"Poll question: Who had the better debut solo out of the NWA clique?"
After having watched HBO's "The Defiant Ones" about Dr. Dre and Jimmy Iovine, I started thinking about DOC's place in the pantheon. His solo debut album is most certainly one of the best displays of lyricism and rapping during that era. I remember, at the time, believing that he was the only one on par with Rakim.
"The Chronic" was left off because it was more of a compilation album than it was Dr. Dre's solo debut.
It's definitely between #1 and #3 for me. Right now though, I take DOC over Cube as a rapper.
Also learned during the documentary that DOC didn't want any cursing on his album and recorded as such because he wanted to prove that he was a serious MC. Maybe he was influenced by Rakim.
11. "I agree with this..." In response to Reply # 1
It's just that DOC came through the door by kicking it down.
It's the diggy-diggy-DOC y'all!
When Cube's solo dropped, his voice was known. DOC's wasn't. So maybe that plays a part in it for me as well. His lyricism and skill were so much different from what the other cats were giving us. My expectations, due to my love for Rakim and KRS at the time, weren't as high for West Coast rappers. Too Short and Ice T, who was one of my favorites as well, were the other big time West Coast rappers.
It seemed, at the time, that West Coast rappers had very simplistic rhymes and schemes. Seemingly still running with the pre-Run DMC styles. DOC came through on something far different from what the others were doing.
The bro was smooth and had the lyrical dexterity to finesse the shit out of Dre's beats. Everyone else prior to then seemed to labor at doing so.
dula dibiasi Member since Apr 05th 2004 21925 posts
Wed Jul-12-17 12:24 PM
15. "wrong spot." In response to Reply # 11 Wed Jul-12-17 12:25 PM by dula dibiasi
.
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it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes
dula dibiasi Member since Apr 05th 2004 21925 posts
Wed Jul-12-17 10:38 AM
2. "cube, and it isn't particularly close. lolz @ option 5." In response to Reply # 0
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it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes
Mind you, I pick Cube's too but I don't believe it's a longshot that DOC had the better album. NOCDIB may not be as culturally significant as AMW but quality-wise it's closer, IMO, than you seem to think.
7. "I think the cultural and sociopolitical impact is what separates them." In response to Reply # 4
From a strictly hip-hop sense, I don't really know how one could choose between the two albums (DOC's and Cube's, that is). Both are exceptional lyrically, both contain some of each production outfit's best career production (which is saying something).
But AmeriKKKa's ... has a staying power that No One ... lacks, based solely on the content. Cube was speaking to racial issues that are still alive today. So the album still resonates like few from that time period do.
No One ... is an amazing album lyrically and sonically, but it lacks AmeriKKKa's level of content.
dula dibiasi Member since Apr 05th 2004 21925 posts
Wed Jul-12-17 12:26 PM
16. "doc is dope. his album's fine." In response to Reply # 4
but amerikkka's most is on a very very short list.
>Why isn't it close though?
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it is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. - sherlock holmes
8. "I've always liked DOC and "No One Can Do It Better" ..." In response to Reply # 6 Wed Jul-12-17 11:28 AM by Brew
>Such a fucking tragedy.
But recently, probably because of the Straight Outta Compton movie as well as the Defiant Ones doc, I've been sadder than ever about DOC's situation. It's so sad. The guy could've gone on to be one of the all time greats but instead we just have one single album. And each time I see the guy get interviewed it makes me even more sad cause you can see in his eyes how disappointed he is about how everything turned out.
Obviously he's left his mark, for those of us in the know about his VAST contributions to the careers of everyone from Dre to Snoop to Eminem and so on ..... but somehow that doesn't make me feel any better anymore LOL. We lost sooooo much great music that would've come from DOC and Dre pushing eachother .... fuck, man.
9. "During The Defiant Ones, I was hurting for the dude..." In response to Reply # 8
>>Such a fucking tragedy. > >But recently, probably because of the Straight Outta Compton >movie as well as the Defiant Ones doc, I've been sadder than >ever about DOC's situation. It's so sad. The guy could've gone >on to be one of the all time greats but instead we just have >one single album. And each time I see the guy get interviewed >it makes me even more sad cause you can see in his eyes how >disappointed he is about how everything turned out.
Did you see his face when there was a few minutes focused on him and his story? That was definitely sad. Shit touched me to my core. Seriously, he was the only dude at that time who I believed could challenge Rakim for supremacy. And for it all to just be taken so suddenly from him was devastating. It was like the first hip-hop tragedy I had to deal with.
And when he referred to having to stand to the side while the core NWA members were being interviewed was seemingly gut-wrenching to him. probably because he fashioned himself to be a serious MC while Eazy was just playing the part and getting all the success.
>Did you see his face when there was a few minutes focused on >him and his story? That was definitely sad. Shit touched me to >my core. Seriously, he was the only dude at that time who I >believed could challenge Rakim for supremacy. And for it all >to just be taken so suddenly from him was devastating. It was >like the first hip-hop tragedy I had to deal with. > >And when he referred to having to stand to the side while the >core NWA members were being interviewed was seemingly >gut-wrenching to him. probably because he fashioned himself to >be a serious MC while Eazy was just playing the part and >getting all the success.
That's what made me the saddest for sure. Because it's so clear that the dude *still* isn't at peace with everything that's happened. It's so devastating cause he genuinely seems like a good dude.
12. "At peace with it..." In response to Reply # 10 Wed Jul-12-17 12:05 PM by Creole
>That's what made me the saddest for sure. Because it's so >clear that the dude *still* isn't at peace with everything >that's happened. It's so devastating cause he genuinely seems >like a good dude. > >Ugh.
That's it right there. It did seem like he isn't yet at peace. I'm hopeful he handled his business correctly though. I'm hopeful he's able to collect serious coin from his writing/publishing on those NWA joints, the Dre joints, and anything else he could. Maybe that would lessen the sting of it all if not necessarily remove it.
20. "Sad to think what DOC's 2nd album would've been" In response to Reply # 8
Looking at Cube's progress from AMW to DC (lyrically, concepts, flow, beats, everything) Just imagine what could've come after No One Can Do It Better shit just hurts
Then again, maybe DOC would've got on some death row g-funk I'll kill your whole family shit look at him in the g-thang video: the weed hat, the fridge full of 40's, the Impala, etc
I don't know, Suge probably would've poisoned his mind too
21. "Yea it's hard to predict for sure. But ..." In response to Reply # 20
>Then again, maybe DOC would've got on some death row g-funk >I'll kill your whole family shit >look at him in the g-thang video: the weed hat, the fridge >full of 40's, the Impala, etc
I don't really hold that against him. Chances are good that I'd have gone all "fuck the world," too had I gone through what he went through, know what I mean ? Hard to keep that same "no cursing, I'm a real MC" mindstate when you can't even talk anymore nevermind make albums.
25. "He has 2 more albums after nocdib" In response to Reply # 20
Helter Skelter had dope production and Doc rapped with his scratchy voice. It's a decent album. Deuce came out later and was more of a compilation with Doc introducing the tracks and doing spoken poetry on one track. It has an NWA reunion song and is overall a solid album.
I feel bad for him too because MC Breed was his close friend and they did a lot of work together and we lost him several years ago.
He is a genuine nice guy, he always responds to his fans on twitter and is quite honest too.
26. "that Shock of the Hour was a good album too" In response to Reply # 0
The production was a perfect compliment to the shit he was talking, that was one of the few tapes that got banned around my house. And on the low, Kizz My Black Azz is one of the dopest Hip Hop EPs ever.
I used get my top popped by this white girl around that time and I would put Fuck What Ya Heard on repeat and point at her head on beat during the chorus. She used to love that shit.
__________________________________________ CHOP-THESE-BITCHES!!!! ------------------------------------ Garhart Ivanhoe Poppwell Un-OK'd moderator for The Lesson and Make The Music (yes, I do's work up in here, and in your asscrease if you run foul of this
28. "There was a time when Cube was the best rapper on the planet" In response to Reply # 0
Now, I absolutely love DOC and No One Can Do It Better. But Cube was killing people with a freaking EP.
Got to go with O'Shea on this one.
<-- Dave Thomas knows what's up... __________________________
Jay: Look here homie, any nigga can get a hit record. This here is about respect. Game: Like Gladys Knight. Jay: Aretha Franklin. Game: Word, I like her too. Jay: Nigga...
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