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Topic subjectRE: Likwit Logic 101
Topic URLhttp://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=19&topic_id=20555&mesg_id=20682
20682, RE: Likwit Logic 101
Posted by nonseq, Mon Dec-04-00 04:27 PM
>>
>
>uh, NO. actually, that's not
>what you said. you
>wrote, "De La dissed some
>of the Native Tongues but
>held back on Ultrmagnetic."
>
>anybody unfamiliar with this track
>(like i already admitted to
>being) would take that to
>mean that de la were
>on a track dissing NT
>and ignoring UltraMag IN THAT
>PARTICULAR SONG.

If you say so. I never limited the statement to one specific track, but at least it's clear now. De La disses some of the NT but held back on Ultramagnetic, read literally, means nothing more to me than a. De La dissed some of the Native Tongues. b. They held back on dissing Kool Keith.


What I'm trying to understand is your criteria for calling Em a bitch, and if you would be willing to call everyone who didn't answer every dis back a bitch. Being that De La and Canibus haven't answered back all the peeps that dissed them, would you take that to mean they picked and chose their battles as well, and that they too are bitches?

Moreover, judging by other posts on this thread, yours included, it seems the Ras Kass dis may not be a dis after all. So, what else are you going to use for your "Em picks and chooses" theory?
>
>
>>>2. Em's fake ass "i
>>>dont give a fukk attitude"
>>>would lead me to believe
>>>that he isnt scared or
>>>at the least hesistant of
>>>dissing anybody, not picking and
>>>choosing his battles (no pun
>>>intended). He obviously chooses
>>>who to beef w/ from
>>>pop icons, to lesser known
>>>emcees. He can diss
>>>other cats subliminaly (DMX,No Limit,
>>>etc. but gets pissed when
>>>Everlast does it?? Please....)

A. How does he dis those artists subliminally?


B.Everlast is a lot more specific. Not only does he say "those that act shady" but talks about how he's the first to rep peckerwood status, etc.

C. Everyone chooses who to beef with. For the most part, Em disses wack pop icons, which isn't exactly a novelty in the hip-hop world, more like a tradition. Everyone else he's dissed has started it first. Lauryn's Hill supposed racist comments about white people got ridiculed. That's it. Exactly who did you expect Em to start beef with randomly? If you discount the Ras Kass dis that is now in dispute, Isn't Em batting 1.000 on retorts?


>questionably everlast (ev's response on dilated
>was supposedly in response to
>"i dont give a f*ck),
>and as i said, he
>does the same sh*t everlast
>did, i.e. diss somebody
>w/o saying their name.
>If he gets pissed when
>Ev does it, why do
>it himself? "that sh*t
>i spit on dilated hurt
>your pride?"--everlast

Eminem says "I'm everlasting". That's a dis? Subliminal disses happen all the time in hip-hop, and emcees that do them and then get dissed in the same manner still get pissed. Again, it seems you're singling out Eminem for doing something that a lot of emcees do. You must have a rather small hip-hop collection if you get mad at artists off that criteria.




>
>
>what weak grounds? if you're
>boy disses me, and has
>never even meant me, i
>wouldnt be justified in at
>least asking you "what the
>fukk is up w/ ya
>man?"

Strangely enough, hiphopsite and elevatedminds said that Aristotle knew Defari beforehand, apparently enough to record a very personal dis track.

>
>>>maybe em is still sore over
>the situation, but i doubt
>that, seeing how he blatantly
>denied any connects to aristotle.
> If you say you
>aint got sh*t to do
>w/ somebody's beef, YOU SHOULDNT
>BE WORRIED ABOUT IT ANY
>LONGER. but yet you
>continually try to depict dilated
>as belonging to this beef
>in any shape or fashion.
> How is what they
>were doing (playing switzerland in
>your analogy) any different than
>what Em did on the
>wakeupshow??
>Come on son, you cant
>have your cake and eat
>it too.

Here's how: Dilated knew for a fact that their album contained a verse that dissed Eminem BEFORE their album was released. And they were in control of said album. Eminem did not have Aristotle on his album dissing anyone, and it wasn't Eminem's radio show. Apples and oranges.

>>get mad at you was recorded
>in the spring of '99.
> the MM LP dropped
>in the spring of 2000.
> A whole year apart.
> Where was Dre
>recording???? Come on
>man, that's the most flimsy
>excuse for not showing love
>i've ever heard. That's
>exactly what sway was pissed
>about, the attitude that "I'm
>too busy or important to
>drop by the wakeupshow".
> furthermore, DRE HEARD A
>TAPE OF EM ON THE
>WAKEUPSHOW. They have
>done more for him the
>he ever could for sway
>and tech. You
>dont want me to start
>naming heads that were busy
>touring or making albums that
>had the courtesy to drop
>by and show love.
>I'm sure Rza is a
>zillion times more busy than
>Em was, and he DJ'ed
>the wakeupshow for a good
>5 weeks or so while
>he was recording the bobby
>digital LP. Just one
>example. Your argument holds
>no weight.

1. RZA? That Bobby Pitiful album was so wack it's obvious RZA didn't spend anytime on it. He jacked Portishead for a beat. Wow, that's hard. He stepped back on production for all the Wu solo shit. He wasn't THAT busy.

2. Meanwhile, after the SSLP, Em did shit for: Outsidaz, Domingo, Jazzy Jeff, Wake Up Show, established his own label and signed D-12, went on tour, did emTV, helped create 2 websites, the Dre album, and odds are, ghostwriting for the NWA album. He's also shopping the Bad Meets Evil project. Let's not forget: arraignment on gun charges, divorce proceedings, lawsuit from his moms, and recording the d-12 album. Call me crazy, but that looks pretty busy to me. At least, busier than RZA. And, maybe he might have wanted to spend some time with his daughter somewhere in there?

>
>
> Your percentage analogy
>is baseless as hell.
>You gotta be more specific
>than that. Who are
>you talking about, etc.?

What, two examples weren't enough? I mean, hey, if you think Canibus and De La are bitches too, then props for consistency. If not, why the double standard?


> If you mean to
>imply that emcees dont necessarily
>diss those that diss them
>back, why would em respond
>to everlast?

No need to imply. It's the truth. My question is are you consistent with it. Do you deride everyone who doesn't retort to every dis?

And who
>other than Truck Turner and
>that cat from D-12 ever
>dissed canibus? and i
>think canibus addressed the truck
>turner/krs situation before.

Did he retort to Fuzz Scoota?


>EM only betrayed me by betraying
>my wallet with the Slim
>Shady LP. I learned
>my lesson after hearing cuts
>off his second LP.
>And he IS betraying people
>who enjoyed his earlier brand
>of music. Please dont
>use the tired ass argument
>of me feeling betrayed because
>an artist went gold or
>platinum. Do you really
>think i give a sh*t
>how much an artists sells
>if they're music is pleasing
>to me? Soundscan
>is full of sh*t anyway,
>why would i ever listen
>to them? So
>as far as em is
>concerned, Toss him in the
>pile with Ice Cube, Nas,
>Jay-Z, Mic Geronimo, and a
>sh*tload of other talented emcees
>turned wannabe pop stars.

I said that because, Eminem has changed very little compared to the other emcees you named. Think about this:

1. His subject matters the same as on the EP. Still raping, still killing his baby moms, still rapping about drugs, still talking shit. He didn't go the bling bling route, etc. If it's about redundancy, Redman has him beat in that category.

2. He hasn't gone the traditional sellout route as far as making pop hits, i.e. no beat jacks, no R&B choruses on his lead singles. In that respect, Common's more of an offender than Em will ever be.

3. It's not like he turned his back on the underground with that discography I mentioned above. I left out the rawkus joint, too.

4. The Bass Brothers were producing him before he got signed. They're still on board.

5. The multi-syllable rhyme scheme is still there.

6. If it's about being a tight emcee with a mediocre album, you must HATE Ras Kass and Canibus.

Honestly, I'm wondering what is it about his new shit that differs. My boys and I liked Em from the sway and tech days and give him credit for the fact he hasn't sold out still. None of us felt "betrayed". So, if you could list your reasons for throwing Em in that pop MTV category, I'd be interested to see it. Yes, he appears on MTV a significant amount, but that doesn't exactly get Method's ghetto pass revoked, does it?

>>>



AIM: nichet00

"Even when I say nothing, it's a brilliant use of negative space" El-P


Raeshika: i bought slum used today
Raeshika: returned it 3 hrs later.
nichet00: ha ha
nichet00: that should go in my sig
nichet00: putting it in now