do you think it's *impossible* to study hip hop in an academic manner that would be suitable to you?

Or do you just think it hasn't been done yet?

Obviously nothing is going to be perfect right off the bat, but if it never gets started...

(Side note... I've argued that hip hop requires a different approach for appreciation/musicological standards, and usually get either shouted down or ignored... what about a class that attempted to approach hip hop on its own terms?)


>That recognition is often not for "what we are", but for "what
>they like about us".

Well. That would be poor study, wouldn't it?

>I don't know if that's a subtle distinction, but the idea is
>that if Will Smith and Freeway are up for "the best rapper out
>of philly" Grammy (Black Thought was snubbed again)
>
>- you wouldn't want Freeway to win because he's "street"
>- you wouldn't want Will Smith to win because he's cheesy

So they give it to G. Love, right?

>You would want some real recognition of both of their styles.
>
>And that never really seems to happen.

I'm not sure what you mean here... 'recognition of their styles' itself implies an academic-style scrutiny.


>That's not the kind of mainstream recognition that the people
>want.

What people are we talking about here?


>The Damajafication of hip hop?
>
>I go back and forth on that one.

I usually have nothing to contribute to his posts of that ilk, but they're always interesting to read.

>>-the underlying fear that hip hop will not stand up to the
>>scrutiny usually reserved for forms like jazz or classical;
>
>I ain't said that, and most of the riders for it, will say
>that it does match up.
>
>Me, i'm against the whole comparison to begin with.

You haven't said that. I don't know about the 'comparison'; as far as I'm concerned hip hop comes with a completely different set of aesthetics, skills, techniques, values, etc., and so to study it from the same perspective as you study classical is kind of doomed.... you need to retool.

>>-the fact that 'hip hop academia' might sacrifice
>>research/argument standards in favor of PC conclusions;
>
>That's a concern.

Cuiriously: did you see the 'Hip Hop World' or something like that article in Nat'l. Geographic a few months back? I appreciated the sentiment but disagreed pretty strongly with much of the article.


>>So k, if you were arguing against teaching hip hop classes
>in
>>college, what would your argument be?
>
>1) the academy does not deserve it

huh?

>2) they don't have the ability to research it

why not?

>3) what research they will do, will be wrong headed and lead
>to bad scholarship
>4) that bad scholarship continues to enforce harmful ideas
>about the music (PE good, NWA bad and Selling Out Bad, Staying
>True - good)

I tend to agree in theory with the last two, though I'm not really educated on the subject. However, you seem to be putting forth the idea that it CAN'T be done well, and I don't know that I agree with that.

That said, as is probably obvious, of course I'm coming from an outsider's perspective anyway, and a tendency to approach music that is new/different to me in an academic/ethnomusicological way. But thanks for discoursing with me on it.