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Subject: "HIP HOP didn't start in NYC (Texas stand up!!)" Previous topic | Next topic
rhulah
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Sat Apr-12-08 09:05 PM

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"HIP HOP didn't start in NYC (Texas stand up!!)"


          



HHHmmmmmm....interesting.



http://hiphopnews.yuku.com/topic/442

__________________________________________

Anthropology Professor Traces & Challenges
Hip Hop's True Orgins

by Daniel Dexter

http://hiphopnews. yuku. com/topic/441

Austin, TX: Frank Rochester is often described as a principled, fair and honest man to a fault. The 6' 4" 51 year old tenured anthropology professor at nearby University of Texas is a towering figure who you would best not to cross. There's a large number of people 1500 miles away in New York City aka The Big Apple who are about to find out the hard way.


Professor Rochester is one who embodies the stubborn resilient spirit of the Lone Star state who is quite willing to go at an opponent against all odds. After quietly raging a two year battle, Rochester finally may be getting his wish as he takes aim at the media conglomerates who he claims unfairly, undeservedly and erroneously attribute cultural trends to the New York populace.


"Because New York City is home to all the TV networks and big time media, important stories and perspectives from other parts of the country don't get discovered until somebody from New York 'discovers' or 'invents' it", Rochester said with pointed enthusiasm.


"It's now common knowledge that while New York City is often dubbed the fashion capital of the world, it really isn't. The truth of the matter is most fashion trends start overseas in places like Japan and make then make its way to the states beginning with west coast cities like Los Angeles and San Francisco", Rochester noted. "However to listen to the so called big city pundits you would never know that. It's all about New York and it's completely false.
"

As a cultural anthropologist Rochester has discovered that big media have created a mystique around New York that simply needs to be shattered. By falsely attributing cultural trends to the Big Apple many regions in this country have suffered a talent drain. Some of our best and brightest from Texas have wound up going to New York for validation.


The Roots of Hip Hop Expression: Bull-Dancing and Bell Ringing

"New York City being the center of the cultural universe is a myth. It's one big urban legend that in many ways is harmful", Rochester stated. "One of the biggest falsehoods is that New York City is the birthplace of the music phenomenon called Hip Hop. For almost three decades we have been led to believe that a bunch kids from public housing projects went out and created one of the most vibrant and certainly one of the most popular art forms in the 21st century. It sounds good on TV. It reads well in newspaper. It tugs at our heart strings", Rochester grimaced, "But the truth of the matter is this cultural expression is rooted in Texas sharecropping and cowboy culture.
"

Rochester's research shows that long before kids in the Bronx were rapping on the mic, there were rhyme sayers working the cotton fields in Texas as far back as the 1700s. Rochester has in his possession old slave and sharecropping journals and even old African -American newspapers that are filled with rhymes and limericks.


"Black people in Texas have been using rhymes as a form of communication for hundreds of years.", Rochester noted. He continued by stating that it wasn't unusual for groups of African descended men to get in a circle and recite rhyme against one another.
It's part of what many anthropologist have long called the 'African Oral Tradition' In Texas it was known as 'Hollaring in the Circle'.


Rochester pointed out oftentimes the cowboys would join those hollars and their own 2 cents in terms of rhymes. It was slave hands and later, sharecroppers rhyming alongside cowboys. "This is history that isn't recognized", Rochester said.


He went on to explain that break-dancing is actually a derivative of cowboy culture which started off in rodeos. He described how field hands would show off their toughness by lassoing bulls and allowing themselves to be pulled around. At first the cowboys would try and stand up and do fancy moves with their feet as a sign of being quick footed. As the bulls would become more agitated the cowboys would be dragged to the ground at which point they would do fancy spins on their backs while holding tight to the rope.


"This activity was called 'back lassoing' or 'bull-dancing' and it's been in existence at least one hundred years before New York supposedly discovered it.", Rochester quipped.


"If you look at what are described as power moves in Hip Hop dance, you will see that they are no different then the bull dance moves which are still done to this day at Texas rodeos throughout east Texas and near the border towns.".


He added that bull-dancing was accompanied by quick witted wordsmiths who would serves as MCs (Masters of Ceremonies). These individuals would recite rhymes and make up limericks for the bull-dancers.
Often times a cowbell ringer would be in the back ground setting the pace by ringing the bells. At its best the announcer would say his rhyme to the beat of the cowbell.


"I guess a bunch of cowboys and sharecroppers inventing Hip Hop doesn't sound as compelling as compared to some project kids from the Bronx.", Rochester said.


Connecting Texas and the Bronx

Rochester has been able to trace the roots of Cowboy and share-cropping culture and its connection to New York and what would later emerge to be Hip Hop. He explained that in 1970 the Texas rodeo teams went to New York for the first time and did and very well attended exhibit at Madison Square Garden. The teams stayed for several weeks and mesmerized Big Apple residents with their bull-dancing techniques and cowbell ringing. The showmanship captured the imaginations of a lot of people including several New York deejays.


Rochester said if you go and listen to the first raps they sound just like bull-dance calls. The rapper would reflect his voice as if he was throwing up. These deejays later brought that style to the airwaves and popular nightclubs.
Rochester steadfastly maintains that it was from Texas Bull-dancing that Jamaican born Kool Herc adapted what would later become Hip Hop.
There is no doubt in Rochesters mind that Herc as well as other pioneers like Afrika Bambaataa and others all were inspired by the Texas rodeo.


Rochester pointed out two undeniable facts. First, during the 1970 Texas rodeo appearance in New York City, attending the event at Madison Square Garden was a popular class field trip for NY public schools. There's a strong Likelyhood that many of New York's pioneering figures saw first hand rhyming, bull-dancing and cowbell ringing.


Second, is according to migration patterns, many Black Texans fleeing racial discrimination and hardships landed in New York. The Bronx and nearby Westchester county were popular spots that when you do the research show its heavily concentrated with displaced Texans. This means that there is a strong possibility that during the summer months and holidays, Bronx born African American New Yorkers went 'back home to Texas and got exposed to bull-dancing.
/

Taking it to the Capitol

Professor Frank Rochester is absolutely convinced that Hip Hop emerged from Texas before New York City. He claims that one of the reasons that Texas Hip Hop now outsells and is more popular then NY is because when it comes from here the audience is experiencing the 'real thing'.


Rochester feels that the state of Texas is losing not only cultural recognition but also millions of dollars in revenue that could be generated if the world was to know the truth about Texas being the real birthplace of Hip Hop.


Rochester is currently working with lawmakers here in the state capitol to see about suing the city of New York for deceptive and misleading practices.
Texas lawmaker Tony Sanchez says he's in agreement with Rochester. He feels that a strong message needs to be sent to all those complicit in this deception.
Ideally they want to get it legislated so that NY can't officially call itself the birthplace of Hip Hop

"For years Texas has been overlooked and essentially victim to big city politics which has resulted in cultural theft. We can not allow New York City officials to erroneously lay claim to being the birthplace of Hip Hop. It's a lie that needs to be corrected", Sanchez wrote in a recent press release.


This amendment will be introduced to the floor of the Texas assembly next week and attached to Bill HR 321
http://www. capitol. state. tx. us/BillLookup/BillNumber. aspx

Thus far New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg has been silent on this but we suspect he'll be speaking up in due time trying to defend New York's ill-gotten

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
wrong! wrong! (c) Charlie Murphy
Apr 08th 2008
1
RE: wrong! wrong! (c) Charlie Murphy
Apr 09th 2008
7
and
Apr 09th 2008
11
RE: wrong! wrong! (c) Charlie Murphy
Apr 11th 2008
16
wherever it started...
Apr 08th 2008
2
it'll never die...it keeps evolving
Apr 08th 2008
3
      good point but
Apr 09th 2008
4
           hip-hop or rap?
Apr 09th 2008
10
why do we care?
Apr 09th 2008
5
RE: why do we care?
Apr 09th 2008
6
RE: HIP HOP didn't start in NYC (Texas stand up!!)
Apr 09th 2008
8
hahaha
Apr 10th 2008
12
ummm...
Apr 10th 2008
13
      RE: ummm...
Apr 10th 2008
14
my father told me about that rodeo
Apr 11th 2008
15
For Real Tho y'all know this was a joke, right?
Apr 12th 2008
17
i didn't fall for it for one second!
Apr 12th 2008
18
NYC and NY state <<< Texas
Apr 19th 2008
19
hip hop was birthed by TWO TURNTABLES
Apr 21st 2008
20

Nettrice
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Tue Apr-08-08 06:17 PM

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1. "wrong! wrong! (c) Charlie Murphy"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

call and response, rhythmic chants, and even the rhyming the author of the article mentions did not start in Texas

it started in AFRICA

rapping on the other hand started in the West Indies

where it all came together, with the music and dancing (Capoeira) was in New York City

there are parts that originated from all over the globe!

<--- Blame this lady for Nutty.

  

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rhulah
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Wed Apr-09-08 02:46 PM

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7. "RE: wrong! wrong! (c) Charlie Murphy"
In response to Reply # 1


          


Certain aspects have been lifted from various cultures.

  

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Nettrice
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Wed Apr-09-08 07:05 PM

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11. "and"
In response to Reply # 7


  

          

>Certain aspects have been lifted from various cultures.

it was the diversity of cultures in a specific place that brought all those aspects together: breakdancing, graffiti, rapping, beat-boxing and fashion

hip-hop is more than rap music

<--- Blame this lady for Nutty.

  

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EffectiveEssence
Member since Mar 27th 2006
95 posts
Fri Apr-11-08 06:07 PM

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16. "RE: wrong! wrong! (c) Charlie Murphy"
In response to Reply # 1


          

>call and response, rhythmic chants, and even the rhyming the
>author of the article mentions did not start in Texas
>
>it started in AFRICA
>
>rapping on the other hand started in the West Indies
>
>where it all came together, with the music and dancing
>(Capoeira) was in New York City
>
>there are parts that originated from all over the globe!


You're right about everything here...BUT...And I am not trying to debate or nitpick here...BUT...According Mr. Wiggles, Mr. Freeze, and Keith and Kevin aka the n*gga twins, Capoeira had actually never been seen by any bboys when the dance was being created...Matter of fact, one the twins, don't remember which, was once asked by someone interviewing him if he had gotten his style from capoeira...His response was basically "I don't know who this capoeira guy is, but if he's as good as you say he is, I'd like to meet him"

Sources...The Freshest Kids (For freeze and wiggles) and Mrwiggleshiphop.biz for the quotes from the twins...

http://midwestflava.net/forum
http://myspace.com/floorspiders

  

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Fire1986
Member since Jul 15th 2005
415 posts
Tue Apr-08-08 08:43 PM

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2. "wherever it started..."
In response to Reply # 0


          

...it's all but dead now

Everything has been figured out except how to live.

  

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Nettrice
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Tue Apr-08-08 09:43 PM

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3. "it'll never die...it keeps evolving"
In response to Reply # 2


  

          

we keep evolving

<--- Blame this lady for Nutty.

  

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Fire1986
Member since Jul 15th 2005
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Wed Apr-09-08 09:08 AM

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4. "good point but"
In response to Reply # 3


          

but hip hop is devolving, if anything

Everything has been figured out except how to live.

  

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Nettrice
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Wed Apr-09-08 07:03 PM

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10. "hip-hop or rap?"
In response to Reply # 4


  

          

> but hip hop is devolving, if anything

<--- Blame this lady for Nutty.

  

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jahlove7
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Wed Apr-09-08 02:22 PM

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5. "why do we care?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

we've been good to hip hop. but hip hop hasn't been very good to us...who gives a damn where it originates at this point...

inaugural member - okayplayer sports hall of fame.


what i'm digging right now:

chocolate butterfly - self-titled
laura jane - welcome to my planet boo
me & this japanese guy - waiting for the miracle
wade3 - dreams
tracey amos - who are we really?

  

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rhulah
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Wed Apr-09-08 02:45 PM

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6. "RE: why do we care?"
In response to Reply # 5


          


I GIVE A DAMN!!!




>we've been good to hip hop. but hip hop hasn't been very
>good to us...who gives a damn where it originates at this
>point...

  

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rhulah
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Wed Apr-09-08 02:51 PM

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8. "RE: HIP HOP didn't start in NYC (Texas stand up!!)"
In response to Reply # 0


          

As a cultural anthropologist Rochester has discovered that big media have created a mystique around New York that simply needs to be shattered. By falsely attributing cultural trends to the Big Apple many regions in this country have suffered a talent drain. Some of our best and brightest from Texas have wound up going to New York for validation.


...and so have alot of other people from other cities!!

  

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J.D.MACLEOD
Member since Mar 27th 2007
478 posts
Thu Apr-10-08 08:02 PM

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12. "hahaha"
In response to Reply # 0


          

yeah paul wall is the truth!!

nyc bows down to the mighty paul wall and mike jones the inventors

I got them chopped and screwed rodeo mixtapes..2 for 5, 2 for 5.

Funny to think there was a conspiracy to take credit for hiphop when at first nobody would fuck with it





"it is unclear to me why anybody over 15 would listen to an album like Curtis, except to review it."-John H. McWhorter

  

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Nettrice
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Thu Apr-10-08 08:21 PM

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13. "ummm..."
In response to Reply # 12


  

          

>yeah paul wall is the truth!!

NO

<--- Blame this lady for Nutty.

  

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J.D.MACLEOD
Member since Mar 27th 2007
478 posts
Thu Apr-10-08 09:26 PM

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14. "RE: ummm..."
In response to Reply # 13


          

really?




"it is unclear to me why anybody over 15 would listen to an album like Curtis, except to review it."-John H. McWhorter

  

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jsmooth995
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Fri Apr-11-08 02:13 PM

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15. "my father told me about that rodeo"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I was too young to catch that but my dad says he went to that, and he thinks he remembers the cowboys saying "hip, hop, hibbit" while the bulls jumped around in the rodeo.. kinda deep.

  

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jsmooth995
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Sat Apr-12-08 05:59 PM

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17. "For Real Tho y'all know this was a joke, right?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Y'all do know this whole article was an April Fool's Day joke from Davey D, right? There is no Frank Rochester..

  

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Nettrice
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18. "i didn't fall for it for one second!"
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

:P

<--- Blame this lady for Nutty.

  

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Yadgyu
Member since May 31st 2006
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Sat Apr-19-08 01:28 AM

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19. "NYC and NY state <<< Texas"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Texas wins!!! Flawless victory!

___________________________________

Strange is inevitable...

  

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My_SP1200_Broken_Again
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Mon Apr-21-08 06:40 PM

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20. "hip hop was birthed by TWO TURNTABLES"
In response to Reply # 0
Mon Apr-21-08 06:40 PM by My_SP1200_Broken_Aga

  

          

...i dont see any mention of "two turntables" in this nonsense ...so the winner is the BRONX via Jamaica

----------------------------
http://twitter.com/DJCHIEFONE
http://soundcloud.com/DJCHIEFONE

DJ CHIEF-ONE - SUMMERTIME 09 MIXTAPE:
http://soundcloud.com/djchiefone/dj-chief-one-summertime-09-mixtape-1-08-56-mp3

  

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