Hey socially and politically concious lyrics and the best drummer in the music biz are two things they've got in common.

I see the underground hip hop of today to my generation as what punk rock was for my father's generation. I just wanted to get some feedback on that, i know there are some pretty obvious differences but think about the similarities. Hip hop's history so far has had some paralells to rock's history, has it not?

Anybody else wanna sound off on this question?

seriously.

?uest is good but even he would say that he isnt the greatest drummer ever, and niether was the clashes drummer (dont get me wrong, they are both tight but you are stanning for real)

and dude, I love black thought, but what was the last really politically concious rhyme that he dropped? dude mostly raps about how much better he is than you.

and I am a HUGE roots fan, dont get me wrong, but yall get caught up on these type of comparisons

not that i support the rather inane 'the clash' comparison

but

riq is far from that one-dimensional

I know black thought isnt thaaaaat one deminsional, ok hes not at all. and i dont know what i was smokin that day, but the clash comparison, is...well there is no comparison

Guns are drawn, Star, Why?

The Clash were cocky too.

i luv that song
great replay vaule to.

1-Guns are drawn;
2-Why;
3-duck down.

http://www.looptroop.nu/

Well first off, I mean while I think is a bit hastey to say that ?uestlove is hands down the best drummer in music today... at least I've heard it said before. But to say that Topper Headon was the best of his time... I've never heard of such an opinion much less thought about it. Topper was nasty, dont get me wrong, but I dont know about this claim you're making here.

I'd say if anything.. in order to be "the clash of hip hop" or the clash of anything really you have to look at a group's musical and lyrical progression. I'd say the formula would have to be as follows

1)The group would have to start out cutting edge and mold breaking, but ultimately their early work is rigidly within the essence of whatever genra they're in. (Even if they helped define what that genra is) In other words, the clash were straight ahead punk in the early days.

2)The group outgrows the genra they defined. They start to experiment outside of the lines of said genra, and mix in different sounds with that original sound.

3)The group's experimentation again defines a certain "sound," and they're no longer mixing in different elements into the first genra, but simply creating creating gerna-defying music.


I mean that is a crude way to break this down, but I think it'll do. I don't know if the roots fit that mold at all. I mean I suppose you could say that The roots started off the essence of what an organic hip hop band would be on Organix, and then began to experiment (illadelph- try to sound like samples; TFA- encorporate drum and bass into live hip hop; Phrenology- what does a hip hop band sound like when they try to rock; TTP- organic group sounding inorganic with the stortch beats) Don't hold that quick little roots summary against me, but I feel like we all know where and how the roots have experimented and encorporated otehr genras and sounds into their own.

Ultimately however, as original as the roots are... they are more original in approach, technique, and in method, than in outcome. Example: Illadelph Halflife isn't as unique SOUNDING, as was uniquely RECORDED. Don't get me wrong, they do things that nobody ever has, and they've been the first to do a lot of shit. They're pioneers, and while they certainly have some unique songs in their catelogue, at the end of the day, you could agrue that the roots make unique HIP HOP music, while The Clash were making unique MUSIC. Sure You Got Me is astounding if only for the drum and bass at the end, but its still a hip hop song. I don't know what the fuck you'd call something like the Clash's "Straight to Hell."

I think that the only sutable group to be "The Clash of Hip Hop" is OutKast.

They started off Straight ahead hip-hop, while helping to define the soutehr sound. They moved to perfecting their brand of hip hop, while branching out beyond their regional sound. Started to make some one of a kind sounding, never ever to be heard again type shit, and then penned shit like BOB and Ghettomuzik which simply is in a brand by itself. Outkast arent as as political Joe Strummer, but they're about as political as Thought most days of the week.

I don't really like either comparison, but I'd say (for what it counts of course, which isnt much,) OutKast is the Clash of Hip Hop... uh, maybe.


Until the roots can keep up with the Clash's Punk-Rockabilly-Reggae-Rock-n-Roll-Dub-Showtunes-Prog.rock-hiphop-newwave-world-disco I don't think we have to have this discussion again

With that said the Roots are doing some thangs.


peace,
TotalRequestloveLive

Not really feeling the Roots or OutKast comparisons here. What about hip-hop artists who encompassed the Clash's attitude, not just mirroring their career? I think the most obvious choice here is PE.

The clash ended in a rockstar plane crash of cocaine and glitz. By the end of their career the executives owened their asses and their sound. I don't see the roots going down this path. The clash has always been one of my top 5 favorite punk bands for about 6 or 7 years now but I don't think their career is at all comparable to the roots. I do agree that both bands have tried a huge amount of different sounds but for some reason i can compare them. Also topper headon is a huge influence to me as a drummer, but his shit never made me think about musicality like ?uests stuff does. Topper never really directed the clash like ?uest directs the roots. Topper was a great drummer but there were better punk drummers *cough* bill stevenson *cough* robo *cough* chuck biscuits *cough*

because as good as the clash was, their entire image and sound (at least in their later days) was dictated by mangers, record execs, etc. the roots have shown me so far that they have their own vision and aren't willing to compromise for any labels (see geffen) or anyone's ideas of what hip-hop should be.

prolly not, but i would love to see how they covered "The Magnificent Seven"

anyone agree?

Say bu-bu-bu-buy to the bus

it was invented by Roger Daltrey and Pete Townshend of The Who.

I'm not trying to cause a big S-S-S-S-Sensation
Just talking 'bout my G-G-G-G-Generation

NOPE.






Playlist Selection-
Eddie Hinton-Playin' Around
Bobby Charles-The Bearsville Album
Doris Duke-I'm A Loser
Irma Thomas-Inbetween Tears
Miles Davis-In A Silent Way

topper headen was good, but nowhere near the best in the biz (in his time or beyond).

The comparisons are more deep than that, i was just asking a question you don't have to call me a cracker. I'm taking this over to a new post

probably in attitude, though i belive the Clash had a universal compromise, i dunno if the Roots has that yet, Clash could talk about problems in Japan (Straight to hell), Southamerica (Sandinista), Europe, like I said the Roots are more local...

There is still a lot of stuff that links the Clash with hiphop, Grandmaster Flash opened The Clash a coupple of concerts in America.

Can we please get some OkayArtists comments on this stuff? Specifically the Roots, ?uest i know you read this shit.

replace black thought w/ com or even better mos def, and get em to groove more then get into the jazz stuff and they'd be on it, imo

(i am by no means saying for blk thought to REALLY be booted for com or mos, im saying IF)

Hey BT is the man, but you gotta wonder what they would sound like w/ someone else.

don't get it twisted. its drum and voice, always has and probably always will. they should do a concept album on that.

I don't know how much anyone's ever gotten into Hardcore/Punk underground ish but I used to be into the scene pretty heavy and I've always said to my brother that there's SO many comparisons between the two scenes. This article was so hilarious to me not only because its just plain funny but because its exactly what I'm talking about. The SAME ish could come out of any hardcore/punk kids mouth. There are tons of backpackers/scenesters in hc.

Check this article for a laugh even if you don't know what I'm talking about.

http://www.hiphop-blogs.com/hiphop/2005/06/how_to_handle_a.html

The roots might be the last of what hip-hop represents as punk. No real political messages. But if you want to look at them as representing the left to hip-hop's gangster right, yeah, they are punk. But not the Clash.

I'm loving every freaking minute of this discussion. Two of my favorite bands being mentioned together. I think Public Enemy is more like the clash in message and dealing with broad topics. But that means no dis to the Roots as I have been an OKPlayer for since 98

Biggs

for being a white boy i dont know jack about rock....basically hate it...except for late 60's early 70s stuff just cause my moms and pops are into that kinda stuff.....

with that being said i hate rock....with that being said i hate urban radio.....

_________________________

_________________________

>Hey socially and politically concious lyrics and the best
>drummer in the music biz are two things they've got in
>common.
>
>I see the underground hip hop of today to my generation as
>what punk rock was for my father's generation. I just wanted
>to get some feedback on that, i know there are some pretty
>obvious differences but think about the similarities. Hip
>hop's history so far has had some paralells to rock's history,
>has it not?
>
>Anybody else wanna sound off on this question?


Think Evolutionary not Revolutionary, Evolve Youself.
I see hiphop nowadays goin'to a very wrong direction, punkmusic has always ramained the same, tha's why they still have a very consistent movement, not contradictory to its followers, they still defending the same idiology as back in the latest 70's. Hiphop on the other hand has left its basic principles, even though some still fighting to keep it together, to me punk music will always keep its roots intact, reflecting the atittude of its followers while hiphop will break apart (if we don't act)reflecting the media media spotlights.

This is some true shit. I gotta say i've been in the punk scene for awhile know and we have alot of problems, punk rock is getting tooled by the media also. One of the bands in my oppinion that really helped put punk down a bad direction was pennywise. Saddly those cats arefrom my hometown even went to the same high school as me. They really brought the "cool bro punk rock" trend in =/

I've always wanted to hear The Roots cover Train in Vain.

I would love to hear Armagideon Time or anything that has Dub influences...that'd be dope. just imagine that shit


kb


Jazzyfatnastees
Let It Be Mine
2005


In the deck:
Jazzyfatnastees-Let It Be Mine
Fugees-"Take It Easy"
Nina Simone-"Do What You Gotta Do"
Stiffed-Burned Again
Kudu-"Red Light Green Light"
The Slack Republic-"Overcompensating"
G*A*M*E* Rebellion-Trapped and new shit
******

www.jazzyfatnastees.com
www.stiffedmusic.com
www.myspace.com/stiffed

Don't mention Springsteen in the same breath as any great musicians, we don't need to degrade anybody.

at first i was like "hell yeah" on first thought, but with the points other people have brought up i'd say the roots are much more of a rancid type punk (never "selling out" to use that horrible term, but im not liking their new albums as much) they have genrally political songs but no deep concious songs, topics can be drawn in comparison though, general disscussion of street life, drugs etc without glorifying it the clash don't really have any comparison and there is no way in hell topper headon was the best drummer around, i hope that wasn't a school of rock quote you took that from :p In terms of the political messages i'd say the Roots could be more compared with the skinhead Oi bands of the 80's, Sham69, cocksparrer, The exploited - pro nationalist (not racist, loadsa people get skinheads and boneheads/hammerskins mixed up (black empowerment kinda idea for the roots)

Their latest two albums are better than there earlier stuff to me, i didn't find TFA as good as their last two. The songs lost their live energy in the studio, whereas the songs on their two latest albums did not.

I mean I don't think that any band similarity is stronger in music. Not the Weezer/Pixies, not the DropkickMurphys/Pogues. Nothing. Rancid's entire career is the Clash

WTH? Right back at you fool. Don't mention Bruce Springsteen next to any other great artists?! Are you mad? The man is maybe the greatest American songwriter and Born to Run is arguably the greatest album ever made amongst people who actually know music. Here's an example of the Boss mentioned next to other great artists.
The Beatles: 12
Bruce Springsteen: 10
Bob Dylan: 9
Those were the three artists with the highest number of albums on Rolling Stone's list of the 500 greatest albums ever made.

He pull's back, he shoots, he scores!!!! Onetakedizzle wins again!

To be fair, the match was a little one sided because you obviously have no clue what the hell you're talking about.

...I crown thee Sofa King Retarded!

He's a good songwriter, but his voice turns me OFF!!!!