Trying to figure out if music has changed, or I've changed because I loved loved loved new (and old) music in my aughts, teens, twenties and much of my thirties - but now I like about 5% of it?
Is it just because as we get older our musical taste stops developing?
Could it be that since Pro-tools things have sounded very similar due to increasing compression and quantization coupled with the same autotune and same drum patches ?
Could it be because music is effectively free now and we don't sit and listen to a record multiple times like we did when he actually spent money on it?
Is it just that algorithms on Spotify/Google play/iTunes are pushing material that sounds similar vs. music that has a similar purpose/taste?
1. "You should have more discernment as you get older" In response to Reply # 0
I find I still like new music, but I just can't get excited for every new release, and new releases are coming out faster than ever. I'm usually about a year behind 'what's hot' too. I buy into image waaay less.
Go back and listen to a lot of the stuff you thought was hot back in the day. A large chunk of it is probably shit. There's a large amount of cream that has risen to the top, but it's floating on top of decades of trash juice.
Unless you're just like 'new stuff is dumb, i'm just gonna rock Timbs and listen to Jeru the Damaja for the rest of my life!' I think that happens to some people too.
In a generation of swine, the one-eyed pig is king. -Hunter S. Thompson
37. "You may have half nailed me" In response to Reply # 1
>Unless you're just like 'new stuff is dumb, i'm just gonna >rock Timbs and listen to Jeru the Damaja for the rest of my >life!' I think that happens to some people too.
I listened to 3 Jeru albums on Tuesday, Sun, Wrath and Heroz for Hire.
My dad was an artist and I think he kinda understood. Some stuff was just a 'NAH' but if he could find some artistic merit...he'd rock with me.
I find myself teaching my kids the same stuff. I'm not s'posed to like they shxt. If I do, we're both lucky. But I just teach them to discern between a quality composition and hot trash
and there's a time and a place for everything; cause I will get shxtty drunk and sing the hook to Mo Bamba like it's nothing.
3. "Hard to say.................." In response to Reply # 0
I'm not sure that there can be another generation who can make Hardcore punk, or Neo-Soul or Black Rock like my generation (or the generation slightly ahead of me/us)
but....
As some may have taken note on that pop song post, I have been convinced the pop machine is able to make pop that really has a special thing (as we know, that takes lot's of talented musicians and writers to make pop tracks, as opposed to Hardcore punk or Black rock bands making "hot" music)
So....
I don't have the foresight to know whether bands (Alt-Rock, Hardcore punk, Black Rock or Neo-Soul) can ever have "anything" again, but...the pop "machine" still has a lot of life (seemingly) in it. So...
I guess there could be some new trip-hop influenced artists coming up (I loved trip-hop) but I'm not sure...
4. "i have to dig...but there is enough quality for me these days" In response to Reply # 0 Wed May-22-19 07:50 PM by tomjohn29
i have a stable of artist who consistently put out good work go to their shows buy their albums they release loosies that i make playlist out of rinse repeat all that other stuff you said went over my head
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Navem nu, cuando sol Tutu nu, vondo nos nu Vita em, no continous non Nos nu ekta nos sepe ta, amen
When the sun shades the ship We sweat and life is not safe To swim or to touch not When we unite we hedge amen
5. "The music changed. I/we stayed the same." In response to Reply # 0
The music's supposed to evolve. And I mentioned this in another thread recently but I think that due to the fact that we have so much classic (personal or otherwise) music to compare it to, the music that changed us and shaped us, and pretty much raised us ... the new stuff just doesn't move us like that anymore. Meanwhile the young kids are experiencing the new stuff for the first time or close to the first time, just like we did when we were experiencing Nas, The Roots, and etc. etc. etc, for the first time. That stuff blew us away, and because we've got so much of that classic old stuff to compare it to, the new stuff just won't don't it for us.
Meanwhile, the kids are being blown away for the first time by the new stuff. And they'll pick through the old stuff and love some of it, and find some of it unlistenable ... just like we did w/like classic rock and all music from the 60s and 70s that our parents worshiped.
9. "This is true too for the most part." In response to Reply # 6
>RE: a lot of y'all liked shitty music back then too >I find tons of new music that I like. > >the only thing that gets me is people pretending things were >better back when -- they fucking weren't. > >look at that absolutely dogshit Play album that sold a >bazillion copies. that wouldn't move a single unit today
I find new music I like as well ... but there's definitely a difference in just how inspired or moved I am by it, compared to when I was younger.
Re: pretending things were better way back when, that's definitely something most of us are guilty of but personally I try to stay away from the whole "new music just isn't as good as the old stuff ..." cause a lot of it is perspective tied to nostalgia. So yea - we all liked a lot of shitty music back in the day, and still have nostalgia tied to it so we're biased toward it. But it's all subjective so it doesn't necessarily mean it was "better" ... it just sounds better to us cause of that perspective that's only possible via age and experience, and the natural tendency to compare.
43. "music could never again hit me like it did when I was a teenager" In response to Reply # 9
because I'm not a fuckin teenager anymore
the list of things I can feel for the first time ever, is at this point in my life, pretty short.
nobody can make a song that I feel expresses my anger or some silly shit like that because...I've been coming to terms with those feelings for 20 years now, it's just not possible
28. "I went back and listened to some of his bigger works in the last few" In response to Reply # 18
weeks.
I've known who he was for years because of his name and also because he has a distinct look. But somehow I missed his rise in the late 90s and early 2000s. I couldn't believe how mediocre and soulless (even though he was trying to make somewhat soulful music) his music was.
I was like "This is the stuff that was flying off the shelves in 1999?
7. "we look at our time with rose colored glasses." In response to Reply # 0
there's always been bad music. each generation loves their own and hates whatever comes next.
the music has changed, as it should. however, there's plenty of good stuff. we have less time for searching for it, even with all the tools to find it.
we can also be reluctant to get into the new music because of the experiences. might like instruments/bandsd better. may like the old technology better. don't want to do a subscription service. prolly not going to concerts of new artists.
8. "Yea all of this for sure." In response to Reply # 7
>there's always been bad music. each generation loves their >own and hates whatever comes next. > >the music has changed, as it should. however, there's plenty >of good stuff. we have less time for searching for it, even >with all the tools to find it. > >we can also be reluctant to get into the new music because of >the experiences. might like instruments/bandsd better. may >like the old technology better. don't want to do a >subscription service. prolly not going to concerts of new >artists.
Dj Joey Joe Member since Sep 01st 2007 13770 posts
Wed May-22-19 10:53 PM
11. "It's More Music Than Before But It's Still The Same..." In response to Reply # 0
...while I think how much people can take in and how much of crap people can tolerate has lowered.
These days it's so many artists making music for every sub-genres of every style out there that now it's an abundance of it but now the quality of it has lowered cause of how easy it is to make it without having a ton of musicians and going thru so many checks & balances before it reaches our ears.
Now with so many ways to access it instead of radio, friends, clubs, & television to get it like it was back in the day, now we got our cellphones that have access to countless hours of any style where ever we take our phones, now it's a website that has videos, now you got sites where you can access mixes from DJs around the world, not just your local radio on a certain night, a dj at a club, or shared with a friend thru a dubbed cassette or cd.
With so many avenues to hear music, and so many places trying very hard to find the type of sound you like & cater to it 24/7 you get numb to the special feeling you use to have when you heard a tune, even the mediocre tunes that many liked in the past wouldn't have the same magic feeling if it was made today cause it's probably 100 times more of the same out there to listen to within seconds if you know where & names to look for.
So instead of finding and treasuring a needle in each haystack, now we mostly treasure the biggest shiniest needles in a stack of needles with a perimeter of hay at the bottom of the stack.
--------- "We in here talking about later career Prince records & your fool ass is cruising around in a time machine trying to collect props for a couple of sociopathic degenerates" - s.blak
17. "Yea - this part is a gift and a curse." In response to Reply # 11
>These days it's so many artists making music for every >sub-genres of every style out there that now it's an abundance >of it but now the quality of it has lowered cause of how easy >it is to make it without having a ton of musicians and going >thru so many checks & balances before it reaches our ears.
A gift because a lot of really talented artists are able to get their product out without all the roadblocks and potentially never being heard at all.
A curse because the marketplace is so watered down, that even the most talented artists aren't necessarily as motivated (for lack of a better term) to release *only* their very best and because they don't have as many checks and balances (like you said) they can kind of trial and error everything which leads to fewer perfect or classic albums.
12. "Plenty of good new music...you just gotta break out of the algorithm " In response to Reply # 0
to find it....
Music consumption is def. a much more casual and lazy pursuit nowadays. Streaming algorithms and group think(haha, throwback term) push a lot of bullshit to the front much faster than in previous decades....but it's still pretty much the same as it's ever been. The good shit is usually playing the background to all the noise and bullshit.
14. "Music changed. Studies have been done on it." In response to Reply # 0 Thu May-23-19 07:43 AM by Boogie Stimuli
Maybe I'll find one later when I have more time, but there was more diversity in music in the 60's than any other time if I'm remembering correctly... popular music at least. As a jazz enthusiast, James Brown even spoke on how disco was a decline from his own time in terms of musical variation, so imagine how much of a decline a lot of these 4-bar loops are. Then you take into account that actual instruments don't play a lot of the music we hear to today with it being electronically driven. I think instruments are important for the natural tempo variations, different way chords are stricken, drum hits, etc... there's a natural feel to it. I think the reason older heads have a hard time getting into newer hip hop is b/c rap in their day was heavier on samples. I appreciate the newer stuff because I want us to get back to creating our music from scratch as much as the stuff we sampled. Many folks gonna talk about whatever the algorithms and corporations tell them is hot, because people can be sheepish, but I like to think there's something somewhere in us that just wanna hear some funky shit. That said, there's a lot of really good music out there for whatever kind of music you wanna hear these days. The main issue is that what you receive is more controlled than it's ever been if you aren't actively seeking out these amazing artists out here.
15. "Rap music HAS changed" In response to Reply # 0 Thu May-23-19 07:42 AM by Adwhizz
Rap is in what I look at as a post punk phase where rappers are influenced by artists from a wider range of genres
There's less of an emphasis on complex lyracism/punchlines and more focus on hooks, vocal melodies, and rappers are more likely to show emotional vulnerability in their songs.
There's a lot of good songs coming out even if the rappers aren't trying to be the next Rakim or Biggie
Also sampling laws, software based beat production changed the way modern rap sounds
R.I.P. Loud But Wrong Guy Dec 29th 2009 - Dec 17th 2017
32. "Yeah, I do agree that musically, it's always going to shift" In response to Reply # 15
It's not always a bad thing. Some stuff from the 90's just sounds too simple now and you wonder what it would be like if the people making it listened to anything other than NY rap from 92-95.
Of course, I also wish that @lil_dipshit or whoever the hottest young rapper is WOULD listen to something that predates The Carter III.
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12 play and 12 planets are enlighten for all the Aliens to Party and free those on the Sex Planet-maxxx
49. "you nailed it, the culture has changed a lot, too, and it's more mainstr..." In response to Reply # 15
i think there was always space for alternative voices and vulnerability but they were on the fringes.
you still have a ridiculously "macho" mainstream though, although today's guys would also give a girl $10,000 for sex and stab each other in the eye to get on a track with justin bieber. basically the mainstream part of the culture has become even more worthless (negative value now), aimless and pointless IMHO. but there is kind of an interstitial space between that and the fringe that i find kind of encouraging.
And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.
BrooklynWHAT Member since Jun 15th 2007 85056 posts
Fri May-24-19 01:35 PM
50. "as it should be. the circle of life" In response to Reply # 47
also im 28 but i routinely get clocked at about 20. and if my mom (who i take after) is any indication i'll always look young. on some Hill Harper shit.
51. "RE: as it should be. the circle of life" In response to Reply # 50
>also im 28 but i routinely get clocked at about 20. >and if my mom (who i take after) is any indication i'll always >look young. on some Hill Harper shit.
^with that premise we got an old man in the club in the making lol
20. "It's Both and it's been this way forever. " In response to Reply # 0
Yo. You parents didn't like your music. Your grandparents didn't like your parents music. Today's kids won't like the music of 25 years from now.
Music is generational, music will change, musical tastes stay mostly static.
Most people listen to the music of their youth and formative years. it's always been this way. ______________________________________________________________________________
>you will always hold dear the stuff that you grew up on. even >stuff i thought was trash back then i find nostalgia hitting >me when it comes on lol
Like I hear Cash Money stuff now and I'm like "why'd I hate this shit so much" lol. It's still mostly trash but that wave of nostalgia hits.
>the vibe is going to change and match the youth at the time. >there will always be nostalgia acts trying to bring back a >sound they grew up on. > >theres a ton of great music out now but you do have to dig. >probably have less time and energy to dig for it as you grow >older.
seasoned vet Member since Jul 29th 2008 6024 posts
Thu May-23-19 12:18 PM
22. "the 'its always been like this' is such a lazy argument" In response to Reply # 0
funny how our generation had zero issues appreciating the greats of our parents and grandparents generation...the isleys, james brown, motown, stax, etc.
and yet this generation gives the middle finger to everything that came before them as well as anything current that doesnt cater to them
shit, what would hiphop even be if not for our generation reaching back?
hell, even our parents and grandparents look at the shit now and say SOMETHING is missing
i cant say i interact with a lot of youth so i dont know if they are disrespecting the greats of our time. probably disrespecting popular acts from 10 years ago but im sure theyre still repping pac and biggie. the ones that arent lazy wouldnt surprise me if theyre bumping tribe wu and others that are more known.
regarding our parents feeling like todays music is missing something..i think its the same as us not quite getting todays music. its not made for us. it takes some time for us to appreciate the new wave if we do.
i would expect 10 years from now the bulk of us will appreciate music that is out now, especially compared to whatever "garbage" is popping 10 years from now.
we had our music, but we didnt have access to it 24/7
riding in the car with our parents, cleaning the house, dinner time, etc
there were moments everyday where we had no choice but to listen/ watch what our parents listened to/ watched. that forced us to have a sample of what to appreciate, it gave us a base...a foundation to work with.
today, kids are plugged in 24/7
riding in the car? the have their devices school? they're allowed to have tablets, phones, and laptops with wifi
shit, ive seen parents let their toddlers eat at the table with headphones and a tablet
they dont have those captive moments anymore where that have to suffer through what entertainment mom and dad consume, so they dont gaf about it and dont care to
my son is 12 now. since he was born i always limited what he listened to or watched. i restricted his music to the playlists i made for him, his tv only had a hard drive with what i put on it, no cable.
my son has that appreciation his generation lacks. now that hes older and has a base im starting to let him explore media on his own
ive asked several 60-70 year olds about this generation. they all acknowledge generations are different but they all said this one skipped something.
34. "Not a parent and my nieces and nephew aren't old enough" In response to Reply # 29
Do 12 year old hip hop fans really not know Wu-Tang or Biggie? I would assume that those rappers being name checked by modern artists would at least lead to some base knowledge.
I think you are on to something with how omnipresent phones/tablets are and how you never really have to hear something you don't want to these days. Also, if you wanted to hear a song you didn't own, you had to listen on the radio or watch TV for the music video, and you were going to be exposed to a lot of other stuff. You never need to do that now.
At the same time, everyone thought at least some older music was corny growing up. That's a part of realizing your own tastes, so kids are never going to be exactly where their parents are.
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12 play and 12 planets are enlighten for all the Aliens to Party and free those on the Sex Planet-maxxx
39. "how we consume music now is definitely questionable" In response to Reply # 29
its both awesome and sad how much access we have to music now.
i know theres albums i love from back in the day that i would not have even listened to all the way through if i had the same access back then as i do now.
music can really grow on you but with so much stuff available its rare that you will let things grow on you. either you feel it now and you can get tired of it or its forgotten.
we will adjust.
on the flip side, so much stuff ive listened to lately that i would not had discovered if it werent for the amount of access to music we have now.
40. "the access now makes it more disposable." In response to Reply # 39
its so easy to listen to anything and its free. I don't have to struggle to get my money up to get the latest. just wait 3 minutes and its on youtube.
the other part for me is there's no mystique today. artist were bigger than life and I didn't know as much about them. now they're just regular. they're touchable.
41. "No doubt about this. Ton of albums I've probably let slip ..." In response to Reply # 39
>music can really grow on you but with so much stuff available >its rare that you will let things grow on you. either you feel >it now and you can get tired of it or its forgotten.
... thru the cracks simply because they didn't blow me away upon first and second listen.
>on the flip side, so much stuff ive listened to lately that i >would not had discovered if it werent for the amount of access >to music we have now.
26. "That's a small but loud percentage of the new artists, tho." In response to Reply # 22 Thu May-23-19 12:37 PM by Brew
>funny how our generation had zero issues appreciating the >greats of our parents and grandparents generation...the >isleys, james brown, motown, stax, etc. > >and yet this generation gives the middle finger to everything >that came before them as well as anything current that doesnt >cater to them > >shit, what would hiphop even be if not for our generation >reaching back? > >hell, even our parents and grandparents look at the shit now >and say SOMETHING is missing
Not ALL new artists are tossing up the middle finger. Just seems like it's all of them cause the ones doing it are the most brash and loud.
31. "A lot of it is how artists are perceived, too" In response to Reply # 26
When some pink-haired rapper comes out auto-tune warbling about killing his mom with a giant Xanax or whatever, it looks to us like he came out of nowhere. In his mind, he's probably just doing his best Wayne tribute. Or how OF came out looking like a bunch of crazy punk kids who hated everything, when it turns out Tyler was just the world's biggest Neptunes fan the whole time.
Chuck Klosterman said something about Guns n Roses that sticks with me about how musically, they wore their influences all over their sleeves. But to everyone else, they looked like five guys who gave no shits about what came before them, because it's how they wanted to be seen.
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12 play and 12 planets are enlighten for all the Aliens to Party and free those on the Sex Planet-maxxx
>When some pink-haired rapper comes out auto-tune warbling >about killing his mom with a giant Xanax or whatever, it looks >to us like he came out of nowhere. In his mind, he's probably >just doing his best Wayne tribute. Or how OF came out looking >like a bunch of crazy punk kids who hated everything, when it >turns out Tyler was just the world's biggest Neptunes fan the >whole time. > >Chuck Klosterman said something about Guns n Roses that sticks >with me about how musically, they wore their influences all >over their sleeves. But to everyone else, they looked like >five guys who gave no shits about what came before them, >because it's how they wanted to be seen.
30. "I want to hear some good melodies. But because the music industry" In response to Reply # 0
decided to abandon R&B at the mainstream level (or did the younger generation first decide they didn't like it anymore?) the closest we get to any melody at all is modern day rappers mumbling, humming and half-singing.
There's almost no music that comes out anymore that has any finger-snapping, two-step at the wedding reception type of groove.
And I second the person above who said that alot of this younger generation gives the middle finger to almost anything that came out before 2005. We worshiped the music of our parents' day. That's not the case now at all.
35. "When did kids start listening to older/parents music?" In response to Reply # 0
Late 70's? Early 80's? Because I don't think anyone in the 1960's was going back to circa-WWII era records for jams.
It wasn't at all seen as odd for people (I graduated high school 2002) to like stuff from the 60's/70's when I was growing up. But someone had to start that.
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12 play and 12 planets are enlighten for all the Aliens to Party and free those on the Sex Planet-maxxx
36. "That's a good question. I'm sure it's increased over time." In response to Reply # 35 Thu May-23-19 03:11 PM by Brew
>Late 70's? Early 80's? Because I don't think anyone in the >1960's was going back to circa-WWII era records for jams. > >It wasn't at all seen as odd for people (I graduated high >school 2002) to like stuff from the 60's/70's when I was >growing up. But someone had to start that.
Probably largely based on the increasing availability of old music.
I'm an '02 grad myself. And yea we were digging up all the classic rock stuff especially when I went to college.
53. "I would say 70s and 80s would be correct for two reasons" In response to Reply # 35
1). Record albums: The art work along with longer playing time played a huge role in my household, My mom cleaning the house to certain albums is a fond memory. I would go through my parents shelves and read the album while listening.
2). Radio stations: I like music from different jazz eras because my dad played different kinds of Jazz on his reel to reel and listened to WNCU radio station. My parents hated the rap and R&B I listened to, so they tuned in to “their” radio station (foxy 107, etc) in the car and at home.
Hell, my kids like the older stuff I listen to because I’m not listening to current music when they’re in the car with me. So much so, they’re streaming EWF, Kool and the Gang, J Dilla etc on their own.
44. "counterpoint: try creating a new circuit or map" In response to Reply # 0
when it comes to music people tend to get caught in mindless habit.
1. go to player > play the same old thing.
2. go to place where you find new music > find new music > add new music to player > play new music repeatedly until it becomes old music - see step 1.
I've found when I hack old listening habits I always find some new shit I like.
There is way too much music out there to have this opinion. AND, there is a lot of stuff out there that you missed.
I've broken habits a few ways like....
-drilling down music history, as in, looking up song credits and finding out who wrote what and then seeing what they wrote or doing a sample dig - like, a recent one for me was noticing the opening song to Monica's first album referenced a West Side Connection sample but I knew it wasnt the original which in turn led to me finding out it was George Duke song which in turn lead to me digging into Geroge Duke's back catalog which then made me remember early Scarface sampled George Duke which lead to a mini early Scarface music journey.
-Radio stations in Spotify or Pandora based on a song you like and then hearing other shit you would have never ever found on your own.
-Playlists based on favorite genres but then getting specific to themes or eras
-Artists playlists - that Jay Z fav rapper playlist of 2018 introduced me to a lot of new shit
-Quick digs through The Needle Drop (he is polarizing but hes good for seeing whats out there), Quick digs through pitchfork
-Oh, mixes on Mixcloud are always great for hearing new shit.
-Soulection mixes, Lucky Me Mixes, Sara Farina mixes, Giles Peterson BBC6 mixes,
-Soundcloud for new shit but you have to work it a bit
48. "It doesn't 'suck' but it has changed in fundamental ways" In response to Reply # 0
Pop music in particular is very scientific now, they tailor BPM and so many other things to studies that show the ideal characteristics of sound. That has accelerated the lowest-common-denominator and homogeneous trends that have always existed in pop music. There is less and less individual expression, sound is engineered for a specific purpose (mass appeal) and music sounds more and more alike (rap is especially striking in that with the rise of auto tune, trap, etc). Again while I think these trends have always been present, they've accelerated and intensified in recent years in all popular genres.
I think there is still some great music out there and I also look back in *some* stuff I used to love and find it less appealing than I did 20 years ago. But no question music and the industry has changed a lot, and, in many ways, it has changed for the worse.
And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.
52. "Those Old Enough Watched HipHop Get Gentrified" In response to Reply # 0
TO watch hiphop go from all the way us, to seeing rich kids get decision making positions, then watch the music turn to shit can say that the music changed. Talentless white kids at the top of hiphop charts isn't how this shit was supposed to go.
legsdiamond Member since May 05th 2011 79554 posts
Tue May-28-19 10:17 AM
56. "I was in Atlanta for my nephews show" In response to Reply # 52
He is a “purist” and it’s strictly rap and hook.
Then a white kid got up there and said “I almost died last week, I just got out of the hospital” and started doing some awful emo Post Malone impression repeating the same word/line with loud 808’s for 3 minutes.
Shit like that would get booed off the stage back in the day.
**************** TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*
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