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Topic subjectThe Black Man/White Woman thing....
Topic URLhttp://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=22&topic_id=23285
23285, The Black Man/White Woman thing....
Posted by guest, Thu Jul-13-00 06:37 AM
i was thinking about this the other day and i decided to share my thoughts. i've always had this kinda complex attitude about brothas with white girls. first of all, i think if a brotha wants a white girl, let him have one. i think he may as well go ahead and get what he wants rather than giving me grief because he's secretly wanting her, and i'm not even headed in her direction (and don't want to). that being said, though, i don't feel brothas should be with white girls, but it's not out of hostility towards white girls, it's out of love for my brothas. honestly, i believe that the two of us are one. we are complimentary to one another in every way - the Creator made us this way. there is more to true male -female "relationships" than most of us realize, and while a brotha may experience happiness with a white girl, i believe that there is potential inside of us that is only realized in true partnership with someone who was created specifically for us. and i don't think white girls were created for Black men. anyway, i know this may be perceived as the same ole' negativity about inter-racial relationships, but it's honestly not meant in that spirit. i just think brothas have so much unrealized potential - and it won't be realized until they first find themselves, and then connect with the other half of themselves - a true sista.
23286, RE: The Black Man/White Woman thing....
Posted by janey, Thu Jul-13-00 06:45 AM
I was completely with you until you raised an argument about who was "created" for whom. I think that in general people will be able to form a deeper bond with someone with whom they share as much as possible, and race and race issues form an enormous part of our nonconscious attitudes, beliefs and ideologies. I would expect that most people will want to bond with someone who has similar experiences to theirs.

But people share different things, and if two people find a deep bond that is formed without regard to race, or through understanding arising from differences rather than arising from similarities, I'm not going to argue with them.

One love.
23287, RE: The Black Man/White Woman thing....
Posted by guest, Thu Jul-13-00 06:49 AM
It used to irk me to see black men with white women but I've come to realize that if the essence of that person is who they fell in love with then who am I to complain about it. The only issue I have with interracial dating is when a person will only date that particular race..(meaning a black man will only date a white woman). I think all options need to be kept open. Personally I don't think I'll ever date a white man but I haven't ruled it out. If I meet a white man and he has qualites that interest me I just might. Touching on your point about the black woman being created for the black man I don't agree. I believe GOD created us ALL and he see's no color, if you go back far enough in time we were all created from the same seed. The prejudices(sp) and issues we have with race, we created ourselves. This is my first post of which I replied with any real substance..so don't be mean to me alright!!! This is just one person's opinion. :)
23288, RE: The Black Man/White Woman thing....
Posted by janey, Thu Jul-13-00 06:55 AM
One of the things that worries me about taking the "created for" argument is that this is exactly the same argument used by the State of Virginia in 1967 when an interracial couple sued the State because they wanted to get married.

The all white court said, in essence, "God made all different races and wanted them to be separate, as evidenced by the fact that He put them on different continents." They denied the couple the right to marry.

The Supreme Court of the U.S. overturned the decision and the choice of who we marry has been considered a fundamental right since then (part of the "privacy" right). Interestingly, the couple in question was a white man and a Black woman.

May all beings be happy.
23289, Did you say NINETEEN-67?
Posted by DJ_scratch_N_sniff, Thu Jul-27-00 05:43 PM
that's One-NINE-Six-Seven? I'm not doubting it but i am surprised...
23290, RE: Did you say NINETEEN-67?
Posted by janey, Fri Jul-28-00 05:19 AM
Yep. Scary, huh? The case is Loving v. Virginia. I can give you a link to the case if you'd like.

Now, the other thing to keep in mind is that 1967 is the year that this was decided by the federal Supreme Court. There are a couple of things to keep in mind when thinking about that fact. That case made it the law of the nation -- which means that Virginia and every other state had to follow that law. But that DOESN'T mean that no state allowed interracial marriage before 1967. Probably some did. But Virginia sure didn't and certainly at least some other states didn't.

Also, this same issue might have been determined the very same way ten, twenty, fifty years before IF it had been presented to the Supreme Court. But it wasn't. The Supreme Court can only make decisions, interpret the Constitution, and thereby create binding precedent when it is presented with a case. So we all depend on people who find themselves in an untenable situation to take the initiative and challenge laws such as this.

But also, chew on this for a while. It is now and has been for ten years or so (I can also get the exact date of this case if you like) the law that states have the right if they so choose to create laws that make "sodomy" illegal (look up the word, it means a lot more than you might think). That issue was decided in a case in which two men were discovered in a sexual act in their bedroom by a policeman who had been admitted to the home by a visitor to the home (i.e., not even a resident in the home). The cop was there on other business, and happened to look through a bedroom door that was slightly ajar, and saw two men making love. Arrested 'em. This was in Georgia. Long story short, Georgia lower courts held that the law was okay, and the judgment was ultimately appealed to the federal Supreme Court because one of the men (and his lawyers and pretty much everyone else) believed that passing a law that made a consensual act illegal must violate the federal Constitution. The Supreme Court said, no, if the state had a good reason to pass the law, then it doesn't offend the right to privacy.

A few years ago, the same case then found its way to the Georgia Supreme Court, which decided that the law was over intrusive and struck it down.

But we're still living in a country in which the federal Supreme Court has said that states can pass laws telling us what we can and can't do in our bedrooms.

What do you think about that?

Peace
23291, very scary
Posted by DJ_scratch_N_sniff, Sun Jul-30-00 01:27 PM
if it ain't too much trouble i'd like that link... very scary.
23292, Here 'tis
Posted by janey, Mon Jul-31-00 04:26 AM
http://oyez.nwu.edu/cases/cases.cgi?command=show&case_id=214&page=abstract

From this link you can also link to the full opinion.

There are lots of good books out there on the Supreme Court and its important decisions. The very best, in my opinion, is Laurence Tribe's "American Constitutional Law", but that's pretty expensive and covers more than the First Amendment, which is really what we all are most interested in on a day-to-day basis.

There's also a book called "May It Please The Court" that contains actual transcripts of some key arguments before the S.C. and I'm pretty sure this is the one that also has a CD with some of the arguments on it. Very instructive.

Peace.
23293, P.S. X 2
Posted by janey, Mon Jul-31-00 04:50 AM
1. Note that my personal hero, Chief Justice Earl Warren, wrote the opinion.

2. I just realized that the summary doesn't include the date that the case was decided. Really, click on the link on that page and just read the facts of the case. You'll be amazed and scared at the ferocity of the Virginia statute.

Peace
23294, Works in theory
Posted by guest, Thu Jul-13-00 07:12 AM
But in the real world we All have a great distance to go before we reach the state of what you signify as being "true." In my estimation "Whites" have a long way to go in terms of realizing their true selves (as opposed to the vicious lie that would deem them White- I go into this elsewhere) and coupling with that willfull abandonment of culture is especially dangerous for Blacks but any sister or brother also has that distance to go as well and as such its hard to quantify how far any of us have left on the path to true social enlightenement.

Its reasonable enough to say that thus far none of us have gotten there yet so quantifying how far we've come or even how much farther we've come than others doesnt really matter much.

Speaking personally there is a bond that I have with my Black girlfriend that I have never experienced before in my life- but Ive dated both black and "white" women and can say honestly that women on either side of (bullshit) race classifications are misguided and far from "true".
Even the two of us still have a great deal of ideas that are in much need of correction but to hold each other responsible for repairing those ideas is co-dependence and thats not necessarily healthy.

I think any of us will find that the idea of the "true sista" might just be too much for any person to bear- be they Black or White and I wonder if there is a difference between underestimating Black women and dating white ones or overestimating Black women and engaging in relationships that still dont work.

If Im not actively engaged in completing myself as an independent man or realizing that I am already whole- then adopting a Black woman as if she can complete me will provide a detriment to each of us reaching our full potential as people.

if a black man and a black woman only represent themselves as halves from the start then they are already diminishing their potential. Why settle for two halves making a whole when you can bring together two wholes...


The truth is we all have much much more to learn about ourselves and to stall that development to consider how far others have come will not be fortuitous in your personal development even if its for teh sake of loving a sista who you might think will fulfill your life. The twisted psychological baggage of teh people around you is just as bottomless as your own- it may soothe you to peer down into their idiosynchracies but you might just be better off repairing your own.

If you are somehow not complete today you will continue to be incomplete when you take on a partner even if culturally you presume that they share in your identity. By taking on someone else's half you only sacrifice your potential of being independently and individually whole.


K
23295, RE: Works in theory
Posted by guest, Thu Jul-13-00 08:27 AM
just to clarify the "two halves" thing...by no means do i feel that we are not complete people without a mate. but in Islam, we're taught that 'Marriage is half of your faith." at first i was rebellious because i thought it meant unless you're married, you're not a true Muslim. but later on i discussed it with my mom, and it means that although it's all well and good to be on our own, our faith is tested on a whole other level when we enter into marriage because we are then on the path to becoming one with the Creator as well as becoming one with another person - both of which are not easy. at that point we get to know ourselves not only through our own eyes, but through the eyes of another. hopefully we learn and grow in ways that would be impossible without the "tension" / complementarity (however you wanna see it) created through a relationship. so when i say we're two halves, i don't mean we're worthless as long as we're single, i mean our union with one another enables us to grow on a deeper level.
23296, well then
Posted by guest, Thu Jul-13-00 09:42 AM
If those are your beliefs then by those premises alone you could fairly extend those properties between ANY two people, race classifications are hardly observed by Allah- and are also disregarded by the Qu'ran.

Your presumption that Black men and White women are not fitting to "become one with the Creator as well as becoming one with another person" is certainly not the way of Islam as Islam would encourage all people to become one with the Creator.

Sista- if it bothers you, it bothers you- thats ok. But dont let it get into your head in such a fashion that you'll need to adjust your religion to fit it in.

At the heart of the matter race is a lie and we should be more concerned with that than this - a mere consequence of the greater lie.

Ask yourself, do you have a problem with Black men dating Latino women or maybe Indian women, or "bi-racial" men dating anybody? Do you realize that biologically and scientifically there is no race variance among human peoples- as such the differences you're offended by are cultural and ethnic ones. Do you have a problem with Black men dating German or Irish women?

Unless you're willing to claim that any ethnicity is inferior to another then the only problem that remains is that "white" culture persists to perpetuate superiority ideology and you would rather Black men not fall for it.

well in that you have a legitimate concern- but please make sure that you're not falling for it either.

K
23297, RE: Works in theory
Posted by SankofaII, Sun Jul-23-00 04:47 PM
dayam koalalove,
is there EVER a day that goes by in which you DO NOT speak TRUTH?? :)

ryan




Check Out My New Signature, Fam:

"If you don't like me, I'll punch you
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--Vin Diesel (THE FACE--MAY 2000)

"It is essential that non-gay black people recognize and respect the hardships, the difficulties black gay people experience, extending the love and understanding that is essential for the making of an authentic black community".
--bell hooks

"Homosexual persecution and condemnation has at its roots not only social ignorance, but a philosophically active anti-feminist dogma".
--Lorraine Hansberry

"Isn't it a shame? A black man invented the clock, and some black folks still don't know what time it is".
--Jewel McCabe"


"When a star shines, you get the light several million years later, and the star's probably dead by the time you get the light. I'd rather be the moon".
--Me'Shell Ndegeocello


"Being a healthy black gay adult is doubly hard, considering the propaganda to the contrary".
--Me'Shell Ndegeocello
23298, i'm saying!
Posted by naame, Thu Jul-27-00 08:29 PM
what we have is much more than they can see. - george benson
23299, I don't agree....
Posted by illosopher, Thu Jul-13-00 07:28 AM
Look i feel like Black men and women need have more healthy relationships no doubt. I feel like our relationships has been retarded by the legacy of slavery and racism and discriminatory economic system. I undertstand that and champion that cause. But if i as a black male am attrrcted and related to a white woman (this happens alot in the small college town i'm in), i'll date her cuase what says i'm obligated to date black women. I refuse to limit myself to one demographic group. I think black women need to face their inferiority complex towards white women. Black women need to not feel so betrayed by bruhs who date white women. I feel like black women feed into the white beauty myth and try to combat it by trashing white women by saying shit
"Those white bitches, blah, blah, look at them"
"Look at those ugly white girls, they aint shit!"
But deep in their hearts you see the inferiority from feeding in to a BULLSHIT WHITE BEAUTY MYTH. I feel like Black Women are very Beautiful but until they accept they're own beauty they will always have a complex. They always will be rocking long weaves, blond streaks, blue contacts, and other bullshit cosmetic products that try to cover up your beautiful Afrikaness.
It's funny cuz i know mad sistas i tries to holler at but they played cuz they like you some intellectual shit (*Note in major cities and quality universities they're are many Black Women who dig intellectual and culturally aware Black Men, But where i'm at this doesn't exist) I find myself dating liberal minded white women or international women from Africa or Latin America. These people relate to me better cuz they have interest in politics and philosophy (history, diversity in music. I'm in a hip-hop but i listen R&B, Soul, Rock, Blues, Jazz, World Beat, etc. Up here its all about 504 Boyz, the LOX, (I can say there more white folks who rock Black Star and Common and Coltrane and blacks at my school)
*Note this is where i'm at i would like to meet some of the sistas that post on these boards cuz yall don't exist where i'm at...
I think if you find someone to realte to, you should go with it, ya mean...
All i can say is find a man who is good for you...
no matter what background and enjoy life...

love a brother who cares about the sistas but who may date a white lady

23300, RE: The Black Man/White Woman thing....
Posted by guest, Thu Jul-13-00 08:20 AM
My Jay is my best friend. He is black, I am Native-American. We have so much in common, and at times, I think, I wonder if I'm gonna marry him? Another thing that is so fascinating to me is how our different cultures have experienced oppression, and how we've both dealt with it, and keep learning about it. At times, we are perfect and we compliment each other in every way. We try to keep open minds and grow each day together. I love him!
I consider Jay one of my true soul mates. And while I'm not sure if I consider him my "half," I know he is a part of me, and I a part of him. Whomever you love, you love, despite differences. I'm not completely feeling the comment that black bros' potential "won't be realized until they first find themselves, and then connect with the other half of themselves - a true sista." Maybe because secretly I hope Jay's my half, and I'm not a sista!

"I'm so bored of cowards who say what they want, then they can't handle." Bjork, 5 Years
Peace}}i{{Love}}i{{Empathy
23301, RE: The Black Man/White Woman thing....
Posted by BurbKnight, Thu Jul-13-00 08:36 AM
i don't know...... I can't see myself being with any other woman but a black woman. Not saying that i won't date a woman outside my race, but more than likely I won't...... maybe that's why I am alone now,not a lot of black folks in my side of town. And the ones that are on my side of town, are either married or got boyfriends.

But I just love black women..... It just seems like I could be complete with a black woman. Maybe it's a cultural thing..... the fact that our families have gone through the same things and we can talk about issues, is a really strong reason why I love black women.

Don't get me wrong, there are a lot of fine white, hispanic and asian women, but a black woman just seems complete with me.

The intellect thing is what seems to get me..... seems like a lot of black women don't want you unless you have been in prison and got 15 children these days (not saying that is true for all of my sistas, just the ones that I tried to holla at).... naah mean?

Peace!!!!!!

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23302, I love you Burb!
Posted by Dove, Thu Jul-13-00 05:14 PM
do your thang :-)
Dove
~Sheepish Lordess of Chaos~

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23303, sad but true.............
Posted by gemini, Fri Jul-14-00 11:05 AM
the "ghetto-ization" of our culture, maybe??

It's weird too, that most of my peers (educated, single black women) hold these contradictory standards when it comes to who they will date, and don't do anything to try and work on the emotional problems that a lot of us have that make us "undateable"........

I'm playin' Shakespeare, makin' up words and ish........but do you know what I'm sayin'?

"Y'all don't believe fat meat greasy!!"-my mama

"Unhappy People Smell Like Chitlins"
-'Stress
23304, RE: sad but true.............
Posted by illosopher, Fri Jul-28-00 05:25 AM
Heavy point!
23305, RE: The Black Man/White Woman thing....
Posted by guest, Fri Jul-14-00 10:49 AM
Black men have inspired me to look beyond color in an individual. There was a time when white/other men came on to me and I felt as if I would somehow betray myself (and my people) by accepting an invitation for a date. The irony here is that I live in a place where interracial dating is like second nature for black men though many sista’s are following suit in growing numbers. I have high hopes of marrying a strong, proud, beautiful and brilliant black man and raising numerous healthy children.

I truly believe that this whole black man/white woman thing has divided the sexes and created alot of unneeded tension in the community. But one thing I’ve learned from my surrounding environment is: find love where you can because if you wait around too long (in this day and age) you may not find it at all.
23306, can I hug you?
Posted by Dove, Fri Jul-14-00 04:19 PM
>find love where you can because if you wait around too long (in this day and age) you may not find it at all

That is the most on point quote I've seen in a long time. So true.

Dove
~Sheepish Lordess of Chaos~


23307, My perspective...
Posted by Tank, Fri Jul-14-00 12:00 PM
I have never been so racially obcessed until I came to this country, I truly never gave a fuck before coming here. In engerland I messed with Nubians and crackas and the shades in between but at the same time I was not with a Nubian or a cracka, I was with (insert name here).

Since coming here I see a whole new perspective on things that I never knew existed - people actually care and obcess over colour lines. Crikey, I have had to relearn a lot of shit.

So this is my dilema - I truly do not care what colour/race/nationality you identify with, however I see you all do and so I have to become aware of it in order to not be ignorant to others opinions and feelings. Hypothetical situation for you - I love a Nubian brother, not becuase he is Nubian but because I love him. He Loves my cracka self not because he is in denial of his Nubian self but because I make him laugh and all those other things that people love me for. Do I deny my feelings so that I do not piss off other Nubian sista's and brotha's or do I follow my heart and risk the consequences?

Remember that I do not think like the american does in regards to race and answer the question. Do I betray myself to not hurt someone I Love, (and that someone is you) or do I Love someone and deal with the ramifications of that Love being misunderstood as an economic/social/cultural boost for either party?

Just wondering... :-)

Peace,

Tank

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"As do many strong people, she had found herself a victim of the tyranny of the weak." Tom Robbins, Even Cowgirls Get the Blues
23308, Tank.
Posted by Dove, Fri Jul-14-00 04:23 PM
:-)
That was great dammit. Can I move to England?

Dove
~Sheepish Lordess of Chaos~


23309, Interesting perspective...
Posted by guest, Fri Jul-14-00 06:28 PM
Tank. It's funny you bring that up! I was discussing that same issue with some friends of mine. I've never been out of the country but I've often heard similar experiences as yours. I do often feel like we are so concious of color and class in the country...it makes me sick! I need to travel and see how things break down elsewhere.

"It could really hurt if you don't know what your doing" (Richie-The Last Dragon)

ONE DAY IT WILL ALL MAKE SENSE - Common

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23310, RE: Interesting perspective...
Posted by SankofaII, Sun Jul-23-00 04:55 PM
dayam, why is everyone talking abotu this? i was having a convo on this similar vein with a close friend of mine from london. he's a black gay man and we were talkingabout how americans are SOOOO race conscious.

it's annoying...everyone i know is obsessed about race. and NOT ONLY if it's black on white dating..hell, i have friends who will NOT date a black person that's darker than them or lighter than them....it's strange how such a simple thing as falling in love with someone can be so complicated and misconstrued b/c of folks fears and ignorance about race.

hmm...it's interesting. i could care less who i'm with..granted, i'm like burb--there are a LOT of beautiful latino/white/asian/native american men out there in this world, but i feel so much more whole being with a brotha. not that i felt like i was half of a human being, but i just seem to get that extra special something from a black man....


Tank...speaking of London, where are some COOL ASS places to live for a black gay man? email me at Nubianman22@hotmail.com

i'm planning on communting between continents in the next 4-6yrs (and possibly going to grad schoolin london).

Ryan




Check Out My New Signature, Fam:

"If you don't like me, I'll punch you
dead in the fucking face"
--Vin Diesel (THE FACE--MAY 2000)

"It is essential that non-gay black people recognize and respect the hardships, the difficulties black gay people experience, extending the love and understanding that is essential for the making of an authentic black community".
--bell hooks

"Homosexual persecution and condemnation has at its roots not only social ignorance, but a philosophically active anti-feminist dogma".
--Lorraine Hansberry

"Isn't it a shame? A black man invented the clock, and some black folks still don't know what time it is".
--Jewel McCabe"


"When a star shines, you get the light several million years later, and the star's probably dead by the time you get the light. I'd rather be the moon".
--Me'Shell Ndegeocello


"Being a healthy black gay adult is doubly hard, considering the propaganda to the contrary".
--Me'Shell Ndegeocello
23311, The myth of global racial tolerance - outside of the US
Posted by nahymsa, Mon Jul-24-00 05:46 AM
Its a lie...

I've traveled extensively outside of the country & have both friends & family that live abroad.

While its not as "in your face" - it is there.

See Frances immigration policy & treatment of Africans

See the treatment of Aborigines in Australia.

See the xtra religious requirements given to African jews that aren't given to European ones.

Don't believe the hype. All over the world racism is a huge problem. The fact that its ignored so that people can get their swerve on across the color line doesn't mean that the problems don't exist.
23312, RE: The myth of global racial tolerance - outside of the US
Posted by SankofaII, Mon Jul-24-00 06:35 AM
true..very true. as soon as i posted, i got online with a friend of mine who's an african jew and she was telling me about all the injustice she experiences on the regular when she's in Europe, trying to attend a synagogue and what not (you DO KNOW that MANY european/white jews don't ACKNOWLEDGE African jews?? crazy...)


it seems like it, but it isn't. hell, i'm sur eyou remember all of those bombings in London that were racially motivated a year or two ago??


no one's perfect--i think we all assume it's different in the states cause of what we SEE on tv and NOT what we experience for real.

ryan




Check Out My New Signature, Fam:

"If you don't like me, I'll punch you
dead in the fucking face"
--Vin Diesel (THE FACE--MAY 2000)

"It is essential that non-gay black people recognize and respect the hardships, the difficulties black gay people experience, extending the love and understanding that is essential for the making of an authentic black community".
--bell hooks

"Homosexual persecution and condemnation has at its roots not only social ignorance, but a philosophically active anti-feminist dogma".
--Lorraine Hansberry

"Isn't it a shame? A black man invented the clock, and some black folks still don't know what time it is".
--Jewel McCabe"


"When a star shines, you get the light several million years later, and the star's probably dead by the time you get the light. I'd rather be the moon".
--Me'Shell Ndegeocello


"Being a healthy black gay adult is doubly hard, considering the propaganda to the contrary".
--Me'Shell Ndegeocello
23313, yep...
Posted by bluetiger, Mon Jul-24-00 06:47 AM
>true..very true. as soon as i
>posted, i got online with
>a friend of mine who's
>an african jew and she
>was telling me about all
>the injustice she experiences on
>the regular when she's in
>Europe, trying to attend a
>synagogue and what not (you
>DO KNOW that MANY european/white
>jews don't ACKNOWLEDGE African jews??
>crazy...)

I heard very similar stories from black muslims who were treated as second class citizens by arab muslims......

Thanks for reading. I love you.

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Black Sabbath - Sabotage
23314, Agreed and disagreed...
Posted by Tank, Tue Jul-25-00 10:42 AM
Don't get me wrong, I was not meaning to convey that it is all lovely dovey in engerland. There are still organisations like the BNP and the NAtional Front, but what I was trying to convey is that it is NO WHERE near the degree it is here.

The majority of people don't have 'Black' or 'white' friends/boyfriends/girlfriends in London, they just have friends...

Peace,

Tank

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"In the path of our happiness shall we find the learning for which we have chosen this lifetime." Richard Bach, Illusions

"As do many strong people, she had found herself a victim of the tyranny of the weak." Tom Robbins, Even Cowgirls Get the Blues
23315, another american attitude...
Posted by guest, Fri Jul-21-00 02:56 AM
..is to do what u want to do, and screw what others think about you. That's how famous artists (not sell-outs) make it to the top - they stick to their guns, even though it might create controversy. Americans seem to love and respect strong independant people.

The fact of the matter is, you can't please everyone - and you'll drive yourself crazy if u think u can. So, don't worry about other people's hang-ups.. that's their issue.

~You can please some people some times, but you can't please everyone all the time~
23316, I'm no essentialist...
Posted by HotThyng76, Mon Jul-17-00 11:15 AM
I don't feel any of us were "made for each other". I connect sentiments like that to the old Adam & Eve Creation story, which I don't believe. Viewpoints like this paint too rosy a picture of relationships. Just cuz you're both Black doesn't mean everything is gonna be Hunky Dory.

And then there's the fact that I'm gay.... It's cute that ppl think men & women are "complimentary", but really it's not like that for all of us.



------
JULY IS HOT THYNG MONTH, DAMMIT.

NEVER FORGET...JULY 25
23317, The Black Man/White Woman thing....
Posted by bluetiger, Mon Jul-17-00 04:44 PM
is a non-issue. It doesn't matter. At all. Ever. It only bothers people obsessed with the false concept of race and colorism. I hope everyone in the world will copulate and procreate with someone who doesn't look exactly like them. It will help the gene pool.

Thanks for reading. I love you.

In Rotation:
Tool - Aenema
Deftones - White Pony
A Perfect Circle - Mer De Noms
Down - Nola
Slum Village - Fantastic Vol II
Black Sabbath - Sabotage
23318, word
Posted by unity, Wed Jul-19-00 09:09 AM
i agree with you 99.9%
the small percentage that does not agree with you is the part of me that understands that many people aren't ready for this yet and race does matter. It will have an impact on your life in a multitude of ways and so it will affect you and whoever you choose as a partner.

personally, i think interracial marriage is great--i wouldn't be here without it. Unless i marry someone who is multiracial as well, i suppose i will technically be marrying interracially myself. My sister-in-law is white and that is just fine with me. i don't really thing about it too often--except now that they are expecting a baby girl, so i have been thinking that i am gonna have to help my sister-in-law with this child's hair... ;-)

Essentially, what i am saying is that the ideal situation is for folks to love, marry, befriend etc. whomever they choose without "race" being a barrier, but in the real world, these false race clasifications that we structure so much of our lives by, will inevitably dictate not only our decisions, but the ways in which we are treated for making these decisions...

not sure if i'm making sense. low blood-sugar making it hard to think clearly. perhaps i'll be back after i get some grub.




"You are the revolution,.....don't wait to see it on the 6 o'clock news. Bear witness to yourself."
--Wise_7

"theres' so much tension and hate in the world that the act of love to your neighbor is trully revolutionary...it's all about thinking differently than the mainstream concerns of now. "
--mayhem

"SO POWERFUL IS THE LIGHT OF UNITY THAT IT CAN ILLUMINATE THE WHOLE EARTH."
--Baha'u'llah
23319, Food for thought?...
Posted by Bronx1, Mon Jul-17-00 05:58 PM
Why Do Black Men Choose
White Women?
©1998/1999 Rosie Milligan, Ph.D


Do Black men perceive White women as more beautiful, sensuous, and submissive than Black women? What impact did the nightmare of slavery have on the Black woman regarding her attitude towards her body and sex? An excerpt from the book...


I want to make it understood that I am not against interracial marriages; everyone should have the right to choose his or her own soul mate. But we are in great need of examining the reasons why Black men are choosing White women...

Let's first examine the Black woman. To understand the present condition of any sex or race, the past condition or history must be examined and understood. Black men have no standard to measure the African American woman other than the European standards. All men must realize that the Black woman has a unique perspective; she has a background and history of her own that is far different from those of women of other ethnic groups.

Many loving relationships have been ruined between Black women and their men because of a lack of knowledge about the Black woman's history. The relationship between White men and Black women were the major factors in creating the brain damage the Black man has today for the White woman.

Black women do not embrace their sexuality as freely and honestly as other women. This is due to her being made to feel ashamed of her body, and due to her history of rape at a very early age. Many White men had their very first (and best) sexual encounters with a Black woman, so that they could keep their own women pure and unspoiled until marriage. They raped the young black female, usually by the age of 13.

I was told by the elders that when the White men entered a Black man's cabin, the Black man was made to leave the cabin or was made to stay and watch. I was told that when the White men finished he would pat the Black man on the head while leaving and the Black man would say "Massa, I hope you liked it." The White man would respond, "Yes, good pussy boy," as he went home to his innocent sleeping beauty. Thus, since White women were not labeled sexually promiscuous savages, they do not come under the scrutiny for their sexual appetites or behavior that Black women do.

A Black woman's sexual experiences, the social setting in which she was reared, her physical capabilities, religious background, and upbringing all have a strong impact and influence on how she genuinely feels about sex; how much she enjoys sex; her willingness to explore various positions an exotic practices during sex. Obviously, the Black woman is still haunted by the effects of slavery on her sexuality. As we approach the new millennium, 135 years post Emancipation Proclamation, Black girls and Black women are still the most frequent victims of rape and assault.

What does all this have to do with Black men choosing White women?

According to the U.S. Census Bureau, one out of every 20 marriages is interracial. There were to 246,000 Blacks married to Whites in this country last year, almost four times the number in 1970. According to statistics, the number of Black men that are married to White women far outnumber any and all other cross-cultural marriages.

The White woman has for years been portrayed as the very essence of beauty and the epitome of all that is good. America has done a great job of selling the White woman. It is not just the Black man who feels his self-esteem heightened by having her. Alternatively, the Black woman has been portrayed very negatively in the media. Only recently having seen her passionately making love. You have seen her raped, abused, and offering to perform oral sex for drugs. The Black woman has been given such titles as gold digger, male basher, sapphire, and bitch.

Girls and women who are victims of physical and sexual abuse have difficulty in the areas of sensuality and sexual intimacy. Yet, Black females continue to search for love and Black men to search for sex. In their quest for love, women get sex and a baby and left alone. Black women want to be loved, not sexed. Black women want their men to come home and help them formulate a definition of Black man and Black woman that works for them. The Black man needs sex as a means of determining his self worth, and the Black woman because of her history, is afraid of it. These differences make communication between the Black male and female on sexual issues very difficult.

Is sex that important to a Black man? Sex is one of the most sought after experiences, and (besides money), is the only factor in our civilized societies that people pursue at the risk of causing harm to themselves. Sex is the only form of gratification within reach for the economically deprived male. He cannot take a weekend cruise. He cannot hide away in his yacht at sea. He finds himself trying to crawl back into the uterus for comfort via the warm vagina. The vagina become the hideout for Black men seeking to escape the woes of life's challenges.

Additionally, many Black men were encouraged as boys by their fathers and friends to "get you some White pussy, man!" I remember hearing men who lived in the South asking man who visited the North, "man, did you get you some White pussy?"

A Black man like any other man, wants the best that life has to offer, and for many Black men that means having a White woman. The best looking by European standards. The best sex -- as they have seen in pornographic movies and magazines for years. A push over -- the White woman is said to be very submissive to the Black man. Some believe that the White woman may be submissive to the Black man because he treats her the way that she has been portrayed, as a precious stone, a royal queen, and a Virgin Mary (once she gets out of bed).

Many reasons have been given as to why Black men cross the color line. I have heard and read reasons as simple as "opposites attract" to "the Black man wants to get revenge." I believe that after reading this entire book, you truly understand the Black man's relationship with the Black woman and why he chooses the White woman.

Make Your Comments on the Message Board



advice relationships love sex interracial White women Black men sex stereotypes


23320, Food for thought?...
Posted by Bronx1, Mon Jul-17-00 05:58 PM
Why Do Black Men Choose
White Women?
©1998/1999 Rosie Milligan, Ph.D


Do Black men perceive White women as more beautiful, sensuous, and submissive than Black women? What impact did the nightmare of slavery have on the Black woman regarding her attitude towards her body and sex? An excerpt from the book...


I want to make it understood that I am not against interracial marriages; everyone should have the right to choose his or her own soul mate. But we are in great need of examining the reasons why Black men are choosing White women...

Let's first examine the Black woman. To understand the present condition of any sex or race, the past condition or history must be examined and understood. Black men have no standard to measure the African American woman other than the European standards. All men must realize that the Black woman has a unique perspective; she has a background and history of her own that is far different from those of women of other ethnic groups.

Many loving relationships have been ruined between Black women and their men because of a lack of knowledge about the Black woman's history. The relationship between White men and Black women were the major factors in creating the brain damage the Black man has today for the White woman.

Black women do not embrace their sexuality as freely and honestly as other women. This is due to her being made to feel ashamed of her body, and due to her history of rape at a very early age. Many White men had their very first (and best) sexual encounters with a Black woman, so that they could keep their own women pure and unspoiled until marriage. They raped the young black female, usually by the age of 13.

I was told by the elders that when the White men entered a Black man's cabin, the Black man was made to leave the cabin or was made to stay and watch. I was told that when the White men finished he would pat the Black man on the head while leaving and the Black man would say "Massa, I hope you liked it." The White man would respond, "Yes, good pussy boy," as he went home to his innocent sleeping beauty. Thus, since White women were not labeled sexually promiscuous savages, they do not come under the scrutiny for their sexual appetites or behavior that Black women do.

A Black woman's sexual experiences, the social setting in which she was reared, her physical capabilities, religious background, and upbringing all have a strong impact and influence on how she genuinely feels about sex; how much she enjoys sex; her willingness to explore various positions an exotic practices during sex. Obviously, the Black woman is still haunted by the effects of slavery on her sexuality. As we approach the new millennium, 135 years post Emancipation Proclamation, Black girls and Black women are still the most frequent victims of rape and assault.

What does all this have to do with Black men choosing White women?

According to the U.S. Census Bureau, one out of every 20 marriages is interracial. There were to 246,000 Blacks married to Whites in this country last year, almost four times the number in 1970. According to statistics, the number of Black men that are married to White women far outnumber any and all other cross-cultural marriages.

The White woman has for years been portrayed as the very essence of beauty and the epitome of all that is good. America has done a great job of selling the White woman. It is not just the Black man who feels his self-esteem heightened by having her. Alternatively, the Black woman has been portrayed very negatively in the media. Only recently having seen her passionately making love. You have seen her raped, abused, and offering to perform oral sex for drugs. The Black woman has been given such titles as gold digger, male basher, sapphire, and bitch.

Girls and women who are victims of physical and sexual abuse have difficulty in the areas of sensuality and sexual intimacy. Yet, Black females continue to search for love and Black men to search for sex. In their quest for love, women get sex and a baby and left alone. Black women want to be loved, not sexed. Black women want their men to come home and help them formulate a definition of Black man and Black woman that works for them. The Black man needs sex as a means of determining his self worth, and the Black woman because of her history, is afraid of it. These differences make communication between the Black male and female on sexual issues very difficult.

Is sex that important to a Black man? Sex is one of the most sought after experiences, and (besides money), is the only factor in our civilized societies that people pursue at the risk of causing harm to themselves. Sex is the only form of gratification within reach for the economically deprived male. He cannot take a weekend cruise. He cannot hide away in his yacht at sea. He finds himself trying to crawl back into the uterus for comfort via the warm vagina. The vagina become the hideout for Black men seeking to escape the woes of life's challenges.

Additionally, many Black men were encouraged as boys by their fathers and friends to "get you some White pussy, man!" I remember hearing men who lived in the South asking man who visited the North, "man, did you get you some White pussy?"

A Black man like any other man, wants the best that life has to offer, and for many Black men that means having a White woman. The best looking by European standards. The best sex -- as they have seen in pornographic movies and magazines for years. A push over -- the White woman is said to be very submissive to the Black man. Some believe that the White woman may be submissive to the Black man because he treats her the way that she has been portrayed, as a precious stone, a royal queen, and a Virgin Mary (once she gets out of bed).

Many reasons have been given as to why Black men cross the color line. I have heard and read reasons as simple as "opposites attract" to "the Black man wants to get revenge." I believe that after reading this entire book, you truly understand the Black man's relationship with the Black woman and why he chooses the White woman.

Make Your Comments on the Message Board



advice relationships love sex interracial White women Black men sex stereotypes


23321, definitely an interesting perspective
Posted by guest, Fri Jul-21-00 03:40 AM
I benefitted from your little excerpt. thank you.

But what do u have to say about shelly's little comment?
"The other side of the coin. White women are fed up with white men. White men are condescending , controlling and mean. Why do you think eating disorders are higher in white women. White men expect them to really look like Pamela Anderson . So white women are fed up with trying to be Barbie and turning to men who's going to love them they way they are. Which are our black men. "

That view of the white male is a little extreme for me, but you get the jist.. the overall expectations of europeans to have thin women (remember corsets? and kate moss?) And i do believe the love for big booty (which is now becoming more trendy) does stem from the black/hispanic cultures. I work for a jewish woman who asked me, "Does this outfit make my butt look big?" - as if it was a bad thing. I simply thought, "Why would anyone WANT a flat ass?" But that's the stereotypical white female question when it comes to fashion, *worried tone* "does this make my butt look big??" So, *I* think there IS a love of the black (and hispanic) female figure. They stereotypically have more fat deposits in the breasts & ass.
23322, RE: The Black Man/White Woman thing....
Posted by guest, Wed Jul-19-00 05:33 AM
I was wondering what you meant by Black men finding themselves; is there a search I am unaware of... actually what seems strange is having a discussion such as this in a setting such as America.

I find America quite cold; don't get me wrong, I am flabbergasted how people enter any sort of relationship; it appears that there is such a distance b/w people and there really is no sense of community - everyone seems locked in their own myopia; to some extent no fault of theirs - the country is just to dam big.

A good friend of mine I came to know quite well moved from Chicago to St Louis (relatively close) at least looking through American eyes.

What struck me was not her sexual desire to be close to someone; because she was not like that; but I noticed in her eyes a deep sense of isolation; it really did not matter how much money she made or how much she saw her goals materialize; believe she was depressed; don't get me wrong she hid it well and especially towards me; but the truth was in the eyes:

trust me one grabs happiness or shades of it anywhere you can get it; once you have it abuse it to the fullest (I mean that in a nice way)

You might not come across it again; and that might be your last chance or only chance to truly share something, anything with someone: in America this is even double hard work : trust me

within this context black/white/green/yellow/orange/purple : all these colors become shades of Grey, when loving someone or someone loving you is all that matters: believe me don't believe the hype: loving someone if only for a split second without any baggage is the most important and possibly the only thing our neurons should be geared towards.

I guess I am feeling less cynical today; it is a step in the right direction I guess: live and let live is my motto.

Xala.

23323, The fly ish
Posted by Mr_B, Wed Jul-19-00 10:00 AM
You know what the fly shit about this discussion is? The fact that the next generation benefits from it.
I don't know about anybody else's fam, but I know my pops' fam was on that "Don't you bring no white girl in this house!" ish. And I know that was a common attitude then, and probably still is today, but I think it's less common. My mom used it jokingly, and if I have kids they'll never hear it.

I don't agree with anyone who sets out to date only one race, whether that one race is their own or not. I think people in real interracial relationships are brave souls, cause they catch it from their own race and their mate's race.

If you can be friends with people of another race, then you can be more than friends with them, too. If you can't be friends with people of another race just because they're of another race, then you're an asshole, or a coward.
23324, RE: The fly ish
Posted by reefdogg, Mon Jul-31-00 06:19 AM
>You know what the fly shit
>about this discussion is?
>The fact that the next
>generation benefits from it.
>I don't know about anybody else's
>fam, but I know my
>pops' fam was on that
>"Don't you bring no white
>girl in this house!" ish.
> And I know that
>was a common attitude then,
>and probably still is today,
>but I think it's less
>common. My mom used
>it jokingly, and if I
>have kids they'll never hear
>it.

you make a great point ... by this discussion happening now, we can make sure that future generations can have more insight into the problems that we have today ... what worries me is that the future generations that's being raised by biggots, etc, that continue some of these bad attitudes and negative thoughts ...


>
>I don't agree with anyone who
>sets out to date only
>one race, whether that one
>race is their own or
>not. I think people
>in real interracial relationships are
>brave souls, cause they catch
>it from their own race
>and their mate's race.
>

that's true love right there ... they may catch it but they're beyond that pettiness...

>If you can be friends with
>people of another race, then
>you can be more than
>friends with them, too.
>If you can't be friends
>with people of another race
>just because they're of another
>race, then you're an asshole,
>or a coward.

i agree 100%, i have plenty of non-black friends ... why? cause they're FRIENDS, period.


----
IM and ICQ name: reefdogg1 (number one at the end)

where my Jersey heads at?!?!?!

okayivyleagueplayer reppin Brown University and NSBE region ONE !!!!

"you're either part of the problem or you're part of the solution .. what's your contribution to life?" - J5

"the rule of allah is god's equality / i desire for my brothers, the same that i desire for me / but when my brother's stay dying, of everything else but old age / my heart fills up with what, RAGE!!!!!" - J-Live (thanks d_dog)
23325, Black Man/White Woman theories are wack...........
Posted by guest, Wed Jul-19-00 10:47 AM
1.Their are black men and white women who love one another. Not because she is white or he is black. They have an honest love for each other.Like Tank said.

2.Why are we concerned about brothers who do not like black women? I see it as one less brother sweating me. Who cares ? If he wants someone because of their skin color you should feel sorry for her because she isn't in a loving and caring relationship. I know. I was married to a white man and unbeknowest to me he didn't like white women. I found out soon enough and left. I felt objectified , I wasn't really loved because of me just my skin color . So there. Don't hate her , feel sorry for her and pray she has enough since to get out, because that is not love.

3. The other side of the coin. White women are fed up with white men. White men are condescending , controlling and mean. Why do you think eating disorders are higher in white women. White men expect them to really look like Pamela Anderson . So white women are fed up with trying to be Barbie and turning to men who's going to love them they way they are. Which are our black men.

So let's stop saying there's a problem with black love. There is no problem , you just need to find the black man that has love for you and give it back to him.

The statement about white doesn't pertain to every white man.

23326, READ: a piece of history
Posted by guest, Fri Jul-21-00 02:42 AM
that same mentality reminds me of how religious people say, "men and women are created to be together" and believe homosexuals CHOOSE to be gay. Even though i completely don't believe this theory, it still makes more sense to me than saying that people are meant to stick to their own race. It's like god saying (before america came into existance), "don't leave your country - EVER. don't ever marry someone out of your community".

I think my history professor even once said that people become genetically stronger by mixing races (otherwise, that race tends to form certain weakness. Like, you ever notice how black people are more prone to certain diseases, as are whites and hispanic are prone to others?) The "stick to your community" mentality has been around since almost as early as humanity. At first this was useful for survival (a defense mechanism against other tribes/enemies) which is understandable. Offering a woman from your own tribe to another was sometimes a peace agreement. When people could only preserve legends verbally through generations, sticking to your "own kind" was also somewhat important. In my eyes, this mentality eventually became silly (writing was invented, and communities have grown) - parents simply wanted their children to preserve "tradition". I don't see what's so important about doing or believing the SAME EXACT things as generations before u; for me, nothing's set in stone.

Of course i respect your opinion and all, but sometimes i just don't understand people.... (but i am VERY glad you are open-minded enough to accept other people's choices; it's pointless to stress about what OTHER people do with their lives)
23327, what about black women and white men
Posted by guest, Sun Jul-23-00 06:06 PM
Why do black women always think it's only black men that date white woman? Or rather they prefer to only cite black men dating white woman and ignore black women dating white men. For two months I actually counted how many black and white couples I saw and how many black men were with white woman and vice versa. You know just to see what some black women were beefing about. I actually saw more black women with white men. (Even though I know if i did a scientific observation I'm sure the number would be equal) I did notice that alot of sisters had some preppy men while the brothers had jawns that looked like gutter crap. Now for the record I think beauty is beauty and ugly is ugly and it doesn't matter what race you are. I just want to know have anybody seen that before and wonder what hell was going on.

Also I met quite a few afrocentric women and men that married or dated white people. This always tended to shock me cause they would be the last people i would think would find their mate outside their race. So hopefully it is love and not something else.

Also, it tears me up when I her a black person say I only date white people or a white person say they only date black people. It makes me think that person has a self esteem problem. I'll date anybody if they look good AND have a good personality.

Thanks for letting me rant.
23328, personally...
Posted by guest, Sun Jul-23-00 08:42 PM
i have my phases of what type of person turns me on. If someone asks me, "what kind of guy do u like?" I can say, "well, right now i like... thugs/pappychulos/gothic (whatever!) guys." But i explain that it's never definite... it's usually a visual preference, and most of the time i meet a guy who don't fit that certain category (who breaks the mold of what "type" i like). So personally, if i say, "i like frat boys" ((which i don't)) it doesn't mean i'd NEVER go for any other kind of guy.
23329, Black women are the least likely to marry outside of their race
Posted by nahymsa, Mon Jul-24-00 05:41 AM
The numbers aren't equal..the government does a count. Black men marry outside of black women something like 6 times as much as black women marry others.

This can be explained by the fact that:

1) all men of any group tend to marry outside of that group more than the women. Its because men have more options due to their gender, including more freedoms to break cultural/social traditions.

2) The black aesthetic is not valued when it comes packaged in women. Ie, while dark skin/nappy hair/etc in men is perceived/stereotyped as sexy/dangerous in men, in women it is seen as masculine and/or ugly. In sexist societies, women tend to be judged more by appearance, and if black looks are generally denigrated then black women will not be perceived as attractive to men outside of her group. On the flip side, the white aesthetic is glorified, particularly in women, so black men are more likely to view the white aesthetic as attractive and seek it.
23330, RE: Black women are the least likely to marry outside of their race
Posted by guest, Tue Jul-25-00 02:21 PM
Where can a brother get that documentation?
23331, The government keeps stats on marriage
Posted by nahymsa, Wed Jul-26-00 07:31 AM
including interracial stats. You can pull those up on the internet. Plus there are studies on black/white interracial marriages. Though the stats vary, from what I've read most state that black men marry outside their race 4 to 6 times as much as black men.

Check it out for yourself
23332, I'll check myself
Posted by ASTRO, Wed Jul-26-00 09:50 AM
Don't you realize how easy for someone to say the "government"? If you make a powerful statement like that you should be able to direct a person where they can get documentation or cite a source. You made the statement. Why is the burden of finding out if your statement can be backed up on me?

Because I am curious to know I will check for myself but damn stop the throwing out statements as fact unless you have a source a person can reference.
23333, Didn't realize this was a research paper
Posted by nahymsa, Wed Jul-26-00 10:13 AM
I don't keep a handy list of all the materials I've ever referenced next to my computer....not unlike most people here who regulary reference information without supplying supporting documentation.

Is that the new standard at Okayplayer? I hope you're as diligent in reminding everyone of that as you are of me.

That being said, just because you asked so nicely, I will go back & indicate where you can find some of the materials that I based my statements & you can do the math yourself.



23334, RE: Didn't realize this was a research paper
Posted by guest, Wed Jul-26-00 12:48 PM
Nope it's not a okayplayer standard but I did want to know and you totally left a brother hanging by saying search the internet. I don't know about you but when i read things of importance, I can give you general idea where i found that info. If I don't rememeber, I'll say, "I don't remember." You made a very strong statement, is it so wrong for for me to ask you to back it up? I would hope everyone on okayplayer and around the world would do the same. Challenge us to come correct. Now I'm not trying to act like this is class but I'm one of those type of people that want to be enlighten. So if you think i was being to rough ...sorry. And thanks for putting a post with my name on it.

"Why do brothers don't know and front and don't ask?"
23335, its all good :-)
Posted by nahymsa, Thu Jul-27-00 04:56 AM
peace
23336, wait a second
Posted by janey, Tue Jul-25-00 02:24 PM
just with respect to the notion that men marry outside their race more than women do...Well, the women they are marrying must be marrying outside of THEIR race, right? So how can the numbers add up unless a few women are marrying all the men of other races?

Peace.
23337, Read my poem in Freestyle...
Posted by Mil, Tue Jul-25-00 04:33 PM
http://www.okayplayer.com/dcforum/freestyle/4832.html

It was inspired by posts like this...

Blowin the doors off shit like bricks of C-4,

Mil

AIM: Milspectah Deck
E-Mail: Mil@thejawn.com
http://www.thejawn.com

"Mixed race is the place/ It feels good to be neither/Its a relief to deny racial purity/We're amused as America slowly comes to see/The beauty of negritude and Native American attitude/We've been living it day-to-day since 1492"-Ed Morales, "Rebirth of the New Rican"

"...But Rebellion is the circle of a lover's hands, that must keep moving, always weaving."-Martin Espada, "Rebellion is the Circle of a Lover's Hands (Pellín and Nina)"
23338, DAYAM!!
Posted by SankofaII, Wed Jul-26-00 01:33 PM
Mil came withthe realness..:)
Ryan




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23339, love is more than a feeling
Posted by guest, Wed Jul-26-00 06:43 AM
thats all Im gonna say

as i paint to the wind's breath
freestyle to my footsteps
and create till the heartbeat's got no rhythm left...
-archangel_500years

So my path switches
Now devoted to uncovering all the glitches
That they left when they tried to hide my past
Under vast lies and advertisement pitches
So I dig deeper than subterranean level ditches
Deeper than the seeds of hate planted over those of vitality
Deeper than the hole I dug my self in when I was slaving for a salary
Deeper than the sin soil that his roots were cowardly planted in
Deep enough to find my soul again
And bring an end to confusion and fallacy
I must go deeper
-Amina NiaRa (deeper existence)





23340, RE: love is more than a feeling
Posted by DJ_scratch_N_sniff, Thu Jul-27-00 05:40 PM
>thats all Im gonna say
>
yeah... right now.

but you'll be back to see if anyone replied...
23341, RE: The Black Man/White Woman thing....
Posted by DJ_scratch_N_sniff, Thu Jul-27-00 05:38 PM
i believe
>that there is potential inside
>of us that is only
>realized in true partnership with
>someone who was created specifically
>for us

what's next? I think that medium complected men shouldn't date dark or light-skinned women, but someone who was created specifically for us..?

Please.

However, there is a current state of things in the US and some other places, where too many black men have lost the proper respect for their own women... and inter-"racial" relationships spring up out of the shear novelty of having someone "different"... There's a level of maturity that someone should have about any issues regarding someone else before they consumate a relationship... and some folks - many folks - are not mature enough to deal with someone of a different "race" in a relationship... funny you don't see such big issues in white male/asian female relationships which are so common these days... That's because the problem is cultural... Asian Americans don't have the deep-seated and long historical conflict with "whites" that African Americans do. For example, do you have a problem with black men dating Samoan women? No, and why not? Because of history, not because of who's "created" for someone else.

My problem with the initial post here is that it is racial. What I mean by "racial" is that you acknowledge race as something important. What I mean by "race" is the idea that "black" and "white" are mutually exclusive and naturally different. "Racial" is not far off from "racist" which is the promotion of separatism and the theory of superiority or supremacy of any "race/s" over any other.

But I'm in agreement with the fact that there's alterior motives (and they ain't all good) behind the man and the woman in most black man/white woman things... sad but true.

PIZ (pronounced spanishly, thats peace)