"LOL, so heads hatin on Tim Burton on PTP now!?!!" Tue Mar-09-10 02:50 PM by astralblak
haven't seen Alice yet, but this is his catalogue to me:
Sweeney Todd - @@@ 1/2; if it werent for the over the top musical aspect, i would've enjoyed it more Corpse's Bride - @@@@ great. Charlie & The Chocolate Factory - @@@ 1/2; never understood the hate for this film Big Fish - @@@; it was aight, visually great though Planet of the Apes - @@; just not good Sleepy Hollow - @@@@; one of my favorites Mars Attacks - Haven't Seen Ed Wood - @@ 1/2 Deep is the only redeeming value of that film, but for some reason i think Burton made a bad film, because that's what ed wood made Batman Returns - lets just forget about this Edward Scisssorhand - @@@@; still a great story Batman - @@@; its really corny now Beetlejuice - @@@ 1/2; caught on TV the other day and it's still the shit Pee Wee's Big Adventure - havent seen since i was a kid
1. "RE: LOL, so heads hatin on Tim Burton on PTP now!?!!" In response to Reply # 0
>haven't seen Alice yet, but this is his catalogue to me: > >Sweeney Todd - @@@ 1/2; if it werent for the over the top >musical aspect, i would've enjoyed it more Well it was a musical so I don't know how you get rid of the over the top musical aspect.
>Batman - @@@; its really corny now >Beetlejuice - @@@ 1/2; caught on TV the other day and it's >still the shit >Pee Wee's Big Adventure - havent seen since i was a kid I enjoyed all three of these but in general his whole pancake-makeup, goth-kid, Hot Topic aesthetic just doesn't appeal to me.
3. "that is a rather ridiculous criticism." In response to Reply # 1
>>haven't seen Alice yet, but this is his catalogue to me: >> >>Sweeney Todd - @@@ 1/2; if it werent for the over the top >>musical aspect, i would've enjoyed it more >Well it was a musical so I don't know how you get rid of the >over the top musical aspect.
An adaptation of a musical has an over-the-top musical aspect? Imagine that.
14. "my bad, let me explain" In response to Reply # 3
im not really a fan or musicals, but some do work. mostly, I just wish there wasn't so much sung dialogue, just a couple here and there. the bombast of musicals is what usually keeps them out my year end favorites or repeat viewings
22. "only musicals like that are Golden Age films or Disney films" In response to Reply # 14
where they have like 5 or six songs in an 80-minute runtime.
Virtually every *other* film musical made since, say, 1960 has well over a dozen songs, many of them back to back with brief dialogue scenes, so just say you don't like musicals period.
2. " I like a lot of his work, but these need to be addressed. " In response to Reply # 0 Tue Mar-09-10 03:26 PM by bignick
>Charlie & The Chocolate Factory - @@@ 1/2; never understood >the hate for this film
It's an awful remake of a classic movie. That's why the hate.
>Planet of the Apes - @@; just not good
How are you gonna remake a movie from 30 years ago and the FX are worse? Tim Roth is the only person who shouldn't be embarrassed to be associated with that movie. Awful.
batman returns and apes were awful. that @@ was generous in retrospect.
as far Charlie goes, I don't think it was an awful remake, it was an alternative take: one that was much weirder and creepier. it lost a lot of the charm and morality of the OG, but it had its own voice. I liked it.
8. "And that's the problem." In response to Reply # 5
Not that he's the only guy to do this but he's basically never really grown as a filmmaker IMO. He knocked it out of the park in his first few films and then has been remaking that theme over and over again. At first it was like "Oh man, what a new and unusual vision this guy has" and now it's "Oh here's that same exact vision from this guy."
He's still a great director but I'd like to see him move in a new direction.
12. "yeah, I can't really disagree with any of that n/m" In response to Reply # 8
>Not that he's the only guy to do this but he's basically >never really grown as a filmmaker IMO. He knocked it out of >the park in his first few films and then has been remaking >that theme over and over again. At first it was like "Oh man, >what a new and unusual vision this guy has" and now it's "Oh >here's that same exact vision from this guy." > >He's still a great director but I'd like to see him move in a >new direction.
15. "I respect this analysis" In response to Reply # 8
and its intersting because until I looked at his filmography, I never realized that his films have literally been with me throughout my entire life. I think spike is the only other director I can say this of. so I may have an unacknowledged nostalgia with his films. but I guess his aesthetic/vision is what I want to see when he drops a new film, so I don't end up disappointed
27. "My thoughts exactly..." In response to Reply # 8
Not that most directors don't eventually settle into a "shtick," but his is particularly predictable and boring at this point. If you would've asked me 10 years ago who was gonna do a "twisted" remake of "Charlie & the Chocolate Factory" and "Alice In Wonderland," I could've predicted Tim Burton. And if you asked who he would cast in the lead role in both, I would've predicted Johnny Depp, too. But when he crafts a vision that is more or less completely his own -- rather than taking a classic story and gothifying it -- he usually does a good job.
Frank Longo Member since Nov 18th 2003 86673 posts
Tue Mar-09-10 04:39 PM
6. "VERY perplexing grades you've given." In response to Reply # 0
How do you have these...
>Corpse's Bride - @@@@ great. >Charlie & The Chocolate Factory - @@@ 1/2; never understood >the hate for this film >Sleepy Hollow - @@@@; one of my favorites
...over these?
>Big Fish - @@@; it was aight, visually great though >Ed Wood - @@ 1/2 Deep is the only redeeming value of that >film, but for some reason i think Burton made a bad film, >because that's what ed wood made >Batman - @@@; its really corny now
i caught Big Fish a couple of years after all the critical acclaim and i went in with high expectations, and I found the story to be dull. not to add that i typically tune out of moralizing white narratives about adventure, and growing old. im a bit of a bigot in that sense
ed wood was awful. i saw it for the first time in 2006, because it had Deep and i got amped when i found Burton directed it. and i was very disappointed. the first 30mins i was captivated, than i was just viscerally terrorized by the film.
9. "I ranked them in order with some other friends." In response to Reply # 0
BIG FISH PEE WEE'S BIG ADVENTURE ED WOOD ALICE IN WONDERLAND BEETLEJUICE MARS ATTACKS! EDWARD SCISSORHANDS BATMAN PLANET OF THE APES -tied with- CHARLIE AND THE CHOCOLATE FACTORY -tied with- SLEEPY HOLLOW BATMAN RETURNS
ALICE through SCISSORHANDS are interchangeable on any given day. That's just how I feel at the moment. Still never saw SWEENEY or CORPSE, and I won't count NIGHTMARE, because that, to me, is Selick's vision.
Frank Longo Member since Nov 18th 2003 86673 posts
Tue Mar-09-10 06:40 PM
10. "Off the top, I'd go:" In response to Reply # 9
>PEE WEE'S BIG ADVENTURE >ED WOOD >BIG FISH >BEETLEJUICE >EDWARD SCISSORHANDS >MARS ATTACKS! >BATMAN >BATMAN RETURNS >CORPSE BRIDE >SLEEPY HOLLOW >CHARLIE AND THE CHOCOLATE >FACTORY >PLANET OF THE APES
19. "I really don't like that movie." In response to Reply # 16
I like Keaton and Pfieffer's performances, but hate everything else about it. I hate the Burton-esqe Circus Folk. Hate the penguins with missiles on their backs. I hate Max Shrek and his kid. But most importantly, Burton's idea of the Penguin is beyond stupid to me.
I would go as far as to say I like BATMAN FOREVER more than I like RETURNS.
18. "Cmon, let's rank these shits" In response to Reply # 0 Tue Mar-09-10 07:27 PM by ZooTown74
Pee Wee's Big Adventure - Still his best.
Ed Wood - Depp and Landau and Bill Murray. Cmon.
Sweeney Todd - Blood and songs; the high point of his goth period, time to move on, bro
Batman Returns - NOPE, it's seriously underrated.
Mars Attacks - 50's fetish kitsch done Burton style.
Batman - Cmon, if Nolan's joints weren't so goddamn fresh we'd still be celebrating these shits. Now they're called "dated" and "corny." *smh*
Beetlejuice - Still fun and goofy.
Edward Scissorhands - Beautiful and sad, but too sad for me. Speaking of which,
Big Fish - Beautiful and sad and DULL.
Sleepy Hollow - Deep does goofy Ichabod. Might be better than this ranking but I haven't seen it in awhile so it goes here, and it HAS to undoubtedly be MUCH better than
Planet of the Apes - BOW YOUR HEADS! How about no.
Edward Scissorhands, Beetle Juice, Love Mars Attacks...everything else is eh.
I feel like it is the same style, same feel. No real diversity in his movies. And I really dont dig helen bonham carter.
On that note. Just saw Big Fish recently, long overdue, and loved the hell out of it. Really just thought the whole thing was brilliant. So I think he can be great. Just chooses to keep on the same tried path of his.
31. "Pee Wee's Big Adventure is in my all time Top 25" In response to Reply # 0
It was his Illmatic.
I've been trying to tell anyone that would listen that his movies have been no good for over 10 years.
He has at least four certifiables: PWBA Ed Scissorhands Beetlejuice Batman
Three good ones Ed Wood Sleepy Hollow Mars Attacks!
The rest is blah or garbage and were made in the last decade. He made all of his good movies in the 80s and 90s.
>haven't seen Alice yet, but this is his catalogue to me: > >Sweeney Todd - @@@ 1/2; if it werent for the over the top >musical aspect, i would've enjoyed it more >Corpse's Bride - @@@@ great. >Charlie & The Chocolate Factory - @@@ 1/2; never understood >the hate for this film >Big Fish - @@@; it was aight, visually great though >Planet of the Apes - @@; just not good >Sleepy Hollow - @@@@; one of my favorites >Mars Attacks - Haven't Seen >Ed Wood - @@ 1/2 Deep is the only redeeming value of that >film, but for some reason i think Burton made a bad film, >because that's what ed wood made >Batman Returns - lets just forget about this >Edward Scisssorhand - @@@@; still a great story >Batman - @@@; its really corny now >Beetlejuice - @@@ 1/2; caught on TV the other day and it's >still the shit >Pee Wee's Big Adventure - havent seen since i was a kid
we just dont agree, because ive dug sweeny, corpse's and charlie. but i hear the criticism that its all visually and thematically bleeding into each other
33. "yo fuck ANYONE trying to shit on the first Batman" In response to Reply # 0
I mean sincerely and truly. The movie was in NINETEEN EIGHTY NINE YOU JACKOFFS. It changed the ENTIRE FUCKING GAME for comic book hero movies FOREVER. it was the first time batman donned all black, and the first time a superhero has ever been portrayed darkly. seriously i was on that movie like a fiend but it was fucking fire and i'll smack someone with a brick for trying to say otherwise.
batman returns was a drop off, but it wasn't a bad movie either. the franchise was still alive until joel schumacher took hold dat shit.
38. "im not going to disagree with any of that" In response to Reply # 33
but some art, just doesn't stand the test of time and some of Batman is just corny now. Burton even said he wanted to maintain some of the kitch elements in the series for his movies. muhfuckas act like a 3/5 is a saying shit is wack. it means its good
40. "this is my last comment on this thing" In response to Reply # 38
>but some art, just doesn't stand the test of time and some of >Batman is just corny now. it's extremely hard to find ANY comic book flick that doesn't involve SOME corn, that's part of the point. but it's also like extremely silly to debase something moreso because of similar works that it has preceded, when special effects and technology will ALWAYS go forward.
Burton even said he wanted to >maintain some of the kitch elements in the series for his >movies. muhfuckas act like a 3/5 is a saying shit is wack. it >means its good
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