>if only i was a DJ
>at all...

aw man- i dont know if you can claim DJ scratch n sniff if you aint no dj- but i wont tell nobody.

> I'm not saying this
>as well as I'm thinking
>it, so bear w/

I got you- forget about it. (thats to be taken in that Donnie brasco type of way)

>True. You can say that
>Black as a culture has
>existed for thousands of years...
>but what I think you
>mean is African American culture.
>Black describes many different peoples
>with very different cultures, so
>I'm assuming you're talking about
>Afro Americans.

Black as i mean it means all that- the deivation is a succint political and ideological movement of the 50's in 60's. It was recognition of where we came from, what we are doing here, and where we are to go from here- these are the basic principles of faith and culture. (This is also the exact reason why whites dont gel as a culture- they refuse to admit those things or realize the commonality of origin and status quo- and the future is primarily an individual concern).

Black in my reference connotes the situation of our culture and provides that Black men can determine themselves as african american, colored, niggas or whatever- this is kujichagulia- Black also provides itself as a more succint ideology of politics and as such those who research and follow the doctrine and teachings and customs of the Black nation will find that it is a very specific manner of thinking and actiung and not just that which describes the color of your skin.

It is politically the succint opposition of race ideology and culturally the recognition of all that such ideology has made of African American culture and people. Im only wary of claiming it as a consequence cuz several Black nationalists are determining that Blacks knew what they were doing all along (we're not supposed to talk about that yet though).

>You're right in pointing out that
>the word "only" might have
>been implied by what I
>said, but you can't deny
>that racism has had a
>huge impact on what Af
>Am culture is.

most certainly- but like i said the term "consequence" indicates that we were acted upon and were utterly powerless against the attack- i dont think thats a very affirming idea nor do i think it is entirely true.

>>Even the fact that we
>>call ourselves "Black" is not
>>something suggested by race ideology-
>>it is called Kugichagulia- self
>>determination.
>
>Are you saying Blackness = Kugichagulia?

no no Im saying the right to determine one's own identity is kujichagulia. It is important to realize that all men have the natural right to determine themselves and then be acknowledged primarily by that determination. If white people are determined to represent themselves in race- we are determined to represent ourselves as Black- the antithesis of that philosophy; the problem is too many people assume that since the words are semantically antecedent that "Blacks" infer race by that term- thats just not where it came from.

The equation is simple just make the ideological analogy. Whites equalled a whole human, niggers equalled about 3/5, as they became free and determined themselves as Black- Black being a antecedent term- they implicitly determined their kind as an equal whole. This doesnt mean they accepted or correlated this determination to race theory as that would put them right back in the cast of being a subspecies- they merely used its terminology to provide equal and lateral dignity for Black people.

When little Black kids started screaming "Im Black and Im proud", when Black olympians raised the iconographic Black fist it scared the world- not because of what color they were (as they should have known that by seeing them right?) but because of what they were claiming.

Had Blacks been content with or in agreement with race philosophy the slogan would have been "Im colored and Im proud." the perfect example of ideological complacency is the NAACP. The Black power movement that followed was not so compromising.

>right... u got me... but
>now you're going outside of
>African American culture... Voodoo is
>mostly Caribbean and West African...
>So I'm getting confused by
>what you mean by "Black"
>as a culture. African
>American culture is very different
>from those cultures...

You might want to see how voodoo affects the southern regions of this country and several Jamaican and Haitian descendants that span the Americas- even Hip Hop music as we know it is a derivative of Jamaican stylings and that demonstrates a heavy influence. what Black connotes is not just particular customs but commonality among several and the common dust between them.

In the case of Mexicans and their exceeding commonality over haitians or afro brazillians - this may work for surface items that are the example of contemporary customs (as our current common contributer is american oppression) several ancient customs still link us back to very similar places. In this case its not so much that mexican americans have something more related to afro americans than haitains as it the fact that haitians (and this is even indicated in your statement) by and large are refused the contribution of American traditions and recieve a great deal more of the oppressive imposition.

>> Furthermore
>>this idea may put forth
>>the idea that due to
>>racism in America we are
>>not entitled to claim that
>>which made us Black previous
>>to racism and thats just
>>not fair.
>
>What was Black before racism?

Black was a place called KMT, Black was Akhenaton, Black was the growing understanding that all things are one despite the fact that they can be conceived as mutually exclusive. Black was a startling idea that something within us extended to the cosmos beyond, this property has scientifically been claculated as melanin and has been determined to be a cosmic element in heavy abundance. In stellar science Melanin is considered one of the properties that maintains light and radioactive conduction and drilled down to the human form it is not only demonstrative in our skin but is also a crucial component to the function of the eye- meaning that it is not only a large component of what we see but even how we see it.

The bottom line is Blackness might very well be something we've been looking for all along but due to a great deal of suppression we lost track of alot of the science that was being formulated. Dont misunderstand however that the sense of which Im speaking of Black currently is the foundation of the Black politics I generally speak of it is only a more focsed direction of those philosophies. before the consequence of racism Black was Black but we didnt have much of a reason to refer to it as such, now we do...

Its not so much that Black is all things- we're still determining exactly what all those things are- but Black must stand defiantly against those things that claim to be things that they are not.

>That's a good point. Tribes
>and crews have always existed
>with all peoples of the
>Earth. I don't see
>how that "make Black".
> It makes them a
>social human.

The difference is in how they gather and communicate and socialize and respond to other crews. We cant just say its the same as the general principle because we've only mentioned the general ideas- if you want to talk about particulars Im sure you'll find several independent customs that flourish in certain crews and dont exist in others. Sure in a general sense it makes them social humans no matter what differentiates them- but to observe and respect those differentiations is the implicit point of tribe.

>>If Black culture today was merely
>>a consqeuence of racism we
>>would still be in shackles.
>>Black culture is not the
>>consequence of racism in the
>>sense that racism caused us-
>>our culture today is more
>>in the sense of whats
>>left of african and many
>>Hispanic traditions.
>
>How did you go and bring
>Hispanic into this?

As you said "Mexican-Americans are generally closer culturally to Afro Americans than Haitians or Afro Brazilians are." You concede overall that there is commonality among them all. In fact its no big secret that Blacks and Hispanic peopels have intermingled and influenced each other for centuries. The ruins of the Olmec people and several African artifiacts found on pre-american soil demonstrate that we did so even long before the onslaught of colonialism. To say that colonialism and racism undermined all of that influence is not very likely as a great deal of the influence was hardly recognized and more than likely not even considered.

>OK... I personally would not use
>the word "proud" to describe
>how I feel about my
>genetic make-up. But I
>definitely feel "lucky".

as i said- you're genetic make up is literally and scientifically who you are- why not be proud of who you are. this doesnt connote that you feel superior to anyone else.

>It did. And thanks for
>laying off the flames.

I think thats fire's job

K