bismillah

>>come on standard. the comparison of
>>what is "natural' for animals
>>and humans is not a
>>good one.
>>doesnt the female black widow kill
>>her male partner?
>>not natural to us to do
>>that, especially after mating! that
>>would be considered SICK to
>>humans.
>
>This is the related to the
>point I was trying to
>make. I was trying
>to ask by what standard
>do you judge "natural".

the same standard that you used to say the next statement:
>We (most of us, anyway)
>accept that murder is not
>natural, as it ends the
>life of another person.
>No arguement here.
>
>>dont snakes swallow their food whole
>>w/o chewing?
>>not natural for us to do
>>that. and for those that
>>half chew their food, believe
>>they have health problems that
>>stem from it.
>
>We accept that swallowing food whole
>(for us) is unnatural...it has
>unhealthy side effects that we
>would mostly like to avoid.
>
>
>>and about hermaphrodites.......
>>i was just reading about this
>>and how this situation fits
>>in islam.
>>islam looks to the character of
>>the person and the physical
>>features. when he or she
>>reaches puberty, it becomes known
>>to the individual which way
>>they are inclined to go,
>>but they are not to
>>go both ways simply b/c
>>they have the MEANS TO.
>>the OVERALL inclination of the
>>person determines their status in
>>society.
>
>Right...which is my point. The
>hermaphrodite is allowed to follow
>their NATURAL inclinations. So
>why is the homosexual forbidden
>to do the same?
>If the arguement is that
>it is UNnatural, by what
>standard is "natural" being judged?

the key words are: follow their NATURAL inclinations.
not FOLLOW their desires.

and once again, its the same standard used by you above.
you deduced by a set of standards you ALREADY have that NOTHING can come out of MURDERING and SWALLOWING W/O CHEWING, EXCEPT HARM.

and that is the SAME standard that is INSIDE ALL OF US.
some just fight that standard, and proceed to do what ever theY want to do.

hence you have: rape, murder, incest, drunkeness, liars, politicians, highness, bigotry, fornication, adultery, homosexuality, etc......

is anybody born w/ any of these qualities?

Allah says in the 2nd surah, Al-Baqarah(The Cow) 2.25: But give glad tidings to those who believe and work righteousness, that their portion is Gardens, beneath which rivers flow. Every time they are fed with fruits therefrom, they say: "Why, this is what we were fed with before," for they are given things in similitude; and they have therein companions pure (and holy); and they abide therein (for ever).

subhaanakallahumma wabihamdika ashhadu anla ilaha illa anta astaghfiruka wa attuubu ilaika