not recognize the power of the mighty K. I think the Lesson may have softened you up a bit. :-)

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How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

>when you say "job" are you
>implying that you're an employee/contractor/benefiter
>of BET?

I did not say that.

>This is a very big leap.
>I said nothing of the
>sort. I said that if
>NBC can find a way
>to bend/bypass FCC regulations then
>so can BET. Period. i
>didn't say it would be
>easy or cheap. I simply
>said they could do it
>if they wanted too. All
>that putting words in my
>keyboard. K you know better.

NBC didnt "bend" any rules they made a request of the FCC that found substative merit in the entirety of Schindler's list. In sharp contrast Schindler's list does not contain profanity, depiction of driug sales, violence, prison situations. Furthermore BET is not network - totally different rules. If you arent talkin about the finances of it then you're comparing yankees to the lakers- nbc and bet arent in the same ballpark.

>>two totally different entities.

>if you say so. i disagree.
>all the money goes into
>one pocket. it's a privately
>held company so again he
>can do whatever he pleases.

Thats not how companies work in general- and ill tell you from first hand experience that thats not how BET works. Think about it- as they are separate companies they dont all go to Bob Johnson for approval. If I head BET.com and you head BET network Id throw a fit if Bob gave you 2 million to show slam while my company is struggling. He can do whatever he pleases- sure - but this would be a bad move for many reasons.

>Yeah I did. You just ignored
>it. Again I say, if
>BET wanted to show WHATEVER
>they had the rights to,
>they would find a way
>to do it. Disagree (which
>I'm sure you will)? Unless
>you show me why not
>then I won't change my
>opinion.

But Ive already demonstrated that BET doesnt have the rights to it- nor would it comply readily to FCC regulations. So there it is- BET couldnt show this film even IF they wanted to- they cant afford it.

>You're missing my point about "the
>Corner". BET could have done
>a program of this quality,
>if they chose to. Could
>they cut out the injection
>scenes and some of the
>cursing? If they wanted too.
>Hill Street Blues was gritty
>and very real and they
>never said cursewords. Roots was
>powerful without cursewords. It's all
>in the presentation.

Thats all network- you're back in forth but you cant drag television media over those lines so easily. They are different beasts. Network for a long time served as people's only television media so as such it had to allow certain blue material (like david carusso's ass). Basic cable emerged as an opportunity for family values to have media that would not engage in such material unless the subscriber made a specific request to have that material in their home. Case in point- you have yet to see a bared ass on basic cable.

BET could not do a program of this quality- they would need a healthy budget and they would need sponsorship- they would get neither.

>
>Did you see the part about
>2 BILLION? Tell me again
>how they ain't be gotten
>no money?

You just said it yourself- 2 billion split between 14 companies- how much is left? Slam would warrant at least a million dollar liscensing fee- not to mention what it would cost if you wanted to show it more than once. Now figure in how much money theyd make for this film- where is the corporate sponsorship? Coke aint gonna do it- the only people whod be down is the record industry and their not gonna pay much cuz there's no competitive pricing (no other sponsors). So now youve got a highly priced- undersponsored event that takes up 2 hours of BET time; time that could be spent on less expensive programming with more financial support.

This is not a good idea no mater how you slice- BET would get more out of it by giving me the million.

They have enough
>money to get a place,
>hire all the performers/set designers/makup/camera
>folk/etc for their 20th anniversary
>special (I hope you saw
>it) but they can't find
>the time nor money to
>get the rights to show
>say "Roots"? Get outta here
>K.

In the first instance- thats all in house expense- whatever they spend their company gets at least half back- they can write another quarter of it off. If you purchase the rights for roots all that money leaves the company and you sacrifice at least a week to broadcast (as opposed to one night)- whoever doesnt like roots is alienated and so are the sponsors. Furthermore for all the money you just paid- a broadcast this magnitude can only be shown once, the 20th anniversary special can be repeated til people get sick of it- all profit from that point on. Now let's tally that up...

Roots- hefty liscencing fee, sacrifice an entire week of primetime programming, mitigates discount sponsorship (Coke aint payin a premium for ads that will run across an entire week- they'll typically even the run out with one of those- Coke loves Black people promos), You can only show it once.

20th anniversary special- production is covered by ticket sales and sponsorship before the program even airs, sacrifice only 1 night of primetime programming and any desirable block subsequently, mitigates sponsorship according to viewership- supposedly high due to the various celebrities and perforances (sponsors love celebrities- sponsors do not love slaves), You can show this as many times as you want...and if people like it- you get all the credit and can do the same thing next year.

now which is a more reasonable business decision? The answer is obvious but if you still dont believe- imagine the programming director of BET network calling Bob Johnson to make such a request. Bob Johnson also owns the company that has the rights to movies like Roots and has a business of selling those films to people on a pay per view basis.

Bob: So you're asking me to give you a million to liscense a movie that we have the ability to show and be paid for by subscribers - for the chance for BET to show it on basic cable for free and at a heavy cost to us...let me think.

>As for the rest of your
>post, I with some of
>it (can you tell I
>don't feel like pickin those
>parts out). But regardless, for
>some reason your arguements seem
>to be slipping of late.
>You OK buddy? Seriously. You're
>the resident eloquator, I'd hate
>for folk to not recognize
>the power of the mighty
>K. I think the Lesson
>may have softened you up
>a bit. :-)


The only weakness in my argument is that you continue to fail to see the facts of the matter youve raised. You percieve BET holdings as this monolith of financial power and thats just not how it is in the real world. Just because its privately owned doesnt mean everybody has rights or access to the primary funds. What holding company allows all its entities to draw from one pocket? Thats foolish. My argument lags because Ive got nothing substantial to argue- you're just wrong.

K

>I did not say that.
good. just making sure. but you keep saying things like "firsthand knowledge" and "it's my job" so i gotta cheack and make sure we don't have a "spy" in our midst. :-)


>You just said it yourself- 2
>billion split between 14 companies-
>how much is left?

Fourteen? Is that your count?

> you're just wrong.

Perhaps. But one thing you missed in all that was a little thing called irony.

Frankly, all that rambling was just my way of pushing the post back up. You missed it.
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How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

so i gotta cheack
>and make sure we don't
>have a "spy" in our
>midst. :-)

I wouldnt necessarily say "spy" more like an intermediate contact of sorts. i work for BEt just about as much as I work for okaypleyr

>Fourteen? Is that your count?

1. BET holdings
2 BET cable network
3. BET on Jazz
4. BET movies
5. BET action pay per view
6. magazines: Emerge, Upscale, Heart and Soul
7. Arabesque books
8-12. "four themed restaurants"
13. BET.com
14. BET films

I didnt even count the magazines individually- nor did I count a few other future endeavors- but its easily 14 companies and many many more.

>> you're just wrong.
>
>Perhaps. But one thing you missed
>in all that was a
>little thing called irony.
>
>Frankly, all that rambling was just
>my way of pushing the
>post back up. You missed
>it.

No way Boodah- Im still pushing it up!

K

>I wouldnt necessarily say "spy" more
>like an intermediate contact of
>sorts. i work for BEt
>just about as much as
>I work for okaypleyr

That's really not saying much. Who really knows what you do for OkayPlayer? The conspiracy theorist in me says "Trust no one" :-) You could be Angiee or anybody else for all I really know.
But then again, you could always lie about your place in BET and be old Mr. Johnson himself....

Dontcha just LOVE Internet Anonymity?

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How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

>That's really not saying much.

Exactly

so how do we change this???who governs the fcc?what in the movie (content)is unexceptable the was very little profanity i dont recall any sex only the referance to weed.but they "covered" that preety well you know?so tell me how do we change the things that are holding the information back?cause what ever you tell me that is what i shall concentrate on!!!my word is my maat!

There's a fair bit of profanity- particularly Saul's cel neighbor's rhyme. I dont really see there being much change necessary in this instance- its not like people cant get ahold of Slam you just cant show it on basic cable. These restrictions make it so that your 8 year old son cant turn on BET and see extreme and adult media- i think that is fair and reasonable.



>so how do we change this???who
>governs the fcc?what in the
>movie (content)is unexceptable the was
>very little profanity i dont
>recall any sex only the
>referance to weed.but they "covered"
>that preety well you know?so
>tell me how do we
>change the things that are
>holding the information back?cause what
>ever you tell me that
>is what i shall concentrate
>on!!!my word is my maat!
>


Yo I illustrate and design • for dose doin crimes • totin heat and in the streets like yellow lines • And Im here ta represent for em • So bow down to dem cats dat swing DOWNTOWN

But, they do so b/c of low-cost programming. People are always irritated by BET showing just videos, a few talk shows, and a bunch of cancelled series but tey don't have the resources to create much original programming, beyond putting a camera on Tavis and letting him yap for an hour.

The reason why BET is so profitable is because a large part of their programming is videos, which are provided to them free of charge from record companies. It's not as if they have to pay the production costs of the videos. It's similar to a magazine who doesn't have to pay it's authors or photographers.

I think people put to much of a burden on BET to encompass the entirety of "Black Entertainment" just because of the name. They are basically a music video channel that dabbles in other programming. However, they are the only "Black channel" out there, so we expect a lot out of them. I'm not defending BET's programming completely; a lot of what they show is trash. But, I do understand some of their limitations.

What BET needs is some competitors for their makret share, other Black-oriented programming channels that not only will ease their burden of carry the duty of representing all things black on cable, but also to give them some impetus to tighten up their game.





http://midnightfusion.com
http://www.mp3.com/midnightfusion

of bet being a black video channel. but i have to agree that's what it is. regardless of name. put's everything into a little different perspective.

**********THE SIG**********

i'm a tru pisces tryna flow in the direction of both of these okplayer quotes:

"I m raising a fuckin angelic being who is going to replenish this fuckin earths cuz in 2G all we fuckin do is talk.....im teachin my seed to turn his spirit inside out and spread beams of green light"
-nebbie

"GOd give me the strength to change the things i can, understanding for those i cannot and the muthafuckin heart to stand up for my beliefs and principles, so that when the government that is suppossed to protect me turns against me and my people we will have the means, the might and the muthafuckin gun power to blow away our oppressors
umm amen"
-earthqueen

and last but not least:

"all things considered, i'd rather be me"
-bfnh

Folks hatin on BET needs to chill. No cable entertainment television station should bear the responsibility of teaching and eduacting and entire people. People screaming they wanna see some more educational shows on BET, but that's not BET's job or responsibility. It's an entertainment cable station, not a school. I like BET. I can stand to watch all the shows that come on the channel. Folks acting like they don't watch BET, but they know they do. I admit that they do show more videos than needed, but that's their bread and butter and as an entertainment channel, they shouldn't abandon it. Live form LA is really a nice show that showcases black talent that you wouldn't otherwise see on TV. And the show is funny and fresh. This self hatred needs to stop. This jealousy and envy needs to stop. When I watch Comic View, I enjoy seeing black comedians doing black humor that mainstream stations won't even consider. It's called "Comic View" and people expect to see some type of political show. If you don't like black comedians, then don't watch black comedians. BET is not gonna tell black comedians what comedy they can do and what they can't. As far as the raunch in the videos, I don't like it either, but BET didn't direct the videos. Blame the greedy ass record companies and artists for puttin that crap in the videos. BET have video shows that showcase the latest videos, they don't control the making of the video. The same videos for songs that go quadruple platinum, so somebody's buying and enjoying the songs and videos. You haters don't place responsibility like this on any other station. MTV show the same shit over and over again and there ain't negative MTV posts on here. They show the same videos as BET, but no one says anything. This self hatred needs to stop.

do i hear another?

Princeguy: Have you followed the progression of this entire dialog (I can't tell because NOW you wanna jump in from the peanut gallery after damn near a month of this)? If you REALLY paid attention you would see that few are hating just to hate. Quite a few of us would sinmply like to see BET increase the quality of their programs. You say, if you don't like it, then don't watch and I say it would be a disservice to the network(s) to simply bail on them. I see tis more as an attempt to put forth suggestion as to how to make it better. In doing so (as Koala agrees), we need to determine what it is we don't like and then figure out a way to get the point across. I've come to your defense in other posts when folk were trying to jump on you for YOUR beliefs, and now it's time for you to step back and observe that several of the viewpoints made THROUGHOUT this discussion have validity. What if someone had said to you while you were descibing your beliefs regarding homosexuality had said, "If you don't like it, ignore it"? Don't you as a good steward have a responsibility to speak truth regardless of whether it'll make you popular or not (and at risk of being called a "hater")? Please explain how we would like BET to tighten up their quality, business practices, or diversify their progrmming makesus a hater, but when you were sharing YOUR beliefs it was simply speaking truth. You're frankly being a biot hypocritical. I agree that there are plenty who just wanna knock BET for the sake of knocking it, but here we have folk that are actually trying to implement some change WITH suggestions.

K: I find it interesting that you would be so quick to imply "Ah someone else who is reasonable" simply based on them agreeing with you. Did you ask THIS guy where the answers to your questions? How is it that the those on the opposite side of your argument need to justify themselves and not those who agree (or seem to) with the stance you defend. Similarly, I'd like to see YOUR answers to your own survey just in the interest of fairness.
---
All that aside, I (and I'd venture to say teh rest of those you have labeled "BET haters") appreciate your commentary. Originally (in another post), it was stated that for those who disagree this simply isn't your fight. If you enjoy BET as it is, the cool. IF YOU DON'T enjoy it as it then why not do something besides complain? K started THIS topic to get folk to quantify their viewing habits in an effort to determine the actual patterns of thse who were "complaining". This was done. NOw you wish to go BACKWARD to discussing the validity of the complaints. Frankly, this was done already both here and in General Discussion. If you didn't get your opinion sid then, I'm sorry. Perhaps it would be better to go read those threads because very little new information is coming from THIS version of that debate.
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How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

>K: I find it interesting that
>you would be so quick
>to imply "Ah someone else
>who is reasonable" simply based
>on them agreeing with you.
>Did you ask THIS guy
>where the answers to your
>questions? How is it that
>the those on the opposite
>side of your argument need
>to justify themselves and not
>those who agree (or seem
>to) with the stance you
>defend. Similarly, I'd like to
>see YOUR answers to your
>own survey just in the
>interest of fairness.

I never made any such implication as to my judgement of his opinons- i simply said i heard one little voice in the wind. i never said that i agreed with that voice- or that that person denmonstrated quite clearly that they have a very reasonable handle on what televison is as opposed to some grandious notion of what it should be. I only said i hear what this guy is saying.

Come on Boodah- you know how slick i am.


K

...your should have said:

I hear ANOTHER lonely voice in the wind. :-)

HAHAHA!

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How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

at the time when that one voice posted this thread was pretty silent- as such i didnt hear another voice in the wind i only heard the one.

Furthermore this is a line from an old negore spiritual- cant go changing the lyrics- you can mumble em and get away with it but no changes allowed.

K

You aren't slick enough for me to have not notcied haow your ignored the part of my post where I asked for YOUR viewership :-)

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How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

slick enough to put it in another post while you were typing this one tee hee

Boodah, for the folks who aren't hating on BET for the sake of hatin', then this doesn't apply to them. My response was more so because of the fact that overall and consistently BET seems to be the only CABLE ENTERTAINMENT STATION that's gets attacked and criticised so unfairly, when I don't see anything BET does that other cable stations aren't doing. It's entertatinment and people are acting like they should always "learn" something from watching BET. That's not BET's responsibility. Why are people on here putting BET under the microscope so much. It's the self hatred that I don't like. It's the envy that I don't like. I consider BET to be a blessing to black people in America. Everything isn't gonna be perfect but that doesn't mean you jump on it and just throw it away.

>Quite a few of us
>would sinmply like to see
>BET increase the quality of
>their programs

This is not what's being said. People are out for blood from BET. They recklessly try to make it out to be an evil demon or something. They get malicous with their words about BET. They don't express that they "simply" anything. And what does this have to do with God's view on homosexuality? We're talking about B-E-T, not G-O-D. Boodah, my post wasn't directed specifically towards you, it's to the haters who know they watch BET, but just hate to be "down". Because it's now vogue to hate on BET. The followers who don't think for themselves, but just want acceptance from others.

Yes. I agree that BET has room for improvement, but so does every station. There will never be a perfect station, because people have different tastes. But, I mean, what has BET done that's so wrong. Why people acting like they don't watch videos or watch black comedians all of a sudden? Nobody should be watching tv 24/7 anyway. But I enjoy Live from LA, Comic View, and some of the videos. It's entertainment. I blame the videos on the record companies, and not BET. BET can't become "the censor station". Especially when most the people complainin will just watch the videos on MTV anyway. How am I being hypocritical by voicing my support for BET and showing my disdain for all the folks hatin on BET?

> Boodah, for the folks who
>aren't hating on BET for
>the sake of hatin', then
>this doesn't apply to them.

Then why comment HERE? The viewpoint that "some of y'all are haters" has already been made, duly noted, and addressed. This BET thing has been going on for a while, and truthfully the discussions that have been taking place on THIS board have been more toward "So what are you gonna do about it" realm.

>I don't see anything BET
>does that other cable stations
>aren't doing.

Funny, cause THIS is how thins thing got started. A player originally said "The NAACP is boycotting the entertainment networks for a lack of quality Black/minority programming (among ohter things) why does/should BET get away with the same thing?" they also said, "for those of us who sit and complain about how we would like better programming on BET what are we doing to get our voice heard?" Fro THAT the idea of some sort of boycott/protest was born and after a whole lot of bantering back and forth about "who are you to boycott" and "do you even know what a boycott reall is", here we are now. For you to jump in with the "Quit Hating" arguement is really adding nothing at the stage we are at now.That's why I said, go back through this post and the others floating arount OkayActivist to see the pregression of the discussion.

>It's entertatinment and
>people are acting like they
>should always "learn" something from
>watching BET.

Why not learn something? TV doesn't have to be just mental junkfood? What's so wrong with being entertained and learning/teaching something at the same time? Again, if BET only wantes to be the Black comedy/video channel then say that. Some (not all) would like to see "our" station reflect a broader range of what we find entertaining. Videos and comedy are fine, but more than 90% of BET programming is music related and even THOSE shows get run into the ground. Don't even get me started on their business practices concerning "Comic View". Those comics you see are being taken advantage of just like workers in a sweatshop. It's akin to a recording artist getting jobbed by a record label, if for no other reason than they aren't paying what the work is worth. Period. This has been well publicized and discussed. You turn on your TV and laugh without recognizing that teh stuff you are watching is people being pimped.

>That's not BET's
>responsibility. Why are people on
>here putting BET under the
>microscope so much.

Why not? If you are going to tout yourself as "The Black Network" then your gotta take the responsibility that comes with it. If you're only looking out for delf, then say so. Perhaps folk put them (BET) under the microscope because they feel that they expect "others" to treat us/them crappy, but expect more from one of "our own". I DO recognize that there are those that just hate to see someone else succeed where they aren't, but those folk have weeded themselves out already.

>It's the
>self hatred that I don't
>like. It's the envy that
>I don't like.

Why does dislike of BETs programming decisions/business practices have to translate to self hatred? Frankly, it DOESN'T really translate to HATE of BET. I love me some me (just like I love BET and all things that are part of my culture). You're being a bit judgemental.

>I consider BET to be a blessing
>to black people in America.

So do I. As such I'm going to sit by and let them pump out just any old thing either.

>Everything isn't gonna be perfect
>but that doesn't mean you
>jump on it and just
>throw it away.

It also doesn't mean that you have to just roll with imperfection. As a Christian you know full well that one should strive to be the best they can and not settle. No one is talking about "Throwing BET away". Where did you get that from?

>This is not what's being said.
>People are out for blood
>from BET. They recklessly try
>to make it out to
>be an evil demon or
>something.

Not here they don't. Again I say LOOK at the posts in this thread. Do you see how much BET we watch and how long we've been doing it. I can say PERSONALLY that I have fought to get BET on a couple of cable systems because I wanted to see Black folk have the opportunity to have representation. If you're speaking about folk outside of this post/board then you're screaming at the wrong folk. You said you aren't talking to me. Fine. So who are your talking to, and are they even here to hear you?

>And what does this have to do with God's
>view on homosexuality? We're talking
>about B-E-T, not G-O-D.

I was referring to a series of threads where you made your opinions known amongst a group of people with differing opinions. I ventured to say that you felt a certain amount of responsibility to pick up your banner and not just "watch the crowd go by". I remember how you were called names and attacked. Now I'm likening this to your running up in here calling folk haters. I'm wondering why you don't allow the same grace (in terms of saying what you felt to be right without being called a homophobe) to folk who strive to make their opinions known about BET thgat I demanded for you? You label folks as a "hater" and then go so far as to make psychological evaluations of them (all that "self-hate" business). I ask are you NOT being judgemental?

>...The followers who don't think
>for themselves, but just want
>acceptance from others.

I say be careful who you paint with that brush. Fine, you werent talking to me, I'm still going to ask you to quantify who are you to judge that someone is doing this or not.

>I agree that BET has
>room for improvement, but so
>does every station.

But right now we're talking about BET. You agree that some form of change would be nice, SO WHAT ARE YOU GONNA DO ABOUT IT?? Don't YOU be one of those who is contennt to see the need for change but wait for someone else to make it happen. Isn't this what you said you disliked about the "haters" (going with the flow I mean)?

>But, I mean, what has
>BET done that's so wrong.

What have they done wrong in YOUR eyes (you said they could do better yourself)? You wanna know what folk are fussing about specifically, I say READ ALL THE POSTS.

>Why people acting like they
>don't watch videos or watch
>black comedians all of a
>sudden?

Who said either of those things?

>How am I being hypocritical by
>voicing my support for BET
>and showing my disdain for
>all the folks hatin on
>BET?

Because frankly you're doing the same thing in reverse. And on top of that you agree with the folks you're labeling.
------QUOTE STARTS HERE------
Help BooDaah STAY the Moderator for the OkayActivism Board....

Fill Angiee's Mailbox full of requests for me (HAHA she'll LOOOOVE THAT!!!)

How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

>How much BET do you watch-
>daily, weekly, etc.

at least 3-4 hours a day during the week and maybe two more hours on teh weekend.

>When do you typically watch BET?

5-8 pm then again at 11

>What do you watch on BET?

Rap City, Hits, BET tonight, knowing and understanding your credit

>What are you looking for on
>BET?

documentary and real life broadcasting. Let's get cameras into the Hip Hop scene- lets see what black families live like nowadays- lets take it to the streets (problem is alot of the BET haters will not lilke what they see).

>Do you watch the commercials on
>BET?

Yes- I need to clarify why I asked this question. if you're not watching the commercials not only are you missing out on the opportunity to see which sponsors you should be fond of for their contribution to BET but also you miss the promos for other BET programming. If you flip channels as soon as Rap City leads into a break youd hardly know about Heart and Soul or BET tonight- I think that may be part of the problem.

>How long have you been watching
>BET?

at least since 92

>What is your favorite BET show
>and why?

Rap City- I love to see Black people enjoying themselves; whether they're slinging or balling or being righteous or whatever- it is heartwarming every time i see a smile stretch across a black man or womans face. It is perpetually glorious to me even if some of those smiles have none of its original teeth.

>What is your least favorite BET
>show?

Gospel is not really my thing so if Im going to tune out at any point it will be on Sundays.

>What other television media do you
>watch regularly?

News and information: CNN, CNBC, Mtv, E, Network and sub netwrok (wb and upn and shit)- I watch alot of television.

>finally- name 10 BET shows.

Rap city, Heart and Soul, BET Tonight (denzel was on last night),Out the Box, Comic View, Teen Summit, All, Hits, Lead Story.

>give it a try please- the
>road to change doesnt always
>have to start off with
>opposing the status quo.
>
>K


Yo I illustrate and design • for dose doin crimes • totin heat and in the streets like yellow lines • And Im here ta represent for em • So bow down to dem cats dat swing DOWNTOWN

It's funny because your responses don't differ that greatly from some us "haters".

My next question is:

What do YOU suggest (and what are you doing to implement) getting some of those things you say you would like to see mad and shown?

------QUOTE STARTS HERE------
Help BooDaah STAY the Moderator for the OkayActivism Board....

Fill Angiee's Mailbox full of requests for me (HAHA she'll LOOOOVE THAT!!!)

How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

experiencing technical difficulty

My suggestion is that beyond all those other programming ideas BET needs saturday morning cartoons- thats my forte, but you couldnt imagine how long its taking me to bring those ideas to light.

Im an illustrator and animator- as such my contribution will be the actual productions I put forth and the projects I lend my hand to. Thats a lot of work as such there's nothing more i can do for the other programming instances you guys have issues with.

As my work becomes available and popular i hope my influence can find its way into the BET line-up but even then- ill be repsonsible for producing so much material that making suggestions and demands for change will hardly fit in my schedule.

Thats why I suggested that okayplayers get together and start developping their own programming as well- Im doing it but doing it alone is killing me and if Im still alone when its done I dont know how much success it will have.

No matter how good my shows are- if nobody is watching BET nobody will be watching my shows- and for several reasons I have no intention of going anywhere else with my ideas.


K

>..BET
>needs saturday morning cartoons

I think this is a fan-freaking-tastic idea. A danger I see (one of many) is that one of the ways people won't watch is if they put you on at the crack of dawn and shove 50,000 commercials into your show. This is the VERY thing I'm talking about. Not a TOTAL lack of quality programming, but moreso the lack of diversity in programming. If they put YOUR show on, something is either gonna have to get bumped or dropped. From a business standpoint it's easier (and cheaper) to just throw some videos on than to pay you what your work is worth. Not only that but you would need to be careful to not "sell your soul" like the comedians did/do. What if they bought say 13 episodes of your show and then ran them forever without you getting residuals? That would suck right? I'm sure you're smarter than that, but some folks wanna "get on" so bad that they'll agree to damn near anything. Ask Bro. Macgruder (OkayPlayer FreeHuey) why there's no Boondocks cartoon on BET. I'm sure he could throw a little light on this.

>.. but you couldnt
>imagine how long its taking
>me to bring those ideas
>to light.

You knwo what my brother, you really have no idea how much I DO know about it. It was my greatest desire (and probably still is) to be an animator and part of the reason why I'm not doing it is because of the politics of it. Even beyond animation, as an artist I DO know how hard it is to "birth" an idea and then to try to get it seen.

>Thats a lot of work as
>such there's nothing more i
>can do for the other
>programming instances you guys have
>issues with.

So then let us fight this good fight from whatever direction "we" choose because ultimately we're both striving for the EXACT same goal. Without you (and those like you) we have nothing to hold up as quality, and without us you have no one to champion the idea that there is a market for what you're offering.

>Thats why I suggested that okayplayers
>get together and start developping
>their own programming as well-
>Im doing it but doing
>it alone is killing me
>and if Im still alone
>when its done I dont
>know how much success it
>will have.

There are many of us who that is not our forte (generating new programming), our forte is demanding a spot for that programming. Each has to fight according to where his strength lies right?


>No matter how good my shows
>are- if nobody is watching
>BET nobody will be watching
>my shows- and for several
>reasons I have no intention
>of going anywhere else with
>my ideas.

I would jus hate for YOU or BET to decide that nobody will be watching without giving us a chance to.
------QUOTE STARTS HERE------
Help BooDaah STAY the Moderator for the OkayActivism Board....

Fill Angiee's Mailbox full of requests for me (HAHA she'll LOOOOVE THAT!!!)

How's THAT for pandering HMMMM???

I dont mind commercials as long as Im in command of the media I produce. the thing about Koala is that he doesnt give a fuck about getting on or getting paid. Ice Cube said it best- i did this shit when i was broke I have no problem going back.

I dont know why Aaron doesnt have a cartoon on BET- I wasnt even aware that he was interested in animation. We actually met a long time ago- but neither of us would remember each other.

As for my work- Ill do it no mater who buys it who watches it etc. If I cant have things my way- Ill cut the shit straight to dvd and sell it on the web.

koala does not give a fuck- my inspiration is Dawud Anubwile who did Brotherman- he never had one bit of corporate support yet and still and lot of heads know exactly what brotherman was- I know specifically what it meant to me and as long as i can bring that - quality, energy, and experience to my people i will be satisfied.

K

Personally, I'd rather see BET narrow its focus. Stick to the videos. Show more diversity in videos programming. I'd rather see more videos than reruns of Sparks. They might be wiser to spin off their informational programming to another channel, though that may not be viable. Even with his millions Bob Johnson is a small fry in comparison to Viacom.

I hope other minority entertainment ventures have the opportunity to enter the arena and give Bob some company. Also, I think his focused has shifted from the channel, to his other ventures like restuarant franchises--which has a much wider profit margin-- and now the airline. He doesn't seem to be putting much into growing BET. He needs to spend more dough on improving programming and maintaining talent like Ananda & Ed Gordon who went on to money-greener pastures.

But, everytime I muster sympathy for Bob, I catch a spelling error on a video title, and I'm just disgusted.


http://midnightfusion.com
http://www.mp3.com/midnightfusion

Simple questions.

*How much BET do you watch- daily, weekly, etc.
Zero! I don't have cable, but it would probably somewhere between 2 - 5 hours at the most. (I use to watch for the occasional music video and BET tonight)

*When do you typically watch BET?
Use to watch at varius hours (had 3 days off and I suffer frominsomnia) I'd watch as early as possible (after te infomercials) and as late as 2/3 am.

*What do you watch on BET?
BET tonight, the show with Tavis Smiley and the video shows once ina while. NOT COMIC VIEW! Da shit is garbage! (esp. the way BET treats the comedians!)

*What are you looking for on BET?
Good entertainment. Not oscar/emmy worthy stuff, but palatable stuff at least!!

*Do you watch the commercials on BET?
Most times...no. Same with the other networks.

*How long have you been watching BET?
6/7 years

*What is your favorite BET show and why?
BET tonight, they cover topics of today, primarily dealing with the Africans in america.

*What is your least favorite BET show?
Comic view.

*What other television media do you watch regularly?
PBS (when they're not on that british BS!!) Some of the "big 3" networks programs (ER, 3rd Watch, sports shows, etc)

*finally- name 10 BET shows.
I won't even attempt to, it's been 8/9 months since I've actually sat down and watched that station.

Peace2U,
Ré Alief
_____
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