9. "RE: you just dug the hole deeper" In response to Reply # 7
> >smh @ this > >using the man's willingness to release a variety of work as a >knock against him > >shameful >
Just because its a variety of work doesn't mean its all good. But I dug The Further Adventures of Lord Quas and a lot of people here didn't dig that so what do I know.
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18. "is this something you take personally?" In response to Reply # 16
I get the whole opinion thing, but it's not like this is 4o or some shit
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32. "the more likely answer is that people see what you see" In response to Reply # 25
and just choose to not agree he has neither the catalogue or innovation to be considered the best, honestly I may not have him firmly in my top ten and I've been a fan of dude for almost 2o years
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35. "yeah his catalogue is shaky at best" In response to Reply # 33
and how in the hell am I living in the past when Lib was out 2o years ago? you're telling me he's been more innovative and integral to the culture than everyone else, and I'm saying it's not true at all
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43. "I haven't ignored anything" In response to Reply # 39
He's done more unlistenable music than any high caliber producer that I can think of, and I say that as a person that's heard and liked most of it Madlib has been one of Hip Hop's true lifelines for the past decade especially, but the culture didn't shift when he came along the way it did with the other 3-and I'm not talking about influence as much as I am technique You can love his work so much that you pop one off in your own mouth listening to Rock Konducta in reverse, but you've yet to come with a argument beyond "I love the stuff and you guys don't get it if you don't agree" And that's not a viable argument to begin with
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45. "you know this is an argument i've been building for years" In response to Reply # 43
i really think you underestimate the catalog and innovation (basically birthing a generation of sp 202-404 based producers for one) but you make certain acknowledgements that show you're aware just not ready to put him above the heroes of your youth
48. "Actually I grew up on Hip Hop from the beginning" In response to Reply # 45
I was here for all periods of the culture so your argument doesn't wash; if I felt that way I'd never put Pete and his peers above Rick Rubin and Larry Smith You're going to have to deal with the fact that you have no argument for your stance beyond a personal feeling you have with the music, and honestly the fact that you've been building an argument for this shows you're frighteningly invested in people "recognizing" that you're right
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28. "you don't have to go this far to prove your point" In response to Reply # 26
>Ob4cl & Liquid Swords >remain two of the most overrated records in the history of the >genre >
Both of those albums are incredible and are absolutely as good as people say they are. Madvillain is on that level, too. No need to bash the classics, Madlib's got his as well.
41. "Well..." In response to Reply # 38 Sun Sep-28-14 07:51 PM by Anonymous
I am of the opinion that RZA benefited from the Wu MCs more so than the other big 2...Pete and Primo.
And I Iove CL and Guru so don't take that as a slight to them.
But in my opinion, RZA and the Wu were more about the overall image and concept of the group than his actual production.
I also believe his genius his producing those albums wasn't necessarily in his actual beats but in the way he composed the sound, atmosphere and flow of the albums.
So this is a tough question to ask because I believe people are not judging this on the same baseline.
People picking RZA are doing so based on the albums he produced and executive produced. His track record is ridiculous for those first 4-5 years.
People picking Madlib are doing so based on the actual beats, track for track. Madlib is a producers producer and has the technical shit down better than most.
For some people, that doesn't mean much if it doesn't equate into classic albums.
And it sounds like for others, RZA's classic run doesn't mean much because they don't feel the actual beats by themselves are the star of the show.
Next two are going to be Dilla and Pete and Potty has already said he's picking Lib everytime No need for this to even exist
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19. "just kidding, have at it " In response to Reply # 15
at least we get a lively debate out of it
__________________________________________ CHOP-THESE-BITCHES!!!! ------------------------------------ Garhart Ivanhoe Poppwell Un-OK'd moderator for The Lesson and Make The Music (yes, I do's work up in here, and in your asscrease if you run foul of this
>And I'd much rather hear Madlib works than the Rza's in 2014, >but the Rza is the Rza.
To Alter Personality Structure is playing on my Pandora right now. I'm 40. I caint be at my desk all fucking angry, which is what's gon happen if I'm listening to some old RZA shit.
Why y'all even tryna compare the two anyway? They are such divergent artists...these dudes really aint nuthin alike. apples oranges etc...
RZA peaked higher but he fell off harder. Madlib has been much more consistent despite what people say about his quality control (which, to be fair, has some truth to it).
Also, RZA's classic albums have as much to do with the talent he worked with as much as the brilliant production he netted. Classics come from both ends, and RZA did his part just like Madlib did when he worked with equally competent MC's, most notably with DOOM.
I think it's really close and it depends on what you value in a producer, but Madlib is still going strong after 20 years in the game, meanwhile I cannot remember the last fully RZA produced work that I felt reached his pre-97 standards.
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