A buddy of mines is really big on the Hagler, Hearns, Duran, and Leonard era. I told him that the era that I call Muderers Row which featured Norris, Brown, McCallum, Jackson, Toney, Jones Jr., Benn, and McClellan was far better. This era was full of vicious KO artists that would've knocked out or won lopsided over those four fighters i.e. Norris' flawless win over Leonard, which would have gone the same way even if Leonard was in his prime.

What are your thoughts and opinions on these two eras?

>A buddy of mines is really big on the Hagler, Hearns, Duran,
>and Leonard era. I told him that the era that I call Muderers
>Row which featured Norris, Brown, McCallum, Jackson, Toney,
>Jones Jr., Benn, and McClellan was far better. This era was
>full of vicious KO artists that would've knocked out or won
>lopsided over those four fighters i.e. Norris' flawless win
>over Leonard, which would have gone he same way even if
>Leonard was in his prime.
>
>What are your thoughts and opinions on these two eras?

I mean, saying that the Four Kings (Hagler, Hearns, Duran,
and Leonard) were anything less than the best is usually
a non-starter for "boxing heads" but you've got a pretty
damn strong argument there....I'm gonna have to think about
this




----------------------------



O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"




"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "

If you gonna include hawk pryor on that early 80s list of greats they are clearly better

Hagler would go thru any of those guys you mentioned and I think Duran would as well

>If you gonna include hawk pryor on that early 80s list of
>greats they are clearly better
>
>Hagler would go thru any of those guys you mentioned and I
>think Duran would as well

Hawk helps but he still doesn't make them better. Like I stared, if Norris vs. Leonard was total domination then I believe that The Four Kings wouldn't have been that if they to face these guys.

>Hawk helps but he still doesn't make them better. Like I
>stared, if Norris vs. Leonard was total domination then I
>believe that The Four Kings wouldn't have been that if they to
>face these guys.

Leonard was basically past his prime in 84 when he retired for the 2nd time.

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Aaron Pryor... Alexis Arguello, Wilfred Benitez, Donald Curry, Marlon Starling (honorable mention: Mark Breland and Milton McCrory)

Every last one or those fighters from the 80s era are all-time greats (except Curry and Starling).the 90s era fighters are HOFers but they're not in that upper echelon of elite fighters (except Roy)

Terry Norris beating a 35 yr old Ray Leonard who was clearly over the hill at that point isn't all that impressive

And actually, he didn't knock Leonard out, he whooped his ass, though, pretty bad but
Ray withstood the beatdown

And yes, Hagler at his best WALKS through ALL those dudes

Possibly Hearns too if he fights any of those dudes at 147 where he is still the hardest puncher in the history of that division

Sugar Ray in his prime might've had a more difficult time with several of those fighters but I think he would prevail

I'd give Duran the edge over all the fighters the OP mentioned w/the exception of Roy - Roy's speed and him being the bigger fighter would've presented a problem for Duran

grassrootsphilosopher

>Aaron Pryor... Alexis Arguello, Wilfred Benitez, Donald
>Curry, Marlon Starling (honorable mention: Mark Breland and
>Milton McCrory)
>
>Every last one or those fighters from the 80s era are all-time
>greats (except Curry and Starling).the 90s era fighters are
>HOFers but they're not in that upper echelon of elite fighters
>(except Roy)
>
>Terry Norris beating a 35 yr old Ray Leonard who was clearly
>over the hill at that point isn't all that impressive
>
>And actually, he didn't knock Leonard out, he whooped his ass,
>though, pretty bad but
>Ray withstood the beatdown
>
>And yes, Hagler at his best WALKS through ALL those dudes
>
>Possibly Hearns too if he fights any of those dudes at 147
>where he is still the hardest puncher in the history of that
>division
>
>Sugar Ray in his prime might've had a more difficult time with
>several of those fighters but I think he would prevail
>
>I'd give Duran the edge over all the fighters the OP mentioned
>w/the exception of Roy - Roy's speed and him being the bigger
>fighter would've presented a problem for Duran

<---
Fuck a sig, my presence is enough.

>Aaron Pryor... Alexis Arguello, Wilfred Benitez, Donald
>Curry, Marlon Starling (honorable mention: Mark Breland and
>Milton McCrory)
>

Only Pryor and Arguello deserve any mention out of the fighters you named.

>Every last one or those fighters from the 80s era are all-time
>greats (except Curry and Starling).the 90s era fighters are
>HOFers but they're not in that upper echelon of elite fighters
>(except Roy)
>
>Terry Norris beating a 35 yr old Ray Leonard who was clearly
>over the hill at that point isn't all that impressive
>

Leonard wasn't over the hill, seeing as he retired quite a few times during his career. Actually he should've made a better showing and got his ass handed to him. Leonard had a lot of time off between retirements and wasn't in a whole lot of wars. Just face the fact that he was outclassed. Even though Norris didn't knock him out, the beating that Leonard took was far worse than being knocked out.



>And actually, he didn't knock Leonard out, he whooped his ass,
>though, pretty bad but
>Ray withstood the beatdown
>
>And yes, Hagler at his best WALKS through ALL those dudes
>

Hagler wouldn't win against McCallum, Toney, RJJ, or McClellan. He wouldn't by any means move up to 168 for a fight against Benn. The others would have a punchers chance against Hagler.


>Possibly Hearns too if he fights any of those dudes at 147
>where he is still the hardest puncher in the history of that
>division
>
No chin Hearns would got knocked out by all of those fighters!!!!


>Sugar Ray in his prime might've had a more difficult time with
>several of those fighters but I think he would prevail
>
Leonard's speed would help and would probably fare better against these fighters than the others. I think that a few of these guys would knock Ray out.


>I'd give Duran the edge over all the fighters the OP mentioned
>w/the exception of Roy - Roy's speed and him being the bigger
>fighter would've presented a problem for Duran
Duran depended on his toughness, and he wouldn't be able to intimidate any of these fighters. The only fighter that I would give Duran the advantage would be against Brown.

BTW... None of the Four Kings fought McCallum, and he was fighting in their era!!!

>>Aaron Pryor... Alexis Arguello, Wilfred Benitez, Donald
>>Curry, Marlon Starling (honorable mention: Mark Breland and
>>Milton McCrory)
>>
>
>Only Pryor and Arguello deserve any mention out of the
>fighters you named.

Nope, Wilfred Benitez was a world champion by the age of *18* - he and Leonard had a classic championship fight which was Sugar Ray's 1st real test as a pro - and both Marlon Starling and Donald Curry were top 10 welterweights in the 80s and both were title holders

>>Terry Norris beating a 35 yr old Ray Leonard who was clearly
>>over the hill at that point isn't all that impressive
>>
>
>Leonard wasn't over the hill, seeing as he retired quite a few
>times during his career.

SRL was clearly past his prime when he fought Norris - nearly 95% of all fighters were on the downside of their career by the age of 35 at that time..and, yes, SRL did retire 2x but he also was part of some brutal *15* round wars which has to be factored in when talking abt him being past his prime vs *some *fighters today (Mayweather(BHop/Pacquiao etc.) who are still fighting well past their mid to late 30s because of various reasons

Actually he should've made a better
>showing and got his ass handed to him.

The fact that he DIDN'T get knocked out was surprising and dare I say admirable considering how one-sided the fight was

Leonard had a lot of
>time off between retirements and wasn't in a whole lot of
>wars.

Really?!?! Yeah I guess the 1st Duran-Leonard wasn't a war, neither was the Benitez fight which went 15 rds. or the 1st Hearns fight where he got his retina detached in a grueling 14 rd fight (even the 2nd fight was tough in which the consensus was that he lost)...the Hagler fight wasn't a war either I guess even for a guy who had had as long a layoff as SRL??? yeah aight

Just face the fact that he was outclassed. Even though
>Norris didn't knock him out, the beating that Leonard took was
>far worse than being knocked out.

Wth - uh I already said as much but no one who knows anything abt boxing would dare say SRL was in his prime when he lost to Norris


>Hagler wouldn't win against McCallum, Toney, RJJ, or
>McClellan.

Yeah ok - you just exposed yourself - I'm not going to even waste time arguing that non sense

He wouldn't by any means move up to 168 for a
>fight against Benn. The others would have a punchers chance
>against Hagler.

A punchers chance? Hell is you talking abt lmao - Hagler was NEVER KNOCKED OUT NOR KNOCKED DOWN as a professional and he faced harder punchers than ANY of the fighters you mentioned - as far as moving up to 168, Hagler made it clear since he was the undisputed middleweight champion like forever that he wasn't going to move up or down to fight anyone. So none of those fighters could challenge him at 160 (maybe Roy but his jaw was too weak and he didn't have enough punching power to knock out or hurt Hagler and I could see Hagler wearing him down in the later rds.)
>
>
>>Possibly Hearns too if he fights any of those dudes at 147
>>where he is still the hardest puncher in the history of that
>>division
>>
>No chin Hearns would got knocked out by all of those
>fighters!!!!

Roy's chin was just as suspect as Hearns and he's maybe the only fighter out of the choices who could beat Hearns (in a decision)...but if Hearns lands FIRST then all those dudes would be put to sleep - his reach and height makes him a difficult fight for anyone
>
>>Sugar Ray in his prime might've had a more difficult time
>with
>>several of those fighters but I think he would prevail
>>
>Leonard's speed would help and would probably fare better
>against these fighters than the others.

Nope I seriously doubt that...and I'm a SRL fan but he would NOT fare better than Hagler or Hearns and possibly not Duran either against those fighters

> I think that a few of
>these guys would knock Ray out.

Yeah, right - he was never knocked out by fighters who were much harder punchers than the 90s fighters mentioned in this post but you believe a few of these 90s era fighters guys woulda knocked Sugar Ray out lol
>
>
>>I'd give Duran the edge over all the fighters the OP
>mentioned
>>w/the exception of Roy - Roy's speed and him being the
>bigger
>>fighter would've presented a problem for Duran

>Duran depended on his toughness, and he wouldn't be able to
>intimidate any of these fighters.

Are you sure we're talking abt the same Roberto Duran? Because Duran didn't have to depend on intimidating fighters, opponents were naturally intimidated because of his tazmanian devil type fighting style - he was a relentless puncher who threw punches from all angles, similar to Pacquiaon, only Duran was a much more skilled boxer


The only fighter that I
>would give Duran the advantage would be against Brown.

K
>
>BTW... None of the Four Kings fought McCallum, and he was
>fighting in their era!!!

Mccallum ascension came closer towards the end of the 80s when Sugar Ray/Hagler/Duran/Hearns reign was coming to an end - he wasn't on anyone's radar in the early 80s which is why he didn't fight any of those guys not to mentioned he was a bigger fighter than all of those guys

grassrootsphilosopher

with Hagler, Leonard, Hearns and Duran.

------------------
One Hundred.

Tyson/JCC rose to prominence in the wake of Marvin Hagler's retirement from the sport.

WHAT'S GOOD *****? What's REALLY good?!?!????!!! Ha HA!
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lightweights in their prime, so to say a group of mw's and super mw's would beat them doesn't reallymake sense.

also, i would argue that Duran, Leonard, and Hagler all have better resumes than any of the other group's members.

>lightweights in their prime, so to say a group of mw's and
>super mw's would beat them doesn't reallymake sense.
>

Hearns and Leonard fight at 154 in their prime. Duran was around for a while before making the move to welterweight, and still had a lot of fight left so I am not buying that arguement. Norris, Brown, McCallum, and Jackson all fought at 154.


>also, i would argue that Duran, Leonard, and Hagler all have
>better resumes than any of the other group's members.

Don't discredit the group after this era. They all fought each other and that is a good enough résumé for me. If we can look at the fight between Mugabi and Hagler, that was a tough fight for Hagler. The era after him made Mugabi look like a bum in the ring.

Awesome


does it really matter?

for all my fans who keep my name in their mouth: http://i.imgur.com/v2xNOpS.jpg

Him alone trumps any of those bums on your side of the argument.

Then add Hagler and Ray Leonard, cmon.


McCallum, GTFOH!



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>Him alone trumps any of those bums on your side of the
>argument.
>
>Then add Hagler and Ray Leonard, cmon.
>
>
>McCallum, GTFOH!
>
>

Apparently you know nothing about the sport. None of the Four Kings would survive the era that came after them.