Posted by Solarus, Wed Jul-18-01 09:54 AM
>1) Is this the God in which
>you believe in?
Do I believe that God is IMMANENT and TRANSCENDENT? Yes.
>2) If so why? Give me
>some plusible evidence at your
Please clarify this question. What is "plausible evidence?"
>3) How does this God handle
What is "evil?" I can tell by the way in which you are asking these questions that you are conceiving "God" from the confines of your Christian perspective.
1) You said "this God," where "this" implies specifity. To specify "God" for all Afrakans is erroneous. From the beginning, I implied that "God is IMMANENT..." was only a "concept" not any particular "diety." In comparison I used the "God is SEPARATE from His creations" - concept found among "Western" religions (eg. Judaism,Christianity, Islam, ancient Greek religion, etc.). Correct if I am wrong but "Gods" within these religions are not all the same. Is Jehovah the same as Allah to you? Or is Allah the same as Zeus?
Afrakans all the Divine by different names and may also possess varying conceptions of IT. I even pointed this out in the post "Diversity in ONE (cont.)" :
"In closing, let me say that two Akan philosophers that I referenced, Kwasi Wiredu and Kwame Gyeke, both agree on the Akan consensus of “two heads are better than one.” This statement implies that no one’s explanation is taken as final. "
Even among one group there ideas varied, which is acceptable within Afrakan theology as explained here:
From "Diversity in ONE"
"One of the major effects of the “God is IMMANENT” concept, is “diversity.” “Diversity” in the sense that one’s concept of the divine and the universe INCLUSIVE versus being mutually EXCLUSIVE. If God is truly IMMANENT and TRANSCENDENT then any conception of IT can POTENTIALLY be valid. *POTENTIALLY meaning that if the conception of “God” does not further establish an adequate order and structure for the optimal survival for its adherents then it is useless. This diversity causes little if not any emphasis on the either-or dichotomy in the conception of ideas that is found in Western thought. Thus right or wrong is not defined by some unchanging abstract source, but rather it is defined by the consensus of the group. This simple but pivotal point can be seen in a number of discrepancies, misconceptions, and misunderstandings held between Western and Afrakan concepts."
2)You asked for "plausible evidence." Let me try and discern what this means:
Main Entry: plau·si·ble
Etymology: Latin plausibilis worthy of applause, from plausus, past participle of plaudere
1 : superficially fair, reasonable, or valuable but often specious <a plausible pretext>
2 : superficially pleasing or persuasive <a swindler..., then a quack, then a smooth, plausible gentleman -- R. W. Emerson>
3 : appearing worthy of belief <the argument was both powerful and plausible>
Main Entry: 1ev·i·dence
Pronunciation: 'e-v&-d&n(t)s, -v&-"den(t)s
Date: 14th century
1 a : an outward sign : INDICATION b : something that furnishes proof : TESTIMONY; specifically : something legally submitted to a tribunal to ascertain the truth of a matter
2 : one who bears witness; especially : one who voluntarily confesses a crime and testifies for the prosecution against his accomplices
So I am interpreting that you mean "Show me something that furnishes proof that is worthy to believe in, concerning your assertion that God is IMMANENT and TRANSCENDENT."
Well according to my (Afrakan) standards "suitable" proof (each post has been designed to show how this concept resides within various Afrakan belief systems) has already been submitted throughout this entire post. To the Afrakan, proof is determined by functionability for the group and whether or not the group accepts it. Because there is no either/or dichotomy in thinking, then any answer is potentially suitable as long as it is functional, viable and acceptable to the group's standards and survival.
Now assuming that you are a Christian stemming from a Western cultural ethos, thereby subjected to either/or dichotomy and "God is SEPARATE"-concept, I would then estimate that "plausible evidence" to you concerning "God is IMMANENT...", would be documentation of IT speaking these words to the people and then being transcribed in some fashion. Well according to the Afrakan oral tradition, there is such a story that might be of value. It was transcribed and translated from Yoruba by Awotunde Ifaseeyin Karade. However realize that this is only ONE example from the Ifa tradition of the Yoruba and several more exist around the continent. Go here: http://www.okayplayer.com/dcforum/DCForumID1/3291.html#27
3) You asked about "evil." If you read all of the posts then you would have some idea of how at least ONE particular Afrakan tradition views "evil."
From "Afrakan in the New World":
"To identify Eshu with evil is to misunderstand the basic principles of Yoruba philosophy. Unlike the European, the Yoruba does not conceive the world as a conflict between good and evil, light and darkness, God and devil. He is realistic and recognizes that all forces-even divine forces- have destructive as well as constructive possiblities. The secret of life, then and the purpose of orisha worship is to establish a constructive relationship with these powers."
I KNOW you are using your own concept of "evil" and superimposing it onto an Afrakan theological/philsophical perspective within your question. That can't be done as you will only be confused and beguiled and no serious discussion or understanding can be grasped. "How God handles evil" does not even make sense to me.
>4) And if you don't believe
>in this God then why
>do the Afrikan's
>believe in this God?
See my above answer.
***Words of Wisdom***
"Every time you rise from your sleeping state, you have been reincarnated. Every time you recover from a bad experience, you have been reincarnated. Every time you have been given a new lease on life, you have been reincarnated. Every time you breath in and out, take in the fresh breath of life and feel the divine intelligence flowing in and around you, you have been reincarnated."- Mfundishi Bakari
"I am in love everyday, whether I am with someone or not. Why? All love is based on a search for spirit. For me love is timeless, transcendent, peaceful, freeing, soul-based, unifying, and enhanced evolution. This is the basis of my activism."- Nettrice, the embodiment of Oshun
"Since we all make up the rules as we go along, love can mean many different things to many different people. But, for me love is a total commitment to understanding that is not limited to just people but is open to the totality of life. As long as we approach love from a fear based mentality and perceive it through veils of guardedness and anxiety, it will always be restricted by our fears."- Mfundishi Bakari