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mrhood75
Member since Dec 06th 2004
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Wed Oct-29-14 04:04 PM

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"When the Purple Rain came falling down (Long SWIPE)"


  

          

Or how Prince fucked off much of his good will at what was seen as the zenith of his career.

The following is an excerpt from Alan Leeds book about the making of the "Purple Rain" album. Didn't see it posted before, so I'm posting it now:

https://medium.com/cuepoint/when-purple-rain-came-falling-down-2f0babc363b9

When “Purple Rain” Came Falling Down
At the apex of his success, Prince made a high-profile decision that damaged his reputation for years

Following the success of the Purple Rain film and soundtrack—which made Prince the first person in US history to have the number one album, single, and movie in the country simultaneously—anticipation for the tour was at a fever pitch. Ultimately, Prince and the Revolution would perform just shy of a hundred shows in five months, from late 1984 into the spring of 1985, selling 1.7 million tickets.

Initially, the mood surrounding the tour was triumphant. “At first, everybody was sharing the quest,” says tour manager Alan Leeds. But soon enough, Prince was ready to move on to his next project, and he started lashing out at those around him. “Things started cracking during the tour,” according to Revolution guitarist Wendy Melvoin.

“I was doing the seventy-fifth Purple Rain show, doing the same thing over and over,” Prince would later say. “And I just lost it… I knew I had to get away from all that. I couldn’t play the game.” He abruptly cut off the tour, never taking it overseas, and quickly released the Around the World in a Day album, stopping the momentum of Purple Rain in its tracks.

In this excerpt from the upcoming Let’s Go Crazy: Prince and the Making of Purple Rain (Atria), author Alan Light describes the unraveling of the tour, including the very high-profile low point that damaged Prince’s reputation for years.


To those close to him, Prince was starting to display signs of his usual restlessness. “He was bored,” says Melvoin. “He gave it everything onstage, and he was always in that. But he was gone, he was uninterested, and he had moved on.”

“I think he kind of took things for granted for a minute there,” says Revolution keyboard player Lisa Coleman “and he’d never done that before.”

“Creatively, he was over it,” says Alan Leeds. “I’m sure it was fun playing the music for a while, but this is a guy who never stopped rehearsing, so they were all tired of playing the songs long before the tour started—they’d been playing them every day in rehearsals for a year, and the crew had been hearing them every day for a year.

“Also, there was a decision made to basically replicate the movie as much as possible. For the sake of the audience, that’s what you had to do; it’s what you were selling. A no-brainer. But what it also meant was a very constricting set, because the show was so theatrical, it left no room for spontaneity—in wardrobe, in choreography, or in the music. All the theatrical aspects of it made for a great production, but essentially it was a Broadway play with no give or take, with the exception of the encores, where he could stretch out. We paid a lot of overtime in a lot of buildings, because the only time of the night when he had any fun was the encores, which could go on for hours.”


One stunning example of the high points was the second night in Atlanta. Prince is in a buoyant mood, stopping and starting the Revolution like they were one of James Brown’s finest bands. He turns somersaults, brings out Jerome Benton to dance the Bird with him, and repeatedly teases a final exit during the encore, driving the audience further and further into a frenzy. “Chalk one up for the Kid!” he crows. “Now who gonna mess with us?” He may have been getting tired of the routine, but he could still whip himself and his musicians into something near perfection.

In the Los Angeles Times, though, Robert Hilburn—the respected critic who had conducted the final interview with Prince before Prince’s self-imposed media silence—skewered the show for its more staged aspects. “Prince became a near-parody of himself, pandering to the audience’s fascination with his sexy persona,” he wrote, expressing his concern that “Prince’s lame sexual posturing on the Purple Rain tour meant he was becoming the Bo Derek of rock.”

Nor was any of the touring party prepared for the security issues and general madness that would explode in each city they hit. “Your privacy level goes away,” says the Revolution’s other keyboardist, Matt (“Doctor”) Fink, “and you can’t get out of the hotel or you’re in a restaurant surrounded by people—they find out you’re there. We were in a mall in Atlanta, and Bruce Springsteen was hanging out that day in the mall, too, at the same time. He was incognito; he looked like a bum. We ran into him: ‘Hey, Bruce, how you doing, man?’ And then we went into a restaurant and somebody knew it was us and spread the word, and the next thing you know, there was a crowd outside blocking the door to get out of the restaurant. So that freaked me out.”

“Prince always acted as if ‘this is really going to blow up,’ but I don’t think even he thought about what that meant, how did that translate into day-to-day existence,” says Leeds. “The old-school in me only saw that within the parameters of the traditional music business—‘Okay, he’s gonna have a huge album, it’s gonna cross over, and we’re gonna play arenas.’ But not this, not closing motels and city streets.


Prince at the premiere of Purple Rain in Hollywood on July 27, 1984: he arrived in a purple stretch limo and, flanked by beefy bodyguards, sashayed down the carpet carrying a single rose
“We’re in D.C., staying at the Watergate, and Prince, as his habit was, had his hair styled—we’d find a salon that he could then rent out for the day, chase all the employees out, pay them off, and put newspaper in the windows and privatize it for an hour so he’d have the facilities. But somehow the word leaked—maybe the proprietor leaked it, because he’s no fool—and I’m sitting in the hotel with Gwen, my wife, who was my assistant on the tour, and somebody called and said, ‘You got the TV on? Well, turn on channel whatever,’ and it’s like every local station in D.C. had their trucks in front of the salon and Wisconsin Avenue was closed down. The police had closed the street, because the people had come out of every building and clogged the streets and the sidewalks! So, no, nobody anticipated that, nobody really thought that that’s what it was going to mean.”


As the new year of 1985 dawned, Prince also had to add a new round of performances and appearances to his schedule, since Purple Rain was nominated for a battery of awards. The album would win two Grammys—for Best Rock Performance by a Duo or Group and Best Album or Original Score Written for a Motion Picture or a Television Special—and, more incredibly, an Oscar for Best Original Song Score. (Apollonia Kotero later recalled that one night, after watching the Purple Rain dailies, she told Prince, “‘You know you’re going to get an Oscar for this movie—not for the acting, but for the music.’ He… slid off his chair, joking around, and said, ‘You think so?’ ”)

Each of these shows offered a new opportunity for Prince to make an international impression, which he took full advantage of. At the Grammys, his onstage entourage included a little person. At the Brit Awards, hulking bodyguard Big Chick joined him onstage. Prince wore a pink feather boa, and his entire acceptance speech was “All thanks to God. Good night.” When his name was announced at the Academy Awards, he grabbed Melvoin and Coleman, bringing them to the podium and handing off his trophy for Melvoin to hold.

“Of course, with Prince every TV appearance had to have something amazing or weird or shocking to stick out, so that’s what we would start focusing on at sound checks,” says Coleman. “We’d work out how to play ‘Baby I’m a Star’ or whatever on the next awards show. He put his energy into that—and I think he was having a great time. He had everything at his fingertips, and he started really planting a lot of seeds and he was riding high. He was pretty confident about everything—almost too cocky, in a lot of ways, and he kind of burst the bubble a little bit. Like, ‘I can do anything,’ ‘Muthafuckas will buy anything.’

“He had these personalities, and he could just get mean. There was a part of Prince that we called Steve, and that was the guy that you could bum around with.”

“That’s the guy you spent the night with, and ate grapes and went to the grocery store with, and he was adorable,” says Wendy Melvoin.

“He’d buy ice cream cones and wore sneakers,” says Coleman, “but the next minute, he’d be like ‘Hey, muthafuckas — ’ ” “He’d be fucking George Jefferson. And you’d be like, ‘Oh, God.’”

“I knew at that point that it was the beginning of the end,” says Susannah Melvoin. “He had found the thing that was going to throw him into the stratosphere of stardom, but also that he couldn’t stop. He became more moody, more superstitious, more compelled to keep his image solid and not break the mold, and that became confining. It’s hard to live on a day-to-day basis that way. He had to live and breathe this character, and it was like, ‘Who the fuck is that guy?’ Sometimes it could be really scary.”

Things came to a head on January 28, following the American Music Awards in Los Angeles, at which Prince was nominated for ten awards (Sheila E. had two nominations, and the Time picked up one, as well). A few days earlier, “Take Me with U” had been released as a single, the final single from Purple Rain; it was also the only one with another track from the album, an edit of “Baby I’m a Star,” as the B-side, and the only one to fall short of the Top Ten, peaking at number 25.


Prince holds up a gloved hand as he accepts an American Music Award for his single “When Doves Cry,” alongside members of his band
The night of the AMAs that year was a historic moment in the music business, when dozens of the world’s top recording artists, rather than going to parties or back on their tour buses after the ceremony, headed to Hollywood’s A&M studios to record the song “We Are the World” to benefit African relief efforts. Written by Michael Jackson and Lionel Richie, produced by Quincy Jones, and featuring the voices of such legends as Stevie Wonder, Bob Dylan, Ray Charles, and Bruce Springsteen, the song would become the fastest-selling single in U.S. history and serve as the climactic moment of the Live Aid concert in Philadelphia in July.

Prince had, of course, been approached to participate, but he passed and proposed a different kind of contribution to the project. “I was with Prince one day at his home studio, just the two of us,” says Susan Rogers, who engineered Purple Rain and Prince’s next few albums, “and he got a call from Quincy Jones asking him to come be part of ‘We Are the World.’ I only hear Prince’s side of the conversation—I was in the control room waiting—but he declined it. It was a long conversation, and Prince said, ‘Can I play guitar on it?’ And they said no, and he ultimately said, ‘Okay, well, can I send Sheila?’ And he sent Sheila. Then he said, ‘If there’s going to be an album, can I do a song for the album?’ And evidently they said yes.”

At the awards show, it was a whirlwind of logistics and scheduling; everyone was buzzing about what was planned for later in the evening. “They kept us so cloistered that a lot of information never would get to us,” says Coleman, “so I don’t remember even knowing about ‘We Are the World’ until that day, when everybody was talking about it backstage. Like, ‘We’ll see you tonight, right?’ And I was like, ‘What are they talking about?’”

“Prince was pissed,” says Wendy Melvoin. “He was like, ‘I don’t want to see any of you there, you’re not allowed to go there.’ ”

Until the last minute, Prince’s managers were still trying to persuade him to show up for the session. “At the American Music Awards, he keeps telling me the only thing he’ll do is play guitar,” says Bob Cavallo, one of Prince’s managers at the time and a producer of the Purple Rain movie. “So I call Quincy, and he says, ‘I don’t need him to fucking play guitar!’ and he got angry. I said, ‘All right, I don’t know, he’s not feeling well’—I start this whole campaign that he’s getting the flu. I say to Prince backstage, ‘I’m gonna say you’re sick—if you go out tonight and you’re seen, I can see the headlines: ‘Prince Parties While Rock Royalty Saves Millions’ or whatever the fuck they want to write. They suspect you anyway. You’ve got to stay home, ride it out, and be sick.’ ‘Okay,’ he says. (Prince and his entourage) go directly from the American Music Awards to some fucking club on Sunset. On their way out, his bodyguard—idiot guy—smacks somebody, the press picks it up, and that was it.”


Prince performs at the American Music Awards.
After Prince, who won three trophies and delivered a blistering performance of “Purple Rain,” left the awards ceremony, he and his entourage sped back to the Westwood Marquis hotel—at least for a while.

“We implore him, no matter what happens at the awards, we cannot go out in the streets and celebrate if you’re not going to go to A&M and show up for this,” says Leeds. “Fargnoli and I were like, ‘Dude, the eyes are on you, okay? You just cleaned up. The two biggest things on the planet tonight are this recording session and you, and everybody is going to want to know why that’s not one thing. So take your awards and keep your ass in the hotel. You cannot run the clubs the way you usually do, with two bodyguards, chasing girls. Not tonight, not while this is going on.’

“So that was good until about two in the morning. I think Bobby and his wife, Vicki, and me and Gwen were the last ones to leave his room. We stayed with him on purpose—but it was a big night, and he was on cloud nine. We left him around two, two-thirty in the morning, and at maybe four o’clock, four-thirty, the phone rings and it’s Chick. ‘Hey, buddy, better get back up!’ ‘What?’ ‘Well, we were at Carlos and Charlie’s, and Big Larry, the bodyguard, he’s in jail, the sheriff’s got him.’ I’ve had scandals on tour where musicians got busted and shit happens, but I’ve never read anything that was on page A1. It was just plain weird.”

The UPI wire service story led with the contrast between Prince’s problems that night and the good vibes of the “We Are the World” session: “Quick-fisted bodyguards provided a violent counterpoint to a night of international camaraderie.” Ken Kragen, one of the USA for Africa organizers, was quoted as saying that “the effort would have been much more marketable with Prince’s participation.” The Los Angeles Times later offered a pithy summary of public opinion, writing that Prince’s actions “led many to think of him as an arrogant jerk.”

It was left to others to try to pick up the pieces. “I was doing all these interviews at that time, and everybody wanted to know why he wasn’t there ,” says Wendy Melvoin. “I wasn’t allowed to say the real reason—which he would’ve gotten his fucking ass kicked hard for… I had to say, ‘We were in a mobile truck somewhere, he couldn’t make it, duh-de-duh.’ I knew there’s no way I can say, ‘Because he thinks he’s a badass and he wanted to look cool, and he felt like the song for “We Are the World” was horrible and he didn’t want to be around ‘all those muthafuckas.’ ”


Prince declined his invitation to join the epic gathering of music superstars recording “We Are The World” on January 28, 1985, at A&M Recording Studios in Hollywood
“It was horrible. He had us go to Carlos and Charlie’s and have a fucking party. I remember it perfectly, thinking, ‘This is so wrong. This is so wrong.’ We were embarrassed. Everybody in the band was horrified. And that’s where it felt like, there’s something shifting here, where he’s getting nasty. The entitlement—it was almost like a kid with too much candy.”

“I think he was just too self-involved,” says Coleman. “Even though he was reading all the magazines, he wasn’t reading Time magazine; he was reading music magazines and fashion magazines. So his view of the world, politics, or anything—he just didn’t know. He wasn’t in tune with that. That wasn’t his cause. He just became his own cause; the message went away.”


As bad a decision as it may have been to blow off the “We Are the World” recording, it is worth remembering that Prince was in the middle of a tour that included an ongoing charity component that raised $250,000 for Marva Collins’s work in Chicago and included multiple food drives and four free concerts for special-needs children. He would write a song, “Hello,” that would be released in July as the B-side to Around the World’s “Pop Life” and would present his side of the incident with the paparazzo.

When he spoke to MTV at the end of 1985, Prince offered something close to humility. “We had talked to the people that were doing USA for Africa, and they said it was cool that I gave them a song for the album,” he said. “It was the best thing for both of us, I think. I’m strongest in a situation where I’m surrounded by people I know. So it’s better that I did the music with my friends than going down and participating there. I probably would have just clammed up with so many great people in a room. I’m an admirer of all of the people who participated in that particular outing, and I don’t want there to be any hard feelings… The main thing says is that we’re against hungry children, and our record stands tall.”

Five days after the AMAs, following a sold-out show at the 80,000-plus-seat Superdome in New Orleans, he recorded “4 the Tears in Your Eyes,” the song he contributed to the USA for Africa album. “We had a mobile truck there, and Prince recorded the song during sound check,” says Susan Rogers. “As soon as the check was done, he came back into the truck and we stayed up all night, did the overdubs, finished it, mixed it. The next day we’re still there, we’ve been up all night, and he’s got another show to play. He was hungry, and he said, ‘Do you think you can find any food here?’ So I left the truck and went upstairs, and there were some people who were clearing out a room; they had catered a party and they had some leftover cold cuts and bread and pickles and chips and warm soda that they were going to throw out. I asked them if I could have some of it, and they said, ‘Yeah, help yourself,’ so I made up a couple of plates and I brought them back, and he and I had our leftover sandwiches and our warm soda, and we finished the track.

“A bit later, I remember reading in People magazine that at the ‘We Are the World’ session, they had champagne and caviar. In the papers, they had just torn Prince up: ‘How dare he? He doesn’t care about starving kids.’ And I thought, ‘No, actually, he was the one who went hungry on their behalf, who sat up all night and was happy to eat stale bread and warm soda to make a track for your record. He’s the one who didn’t have caviar and champagne.’ But you can’t say those things. I asked him, ‘Aren’t you going to say anything?’ And he said, ‘No, if you say anything, they got you.’ ”

The USA for Africa album shot to number one, and “4 the Tears In Your Eyes” was well received by critics, though it didn’t generate any real radio interest or move the needle for the project. And the damage was already done. Bob Cavallo looks back on the “We Are the World” fiasco as a crucial turning point in Prince’s entire career. “All of the superstars there just said horrible things about him,” he says. “I don’t know that they said anything to the press, but I know how incensed they were.

“I believe that moment is what made people ambivalent about his greatness. When you get negative press going, you need twenty years for people to stop reflecting on it. And if guys like Springsteen or whoever are talking about how great he is, like they used to, it would add to the legend. But instead, everybody kind of backed off, like, ‘What the fuck kind of idiot is he that he would go to some dance club instead of just going there and singing two lines in the song?’”

Saturday Night Live opened the February 2 episode with a sketch about the situation. Cast member Rich Hall, playing MTV VJ Mark Goodman, introduced the bit, saying, “As you know, Prince did not appear in the big USA for Africa video because he was busy bailing out his bodyguards after they beat up some of his fans outside of a Hollywood restaurant.” But now, the “sultan of screen” had organized his own video effort for world hunger. Billy Crystal, as Prince, sang:

I am also the world, I am also the children,
I am the one who had to bail them out, Now ain’t that givin’!
It’s a choice I made! The kids will have to wait,
There’s got to be another way to get on MTV
Cast members playing Bruce Springsteen, Paul Simon, and Willie Nelson all entered the studio, trying to sing, but each time “Prince” signaled to his bodyguards—played by Mr. T and Hulk Hogan—who manhandled the other artists and tossed them out of the room.

Two months later, Prince played the final date of the Purple Rain tour, to an audience of 55,000 in Miami’s Orange Bowl. He ended the show saying, “I have to go now. I don’t know when I’ll be back. I want you to know that God loves you. He loves us all.” Just two weeks after that, with minimal warning, his new album, Around the World in a Day, arrived in record stores, and the Purple Rain era was over.

-----------------

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
i definitely got the sense that he was blackballed
Oct 29th 2014
1
Ya Think. SOTT lost to fucking Joshua Tree, man.
Oct 30th 2014
14
nice read
Oct 29th 2014
2
I don't see how that messed his career up
Oct 29th 2014
3
I'm not gonna say I believe it messed his career up but
Oct 29th 2014
6
*Index Finger Point Of Acknowledgement*
Nov 13th 2014
105
I'm interested in this book.
Oct 29th 2014
4
Thank you.
Oct 29th 2014
5
great read. i want that book.
Oct 29th 2014
7
Lisa said he was George Jefferson. HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Oct 29th 2014
8
Speaking of Mr. J...
Oct 31st 2014
22
RE: Speaking of Mr. J...
Oct 31st 2014
25
RE: Speaking of Mr. J...
Nov 01st 2014
27
RE: Speaking of Mr. J...
Nov 01st 2014
32
      RE: Speaking of Mr. J...
Nov 01st 2014
34
      RE: Speaking of Mr. J...
Nov 01st 2014
35
           RE: Speaking of Mr. J...
Nov 01st 2014
36
                RE: Speaking of Mr. J...
Nov 01st 2014
37
                you guys are fucking weird.
Nov 02nd 2014
38
                Yep..step away from the madness, MME, seriously.
Nov 02nd 2014
39
                You got it
Nov 02nd 2014
41
                     lol talkin to yourself
Nov 02nd 2014
42
                RE: you guys are fucking weird.
Nov 02nd 2014
40
                RE: you guys are fucking weird.
Nov 03rd 2014
47
                     MME made a sensible point that only non-sensible folk would deny
Nov 06th 2014
71
                2001 'was a very good year' (c) Frankie Sinatra
Nov 03rd 2014
48
                RE: Speaking of Mr. J...
Nov 04th 2014
52
      RE: Speaking of Mr. J...
Nov 02nd 2014
43
           RE: Speaking of Mr. J...
Nov 07th 2014
81
RE: Speaking of Mr. J...
Nov 01st 2014
29
      RE: Speaking of Mr. J...
Nov 01st 2014
30
      RE: Speaking of Mr. J...
Nov 01st 2014
33
           RE: Speaking of Mr. J...
Nov 02nd 2014
44
speak the truth & shame the devil
Nov 04th 2014
51
      RE: speak the truth & shame the devil
Nov 04th 2014
57
lol
Oct 31st 2014
24
2 things
Oct 29th 2014
9
the song was not written on the spot.
Oct 29th 2014
10
      thanks for the info
Oct 29th 2014
11
      Prince would have had a part in which he and MJ sang to each other
Oct 29th 2014
12
           bob geldof had a lot of nerve calling anyone a creep.
Oct 30th 2014
13
           the part that eventually was done by Huey Lewis. P would've killed that ...
Nov 04th 2014
58
      RE: the song was not written on the spot.
Oct 31st 2014
16
RE: When the Purple Rain came falling down (Long SWIPE)
Oct 31st 2014
15
RE: When the Purple Rain came falling down (Long SWIPE)
Oct 31st 2014
17
& duetting with m.j....cheesearoni
Nov 04th 2014
53
WeAreTheWorld is a horrible song & the funds got misappropriated anyway
Oct 31st 2014
18
^^^ prince knew what was up with that song/project
Oct 31st 2014
20
has prince ever let anybody produce a song for him, ever?
Oct 31st 2014
23
succinct
Nov 04th 2014
54
if he'd been on it, Id been more compelled to listen to it
Oct 31st 2014
19
It doesn't matter now, but
Oct 31st 2014
21
Alan Light
Nov 01st 2014
26
lulz
Nov 04th 2014
55
I always thought ATWIAD was the cause...
Nov 01st 2014
28
it was
Nov 01st 2014
31
RE: I always thought ATWIAD was the cause...
Nov 03rd 2014
45
that album had "Raspberry Beret", "Pop Life" and "America" on it
Nov 04th 2014
49
Prince is an a-hole but good call skipping that corny ish.
Nov 03rd 2014
46
prince won (c) chris rock
Nov 04th 2014
50
All the "But the song sucked!" talk misses the point
Nov 04th 2014
56
Yeah, that 'the song sucks' shit is the dumbest retort ever
Nov 05th 2014
59
RE: Yeah, that 'the song sucks' shit is the dumbest retort ever
Nov 05th 2014
60
You're free to believe that.
Nov 05th 2014
61
RE: You're free to believe that.
Nov 05th 2014
62
RE: You're free to believe that.
Nov 10th 2014
92
Yeah, you missed the point. Again.
Nov 06th 2014
63
      RE: Yeah, you missed the point. Again.
Nov 06th 2014
64
      RE: Yeah, you missed the point. Again.
Nov 07th 2014
80
      RE: Yeah, you missed the point. Again.
Nov 07th 2014
82
      RE: Yeah, you missed the point. Again.
Nov 10th 2014
93
subtract the personalities involved.
Nov 08th 2014
84
      I mean, really I have no idea why people refuse to understand this^^^^^^...
Nov 08th 2014
87
           because the bottom line was he never agreed to participate
Nov 10th 2014
98
acting like a rock star got him ostracized by rock stars
Nov 06th 2014
65
You need to put that in its proper context, though.
Nov 06th 2014
66
RE: You need to put that in its proper context, though.
Nov 06th 2014
68
Raising awareness of an issue is not necessarily 'beating one's chest'
Nov 06th 2014
69
      RE: Raising awareness of an issue is not necessarily 'beating one's ches...
Nov 06th 2014
70
RE: You need to put that in its proper context, though.
Nov 06th 2014
75
      RE: You need to put that in its proper context, though.
Nov 07th 2014
76
           succinct like a mug
Nov 07th 2014
77
black artists are property
Nov 06th 2014
67
      tellin a grown man to stay in a hotel
Nov 09th 2014
91
           RE: tellin a grown man to stay in a hotel
Nov 10th 2014
94
RE: All the "But the song sucked!" talk misses the point
Nov 07th 2014
79
I think "the Song sucked" is short hand for, it wasn't that big of a dea...
Nov 11th 2014
103
Madonna didn't make it either, right?
Nov 06th 2014
72
RE: Madonna didn't make it either, right?
Nov 06th 2014
73
she has privilege that prince does not
Nov 06th 2014
74
Last thought: Where did Prince go wrong?
Nov 07th 2014
78
no US tours , horrible choice for singles , no vids for key singles
Nov 07th 2014
83
Prince really neglected to promote his best material.
Nov 08th 2014
85
      RE: Prince really neglected to promote his best material.
Nov 08th 2014
86
           RE: Prince really neglected to promote his best material.
Nov 09th 2014
89
commercially or artistically?
Nov 09th 2014
88
RE: commercially or artistically?
Nov 09th 2014
90
You know, I agree with this
Nov 10th 2014
95
      it makes a certain amount of sense.
Nov 10th 2014
96
           I wrote this and backspaced it.
Nov 10th 2014
97
'sitting on music' wasn't a thing in the early 80s.
Nov 10th 2014
99
      even WB didn't have THAT much of a problem w/ it.
Nov 10th 2014
100
      RE: 'sitting on music' wasn't a thing in the early 80s.
Nov 10th 2014
101
           fine.
Nov 10th 2014
102
Howard Bloom (Prince's former PR rep) on when "everything changed"
Nov 12th 2014
104
RE: When the Purple Rain came falling down (Long SWIPE)
Nov 18th 2014
106

MISTA MONOTONE
Member since Jan 30th 2004
58563 posts
Wed Oct-29-14 02:57 PM

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1. "i definitely got the sense that he was blackballed"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

this would explain why for sure. sheesh Prince.

on the plus side, we did get Hello out of the deal. i dig (& dug) that song.

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Basaglia
Member since Nov 30th 2004
49463 posts
Thu Oct-30-14 11:14 PM

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14. "Ya Think. SOTT lost to fucking Joshua Tree, man. "
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

____________________________________________________


Steph: I was just fooling about

Kyrie: I wasn't.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8OWNspU_yE

  

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c71
Member since Jan 15th 2008
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Wed Oct-29-14 03:08 PM

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2. "nice read"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

yes

  

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revolution75
Member since May 07th 2003
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Wed Oct-29-14 03:31 PM

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3. "I don't see how that messed his career up"
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Oct-29-14 03:31 PM by revolution75

  

          

I think moving away from the sound that led him to stardom is what messed him up
Cats weren't really talking about him missing from that session
It was how "weird" his music was getting
(In 85 standards, atwiad was a weird record to folks)
Hence the popularity of rftw in 85..they gave folks that mpls sound.

Eclectic Soul/Sunday, 2-4 PM est/89.3 WCSB.ORG

  

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AFKAP_of_Darkness
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6. "I'm not gonna say I believe it messed his career up but"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          


>Cats weren't really talking about him missing from that
>session

I do remember reading back in 85 about how it was a BIG deal that he didn't participate in that session.

I remember it well because I can't forget trying to understand why exactly it was such a big fucking deal, but it was something that was being talked about... even in a teen zine like Right On!

And I remember apologists being all "Well, at least he still gave them '4 The Tears in Your Eyes' so we have to believe his heart was in the right place!"

_____________________

http://fc03.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2010/287/6/c/the_wire_lineup__huge_download_by_dennisculver-d30s7vl.jpg
The man who thinks at 50 the same way he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life - Muhammed Ali

  

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
132214 posts
Thu Nov-13-14 09:45 AM

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105. "*Index Finger Point Of Acknowledgement*"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

>I think moving away from the sound that led him to stardom is
>what messed him up
>Cats weren't really talking about him missing from that
>session
>It was how "weird" his music was getting
>(In 85 standards, atwiad was a weird record to folks)
>Hence the popularity of rftw in 85..they gave folks that mpls
>sound.

I would agree with that.
But it really became pronounced around the time of Graffiti Bridge.
Prince "weird" used to be cool
but then it just was ... weird.

  

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Buck
Member since Feb 15th 2005
16160 posts
Wed Oct-29-14 03:46 PM

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4. "I'm interested in this book."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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Pete Burns
Member since Oct 18th 2005
5446 posts
Wed Oct-29-14 04:05 PM

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5. "Thank you."
In response to Reply # 0


          

  

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SoWhat
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7. "great read. i want that book."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

fuck you.

  

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MME
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8. "Lisa said he was George Jefferson. HAHAHAHAHAHAHA"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I can totally see that.

____________________________

FUCK DONALD TRUMP

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Fri Oct-31-14 03:03 PM

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22. "Speaking of Mr. J..."
In response to Reply # 8


          

W&L would have still been working at the cleaners if it werent for the Midget...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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MME
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25. "RE: Speaking of Mr. J..."
In response to Reply # 22


  

          

>W&L would have still been working at the cleaners if it
>werent for the Midget...

cmon, Murph, you know that's not true

____________________________

FUCK DONALD TRUMP

  

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Red07
Member since Oct 19th 2005
482 posts
Sat Nov-01-14 09:52 AM

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27. "RE: Speaking of Mr. J..."
In response to Reply # 25


          

>>W&L would have still been working at the cleaners if it
>>werent for the Midget...
>
>cmon, Murph, you know that's not true


we dont know that it wouldnt be true either; Fact is ; he put them on

  

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MME
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Sat Nov-01-14 10:16 PM

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32. "RE: Speaking of Mr. J..."
In response to Reply # 27


  

          

>>>W&L would have still been working at the cleaners if it
>>>werent for the Midget...
>>
>>cmon, Murph, you know that's not true
>
>
>we dont know that it wouldnt be true either; Fact is ; he put
>them on

Both Wendy and Lisa come from musical families. Their dads were session musicians for some of the biggest names in music, including the Jackson 5. If they had never met Prince I highly doubt they'd be working at a cleaners. They might've been doing what they're doing right now; movie/tv scores, or session musicians like their fathers. The point is, they'd still be involved in music in some form or another.

____________________________

FUCK DONALD TRUMP

  

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rdhull
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Sat Nov-01-14 10:41 PM

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34. "RE: Speaking of Mr. J..."
In response to Reply # 32


  

          

>>>>W&L would have still been working at the cleaners if it
>>>>werent for the Midget...
>>>
>>>cmon, Murph, you know that's not true
>>
>>
>>we dont know that it wouldnt be true either; Fact is ; he
>put
>>them on
>
>Both Wendy and Lisa come from musical families. Their dads
>were session musicians for some of the biggest names in music,
>including the Jackson 5.

and didnt attend the We Are The World Sessions on Prince's orders lol

  

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MME
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Sat Nov-01-14 10:59 PM

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35. "RE: Speaking of Mr. J..."
In response to Reply # 34


  

          

>>>>>W&L would have still been working at the cleaners if it
>>>>>werent for the Midget...
>>>>
>>>>cmon, Murph, you know that's not true
>>>
>>>
>>>we dont know that it wouldnt be true either; Fact is ; he
>>put
>>>them on
>>
>>Both Wendy and Lisa come from musical families. Their dads
>>were session musicians for some of the biggest names in
>music,
>>including the Jackson 5.
>
>and didnt attend the We Are The World Sessions on Prince's
>orders lol

So?

Yeah, and they felt bad about it. The reason? They both grew up in the music business and knew almost everybody in that room that did the song that night.

____________________________

FUCK DONALD TRUMP

  

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rdhull
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Sat Nov-01-14 11:34 PM

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36. "RE: Speaking of Mr. J..."
In response to Reply # 35


  

          

>>>>>>W&L would have still been working at the cleaners if it
>>>>>>werent for the Midget...
>>>>>
>>>>>cmon, Murph, you know that's not true
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>we dont know that it wouldnt be true either; Fact is ; he
>>>put
>>>>them on
>>>
>>>Both Wendy and Lisa come from musical families. Their dads
>>>were session musicians for some of the biggest names in
>>music,
>>>including the Jackson 5.
>>
>>and didnt attend the We Are The World Sessions on Prince's
>>orders lol
>
>So?
>
>Yeah, and they felt bad about it. The reason? They both grew
>up in the music business and knew almost everybody in that
>room that did the song that night.Y

You claim that with all the pull W&L had what with their family being music industry vets that theyd be well known etc anyways yet for the event of the year with all these artists etc they did not go because Prince told them not to.

  

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MME
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Sat Nov-01-14 11:46 PM

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37. "RE: Speaking of Mr. J..."
In response to Reply # 36


  

          

>>>>>>>W&L would have still been working at the cleaners if
>it
>>>>>>>werent for the Midget...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>cmon, Murph, you know that's not true
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>we dont know that it wouldnt be true either; Fact is ; he
>>>>put
>>>>>them on
>>>>
>>>>Both Wendy and Lisa come from musical families. Their dads
>>>>were session musicians for some of the biggest names in
>>>music,
>>>>including the Jackson 5.
>>>
>>>and didnt attend the We Are The World Sessions on Prince's
>>>orders lol
>>
>>So?
>>
>>Yeah, and they felt bad about it. The reason? They both grew
>>up in the music business and knew almost everybody in that
>>room that did the song that night.Y
>
>You claim that with all the pull W&L had what with their
>family being music industry vets that theyd be well known etc
>anyways yet for the event of the year with all these artists
>etc they did not go because Prince told them not to.
>
>

and??....your POINT?

____________________________

FUCK DONALD TRUMP

  

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AFKAP_of_Darkness
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84244 posts
Sun Nov-02-14 06:30 AM

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38. "you guys are fucking weird."
In response to Reply # 36


  

          

this is like like Prince stannery on a level this board hasn't seen since 2001.

MME... don't engage yourself in this.

_____________________

http://fc03.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2010/287/6/c/the_wire_lineup__huge_download_by_dennisculver-d30s7vl.jpg
The man who thinks at 50 the same way he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life - Muhammed Ali

  

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Pete Burns
Member since Oct 18th 2005
5446 posts
Sun Nov-02-14 06:42 AM

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39. "Yep..step away from the madness, MME, seriously."
In response to Reply # 38


          

  

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MME
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Sun Nov-02-14 08:30 AM

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41. "You got it"
In response to Reply # 39


  

          

>

____________________________

FUCK DONALD TRUMP

  

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rdhull
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Sun Nov-02-14 08:33 AM

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42. "lol talkin to yourself"
In response to Reply # 41


  

          

>>
>
>

  

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MME
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Sun Nov-02-14 08:22 AM

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40. "RE: you guys are fucking weird."
In response to Reply # 38


  

          

>this is like like Prince stannery on a level this board
>hasn't seen since 2001.
>
>MME... don't engage yourself in this.

You know what, AFKAP, you are absolutely right. I no longer care enough to engage in org-type fuckery like that anymore. That's what I realized last night.

And now, I walk away...

____________________________

FUCK DONALD TRUMP

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Mon Nov-03-14 05:06 PM

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47. "RE: you guys are fucking weird."
In response to Reply # 40


          

>>this is like like Prince stannery on a level this board
>>hasn't seen since 2001.
>>
>>MME... don't engage yourself in this.
>
>You know what, AFKAP, you are absolutely right. I no longer
>care enough to engage in org-type fuckery like that anymore.
>That's what I realized last night.
>
>And now, I walk away...

I feel u and all...But were those comments even that "Org"-ish?...The Org is on some other La La land shit...There are some folks on there that even balk at criticizing Prince for his past asshole behavior...

I don't think anyone in this thread was on it like that...At all...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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spirit
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Thu Nov-06-14 04:16 PM

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71. "MME made a sensible point that only non-sensible folk would deny"
In response to Reply # 47


  

          

" The point is, they'd still be involved in music in some form or another."

Just saying that W&L would still be making music even if they never played with Prince isn't a bold statement. They may never have gotten notoriety, but saying that they would have probably pursued a music career isn't something that can reasonably be denied, considering the family connections MME mentioned (that I didn't even know about til he mentioned them). Now, if you want to say "They probably wouldn't have been able to get as much work doing scores as they do without Prince," that's another argument.

Peace,

Spirit (Alan)
http://wutangbook.com

  

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rdhull
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Mon Nov-03-14 11:27 PM

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48. "2001 'was a very good year' (c) Frankie Sinatra"
In response to Reply # 38
Mon Nov-03-14 11:53 PM by rdhull

  

          

and lets get something straight, you're weird too

this aint any more stannery or ridiculous than you and yours 15 years of back n forth bullshit lol

and lets stop pretending that the lesson lol isnt a bastion of stannery for ______(fill in the blank) or isnt a pejorative as "org" references are

and who doesnt stan for anything anyways? owner of this joint is stan numero uno and its time to realize that there's nothing wrong with that etc

p.s. if you wanna see some stannery, read my AOA-PE review lol

>this is like like Prince stannery on a level this board
>hasn't seen since 2001.
>
>MME... don't engage yourself in this.

this nigro got nerve lol

  

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fire
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Tue Nov-04-14 11:04 AM

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52. "RE: Speaking of Mr. J..."
In response to Reply # 36


          


>You claim that with all the pull W&L had what with their
>family being music industry vets that theyd be well known etc
>anyways yet for the event of the year with all these artists
>etc they did not go because Prince told them not to.
>
>


________________________________________
who gonna check me boo?!

www.twitter.com/firefire100
http://instagram.com/firefire100
www.philadelphiaeagles.com

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Sun Nov-02-14 03:31 PM

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43. "RE: Speaking of Mr. J..."
In response to Reply # 32


          

>>>>W&L would have still been working at the cleaners if it
>>>>werent for the Midget...
>>>
>>>cmon, Murph, you know that's not true
>>
>>
>>we dont know that it wouldnt be true either; Fact is ; he
>put
>>them on
>
>Both Wendy and Lisa come from musical families. Their dads
>were session musicians for some of the biggest names in music,
>including the Jackson 5. If they had never met Prince I highly
>doubt they'd be working at a cleaners. They might've been
>doing what they're doing right now; movie/tv scores, or
>session musicians like their fathers. The point is, they'd
>still be involved in music in some form or another.

I dont think anyone is debating that...we all know W&L's pedigree..But to act like Prince didnt put them on in terms of giving them a platform to the point where the Wendy & Lisa moniker was famous beyond industry connects and talent is missing the point...

I think the only person in his band that has the right to gripe about anything is Andre Cymone given his treatment of dude when Cymone was basically riding shotgun with Prince from the beginning...

W&L def have the right to gripe about their own treatment by Prince...But I also think its important to remember that the Midget as much as an asshole he was during that Revolution period did more for his backing band than most artists would even think about doing...He gave them platforms to pursue whatever they wanted to do...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Red07
Member since Oct 19th 2005
482 posts
Fri Nov-07-14 11:56 AM

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81. "RE: Speaking of Mr. J..."
In response to Reply # 43


          

>>>>>W&L would have still been working at the cleaners if it
>>>>>werent for the Midget...
>>>>
>>>>cmon, Murph, you know that's not true
>>>
>>>
>>>we dont know that it wouldnt be true either; Fact is ; he
>>put
>>>them on
>>
>>Both Wendy and Lisa come from musical families. Their dads
>>were session musicians for some of the biggest names in
>music,
>>including the Jackson 5. If they had never met Prince I
>highly
>>doubt they'd be working at a cleaners. They might've been
>>doing what they're doing right now; movie/tv scores, or
>>session musicians like their fathers. The point is, they'd
>>still be involved in music in some form or another.
>
>I dont think anyone is debating that...we all know W&L's
>pedigree..But to act like Prince didnt put them on in terms of
>giving them a platform to the point where the Wendy & Lisa
>moniker was famous beyond industry connects and talent is
>missing the point...
>
>I think the only person in his band that has the right to
>gripe about anything is Andre Cymone given his treatment of
>dude when Cymone was basically riding shotgun with Prince
>from the beginning...
>
>W&L def have the right to gripe about their own treatment by
>Prince...But I also think its important to remember that the
>Midget as much as an asshole he was during that Revolution
>period did more for his backing band than most artists would
>even think about doing...He gave them platforms to pursue
>whatever they wanted to do...
>
>

Did Skipper ever have a gun and make them play under duress..The fact they say he treated us shitty yet int eh same breath say they were shocked and saddened when fired!

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Sat Nov-01-14 04:38 PM

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29. "RE: Speaking of Mr. J..."
In response to Reply # 25
Sat Nov-01-14 04:42 PM by murph71

          

We all know Prince was/is a control freak asshole to the highest level...

But I could only imagine members of James Brown's band wishing they could get a 1 millon bonus after a tour like the Revolution ...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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rdhull
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33137 posts
Sat Nov-01-14 06:04 PM

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30. "RE: Speaking of Mr. J..."
In response to Reply # 29


  

          

>We all know Prince was/is a control freak asshole to the
>highest level...
>
>But I could only imagine members of James Brown's band wishing
>they could get a 1 millon bonus after a tour like the
>Revolution ...
>


not only that but being prominently presented in a major motion picture grossing 80 million in 1984

  

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MME
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Sat Nov-01-14 10:18 PM

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33. "RE: Speaking of Mr. J..."
In response to Reply # 29


  

          

>We all know Prince was/is a control freak asshole to the
>highest level...
>
>But I could only imagine members of James Brown's band wishing
>they could get a 1 millon bonus after a tour like the
>Revolution ...
>

What are you talking about?

____________________________

FUCK DONALD TRUMP

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Sun Nov-02-14 03:41 PM

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44. "RE: Speaking of Mr. J..."
In response to Reply # 33


          

>>We all know Prince was/is a control freak asshole to the
>>highest level...
>>
>>But I could only imagine members of James Brown's band
>wishing
>>they could get a 1 millon bonus after a tour like the
>>Revolution ...
>>
>
>What are you talking about?

That W&L's gripes on the way Prince was on his George Jefferson shit should be taken with heavy perspective...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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fire
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Tue Nov-04-14 11:02 AM

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51. "speak the truth & shame the devil"
In response to Reply # 22


          

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Tue Nov-04-14 02:05 PM

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57. "RE: speak the truth & shame the devil"
In response to Reply # 51
Tue Nov-04-14 02:05 PM by murph71

          


Indeed...

And it's not like folks are saying Prince isn't an asshole...In fact, there's a post that went up today about Prince's lawyers allegedly shutting down those GREAT Music Snob episodes because he didn't like them using his music (more like he didn't like some of their criticisms...lol)

That's^^^^asshole tendencies if true...

But of course calling Prince an asshole, a dick, and a dude that is still clueless when it comes to his obsessive nature of scrubbing his music off the web (that shit pisses me the fuck off...for real) is a lot different than saying 'Yeah!!!!' to old band members bitching about how he treated them when he not only gave them a huge platform to get a global spotlight, but he took care of them financially in ways that most backing band members would never experience....

Like I said, Andre Cymone is the only dude that can REALLY gripe and not sound crazy...

But W&L got everything they wanted and more from Prince...Talented women who more then do their thing...But come on....lol

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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rdhull
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Fri Oct-31-14 08:18 PM

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24. "lol"
In response to Reply # 8


  

          

  

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aolhater
Member since Oct 14th 2002
1332 posts
Wed Oct-29-14 07:18 PM

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9. "2 things"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

1 how did prince know the song was horrible...i thought it was written and composed that night
2 i can't imagine prince in We Are the World now ...i mean whose part would he sing cyndi laupers...huey lewis..

*professional lurker*

  

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SoWhat
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Wed Oct-29-14 09:14 PM

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10. "the song was not written on the spot. "
In response to Reply # 9
Wed Oct-29-14 09:16 PM by SoWhat

  

          

>1 how did prince know the song was horrible...i thought it
>was written and composed that night

MJ & Lionel wrote it ahead of time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/We_Are_the_World#Background_and_writing

Stevie was supposed to write it w/them but was too busy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/We_Are_the_World#Recording_sessions

copies of a demo version w/guide vocals were circulated among the invited singers. Prince was invited so i'm sure they sent him a copy.

>2 i can't imagine prince in We Are the World now ...i mean
>whose part would he sing cyndi laupers...huey lewis..

i agree. lol.

fuck you.

  

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aolhater
Member since Oct 14th 2002
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Wed Oct-29-14 09:18 PM

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11. "thanks for the info"
In response to Reply # 10


  

          

*professional lurker*

  

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SoWhat
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Wed Oct-29-14 09:19 PM

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12. "Prince would have had a part in which he and MJ sang to each other"
In response to Reply # 11
Wed Oct-29-14 09:20 PM by SoWhat

  

          

^ there it is.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/We_Are_the_World#Recording_sessions

The final night of recording was held on January 28, 1985, at A&M Recording Studios in Hollywood. Michael Jackson arrived at 9 pm, earlier than the other artists, to record his solo section and record a vocal chorus by himself. He was subsequently joined in the recording studio by the remaining USA for Africa artists, which included Ray Charles, Billy Joel, Diana Ross, Cyndi Lauper, Bruce Springsteen and Smokey Robinson. Also in attendance were five of Jackson's siblings: Jackie, La Toya, Marlon, Randy and Tito. Many of the participants came straight from an American Music Award ceremony, which had been held that same night. Invited musician Prince, who would have had a part in which he and Michael Jackson sang to each other, did not attend the recording session. The reason given for his absence has varied. One newspaper claimed that the singer did not want to record with other acts. Another report, from the time of "We Are the World"'s recording, suggested that the musician did not want to partake in the session because organizer Bob Geldof called him a "creep". Prince did, however, donate an exclusive track, "4 The Tears In Your Eyes", for the We Are the World album. In all, more than 45 of America's top musicians participated in the recording, and another 50 had to be turned away. Upon entering the recording studio, the musicians were greeted by a sign pinned to the door which read, "Please check your egos at the door." They were also greeted by Stevie Wonder, who proclaimed that if the recording was not completed in one take, he and Ray Charles, two blind men, would drive everybody home.

fuck you.

  

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shockzilla
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Thu Oct-30-14 07:15 AM

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13. "bob geldof had a lot of nerve calling anyone a creep."
In response to Reply # 12
Thu Oct-30-14 07:16 AM by shockzilla

          

Dirty bastard that he is.

  

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jaywonder
Member since Jun 05th 2007
8431 posts
Tue Nov-04-14 07:08 PM

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58. "the part that eventually was done by Huey Lewis. P would've killed that ..."
In response to Reply # 12


  

          


http://boundless-expression.tumblr.com/

http://themichaeljacksonarchives.tumblr.com/

  

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TR808
Member since Oct 24th 2012
2012 posts
Fri Oct-31-14 10:16 AM

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16. "RE: the song was not written on the spot. "
In response to Reply # 10


  

          

>>1 how did prince know the song was horrible...i thought it
>>was written and composed that night
>
>MJ & Lionel wrote it ahead of time.
>
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/We_Are_the_World#Background_and_writing
>
>Stevie was supposed to write it w/them but was too busy.
>
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/We_Are_the_World#Recording_sessions
>
>copies of a demo version w/guide vocals were circulated among
>the invited singers. Prince was invited so i'm sure they sent
>him a copy.
>
>>2 i can't imagine prince in We Are the World now ...i mean
>>whose part would he sing cyndi laupers...huey lewis..
>
>i agree. lol.



I can hear Prince Ripping in on Burce Springsteins Part...

That Guitar solo would have been epic on that song....

I agree the song was horrible... and I remember as a kid wondering why he didnt just show up...

it made him look like an asshole....

This read was great ...thanks...

You take the blue pill, the story ends. You wake up in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe. You take the red pill, you stay in Wonderland, and I show you how deep the rabbit hole goes.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Fri Oct-31-14 10:07 AM

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15. "RE: When the Purple Rain came falling down (Long SWIPE)"
In response to Reply # 0


          

Alan Light knows his Prince...being around dude when I was a young pup trying figure it out I've always had immense respect for the OG...

But Im glad Prince didnt go to that We Are The World session. It would have been very un-Prince like...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Red07
Member since Oct 19th 2005
482 posts
Fri Oct-31-14 11:29 AM

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17. "RE: When the Purple Rain came falling down (Long SWIPE)"
In response to Reply # 15


          

>Alan Light knows his Prince...being around dude when I was a
>young pup trying figure it out I've always had immense
>respect for the OG...
>
>But Im glad Prince didnt go to that We Are The World session.
>It would have been very un-Prince like...
>
>


Exactly,, like when he was talking about the Bad video when he said run that in your mind with 1988 prince playing wesley snipes character..really,, I for one hated We are the world and still do..Basically if you like P for P you didnt give a shit..the only ones who seem to be catching feelings is mf'er s who wanted to make more money off of him and he didn't allow it.

the george jeff reference is hilarious; can totally see him calling dr, fink honkey

  

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fire
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53. "& duetting with m.j....cheesearoni "
In response to Reply # 15


          


>
>But Im glad Prince didnt go to that We Are The World session.
>It would have been very un-Prince like...
>
>

________________________________________
who gonna check me boo?!

www.twitter.com/firefire100
http://instagram.com/firefire100
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Bombastic
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18. "WeAreTheWorld is a horrible song & the funds got misappropriated anyway"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

P ain't the social hobnobbing type but Id imagine the root of the issue was him not wanting to be a bit player on the set of something MJ's camp spearheaded.

Funny that acting like a rock star could get you ostracized by a community of rock stars tho.

Lotta coked-out self-righteous talk in the room that night I'm sure.

None of those people (well, aside Dylan who I know loved him) prolly liked that little midget for their own reasons (like the fact that he was killing all of them with his talent at the time) and missing that session became the unifying 'oh, he's an asshole, we don't like him now' high school cafeteria excuse.

  

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revolution75
Member since May 07th 2003
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Fri Oct-31-14 01:56 PM

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20. "^^^ prince knew what was up with that song/project"
In response to Reply # 18


  

          

Hello was an excellent song with him telling his side of the story

Eclectic Soul/Sunday, 2-4 PM est/89.3 WCSB.ORG

  

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Joe Corn Mo
Member since Aug 29th 2010
15139 posts
Fri Oct-31-14 03:53 PM

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23. "has prince ever let anybody produce a song for him, ever?"
In response to Reply # 18


  

          

and for a song MJ wrote?


no way.

  

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fire
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Tue Nov-04-14 11:08 AM

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54. "succinct"
In response to Reply # 18


          

  

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rdhull
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19. "if he'd been on it, Id been more compelled to listen to it"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

when it came on

  

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MME
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21. "It doesn't matter now, but"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

at the time this happened, I was twelve, and for me it added to his already huge bad-boy image. and I LOVED IT. He was a REBEL, yeah! *eyeroll* It was all so silly

____________________________

FUCK DONALD TRUMP

  

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15
Member since Mar 01st 2005
9915 posts
Sat Nov-01-14 03:42 AM

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26. "Alan Light"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

NO! LIST
Tom Petty
M J
Zeppelin
Springsteen
Neil Young
Eagles
Ray Charles
Madonna
Chuck Berry
South Park TV Songs
Justin Timberlake
"Food Glorious Food"
"Twilight Zone" theme
"A Boy Named Sue"
"Night Moves"
"The Situation"
"Superbowl Shuffle"

  

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fire
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111370 posts
Tue Nov-04-14 11:09 AM

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55. "lulz"
In response to Reply # 26


          

________________________________________
who gonna check me boo?!

www.twitter.com/firefire100
http://instagram.com/firefire100
www.philadelphiaeagles.com

  

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LeroyBumpkin
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Sat Nov-01-14 01:11 PM

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28. "I always thought ATWIAD was the cause..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

...not We Are The World. Granted, I was just a kid so I didn't hear about this whole "submit a song vs. singing" thing until I got older. I didn't know they turned him down from playing guitar which would have been a good compromise. I mean, you'd have to think they made concessions for the other artists so things would fit. Made sense here.

But yeah, I always thought it was the total shift in music style that did him in during this time. Kinda like Stevie following up SITKOL with the Secret Life Of Plants.

https://digife.com

  

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rdhull
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Sat Nov-01-14 06:05 PM

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31. "it was"
In response to Reply # 28


  

          

  

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Red07
Member since Oct 19th 2005
482 posts
Mon Nov-03-14 11:52 AM

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45. "RE: I always thought ATWIAD was the cause..."
In response to Reply # 28


          

>...not We Are The World. Granted, I was just a kid so I
>didn't hear about this whole "submit a song vs. singing" thing
>until I got older. I didn't know they turned him down from
>playing guitar which would have been a good compromise. I
>mean, you'd have to think they made concessions for the other
>artists so things would fit. Made sense here.
>
>But yeah, I always thought it was the total shift in music
>style that did him in during this time. Kinda like Stevie
>following up SITKOL with the Secret Life Of Plants.


Cant really do him in if he is still here today alive and kicking with a flourishing career can you?

Just saying..

  

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DVS
Member since Sep 13th 2002
19730 posts
Tue Nov-04-14 09:56 AM

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49. "that album had "Raspberry Beret", "Pop Life" and "America" on it"
In response to Reply # 28
Tue Nov-04-14 09:57 AM by DVS

  

          

it's not like he dropped a piece of shit afterwards

D

vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv

Waldorf and Statler Vol 4:CONAN IS OUT NOW!!!: http://waldorfandstatler.bandcamp.com

and don't forget to check "DVS 4 ALDERMAN"

http://windimoto.bandcamp.com/album/dvs-4-alderman-bandcamp-exclusive-expanded-editio

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Mon Nov-03-14 12:58 PM

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46. "Prince is an a-hole but good call skipping that corny ish. "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

  

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fire
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Tue Nov-04-14 10:26 AM

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50. "prince won (c) chris rock"
In response to Reply # 0


          

________________________________________
who gonna check me boo?!

www.twitter.com/firefire100
http://instagram.com/firefire100
www.philadelphiaeagles.com

  

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mrhood75
Member since Dec 06th 2004
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Tue Nov-04-14 12:21 PM

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56. "All the "But the song sucked!" talk misses the point"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Yes, the song sucked. But it really doesn't matter if it was garbage or it was the greatest piece of recorded music since "Let's Get it On". I'd certainly hope we're all adult enough to agree that even considering that the song was trash, it was really bad form of Prince to spend the night partying while the rest of "Record Industry Royalty" was off recording a track for charity.

No one would have cared if Prince wasn't on "We Are the World" if he wasn't out making an ass of himself instead. THAT was the issue, not whether or not he was going to be trading lines with Michael Jackson.

-----------------

www.albumism.com

Checkin' Our Style, Return To Zero:

https://www.mixcloud.com/returntozero/

  

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AFKAP_of_Darkness
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Wed Nov-05-14 11:54 AM

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59. "Yeah, that 'the song sucks' shit is the dumbest retort ever"
In response to Reply # 56
Wed Nov-05-14 11:55 AM by AFKAP_of_Darkness

  

          

so is the "the funds were misappropriated"....

But I know that amongst a certain kind of person here, ANYTHING Prince does is ultimately the just and noble action, even when they throw in the token rejoinder of "we know he's an a-hole... lol"

EDIT: mentioning that the stars at the session drank champagne while Prince drank warm soda is idiotic too.

_____________________

http://fc03.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2010/287/6/c/the_wire_lineup__huge_download_by_dennisculver-d30s7vl.jpg
The man who thinks at 50 the same way he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life - Muhammed Ali

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Wed Nov-05-14 12:29 PM

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60. "RE: Yeah, that 'the song sucks' shit is the dumbest retort ever"
In response to Reply # 59
Wed Nov-05-14 12:54 PM by murph71

          

>so is the "the funds were misappropriated"....
>
>But I know that amongst a certain kind of person here,
>ANYTHING Prince does is ultimately the just and noble action,
>even when they throw in the token rejoinder of "we know he's
>an a-hole... lol"
>
>EDIT: mentioning that the stars at the session drank champagne
>while Prince drank warm soda is idiotic too.


There are some real "Prince-on-that-bullshit" actions for which OUR HERO (see what I did there?) should get fried for....Sicking his lawyers on fan websites? Breaking Cap. Kirk's guitar with no respect for dude's property? Shitting on artists for RECORDING covers of his music when he just did the same on his new album?

^^^^THESE are ego-driven, delusional actions for which Prince deserves a MAMMOTH middle finger and dressed down accordingly...No "we know he's an a-hole...lol" excuses...Nigga acting like a bitch...

Not showing up to an all-star gathering of singers/artists for a charity single is not even remotely in the same bag as those other things....At all...

But I'll let u continue on, KAP....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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AFKAP_of_Darkness
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Wed Nov-05-14 01:23 PM

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61. "You're free to believe that."
In response to Reply # 60


  

          


>Not showing up to an all-star gathering of singers/artists for
>a charity single is not even remotely in the same bag as those
>other things....At all...

But what does that have to do with whether or not the song sucked (an objective opinion anyway), whether the funds got misappropriated (which I'm sure Prince presciently was able to foresee at the time) or whether the singers ate caviar (uh... why shouldn't they?)?

_____________________

http://fc03.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2010/287/6/c/the_wire_lineup__huge_download_by_dennisculver-d30s7vl.jpg
The man who thinks at 50 the same way he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life - Muhammed Ali

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Wed Nov-05-14 02:12 PM

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62. "RE: You're free to believe that."
In response to Reply # 61
Wed Nov-05-14 02:17 PM by murph71

          

>
>>Not showing up to an all-star gathering of singers/artists
>for
>>a charity single is not even remotely in the same bag as
>those
>>other things....At all...
>
>But what does that have to do with whether or not the song
>sucked (an objective opinion anyway), whether the funds got
>misappropriated (which I'm sure Prince presciently was able to
>foresee at the time) or whether the singers ate caviar (uh...
>why shouldn't they?)?


I never said anything about the song sucking...And I don't care if people were drinking champagne while P was drinking his own piss...

It was the man's choice to not participate...And given that dude was on some lone wolf, outsider, super control freak shit it made perfect sense that Prince--at the height of his popularity and commercial impact--would say 'Nah, I'm good'...and send Sheila E instead...

Again, when Prince acts like an ass I call him out for it...But to me there's something cool about someone sticking to their convictions and not thinking he/she has to be a part of the team just to be liked/loved...Prince responded to the backlash in a very grounded, straight-no-chaser way on "Hello"....

And yeah...some folks did find "We Are The World" as corny as all hell...But I never heard that excuse from Prince or the folks that was around him during that time...Dude simply didn't believe in the cause and probably felt weird following the lead of MJ and Lionel...




GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Bombastic
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Mon Nov-10-14 02:22 AM

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92. "RE: You're free to believe that."
In response to Reply # 61


  

          

>
>>Not showing up to an all-star gathering of singers/artists
>for
>>a charity single is not even remotely in the same bag as
>those
>>other things....At all...
>
>But what does that have to do with whether or not the song
>sucked (an objective opinion anyway), whether the funds got
>misappropriated (which I'm sure Prince presciently was able to
>foresee at the time) or whether the singers ate caviar (uh...
>why shouldn't they?)?

It doesn't, those were all things that we came to see over time that should give us even less reason to hype the evening in question as some kind of defining moment triggering a decline 30 years later.

I don't care that they were likely all coked up, eating caviar and drinking champagne, that's the life they're afforded particularly then.

It's the pomposity and sheer ridiculousness of that crowd being betrayed and/or angered (like he had a relationship with almost any of them to begin with) that I can't abide.

Rushing the next album after Purple Rain, blowing up his once-promising film career with the follow up critical/commercial disaster of Under The Cherry Moon, those two albums having maybe 3 singles combined that approached the impact of 1999/PR's top 3/4 warhorses a piece......even just shunning press or not performing at Live-Aid would be more legit than this narrative weaved above.

He skipped a chance to sing two bars of lead vocal and be in a choir on a schmaltzy charity single spearheaded by his biggest competitors then he went club-hopping on Sunset after an award show as a 25-year-old rock star in his playboy prime and his bodyguard happened to get arrested.

  

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mrhood75
Member since Dec 06th 2004
44719 posts
Thu Nov-06-14 01:55 AM

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63. "Yeah, you missed the point. Again. "
In response to Reply # 60


  

          

It wouldn't have mattered if he had just missed the session. It's that he skipped the session and was seen out partying like an asshole. He doesn't go on out clubbing and sticks to the "I was sick" story, it's all a non-issue. Choosing to celebrate like a nimrod while the rest of the music industry stars are in the studio recording a song for charity is where he fucked up.

-----------------

www.albumism.com

Checkin' Our Style, Return To Zero:

https://www.mixcloud.com/returntozero/

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
23113 posts
Thu Nov-06-14 09:39 AM

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64. "RE: Yeah, you missed the point. Again. "
In response to Reply # 63
Thu Nov-06-14 09:41 AM by murph71

          

>It wouldn't have mattered if he had just missed the session.
>It's that he skipped the session and was seen out partying
>like an asshole. He doesn't go on out clubbing and sticks to
>the "I was sick" story, it's all a non-issue. Choosing to
>celebrate like a nimrod while the rest of the music industry
>stars are in the studio recording a song for charity is where
>he fucked



As for Prince turning them down? Him partying is besides the point. Your point would have hit home more if Prince agreed to come, and then said NOPE I'M SICK and then backed out....Dude turned them down and then asked if he could write a song for the project...

It wasnt that serious. But since Prince wasnt about being a part of the establishment hes made out to be a dick. The irony is there are plenty of other things that makes Prince a dick...More than him saying he's sick, writing and recording a new song for said charity and keeping it moving...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Red07
Member since Oct 19th 2005
482 posts
Fri Nov-07-14 11:50 AM

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80. "RE: Yeah, you missed the point. Again. "
In response to Reply # 63


          

>It wouldn't have mattered if he had just missed the session.
>It's that he skipped the session and was seen out partying
>like an asshole. He doesn't go on out clubbing and sticks to
>the "I was sick" story, it's all a non-issue. Choosing to
>celebrate like a nimrod while the rest of the music industry
>stars are in the studio recording a song for charity is where
>he fucked up.


He a grown man,, He can do what the fuck he wants.. You dont let no one ever dictate what you can and cant do,.

  

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mrhood75
Member since Dec 06th 2004
44719 posts
Fri Nov-07-14 12:43 PM

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82. "RE: Yeah, you missed the point. Again. "
In response to Reply # 80


  

          


>He a grown man,, He can do what the fuck he wants.. You dont
>let no one ever dictate what you can and cant do,.

Then as a grown man, he deals with the consequences of his actions. Like most grown do.

-----------------

www.albumism.com

Checkin' Our Style, Return To Zero:

https://www.mixcloud.com/returntozero/

  

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Bombastic
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Mon Nov-10-14 04:20 AM

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93. "RE: Yeah, you missed the point. Again. "
In response to Reply # 63


  

          

>It wouldn't have mattered if he had just missed the session.
>It's that he skipped the session and was seen out partying
>like an asshole.
He's a 25-year-old rock star in LA on Grammy Night who went to go fuck around at clubs on the Sunset Strip.

He doesn't go on out clubbing and sticks to
>the "I was sick" story, it's all a non-issue.
Why is he grounded or needing a doctor's note to excuse a truancy?

Choosing to
>celebrate like a nimrod while the rest of the music industry
>stars are in the studio recording a song for charity is where
>he fucked up.

Oh please, he mighta saw or passed by David Lee Roth, Madonna, John Mellancamp and/or Billy Idol on his way in/out of VIP.

Let's stop acting like this was a comprehensive list of the luminaries on the musical landscape or that the mainstream music industry is a shared sports team and he skipped a practice or meeting.

The 80's (particularly the middle-peak of it) was a plastic era filled with empty gestures from Just Say No, Hands Across America, USA For Africa, Baby On Board, Concorde flights, Star Wars, Morning In America, Ebony & Ivory, Paul Simon's South African Angle and whatever the hell The US Festival was supposed to be.

Sloganeering trickling down from the elite levels of all of our major governmental/societal/financial institutions to continue as a society patting itself on the back for being good while in plain sight setting the wheels in motion for a new level of greed and craven corporate-driven perversion of democracy.

And no, I would not pretend that those were things that influenced Prince's decision not to partake in that evening's supposedly all-important reindeer game, I alredy explained where he was likely coming from in the first line of the first reply.

But the finger-wagging in this article/post as if Prince had a mandate to participate or needed to issue an alibi, hide in a hotel room or some grand atrocity was committed because a bodyguard of his got a little handsy on a night which could have just as easily included Sean Penn bludgeoning paparazzi with their own cameras as Madge looked on and down the hill the LAPD was sending Battle Ram's to bulldoze homes that might have gang affiliation?

*that* attitude is far more offensive to my sensibilities than Prince's crime in question.

We're talking about a socially-awkward, hyper-competitive, 25-year-old wunderkind who wasn't (pick any number of names to fit each category to follow) milquetoast, in or approachiny middle age, an inconsequential dickrider and/or the two authors of the all-important song who along with the vet producer already amounted to about six decades of experience in the music business between the three of them by 1985 while Prince had been on MTV for maybe two calendar years.

The Kid archetype was based on a loner mystique unable to trust people, cede any control of his art or play well with others.......and that was amongst his actual "scene" of freaky Minneapolis folks he was raised amongst.

In the midst of his moment in the cultural/creative zeitgeist he's gonna be a bit player on MJ's set?

Q was gonna arrange a part in there for him to do his thing there?

I mean, Q coulda even called his bluff and let him play a guitar break for a few measures but he knew damn well he wasn't about to risk giving him a platform to steal shine in that scenario.

Tom Petty prolly still gets that screw face from the Harrison R&RHOF Induction stage any time he thinks about what a mistake he made letting Prince come out for that last solo.

And some might debate it was hammy, unnecessarily aggressive, brazenly scenery-chewing or whatever but what can't be denied is that it was a genuinely memorable moment in what are oftentimes somewhat stodgy affairs which runs counterintuitive to what we know or knew rock & roll at its best to be.

Prince is by most measures of social construct for normal people, kind of a dick.

This is a man who during the 80's repeatedly told the press (on the rare occasions he would actually bless them with a few words) that he only listened to his own music whether in the car, on his headphones while exercising or even on the stereo in his bedroom while entertaining female company.

That is what makes him, despite a career that in his heyday featured music that could hardly even be classified as 'rock' for the most part, an actual rock star to a degree that Dave Grohl could never be no matter how many films he makes about his heroes or rock idols he performs or collaborates with during his well-intentioned yet artistically unremarkable career.

I don't begrudge any entertainer/public figure their political or religious beliefs and would encourage them to champion the causes they hold dear to their hearts while engaging in charitable works at a level they deem fit.

But when those personal beliefs become the hammer used to hit others with if they don't adhere to the same standard, then the risk of sanctimony is likely soon to follow (ironically, Older JW Prince has often been a prime example of this same behavior).

I will leave you with a word from the gospel according to Big Baby Jesus: http://youtu.be/PlWUDS-vXGc

  

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
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Sat Nov-08-14 01:09 PM

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84. "subtract the personalities involved."
In response to Reply # 59


  

          

if someone, offered to do a project...

declines, under the excuse of being "ill", then gets caught out there partying on the night of the project activities, against the advice of those managing you...


then yeah.

you deserve to be clowned for that.

all you had to do was decline and keep it moving.

instead, you fake sick, then go out partying like you won't be caught... LOL

I mean, seriously.

forget about Prince. if ANYONE did something like this, they'd be roasted.

  

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mrhood75
Member since Dec 06th 2004
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Sat Nov-08-14 09:39 PM

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87. "I mean, really I have no idea why people refuse to understand this^^^^^^..."
In response to Reply # 84


  

          

-----------------

www.albumism.com

Checkin' Our Style, Return To Zero:

https://www.mixcloud.com/returntozero/

  

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Bombastic
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98. "because the bottom line was he never agreed to participate"
In response to Reply # 87


  

          

at any point or show any interest in being part of the project as it was constructed.

Instead he offered alternate options (him playing guitar on the track instead, which Q spazzed about and/or contributing an original song of his own to the soundtrack) but at no point leading up to or on the night in question did he actually agree to be at that session nor did he concoct the illness story, that was the hyperventilating of managers about the blowback if he'd offered no explanation and just went out that night, overcompensating in a panic once it became clear to them that he still had no intention of going to the thing.

So you guys wanna act like he backed out of a commitment he made, spent time pumping up a fake illness and defied his management on the prior two issues when that's just not the case.

You guys are reflexively trying to make a Jay Electronica studio-time/release-date post out of this but it doesn't fit in this context.

  

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Bombastic
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65. "acting like a rock star got him ostracized by rock stars"
In response to Reply # 56


  

          

It was a silly thing to be outraged about then and/or now.

It's also clear they would have been mad had he just stayed home anyway, as it's pretty clear by all accounts the collective at the session was mad before the bodyguard news broke the next day.

  

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AFKAP_of_Darkness
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66. "You need to put that in its proper context, though."
In response to Reply # 65


  

          

Saying "acting like a rock star" is dangerously vague.

That kind of "rock star" behavior really was not in vogue in the early 80s. Look at the big stars of the era: Phil Collins, MJ, LBR, The Boss, Hall & Oates... metal wouldn't really blow up till the latter part of the decade, bringing back the stereotypical "rock star" act with it.

_____________________

http://fc03.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2010/287/6/c/the_wire_lineup__huge_download_by_dennisculver-d30s7vl.jpg
The man who thinks at 50 the same way he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life - Muhammed Ali

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Thu Nov-06-14 01:36 PM

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68. "RE: You need to put that in its proper context, though."
In response to Reply # 66


          

>Saying "acting like a rock star" is dangerously vague.
>
>That kind of "rock star" behavior really was not in vogue in
>the early 80s. Look at the big stars of the era: Phil Collins,
>MJ, LBR, The Boss, Hall & Oates... metal wouldn't really blow
>up till the latter part of the decade, bringing back the
>stereotypical "rock star" act with it.


And I think that's why most Prince fans didn't mind the Midget not being a part of it....He wasn't going to be part of the crowd...

I think it goes beyond being the stereotypical rock star...It was Prince being Prince...He was the same way when he first got signed and he's the same way now: on some lone wolf shit who never beat on his chest about his own charity efforts like others that were in that room...

I kinda dug the fact that dude was helping kids in the 'hoods of Chicago and practically adopted a school and made it his cause to keep it open...I had a friend that was going to that Marva Collins school. He was happy and bragging to me about Collins talking to the students about the money P raised for their school to keep it open...

Some people give in their own way...Why be a slave to what other people think?

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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AFKAP_of_Darkness
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69. "Raising awareness of an issue is not necessarily 'beating one's chest'"
In response to Reply # 68


  

          

>on some lone wolf shit
>who never beat on his chest about his own charity efforts like
>others that were in that room...

_____________________

http://fc03.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2010/287/6/c/the_wire_lineup__huge_download_by_dennisculver-d30s7vl.jpg
The man who thinks at 50 the same way he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life - Muhammed Ali

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Thu Nov-06-14 02:32 PM

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70. "RE: Raising awareness of an issue is not necessarily 'beating one's ches..."
In response to Reply # 69


          



U r right....

I just like the fact that the guy that is being made the villain in all this was putting in work behind the scenes for schools that desperately needed money...And in my neck of the woods no less. And never did we see a press conference or a news blast about it when he actually was breaking off bread until Marva Collins announced it. Meanwhile he was being called everything but a child of God...

Everybody gives in their own way, I guess...

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Bombastic
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Thu Nov-06-14 09:55 PM

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75. "RE: You need to put that in its proper context, though."
In response to Reply # 66


  

          

>Saying "acting like a rock star" is dangerously vague.
>
>That kind of "rock star" behavior really was not in vogue in
>the early 80s. Look at the big stars of the era: Phil Collins,
>MJ, LBR, The Boss, Hall & Oates...

That list is comprised of people that had either already done their young rock star stuff that Prince at 25 at his commercial/critical apex was right in the middle of doing (far more mildly I might add) or they are barely rock stars at all.

Can you imagine David Bowie (now in the midst of being lost in the wake of his biggest hit/last great album and now filming the rock vocalist version of the Top Gun volleyball scene) at any time in the decade plus before 1984/85 having to answer for not being one more show pony in a crowded room of self-congratulatory cocaine and caviar to record a shitty song or getting lambasted by peers in the rock community for his bodyguard getting arrested?

I understand the climate, Live-Aid took place in my city, we owned all those records and my parents went to JFK Stadium as I watched/recorded 10+ hours of concert footage with the babysitter and made a donation to USA For Africa then received a t-shirt that went past my knees in the mail.

What I'm saying is now that I look back at it as a grown up, I realize I don't really respect it much more than I do all the faux-outrage on Twitter.

I guess that in my mind not giving a shit what some old Brit cunts who had already been thru decades of drugs and debauchery now hanging on into the Reagan era, forming w coalition of the pseudo-conscious while battling to maintain the pasty positioning of the new visual medium on cable, making huge echo-chamber drum sounds and Whiteboy synthisized crystalized/polished turds was actually pretty damn rock & roll.

And perhaps why Prince's work from the first half of that decade, despite the neglected catalog and shitty sound from an audiophile perspective........holds up to this day in a way that Reckless, No Jacket Required, Dream of the Blue Turtles and Big Bam Boom do not.

Anyway, I can pinpoint a lot of ways Prince went wrong after this period but this really ain't it.

metal wouldn't really blow
>up till the latter part of the decade, bringing back the
>stereotypical "rock star" act with it.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Fri Nov-07-14 09:54 AM

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76. "RE: You need to put that in its proper context, though."
In response to Reply # 75


          

>>Saying "acting like a rock star" is dangerously vague.
>>
>>That kind of "rock star" behavior really was not in vogue in
>>the early 80s. Look at the big stars of the era: Phil
>Collins,
>>MJ, LBR, The Boss, Hall & Oates...
>
>That list is comprised of people that had either already done
>their young rock star stuff that Prince at 25 at his
>commercial/critical apex was right in the middle of doing (far
>more mildly I might add) or they are barely rock stars at all.
>
>
>Can you imagine David Bowie (now in the midst of being lost in
>the wake of his biggest hit/last great album and now filming
>the rock vocalist version of the Top Gun volleyball scene) at
>any time in the decade plus before 1984/85 having to answer
>for not being one more show pony in a crowded room of
>self-congratulatory cocaine and caviar to record a shitty song
>or getting lambasted by peers in the rock community for his
>bodyguard getting arrested?
>
>I understand the climate, Live-Aid took place in my city, we
>owned all those records and my parents went to JFK Stadium as
>I watched/recorded 10+ hours of concert footage with the
>babysitter and made a donation to USA For Africa then received
>a t-shirt that went past my knees in the mail.
>
>What I'm saying is now that I look back at it as a grown up, I
>realize I don't really respect it much more than I do all the
>faux-outrage on Twitter.
>
>I guess that in my mind not giving a shit what some old Brit
>cunts who had already been thru decades of drugs and
>debauchery now hanging on into the Reagan era, forming w
>coalition of the pseudo-conscious while battling to maintain
>the pasty positioning of the new visual medium on cable,
>making huge echo-chamber drum sounds and Whiteboy synthisized
>crystalized/polished turds was actually pretty damn rock &
>roll.
>
>And perhaps why Prince's work from the first half of that
>decade, despite the neglected catalog and shitty sound from an
>audiophile perspective........holds up to this day in a way
>that Reckless, No Jacket Required, Dream of the Blue Turtles
>and Big Bam Boom do not.
>
>Anyway, I can pinpoint a lot of ways Prince went wrong after
>this period but this really ain't it.
>
>metal wouldn't really blow
>>up till the latter part of the decade, bringing back the
>>stereotypical "rock star" act with it.


After this^^^^we should just shut this shit down...Like for real....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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fire
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Fri Nov-07-14 10:39 AM

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77. "succinct like a mug"
In response to Reply # 76


          

________________________________________
who gonna check me boo?!

www.twitter.com/firefire100
http://instagram.com/firefire100
www.philadelphiaeagles.com

  

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fire
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67. "black artists are property"
In response to Reply # 65


          

no matter how big they are

________________________________________
who gonna check me boo?!

www.twitter.com/firefire100
http://instagram.com/firefire100
www.philadelphiaeagles.com

  

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rdhull
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Sun Nov-09-14 10:51 PM

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91. "tellin a grown man to stay in a hotel"
In response to Reply # 67


  

          

on the biggest night of his life etc


>no matter how big they are

  

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Red07
Member since Oct 19th 2005
482 posts
Mon Nov-10-14 09:10 AM

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94. "RE: tellin a grown man to stay in a hotel"
In response to Reply # 91


          

yeah they crazy as fuck

  

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Red07
Member since Oct 19th 2005
482 posts
Fri Nov-07-14 11:48 AM

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79. "RE: All the "But the song sucked!" talk misses the point"
In response to Reply # 56


          

>Yes, the song sucked. But it really doesn't matter if it was
>garbage or it was the greatest piece of recorded music since
>"Let's Get it On". I'd certainly hope we're all adult enough
>to agree that even considering that the song was trash, it was
>really bad form of Prince to spend the night partying while
>the rest of "Record Industry Royalty" was off recording a
>track for charity.
>
>No one would have cared if Prince wasn't on "We Are the World"
>if he wasn't out making an ass of himself instead. THAT was
>the issue, not whether or not he was going to be trading lines
>with Michael Jackson.



HOw exactly is going ojt making an ass of himself..was he publicly intoxicated, groping women

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Tue Nov-11-14 08:37 AM

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103. "I think "the Song sucked" is short hand for, it wasn't that big of a dea..."
In response to Reply # 56


  

          

the long run. A bunch of self-important musicians placed all this significance on the song and Prince didn't buy into it.

Prince won because he didn't buy into it and he is one of the few from that gathering that are still standing.




**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

http://blackpeopleonlocalnews.tumblr.com/

  

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spirit
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72. "Madonna didn't make it either, right? "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Her absence from "We Are The World" didn't seem to hurt her any.

Peace,

Spirit (Alan)
http://wutangbook.com

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Thu Nov-06-14 04:30 PM

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73. "RE: Madonna didn't make it either, right? "
In response to Reply # 72


          

>Her absence from "We Are The World" didn't seem to hurt her
>any.


We know the reason to that though....lol

Also, she did appear at Live Aid....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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fire
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Thu Nov-06-14 04:47 PM

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74. "she has privilege that prince does not"
In response to Reply # 72


          

________________________________________
who gonna check me boo?!

www.twitter.com/firefire100
http://instagram.com/firefire100
www.philadelphiaeagles.com

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Fri Nov-07-14 11:48 AM

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78. "Last thought: Where did Prince go wrong? "
In response to Reply # 0
Fri Nov-07-14 11:48 AM by murph71

          


Again, I got a lot of respect for Alan. I interned at a magazine when he was the head chief there...Talked to him about all things Prince--the good and the horribly bad...

But Prince not attending "We Are The World" had no affect on P's career one way or the other...

U know what had an impact on Prince's career? Dude flooding the market with music....

Prince never let the public time to miss him....Not saying that dude should have taken those MJ like layoffs...But shit...Dude was averaging an album a yeah, producing other acts WITH HIS SOUND, and touring like a mad man....

Like really...Who else would drop a follow-up album THE NEXT YEAR after their biggest commercial release? That's what Prince did after Purple Rain. This started a domino effect that not only cut into his record sales but it never let the public get a chance to catch up...We can talk about the bomb of a movie Under The Cherry Moon...But I am of the belief that Prince would have toured beyond a few spots in the US and in Europe...

Prince sitting on his music would have not only extended his run, but it probably would have given an album like SOTT more room to breath, which would have allowed him to do a full US tour, ect, ect...

Sure gangsta rap played a role in making Prince less menacing...And Teddy Riley made his "black" down to earth, New Jack Swing sound the new pop music, forcing P and MJ to catch up...But really, Prince being eaten by the music monster had the BIGGEST impact on his run...

The irony is TODAY Prince is being celebrated for his prolific output...Wasn't quite like that back then....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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revolution75
Member since May 07th 2003
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Fri Nov-07-14 04:08 PM

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83. "no US tours , horrible choice for singles , no vids for key singles "
In response to Reply # 78


  

          

I get taking a break in 85 and cleansing the palette of all things PR
BUT he really should have toured the states in 86 and 87...especially 87!!!
His peak years in Europe is based solely on those amazing tours
By 88,it was too late to tour the U.S.

Plus, his head scratching choice to drop Mountains after the smash success of Kiss messed him up
Same for SOTT, if I was (w/no video) was a horrible second release choice when there were better choices that would have boosted sales.
U got and I could saved Sign not because they were the best songs, it was the videos that got him over.

Eclectic Soul/Sunday, 2-4 PM est/89.3 WCSB.ORG

  

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
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Sat Nov-08-14 01:12 PM

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85. "Prince really neglected to promote his best material."
In response to Reply # 83


  

          

if not for Purple Rain and all the work that went into the movie and album...

LOL, I'm not sure Prince reaches the artistic heights he does afterward.

I guess I give him all the credit in the world for trying to "keep it underground". My dude JCM had a post about how Prince was trying to ward off a "certain" kind of following (ironically that's who he's been trying to court since the post-Batman fall off), and in that, records that should have been bigger successes than they were based on the combo of his celebrity and the actual quality of the music never reached those heights.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Sat Nov-08-14 08:20 PM

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86. "RE: Prince really neglected to promote his best material."
In response to Reply # 85


          

>if not for Purple Rain and all the work that went into the
>movie and album...
>
>LOL, I'm not sure Prince reaches the artistic heights he does
>afterward.
>
>I guess I give him all the credit in the world for trying to
>"keep it underground". My dude JCM had a post about how Prince
>was trying to ward off a "certain" kind of following
>(ironically that's who he's been trying to court since the
>post-Batman fall off), and in that, records that should have
>been bigger successes than they were based on the combo of his
>celebrity and the actual quality of the music never reached
>those heights.


I think that's why dude was releasing music like a madman...He didn't care about the normal formats that were used within the record industry machine...He didn't care about building up hype for an album. He didn't care if fans had little notice to jump from project to project. He didn't care that his sound had become omnipresent in popular music and that maybe it would be a good idea to fall back for a minute...

And he didn't care to play the game (We Are The World, Live Aid, the would be Bad collaboration, ect...)...This meant that an album like SOTT, which is now viewed as a landmark work, stalled after it's double platinum success, a victim as others have said of baffling singles and not touring the States...

But when you really think about it, Prince had retained that commercial golden-boy status after the Batman album and Diamonds & Pearls...Dude sold a combined 15 million copies on those two projects...

Once he saw the success of those two albums dude started to chase that overt commercialized dragon....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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Red07
Member since Oct 19th 2005
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Sun Nov-09-14 05:39 PM

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89. "RE: Prince really neglected to promote his best material."
In response to Reply # 86


          

Yep, i remember in 87 a lot of critics were saying, the years best album is sitting near the bottom of Billboard 200 albums list...So, the ? is, did it really hurt his career..In retrospect, artists would die for his career.. I believe Anita Baker recently stated she thought he was crazy as a loon when he waged battle his warners until said label started tripping on her then it all made sense.

  

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Joe Corn Mo
Member since Aug 29th 2010
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Sun Nov-09-14 02:49 PM

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88. "commercially or artistically?"
In response to Reply # 78


  

          

if we wanna be honest, prince still had commercial juice
all the way through "most beautiful girl in the world."

all the 80s stars were eating good through the mid 90s, really.

what killed prince was the assless chaps AND the name change AND the battle with Warner Bros AND the outright refusal to release commercially viable product.

i have a theory that prince can release listenable songs whenever he feels like it.
he needed a hit for D&P and we got the title track.
he needed a hit from the beautiful experience to prove WB wrong and we got "most beautiful girl on the world."

he wanted a comeback in 04 and he played PR at the Grammys,
released musicology and then followed it up with Black Sweat.

He reunited with WB and he released the album.

I'm not saying he can shit out a PR whenever he wants,
but he can have a presence on the radio any time he wants one.


it's like he dropped sign of the times
and then decided he wasn't giving ppl music on their terms unless he wanted to.



where did he go wrong artistically?
that's a harder question.



>Again, I got a lot of respect for Alan. I interned at a
>magazine when he was the head chief there...Talked to him
>about all things Prince--the good and the horribly bad...
>
>But Prince not attending "We Are The World" had no affect on
>P's career one way or the other...
>
>U know what had an impact on Prince's career? Dude flooding
>the market with music....
>
>Prince never let the public time to miss him....Not saying
>that dude should have taken those MJ like layoffs...But
>shit...Dude was averaging an album a yeah, producing other
>acts WITH HIS SOUND, and touring like a mad man....
>
>Like really...Who else would drop a follow-up album THE NEXT
>YEAR after their biggest commercial release? That's what
>Prince did after Purple Rain. This started a domino effect
>that not only cut into his record sales but it never let the
>public get a chance to catch up...We can talk about the bomb
>of a movie Under The Cherry Moon...But I am of the belief that
>Prince would have toured beyond a few spots in the US and in
>Europe...
>
>Prince sitting on his music would have not only extended his
>run, but it probably would have given an album like SOTT more
>room to breath, which would have allowed him to do a full US
>tour, ect, ect...
>
>Sure gangsta rap played a role in making Prince less
>menacing...And Teddy Riley made his "black" down to earth, New
>Jack Swing sound the new pop music, forcing P and MJ to catch
>up...But really, Prince being eaten by the music monster had
>the BIGGEST impact on his run...
>
>The irony is TODAY Prince is being celebrated for his prolific
>output...Wasn't quite like that back then....
>
>

  

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Red07
Member since Oct 19th 2005
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Sun Nov-09-14 05:41 PM

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90. "RE: commercially or artistically?"
In response to Reply # 88


          

I agree. Jimmy Jam has always said that if prince wanted to write a hit, he'd write a hit,,,,

  

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
132214 posts
Mon Nov-10-14 10:32 AM

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95. "You know, I agree with this"
In response to Reply # 88


  

          

>all the 80s stars were eating good through the mid 90s,
>really.
>
>what killed prince was the assless chaps AND the name change
>AND the battle with Warner Bros AND the outright refusal to
>release commercially viable product.
>
>i have a theory that prince can release listenable songs
>whenever he feels like it.
>he needed a hit for D&P and we got the title track.
>he needed a hit from the beautiful experience to prove WB
>wrong and we got "most beautiful girl on the world."
>
>he wanted a comeback in 04 and he played PR at the Grammys,
>released musicology and then followed it up with Black Sweat.

the '90s was the worst time to be a Prince fan. ever.

the funny thing is that I'm hearing more increasingly that people became Prince fans in the '90s. which lends itself to what you said... when he writes those hits, he gets peoples' attentions.

but he was making the equivalent of rap albums in the CD boom. One track to sell the record, and then you find out you got a lot of doo doo surrounding that track (see: Immobliarity)


  

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Joe Corn Mo
Member since Aug 29th 2010
15139 posts
Mon Nov-10-14 11:29 AM

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96. "it makes a certain amount of sense. "
In response to Reply # 95


  

          

i fell in love with stevie wonder when i saw that cosby show episode.
i didn't get into his 60s/ 70s stuff until my senior year in high school.

and yes, the 90s were awful.

it was actually easier to be an MJ fan, in a way.
because it was plausible that MJ was a kindhearted fool
that actually wanted you to be a fan, for the most part.

prince hated his fans.
sued them. trolled them. he hated us. lol

>the '90s was the worst time to be a Prince fan. ever.
>
>the funny thing is that I'm hearing more increasingly that
>people became Prince fans in the '90s. which lends itself to
>what you said... when he writes those hits, he gets peoples'
>attentions.
>
>but he was making the equivalent of rap albums in the CD boom.
>One track to sell the record, and then you find out you got a
>lot of doo doo surrounding that track (see: Immobliarity)
>
>
>

  

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
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Mon Nov-10-14 11:56 AM

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97. "I wrote this and backspaced it."
In response to Reply # 96


  

          

>it was actually easier to be an MJ fan, in a way.
>because it was plausible that MJ was a kindhearted fool
>that actually wanted you to be a fan, for the most part.

nearly all the "legacy" artists you could name had a better time in the '90s than Prince. including MJ (considering all the mess that went down with him music-related and otherwise).

>prince hated his fans.
>sued them. trolled them. he hated us. lol

part of the trolling was burying his great material, or sullying stronger material with nonsense. or giving it away on some BS (The Undertaker, my personal favorite project in the '90s).

it took all the way to Emancipation for Prince to cut most of the BS. Of course he does so on a 3-disc set. LOL.

I felt the Gold Experience was close, too. The problem w/that album again, is that he had to "troll" somehow. also, he didn't promote it because Warner Brothers feud.

but going back to your other comment. If Prince wants to make a "hit", he can do so.

Though Prince isn't really promoting it, you know which song casual listeners and/or people who jumped off the bandwagon said brought them back to Prince?

"The Gold Standard".

and one listen, and you know why.

I have had people who come up to me (because they know I like Prince so much) to tell me about that song.

Prince has been doing "versions" of such a song for years, but that one caught people's ears.



  

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HotThyng76
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Mon Nov-10-14 02:12 PM

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99. "'sitting on music' wasn't a thing in the early 80s."
In response to Reply # 78
Mon Nov-10-14 02:13 PM by HotThyng76

  

          

not even 10-15 yrs prior acts regularly released TWO studio albums per year. remember, CBS was panicked/pissed when Sly spent 2 yrs working on Riot after Stand! and Motown wasn't too happy that Stevie spent 2 yrs on SITKOL after FFF - which had followed Innervisions, TB and MOMM w/in a yr and half or so.

and big-time acts who also wrote and produced for other acts regularly had their own product competing w/product they'd produced (Curtis Mayfield, James Brown, George Clinton, Stevie Wonder, Maurice White, et al). even MJ didn't really sit on his music after Thriller (Victory album came in 1984) but the success of Bad 5 yrs after Thriller kinda woke up labels up to the idea that the gen pop will stick w/an act even if no new product is released for a 'long' stretch.

so what Prince did in the early 80s by releasing his own studio album each yr while music he'd produced was also out there wasn't abnormal. that's not what hurt his career as much as it was about poor promotional efforts - poor single choices ('Mountains' instead of 'Girls & Boys', 'If I Was Your Girlfriend' instead of 'U Got the Look' or 'Adore'), lack of music videos ('Sign o' the Times', 'Pop Life'), lack of touring in the USA (SOTT Tour 1987).

the idea that Prince needed to sit on his music is hindsight talk, IMO. back when P was doing it acts on his level were still expected to deliver new product at least yearly.

  

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Joe Corn Mo
Member since Aug 29th 2010
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Mon Nov-10-14 02:59 PM

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100. "even WB didn't have THAT much of a problem w/ it. "
In response to Reply # 99
Mon Nov-10-14 03:08 PM by Joe Corn Mo

  

          

1999,
sign of the times,
graffiti bridge,

that's three double albums.
prince was upset because he wanted sign to be a triple album.

and i guess there were other problems, too.
but he got 3 movies, a blockbuster soundtrack, countless side groups,
i mean, looking back, it's tough to see what prince was mad about.

They pretty much let him do whatever he wanted.

he had a point about not owning masters, generally.
but really, prince needed to calm down.

  

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murph71
Member since Sep 15th 2005
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Mon Nov-10-14 04:46 PM

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101. "RE: 'sitting on music' wasn't a thing in the early 80s."
In response to Reply # 99
Mon Nov-10-14 04:53 PM by murph71

          

>not even 10-15 yrs prior acts regularly released TWO studio
>albums per year. remember, CBS was panicked/pissed when Sly
>spent 2 yrs working on Riot after Stand! and Motown wasn't
>too happy that Stevie spent 2 yrs on SITKOL after FFF - which
>had followed Innervisions, TB and MOMM w/in a yr and half or
>so.
>
>and big-time acts who also wrote and produced for other acts
>regularly had their own product competing w/product they'd
>produced (Curtis Mayfield, James Brown, George Clinton, Stevie
>Wonder, Maurice White, et al). even MJ didn't really sit on
>his music after Thriller (Victory album came in 1984) but the
>success of Bad 5 yrs after Thriller kinda woke up labels up to
>the idea that the gen pop will stick w/an act even if no new
>product is released for a 'long' stretch.
>
>so what Prince did in the early 80s by releasing his own
>studio album each yr while music he'd produced was also out
>there wasn't abnormal. that's not what hurt his career as
>much as it was about poor promotional efforts - poor single
>choices ('Mountains' instead of 'Girls & Boys', 'If I Was Your
>Girlfriend' instead of 'U Got the Look' or 'Adore'), lack of
>music videos ('Sign o' the Times', 'Pop Life'), lack of
>touring in the USA (SOTT Tour 1987).
>
>the idea that Prince needed to sit on his music is hindsight
>talk, IMO. back when P was doing it acts on his level were
>still expected to deliver new product at least yearly.

U r correct...But the '60s and '70s were waaaaay different than the '80s....

The '60s and '70's were the eras in which artists DID NOT sit on music...Labels basically implored/forced their artists to release singles with no daylight and by the time the "album" era came in the late '60s labels wanted an album a year...They felt in order for an act to stay relevant artists had to keep dropping records....As you noted Sly and Stevie caught some flack from their labels because of the long period it took to release their albums...

This^^^^is true...

For most labels if it took longer than four months to work on an album you were eating up studio money....

That all changed with the blockbuster era of the '80s headlined by albums like Thriller.....

Warner Bros had NO problem with Prince dropping back to back to back releases with Dirty Mind, Controversy, and 1999 because he was building his audience....But by the time MJ dropped Thriller everything had changed...

By the '80s, labels wanted their SUPERSTAR ACTS to release their "event" album and drop a shit load of singles, videos, and tour to ride out that wave. You mentioned MJ following up Thriller with the Jackson's Victory album? That wasn't viewed as a "MJ" project...In fact, Mike didn't even appear in any of the Victory videos....He didn't want no parts of that album nor that tour. But he did so for the FAM....

Nah, MJ was very strategic. He wanted to give the public time to let Thriller go (didn't happen...lol). He wanted his fans to anticipate his next release AND he wanted to destroy Thriller. Which meant giving the public time to miss Michael Jackson, which allowed Mike to take his time on his next release (Bad)...

But really, don't take it from me...here's a list of some the BIG albums that came out in the '80s and their follow-ups....


Tina Turner: Private Dancer (1984)...Break Every Rule (1986) (2 year break)

Lionel Richie: Can't Slow Down (1983)...Dancing On The Ceiling (1986) (nearly a 3 year break)

Madonna: Like A Prayer (1984)...True Blue (1986)...Like A Prayer (1989) (a two and 3 year break..)

Bruce Springsteen: Born In The USA (1984)...Tunnel Of Love (1987)

Janet Jackson: Control (1986)...Rhythm Nation (1989)...Janet (1993)

Even Whitney Houston waited 2 to 3 years between albums before her drug issues....

Prince? Not so much....Dude was releasing music like he only had three years to live....Dude was still releasing singles off of Purple Rain when ATWIAD came out....That was one of the main reasons he beefed with WB...He wanted to release music at the exact time he wanted to release it...That meant stepping on the momentum of an album/never taking a break...Yeah, poor single choices and his penchant for giving up on the promotion on his releases played a HUGE role.

But I believe Prince didn't give much time for his fans to breath in between releases....

GOAT of his era......long live Prince.....God is alive....

  

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HotThyng76
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Mon Nov-10-14 04:58 PM

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102. "fine."
In response to Reply # 101


  

          

  

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self_ish
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Wed Nov-12-14 11:27 AM

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104. "Howard Bloom (Prince's former PR rep) on when "everything changed""
In response to Reply # 0


          

Partial swipe:

I went to see a show in...I've got to keep these things straight... back around 1986 or 1987. It was after "Purple Rain" (and) while he was working on "Under the Cherry Moon." It was at Nassau Coliseum (in Long Island, NY), which is an 18,000 seat (theater). Prince has always been one of the most amazing performers I've ever seen onstage in my life. (He), John Mellencamp and Michael Jackson are three of the most amazing performers I've ever seen. Prince was dancing incredibly onstage and the lighting was wonderful-- that's another thing that he has a gift for-- and, all of sudden, a voice came out from the middle of the ceiling, which was probably four to five stories over us, and it was the voice of "God" telling Prince...it didn't even matter what it was saying. Something became very obvious: part of his mind was Prince and part of his mind was his father. The battle had begun between two of Prince's voices. Some would have called it the battle between his ego, id and his superego.

Once upon a time when I was in Indiana with John Mellencamp (he) sat me down to watch a movie called "Hud (starring Paul Newman, released in 1963)." "Hud" is about a young guy who rebels against his dad. John explained to me (that) the underlying pattern of this movie is first Hud rebels against his dad, then Hud becomes his dad. John's point was we all go through that. Well, that's what I saw happening with Prince. The voice of his dad was coming out in him, that was the voice that he would have interpreted as the voice of God. It was taking more and more control; it was asking for more and more control.

When "Under the Cherry Moon" was finished, I got a call from Bob Cavallo and he said "We're showing the movie tomorrow at our 600 seat theater on Sunset Boulevard." It was a test theater, all the people in the audience had little buttons that they could rotate to show how they're responding to a scene. I watched the movie and it was terrific! I came out and I told them so. I thought it was really good.

Later--it could have been anywhere from two weeks to two months--I got another call from California saying "You've got to be out here tomorrow. Prince has made changes in the film. You're not supposed to see it, but if we hide you in our office at night, could you look at it and tell us what you think?" Well, in the first version that I saw, Prince had a happy ending. It was a ending that Warner Brothers insisted he use. Normally, I'm against outsiders dictating to an artist what he can and cannot do, it’s almost always a disaster. But, in this case, the ending worked. When I saw the second version of "Under the Cherry Moon," Prince had gone in the opposite direction. He killed off his character. Why? Because Prince was identifying with God more strongly than he was identifying with himself. He felt that he had to do what God would have demanded: if he (was) a character who was a scamp, who represented his era of sexual freedom, he had to kill himself off. And he did. The movie was pathetic. It was terrible. There was no point in watching it really, except for Kristin Scott Thomas, who was an amazing discovery. So, that's when it all changed, when the voice of Prince's dad took over who Prince was.

Then in 1988, we all got the word: Bob Cavallo was fired, I was fired, everybody was fired. Prince was taking off in a new direction, dictated by the god inside of him. I've always seen the god inside of us as ecstatic figures, as figures that take a sense of these wild varieties of the religious experience. Prince had discovered a god who, instead, was a disciplinarian; not a God of passions, but who a God who clamps down and controls the passions. So, that's when it all changed. That's when Prince became the "artist formerly known as Prince."

Full article: http://beautifulnightschitown.blogspot.com/2014/10/the-truth-howard-bloom-talks-2.html

......................................

https://soundcloud.com/jasper_brown

http://jasperbrown.bandcamp.com/

  

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Strangeways
Member since Jul 10th 2007
1988 posts
Tue Nov-18-14 10:08 PM

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106. "RE: When the Purple Rain came falling down (Long SWIPE)"
In response to Reply # 0


          

oh LORD......here comes the drama!

  

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