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Lobby The Lesson topic #2750245

Subject: "FACE VALUE is the best Phil Collins record, right?" Previous topic | Next topic
fontgangsta
Member since Sep 04th 2005
5465 posts
Sun Oct-21-12 09:02 PM

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"FACE VALUE is the best Phil Collins record, right?"


  

          

is it even close?

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
Yeah. No Jacket Required is #2
Oct 22nd 2012
1
I'll Agree With That
Oct 22nd 2012
2
i was thinking that
Oct 22nd 2012
3
They Always Clutter It With Every Beatles & Rolling Stones Album
Oct 22nd 2012
4
a lot of folks don't consider it "rock."
Oct 23rd 2012
6
      pop ?
Oct 23rd 2012
7
      i'd say so.
Oct 23rd 2012
8
      a lot of folk consider it "crap"
Oct 23rd 2012
9
           thx for sharing
Oct 24th 2012
11
                just trying to help.
Oct 24th 2012
13
Both
Oct 23rd 2012
5
Don't forget about ...But Seriously
Oct 24th 2012
10
really nice breakdown
Oct 24th 2012
12
Excellent writing, but still not enough to get me to listen to Phil
Oct 24th 2012
14
RE: Don't forget about ...But Seriously
Oct 24th 2012
16
Are we saying just solo? Abacab deserves some mention
Oct 24th 2012
15

Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
132214 posts
Mon Oct-22-12 07:34 AM

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1. "Yeah. No Jacket Required is #2"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

but Face Value is iconic within his catalog.

  

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Dj Joey Joe
Member since Sep 01st 2007
13770 posts
Mon Oct-22-12 09:07 AM

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2. "I'll Agree With That"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

"Face Value" is a pretty tight album, "No Jacket Required" is dope as well but "Face Value" is his best solo album and probably in the top 100 best rock albums of all time.


https://tinyurl.com/y4ba6hog

---------
"We in here talking about later career Prince records
& your fool ass is cruising around in a time machine
trying to collect props for a couple of sociopathic degenerates" - s.blak

  

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fontgangsta
Member since Sep 04th 2005
5465 posts
Mon Oct-22-12 09:34 AM

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3. "i was thinking that"
In response to Reply # 2


  

          

>probably in the top 100 best rock albums of all time.


but i feel like i NEVER see it in those type of lists

  

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Dj Joey Joe
Member since Sep 01st 2007
13770 posts
Mon Oct-22-12 11:16 AM

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4. "They Always Clutter It With Every Beatles & Rolling Stones Album"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

>but i feel like i NEVER see it in those type of lists

When those lists do decide to narrow it down to one album per artist, I think it would show up but I hardly ever see those type of lists; I'm not saying the Beatles or Rolling Stones don't have more than one good album but it should be fair not saturated with the same artist over & over.


https://tinyurl.com/y4ba6hog

---------
"We in here talking about later career Prince records
& your fool ass is cruising around in a time machine
trying to collect props for a couple of sociopathic degenerates" - s.blak

  

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Joe Corn Mo
Member since Aug 29th 2010
15139 posts
Tue Oct-23-12 01:20 PM

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6. "a lot of folks don't consider it "rock.""
In response to Reply # 2


  

          


which is fair, i suppose.

>"Face Value" is a pretty tight album, "No Jacket Required" is
>dope as well but "Face Value" is his best solo album and
>probably in the top 100 best rock albums of all time.
>
>
>

  

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fontgangsta
Member since Sep 04th 2005
5465 posts
Tue Oct-23-12 02:20 PM

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7. "pop ?"
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

  

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Joe Corn Mo
Member since Aug 29th 2010
15139 posts
Tue Oct-23-12 08:34 PM

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8. "i'd say so. "
In response to Reply # 7


  

          

it wasn't r&b, i don't think.
but then again, it kinda was. at least for certain tracks.


i'm never any good at these categories.
what genre is prince.


i would expect to find it in the "rock" section of my record store.
it's not a perfect fit, but it's good enough.

  

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ninjitsu
Member since Oct 07th 2011
4151 posts
Tue Oct-23-12 11:35 PM

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9. "a lot of folk consider it "crap""
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

which is right on the money.

fuck phil collins.

fuck him.

  

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fontgangsta
Member since Sep 04th 2005
5465 posts
Wed Oct-24-12 09:44 AM

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11. "thx for sharing"
In response to Reply # 9


  

          

now
http://thumbs.newschoolers.com/index.php?src=http://www.csh.rit.edu/~grahams/images/Jeremy%20Piven%20-%20Get%20the%20Fuck%20Out.gif&size=400x1000

  

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ninjitsu
Member since Oct 07th 2011
4151 posts
Wed Oct-24-12 09:55 AM

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13. "just trying to help."
In response to Reply # 11


  

          



  

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Dariusx
Member since May 29th 2002
1174 posts
Tue Oct-23-12 11:19 AM

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5. "Both"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I like Face and Jacket both have great highlights and both have filler Face has more variety with the instrumentals but Jacket has that great intro to We Said Hello Goodbye

  

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box
Member since Nov 07th 2007
320 posts
Wed Oct-24-12 07:54 AM

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10. "Don't forget about ...But Seriously"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Face Value was a revelation in how much it adhered to Genesis's prog rockishness (particularly as Genesis was leaving it behind) while at the same time diverging from it. Through the use of "In the Air Tonight" in Miami Vice and Risky Business, it helped define the cold, distant atmosphere of the early '80s. It was diverse stylistically but held together by a thread of melancholy. To its great credit, it is just as unique today as it was in 1981.

Hello, I must be going has highlights, but is easily a transition album between Face Value and No Jacket Required which has some of Phil Collins' most stand-out numbers ("Take Me Home" just does not get enough airplay on "hits of the 80s" radio). Still it has some serious limitations. "S-s-sussudio" and "Don't Lose My Number," hits that they were, are proof that Phil, as much as he wanted to be dance-pop, still couldn't let go of his prog tendencies. Try to dance to those songs, I dare you. The time signatures are just too effed up. He crafted a great illusion though. And the non-hits ("Who Said I Would," "Only You Know and I Know," "I Don't Wanna Know," "Who Said I Would") are so forgettable that by the end of a four-song list I'd forgotten that I already mentioned "Who Said I Would." It's an album of high highs and low lows.

...But Seriously, though, I think is the pinnacle of his output. In some ways it's the refinement of formulas he'd been working on with Genesis, as a solo performer and as a producer for other artist, and rehashes (and mostly improves upon) themes he'd tackled before ("Find a Way to My Heart" is "Take Me Home" again, but I can forgive because they are both so good). But on the whole, I think it's his first album to aspire to something truly grand and it achieves it. It's probably his best album lyrically, and let's face it, his lyrics have never been his strong suit (that would be being a passionate and compelling vocalist with a limited instrument). The arrangements are great, he finally uses his superb brass section up to their potential on tracks like "Hang in Long Enough," "Heat on the Street," and "Saturday Night and Sunday Morning." It recaptures some of the interesting musical textures he hadn't explored since Face Value ("Colours"). This all goes to make the non-hit tracks more listenable than on any of his previous albums. In 1989/90, when you couldn't stand to hear "Another Day in Paradise" or "Something Happened on the Way to Heaven" again because of radio overplay, there was still plenty on the album to listen to. And the production value is crystalline. Listen to the album on a good sound system and its a vibrant example of good studio-craft. The album gets overlooked because it came along just as people were realizing they were getting tired of his reign over the 80s, but it really is a more solid album, front to back, than any of his other work.

After that, he released Both Sides, written, produced and with every instrument performed by Collins and what a mistake that was. The whole thing sounds like it was made in a tin can without a lick of inspiration. And then began Phil Collins' ascent (or descent) to Elton Johnnitude. No complaints against Elton John, but Phil Collins being Elton John will never be as good as Phil Collins being Phil Collins.

box
___
Just looking out of the window
Watching the asphalt grow
Thinking how it all looks hand-me-down

  

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fontgangsta
Member since Sep 04th 2005
5465 posts
Wed Oct-24-12 09:50 AM

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12. "really nice breakdown"
In response to Reply # 10


  

          

thx

  

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lonesome_d
Charter member
30443 posts
Wed Oct-24-12 10:49 AM

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14. "Excellent writing, but still not enough to get me to listen to Phil"
In response to Reply # 10


          

-------
so I'm in a band now:
album ---> http://greenwoodburns.bandcamp.com/releases
Soundcloud ---> http://soundcloud.com/greenwood-burns

my own stuff -->http://soundcloud.com/lonesomedstringband

avy by buckshot_defunct

  

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BrainChild
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25933 posts
Wed Oct-24-12 03:41 PM

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16. "RE: Don't forget about ...But Seriously"
In response to Reply # 10


  

          

>In 1989/90, when you couldn't
>stand to hear "Another Day in Paradise" or "Something Happened
>on the Way to Heaven" again because of radio overplay

tire of "Something Happened On The Way To Heaven"???

Never.

--me--
www.djbrainchild.com
www.gordongartrellradio.com
www.twitter.com/djbrainchild

  

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Call It Anything
Member since Aug 13th 2005
10951 posts
Wed Oct-24-12 10:51 AM

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15. "Are we saying just solo? Abacab deserves some mention"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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