>and i'm not tryin to start isht.<P>tink, when are you not tryin to start some ish? nuh please!!!!!<BR> <BR>> just answerin the question: <BR>>>what established (as in more than 6 <BR>>>records under their belts) does $5 <BR>>>shows? <BR>>>name me 5, better yet name me <BR>>>2. 2 artists (established artists) who <BR>>>does a show for $5 or <BR>>>less........ <P>>first i gotta take issue with your <BR>>definition of established. 6 records??? <BR>> so ATCQ wasn't established???<P>tink tribe has 6 records. what in the world does this have to do with what i'm speaking of?.....<BR> <BR>there's <BR>>a lot of groups that only <BR>>have one or two records but <BR>>have an established reputation from touring <BR>>or word of mouth. ESPECIALLY <BR>>in a genre like punk or <BR>>hardcore....<P>punk and hip-hop are apples and oranges.<BR>again.......hip-hop is what we are speaking of. naw, eff that, fine any genre we can speak on. but in order for any act to do an extensive amount of shows, mind you, around the clock on more than 20 countries. the argument here is not "who is an established artist, the argument here tink, is why am i being challenged like i'm ripping off some people with a $5 dollar show (that was all ages to begin with, so this post wouldn't even be needed if mofo's would do a lil' investigation) so if i sound like i'm on the edge.......damn right i'm on the edge.<P><BR> <BR>>i seen sick of it all (quite <BR>>established, heads never heard of them, <BR>>it's THEIR problem) twice for FREE, <BR>>at least 4 other times for <BR>>between $5 and $10. i <BR>>saw H2O for $5 twice (they're <BR>>established too, only 4 records but <BR>>trust me). agnostic front plays <BR>>for $5-10 all the time.<P>okay. once again. es-tab-lish-ed. by industry standards (gold record at least, hit single, a video at least 7 times a week, a major story in a major periodical).....or whoever. i'm sorry but even though i've heard of these bands i've not seen them in the least sense on mtv ("blah blah blah from h2o got arrested this week for.....") following or no following sorry but they could release a volume of ish the size of prince's catalouge. but still this is not the point.<BR> <BR>>see, these bands just don't usually <BR>>go through the types of promoters <BR>>hip hop acts go through because <BR>>hardcore and punk is so DIY <BR>>(do it yourself). most of <BR>>the promoters in a city are <BR>>just kids from the local scene <BR>>who know how to get a <BR>>show organized. see, all it <BR>>takes in HC is a venue, <BR>>a PA, somebody who knows some <BR>>sound, somebody for security, and a <BR>>SHITLOAD of flyers. i won't <BR>>get the electric factory but i <BR>>could get 200 people in a <BR>>VFW every weekend for 6 months <BR>>if i can keep bringin the <BR>>bands. some hip hop could <BR>>use the DIY approach, but that's <BR>>not gonna happen, and heads should <BR>>just stop complaining. <P>again tink. this was not the focus of the debate. i know you meant well, and i'm not tryin to yank your chain, but this has nothing to do with the matter at hand...<P>"....start your own company??!? your parents don't have enough money to buy you a company!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"