Before you read, please know it is not my intention to be harsh or rude. Rather, this is my attempt to help you understand the reality of Islam, insha' Allah.

>I have to give you credit
>on your respone but I
>really do not believe that
>the Qur'an can be considerd
>an a reliable source in
>this case. There are just
>to many holes in it
>for it to be considered
>a book of Divine Inspiration.
>Both the Bibical view of
>Jesus and the Islamic view
>of Christ cannot both be
>right in there claims.One says
>that he is God the
>other a prophet.

There are no holes in the Qur'an, but there may be holes in the English interpretation that you are reading from because man makes error. Also, the condensed English interpretation of the Qur'an has little or no Tafseer or explanation from Sunnah and the Qur'an itself. Also, the Qur'an abrogates the original Torah and the original Gospel (not the same as any of the books of the New Testament), and both of these are not to be found in their original condition today. The original Torah and Gospel were Books that were to be expired and not to last forever, this is why the oldest dated scrolls you can find are dated hundreds or thousands of years after they were originally written. So how can you compare a tampered book with the Qur'an when a pillar of Iman is to believe that the Qur'an is the last and final Book of Allah and that it is protected by Allah and will not be changed? This is a bad comparison, which is the root of your dodgy belief in what Islam is. There is no contradiction between the Qur'an and the Bible, because the Qur'an says that the Torah and Gospel have been tampered with and changed by men, so this is an unequal comparison.

>But if we are to be
>consistant with the teachings of
>the Qur'an Jesus is placed
>higher than just a prophet.

This is not what the Qur'an says.

4:171
O People of the Scripture (Jews and Christians)! Do not exceed the limits in your religion, nor say Allah aught but the truth. The Messiah Isa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary), was (no more than) a Messenger of Allah and His Word, ("Be!" - and he was) and a spirit (Ruh) created by Him; so believe in Allah and His Messengers. Say not: "Three (trinity)!" Cease! (it is) better for you. For Allah is (the only) One Ilah (God), glory be to Him (Far Exalted is He) above having a son. To Him belongs all that is in the heavens and all that is in the earth. And Allah is All-Sufficient as a Disposer of affairs.

Ruh-ullah: According to the early religious scholars from among the Companions of the Prophet (saws) and their students and the Mujahidun, there is a rule to distinguish between the two nouns in the genitive construction:
a) When one of the two nouns is Allah, and the other is a person or a thing, e.g. Allah's House (Bait-ullah); Allah's Messenger (Rasul-ullah); Allah's slave ('Abdullah); Allah's spirit (Ruh-ullah), the rule for the above words is that the second noun, e.g. house, messenger, slave, spirit is created by Allah and is honourable in His Sight, and similarly, Allah's spirit may be understood as the spirit of Allah, in fact it is a soul created by Allah, i.e. Isa. And it was His Word: "Be!" - and he was. (i.e. Isa was created like Adam).
b) But when one of the two is Allah and the second is neither a person nor a thing, then it is not a created thing but is a quality of Allah e.g. Allah's Knowledge ('Ilm-ullah); Allah's Life (Hayat-ullah); Allah's Statement (Kalam-ullah); Allah's Self (Dhat-ullah).

5:75
The Messiah (Isa), son of Maryam, was no more than a Messenger; many were the Messengers that passed away before him. His mother (Maryam) was a Siddiqah (i.e. she believed in the Words of Allah and His Books). They both used to eat food (as any other human being, while Allah does not eat). Look how We made the Ayat (proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.) clear to them; yet look how they are deluded away (from the truth).

19:30
He (Isa) said: "Verily I am a slave of Allah, He has given me the Scripture and made me a Prophet"

>He was sinless(Sura 3:46) Muhammed
>sinned and needed forgiveness(Sura 40:55
>and 42:5)

3:46
"He will speak to the people in the cradle and in manhood, and he will be one of the righteous."

This verse does not say Isa (as) was sinless.

Regarding the subject of the Prophets committing sins, I will show you what the Scholars of Islam say about this:

“The ummah (Muslim nation) is agreed that the Messengers are infallible in carrying out their mission – they do not forget anything that Allaah has revealed to them except with regard to matters that have been abrogated. They are also infallible in conveying the Message – they do not conceal anything that Allaah has revealed to them, for that would be a betrayal and it is impossible to imagine that they could do such a thing. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning): `O Messenger! Proclaim (the Message) which has been sent down to you from your Lord. And if you do not ,then you have not conveyed His Message…' (al-Maa'idah 5:67). If anything is concealed or changed, then the punishment of Allaah will befall the one who is guilty of doing these things, as Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning): `And if he (Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him)) had forged a false saying concerning Us (Allaah), We surely would have seized him by his right hand (or with power and might), and then certainly should have cut off his life artery (aorta).' (al-Haqqah 69:44-46). One aspect of infallibility is that they (the Prophets) do not forget anything of that which Allaah has revealed to them, and thus no part of the revelation is lost.”

(Al-rusul wa'l-risaalaat (The Messengers and their missions), `Omar al-Ashqar, p. 97)

`Omar al-Ashqar also said (op. cit., p.102): “The Prophets and Messengers may also strive to find the right judgement in the situations with which they are faced, and they judge according to what they themselves see and hear – they do not have knowledge of the Unseen. They may make an incorrect judgement, as happened to the Prophet of Allaah Dawood (David), who failed to do so, and Allaah helped his son Sulaymaan (Solomon) to come up with the right answer in that particular case. Abu Hurayrah (may Allaah be pleased with him) reported that he heard the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) say: `There were two women, each of whom had a son. A wolf came and carried off the son of one of them, who said to the other, “The wolf has taken your son.” The other said, “No, he took your son.” They came to Dawood to ask him to judge between them, and he ruled in favour of the older woman. Then they went to Sulaymaan the son of Dawood and told him what had happened. He said, “Bring a knife and divide the child between them.” The younger woman said, “Do not do that, may Allaah have mercy on you! He is her son.” So Sulaymaan ruled in favour of the younger woman.' (Reported by al-Bukhaari).

“The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) explained this story: Umm Salamah, the wife of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) narrated that he heard a dispute going on at the door of his apartment, so he went out and told them: `I am no more than a human being. Disputing parties may come to me, and one of you may be more eloquent and persuasive than the other, so I may think that he is telling the truth and rule in favour of him. Whoever has a judgement in favour of him to the detriment of a fellow-Muslim's rights, this is a piece of the Fire – let him take it or leave it.'”

When it comes to the idea of the Prophets committing major sins (kabaa'ir), Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyah said (in al-Fataawaa, 4/319): “…The belief that the Prophets are free of major sins, but not of minor sins, is the opinion of the majority of Islamic scholars and of all (Muslim) groups… It is the opinion of most mufassireen (commentators on the Qur'an), scholars of hadeeth and fuqaha' (jurists).”

With regard to whether it is possible for the Prophets to commit minor sins, in Lawaami' al-Anwaar al-Bahiyyah (2/214), al-Safaareeni quoted from Ibn Hamdaan who said in Nihaayat al-Mubtadi'een: “They are infallible in conveying the commands and message of Allaah, but they are not infallible in any other regard. They may make mistakes, forget things, or commit minor sins – according to the most well-known opinion (of the scholars) – but they will not be approved for these mistakes.”

The majority of scholars take the following as evidence to support their claim that the Prophets are not free from minor sins:

1. Adam's sin in eating from the tree from which Allaah had forbidden him to eat. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning): “And (remember) when We said to the angels, `Prostrate yourselves to Adam.' They prostrated (all) except Iblees (Satan), who refused. Then We said, `O Adam! Verily, this is an enemy to you and to your wife. So let him not get you both out of Paradise, so that you be distressed in misery. Verily, you have (a promise from Us) that you will never be hungry therein nor naked. And you (will) suffer not from thirst therein nor from the sun's heat. Then Shaytaan whispered to him, saying: `O Adam! Shall I lead you to the Tree of Eternity and to a kingdom that shall never waste away?' Then they both ate of the tree, and so their private parts appeared to them, and they began to stick on themselves leaves from Paradise for their covering. Thus did Adam disobey his Lord, so he went astray.” (Ta-Ha 20:116-121)
2. When Nooh prayed for his kaafir son, Allaah rebuked him for doing so, and taught him that this person was not a member of his family, and that this prayer was not a righteous deed on his part. So Nooh sought forgiveness from his Lord, repented and returned to Allaah: “Nooh said: `O my Lord! I seek refuge with You from asking You that of which I have no knowledge. And unless You forgive me and have Mercy on me, I would indeed be one of the losers.'” (Hood 11:47 – interpretation of the meaning).
3. When Dawood realized that he had been too quick to judge, without listening to what the second disputant had to say, he hastened to repent: “… and he sought Forgiveness of his Lord, and he fell down prostrate and turned (to Allaah) in repentance.” (Saad 38:24 – interpretation of the meaning).

Everyone, even the Prophets, is in need of the forgiveness of Allaah. Allaah has blessed His Prophets by forgiving their sins, and He has blessed our Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) as He said (interpretation of the meaning): “That Allaah may forgive you your sins of the past and the future, and complete His favour upon you, and guide you on the Straight Path.” (al-Fath 48:2)
4. Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyah said, in al-Fataawaa 10/296, “Concerning the issue of forgiveness of the Prophets' sins: Allaah, may He be exalted, does not speak of any Prophet in the Qur'aan, except He also mentions repentance and seeking forgiveness. For example, Adam and his wife said: `Our Lord! We have wronged ourselves. If You forgive us not, and bestow not upon us Your Mercy, we shall certainly be of the losers.” (al-A'raaf 7:23 – interpretation of the meaning). Nooh said: “O my Lord! I seek refuge with You from asking You that of which I have no knowledge. And unless You forgive me and have Mercy on me, I would indeed be one of the losers.'” . Ibraaheem said: “Our Lord! Forgive me and my parents, and (all) the Believers on the Day when the reckoning will be established.” (Ibraaheem 14:41 – interpretation of the meaning) and “… You are our wali (Protector), so forgive us and have Mercy on us, for You are the Best of those who forgive. And ordain for us good in this world, and in the Hereafter. Certainly we have turned unto You…” (al-A'raaf 7:155-156 – interpretation of the meaning). Moosa said: `…You are our wali (Protector), so forgive us and have Mercy on us, for You are the Best of those who forgive.' (al-A'raaf 7:155 – interpretation of the meaning). Then he (Ibn Taymiyah, may Allaah have mercy on him) gave further examples, but what we have mentioned here is sufficient. And Allaah knows best.

>Jesus did Miracles
>( Sura 3:49) Muhammed did
>not (sura 13:8 also 6:37;6:109;17:59)

The Qur'an states that all of the Prophets (as) did miracles.

40:78 And indeed We have sent Messengers before you (O Muhammad saws): of some of them We have related to you their story. And of some We have not related to you their story, and it was not given to any Messenger that he should bring a sign (miracle) except by the Leave of Allah. But, when comes the Commandment of Allah, the matter will be decided with truth, and the followers of falsehood will then be lost.

In regards to the ayat you cited as evidence against Muhammad (saws) not doing miracles, you are misinterpreting these ayat. Allah is explaining how the hypocrite will say that if only Allah were to send him/her a sign that he/she would believe, but even after signs are given to these people they still don't believe. Allah says the same thing about Musa (as) and the Children of Israel when they asked for a sign.

About 17:59, this ayah is speaking about Saalih (as) not Muhammad (saws) and this is an example of a sign sent to the people of Thamud which was rejected by them because they were hypocrites.

Also, I can go into detail if you need me to about the miracles that Muhammad (saws) performed by Allah's permission, as there are many describe in Ahadith.

>Jesus was the Messiah (sura 3:45;4:157,171)Muhammed
>did not.

This does not place Isa (as) above Muhammad (saws). Islam does not teach that Isa (as) was the savior of mankind or anything like the the definition of Messiah is used for in Christianity, rather he was just a Prophet and warner to the Jews.

>Jesus went to
>heavan (Sura 4:157) however sura
>199:33 says he died and
>would be ressurected.

There is no Surah 199, but I think you meant 19:33. Once again because there is no Tafseer of the verse you can mistake this ayah as saying Isa (as) died.

19:33 "And Salam (peace) be upon me the day I was born, and the day I die, and the day I shall be raised alive!"

Isa (as) has not died yet, and this is a reason he will return before the Day of Judgement because everyone must taste death. The day Isa (as) will die is after he returns and kills the Dajjal and abolishes the Jiziyah, etc. He will live and then die like every human being. The day he shall be raised alive is the Day everyone will be raised alive, i.e. the Day of Judgement.

>If anything the Qua'ran might as
>well claim that he is
>God they gave him everything
>else.

No comment, I've explained all of your misunderstandings about the Islamic view of Isa (as) using the Qur'an.

>Another area of confusion is the
>unity of God. Although Muslims
>attack the Trinty( a concept
>most Muslims do not understand
>or just cannot express correctly).

Muslims do understand Trinity and we also understand Paganism. When the Muslims took refuge in Abyssinia the Pagan Arabs chased after them and told the Christian King Negus (who later accepted Islam) that they are just misunderstood by the Muslims and that they don't worship the idols, rather they use the idols to get to Allah. This is the result of the confusion of paganism, a lack of understanding of what they are doing themselves! The "unity of Allah" or Tahweed has been explained in great detail by the Scholars of Islam who used the Qur'an and Sunnah not their own philosophical opinion and I can give you more information later if you'd like, insha' Allah.

>But Muslims allow for somethig
>besides Allah to be eternal
>expression of God without being
>numerically identical to him the
>Qur'an. Muslim scholars along with
>the Qua'ran have made distintions
>within Gods unity. Sura 85:21-22
>"Nay this is a Glorious
>Qur'an in a Tablet Preserved.
>The Qur'an is uncreated and
>identical to the mind of
>God. Thus why can't Christ
>be the eternal "expression of
>Divine Will?

Those ayat are saying that the Qur'an is being preserved by the Preserver. How is the thing being preserved equated with the One Who is Preserving it? Isa (as) is a Word of Allah. Allah simply says "Be!" and it is.

>PS If you want to comment
>on this please do so
>with gentleness and respect. It
>might take me time to
>respond because I donnot have
>a computer of my own
>and please forgive any errors
>in grammer.

I have a word of advice for you if you are sincerely seeking true knowledge about Islam. Do not rely on an English translation/interpretation of the Qur'an. I suggest you read Tafseer Ibn Kathir, which has been translated into English and is 10 Volumes. You can purchase it at http://www.dar-us-salam.com

May Allah forgive me for any mistakes I have made.
Yusuf