In a marraige/live-in situation, what exactly does it mean to be the Head of the Household?

Men: do you feel as if you are prepared to do this...or if you ever will?
Women: how do you feel about this concept?

i expect my mate to be the head of house
& understand that role & accept it before we co-habitate

head of household...what does that entail
is his word the final on all things?

¤ steady r u ready...what's goin on ¤

only because it's not quite sumthin i can articulate w/"acceptable" reasonin

i feel as tho my mate is the person who provides refuge for me as his mate...who is the head, not in the sense of the brains but as the foreperson to our household, our unit

he is to be the one who sacrifices himself before me as i support him in the role{s} i occupy

he's been givin certain strengths/advantages i expect him to employ

hehe..

lol... just kidding.

you and maybe Boodah

Do unto others, as you would have them do unto you.

.

holds the remote at all times
and gets the big piece of chicken.



_________________
best believe I sweat out weaves.

>holds the remote at all times

sure you love her, but UPN tonight is out of the realm of for better or worse

he may not come up with the idea...but its his final descision.

it ain't happening.
I wouldn't expect him follow through with what it takes to be the head of the household bc i'm not his wife.

In marriage i would hope to find a man deemed worthy enough to trust to follow out that roll. If not, i don't need to marry him.

__________
Sig went datta way--->

Sometimes i think yall are biz markie's test tube babies. © Contagious

But we LOVES posting, precious. Nooooo *snarl*

We HATES posting.

StupidnastyOKP wants us to post... wantses us to click its postssss yessss. Wantses us to loses our JOBS, preciousss. Be unemployed, it does. Killlll OKP. We can sneaks up to it in its sleep and put our fingersss around itsss neck like the little fishies that swimss in the deep dark waters, we can, and then throttle it.

But okp is nice to us, it is. it LOVEses us. © Poetx Tha Addict

should be your covering...

God has called the man to cover, protect and provide not only materially for a woman, but emotionally and spiritually as well

Ephesians 5:22-24
Wives, submit to your husbands as to the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body, of which he is the Savior. Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit to their husbands in everything.


why don't you just die?

i wanna be complimented on my mind not my behind! (c) kEc

http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4288720351
(class reunion website..pics of me in high school...)
http://www.students.uiuc.edu/~callon/photo_gallery.html

the word submit does bother me slightly

but what i've come to realize is ppl don't focus on the latter part of the scripture. if the husbnd is in line with God who is the real head of the house. there isn't any crazy submission that we see distorted and perverse in the world.

i don't think this would be an issue if you have someone equally yoked walking the same path.

i got this great email today breaking this down...

but yeah it's still scary.

why don't you just die?

i wanna be complimented on my mind not my behind! (c) kEc

http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4288720351
(class reunion website..pics of me in high school...)
http://www.students.uiuc.edu/~callon/photo_gallery.html

but i don't think it's scary if you havethe right man. because submiting to him will only benefit you and the family as a whole if he is in submission to the Lord.

We just have to be very careful about who we marry, making sure that he has submitted to Christ. If not, you're in for a world of trouble.

I am trying to work through my issues with such words
and yes, if God is the head of his life then there are no problems, there are however some people who truly don't know what The Head is

Submission is bad when people understand what it totally includes. Women submitting is such a powerful thing. Everyone wants to maintain control when sometimes its just not necessary. Sometimes submission can be as simple as silence, and that can often speak more than actions.



"Not one to wait, cuz I'm no waiter...so when I grow up, don't try to kick it to me later."

you haven't found anyone WORTH submitting to

ideally they person in whom you give that "right" will have your best interests and your confidence

not really the action
but this is in theory

but thats some "issue" type ish

when you get to the point where the word automatically has negative connotation like that...even if you don't mind what it means in practice?

but that's okay, such is why we have grace

or their connotations
it's natural

it used to REALLY bother me
i mean
just the word
and the images it conjures
playing the back...being a rug
i'm making peace with it
i see a difference between submitting and being submissive
if he's handling his(ours)
then i'll go 'head & stfu

¤ steady r u ready...what's goin on ¤

and how it relates the word w/ Christ and the Church.

if you believe in the word then u know that they are not speaking of submissin in a ill oppressive way.

ya know..

__________
Sig went datta way--->

Sometimes i think yall are biz markie's test tube babies. © Contagious

But we LOVES posting, precious. Nooooo *snarl*

We HATES posting.

StupidnastyOKP wants us to post... wantses us to click its postssss yessss. Wantses us to loses our JOBS, preciousss. Be unemployed, it does. Killlll OKP. We can sneaks up to it in its sleep and put our fingersss around itsss neck like the little fishies that swimss in the deep dark waters, we can, and then throttle it.

But okp is nice to us, it is. it LOVEses us. © Poetx Tha Addict

but I can admit that that is not one of my most favorite words

if it matters

that HUSBANDS SUBMIT TO YOUR WIVES as well. people always wanna act like God only discusses submission 2 ur husband. not true. God is about equality as well. check it out. is right there, after the PART of the book u posted.
~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~`~
"i don't think i'd want a man to think i was a higher power, just the final authority." -Bibelot

I’m getting fat. I’m getting fat in places I don’t want to get fat
Like my tummy… I suppose bigger is better than smaller in that area in some respects.
But listen- its like I’m pregnant- carrying around someone's baby in here.
I bet it's a McDonald’s baby or a Wendy’s baby
Shit- as much food as I eat there I bet I’m gestating something.
I’m just getting fat and that’s all there is to it.
Fatty fatty fat fat!!!!
That’s what the kids will call me.
They’ll say: “He's so fat! Look at that fatty fatty fat fat! Hey fat daddy! Look-at-that-fat-daddy!”
I know they will and I’ll have to chase them down and beat them and then eat the evidence.
Damn it I’m going to become a Jeffrey Dahmer all because of this damned pregnant belly.
Can I sue Breyers Ice Cream Corporation?! Like those kids sued McDonalds?
I need to do something...-my bestest friend...luv ya baby!




if u love ur kids...keep them from places like this...
http://www.gda.org/

i caught a peice of creflo dollar this morning
and he was reading that same exact scripture.


stay away from sweethearting with devils © elijah muhammad

It means that the man has the final say on the direction of the house. He is the spiritual head first and foremost. Head of household carries the burden of the house. This does not mean that the woman of the household bows down too him and is his Geisha girl no. The woman entrust the man with such responsibility because he has proven himself to be as such in her eyes. In ideal cases, he is the bread winner, my question to you would be if you made more than a man, would you feel comfortable with him being the head of househould?

>In a marraige/live-in situation, what exactly does it mean
>to be the Head of the Household?
>
>sidebar: What's that scripture about the man as head?

Gen 2:23 - Then the man said, "This at last is bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man." 24 Therefore a man leaves his father and his mother and cleaves to his wife, and they become one flesh. 25 And the man and his wife were both naked, and were not ashamed.

1 Corinthians 7:2 - But because of the temptation to immorality, each man should have his own wife and each woman her own husband.

1 Corinthians 7:3 - The husband should give to his wife her conjugal rights, and likewise the wife to her husband.

1 Corinthians 7:4 - For the wife does not rule over her own body, but the husband does; likewise the husband does not rule over his own body, but the wife does.

1 Corinthians 11:3 - But I want you to understand that the head of every man is Christ, the head of a woman is her husband, and the head of Christ is God.

Ephesians 5:22 - Wives, be subject to your husbands, as to the Lord.

Ephesians 5:23 - For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body, and is himself its Savior. 24 As the church is subject to Christ, so let wives also be subject in everything to their husbands. 25 Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her, 26 that he might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, 27 that he might present the church to himself in splendor, without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be holy and without blemish. 28 Even so husbands should love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. 29 For no man ever hates his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, as Christ does the church, 30 because we are members of his body. 31 "For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh." 32 This mystery is a profound one, and I am saying that it refers to Christ and the church; 33 however, let each one of you love his wife as himself, and let the wife see that she respects her husband.


Colossians 3:19 - Husbands, love your wives, and do not be harsh with them.

cosign

>Gen 2:23 - Then the man said, "This at last is bone of my
>bones and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called Woman,
>because she was taken out of Man." 24 Therefore a man leaves
>his father and his mother and cleaves to his wife, and they
>become one flesh. 25 And the man and his wife were both
>naked, and were not ashamed.
>
> 1 Corinthians 7:2 - But because of the temptation to
>immorality, each man should have his own wife and each woman
>her own husband.
>
> 1 Corinthians 7:3 - The husband should give to his wife her
>conjugal rights, and likewise the wife to her husband.
>
> 1 Corinthians 7:4 - For the wife does not rule over her own
>body, but the husband does; likewise the husband does not
>rule over his own body, but the wife does.
>
>1 Corinthians 11:3 - But I want you to understand that the
>head of every man is Christ, the head of a woman is her
>husband, and the head of Christ is God.
>
>Ephesians 5:22 - Wives, be subject to your husbands, as to
>the Lord.
>
> Ephesians 5:23 - For the husband is the head of the wife as
>Christ is the head of the church, his body, and is himself
>its Savior. 24 As the church is subject to Christ, so let
>wives also be subject in everything to their husbands. 25
>Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church and
>gave himself up for her, 26 that he might sanctify her,
>having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word,
>27 that he might present the church to himself in splendor,
>without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be
>holy and without blemish. 28 Even so husbands should love
>their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves
>himself. 29 For no man ever hates his own flesh, but
>nourishes and cherishes it, as Christ does the church, 30
>because we are members of his body. 31 "For this reason a
>man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his
>wife, and the two shall become one flesh." 32 This mystery
>is a profound one, and I am saying that it refers to Christ
>and the church; 33 however, let each one of you love his
>wife as himself, and let the wife see that she respects her
>husband.
>
>
>Colossians 3:19 - Husbands, love your wives, and do not be
>harsh with them.

i could do the same on what it means to be a father...

I was looking for this one

>
> Ephesians 5:23 - For the husband is the head of the wife as
>Christ is the head of the church, his body, and is himself
>its Savior. 24 As the church is subject to Christ, so let
>wives also be subject in everything to their husbands. 25
>Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church and
>gave himself up for her, 26 that he might sanctify her,
>having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word,
>27 that he might present the church to himself in splendor,
>without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be
>holy and without blemish. 28 Even so husbands should love
>their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves
>himself. 29 For no man ever hates his own flesh, but
>nourishes and cherishes it, as Christ does the church, 30
>because we are members of his body. 31 "For this reason a
>man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his
>wife, and the two shall become one flesh." 32 This mystery
>is a profound one, and I am saying that it refers to Christ
>and the church; 33 however, let each one of you love his
>wife as himself, and let the wife see that she respects her
>husband.
>
>
>Colossians 3:19 - Husbands, love your wives, and do not be
>harsh with them.

But my pastor broke it down for moi like this here...
Christ=husband
Church= Wife right?....now don't take what I'm about to say all EXTRA WRONG...
but who had to die in order for the church to survive? Now think about that....Now does that mean I'm out looking for a guy who will commit suicide just for me? errrr NO but the love I want to share with whomever has to be that deep...marriage is not something to play with and many people do...when I get married the plan is to stay married....bottom line there is sacrifice made on both sides..the weight doesn't just hang on one side but the benefits are supposed to outweigh all that is lost :c)


uNdEr CoNsTrUcTiOn.....
*
Speculatin' on somebody with my Juicy groove
*
My notes on Bush: A village in Texas is missing their idiot
*
DON'T SLEEP
*
We need workers, not leaders. Such workers will solve the problems which race leaders talk about.~Carter G.Woodson
*
The Most Revolutionary Thing A Black Woman Can Do: BE HAPPY
*
cuz I don't wanna get kicked out this fine white mans instituion(c)Lil Roof
*
IT'S JUST MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE ONE IS THE MAGIC NUMBA! (c)Jill Scott
***
The Comedy of life>>>>
www.blackmanwithagun.com

http://[br />theastral1.diaryland.com/"]What
I's 1dering...

My wife also allows me to believe I run shit, when in actuality she's pulling the strings. Much like George Bush and Dick Cheney.

Benefits I enjoy as Head of Hosehold:
I get to take the trash to the curb,
Kill any bug bigger than an ant,
Barbeque, and
Pay the check when we go out to eat.

the guy i was talkin to explained it as two people equally yoked making descisions together. but when a decision has to be made where a agreement isn't reached, it isn't about the man, saying "i'm the head this is what i say, dammit," but more about the wife submitting to her husbands descision for the betterment of the household.

it's not about the husband being the authoritative figure as much as it is the wife submitting. but it works both ways both the wife and the husband, most importantly, must understand their roles.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
God...come in God.
God, come in God.
Damn...you're a girl.
Well, I guess the reason I'm talkin to you tonight is...
cause I've been doing a lot of thinking.
And i consider myself to be a pretty cool guy...
and, i never cheated on any of my girlfriends.
Well...well, except that one lil time in Japan,
and that was just some head...and....head don't count right?
Ahhh, thanks God, I knew you'd understand.
Well...i just feel like,
well...to be honest with you.
God...I just need a sweet bitch.
You know somebody not too...
not too fast, but not too slow.
Cause I don't have it all my damn self...
and life ain't easy.
You know, you just want somebody by your side to help smooth that thing out, knowwhatimtalkinbout.
And, at this point, I mean...Im not being picky.
She don't even have to have a big ole ass, you know...
just something well proportioned to her body.
You know, a nice lil' tale... you know.
wha???...you say you found somebody.
Is she cute??
...so when do I get to meet her?
Ahhhhh...
God...you're the gretest.
Well, I guess I'll talk to you later....
Aaaaa-men.
Oh...I'm sorry, I'm sorry...Aaaa-lady.

-Andre 3000

coverer, protector, provider, takes the bullet, fights the burglar, serves with his life (the same as jesus is given 'head-ness' of the church partly because his great sacrifice for it.)

in EXCHANGE for all this (important, often overlooked point) he is given overall authority.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I've decided: JUDGEMENT IS GOOD.

* = all statements made about the physical traits of females and what Torez
might or might not do to said females are based on Torez as a Single man
not the CURRENT married Torez (unless i'm calling one'a y'all a slur, in which
case it applies RIGHT NOW...)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I've decided: JUDGEMENT IS GOOD.

* = all statements made about the physical traits of females and what Torez
might or might not do to said females are based on Torez as a Single man
not the CURRENT married Torez (unless i'm calling one'a y'all a slur, in which
case it applies RIGHT NOW...)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

i'd say yes, that ultimately somebody has to make a final decisioin, and if a cat is holding up his end of 'head-ness', then it shouldn't be a problem.

again, from the 'jesus' standpoint, he was the head of the disciples, but JUDAS was the treasurer. He made sure the money was right, etc. at the end of the day, judas made the recomendations, etc, but jesus gave the final nod <----------speculation

closer to home:

I suck at money. even though i get the HEAD title from my wife, and i make more than her, MY WIFE does the day to day controlling of the money. when i wanna spend extra from our agreed upon budget, i SUBMIT to her, even though i make more than she does. still, when its time to do big stuff - housebuying, repairs, car buying, etc - we talk about it together. when we thought about rental property, she told me how much we could afford, etc....i listened and since i know she knows what the fuck she's talking about, i followed her recommendations. but at the end, i had to pull the trigger.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I've decided: JUDGEMENT IS GOOD.

* = all statements made about the physical traits of females and what Torez
might or might not do to said females are based on Torez as a Single man
not the CURRENT married Torez (unless i'm calling one'a y'all a slur, in which
case it applies RIGHT NOW...)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

(i assume you're talking in terms of tax purposes because Christainity doesn't really allow for shacking per se)

heres what the IRS says:

To qualify for Head of Household filing status, the following five tests must all be met:


The taxpayer is not married at the end of the year. (There are exceptions to this rule that I'll discuss at the end of this article).


The taxpayer must maintain a household for his or her child, dependent parent, or other dependent relative. (See notes below for additional discussion of dependents.)


The household must be the taxpayer's home, and the household must also be the main home of a qualifying relative (as defined in #2 above) for more than half of the year. (Again, see the notes below for additional discussion of a qualifying individual). There is an exception to this rule: A dependent parent need not live with the taxpayer; however, the taxpayer must provide more than 50% of the cost of maintaining the dependent parent's separate household that was the parent's main home for the entire year.


The taxpayer must provide more than 50% of the cost of maintaining the household.


The taxpayer must be a U.S. citizen or a resident alien during the entire tax year.

Notes on dependents and qualifying individuals (items 2 AND 3):

Cousins do not qualify as a dependent relative.


The taxpayer's unmarried child, stepchild, adopted child, or grandchild do not have to be a dependent.


A foster child must be a dependent.


With respect to the taxpayer's married child, stepchild, adopted child, or grandchild, the taxpayer must be entitled to claim that child as a dependent.


Check the other dependent rules to ensure that any individual in question does, in fact, qualify under the normal dependent rules.

Exceptions allowing married taxpayers to claim Head of Household status:
A married taxpayer living apart from a spouse may qualify as "unmarried" and use the Head of Household rates if all of the following tests are met:

Taxpayer files a separate tax return from the spouse.


Taxpayer's spouse did not live in the household during the last six months of the year.


Taxpayer maintains his/her home as a household that was the main home for a child, stepchild, or adopted child for more than half of the year. However, a foster child must be a member of the household for the entire year.


Taxpayer is entitled to claim that child as a dependent.


Taxpayer provides more than 50% of the cost of maintaining that household.


Taxpayer is a U.S. citizen or a resident alien during the entire tax year.

as some may have what they call lifetime commitments

*shrug*

When I marry, my husband will be the Head of Household. Thats just the way I think it should be ( for me). I would like to work to pay for stuff for the home and the kid/s(when they come) , shopping, staying beautiful etc... and do the shopping and stuff like that, but I would like my man to be the HEAD, take care of business with me as his moral support.

great reply

he takes the lead.

When there is a problem, the rest come to him about it. If need be, he deals with it.

If there is a conflict about a house matter, he trumps everyone. Wife/girlfriend and kids should "voluntarily" relinquish their part in the conflict.

When he and the wife/girlfriend are out on the town and interacting with others, like at a restaurant or something, he should do the talking. If there is a problem at the table or with the food, the waiter addresses him. If there is a problem with a bill or something, the man handles it.

Of course, this requires a certain level of civility in order for all to act accordingly. Which is why "men of the house"'s are becoming fewer and fewer.

Any questions?

"Then the idiot who praises with enthusiastic tone,
All centuries but this and every country but his own"
Gilbert and Sullivan, The Mikado

Check out my .

the waitress part cracked me up.

you are not helping

"Then the idiot who praises with enthusiastic tone,
All centuries but this and every country but his own"
Gilbert and Sullivan, The Mikado

Check out my .

cos a woman like myself, and a man who held such a vision of life would never be in a relationship in the first place.

so no problem.

you wife as a dependent.....ok bad joke, but basically that's the only place where I seen head of household with a definition. Otherwise, it's just hogwash.

>you wife as a dependent.....

It's true I did this last year, even though she wasn't my wife, but we lived together for 3 years, so legally we were.

The man IS the head of the house. IF he is following God's word, a woman should not have a problem following him...

-primary wage earner
-sets course/last word for family activities/purchases
-primary bill payer
-

The male as head of household doesn't really mean much to me. The common definition from the responses I've read all seem to lean towards that meaning the man has the final decision. How do I feel about it? It didn't happen in my house. Didn't happen in my parents' house. My mom is absolutely the head of household. If my husband and I didn't agree on something, ultimately I made the final decision. Such is the result of growing up in a family full of dominant females. I'm not at all open to any kind of submissive state...literal or figurative.

I think it has something to do with who's the primary bread winner. That's the head of household to me.

___________________

Im sorry, you must have mistaken me for someone else. My name is Anastacia Beaverhausen.

It means that He has control over what goes on in this household..He is able to provide for his spouse and childern..He takes care of the home...mr.fix it, shovels, paints...him and the childern. The childern are raised with manners/morals that well represents the family. He is not a drunk or whoremonger...basically he takes care of the home and everyone in it. I shouldnt have to go check what that noise was downstairs...he should!

My personally have no problem with submission...I actually love it! There is no better feeling then loving and being loved!

.

esp. if it means the man is in charge. I'm not saying that in certain situations the man can't lead, and vice versa, but rather each party has something they do well, and sometimes one person is more knowlegable about a certain subject, so they make the final decision, and vice versa.

I feel like whoever I am married to will stand beside me, not above me or ahead of me, but beside me as a protective hedge in whatever may come, and I will do the same for him. Further, I believe it is a wife's duty to live as her husband would want her to, and manage the household accordingly. I also believe as the head of the house, the man should be the provider and the woman the nurturer. I think a man at the head of his household worships his wife for her work as a life giver, and lover, and reflection of himself and every wife should try and be that reflection as best she can, as well as respect her husband for providing as he does.

I look to my dad for a lot of this though. I mean I don't agree with everything he does or believes in, but I think he is an excellent head of his household. He provides for his family in ways that are so unbelievable to me. I have never in my life wanted for ANYTHING, truthfully, and he makes sure he worked hard enough so that my life and my siblings lives would be that way. Further, his marriage, though not the perfect one, reflects his leadership of his household. He and my step mother have a balanced share of work around the house, in their respective jobs and in raising us. She respects that his decision is final, but he respects that her opinion matters, and it works out wonderfully.

I feel old fashioned when I tell folks that what I want my life to be like, and how much of a provider I want my husband to be, but like, I think they take for granted the important role a woman plays in her husband being the head of the household.

Sabes bien que fue un engaño/lo que me hiciste fue un pecado/asi mismo me engañaste/y lloras hoy porque fallaste/como tratas de buscarme/despues que tu me traicionaste/ahora tengo que alejarme/busque la forma de olvidarte © La India



RIP DJ_TeddyBear

is the understanding of what it TAKES to lead

"lead" isn't something taken but given....meaning those who you lead determine your quality as leader. if you don't inspire confidence/trust...then you aren't being a leader. you're being a despot/dictator

similarly being in the "submitted" position is one of support.

EVERYBODY plays a part in making sure the group succeeds. without co-operation from everyone you're gonna fail

but i digress....

Most women don't recognize how much responsibility it takes to manage the household, and uplift your husband. They just know its hard to find a man with the balance, and knowledge of what his leadership role entails. Most are either at one end of the spectrum on some Hail Hitler type bullshit, or some dominate me, I can't make a concious decision on my own type mess...

A lot of the black women I know settle for the latter, which is upsetting, because the role reversal in these relationships is skewed and outrageous.

I can't even deal. I lament daily! Where is my lone ranger? Where is my shining staaaar...where is my happy ending? Where have all the cowboys gone?

No, but seriously what discourages me, and has discouraged me most of my life is that I was raised to think a certain way about a man as the head of the household, the man who I revere at the head of mine is doing an excellent job, but he isn't Black. (No matter how much he thinks he is...) He wasn't raised black, and I often find myself hearing from family/friends if I want a man like him, I'm going to have to search outside of my race to do so...

It makes me all sadfaced inside.

Sabes bien que fue un engaño/lo que me hiciste fue un pecado/asi mismo me engañaste/y lloras hoy porque fallaste/como tratas de buscarme/despues que tu me traicionaste/ahora tengo que alejarme/busque la forma de olvidarte © La India



RIP DJ_TeddyBear

>>He wasn't raised black, and I often find myself hearing from family/friends if I want a man like him, I'm going to have to search outside of my race to do so...

It makes me all sadfaced inside.<<<

especially when there are black men on THIS VERY BOARD holding shit down.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I've decided: JUDGEMENT IS GOOD.

* = all statements made about the physical traits of females and what Torez
might or might not do to said females are based on Torez as a Single man
not the CURRENT married Torez (unless i'm calling one'a y'all a slur, in which
case it applies RIGHT NOW...)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

and are complete anomalies

(yeah right)

like we are invisible....

'member how i said some time back that 'i am not in peace?'

that's part of the reason, truthfully. even though i'm not DOING IT to get recognition, the fact that so many folks think we don't even EXIST....??

it vexes the hell out of me.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I've decided: JUDGEMENT IS GOOD.

* = all statements made about the physical traits of females and what Torez
might or might not do to said females are based on Torez as a Single man
not the CURRENT married Torez (unless i'm calling one'a y'all a slur, in which
case it applies RIGHT NOW...)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

sometimes you gotta check the source

not necessarily in this case, but the baggage is so heavy they couldn't see what they were looking for if he were standing in front of them

similarly, (as stated elsewhere) its easier to say "they all wrong" or "they don't exist" than to look inward and recognize that maybe (just maybe) it's YOU and not them

Granted you can argue that "HEY, I'm doing it..." but someone snatched you both up. The problem is, even if you don't recognize it, you are a rarity. Now if you wanna use your keen eye and scout the rest of us single women some talent, feel free.

And even if it wasn't expressed, I rever any and every man who takes an active and excellent role in his household. I think its dead sexy.

Sabes bien que fue un engaño/lo que me hiciste fue un pecado/asi mismo me engañaste/y lloras hoy porque fallaste/como tratas de buscarme/despues que tu me traicionaste/ahora tengo que alejarme/busque la forma de olvidarte © La India



RIP DJ_TeddyBear

point is we existed, and if we did others do

but for wahever reason (justified or not) they gets little love

and if they mention it they are punks

*shrug*

> you are a rarity.

>And even if it wasn't expressed, I rever any and every man
>who takes an active and excellent role in his household. I
>think its dead sexy.

I think it's more you saying that you couldn't find that in a black man

'specially since they are both married, which to me is kind of the ultimate appreciation.

Either way, I'm not saying that there aren't black men who posses these qualities, I'm just saying, most of my life I've been told otherwise, which is shameful.

Sabes bien que fue un engaño/lo que me hiciste fue un pecado/asi mismo me engañaste/y lloras hoy porque fallaste/como tratas de buscarme/despues que tu me traicionaste/ahora tengo que alejarme/busque la forma de olvidarte © La India



RIP DJ_TeddyBear

or when they say it

its bigger than just me and my situation, because i still have to walk out of the house every day. i've only been married five years. my heart is still more like a regular, single black dude living in america than anytihng else. that's who i sympathize with.

so its hard for me to say 'fuck it, i'm doing my thing, whatever' saying that doesn't nullify the prevailing belief - apparently held by most black women, white women and white men - that black men are _______________ (filled in wack adjective here.) and if i lived in a glass bubble, where these folks opinions didn't effect me, then it wouldn't matter. but i don't. i live/work/praise god/buy groceries/christmas shop/apply for loans/share elevators, office cubicles and neighborhood blocks with these folks. consequently, the same impulse/feeling that leads folks to conclude that black men are ________________, despite the evidence to the contrary right in their face, is the same base impulse that makes them clutch their bags when i get on the elevator with them, frown back at me when i greet them with a smile in the morning, approach me with a gun drawn during a routine traffic stop, etc.

also, there is a petulant, little boy side of me that is angry @ how white cats get a free pass, despite their dirt. which is what i think of when carmia relates that her friends believe she'll have to look 'outside her race' to find her 'lone ranger.' like men that are white/latin/asian, etc are so much better than us.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I've decided: JUDGEMENT IS GOOD.

* = all statements made about the physical traits of females and what Torez
might or might not do to said females are based on Torez as a Single man
not the CURRENT married Torez (unless i'm calling one'a y'all a slur, in which
case it applies RIGHT NOW...)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

maybe you're looking in the wrong places?

I'm lookin at you kinda skeptically. I'm not even 21, and not really dating to marry. Hell, I'm not even dating period. So we'd have to talk about how much 'looking' I'm actually doing.

However, I'd have to ask honestly, do you really think good black men and women of marrying quality are in abundance in this great country of ours?

Sabes bien que fue un engaño/lo que me hiciste fue un pecado/asi mismo me engañaste/y lloras hoy porque fallaste/como tratas de buscarme/despues que tu me traicionaste/ahora tengo que alejarme/busque la forma de olvidarte © La India



RIP DJ_TeddyBear

1. I can't keep up with how old various okps are. I say looking because you say "they" (good black men) are a rarity. How do you know that they're rare if you're not looking?

2. Yes, I do think there are a lot of "good" black men and women out there. My definition of a good man may not be the same as yours. I see a "good" black man as someone who makes Christ the head of his life, cares for his family, is a good provider (or would be if he had a family, since we're talking of single men,)is caring, trustworthy, respectful, a good decision-maker, & dependable. A man worthy of receiving respect.

general, yes.

you seem surprised?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I've decided: JUDGEMENT IS GOOD.

* = all statements made about the physical traits of females and what Torez
might or might not do to said females are based on Torez as a Single man
not the CURRENT married Torez (unless i'm calling one'a y'all a slur, in which
case it applies RIGHT NOW...)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I figured if wifey and fam appreciated it, it's all good

but like i said, i still live 'in the world', too....

wifey and fam can't TOTALLY negate what i experience on a daily basis when i'm not around/talking to them....

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I've decided: JUDGEMENT IS GOOD.

* = all statements made about the physical traits of females and what Torez
might or might not do to said females are based on Torez as a Single man
not the CURRENT married Torez (unless i'm calling one'a y'all a slur, in which
case it applies RIGHT NOW...)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I've just been on an "okay, your loss" thing lately
but I do know of which you speak and am sure will feel it again

you spend your life trying to do and be right and not only do the waywrd et all the pub, but even when your behavior is described it's made to seem as though you aren't even there

(WAB? indeed)

i don't trip (anymore) but it can be a bit taxing to hear how there are NO good brothers/fathers/etc all the time

>i don't trip (anymore) but it can be a bit taxing to hear
>how there are NO good brothers/fathers/etc all the time

it seems you said the same to Torez
I hear you, but still....
some people don't WANT to think there are "good" people out there

but nagative reinforcement is a mug sometimes...even if you recognize it for what it is

Because I understand much of what you're saying.........BUT.....

Why should a Real Man need a woman to "uplift him"? - I ask this, because I look for companionship in a relationship, nothing more, nothing less - I expect that companionship to make me happy, but I don't see it as a situation where that woman's responsibility or role is to uplift me and make me feel better about myself or more like a man.

In short, I don't need a woman for that - it's called self-esteem and confidence.

In any event - can you explain what you mean by manage the household and uplift the man?

It sounds too much like servitude to me.

Now - I will say that I don't have any desire to ever get married, or have children, nor would I ever date a housewife or in general, a woman whose level of career attainment, income and education wasn't similar to mine - as I want to be in a relationship with an equal.

SO maybe my perspective is off.



Still - elaborate.




Peace,








M2

I think the one life you create is far better than any single life you had beforehand. Further, anyone I'm going to be with, is going to make me a better person. Now just because they make me better doesnt make me any short of spectacular before them, it just means their presence in my life alone, adds something that wasn't there before. Perhaps I'm a romantic.

>Now - I will say that I don't have any desire to ever get
>married, or have children, nor would I ever date a housewife
>or in general, a woman whose level of career attainment,
>income and education wasn't similar to mine - as I want to
>be in a relationship with an equal.

Well, there you go... I think a woman who takes care of her house and her children is equal to her husband making six to seven figures in an office. And I think the woman's rewards are far greater...

Sabes bien que fue un engaño/lo que me hiciste fue un pecado/asi mismo me engañaste/y lloras hoy porque fallaste/como tratas de buscarme/despues que tu me traicionaste/ahora tengo que alejarme/busque la forma de olvidarte © La India



RIP DJ_TeddyBear

Who is suing who when the Divorce ends?

Who is going to demand large sums of money claiming that their lifestyle needs to be maintained and that they raised the other's kids?


Obviously - the two aren't equal.




Peace,









M2

as it seems

As far as I'm concerned, both parents are each 50% responsible for the following:

Financially supporting the kids

Raising the kids.

If the man provides 100% of the financial support and the woman does 75% of the raising......

He's bearing more of her responsibilities than she is of his.

Dig?

Additionally, he's also supporting her entirely - grown ass people should be working and paying for at least part of their own financial support.

Let's say someone stays in your house for free, you give them spending money, pay for their car, health care, food, clothes, assume part of the child rearing responsibilities and foot 100% of the money towards raising those kids, etc. I would think the least they could do is clean the house, wait for the repair guy and cook for you, no?

So I would think that 100% of the financial contribution with respect to the kids, 100% of the financial contribution towards supporting her and 25% of the child rearing responsibilities......outweighs her 50% of the child rearing responsibilities and the stuff she does around the house...

No?

You can be the most caring, loving and wise parent on earth - but if you and your family live on a street corner in the bowery, those kids are not going to have a good life.

So in my mind, the two contributions are NOT equal - this is not to devalue one over the other, I'm just saying they're not equal.

Furthermore, why is it that the dollar value of raising a Lawyer's kids is greater than raising a Teacher's kids? These things shouldn't be tied to income (IMO) - as you're basically seeking money to live the lifestyle of a "Lawyer's wife" moreso than seeking money to raise the kids.

Personally, I think that after Divorce, Child Support is for THE KIDS, not the Mother - once the marriage is over the mother should support herself. At most the ex-husband should be paying for no more than 50% of the mother's own expenses.

If the Lawyer father wants to buy his secretary ex-wife a Volvo to drive his kids around in (I'd do that if I were in that situation) because she can only afford a Focus - that's cool - but it shouldn't be part of the Divorce Settlement per se, unless it's a situation where there are five kids and she can't afford a large enough car.

In that case, they should split that expense porportionately or maybe the kids should live with Dad, since Mom can't afford it.

To me - the marriage should be considered a wash based on an agreement betewen the two parties - he doesn't "owe" her extra loot for raising the kids, she doesn't owe him for supporting her.

It's just about the kids now, what do the kids need to be supported financially, NOT what Mommy needs.

I'm a child of Divorce - my mother used my child support on Me only - excess was put into a joint account with both of our names on it, that I got control of when I turned 18.

As far as I'm concerned, a mother receiving child support should follow my mother's example - if she can't the kids should be with Dad.



Peace,













M2

certain things you take over...certain things you give over.

In the end the most rational debater is the head.

is the eyes and ears for the family. He assists w/ decisions for the family and the head does not have an arm so you betta check it.

you will always be
a poor nigger abortion
slip-up. will never
have any money and will
continue letting whyte
men fuck you in the ass.
this is the truth.

--------

Okay Photographers Meet Here>


--------
Some of you say, "Joy is
greater than sorrow," and
others say, "Nay, sorrow is
the greater."

But I say unto you, they are
inseparable. -- The
PROPHET, by Kahlil Gibran

bread winner... or whatever way you want to put it.
If I could stay home cook,clean and have babies I'd be a happy
lady.

...to fall in with the b.s. traditional roles. My firend thinks his role is to be a "provider" like his Pops but he doesn't have the financial security or stability. He'll always seek a mate who has less than he does and get pissed when she's not doing anything with her life (lifestyle). This has happened to him twice in two years.

The other problem is his Pops divorced like three times. He has all these kids and some have had serious issues with divorce and the absence of a father in the home, as Pops moved on to provide for other households.

In my household, Moms was provider. She struggled but we did alright and she checked off "head of household" on all her tax/income forms. We had no problem with that. It helped us become independent and secure in the fact that we had the ability to make our own decisions. No matter what there is no easy way out of being responsible for your own life.

>In a marraige/live-in situation, what exactly does it mean
>to be the Head of the Household?
>
>Men: do you feel as if you are prepared to do this...or if
>you ever will?
>Women: how do you feel about this concept?

my parents divorced and both were "head of household" for their homes as well. I don't think HOH implies that a woman shouldn't be able to do for herself. There shouldn't even be a merger if either party couldn't operate on their own.


>...to fall in with the b.s. traditional roles. My firend
>thinks his role is to be a "provider" like his Pops but he
>doesn't have the financial security or stability. He'll
>always seek a mate who has less than he does and get pissed
>when she's not doing anything with her life (lifestyle).
>This has happened to him twice in two years.
>
>The other problem is his Pops divorced like three times. He
>has all these kids and some have had serious issues with
>divorce and the absence of a father in the home, as Pops
>moved on to provide for other households.
>
>In my household, Moms was provider. She struggled but we
>did alright and she checked off "head of household" on all
>her tax/income forms. We had no problem with that. It
>helped us become independent and secure in the fact that we
>had the ability to make our own decisions. No matter what
>there is no easy way out of being responsible for your own
>life.
>
>>In a marraige/live-in situation, what exactly does it mean
>>to be the Head of the Household?
>>
>>Men: do you feel as if you are prepared to do this...or if
>>you ever will?
>>Women: how do you feel about this concept?

>my parents divorced and both were "head of household" for
>their homes as well. I don't think HOH implies that a woman
>shouldn't be able to do for herself. There shouldn't even
>be a merger if either party couldn't operate on their own.

Well, isn't that the point of some of the posts: men SHOULD be head of household because the expectation is that men/husbands are the providers, not the women who are to submit to them?

My point is that head of household often implies that there should be a "head" or patriarch-as-provider, even when there are two or more people making substantial contributions in one household, i.e. husband and wife. This is the tradition that I think folks fall back on to justify patriarch-as-provider.

with him being the leader long as he doesn't lead me to hell or high water. Its even better if he's able to realize that despite being leader, he's not alone and that we are a team.

Both parents should share responsibilities and should be defered to in certain situations, as one will be more qualified than the other to deal with certain things, but both parents should have input even if one has less knowledge about a particular situation - still, in every day life, an adult should be able to handle the vast majority of things that come up, so there isn't really a need for someone to be an absolute authority, or even someone whose input is weighed more than the other......

........particularly because one parent could die and leave the other one not knowing how to take care of certain things.

Let's say one spouse is a financial whiz is takes care of the day to day finances, the other should be involved enough so that he/she can immediately step in case the other can't take care of those duties.

If one spouse deals with the children more, the other should be involved enough so that he/she can step in if (again) the other is unavailable to handle those duties.

If the Man is the only one who really knows what the deal is with respect to the family finances, knows where the check book is, the deed to the house, etc - while the woman is the only one who nows the kids teachers, what to do with Jr. gets sick, etc.

That family is going to have some problems if anything happens to either parent, or in case of a divorce.

It happens to families where a spouse dies or leaves EVERY Day.

It's easy to just "let" someone take care of you, or be the absolute authority, it's easy to be that authority - in a sense, both people can rest more secure in the relationship.

She submits, the Man leads, everyone is happy.

Thing is - if you feel you need that, it's pathetic and weak - grow a spine and manage the household together, if for nothing else than as a hedge against potential disaster - and more importantly, because you should be able to act like adults and function as partners: As in not being afraid that the relationship will end/you'll lose your security if you don't have absolute power/aren't taken care of.

It's 2003 - people need to start acting like adults.






Peace,









M2

again, if one cannot operate on their own there shouldn't be a merger
and I don't see where HOH is asking for anything different then what you are squawking about

>again, if one cannot operate on their own there shouldn't be
>a merger
>and I don't see where HOH is asking for anything different
>then what you are squawking about

If there is a head of household, than someone is the absolute authority and someone else has surrendered a degree of power.

If you have a true partnership, than neither person can be the "head of household" as the house is run by committe, not by an absolute authority.

And no - the woman managing the house, while the man makes the money and is considered the HOH, is not an equal partnership.

If you're running a true equal partnership, this whole issue of HOH never comes up.

Expertise's definition of a HOH, while loathesome, is spot on - there is no equality in that situation.





Peace,








M2

I think back to this idea of the "final word".....I don't recall there ever needing to BE a final word in my marriage.

We tended to talk things thru to a point where we agreed on the decision.
Not to say you always LIKE the decision...but it was accepted by both parties.

None of this "I get the final word, don't question me" nonsense, IMO, if you say that, you're basically admitting that you're clueless and don't want anyone to know.





Peace,









M2

.

she turns the head any which way she wants it to go...filipino families have always had a matriarchial set up. momma is gangsta.

OOoooooOOo I likes that!

...now is good faye

and keeping the roof over the fam's head, but when both genders are doing this very thing.. the head could be either one of them.. that's my theory.




=====================
I was never because I
never myself how to swim
in holy water. ©Aeon

speaking up
©John Mayer

the status filed on the 1040A

"I'm ... I'm ... I'm just bein' honest." © Andre 3000

.. both parties should be ready to do whatever is necessary to make the household work.

I take care of me.

<~~~~~~~Go-Go Yubari is gangsta!!!
.
.




~~~~~~OKP SIGS OF THE MONTH~~~~~~~

If you're out there you're vulnerable. People prefer to disappear in life to repress their personality. That's not living. It's dying. I see them all over the place, the walking dead. --Grace Jones

Religion is like prison, keep people locked up in different divisions.
Some of them promise you heaven,
but I see a lot of bullshit ism schism,
materialism in the form of spiritually, slave mentality, escape reality....--Dead Prez on that



*****************************

Recommended reading:

******Parable of the Sower- by Octavia Butler*******
Story about a hyper-empath who becomes the founder of a humanist cult created to transform the destiny of humankind

******The spirit of Terrorism- Jean Baudrillard*******
A MUST read for every thinking being
online copy @
http://awake.sparklehouse.com/downloads/papers/baud_terr.html

mail this thread to me when it's done...cuz you know this is my post too, lol.

but unless it's posted over on OkaySports, my mod powers are useless...only kiera, kristy, or the admins can put this post in the hall of fame...i'll inbox one of em for ya tho.

traditionally, this meant you are the breadwinner and the decision maker in the house....and this usually was the male role in the house.

but he should not make major decisions w. out asking his lady. major decisions should be made together.

me n my man live in sin, yeah i said it! and we have been for the last year or so. It took alot for me an independent intelligent black woman who was used to living on her own for the past 3 years to learn to submit without being submissive. It's a balance that is hard to find but well worth it when u find a man worth it. I'd like to say yes my man is the head of the household but he is not without checks and balances, like the president and the house. If I spend money and don't tell him, impeading both of our money, i know ill get in trouble for it, as would he with me if he did the same thing. he knows he gets the glare of death if i find burger king in his car and i aint get none!

kinda like the president is the head but cheney is the one really running shit ;-)

Serena

take care of the household you are head of.

-pay bills
-fix shit around the house
-help the kids do shit
-don't aggravate me
-stay faithful and true to us

i, in turn, will

-donate my fixed amount to the "pay bills" kitty. you do the actual paying and balancing of the account cuz i suck at that stuff
-cook good food for you to eat
-help the kids do shit
-won't aggravate you
-stay faithful and true to us