1. "A bit as expected (if you didn't expect Mini-KG)" In response to Reply # 0 Wed Nov-16-16 12:10 PM by SoulHonky
Barnes is the better scorer, MG-K is the better rebounder, defender, and passer.
MK-G's offense has been a disappointment to say the least. He is what he is on that front although there have been slight improvements. Even if he was given more leeway on a crap team like the Dirk-less Mavs, he wouldn't be consistently scoring like Barnes has. In today's game, he really needs to at least learn to hit the corner 3 to be an elite 3 and D guy.
Barnes has been scoring of late but hasn't offered too much else. And the Mavs are performing as you'd expect a team with Barnes as a top 2 player on it.
In the end, Khris Middleton and Draymond kind of turned into what these guys were supposed to be.
Gilly the Kidd has definitely been the bigger disappointment. It's easy to give Barnes the nod right now because of his scoring but I think both guys are the right fit for their teams right now.
8. "People expected Draymond numbers/role for MK-G" In response to Reply # 4
People would have loved MK-G on Golden State. Point forward focusing on defense and rebounding, letting Curry and Klay do their thing. I'm not sure he'd fit that role better than Draymond has.
I like Gilly and he's an anti-analytics guy because a lot of what he doesn't doesn't show up in the box score but you look at the role Draymond has and the numbers he is putting up, if you asked someone pre-draft who would be doing that, and most people would have said Kidd-Gilchrist.
9. "from what I've seen MKG doesn't have anywhere near the same..." In response to Reply # 8
ballhandling/passing/court vision as Draymond. I also not know if MKG is physical enough to regularly mix it up with the bigs as a center in a small ball lineup like Draymond does.
>People would have loved MK-G on Golden State. Point forward >focusing on defense and rebounding, letting Curry and Klay do >their thing. I'm not sure he'd fit that role better than >Draymond has. > >I like Gilly and he's an anti-analytics guy because a lot of >what he doesn't doesn't show up in the box score but you look >at the role Draymond has and the numbers he is putting up, if >you asked someone pre-draft who would be doing that, and most >people would have said Kidd-Gilchrist. >
5. "becoming pretty obvious Barnes was miscast in GS" In response to Reply # 0
he was a great fit for the system we run. His ability to rebound and guard in the post helped us go small
But it wasn't the best fit for his game and development.
He's just not a great 3 pt shooter. But he's solid from the midrange. Always has actually. I remember when the 3s weren't falling with us, the long 2 was still a good shot for him.
Its too early to say what's going to happen (with Dirk, Deron and Harris out) but it seems like he's found his niche
22.3 points, 5.9 rebounds with a true shooting percentage of 57.1 percent.
11. "This agenda battle was the opposite of Kawhi-PG..." In response to Reply # 0
Neither of these guys has done shit. Meanwhile, although Kawhi > PG, they've both become excellent players so you can't really fault anyone for hyping either of them at the time.
13. "Man, nobody hyped EITHER PG or Kawhi coming OUT" In response to Reply # 11
>Neither of these guys has done shit. Meanwhile, although >Kawhi > PG, they've both become excellent players so you can't >really fault anyone for hyping either of them at the time.
25. "I knew Leonard would be good but I thought like borderline AS" In response to Reply # 13
Not a top 5/10 player. He was a savage at SDSU and got good coaching, but nothing suggested he could shoot this well or control a game this way. He seemed more like a suped-up version of Josh Howard than a suped-up version of James Worthy.
And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.
17. "welp. SouthDallasMan actually turned out to be an NBA player" In response to Reply # 15
all of that crap they heap on EVERY forward prospect in college ("HE'S GONNA BE LEBRON, HE'S GONNA BE LEBRON") for the last 15 years got to me. and then he played another year at NC basically being NyQuil
19. "I hear you and Barnes was definitely overhyped coming out of high school..." In response to Reply # 17
I felt the same way about Andrew Wiggins.
But I felt like MKG was overhyped coming out of Kentucky.
>all of that crap they heap on EVERY forward prospect in >college ("HE'S GONNA BE LEBRON, HE'S GONNA BE LEBRON") for the >last 15 years got to me. and then he played another year at NC >basically being NyQuil > >
Frank Longo Member since Nov 18th 2003 86672 posts
Thu Nov-29-18 01:49 PM
18. "Barnes has had negative +/- nearly his entire career. " In response to Reply # 15
Can you imagine how hard it must have been to get negative +/- on the WARRIORS three out of his four seasons?
Barnes has rocked a negative VORP the last two years. (He has the worst VORP on his team today.) He's a bad defender. (One could argue the worst defender on his team today.) Insanely low assist rate. He has one skill: he shoots a basketball well.
Not to discount that... but it's still *easy* to see how, before MKG's series of injuries, people thought MKG would be better. Because while MKG has never been good at shooting, he was better than Barnes at basically everything else and I'd say still is. MKG off the bench this season has better PER, better rebound rate, better assist rate, better defensive stats, better win shares, better +/-, better VORP... better basically *everything* other than shooting and points per game.
So yeah, Barnes has given no one a reason to regret picking MKG over him at the time imo. This isn't some "you picked Shabazz Muhammad over Giannis?" thing where the guy with obviously lower upside has finished lower. Barnes is who he was always projected to be: Calbert Cheaney with a better outside J. MKG has struggled to stay on the court and it's wildly unlikely he'll ever be the guy he could've become. *shrug* Shit happens.
P.S. Before certain users discount the value of things like +/-, win shares, VORP, PER, etc.: you can argue for weakness/noise within those stats individually, but think about how hard it must be to be mediocre-to-bad consistently in *all of those categories.*
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