The sampler/drum machine wars have been very interesting to watch in recent years. Native Instruments and Ableton being brought to the forefront definitely upped the competition, which is ultimately a win for the consumer (as this means that everybody has to bring their A game in order to keep up).
That was sort of an area where Akai fell by the wayside for a minute there. Thing is, it seems like so many people have converted over (or started with) the other two brands...it seems unlikely that they will get anyone to come back. Plus, while the notion of working on a standalone device is very dope, there are few situations in 2017 where I would think it would be an advantage to not have your computer in the mix.
That said, I would love to play with this and see what it's like firsthand.
2. "don't count out standalone units so quickly" In response to Reply # 1
Not having to worry about moving things to a computer, or hooking up a sequencer to one at all, is pretty convenient. If this thing is a true hybrid it would be a great look.
__________________________________________ CHOP-THESE-BITCHES!!!! ------------------------------------ Garhart Ivanhoe Poppwell Un-OK'd moderator for The Lesson and Make The Music (yes, I do's work up in here, and in your asscrease if you run foul of this
7. "You may be right about standalone, but these are hybrid" In response to Reply # 1
IMO that makes them much more attractive.
I don't want to be tied to my computer but I do want hardware control products that offer tight integration when I work with software. This gives you strong offerings on both fronts.
One incredibly strong selling point of Yamaha's MOXF line is that you get 16 audio channels within Cubase, treating the MOXF like a VST while offering a fair amount of hardware control.
Even a pure standalone that contains an audio/midi interface and offers, say 8 channels of USB audio at once at a minimum could be a killer app.
9. "read on mpc forums you cant host VST with the X or Live" In response to Reply # 7 Tue Jan-10-17 07:31 PM by liveguy
They could be wrong...
I have a Touch so once I have that 2.0 update, I will be more than happy with that...though that X looks REAL dope....Live does too, but that Live is just a standalone Touch.
Akai stepped their game up a lot...
Live - $1,100 X - $2,100
Gotta pay to play.
2.0 is free if you own a Touch....HAPPY AS HELL ABOUT THAT!
We see through all that boo boo like it's ghost shit... (c) Quelle Chris
10. "That's only offline, i.e, in standalone mode. These are hybrids. " In response to Reply # 9 Tue Jan-10-17 08:21 PM by Cold Truth
This is a "best of both worlds" proposition.
Have your cake and eat it too.
Plug up and work with your vst's. You have 8 audio tracks in standalone and 128 when it's plugged in.
Away from a pc for while, on vacation or what have you?
Render your vst tracks to .wavs, put it on a thumb or sd card and work on other elements while you're away.
Hell it even has a rechargeable battery for standalone mode.
You got the bubble guts? You could, conceivably, work wirellessly on the toilet. It's gross but possible. Lol.
You could spend an afternoon at Golden Corral and bang out beats from your pc session between buffet trips.
Or hammer out beats while you're wife drives on something other than a Boss DR x0x.
Whoever informed you got it backwards: this isn't a standalone touch, this is Touch if it had standalone. Word is the touch screen had better response too.
13. "RE: That's only offline, i.e, in standalone mode. These are hybrids. " In response to Reply # 10
For me personally, this is exactly what I've been waiting for and it's finally here.
>This is a "best of both worlds" proposition. > >Have your cake and eat it too. > >Plug up and work with your vst's. >You have 8 audio tracks in standalone and 128 when it's >plugged in. > >Away from a pc for while, on vacation or what have you? > >Render your vst tracks to .wavs, put it on a thumb or sd card >and work on other elements while you're away. > >Hell it even has a rechargeable battery for standalone mode. > >You got the bubble guts? You could, conceivably, work >wirellessly on the toilet. It's gross but possible. Lol. > >You could spend an afternoon at Golden Corral and bang out >beats from your pc session between buffet trips. > >Or hammer out beats while you're wife drives on something >other than a Boss DR x0x. > >Whoever informed you got it backwards: this isn't a standalone >touch, this is Touch if it had standalone. Word is the touch >screen had better response too.
15. "I know that" In response to Reply # 14 Wed Jan-11-17 01:16 PM by liveguy
I already own a Touch and have no intention of buying X or Live anytime soon...hence....all I want is the 2.0 update...that's all i really care about at this point.
We see through all that boo boo like it's ghost shit... (c) Quelle Chris
12. "i have the basics down..." In response to Reply # 11
But definitely prefer the MPC workflow 1000 times over...
I can make a full beat in my MPC in 15 minutes...
Takes me way longer in Ableton...but I'm a newb with Ableton, so that should get better as I learn more.
That said...Ableton is dope and once I get the samples in, I can build from there.
It's possible to get to the MPC style workflow, but you have to really know Ableton to get there.
Youtube University helps.
I'm uber newb with that shit so I'm still learning ableton, and it has little things it does that MPC's used to not be able to do, BUT 2.0 is gonna change a lot of that.
Gonna be interesting once 2.0 drops on how I feel about even wanting to continue the Ableton learning curve.
Could be using that time making music instead....
We'll see...
Tho....Ableton will undoubtedly up the ante sooner than later.
We see through all that boo boo like it's ghost shit... (c) Quelle Chris
18. "Man both of those were zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz" In response to Reply # 16
One thing I've learned over the last 18 years is these companies rarely produce exciting product demos.
It's like they fear boom bap or something.
If they really wanted to blow it out they would have brought in Just Blaze, Pete, and Toomp and given us ten minute discussions on top of a five minute demo.
31. "Yep, I'm not sure what the hell they think they're selling with that" In response to Reply # 30
You should check out Masada Trent's youtube. He's a beta tester and did a live Q&A that did a great job answering people's questions. There's infinitely more value in that then these cheesy ass beat demos.
>You should check out Masada Trent's youtube. He's a beta >tester and did a live Q&A that did a great job answering >people's questions. There's infinitely more value in that then >these cheesy ass beat demos.
21. "Class compliance=plug & play USB without extra drivers" In response to Reply # 20
It means that the product can be plugged in and ready to use without any additional drivers.
So instead of having to use your computer to add additional audio in/out, you can just plug it up to your MPC it becomes another major feature of standalone.
Class compliance also applies to controllers.
So if the report is correct, you could add a controller like the Nektar P1/4/6
which is one of the deepest midi DAW controllers on the market could be plugged up to give you deeper control with multiple faders, knobs and buttons.
then you could plug in audio interface to add a few more I/O.
You'd basically have a very similar setup to a PC daw in a standalone unit, albeit with a limit of 8 audio tracks and and no offline VST's.
It's a pretty dope feature. I know my Kronos can add controllers such as an MPD 32 via USB.
There may be limitations based on power consumption or older controllers that lack USB 3.0 capabilities with their firmware or whatever. To be able to do that with an audio interface is an extra level.
>It means that the product can be plugged in and ready to use >without any additional drivers. > >So instead of having to use your computer to add additional >audio in/out, you can just plug it up to your MPC it becomes >another major feature of standalone. > >Class compliance also applies to controllers. > >So if the report is correct, you could add a controller like >the Nektar P1/4/6 > >http://www.nektartech.com/panorama-p1.html ) > >which is one of the deepest midi DAW controllers on the market >could be plugged up to give you deeper control with multiple >faders, knobs and buttons. > >then you could plug in audio interface to add a few more I/O. > > >You'd basically have a very similar setup to a PC daw in a >standalone unit, albeit with a limit of 8 audio tracks and and >no offline VST's. > >It's a pretty dope feature. I know my Kronos can add >controllers such as an MPD 32 via USB. > >There may be limitations based on power consumption or older >controllers that lack USB 3.0 capabilities with their firmware >or whatever. To be able to do that with an audio interface is >an extra level.
22. "So what's a legit argument for buy the X vs. Ableton and a controller?" In response to Reply # 0
I mean is it really worth buying a new MPC at this point? I understand the notion that nothing sounds like an MPC 60/3000, but what's the justification for dropping 2 grand on something that software can do at a fraction of the price when it probably doesn't provide any of the color that legacy hardware did?
32. "That's a loaded question. Standalone mode is the obvious, " In response to Reply # 22
as has been stated
I've never used Push but the fanbase for that is perhaps the most passionate and rabid group of consumer evangelist in the production game since the MPC 2KXL.
So if that's what you rock and you're 100% happy with it I don't see an argument for you to switch up outside of standalone functionality.
One thing I'll say about the Live and X is that it's brought out a lot of old school MPC heads who haven't been all that excited for the hardware software controllers and those of us who did adopt that newer tech are perhaps even more excited.
This is new territory. This is something that's gone above and beyond to please many masters in a way we haven't seen since the MC 8800.
42. "... and now I'm really considering getting this thing" In response to Reply # 22
In my quest to fully convert to something new (my MPC 1000 is dying and I don't really care to resurrect it) and my inability to work productive out of the SP404 as a standalone workstation, I was thinking "man I should really look at Ableton Live with this Korg controller I have". But... I just can't really get into it. I was so desperate to find out how to make it work like my MPC did as far as getting a sample/chop/program workflow going but it seems like that software is built for something different. This MPC X seems like it can really be an all-in-one workstation and I can probably still keep my 404 as a live performance tool.
I dunno, I think my original post underestimated the importance of a workflow for the type of music that I want to make, and Ableton does seem to accommodate that at all as of yet.
Anybody else been able to replicate a good, MPC-like workflow from software w/ a controller? I still sample from vinyl, btw, so recording into the computer will probably require an additional component along with this controller.
45. "RE: ... and now I'm really considering getting this thing" In response to Reply # 42
>Anybody else been able to replicate a good, MPC-like workflow >from software w/ a controller? I still sample from vinyl, btw, >so recording into the computer will probably require an >additional component along with this controller.
...i use ableton live and a push and a midi keyboard with an audio interface To sample from vinyl you'd definitely need an audio interface... There are customised drum rack presets for Ableton floating around the internet that can make it more MPC like...Ski Beatz had a link to one he built on his youtube channel years ago....I downloaded it then. I think he deaded the link at some point.... I can't judge how MPC like it is because I've never used an MPC but it's pretty cool... I now use a modified version of it to do my chopping..
That's the beauty of programs like Ableton though...it's totally customisable...the learning curve is a bit steep but once you get the basics...it opens so many doors..I don't know any two people who use it the same.
37. "can it load files from older MPCs? " In response to Reply # 0
that's going to be a big question that I haven't seen asked yet.
__________________________________________ CHOP-THESE-BITCHES!!!! ------------------------------------ Garhart Ivanhoe Poppwell Un-OK'd moderator for The Lesson and Make The Music (yes, I do's work up in here, and in your asscrease if you run foul of this
39. "I'd think it would be a standard feature on anything by now" In response to Reply # 38
because the tech is to the point that it can be done easily, and it also widens the customer base. If you want people still uaing 3ks and 60s to buy your new stuff, at least give them access to stuff they already have in use.
__________________________________________ CHOP-THESE-BITCHES!!!! ------------------------------------ Garhart Ivanhoe Poppwell Un-OK'd moderator for The Lesson and Make The Music (yes, I do's work up in here, and in your asscrease if you run foul of this
Dj Joey Joe Member since Sep 01st 2007 13770 posts
Mon Jan-23-17 10:58 AM
40. "I'm Cool With My 2000XL" In response to Reply # 0
Yeah it's got a ton of features that I would love to get a hold of but know it's not going to happen with the old machines but I don't have money like that anymore to but throwing $3000 on the counter all willy nilly.
--------- "We in here talking about later career Prince records & your fool ass is cruising around in a time machine trying to collect props for a couple of sociopathic degenerates" - s.blak
46. "Anyone still rocking SP303/SP404 samplers? Lately I'm Ableton+404" In response to Reply # 0
I was on Maschine+Logic for a while but I switched Logic for Ableton just to learn something new and Maschine+Ableton felt a lil redundant to me (plus my Maschine has some dead pads)
I run 2 outputs into my SP404 and then the output of the 404 goes back into Ableton, so it's effectively as an outboard fx/pedal box as well as a straight up sampler. I'm really liking it.
Plus the 404 runs on batteries so it's been fun banging out beats/sketches when I'm traveling light
49. "RE: Akai announces the MPC Live & X today both standalone. We copping?" In response to Reply # 0
Its really hard to go back...
I never had the 2000xl so my jump was from MPC 60II -> Reason -> Ableton
and I just cant look back (still want a 60II though for "sound")
There are endless ideas and opportunities within Ableton (and a controller) that it just makes no sense to really deal with anything else...
Standalone as an idea is cool but i've only had 2 real huge issues with a computer in a live setting and they were because of (an unplugged external HD) or an unplugged usb cable..
The Push has made it so you can treat the device as a standalone unit and rarely look onscreen ..
So ionno..
Also hate these m-audio (same company) looking MPC's
What I am truly interested in though is the Kontrol series by NI. Being able to access and load plug ins on the keyboard is definitely a benefit.
Double 0 DJ/Producer/Artist Producer in Kidz In The Hall ------------------------------------------- twitter: @godouble0 IG: @godouble0 www.thinklikearapper.com
52. "Depends on your VST collection" In response to Reply # 51
There's definitely a growing cache of VST's with the NKS format, but unless you're using those VST's as your primary source you'll find Kontrol to be somewhat disappointing. By and large a Nektar Panorama is a much better buy than KK IMO.
53. "RE: Depends on your VST collection" In response to Reply # 52
It seemed more customizable than it is. I kinda like to start with the weird shit I've downloaded for Massive, but it doesn't like my 3rd party presets. I need more time to play and mix & match synths and VST's to see what works.
56. "IMO this is a marketing issue. People don't seem to realize it's a hybri..." In response to Reply # 55
I get that they really wanted to market directly to those who have been begging for a standalone unit but there seems to be a fairly widespread impression that it's standalone only and not the true hybrid it actually is.
I can't tell if it's because people stop reading or listening at "standalone" or if the marketing simply neglects the hybrid aspect of things a little too much.
57. "Right, I don't get it." In response to Reply # 56
>I get that they really wanted to market directly to those who >have been begging for a standalone unit but there seems to be >a fairly widespread impression that it's standalone only and >not the true hybrid it actually is. > >I can't tell if it's because people stop reading or listening >at "standalone" or if the marketing simply neglects the hybrid >aspect of things a little too much.
64. "RE: It's not like "going back" to a 60 or something lol" In response to Reply # 55
It is in the simple fact that you cant do what you can do in Ableton...
Ableton's ability for sound manipulation is unmatched amongst DAWs..
Even Pro Tools is a half a step back imo
Double 0 DJ/Producer/Artist Producer in Kidz In The Hall ------------------------------------------- twitter: @godouble0 IG: @godouble0 www.thinklikearapper.com
I'm not that familiar with Ableton, can you give me an example of it's sound manipulation capabilities?
>It is in the simple fact that you cant do what you can do in >Ableton... > >Ableton's ability for sound manipulation is unmatched amongst >DAWs.. > >Even Pro Tools is a half a step back imo >
58. "copped my Live yesterday." In response to Reply # 0
Got the 2 year warranty.
Put a hard drive in it. will load it with my sounds asap. Fucked around with 2.0 Beta for a bit. Not bad. Only gripe about it is that it wont let you export exploded tracks in song mode..only sequences.
One of the things that attracted me to the Live (and 2.0) is the workflow. I don't use a heavy amount of VST instruments. For instance, I have a few outside small hardware pieces to that I play live over drums and samples....MicroKORG XL, Boss Dr-303. With the Live, I don't have to worry about a computer in the way. The Looper and Live Tracks features are dope for my style of production workflow.
And I use Acid as my mixdown DAW for the beat tracks and vocals. The way I can just explode tracks to a USB drive, then throw it on my computer when I'm ready is HUGE for me.
66. "Anyone cop? Anyone play with both the X and Live? " In response to Reply # 0
I'm strongly considering the X over the Live.
It's a steep price but the workflow with so many dedicated buttons vs the menu diving of Live seems like a worthwhile addition, plus the preamps and two additional inputs since I'll be using an external keyboard with it.
But I don't know. None of the shops out here have either for demo.
I've got a good two months before I have to decide so I'm hoping I can get someone hands on time before then.
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