Just saw it reported on CBS Sports, they calling family to the hospital for last good-byes. UH-OH!!!

what an amazing fall from grace. shits sad. plus i guess we will never know the full truth about the sandusky info he may have known.

the situation was complicated and no one knows how much he knew or what he was thinking, etc
him getting fired like that was happening regardless once it became a firestorm in the media
*if* he dies i think the funeral and displays of public support will show that a lot of ppl still respect him and his accomplishments

.

any of that bullshit
public opinion already handed in the verdict on that
the scandal didn't change how i feel about his legacy one bit

.

.

God damn you're dense
_______________________________

Capone N Noreaga - War Report
Jay Dilla - Ruff Draft
Pharcyde - LabCabinCalifornia

Stealing victories

His wins def need an *
____________

for awhile.

But he wasn't going to *ever* retire & unlike FSU we know nobody over there was going to actually push him out, what killed him was likely his body which had already been failing him combined with the stress of that circus this fall & the realization that he'd disgraced the legacy he valued over just about anything else.

that was my call as soon as this ended.

I'm somewhat ashamed to say I actually wagered $100 on the under with a friend over email in the heat of this scandal.

Feel slightly dirty about it now but at the same time if I think about what was actually going on over there while JoePa did nothing (and is still lying in his last interview) then I can say at least he got 83 good years as opposed to the many who's lives were damaged before they'd reached puberty.

I sent dude my PayPal. Might put it towards charity.

>that was my call as soon as this ended.
>
>I'm somewhat ashamed to say I actually wagered $100 on the
>under with a friend over email in the heat of this scandal.
>
>Feel slightly dirty about it now but at the same time if I
>think about what was actually going on over there while JoePa
>did nothing (and is still lying in his last interview) then I
>can say at least he got 83 good years as opposed to the many
>who's lives were damaged before they'd reached puberty.
>
>I sent dude my PayPal. Might put it towards charity.


We've talked about it for a while, I don't think we can wait much longer

>>that was my call as soon as this ended.
>>
>>I'm somewhat ashamed to say I actually wagered $100 on the
>>under with a friend over email in the heat of this scandal.
>>
>>Feel slightly dirty about it now but at the same time if I
>>think about what was actually going on over there while
>JoePa
>>did nothing (and is still lying in his last interview) then
>I
>>can say at least he got 83 good years as opposed to the many
>>who's lives were damaged before they'd reached puberty.
>>
>>I sent dude my PayPal. Might put it towards charity.
>
>
>We've talked about it for a while, I don't think we can wait
>much longer

the media killed him...dude was destroyed and was deeply hurt from the situation...great coach...

>the media killed him

<--- :)

I don't wish the man premature death.

...sound just as bitch as JoePed right now when he was scared to speak on the evil that he LET continue

>...sound just as bitch as JoePed right now when he was scared
>to speak on the evil that he LET continue


Am I wrong for kind of co-signing this?

>Am I wrong for kind of co-signing this?

Too bad he didn't can Sandusky immediately

It's sad to see him go out like he did.


_______________________________

Capone N Noreaga - War Report
Jay Dilla - Ruff Draft
Pharcyde - LabCabinCalifornia

http://i.imgur.com/tCp90.gif

been giving us "Paterno back in the hospital" stories. I understand that football was a large part of his life, but if I was his wife I'd be pissed off because now he's just going to die behind this shit. I know he's old but damn he's more than just a football coach...he's a father, husband and grandfather.

But like someone else said...maybe there is probably more to this shit than we will ever know.

This is why you can't let anything outside of yourself be bigger than you. NOTHING.

<--- :)

in the case.

This old fucker knew his mans was foul.

Yes I hope he dies, and I hope he burns in hell!!

<--- :)

the media is canonize the muhfucka.

That shit is sick to me.

<--- :)

<--- :)

we have no idea what joe knew. he certainly didn't do enough.

those words, or something similar, are what both mcquery and paterno agree that mcquery told paterno.

so joepa is guilty of, at a minimum, not pushing harder to know what was happening in the investigation, when we all know he runs that town.

if that is the case, he definitely should have been fired, because everyone involved deserved to be. on some level he chose not to know, and that showed he didn't have the skill to run the program, because you HAVE t

but obliterate his entire legacy? dude, maybe the guy was just old and not top of things enough to know. maybe the guy was just old fashioned, where when shit like this happens you do what you're supposed to do and then forget about it.

now, if he knew sandusky was raping kids? then, yes, fuck joe paterno. but pretty much everyone involved seems to agree that joe didn't know the extent of the 2002 incident. could it be a conspiracy to protect joe and, by extension, the university? absolutely it could, but it also seems far fetched.

i tend to believe joe's account in the washington post. mcquery came to hime but spared him the full awfulness of what he saw. as joe said, he's an old fashioned guy who had no idea how to handle this, so he sent it up the chain of command and tried his damnedest to forget about it. for that, he needed to be fired, because he's joe paterno and he should have done better.

but that is NOT a "fuck you, i hope you burn in hell" sin. that does not take away him being the single most important person in the economic development of pennsylvania in the 20th Century. that is an old, old fashioned guy making a really awful mistake.

at least 1 kid has been molested?

To me, no.

Idgaf how old you are, touching a kid inappropriately in any form or fashion has NEVER been cool. It aint like Paterno was born B.C.

I get that the man has done a lot for the state. But he knew funny shit was going on with his boy FOR A DECADE. c'mon son

Is that not molestation?

mcqueary gave everyone else the details, not joe.

http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=8&topic_id=1998522&mesg_id=1998522&page=

yet sandusky was parading little tikes around the practice fields...right under joe pa's watch.

not to mention, dont think for a second joe pa didnt know about why dude 'retired' in the first place

i could go on but this argument is beyond irrational/sad at this point

joe can't get a pass for his age in 2002 because he still had enough of his awareness then. you can see it interviews. so if he knew then, fuck joepa.

but the last 6-8 years? cmon, man. he didn't know where he was half the time. that means he absolutely should have been fired. he should have stopped, or been made to stop, coaching at least 6 years ago.

but throw away everything he did because he didn't control his sideline during the senile years? nope, i'm not gonna do that.

>but throw away everything he did

just being mindful of folks that want to piss on his grave...cause i feel they have a right to. sorry, this 'minus' was so heinous that im gonna have to respect those who don't really give a fuck about psu's library.

>because he didn't control his
>sideline during the senile years?

not buying the senile plea cop

you know damn well he didn't have control of anything the last few years. he barely knew where he was.

>you know damn well he didn't have control of anything the
>last few years. he barely knew where he was.

I started saying he had minimal input on game strategy sometime around 2006/2007

we have his acknowledgment (to whatever extent) of the sandusky situation dating back to '98. kind of a big difference. and kind of a big difference between calling plays and managing in-game decisions to having enough sense to kick a child rapist the fuck off campus.

>we have no idea what joe knew. he certainly didn't do
>enough.

I'm sorry but he didn't need dick-in-booty details to be alarmed.

<--- :)

it's not like he squashed it. he sent it to the people whose job it was to deal with such things.

now, that was not ok. any college coach has more sway than the official chain of command, and joepa is not just any college coach. he deserved to get fired.

but let's stop acting like he did nothing. his actions were insufficient, but they were not nonexistent. that, to me, moves it out of the "burn in hell" territory and into the realm of really awful mistakes. he was a guy who was too old for his position who didn't know how to handle shit, so he reported it and hoped it would go away.

...fuck it, write, i'll try to give you an inbox later, but i've been typing about this for an hour and i'm just tired. it's exhausting talking about this shit, especially since no one seems particularly interested in the facts of the case, let alone the facts surrounding paterno's broader career.

>it's not like he squashed it. he sent it to the people whose
>job it was to deal with such things.

No, it's you're fucking job to call the cops and report this dude. End of fucking story. To hell with protocol in a situation like that.

>now, that was not ok. any college coach has more sway than
>the official chain of command, and joepa is not just any
>college coach. he deserved to get fired.

This is about a man finding out about another man raping kids. It's sickening how tainted your mind is by the fact that it was a college coach.

>but let's stop acting like he did nothing. his actions were
>insufficient, but they were not nonexistent.

Lol. Insufficient might as well be nonexistent. You're totally ok with this shit, aren't you?

>moves it out of the "burn in hell" territory and into the
>realm of really awful mistakes. he was a guy who was too old
>for his position who didn't know how to handle shit, so he
>reported it and hoped it would go away.

Because you really, really like the guy. That's all there is to this. You like him, therefore this is ok with you. Look, you find out about this, you turn his ass in to the police. Period. Anything less is unacceptable and you're complicit at that point IMO.

>...fuck it, write, i'll try to give you an inbox later, but
>i've been typing about this for an hour and i'm just tired.
>it's exhausting talking about this shit, especially since no
>one seems particularly interested in the facts of the case,
>let alone the facts surrounding paterno's broader career.

His career has nothing to do with his actions in this case. His broader career is completely irrelevant. You're blinded by that career into copping a million pleas for the fact that he should have went to the cops instead of copping out by telling the school.

is acceptable. Both out of respect and out of disappointment, disdain.

What a situation.

I don't even know what to say. I think I'd need to know what he knew and when in order to know what to say or feel.

I completely agree and you are right.

http://eye-on-collegefootball.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/24156338/34497800?ttag=gen10_on_all_fb_na_txt_0001

Posted by Adam Jacobi

Joe Paterno, the man who for decades was synonymous with Penn State football and was known by the college football world as just "JoePa", has died. Paterno, 85, had been receiving chemotherapy as part of his treatment for lung cancer, and complications from that treatment claimed the longtime Penn State coach's life on Saturday.

Paterno was the head coach of Penn State for 46 seasons before being fired in November as his role in the Jerry Sandusky child sex abuse scandal came under greater scrutiny. Combined with the time he spent as an assistant, Paterno spent a total of 61 years on the Penn State sidelines. He left behind a legacy that, on the field of play, was unparalleled in Division I football. Paterno holds the all-time Division I record for football coaching wins with a 409-136-3 record, and he won two national championships while going undefeated in five different seasons.



Under Paterno, Penn State was a perennial powerhouse, known for decades as "Linebacker U" for its propensity to develop All-American linebackers. Paterno coached such great linebackers as Dennis Onkotz, Jack Ham, Shane Conlan, LaVar Arrington, Paul Posluszny, Dan Connor, and Sean Lee, along with many others.

Additionally, running back John Cappalletti won the Heisman Trophy in 1973 under Paterno, and Cappalletti was one of seven Penn State players to win the Maxwell Award for most outstanding college football player. All in all, 68 players were named first-team All-American by at least one of the major news services under Paterno; 13 of those players were two-year winners.

Paterno's longtime defensive coordinator and the architect of the defensive schemes that came to typify Penn State football was Jerry Sandusky, who's now more well-known for the allegations of underaged sexual abuse against him made by men who were involved in Sandusky's charity, The Second Mile, as boys. Sandusky is still awaiting trial for those allegations, and he pled not guilty to the charges in December 2011.

In an interview with the Washington Post released just a week before Paterno's death, he expressed remorse for not having done more to stop Sandusky's alleged crimes, and he also said he was "just sick about" the situation. Investigators did not bring charges against Paterno, and instead mentioned that he had fulfilled his legal obligations by notifying his superiors about an alleged assault when he was first notified in 2002.

After Paterno was fired in 2011, Penn State named Tom Bradley -- who, coincidentally, was Sandusky's replacement at defensive coordinator -- interim head coach. Bradley went 1-3, including a loss to Houston in the TicketCity Bowl, and was not retained as a coach when Penn State hired Bill O'Brien in January.

Paterno was well known for encouraging his players to excel in the classroom and earn their undergraduate degrees at Penn State, and his name will live on at Penn State after his firing and death. Paterno and his wife Sue were major financial supporters of Penn State University, as they donated millions of dollars for the Paterno Library on campus, and Paterno helped establish the Paterno Liberal Arts Undergraduate Fellows Program.

<--- :)

.

he never tried to do anything to stop dude from raping all those kids......



<---- Downtown Kansas City, Missouri 5/24/2011

From Twitter: Dan McGinn, the Paterno family spokesman, at 8:57 p.m. on reports about Joe Paterno's death: "Absolutely not true."

RIP and all that. Dude will be canonized as an icon....
























However, fuck this dude. This man allowed his friend to ruin dozens if not thousands of men's lives in the name of a football program. He held everyone to a high standard that he didn't stand for when shit counted. I hope they take his name out off NCAA records. There's no telling how many men died in shame and hurt from a lifetime of suffering thanks to what Joe Platerno ALLOWED TO GO ON. WHAT ABOUT THEM? I can't idolize someone with such a fucked up moral compass.. SORRY.

People can say that it's too early for this. Anyone else receives this hatred. Because he's old and coached for forever, everyone's supposed to forget the culture that he created that fostered such negligence?

I hope he rots in the deepest, darkest, coldest pit in hell. He's a great man that made a grave error in judgement which ruined lives. Everyone. Would rever him if he made the right decision years ago.

....dude didn't care about kids being FUCKED by his right hand man ...he can burn in hell as far as I'm concerned

and if life is a game of pluses and minuses, he's still way ahead of the game.

...time to wake up dude ...that wasn't your pops ...wasnt your gramps ...he was a coach that you have NO ties to, who happened to sit back and let children get FUCKED by his buddy

that "minus" negates any nice thing he's ever done.. fuck him

I understand some people are coming from a different place. Just for a day, let the next man feel how he needs to feel about it. Whether it be respect, disgust, or somewhere in the middle.

in the meantime, it's obvious you have no idea what joe paterno did for the university and the state.

i know it's fun in this day and age to act like one issue can obliterate a man's body of work, but it's just not the case here. paterno didn't rape the kids. it's not clear what he knew. it's clear that he didn't do enough, and that meant he absolutely, positively needed to be fired.

but, yeah, without joe paterno penn state is either michigan state or iowa state. the fact that it is one of the top 20-30 research institutions in the nation in a state that hates to publicly fund anything is the testament to a lot of people, but joe paterno is absolutely number one on that list, for reasons that are only tangentially related to the football games he won. put in a way anyone can understand, bobby bowden could have done the same thing for fsu that joe pa did, but he didn't, because he didn't care, because it takes a person of uncommon moral fabric and vision to elevate an entire university and state the way paterno did.

and no, passively enabling a child molester doesn't negate all of that. it doesn't even come close.

but where do we draw the line?

So is ODB the only one for the kids? No I don't think we should discount his good because God knows I've made mistakes and I would hope that my good is what represents me the most, but this situation has such far-reaching effects what does one think? You're talking about academic excellence and we're talking about kids being molested. Can't you see why people would 0_o that?

<--- :)

but, you know, JOE PATERNO DIDN'T MOLEST CHILDREN.

(i feel the need to shout because people act like they don't know that jerry sandusky, and not joe paterno, molested the kids).

we don't even know that joe paterno knew jerry sandusky molested the kids. mcquery probably didn't tell him.

the number one rule of big-time college coaching is that you have to keep the head coach insulated from the dirt so that he can have deniability. what, so we think that mentality guides everything involving the football program but somehow stops when mcquery wants to talk about the most ugly thing ever?

the more i think about it, the more i think everyone at penn state who knew insulated joe. joe's fault in all of this was that he let himself be insulated. that he didn't say, jesus, mike, tell me more. tell me exactly what sandusky did.

and he didn't do that. for which he deserved to be fired. but if all joe did was not ask enough questions, it means that he was either too old, too old fashioned, or unqualified to be a modern head coach, but those are all human failings. they are the kind of failings that happen in a system where your leader needs to be protected from the dirt, because the leader gets used to thinking that it's everyone else's job to handle the dirt, and that he needs to run far away from the dirt to keep the operation rolling.

more basically, they are failings that mean you can't run a major institution like psu football anymore, but they are not "fuck you, did, and burn in hell" failings.

accountability does JoePa shoulder? I know we don't have a measuring stick on that and by all accounts he lost his job behind it, but knowing (and I'm sorry he KNEW) just bothers me.

>but, you know, JOE PATERNO DIDN'T MOLEST CHILDREN.
>
>(i feel the need to shout because people act like they don't
>know that jerry sandusky, and not joe paterno, molested the
>kids).
>
>we don't even know that joe paterno knew jerry sandusky
>molested the kids. mcquery probably didn't tell him.


Like I said you are right he didn't, but to me JoePa didn't need a booty blew for blew to know Jerry was molesting kids. He didn't see me wrestling on the couch...they were in the shower NAKED b...NAKED. An old ass man and a child....NAKED.

>the number one rule of big-time college coaching is that you
>have to keep the head coach insulated from the dirt so that he
>can have deniability. what, so we think that mentality guides
>everything involving the football program but somehow stops
>when mcquery wants to talk about the most ugly thing ever?

If he caught em on the coach in a long t-shirt and draws maybe just maybe we could act like we didn't know, but he was naked in the shower with a child. As far as how the institution of bullshit is held...well that's sad and I don't have words for it.


>the more i think about it, the more i think everyone at penn
>state who knew insulated joe. joe's fault in all of this was
>that he let himself be insulated. that he didn't say, jesus,
>mike, tell me more. tell me exactly what sandusky did.
>
>and he didn't do that. for which he deserved to be fired.
>but if all joe did was not ask enough questions, it means that
>he was either too old, too old fashioned, or unqualified to be
>a modern head coach, but those are all human failings. they
>are the kind of failings that happen in a system where your
>leader needs to be protected from the dirt, because the leader
>gets used to thinking that it's everyone else's job to handle
>the dirt, and that he needs to run far away from the dirt to
>keep the operation rolling.
>
>more basically, they are failings that mean you can't run a
>major institution like psu football anymore, but they are not
>"fuck you, did, and burn in hell" failings.

Like I said I'm not with the burn in hell crew, but the whole going back and forth about what he knew is ridiculous because I don't care what none of y'all say he knew ENOUGH.


<--- :)

if you think advancing education, winning football games and obeying chain of command is a pardon for not protecting children, then by all means Paterno "came out ahead" in your ledger of human comparison. others see it differently.

>in the meantime, it's obvious you have no idea what joe
>paterno did for the university and the state.

i dont care about Penn State or PA.. he let kids get FUCKED.. are you cosigning his actions?

>i know it's fun in this day and age to act like one issue can
>obliterate a man's body of work, but it's just not the case
>here. paterno didn't rape the kids. it's not clear what he
>knew. it's clear that he didn't do enough, and that meant he
>absolutely, positively needed to be fired.

he have gone to JAIL...

>but, yeah, without joe paterno penn state is either michigan
>state or iowa state. the fact that it is one of the top 20-30
>research institutions in the nation in a state that hates to
>publicly fund anything is the testament to a lot of people,
>but joe paterno is absolutely number one on that list, for
>reasons that are only tangentially related to the football
>games he won. put in a way anyone can understand, bobby
>bowden could have done the same thing for fsu that joe pa did,
>but he didn't, because he didn't care, because it takes a
>person of uncommon moral fabric and vision to elevate an
>entire university and state the way paterno did.

DUDE FUCK PENN STATE... he let kids get FUCKED.. AGAIN, are you cosigning his actions?

>and no, passively enabling a child molester doesn't negate all
>of that. it doesn't even come close.

you are a sick bastard

knowing that your assistant coach is dicking down lil boys and not doing anything about to save face for your football program negates ANY good that you've done in your life.....



<---- Downtown Kansas City, Missouri 5/24/2011

>knowing that your assistant coach is dicking down lil boys
>and not doing anything about to save face for your football
>program negates ANY good that you've done in your life.....

were several people beyond Paterno that were in the power to put a stop to Sandusky's reprehensible actions. There was the '98 police investigation which the district attorney decided not to pursue. There was the head of State College police -who Paterno notified - who failed to launch a full investigation into the shower incident of 2002. The school President knew of the allegations. The Board of Trustees knew of the grand jury investigation yet decided to react only after the media shit-storm. And then of course there was Mike McQueary who could have simply went to the police himself instead of passing along the information.

The even bigger culprit (beyond Sandusky) is the 2nd Mile who mysteriously continues to dodge the blame they rightfully deserve. THey knew of allegations/investigations for a long, long time and still allowed Sandusky to invlove himself with kids. That is where he gained access to all these kids.

I don't think Joe is blameless at all. However, I do think the media scrutiny over him has been extremely one-sided. I think putting all the blame on a 76 year old man (at the time) who was increasingly becoming more hands-off with the program is a bit unfair as well. Some folks are acting like Joe was solely responsible for all of Sandusky's misdeeds and I take issue with that. But as I said, I don't think Joe is blameless and I can see why many people won't see things from my perspective.

trying to camouflage that large elephant in the room. I mean the amount of mincing of details around the GA catching Sandusky in the shower is getting on my fucking nerves. A nasty old ass white man was in the shower with a child. I don't give a damn if hadn't put his dick in em yet.

My goodness this is why so many kids are so fucked up because people only really give a shit about their own damn kids.


<--- :)

you, me, or anyone else here posting knows exactly what Paterno knew and to what extent. Furthermore, it's extremely unfair to put all the responsibility on his shoulders when there were plenty of people just as close the situation and with much more information to stop Sandusky. It was Paterno after all who reported the 2nd hand information he was given to the State College chief of police. That's more than you can say about a lot of other folks at PSU/2nd Mile who were privy to the allegations. It's not like he sat back and did nothing. I too believe he could have done more. But then again, he was 76 at time and human. He probably assumed the campus police would resolve the matter.

I love the fact that people are so vigilante about condeming/putting a stop to pedophilia bc it's a deplorable epidemic that ruins millions of lives. Unfortunately, there are far too many cases that go unreported. I hope the victims of Sandusky are able to get some form of justice. However, I refuse to put this all on Paterno as if it was only him who could have stopped all this from happening.

No I don't think he should shoulder all the blame, but I can't sit by and act like that wasn't really fucked up that knowing Sandusky was in the shower wasn't enough.

If McQuerey said that he saw him in the shower with Paterno's grandchild...he probably would be pushing up daisies for sure.


<--- :)

didn't know the best way to handle the situation and did what he thought would be enough. That's his fatal mistake - he thought by informing the head of campus police (which is a legitimate police force) and setting up a meeting with McQueary, the chief of police and the athletic director would be enough. Hence, the 'I wish I would have done more.' The chief of campus police was informed though, that's not the definition of doing nothing.

There's no doubt that he would have done more if the incident involved one of his grandkids. Right or wrong, that's also the case with the majority of people.

>There's no doubt that he would have done more if the incident
>involved one of his grandkids. Right or wrong, that's also
>the case with the majority of people.


anybody's kids but their own which is gravely sad to me.

<--- :)

justice served. But judging how poorly those involved with the case are handling this, I'm very skeptical. A lot of rich grown men trying to cover up what they knew. I can't say with certainty that we will ever get closure on what happened, who knew, and to what extent. It's sad and pathetic all-around.

everything else with cops and the DA and all that shit is semantics to me. Once you know, you:

1. call the cops
2. if the state gets funny-style about pressing charges, you fire the muhfucka on GP

Furthermore, Sandusky was given full access to PSU facilities as part of his severance package. That's not Joe's call. That's the AD/School President who would have had as much knowledge of Sandusky's actions at the time as Joe.

The dropping of the investigation by the DA isn't semantics. That's actually a big deal because it could have put a stop to Sandusky much earlier.

Like I previously mentioned, I don't think Paterno is blameless at all. Based upon what facts I do have however, it does appear that he did much more than a lot of other PSU/2nd Mile administrators who were in a position to can Sandusky a long time ago. Shifting all the blame and focus on Paterno won't dismiss the fact that there were several other people in a position to stop Sandusky who failed miserably.

y not say, "If you allow him access, I won't coach here anymore."
He certainly had the cache to do so, I would think.

have done more. Believe me, I'm thoroughly embarassed and ashamed with how Joe Pa and the rest of the PSU administration handled the situation. It's repulising.

I don't expect you or anyone else here to respect Joe Paterno. I can understand why there is a very strong sense of disdain and hatred for Joe Pa from a lot of folks. I just can't get on board with the 'hope he burns in hell' comments -especially when there are so many unanswered questions in regards to what Joe knew and to what extent. Also, there were many other people privy of the situation with just as much power (and in some cases with the chief of police/school president/attorney general) in even more power to pursue the situation with diligence.

I certainly understand the sentiment of the 'burn in hell' comments. It bothers me to hear them, but I have no choice but to respect them.

Why keep it in the family? Kids getting ass fucked is not PSU's department, it's the police department. I don't care if it was on PSU grounds or not; that's a legit police issue and should have gone to the cops.

Beyond that he did nothing which is deplorable. But he did at least do something, which is more than you can say for a lot of people in charge at PSU/2nd Mile. That is not copping pleas - that's simply pointing out the fact that this wasn't an act carried out alone by Paterno. I choose not view this situation as black and white as a lot of folks here are. That doesn't make them wrong and I am certainly able to understand why so many people have a strong hate for Paterno.

The rest of the staff there can fuck themselves; them having large shares of blame in their own right does not remove that blame from shit bag Joe.

Anyhow, Joe should have contacted the actual police. CPS. Whoever the fuck. Saying he did better than nothing is worthless; that's like clocking into work, spending all day jerking off than working for the last 30 minutes. You did more than nothing, technically, but come on. There is no credit to be earned for passing the buck.

>Beyond that he did nothing which is deplorable. But he did
>at least do something, which is more than you can say for a
>lot of people in charge at PSU/2nd Mile. That is not copping
>pleas - that's simply pointing out the fact that this wasn't
>an act carried out alone by Paterno.

JoePa knew something happened with Sandusky and a little boy in a shower. He's said that interviews. JoePa at the time, WAS Penn State football. He kept his mouth shut so no harm would come to the football program and he could break the record.

That in and of itself is deplorable. PSU profited off of this neglience. So, yes, I hope he rots in hell over this.

you cant say on the one hand that he was the greatest man in the state of pa and did more for the school than anyone else etc, and on the other hand say that he had no control over the higher ups that he "reported" the incident to. jopa basically hand picked the president of the school and the board of trustees, so for him to put this on their lap and wash his hands as if thats all he could do is beyond ridiculous.

mcquerry may have sparred him the details out of respect but once the other higher ups knew you dont think jopa had access to that info or got word of it from someone? people are acting like he did all he could do but for something as serious as this i think a follow up by jopa is certainly within his responsibility as well. he didnt do that. he didnt care enough to ask additional questions or to find out what came of the investigation(s). the most powerful man in state college passed the buck, which is something he never would have allowed any of his student athletes to do. the man is/was a coward.

imagine if nick saban spent 50 years at alabama pushing the university to keep football in perspective and to keep expanding the research and educational programs of the university.

the library is the tip of the iceberg.

That's grimy as fuck

he was a figurehead in every sense of the word. i doubt he knew sandusky was in the stadium.

of the part about him not knowing Sandusky was in the stadium because they let this farce (figure head issue) ride for so long. I guess that's why JoePa kept saying he wasn't going to retire even when he should have probably done that some years ago. I know you are much closer to the situation than me and I can understand how you may feel about this so I'm not going to keep rehashing.

It was a terrible beast that was created.

<--- :)

>I know you are much closer to the situation than me and I
>can understand how you may feel about this so I'm not going to
>keep rehashing.


he's a Penn State alum?? Wow, how is it they are all so brainwashed and delusional?? I've got cousins that went there and they are the same way. Talk about children of the corn.. sad really

If he had no control over anything, why was he there?

To soak up win stats? that's ridic.

but i've been saying that long before this happened. i knew something was going to happen that was really bad, i just didn't think it could be this bad.

let this be a lesson: no matter how much you love someone, when they can't do the job anymore, it's time to go.

when Joe was still pretty on top of his game, I don't know what to tell you because I can't debate that level of naivete.

Joe knew if a kid on his team got a jaywalking ticket in that town, he somehow isn't going to know the investigation into his D-Coordinator who just so happens to retire rather than coach again immediately after.

Please.

to take a much more proactive stance than he did. He made a monumental lapse in judgement by not pursuing the issue further. I think I was clear on that.

The '98 incident was a criminal matter that did not take place on PSU's campus. No coach was witness to what Sandusky did - so no, Joe most likely did not know exactly what happened. There was an investigation that was dropped. I do think at that point Paterno should have fought to keep Sandusky off campus. The fact that Joe didn't take action at that point doesn't sit well with me. But, Joe still didn't have the power to prosecute Sandusky. He didn't have the power to control Sandusky's actions outside of PSU. He didn't have the power to relinquish Sandusky's role/affiliation with the 2nd Mile.

All I'm saying is that there are a lot of uncertainties (and will continue to be for quite some time)in regards to this case. With the information I have gathered, I don't think it's enough to lump all the responsibility and blame on just Paterno. That doesn't mean I am defending his actions - I will never be so blind to think he handled the situation well and is without blame. If that makes me naive, so be it.

>when Joe was still pretty on top of his game, I don't know
>what to tell you because I can't debate that level of
>naivete.
>
>Joe knew if a kid on his team got a jaywalking ticket in that
>town, he somehow isn't going to know the investigation into
>his D-Coordinator who just so happens to retire rather than
>coach again immediately after.
>
>Please.

For arguments sake, lets say jerry took your 10 year old son to those showers, and made your precious little Johnny suck his cock, and JoePa had a little more than an inkling it was happening. Or lets say it was you that he 'passively enabled' to fuck up the ass in the shower. Let's say your little brother or your friends child is one of Jerry's Kids.

You still gonna take this stance?

It's sickening that you're sitting here talking about the accomplishments of this man and downplaying the severity of what happened as though little boys getting ass raped is no big deal, especially if the guys doing the ass fucking won some football games.

The damage done to a child that gets molested far, far, far, FAR, fucking FAR outweighs whatever good this asshole did. DO you not understand the concept of collateral damage, or what?

Did you ever stop and think about the cycles that have likely been started here? Do you not realize that the vast majority of molesters were once molested? So how many of those kids do you think wound up doing the same thing? If even one continued the chain, that's enough. The emotional, mental, and physical damage to these children can be enormous. You're a piece of shit, you know that? To downplay the serious damage done to these children in light of the good he's done is terrible. It's not a fucking pissing contest, but YES, allowing someone to rape children taints the fuck out of everything he's done. None of what he's done matters in the least if he did in fact have knowledge of this and allow this to happen.

I use the word if for obvious reasons.

on the details. However, bshelly is a good dude and that's all I gotta say on that.


<--- :)

>on the details. However, bshelly is a good dude and that's
>all I gotta say on that.

If it makes you feel better, I edited, but that doesn't change my opinions on any man who cops pleas for a guy who 'passively enabled a child molester' just because he likes the guy for his good works. Fuck all his good works, his good works don't mean shit.

of us. And he's raised a few good points regarding the details.
U shouldn't be attacking him like that tho.

Because he likes Paterno.

Oh, he knew about some serious shit, copped out by telling school officials and not the police, but HEY, he did all this other good shit so fuck it. No worries! Just fire him and continue to celebrate all that other shit.

Newsflash: If his response was a grave enough error to fire him over, them it's a grave enough error to indict his character and write his ass out of the record books. His accomplishments SHOULD be downplayed if this issue was severe enough to fire him over. But no, Bshelly wants to have his asshole cake and eat it to.

Low post counts don't make it an alias, b

Look, I understand he has his view on this, but that opinion severely downplays the severity of even passively allowing shit to go on.

Imagine being a victim here, and imagine finding out that people knew but either did nothing, or did just enough to pass the buck. How would you feel?

Would you sit there and say, "Well, hell, look at all the research labs this guy brought to this school. He wasn't the guy who ass fucked me when I was twelve, so I guess it's not that bad that he did just enough so that he can look in the mirror without vomiting."?

Nah

That would be rock salt in a gaping wound. It's insult to injury. How would they feel if they saw someone defending that? Do you think the victims feel that all that Penn State good Joe P did outweighs the trauma of being molested and knowing this guy had knowledge and just passed the buck?

Nope. Sorry. Can't see it. IMO, this warrants an impassioned, strongly worded response. An outright personal attack was uncalled for, which is why I edited, but seriously? If you either been a victim of this sort of abuse or know someone who was... meditate on that shit for a minute.

and people got offended by it, which is unfortunate and coincidental.

But but clearly dude's point of view is subjective due to a bias of some sort.

Maybe he could've stopped things from happening on penn's campus (and honestly I don't even kno about that)

But Sandusky is obviously a sick man who im sure would've found a way to do what he wanted either way. Had this situation been dealt with by Penn we prolly would've never heard about it until yrs after the fact. They would've asked him to resign (quietly) and he would've went on to abuse more kids while the police dragged the case out. Idk if yall really understand university politics. Joe definitely should've done more but to put the blame of kids being abused...kids he didn't even touch...on HIM is crazy

If anyone should burn in hell it should be Penn officials and the officers who kept overlooking and ignoring the complaints being made. At the end of the day Joe did what he was required to do. It may not have been enough...but honestly who's to say what "enough" would've been exactly...especially when people would've done anything they could to cover this all up. I mean the COPS been knew about this and Sandusky JUST got arrested....that right there should tell u a lot

I'm not saying Paterno is totally innocent but he's definitely not the person who should carry the majority of the blame

>RIP and all that. Dude will be canonized as an icon....
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>However, fuck this dude. This man allowed his friend to ruin
>dozens if not thousands of men's lives in the name of a
>football program. He held everyone to a high standard that he
>didn't stand for when shit counted. I hope they take his name
>out off NCAA records. There's no telling how many men died in
>shame and hurt from a lifetime of suffering thanks to what Joe
>Platerno ALLOWED TO GO ON. WHAT ABOUT THEM? I can't idolize
>someone with such a fucked up moral compass.. SORRY.
>
>People can say that it's too early for this. Anyone else
>receives this hatred. Because he's old and coached for
>forever, everyone's supposed to forget the culture that he
>created that fostered such negligence?
>
>I hope he rots in the deepest, darkest, coldest pit in hell.
>He's a great man that made a grave error in judgement which
>ruined lives. Everyone. Would rever him if he made the right
>decision years ago.

1998 and fell back
so stop making sense in here

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<---- 5....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlgiritpmfo

=======================================
Occupy Big Government..

Fannie, Freddie dole out big bonuses
http://dyn.politico.com/printstory.cfm?uuid=3F6F3E67-28B

.

dude isn't worthy of another one next week or next month or whenever

.

_______________________________

Gangrene - Vodka and Ayahuasca
East Flatbush Project-First Born Overdue
Statik Selektah-Population Control

Do better dude.

hell" which is kinda extra, but yeah.


<--- :)

his not "doing more" however and whomever defines that, is worthy of that kind of criticism.
But didn't mean to offend.

the vitriol is kinda jarring. We would all hope not be judged that harshly over even our biggest downfall, but yeah.
<--- :)

the rest of us.
<--- :)

I'd be trying to distance myself from this guy, not sit there and defend him from the message board townsfolk and their pitchforks and torches. If he honestly can't understand why so many people have such intense reactions to this, then he warrants equally intense responses to his defense of this scumbag.

nothing less. Though I don't agree, how he feels about it and his closeness to the situation is understandable to me along with the fact that he's a good and brilliant person period. His stance on the situation doesn't for a second change what I think about him. Argue your points because with those I can agree, but this other shit is extra and miles from the truth.


<--- :)

>His stance on the situation doesn't for a second change what I
>think about him. Argue your points because with those I can
>agree, but this other shit is extra and miles from the truth.

Allowing a child to be molested because you choose to tell school officials about it instead of the police is indefensible. If your good buddy can't see why everyone has such extreme opinions on this situation due to his closeness to it, then he deserves the same side eye the shit bag he's defending so passionately gets. Yes, there is guilt by association, and defending a guy in this situation while downplaying what happened to these victims because, in his eyes, passively allowing little boys to get ass fucked doesn't taint all the good shit the shit bag did before he became complicit in this situation. You can defend him all you want, that's fine- but it definitely tints him with a few drops of shady. It's absolutely fair to question the character of someone who so passionately defends someone for having such an egregious lapse of judgment. That said, I'll continue to argue my point, and I will continue to have my opinion on the character of someone who defends shit bags who even passively allow their friends/coworkers/associates to fuck children.

point of which I agree? Like damn....go to bed.

<--- :)

because you've defended him to this point. Don't try and flip it; I realize you agree on the main points regarding shit bag joe. I'm talking about shelly. Shelly rightly gets a side eye for defending shit bag Joe, which was the point of the post you just responded to, so I don't get what you're talking about since you're defending shelly. You're more than welcome to go to bed yourself though.

it though I disagree doesn't change that. If you are not an alias then you don't even have a clue as to who anyone is on this board and why I'm saying I understand how HE feels about this fucked up situation. You just want to argue so go do it with someone else or go play in 5'clock traffic. lol


<--- :)

>If you are not an alias then you don't even have a clue as to who >anyone is on this board

Why do I need to know people on this board to have an opinion on THIS SPECIFIC situation? I don't need to know the personal history of Bshelly to know how I feel about him defending shit bag Joe. I realize he's "close" to the situation, however that IMO makes it worse. Rather than distance himself, he's pulling himself closer. I don't need to know him or your to have an opinion on that.

>and why I'm saying I understand how HE feels

Like I said, if HE can't understand why so many people are in the "burn in hell camp", then his own character should come into question. I DON'T understand how he feels. I think it's despicable. You don't. Great. The other part- the biggest part- of my issue here is, the fact that he severely downplayed all of this because of all the good shit bag has done. I notice you didn't have shit to say when I pointed out the very real potential long term consequences of molestation victims.

>You just want to argue

Really? I see you and a post full of people arguing back and forth. I don't "just want to argue" any more than you or anyone else in this thread. You just want to defend your friend shelly. I'm far from the only one sharing my opinion on the matter though, so this is bullshit on your part.

>with someone else or go play in 5'clock traffic. lol

Oh, ok. How bout you go get raped while pillars of your community know about it but do nothing or do slightly more than nothing, then get back to me about how understanding you are.

<--- :)

You can't even form a decent, snark free rebuttal. That's what's comical.

<--- :)

You accuse me of just wanting to argue, however I provided a well thought out rebuttal while you spat a line of snark. If you're not going to engage to subject at hand and instead rely on arrogant one liners in order to continue the back and forth, that's pretty much the definition of arguing just to argue. You want to continue the back and forth, but you want to have the last word as well. If you're not going to attempt to actually discuss the issue further, why respond at all?

Because you just want to argue, that's why.

<--- :)

Meanwhile you're really feeling yourself as though you had a gotcha. But then, that's what trolls do, don't they? You've trolled for three straight posts, arguing just to argue. Way to go!

<--- :)

You keep trolling though. It's what people like you do when they don't have a rational, well thought out leg to stand on, but still want to argue. You'll respond in a few seconds with a similar one line bit of snark, feeling yourself up all the while i'm sure. It's also the highlight of your weekend, which I find a bit sad but whatever.

...this is hilarious.
<--- :)

You really are delusional. Scary.

<--- :)

You have neither the attention span nor intelligence to have an in depth discussion. Your response is typical of people who want to sit atop the surface of a topic and talk down to people who don't see something your way; the second someone digs in and gets down to brass tax, you fall back to trolling. In this case, it's your defense of Bshelly's defense of shit bag Joe. When I broke down my reasons for my issue with shelly's stance and ripped apart your poorly thought out "argument", you pretended like we were arguing about paterno, which according to you, you agree with me on. Anyhow, the fact that you consider a paragraph or a two a "whole dissertation" tells me all I need to know about you. At this point, I'll be giving you what you want in the form of the last word, because I've actually got shit to do besides argue with trolls. So your next smarmy one liner can be enjoyed with the foreknowledge that you finally got the last word.

do you?

<--- :)

We don't really know what he knew and when either.

Until we do, there are some that are willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.

I don't know that this is unreasonable.

he needed to be fired. i said that then, i say that now.

How it was foul they fired him.

How he deserved better.

FUCK ALL OF THAT

That nigga was wrong. Knew he was wrong.

I don't want to hear that crying bullshit now.

And of course it's mostly white people.

That asshole should be around to speak up for what he did.

my god

as far as i'm concerned there are still questions about what was known, when it was known, and the degree of severity that was understood
people already have their mind made up tho so let them get their healing i guess
who knows what they have experienced in life. perhaps they can relate better than i can
maybe i'm desensitized but hot button topics don't rile me up
muthafuckers are too reactionary and that's a characteristic typically shared by dumb people

>as far as i'm concerned there are still questions about what
>was known, when it was known, and the degree of severity that
>was understood

He knew Sandusky (i.e, a grown man) was caught in a shower with a young boy. He passed the buck, supposedly doing "what he was supposed to do and followed the chain of command", which is bullshit; YOU CALL THE POLICE. Not the campus police. You don't keep this one in the family, you bust it out. This, just to be clear, isn't an emotional response. It's a rational one. You have knowledge of this, you report it to the police. The real police.

>people already have their mind made up tho so let them get
>their healing i guess who knows what they have experienced in life. >perhaps they can

Even the people who defend him acknowledge he needed to be fired for this and that he didn't do enough. That's enough to have a strong opinion on the matter. If it was enough to get him fired and enough that he should have done more, than that's enough for the court of public opinion to feel however they feel.

>maybe i'm desensitized but hot button topics don't rile me up

Who's riled? People simply have strong opinions.

>muthafuckers are too reactionary and that's a characteristic
>typically shared by dumb people

Like I said, he knew a grown man was in the shower with a young boy. He didn't need to know if there was sex going on; that's enough to warrant calling the police department. That's enough to follow that information through to the bitter end, if he were REALLY all about his morals. There are only two real reasons not to do this:

-He really didn't want the headache and was more concerned with protecting the school and it's staff from the potential fall out.
-He didn't give a fuck, and his moral fiber isn't what he thought it was.

He had enough information to do something with. He doesn't need to see Jerry fuck a ten year old. He didn't need 100% verified eye witness testimony. He had enough to to pursue a full investigation.

The fact that others didn't do what they needed to do on the situation doesn't absolve Joe from HIS responsibility in all this. Let's not pretend that the heat from public eyes don't fall on Joe for being the biggest celebrity of the bunch.

For the record, these aren't reactionary, emotional responses. These are rational statements.

foh, StatePennMan.

the shit is sad, I'll say that much.
JoePa was basically Strom Thurmond status IMO; there's a possibility that the shit was hidden from him as much as it was everyone else. in any case, that he's taking an image L based off this whole affair is par for the course... can't really be too mad at that.

it's kind of like how Mike Vick didn't go to jail for killing dogs, but rather the illegal gambling operation related to dogfighting. he'll still be called a "dog killer" by the unwashed masses.

Sandusky is the real pederast but JoePa is gonna take that L by association.

Joe Paterno was lauded for his, and i'm going to borrow a quote from bshells "uncommon moral fabric." Basically going above and beyond in the development of young people.

He was fired for his actions/inactions related to the most immoral conduct someone can do outside of murder

It is pretty much beyond any doubt at this point that he knew Sandusky was naked in a shower with a young boy. He let that dog lie. Like NEVER EVEN FOUND OUT WHO THE FUCK THE KID WAS. NONE OF THEM DID. that's really the worst part of ALL of that particular story.

I'm not God, none of us are, so I'm not judging him.

But Shells you need to miss me and many others the fuck out of here with ANY references to that motherfucker's morals. PERIOD.

I'm not sure why you feel the need to defend him from internet wishes for him to burn in hell anyway, its clearly fueled by emotion and disgust at the veil that has been recently lifted on his hypocrisy.

Even if we agree that McQueary didn't tell JoePa all the details of the 2002 incident, is there anyone who believes JoePa didn't know about Sandusky's behavior (at that point or even before this incident came to light)?

I think this is why a lot of folx see this differently..

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<---- 5....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlgiritpmfo

=======================================
Occupy Big Government..

Fannie, Freddie dole out big bonuses
http://dyn.politico.com/printstory.cfm?uuid=3F6F3E67-28B

Penn State "faithful" prefer it that way. But this was his right hand man for 30+ years, you can't tell me he didn't know or see anything. It's not like Sandusky was really discreet or anything.

It's much harder for some than others to divorce themselves from the emotion of it all, but at the end of the day (c)John Thompson...the extent of Joe's involvement will never be known. That said, to act like he didn't know anything is just childish and weak.

>Penn State "faithful" prefer it that way. But this was his
>right hand man for 30+ years, you can't tell me he didn't know
>or see anything. It's not like Sandusky was really discreet or
>anything.

Can you imagine some of the crazy shit that might have went on now that we know child molestation was on the table? There are probably bodies and all kinds of ratchet nonsense we will never know about.
<--- :)

I hate to use a shitty cliche, but this was seriously prolly just the tip of the iceberg.

did boeheim see child molester behavior in his assistant during those roadtrips?
if someone is your friend and you think you know them well it can be easy to rationalize suspect ass behavior
it's not as serious but ppl rationalize clues that their mate is cheating all the time. continually giving them the benefit of the doubt until they get hard evidence or it's directly in their face
i'm not sure why this is hard for people to grasp
you're asking if joepa, the entire coaching staff, players, AND the board of directors knew that sandusky was continuously raping kids and no one stepped up?
joepa and the board knew about mcquerys incident. the coaching staff and 3 decades of players would have been privy to sanduskys "behavior"
whatever they knew it wasn't enough (in their minds obviously)
investigate? report? sure, but this is a friend that they knew and trusted
it is what it is

Did Joe Pa know that Sandusky was a pedophile? Yes or No? I find it hard to believe he didn't know..


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<---- 5....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlgiritpmfo

=======================================
Occupy Big Government..

Fannie, Freddie dole out big bonuses
http://dyn.politico.com/printstory.cfm?uuid=3F6F3E67-28B

and JoePa already said he didn't know

I choose to believe neither of those two statements but perhaps that makes me cynical.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<---- 5....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlgiritpmfo

=======================================
Occupy Big Government..

Fannie, Freddie dole out big bonuses
http://dyn.politico.com/printstory.cfm?uuid=3F6F3E67-28B

prolly be dead in a couple of days though

(Sorry to pour salt in the wound, but I've been wanting to say this for a while. After this I'm done commenting with this whole disgusting JoePa/PSU ordeal. If and when I talk about PSU, its strictly x's and o's)

This stance the PSU contingent has taken makes me lmao because they were the most outspoken bunch when TatGate went down. These people were at the front of the OKS lynchmob with pitch forks over Tressel not being forthcoming with the NCAA.

Motherfuckers wanted us to get an SMU death penalty over merchandise traded in for tattoos, while completely disregarding all the good that Tressel did (a lot more than JoePa for sure, considering young people's lives weren't ruined under Tressel)


But now, that the (weak) moral fiber of PSU's athletic program has completely been unraveled,

it's "Can we at least wait until the details come out"

"he did what he was supposed to do, went up the chain of command"

"but but but he was OLD! he didnt know!"


This would be a good time for all of you to stfu and pray for that man's soul, because whatever form of afterlife you believe in, JoePa is about to suffer greatly for what he allowed to happen under his watch.

_______________________________

Gangrene - Vodka and Ayahuasca
East Flatbush Project-First Born Overdue
Statik Selektah-Population Control

Conclusion: BURN IN HELL JOE PA

than life to some of them even if most of them never actually met him. Just like people were emotional and irrational when it came to Michael Jackson, this is a similar thing for a lot of people in that part of the country. The grew up their whole lives with Paterno as this revered, worshipped "icon". That's how this shit happened in the first place, because you don't question Joe or anybody around him. This is like finding out your grandpa knew one of your uncles was a molester and kept it quiet. You wouldn't want to believe it, you wouldn't even want to think about it.

>than life to some of them even if most of them never actually
>met him. Just like people were emotional and irrational when
>it came to Michael Jackson, this is a similar thing for a lot
>of people in that part of the country. The grew up their whole
>lives with Paterno as this revered, worshipped "icon". That's
>how this shit happened in the first place, because you don't
>question Joe or anybody around him. This is like finding out
>your grandpa knew one of your uncles was a molester and kept
>it quiet. You wouldn't want to believe it, you wouldn't even
>want to think about it.

however, that doesn't make anything I typed untrue.

Joe Pa did a lot of great things for a lot of people in the state (and throughout the country), however that was all negated once Joe Paterno decided not to alert police when McQueary told him that he witnessed child rape.




_______________________________

Gangrene - Vodka and Ayahuasca
East Flatbush Project-First Born Overdue
Statik Selektah-Population Control

other than how to be mad that joe was a better coach and man than woody and tressel put together and then squared.

you don't even know what mcquery told paterno.

>other than how to be mad that joe was a better coach and man
>than woody and tressel put together and then squared.

McQueary said he told Joe he witnessed Sandusky engaging in what appeared to be sexual acts with a child in the football facilities. That's all JoePa needed to know.

Hope you don't take this personally, but it is what it is (c)




_______________________________

Gangrene - Vodka and Ayahuasca
East Flatbush Project-First Born Overdue
Statik Selektah-Population Control

it's a horrible, petty look.

And by loss I mean not of the man but of the high-horse that someone who bought into the 'uncommon moral fabric and vision' could once see themselves sitting on while rooting for Penn State.

That was all that was left after the program descended into irrelevance from a competitive standpoint but even that exploded in the most nefarious fashion imaginable last November.

I guess for the remaining true believers in the JoePa myth, at least they'll get to keep the statues & buildings bearing his namesake up now.

>This stance the PSU contingent has taken makes me lmao because
>they were the most outspoken bunch when TatGate went down.
>These people were at the front of the OKS lynchmob with pitch
>forks over Tressel not being forthcoming with the NCAA.
>
>Motherfuckers wanted us to get an SMU death penalty over
>merchandise traded in for tattoos, while completely
>disregarding all the good that Tressel did (a lot more than
>JoePa for sure, considering young people's lives weren't
>ruined under Tressel)
>

grow up.

and luckily for JoePa science teaches us that when he dies the only "afterlife" he'll experience is in the minds of his haters and supporters
he good

and you're telling me to "grow up"

lmao.

>and luckily for JoePa science teaches us that when he dies the
>only "afterlife" he'll experience is in the minds of his
>haters and supporters
>he good

lol @ he good

Yes, going down in history books as a legendary coach who enabled a culture of sexual abuse in a publicly funded university is definitely what he and PSU fans/alum had in mind as a graceful exit.


It's not about me. It's about you and the other PSU fans acting like complete idiots for the past year. I try to avoid lumping you in with Shells, Mig, and Charlie bc they actually know what they're talking about (most of the time) but I just wanted to say this.

You're like the bs of the PSU bunch on OKS.

Don't be such a sensitive little bitch.



_______________________________

Gangrene - Vodka and Ayahuasca
East Flatbush Project-First Born Overdue
Statik Selektah-Population Control

but u knew that already
like i said...grow up

this wouldn't even be a discussion point had shelly not been such an over the top ringleader in the moral crusade against tressel...a man who did a heckuva lot of good for his school and community but failed to report his players free tattoos. it didn't matter to shelly, tressel's act of negligence was simply *that* reprehensible.

now he wants a mulligan for a man who also did a heckuva a lot of good for his school and community...but also harbored a serial child rapist for a minimum of a decade.

ok.

and for all the good that joe pa did for the football program...his failure to handle the sandusky issue like a human being combined with his selfish and stubborn refusal to step down at a reasonable age is going to send the program to the lowest of lows. we'll see how grateful PSU fans are 5 years from now. im not taking glee in that fact, just saying how it is.

Its been proven over the years. This post only adds more proof.

DTS and start over with a new post.

http://www.nbc.com/saturday-night-live/video/Weekend-Update-The-Devil-on-Penn-State/1368181

RIP JoePa

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/7489238/joe-paterno-ex-penn-state-nittany-lions-coach-dies-85-2-month-cancer-fight

Updated: January 22, 2012, 10:19 AM ET
Joe Paterno, 85, dies in State College

Joe Paterno has died at the age of 85 after experiencing serious complications from lung-cancer treatment.

The health of Paterno, who had fought the disease for two months, had grown progressively worse after he recently broke his pelvis in a fall at his home in State College, Pa.

The family announced his death Sunday shortly after 10 a.m. ET., The Associated Press reported.

Paterno died at State College's Mount Nittany Medical Center, where he had been undergoing treatment.

Paterno remained connected to a ventilator into Sunday, individuals close to Paterno's family told The Washington Post.

Joe Paterno won two national championships and a Division I-record 409 games over 46 seasons at Penn State.
The newspaper reported the family had communicated to the hospital his wishes not to be kept alive through extreme artificial means.

Paterno's cancer diagnosis was revealed Nov. 18, nine days after he lost his Penn State head coaching job in the fallout of sexual abuse charges against former defensive coordinator Jerry Sandusky.

Jay Paterno, one of Paterno's sons, thanked fans for their support Saturday.

"I appreciate the support & prayers. Joe is continuing to fight," Jay Paterno wrote on his own Twitter account.

Paterno won two national championships and a Division I-record 409 games over 46 seasons at Penn State and the family has donated millions of dollars to the school.

But his legacy was clouded in the wake of a sexual abuse scandal that has resulted in 52 counts of child molestation against Sandusky. Paterno had announced his retirement early on Nov. 9, but the Penn State board of trustees fired him and university president Graham Spanier about 12 hours later. That day, Paterno called the scandal "one of the great sorrows of my life. With the benefit of hindsight, I wish I had done more."

In his first public statements since the scandal broke, Paterno recently told The Washington Post that he did not know how to deal with the situation when he received a report from a graduate assistant that his former defensive coordinator was accused of abusing a boy in the showers.

"I didn't know exactly how to handle it and I was afraid to do something that might jeopardize what the university procedure was," he told The Post in an extensive two-day interview at his home. "So I backed away and turned it over to some other people, people I thought would have a little more expertise than I did. It didn't work out that way."

Police on Saturday night barricaded off the block where Paterno lives, and a police car was stationed about 50 yards from his home. A light was on in the living room but there was no activity inside. No one was outside, other than reporters and photographers stationed there.

About 200 students and townspeople gathered in State College at a statue of Paterno just outside a gate at Beaver Stadium.

Some brought candles, while others held up their smart phones to take photos of the scene. The mood was somber, with no chanting or shouting.

Jay Paterno tweeted, "Drove by students at the Joe statue. Just told my Dad about all the love & support--inspiring him."

Information from The Associated Press was used in this report.

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/7489238/joe-paterno-ex-penn-state-nittany-lions-coach-dies-85-2-month-cancer-fight

Joe Paterno, 85, dies in State College

Joe Paterno has died at the age of 85 after experiencing serious complications from lung-cancer treatment.

The health of Paterno, who had fought the disease for two months, had grown progressively worse after he recently broke his pelvis in a fall at his home in State College, Pa.

"It is with great sadness that we announce that Joe Paterno passed away earlier today," said a statement from Paterno's family, released Sunday, shortly after 10 a.m. ET. "His loss leaves a void in our lives that will never be filled.

"He died as he lived. He fought hard until the end, stayed positive, thought only of others and constantly reminded everyone of how blessed his life had been.

"His ambitions were far reaching, but he never believed he had to leave this Happy Valley to achieve them. He was a man devoted to his family, his university, his players and his community."

Paterno died at State College's Mount Nittany Medical Center, where he had been undergoing treatment.

Paterno remained connected to a ventilator into Sunday, individuals close to Paterno's family told The Washington Post.

The newspaper reported the family had communicated to the hospital his wishes not to be kept alive through extreme artificial means.

Paterno's cancer diagnosis was revealed Nov. 18, nine days after he lost his Penn State head coaching job in the fallout of sexual abuse charges against former defensive coordinator Jerry Sandusky.

Jay Paterno, one of Paterno's sons, thanked fans for their support Saturday.

"I appreciate the support & prayers. Joe is continuing to fight," Jay Paterno wrote on his own Twitter account.

Paterno won two national championships and a Division I-record 409 games over 46 seasons at Penn State and the family has donated millions of dollars to the school.

But his legacy was clouded in the wake of a sexual abuse scandal that has resulted in 52 counts of child molestation against Sandusky. Paterno had announced his retirement early on Nov. 9, but the Penn State board of trustees fired him and university president Graham Spanier about 12 hours later. That day, Paterno called the scandal "one of the great sorrows of my life. With the benefit of hindsight, I wish I had done more."

In his first public statements since the scandal broke, Paterno recently told The Washington Post that he did not know how to deal with the situation when he received a report from a graduate assistant that his former defensive coordinator was accused of abusing a boy in the showers.

"I didn't know exactly how to handle it and I was afraid to do something that might jeopardize what the university procedure was," he told The Post in an extensive two-day interview at his home. "So I backed away and turned it over to some other people, people I thought would have a little more expertise than I did. It didn't work out that way."

Police on Saturday night barricaded off the block where Paterno lives, and a police car was stationed about 50 yards from his home. A light was on in the living room but there was no activity inside. No one was outside, other than reporters and photographers stationed there.

About 200 students and townspeople gathered in State College at a statue of Paterno just outside a gate at Beaver Stadium.

Some brought candles, while others held up their smart phones to take photos of the scene. The mood was somber, with no chanting or shouting.

Jay Paterno tweeted, "Drove by students at the Joe statue. Just told my Dad about all the love & support--inspiring him."

Information from The Associated Press was used in this report.

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/7489238/joe-paterno-ex-penn-state-nittany-lions-coach-dies-85-2-month-cancer-fight

but hey.

Musburger is talking about how JoePa saying he didn't want to retire because of the fact that Bear Bryant died shortly after he retired. He said JoePa said he didn't have any hobbies or interest outside of football and he would suffer the same fate. Nigga you had a wife, kids and grandkids...

This shit is unbelievably selfish. This is nuts.

<--- :)

>Musburger is talking about how JoePa saying he didn't want to
>retire because of the fact that Bear Bryant died shortly after
>he retired. He said JoePa said he didn't have any hobbies or
>interest outside of football and he would suffer the same
>fate. Nigga you had a wife, kids and grandkids...
>
>This shit is unbelievably selfish. This is nuts.
>
><--- :)

<--- :)

idk if you've been in a "sports" fam but most times the sports takes over the fam (not even in a bad way) his family seemed to have loved him so why make it seem like he hated them or something

either way he didn't commit suicide he was prolly in pain and tired as hell..he was 85. Like come on now yall doing a lot in here. Now you gonna be mad at HIM for dying lol come on now...

just because he was restless and wasn't able to do the same job he had been doing for decades doesn't mean that he didn't love/spend time with his fam.



>
><--- :)

I swear me and write are the only two women in here on a consistent basis

>I swear me and write are the only two women in here on a
>consistent basis

happen.

he's about to be a football saint on espn.

Shady bastard

in the intimate part of life, but then again I'm partly a hopeless romantic so though I know his wife understood and accepted what she signed on for it still bothers me that someone can go so strong for so long and then "lay down and die" when that one aspect of his life is over.
<--- :)

Maybe if he was 40 sumn but Penn State was his life just like with Bear and Alabama. He was right, Bear died a month after retired. When your job is your life force and then it just ends, ESPECIALLY how this ended...Im not surprised he went so soon honestly.

active even when he got older and when he was unable to get around like he usually did *I* knew it was an accelerator to death, so please miss me because in the big picture I understand "to an extent".

In terms of JoePa and people who are married to their jobs that shit has a level of selfishness and self-centeredness that I don't understand or will agree with period. So oh well...sorry.


<--- :)

You and guru need to take that shit --------> that way

It's called rest in peace for a reason got damn

You trying too hard. Apparently you haven't really read shit I have said in here, but I don't really give a shit either, so okay.


<--- :)

secrets portably died with him

...not children (obviously)

He lost his game, he lost his legacy, and as a result, he lost his life. He couldn't take the grieving anymore.

I hope that his death brings both the victims of Sandusky's actions and JoePa's family some peace.

>I hope that his death brings both the victims of Sandusky's
>actions and JoePa's family some peace.

I'd say the lack of a real resolution to this is going to haunt more than help. His family will have to live with the looming shadow of a badly tainted name. The media scrutiny might well be suffocating.
I hope, like you, that they can have some peace at this point, I just don't see it as likely any time soon.

As for the victims, it's a moral victory at best IMO. I doubt this does much of anything for them outside of a momentary "good, fuck that guy" moment.

It's real ugly for all involved and I doubt this helps matters.

>I hope that his death brings both the victims of Sandusky's
>actions and JoePa's family some peace.

>
>>I hope that his death brings both the victims of Sandusky's
>>actions and JoePa's family some peace.

The family would be getting peace from seeing their loved one no longer suffering from this legacy-staining nightmare he went through.

The victims would be getting peace in a different way.

Poorly worded. My bad.

So I'm supposed to believe that campus police can investigate JoePa's defensive coordinator in 1998 and JoePa's not going to hear about it? And then that coordinator, who was the heir apparent to JoePa, "retires" in his coaching prime with a golden parachute? From a football perspective, Sandusky's retirement made the program weaker, but we're supposed to believe that Paterno endorsed that move for the football reasons we've been told?

And we're supposed to believe that there was anything that happened in State College relating to football that Paterno didn't know about? And that Paterno had bosses at the University?

Personally, I believe there is NO WAY Paterno didn't know about the '98 investigation. I would imagine he had to have AT LEAST heard rumors about Sandusky before then. But even if he was completely clueless until '02 (which I find IMPOSSIBLE to believe), he, as the man with the power to stop it (there has never been a more powerful man in that town, and it was HIS GUY), bears a significant responsibility to every victim from the moment he knew, or decided he didn't want to know, until today. Not just for the acts of rape themselves, but for all the suffering and misery that the victims have had and will continue to have. And, being that victims of abuse disproportionately become abusers themselves, all of the abuse that they commit. And all of the abuse that results from that. And so on.

I know JoePa made that University into what it is today. I know he changed the lives of many of his football players for the better. I'll even grant that the icon of JoePa touched people that he never met and someone became a better person because of what they thought JoePa believed in. But I would trade the outstanding University for the average one, some good people that played at Penn State for some average ones that played for Rutgers, and some Bobby Knight disciples for some JoePa disciples, for that tree of abuse to have been cut down at the trunk when someone first had the chance. JoePa, more than anyone, had the chance to cut that tree down, and he chose not to. That's on him, and pointing that fact out to those attempting to shape his public eulogy in a positive light is on us.

RIP Joe. May you be remembered appropriately.

>I know JoePa made that University into what it is today. I
>know he changed the lives of many of his football players for
>the better.

I mean, what's a little ass rape for a couple of kids if so many football players have had their lives changed? Come on man, be reasonable.

>I'll even grant that the icon of JoePa touched
>people that he never met and someone became a better person
>because of what they thought JoePa believed in.

Right. So what if he passively enabled Jerry to be a child molester? People Joe never met became better. That cancels out a little finger banging prepubescent bungholes.

>trade the outstanding University for the average one

WHAT? FUCK YOU MAN!!! An outstanding university is so vital, it matters so much more than a few little boys getting a lil taste of Jerry's man juice. Besides, Joe didn't do it. It's just pretty fucking likely that he knew about it, and after all, he DID tell campus PD. Sheesh. You act like he had power over there to do something about all this. He's just a lil old football coach.

>JoePa,
>more than anyone, had the chance to cut that tree down, and he
>chose not to.

Tree, Schmee. Nothin' at all wrong with little boy's on their knees praying to Jerry's pee-pee. Joe was just a coach man, he didn't know nothin' about nothin. He told campus police, after all, which is better than nothing!

Exactly. Of all the "good" things he did, I struggle to find one that could have only been done by JoePa. But his big, huge, glaring wrong? He was the man with the power and authority to make a difference, and he absolutely chose to put his head in the sand for over a decade. There is no amount of good any human can do that can offset the wrongs JoePa committed.

yall ain't helping anyone by going HAM on a dead man. it's some sandusky shit going down now in our own communities. what are yall doing about it?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<---- 5....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlgiritpmfo

=======================================
Occupy Big Government..

Fannie, Freddie dole out big bonuses
http://dyn.politico.com/printstory.cfm?uuid=3F6F3E67-28B

and i don't think it's accomplishing anything but making yall feel like you would be better.

WE KNOW WE'RE BETTER. we prove that by being better. not by posting the same shit over and over again when there's no one debating it.

fuck him.

You clearly haven't read this fucking post, dude.

You think it gets to 200+ replies without people arguing "Well, he sure was a great dude." ? No.

you give people space to bury the dead so they can condemn him and learn from the experience afterwards.

you know the people sayin "well look at what he accomplished as a coach" are just as likely to do the right thing as the people who are trying to dispute that.

yall want to make sociey better by saying "well this shit he did proves he was never a good person" and hoping guilt and fear will keep people from deluding themselves. that's never worked.

we need to learn that good people and normal people are still capable of fucking up. that's WE'RE capable of fucking up. and be ready to own that and be open about it when it happens.

there are certainly people out there saying fuck joe pa that won't ever admit the dirt they've done.

Pointing out that abuse is totally unacceptable to people who are trying to rationalize it's existence. The mentality of those trying to justify seeing JoePa in a positive light is the same mentality that allows abuse to happen in our own communities. Showing people that you don't get to contribute to ongoing abuse of children and then be allowed to leave the world with dignity. Nurturing a culture where abuse is tolerated in no way, shape or form. Pretending abuse didn't happen and glossing over the evil, despicable things in the world is how scandals like this one end up occurring in the first place.

What are the people pretending JoePa, all things considered, was an alright guy accomplishing?

yall would know that doesn't work

And "if we were talking about any other crime/addiction/college scandal" people wouldn't be in here defending JoePa, and people wouldn't feel the need to call those defenders assholes and morons.

I had to guess at what you were getting at, and apparently I was wrong. Vilifying JoePa is an appropriate response to people who try to downplay his role in an ongoing case of abuse or pretend that he had no role. In any other scandal/addiction/whatever this response would be unnecessary because nobody would be defending and diminishing child rape.

i meant in any other crime/addition/scandal but child rape people would realize that shaming and vilifying the people involved isn't a deterrent.

those reactions are fine initially...but they're about our moral outrage. we're disappointed in other people's weakness and angry about the consequences.

i agree that we need to be more vigilant, but vilification isn't the same thing as vigilance.

>Pointing out that abuse is totally unacceptable to people who
>are trying to rationalize it's existence.

Right? Further, people trying to play the "well he could have done more but at least he did something" card. Too much cake-and-eat-it-too with that for my liking.

>those trying to justify seeing JoePa in a positive light is
>the same mentality that allows abuse to happen in our own
>communities.

Back in, oh... I wanna say 03. There was a serious hazing incident in So Cal, where some football players sodomized freshmen players. The parents of the sodomites tried to play up the good grades, the athletic activities, and general community standing of the players. Somehow, in their minds, there was simply no way these A students could do something like that. It's nothing more than blinders.

Once when I was 13 years old, I beat down a family friend for getting a little to friendly with my little brother. This guy was an older kid (around 16) and my grandmother and her friend (this guys grand mother) insisted it was a family matter. I called the cops myself, and everyone denied what happened, and the cops lectured me about the dangers of false accusations and all that. I got a ton of heat for opening my mouth. So I beat the living shit out of this kid, ok? I handled it. I've done it.

The second time I was 15, and a younger friend of my mom's had been assaulted by one of her friends- you know, the kind of guy who is always trying to fuck his female "friends"? Yeah, well, he wouldn't take no for an answer. I believed her story because she was crying with scratches and ripped clothes, and she had trouble walking. She was a drug user and was afraid to call the cops though. Anyhow, I was out and about on my bike and ran into this dude (another older dude, around 20) and I called his name, and called out his misdeeds; "you're the guy who raped steph!" were my exact words. Did he deny it? Nope; he popped out the "What are you gonna do about it, punk?" gem. Anyhow, I beat the shit out of him too. After I put him to the ground, he tried pulling himself up by my shirt and clawed at my face. Eventually he bit the shit out of my hand.

Anyhow, to answer your question, I've personally taken matters into my own hands on two occasions. I also outed a friends stepfather around the time period I beat up the first kid I mentioned. Of course that irreparably damaged that relationship and EVERYBODY called me a liar. Eventually, he got caught with his hand in that cookie jar and thankfully everyone came around to their senses and he got locked up. They still hold a grudge against me to this day. In retrospect I may not have handled that the way I should have, but I was just a kid trying to do what he thought was the right thing.

None of this is told to be puffed up or brag or portray myself as a boy scout. I'm not holier than anyone and I have sins of my own. My issue here in this thread lies more with those defending Joe, and plenty of other posters in here seem more perturbed by people defending him as opposed to trying to go HAM on JP. Naturally in the course of that, people sort of have to point out the reasons why JP shouldn't be let off the hook so easily. That's just my two cents.

>yall ain't helping anyone by going HAM on a dead man. it's
>some sandusky shit going down now in our own communities. what
>are yall doing about it?

>None of this is told to be puffed up or brag or portray myself
>as a boy scout. I'm not holier than anyone and I have sins of
>my own.

Man, STFU.

I answered. Cry about it, bitch.

Yet this ain't about you, son.

I answered with real-life examples of times I DID do something about it. I'm having a hard time understanding how this is lost on you. So again:

1. He asked what people are doing about these problems in our own communities.

2. I answered with examples of times I've actually done something.

So, for the final refresher: The point of sharing those stories was to answer his challenge of a question, which had a tone with a connotation that assumes we don't do anything about it. Your outrage toward a clear answer to a clear question is mystifying.

<--- :)

http://www.sbnation.com/ncaa-football/2012/1/22/2726064/joe-paterno-dies-legacy-penn-state-lavar-arrington

Joe Paterno's Death Leaves LaVar Arrington And Others With Lots Left To Say



By Bomani Jones - Contributor

As former Penn State Nittany Lions like LaVar Arrington deal with Joe Paterno's death, others are considering his legacy. The answer depends on whether you truly knew JoePa, or just what you were told.

Follow @sbnation on Twitter, and Like SBNation.com on Facebook.

Jan 22, 2012 - Just three months ago, Joe Paterno was JoePa, the patriarch of college football. He was going to save the ‘80s from the Sherrills and Switzers, and he humbled the ‘Canes in January 1987. He graduated players, donated millions back to the university, and gave a community a larger ethos to believe in.

He was the Sports Illustrated Sportsman of the Year in ‘86, a lifetime achievement award as much as anything else, and had 25 years to put more good works on top of that.

Then, one day in November 2011, he was fired. Two months later, he was dead.

Rarely do men die with their legacies in question. There may be disagreement on what said legacies are, but rarely are they in flux. Yet here we are, trying to weigh a series of Paterno's individual acts, all done with an air of piety that seems disingenuous with distance and hindsight against apparent complicity in unparallelled scandal and fresh, unspeakably horrific acts on his watch.

This isn't just about defining Paterno's legacy. When he left Penn State, it became imperative to reconstruct it from the ground up, something that one would think would take way more than two months to do. Now that he's gone, many will give it a try.

So what's there to do when making sense of a complex figure it seems we may have never known in the first place? Defer to those who knew Paterno to discuss the man who existed, and reassess the opinions we created before and after the Sandusky scandal broke. Paterno was capable of heroism, but incapable of being a hero. Did that make Paterno a great man? That all depends on what Paterno and Penn State meant to you in the first place.



"I was just having that conversation with my parents last night."

That was LaVar Arrington's immediate reaction when asked Sunday afternoon what Paterno meant to him. It wasn't a simple conversation. Arrington was as individually decorated as any Penn State player had ever been during his three years in State College. He was twice a first-team All-American, collected the Butkus and Bednarik Awards as a junior, and made one of the iconic plays in college football history as a Nittany Lion.

And none of that seemed to be enough to please his head coach. "I felt like we were almost adversaries," Arrington says. "I felt like he didn't like me, and it placed me in a position where I didn't like him."

Things have changed since. Arrington sees his time at Penn State as perhaps the most important in making him who he is today, "a man raising men," as he said. "Now that he's gone, it sucks to have that clarity. I never told him this. He probably went to his grave thinking I didn't like him.

"That sucks, man."

Arrington heard Joe was like everyone's granddad, and he didn't need that. He had a loving family and looked to Paterno for guidance, no differently than he looked to professors for guidance in class. He also didn't appreciate Paterno publicly questioning his intellect -- which created a perception about Arrington's brains for years -- nor did he like hearing from his head coach that he, the future No. 2 overall pick in the NFL Draft, wasn't even the best linebacker at Penn State. "I wanted that pat on my back, where he's actually looking at me a certain sort of way about something I did." Instead, he got what he termed "tough love," which often just seemed tough.

"‘I love my school, I love my teammates, I love my coaches, I love everything about the institution I was a part of,'" he recalled. "‘Why can't he love me the way I love him?'

"I couldn't accept that was the role that he took in my life."

And how does Arrington feel now about that place Paterno filled?

"What he's done for me, it's amazing how I live my life, and I know, in large part, it's basically due to how much that man challenged me."

He credits Paterno -- whom he, like all other former players, calls "Joe" -- for helping make him the man he is. He says he challenges himself daily, whether on his radio or television shows, his blog with the Washington Post, marriage and everyday struggles all people confront. And he says he does those things with the same ferocity required to confront what Joe Paterno threw in front of him every day.

"You don't really look at it from that standpoint, but Joe did," Arrington said. "He was able to get the big picture on guys. Either you were going to rise up to the challenge, or you were gonna succumb to it."

Arrington is now 33. He has two sons, both of whom he took to Penn State training camps after he retired from the NFL. It gave him the chance to see Paterno interact with his children and, for what he felt was the first time, address him as a man. Paterno has apologized for being so hard on him, making peace in a way that made Arrington afraid Paterno was "going to die soon."

"Maybe, he got caught up on so much on getting accomplished what he wanted to accomplish that he may have been too hard."

Those were the ups and downs Arrington went through with Paterno in his own life. This is before anything related to Sandusky, which hits closer to home for a man who played at Penn State from 1997-99, forced him to reassess everything.

"That dude (Sandusky) was my coach," he said. "I spent more time around him than anyone else. That becomes your environment. That becomes your family. Was I forced to change my way of thinking? I was there!"

And with all his rethinking, past his public declaration that he can no longer associate with Penn State as he did before, his faith and belief in Paterno remains unshaken. "I know Joe's heart. In looking at how the handled the situation, it would have had to have been due to ignorance of the magnitude of what took place."

He doesn't believe Paterno to be a plaster saint and beyond questioning. "I've paid close attention to the way he's made decisions," he says. "It wasn't always for the positive. I had times where I'm looking at Joe wondering, ‘who's the dude? what's he about?'" Simply notifying his superiors was not enough for many, but Arrington doesn't think Paterno could have done more than tell the athletic director and vice president who oversaw security. If Paterno was truly powerful enough to handle those allegations and all they entailed, he asks, then he wouldn't he have been powerful enough to save his job in November?

But how does Arrington reconcile Paterno, the man who taught him to fight challenges, doing little more than what he was supposed to when confronted with Sandusky and the problems and damage he did to so many?

"To me, I can't bring myself to looking at Joe Paterno," he said before pausing.

"Did he handle the situation the way people wanted him to? That's not for me to decide."

Former players like Franco Harris and Matt Millen have subjected themselves to ridicule in defense of their former coach. But how easily should they detach themselves from someone so integral in getting them to where they are? They aren't just former football players. They are entrepreneurs, college graduates, and fathers. They have been Super Bowl champions, and they have been executives. They played football for Paterno, but he has since been a part of their lives. To abandon him, in their eyes, would be to discredit the profound impact he had on them, and the impact they know he had on countless others.

So, like Arrington, they stood by Paterno until his end, and they'll continue to do so now. If the rest are like Arrington, they know they see things differently than someone would who wasn't close to him. And no matter where it places them relative to public opinion, they will be in that place forever.

"I'm not going to say Joe was perfect in the way he handled it," Arrington said. "But he certainly wasn't inadequate in the way he handled that situation. And not in a way where everything that man handled in his life is null and void. Not at all."

Much of what he handled could be captured by two words: Penn State. For Arrington and his fellow alumni, saying "We Are Penn State" meant something.

"That means higher achievement, that means giving back to the community, it means a standard of being something more than average," Arrington said. "If you know the way that we know him, that's what we represent. Joe Paterno represents us. We represent Joe Paterno."

In what may seem like a peculiar way, that's what Arrington and others are doing -- giving back to the community. To affirm Paterno is to affirm themselves. To highlight the good in him is to speak to the good in themselves.

They are Penn State. Joe Paterno is Penn State. And that's a lot to ask them to abandon, no matter the circumstances.

But those of us who aren't Penn State? We should have no such troubles.



I asked LaVar Arrington if his feelings on Paterno would be more in line with public opinion if he weren't so close to the situation. "If it were your father, and you knew your father made a mistake," he replied, "you're gonna handle that different than someone you had no relation to."

Paterno is not my father, nor was he my coach, nor did he represent anything larger about me. He was a towering figure in college football, one hailed as a model for all others. It was a role he enjoyed and embraced, and one he consistently reaffirmed. The appearance of virtue was so closely associated with Paterno that the whites on Penn State's classically simple uniforms seemed brighter, the empty nameplates more noble and symbolic. He represented the brand of Penn State football, and he lent its credibility to help make juggernauts of both Penn State University and the institution of college football.

That credibility went away months ago, though. No matter what the Joe Paterno that LaVar Arrington knows would have done, it's hard to imagine the Paterno we were sold would have stopped short of keeping Jerry Sandusky away from his, or any other, football complex. Arrington doesn't believe Paterno would have withheld information on child molestation to protect Penn State, but JoePa was Penn State. Penn State was he. And in all those silent years, the only thing that was truly protected was Penn State. If that was an accident, it worked out well for Paterno (until it didn't).

But what was Paterno, if he was not the good guy? What was he, were he not the pristine counterpoint to some of the ugliness wrought by competition in college sports? He clearly wasn't just a football coach, unless you think Barry Switzer and his three national champions will be mourned as JoePa is today. He represented an ideal and, ultimately, he failed the notion he claimed to embody.

Switzer did what Oklahoma's football coaches, from Bud Wilkinson and beyond, had to do -- win, by hook or crook. The institution that paid him, the state of Oklahoma, built the OU juggernaut to improve the post-Dust Bowl self-esteem of its constituents, and Switzer wasn't about to let them down. In the end, the Sooners were disgraced, and the program was crippled for over a decade as they cleaned up the mess they caused while feeding the beast.

Was Paterno truly any different? We'll never definitively know what his intentions were or what went through his mind the last 14 years when he saw Sandusky around the building. But we also know a scandal like this meant more than just wins, recruits or money. It challenged the very notion of what it meant to be "Penn State," something so many tied directly to their self-concept. The man who wasn't going to win the easy way, even if according to protocol, passed the buck. As was the case when black students endured death threats on campus, Paterno did nothing that would tarnish the name that had become synonymous with himself, his neighbors, success and righteousness: Penn State.

He was beholden to the same forces as everyone else in college sports, even if he chose to play the game his own way. In the end, he fell victim to what so many thought he was above, as if any man is above those awkward moments when principle, reality and self-interest collide.

But let's not pretend this was some average dude. Simply comparing his paycheck to his peers' and seeing his modest home on the news the last few months spoke to the fact he wasn't exactly like the rest. His dedication to education continued into the new millennium (even the guys in Paterno's doghouse got degrees, Arrington says). For goodness sake, he donated millions and raised more to build a library because that's what Penn State needed to be a top-flight university. He used his position to do great things to help a great number of people.

Was he a great man? I have no idea.

Does it matter? That's the real question.

If you, like math wizard Darren Rovell, think Paterno was the guy he was purported to be, but with one demerit, you're missing the point. Great men are hard to find. Saints rarely exist on Earth. But just as hard to find are people like Paterno, who do great things at all. Appreciating his good work did not require lionizing him, nor does honestly confronting his shortcomings require he be demonized.

Had we not dressed up his good deeds in so much schmaltzy bullshit, painting a picture of Paterno we can easily see now was unrealistically pure, maybe Penn State wouldn't have been so fearful of coming clean. We can't just dig up effusive obituaries, written well in advance, with a November 2011 addendum tacked onto them. It would be wrong to pick up Paterno's story from two months ago, like a movie jumping through the continuum to save time. We can start over, and we can handle it quickly.

As many good things as Arrington has to say about Paterno, his coach was not his hero. He never should have been any of ours.

As Arrington said, Joe Paterno was a man who knew great things were possible if you attacked challenges. In the end, we all wish he had attacked one more. Even good men fall short. Sometimes, way short.

May he rest in peace.

Lavar basically said, "I'm not going to judge".

Bomani basically said, "he did great things and we shouldn't have made him our hero"

Fuck all that.

did you even read that garbage?

>"To me, I can't bring myself to looking at Joe Paterno," he said before pausing.
>
>"Did he handle the situation the way people wanted him to? That's not for me to decide."

http://www.theonion.com/articles/joe-paterno-dies-in-hospital-doctors-promise-to-te,27125/

*ducks out of post as if i were never here*

I can admire at least THAT much about the guy.



Netflix Channel currently tuned to:

5. Phineas & Ferb
4. Venture Bros.
3. Downton Abbey
2. Wire In The Blood
1. Cheers


RIP CHRISTOPHER HITCHENS - All caps when you spell the man name

but that's hilarious

Nothing else matters as much as the kids who have to endure being a rape survivor for the rest of their lives.

Not JoePa's family.
Not willfully ignorant ex players like Lavar and Matt Millen.
Not the students at Penn State who have a fucking library.

I have nothing else to add.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
<---- 5....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dlgiritpmfo

=======================================
Occupy Big Government..

Fannie, Freddie dole out big bonuses
http://dyn.politico.com/printstory.cfm?uuid=3F6F3E67-28B

"I didnt know what man on man rap was" GTFOHWTBS


"Former Penn State head football coach Joe Paterno was in no hurry to forward to authorities a witness' report of a sexual abuse of a young boy because he didn't want to "interfere with their weekends," according to a deposition read in court today. " more GTFOHWTBS

Fuck this dude. He should've stood trial. He went out the easy way.


Joe "Blind Eye" Paterno chose a untarnished football legacy over saving kids from a monster. When his legacy could've been that much greater if he put a stop to it when he had a chance. Completely short sighted.

>

Shout out to BShelly.

JoePed did so much for the community and raised over $1 billion for the community. He did so much to enrich the life of everyone....









































































However, he's best remembered for allowing a fucking child rapist to irreparably harm the lives of countless men. There's a chance that the ONE DECISION he refused to make will greatly harm the football program he built from the ground up.

>Shout out to BShelly.
>JoePed did so much for the community and raised over $1
>billion for the community. He did so much to enrich the life
>of everyone....

lol

You could make an entire post filled with Bshelly/Mignight/southpedoman quotes about how pristine PSU was compared to all the supposed renegade programs in CFB.

Lol mfers went from ringleaders of the moral brigade to lepers amongst CFB fans.
_______________________________
Oddisee - People Hear What They See
Casual - He Still Think He Raw
Oh No - Ohnomite

They were gonna stay on board until that shit was spelled out for them. All those guys are shit.

I have a little over 5,000 posts here of which maybe 10% are PSU related. I'll be very generous and say that maybe 3-5% of which are in praise of Paterno/the program. You got about as much posts between this and the other Sandusky threads bashing the school and fans as I have in totality regarding Paterno/PSU. You can go back and find those tat-gate posts and I gurantee you I have very few (if any at all) posts bashing OSU/Tressel. WHy? Because I didn't care and it wasn't that big of deal to me. You can even go back to the T.Pryor posts and I was one of the few PSU(and BigTen) fans who actually supported him. But apparently I must have really hurt your feelings because you are relentless with your hate.

I will readily admit that I held Paterno/PSU in much higher regard than I ever should have and am a bit ashamed that I bought into the belief that PSU was somehow a cut above other major Div 1 football programs in regards to how they approached the whole student-athlete concept. I will definitely admit that I was guilty of that. But this vendetta you got against me is a bit childish and misguided. My memory is a bity hazy from time to time due to past concussions, but I really don't remember ever going hard at you or the OSU contingent here.

his estate is still chomming
PSU stickers and jerseys still popping in PA
sandusky bout to die in jail
and u mad

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v638/cpilgrim/PSU/psu_koolaid.gif


_____________________
<---- At least we have this

>his estate is still chomming
>PSU stickers and jerseys still popping in PA
>sandusky bout to die in jail
>and u mad

NO SHIT
This piece of shit allowed that to go on
Other higher ups knew
A LOT of people knew

We SHOULD be mad about that shit. All of us. If you're not outraged, or at the very least can't understand why people are, you're a piece of shit too.

_____________________
<---- At least we have this

i did just read the yahoo article i'm guessing prompted this uppage
and it looks like a bunch of speculation based off the fact the dude who saw the bathroom incident didn't report anything
i mean that's the smoking gun?
u either hold joepa accountable
or u don't
*shrug*
nann nigga i know really give a fuck bout this story at this point
no more than we do a bombing in myanmar or an african chick getting her clit chopped
the rest of the country still nancy grace'ing this?

The smoking gun is the wording "after talking it over with Joe..." followed by deciding to not report the incident to authorities.

That means JoePa was involved in and agreed with the decision to cover it up...the end
_____________________
<---- At least we have this

_______________________________
Oddisee - People Hear What They See
Casual - He Still Think He Raw
Oh No - Ohnomite

I mean this goes beyond recruiting, money, etc...

This is real life

The powers that be covered up child molestation

(and this story isn't really making headlines)

why hasn't the NCAA done anything yet

smhcollege footballsmh

So are recruiting violations worse than conspiracy around child rape?

and strictly a criminal manner.

which is a whole lot of bullshit, obviously.

if i see PSU in a bowl game this year im going to vomit.

just off the strength of the allegations alone

at least to give the kids that are there enough time to transfer

Easily the biggest scandal in college sports

and they've done nothing

can the government step in here and punish the school

or are they too busy investigating Barry Bonds and Roger Clemens

then they make quick rulings so your star players can play in the bowl game.

>I mean this goes beyond recruiting, money, etc...
>
>This is real life
>
>The powers that be covered up child molestation
>
>(and this story isn't really making headlines)
>
>why hasn't the NCAA done anything yet
>
>smhcollege footballsmh
>
>
>
>
>
>


<--- ...watch out Mountain West?

within weeks they had set up shop on OSU's campus

has their been ANY ncaa involvement whatsoever on the psu issue other than their initial statement however many months back?

was rendered

gavel, guilty

NCAA gives PSU the death penalty

or do we have to wait on verdicts for

Curley
Spaner
and Schultz

McQuery?

that could take years

this story has already cooled

as evident by the lack of outrage at the most recent discovery

how long?

these recent e-mails establish a conspiracy

if they aren't going to impose any penalties for this

how can impose any going forward for ANYTHING else

do they need to write an NCAA bi-law that forbids child molestation

c'mon

is the NCAA still looking into violations against Bobby Petrino

for a consensual adult sexual encounter

this is absurd

.