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Subject: "Glasper on L-Boogie: You Ain't Done Enough to Be the Way You Are" Previous topic | Next topic
WarriorPoet415
Member since Sep 30th 2003
17895 posts
Tue Aug-14-18 10:37 AM

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"Glasper on L-Boogie: You Ain't Done Enough to Be the Way You Are"
Tue Aug-14-18 10:38 AM by WarriorPoet415

  

          

https://youtu.be/54WECf1ioeY?t=1709

Not that any of this is new, but rarely do we hear an established name in the industry confirm a lot of what's been rumored for a while.

TL;DR:

Drops band members like flies.
Doesn't like paying folk right.
Flighty with musical arrangements
RG says LH hasn't done enough to be a diva.

I do disagree with him that L-Boogie didn't do TMOLH. They lyrics were very personal. And if she didn't write all the music, so what. Plenty of artists have producers. I think the prollem there was her trying to take the lion's share of credit and $ as opposed to how it should have been distributed.

______________________________________________________________________________

"To Each His Reach"

but.....

Fuck aliens.

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
that's brutal.
Aug 14th 2018
1
She's under 45 and made/makes "grown-up" music. She could
Aug 14th 2018
2
there's alway the possibility
Aug 14th 2018
3
after like 20 years she is going to change her ways? doubt it
Aug 29th 2018
166
Nah, Chaka got real GOOD after her diva years....
Aug 14th 2018
5
      yeah, I get it.
Aug 14th 2018
11
Dying @ "beef patty"
Aug 14th 2018
4
yep
Aug 14th 2018
6
this dude is widlin' in the best possible way
Aug 16th 2018
36
I'm dying... LOL
Aug 14th 2018
17
hey, i respect robert glasper
Aug 14th 2018
7
I was getting pissed @ the dude who kept being like ...
Aug 14th 2018
9
I don't think he was disrespectful here.
Aug 14th 2018
13
      Right. OKP be so extra
Aug 14th 2018
18
The main thing I can't abide by is her trying to cut their pay...
Aug 14th 2018
8
man that got me too. After a week of ten hour rehearsals?
Aug 14th 2018
12
She should be the spokesperson for Moviepass
Aug 14th 2018
10
He is right about how she treats musicians, but:
Aug 14th 2018
14
at this point though, Glasper career >>>
Aug 14th 2018
15
Jimmy who?
Aug 16th 2018
35
      I think he meant "Jimi"
Sep 13th 2018
251
Stop.
Aug 15th 2018
23
Glasper, "You Steal Music." LOL
Aug 14th 2018
16
Glasper - Entire interview is dope - Link
Aug 14th 2018
19
Lol. No lies detected but...
Aug 14th 2018
20
Is it?
Aug 15th 2018
24
I see both points
Aug 15th 2018
27
That's not "jassist" at all though...honestly tuning a guitar is easier
Aug 15th 2018
30
      ^^ This is part of the Core issue along with here lack of humility ^^
Aug 15th 2018
31
What happened to the 'New Ark' after?
Aug 14th 2018
21
RE: What happened to the 'New Ark' after?
Aug 15th 2018
22
      RE: What happened to the 'New Ark' after?
Aug 16th 2018
34
From her actions over that last 20 years...
Aug 15th 2018
25
Trinity in 5....444.....3.....
Aug 15th 2018
26
RE: Trinity in 5....444.....3.....
Aug 15th 2018
28
if lauryn's spiritualness is telling her not to pay people
Aug 15th 2018
29
      I don’t understand, can you say it another way?
Aug 16th 2018
33
      lol. forget y’all...
Aug 26th 2018
41
okay this was actually a good interview
Aug 16th 2018
32
Rolling Stone and OKP on the 20th Anniversay of "Miseducation"
Aug 25th 2018
37
Man he trippin’
Aug 25th 2018
38
I'd argue that Glasper is every bit the artist Lauryn is.....
Aug 25th 2018
39
You can argue all you want..
Aug 25th 2018
40
      You’re right, Glasper knows multiple chords.
Aug 26th 2018
42
      im pretty sure he can tune multiple instruments..while she cant tune
Aug 26th 2018
43
           let's not get ignorant in our disrespect
Aug 26th 2018
45
      Robert Glasper isn't half the artist of Ms. Hill
Aug 26th 2018
46
           Was part of her settlement with “New Ark”
Aug 26th 2018
47
           lol, it was not
Aug 26th 2018
48
           lol..FOH...glasper was on the road playin in herbies band..
Aug 30th 2018
200
                lol, i don't see how playing for Herbie some how validates you as an art...
Aug 30th 2018
230
She doesn't have 93 albums in her discog
Aug 26th 2018
44
He's not trippin. You're just capin'
Aug 26th 2018
49
Ms. Lauryn dropped a response to Robert's accusations
Aug 28th 2018
50
RE: Ms. Lauryn dropped a response to Robert's accusations
Aug 28th 2018
51
^^^^
Aug 28th 2018
67
Bruh, after the second paragraph I FB scrolled
Aug 28th 2018
71
      i made it all the way through
Aug 28th 2018
80
That’s a lot of bullshit to gloss over how she screwed over her band
Aug 28th 2018
52
LOL@the late plea cop... sound check ran long...c'mon
Aug 28th 2018
54
      That proves even more how selfish she is
Aug 28th 2018
64
      My go to is: I bet she wasn't late to Austin City Limits.
Aug 28th 2018
83
           RE: My go to is: I bet she wasn't late to Austin City Limits.-NOPE
Aug 28th 2018
90
      prince changed his songs/arrangements
Aug 28th 2018
65
           Exactly what I was thinking, should've sent this directly to Glasper
Aug 28th 2018
69
           But if he's doing the entire 1999 album, he's not changing them all
Aug 28th 2018
89
well written...
Aug 28th 2018
53
lol
Aug 28th 2018
74
Yep, I believe she's delusional and we're suckers for still paying atten...
Aug 28th 2018
84
      Agree. The sad part is I think she's got some mental issues.
Aug 28th 2018
87
      This long ass response let’s me know Glasper wasn’t lying.
Aug 28th 2018
91
           How can that be your conclusion and you didn’t bother reading it all?
Aug 28th 2018
94
                I read enough
Aug 28th 2018
103
      you may be delusional too...
Aug 28th 2018
97
           Well if she doesn't have mental shit going on then she's just an asshole...
Aug 28th 2018
99
           how can read all that and conclude she’s an asshole...
Aug 28th 2018
100
                How can you read that and NOT conclude she's an asshole ?!
Aug 28th 2018
101
           “Non traditional artist” like homeless are “non traditional outdoo...
Aug 28th 2018
112
Is this her first time apologizing for being late?
Aug 28th 2018
55
LOL you saw an apology in there?
Aug 29th 2018
171
      Ahahahaha right.
Aug 30th 2018
180
This is a rambling, defensive, self-indulgent mess.
Aug 28th 2018
56
man i aint reading all that shit
Aug 28th 2018
57
man i aint reading all that shit
Aug 28th 2018
58
"but the contrary, It can be argued that I care too much" Girl Bye.
Aug 28th 2018
59
Peeped a FB report on this and one comment stood out
Aug 28th 2018
60
Ahahahahahaha. Perfect.
Aug 28th 2018
61
My favorite comment I saw was...
Aug 28th 2018
63
      HA!
Aug 28th 2018
68
We gotta update her on how long “several years” is.
Aug 28th 2018
62
The word "My/Myself" appears 65 times
Aug 28th 2018
66
I stopped at Harriett Tubman. Robert Glasper was right after all.
Aug 28th 2018
70
RIGHT - I meant to notice the Tubman mention specifically.
Aug 28th 2018
77
#hashtag
Aug 28th 2018
75
maybe folks would care...
Aug 28th 2018
95
RE: Ms. Lauryn dropped a response to Robert's accusations
Aug 28th 2018
106
James Brown was very well known for fines - most band leaders of that
Aug 28th 2018
107
Sounds like your mind was made up before you read her response
Aug 28th 2018
110
      not at all
Aug 28th 2018
113
So NOBODY gon' say nothing about this?
Aug 28th 2018
108
This reads like "I hit you *because* I love you"
Aug 29th 2018
170
Umm...why is OKP more upset about her than Ye?
Aug 28th 2018
72
Most folks here don't give Kanye a pass, at all.
Aug 28th 2018
73
Kanye's Harold, bruh... homey's dead. We're leaving him.
Aug 28th 2018
76
Literally not true.
Aug 28th 2018
78
lol
Aug 28th 2018
96
Ye wasn't let off the hook.
Aug 28th 2018
79
Man shut up
Aug 28th 2018
82
He's not off the hook, but he admits he's crazy. And he makes albums.
Aug 28th 2018
85
And he shows up on time and, at least used to, put(s) on good shows.
Aug 28th 2018
86
You made all that up bro
Aug 28th 2018
88
There are like 2 actual fans of current MAGA Kanye on here
Aug 28th 2018
92
Because the board is full of Uncle Ruckus
Aug 28th 2018
93
While I agree this place capes for white folks
Aug 28th 2018
102
      Fair enough I can understand why people would be upset
Aug 28th 2018
111
redirection FAIL
Aug 28th 2018
105
Stadiq Huckabee Sanders over here.
Aug 28th 2018
109
Kanye got the credits thing right
Aug 30th 2018
205
Figures that it took a respected industry insider like Glasper
Aug 28th 2018
81
Some good points mixed with some bullshit (re her Medium piece)
Aug 28th 2018
98
that soundcheck stuff SMH
Aug 28th 2018
104
alot of y'all sound dumb as hell
Aug 29th 2018
114
Miseducation is an overrated album....
Aug 29th 2018
115
use your same logic in her defense
Aug 29th 2018
117
sure a singer's voice
Aug 29th 2018
116
      RE: sure a singer's voice
Aug 29th 2018
118
      you don't have to be a great singer
Aug 29th 2018
120
           RE: you don't have to be a great singer
Aug 29th 2018
140
                where did I deny any of this?
Aug 29th 2018
168
      This boils it down right here...
Aug 29th 2018
121
I'm bothered now by Robert's quip he called her Lauryn
Aug 29th 2018
119
That’s dumb.
Aug 29th 2018
128
Reposting an earlier comment: Glasper isn't half the artist of Ms. Hill
Aug 29th 2018
122
!
Aug 29th 2018
125
Damn
Aug 29th 2018
126
Right? Just disrespectful
Aug 29th 2018
129
You know that she had to settle a lawsuit back in 01, right?
Aug 29th 2018
131
      she aint credit DJ premier
Aug 29th 2018
132
           NO ONE has done enough
Aug 29th 2018
133
           i havent mentioned the word fan
Aug 29th 2018
139
                you said
Aug 29th 2018
144
                RE: you said
Aug 29th 2018
148
                     if you listen to the first post-fugees records
Aug 29th 2018
152
                99.9% of all artist? You sound like a stan
Aug 29th 2018
158
                     RE: 99.9% of all artist? You sound like a stan
Sep 03rd 2018
238
           # 1, i reponded to "insinuate that she doesn't write her own work."
Aug 29th 2018
134
           RE: # 1, i reponded to "insinuate that she doesn't write her own work."
Aug 29th 2018
141
           Ehhh. What has Lauryn done since Miseducation?
Aug 29th 2018
142
                smh
Aug 29th 2018
145
                     No one agreed to being a ghost writer. That's why there was a lawsuit
Aug 29th 2018
153
                     nah brother...
Aug 29th 2018
164
                          that a lot of words to completely miss the point.
Aug 30th 2018
187
                               i didnt miss any point
Sep 03rd 2018
237
                     Hold up. If you get got?
Aug 29th 2018
159
                          if u bought tickets to a doom show
Aug 29th 2018
163
Glasper doesn't need Hill. This isn't a rap beef to get his name up...
Aug 29th 2018
123
What ?
Aug 29th 2018
124
      She tried to cheat him out of money (cutting his pay)
Aug 29th 2018
127
      She explained that
Aug 29th 2018
135
           saying "I don't remember" is not explaining, bruh
Aug 29th 2018
136
                It explains that he could be wrong
Aug 29th 2018
138
      Hold up. She slashed his pay and told him not to look her in the eye
Aug 29th 2018
130
           Nah she had a different side of the pay story
Aug 29th 2018
137
                He’s getting a pass because of her history.
Aug 29th 2018
143
                Ehhh I don't know
Aug 29th 2018
147
                     I mean
Aug 29th 2018
160
                "I don't remember that" is "a different side of the story" ?
Aug 29th 2018
146
                     RE: "I don't remember that" is "a different side of the story" ?
Aug 29th 2018
149
                     Lurk's comment was specifically about the "pay" part of the story.
Aug 29th 2018
151
                          RE: Lurk's comment was specifically about the "pay" part of the story.
Aug 29th 2018
155
                               Haha that part was self-evident but OK add that in.
Aug 29th 2018
156
                                    I never told anyone not to look me in the eye
Aug 29th 2018
162
                                         He never said she did.
Aug 30th 2018
182
                                              What ?
Aug 30th 2018
229
                                                   Exact quote "MY FRIEND was like 'first of all don't look her in the eye'...
Aug 30th 2018
235
                                                        RE: Exact quote "MY FRIEND was like 'first of all don't look her in...
Sep 03rd 2018
239
                     The paragraph in context is a different side of the story
Aug 29th 2018
150
                          Not really.
Aug 29th 2018
154
                               Sure it is
Aug 29th 2018
161
                                    That doesn't, at all, "explain what happened"
Aug 30th 2018
183
                                         Yes it does but
Aug 30th 2018
226
Has anyone else gone back and listened to Talib's Ms. Hill since this?
Aug 29th 2018
157
I don't get the team player vibe from LH's response
Aug 29th 2018
165
She's sort of saying she came up with the lyrics and I'm guessing
Aug 29th 2018
167
      your replies don’t go unnoticed...
Aug 30th 2018
179
           ^ I meant harmful...
Aug 30th 2018
206
                glad you liked what I wrote
Aug 30th 2018
224
Hm. I actually feel like I... understand her now?? lol
Aug 29th 2018
169
also this
Aug 30th 2018
175
This is great analysis. Thanks for this.
Aug 30th 2018
184
that's fine if that's her lifestyle,
Aug 30th 2018
190
I can't bring myself to read her whole response, so I'll ask:
Aug 30th 2018
192
No opt ed can change the facts lol
Aug 30th 2018
172
He offered ZERO new info and stands on shaky moral ground
Aug 30th 2018
173
LMAO
Aug 30th 2018
174
Honestly.
Aug 30th 2018
181
She denies his claim, but he thinks he's telling the truth
Sep 04th 2018
241
      "Even if what he is saying is true ..." © you
Sep 04th 2018
242
I literally did not say those words. Your reading comprehension sucks
Sep 04th 2018
240
I like Lauryn, but stop it with the hooks. Those were interpolations
Aug 30th 2018
196
All the L defenders, please post your experience below after attending h...
Aug 30th 2018
176
the opportunity hasn’t been presented...
Aug 30th 2018
177
Translation: you ain’t going
Aug 30th 2018
178
Trin don't go anywhere though
Sep 13th 2018
247
Thats right, she cancelled Charlotte
Aug 30th 2018
186
no one should expect old Lauryn.
Aug 30th 2018
189
      Correct.
Aug 30th 2018
191
      I don’t believe you...
Aug 30th 2018
197
           This isn't about being fair weather though.
Aug 30th 2018
198
           simple as that.
Aug 30th 2018
202
           you don't believe what lol
Aug 30th 2018
199
           that you don’t have the same expectations...
Aug 30th 2018
204
                why would you not believe that? lol
Aug 30th 2018
208
                for the same reason you don’t believe Lauryn’s response...
Aug 30th 2018
211
                     groupthink? what?! lolol
Aug 30th 2018
218
                          in regards to feeling disrespected...
Aug 30th 2018
221
                               yes, I did.
Aug 30th 2018
225
                This is fine. But the opposite view doesn't make the rest of us "fair we...
Aug 30th 2018
209
                Brew...
Aug 30th 2018
213
                     Was I rude or something ?
Aug 30th 2018
216
                          not at all...
Aug 30th 2018
219
                          not at all...
Aug 30th 2018
220
                hahaha
Sep 13th 2018
249
           She owes "you" a show if you paid your money
Aug 30th 2018
201
Lol I'd be the perfect test case for this actually, because I haven't ye...
Aug 30th 2018
185
This is almost as bad as folk defending DOOM when he sent fakes
Aug 30th 2018
188
and you're wilding
Aug 30th 2018
193
      yeah doom was upfront w/ it. lauryn a con-artist basically.
Aug 30th 2018
194
      after he got busted...and people still defended it
Aug 30th 2018
195
I went to a show in DC and it was great
Aug 30th 2018
207
      When was this, and what venue?
Aug 30th 2018
212
      Howard Theater, Small Axe Tour
Aug 30th 2018
215
      damn. I wish...
Aug 30th 2018
214
           RE: damn. I wish...And THATS why mofos keep going...cause you MIGHT
Aug 30th 2018
222
                If you appreciate jazz and know the original versions
Aug 30th 2018
228
She's the "polite" version of GG Allin
Aug 30th 2018
203
I find the sheer intensity of the hate she gets very interesting
Aug 30th 2018
210
      I don't see this as hate.
Aug 30th 2018
217
      Lol, I hear you.
Aug 30th 2018
223
      Timeout: did you just say "it's not like she's a rapist, or anything"
Aug 30th 2018
227
      LOL
Aug 30th 2018
231
      No! Or at least, I didnt think that someone would interpret what i said
Aug 30th 2018
232
      i think its warratned
Aug 30th 2018
233
           I do see your point, lol
Aug 30th 2018
234
she's similar to jd salinger
Sep 03rd 2018
236
she's the rap Harper Lee. One really great work and out.
Sep 04th 2018
243
looks like she booted nas and santigold off a show.
Sep 13th 2018
244
Jeff: oh, she did that thing, that thiiiiing to you guys?
Sep 13th 2018
245
i LLOLed at that. props to jeff. nm
Sep 13th 2018
252
damn, you can't even see opening acts
Sep 13th 2018
246
"the employees of the year, yeah we're back to work..."
Sep 13th 2018
248
I mean.
Sep 13th 2018
250

tariqhu
Charter member
17890 posts
Tue Aug-14-18 11:11 AM

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1. "that's brutal."
In response to Reply # 0


          

its prolly too late for her to get better at this. especially after this interview.

she might be the biggest fall off in hip hop.

Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

  

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Teknontheou
Charter member
32709 posts
Tue Aug-14-18 11:13 AM

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2. "She's under 45 and made/makes "grown-up" music. She could"
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

completely turn all this around tomorrow if she started acting right. She's still "young" wrt to the kind of music she makes.

  

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tariqhu
Charter member
17890 posts
Tue Aug-14-18 11:20 AM

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3. "there's alway the possibility"
In response to Reply # 2


          

but as you said, she's gotta start acting right. I don't see it happening.

Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
71387 posts
Wed Aug-29-18 03:55 PM

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166. "after like 20 years she is going to change her ways? doubt it"
In response to Reply # 2


  

          

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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FLUIDJ
Member since Sep 18th 2002
44616 posts
Tue Aug-14-18 12:06 PM

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5. "Nah, Chaka got real GOOD after her diva years...."
In response to Reply # 1


  

          


"Get ready....for your blessing....."

  

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tariqhu
Charter member
17890 posts
Tue Aug-14-18 12:57 PM

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11. "yeah, I get it. "
In response to Reply # 5


          

we never know. just saying I can't see her doing that. maybe she'll surprise me.

Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
24419 posts
Tue Aug-14-18 11:44 AM

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4. "Dying @ "beef patty""
In response to Reply # 0
Tue Aug-14-18 11:45 AM by Brew

          

Glasper's a funny dude.

Anyway that shit is crazy. She sounds *awful*.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Cam
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13286 posts
Tue Aug-14-18 12:13 PM

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6. "yep"
In response to Reply # 4


  

          

https://www.instagram.com/p/Bly33BcgDGz/?hl=en&taken-by=robertglasper

  

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Garhart Poppwell
Member since Nov 28th 2008
18115 posts
Thu Aug-16-18 09:27 PM

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36. "this dude is widlin' in the best possible way"
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

this is the kind of thing you'd see in a GD post about how "some Robert Glasper ass looking dude" went wild in the airport

__________________________________________
CHOP-THESE-BITCHES!!!!
------------------------------------
Garhart Ivanhoe Poppwell
Un-OK'd moderator for The Lesson and Make The Music (yes, I do's work up in here, and in your asscrease if you run foul of this

  

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Case_One
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54687 posts
Tue Aug-14-18 03:14 PM

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17. "I'm dying... LOL"
In response to Reply # 4


          


.
.
Current Favorite Song: https://youtu.be/8v_KFHnPImY

"I cannot see how nature could have created itself. Only a supernatural force that is outside of space and time could have done that. ~ Francis Collins

  

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Crash Bandacoot
Member since May 13th 2003
10119 posts
Tue Aug-14-18 12:17 PM

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7. "hey, i respect robert glasper"
In response to Reply # 0
Tue Aug-14-18 12:18 PM by Crash Bandacoot

          

sounds like some of this stuff might be true. the host was a little extra, sit your
happy hater-ass down...it's not that serious.

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
24419 posts
Tue Aug-14-18 12:22 PM

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9. "I was getting pissed @ the dude who kept being like ..."
In response to Reply # 7


          

"Oh but were you guys playing the songs right ?" or whatever. He's one of those "Boogie can do no wrong" folks.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Dr Claw
Member since Jun 25th 2003
132214 posts
Tue Aug-14-18 01:13 PM

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13. "I don't think he was disrespectful here."
In response to Reply # 7


  

          

because he was mostly focusing on what she was doing that was disrespectful.

  

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Case_One
Charter member
54687 posts
Tue Aug-14-18 03:15 PM

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18. "Right. OKP be so extra"
In response to Reply # 13


          


.
.
Current Favorite Song: https://youtu.be/8v_KFHnPImY

"I cannot see how nature could have created itself. Only a supernatural force that is outside of space and time could have done that. ~ Francis Collins

  

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mrhood75
Member since Dec 06th 2004
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Tue Aug-14-18 12:17 PM

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8. "The main thing I can't abide by is her trying to cut their pay..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

...by half the day before the gig, then sending her manager to do it and try to play it off as "She's not happy with the way you've been playing." She probably always intended to pay them half of what she promised.

-----------------

www.albumism.com

Checkin' Our Style, Return To Zero:

https://www.mixcloud.com/returntozero/

  

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WarriorPoet415
Member since Sep 30th 2003
17895 posts
Tue Aug-14-18 01:00 PM

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12. "man that got me too. After a week of ten hour rehearsals? "
In response to Reply # 8


  

          

for a 20 min show. You got me all the way fucked up if you ain't giving me my money.


______________________________________________________________________________

"To Each His Reach"

but.....

Fuck aliens.

  

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handle
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Tue Aug-14-18 12:24 PM

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10. "She should be the spokesperson for Moviepass"
In response to Reply # 0


          

Synergy.

------------


Gone: My Discogs collection for The Roots:
http://www.discogs.com/user/tomhayes-roots/collection

  

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Castro
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Tue Aug-14-18 01:38 PM

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14. "He is right about how she treats musicians, but:"
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he ain't ever gonna match this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZlTK7mTpPs


And that is all her. Yes, she don't know any chords, it sounds like an open mic guitar, but she wrote something stunning and truthful, and niggas act like she only has one album.

Glasper has made a lot of beautiful music, and I keep his stuff in rotation, but he ain't ever gonna do MJ numbers like Lauryn did or make something this compelling and raw.

Lauryn is late. Lauryn steals music. Lauryn is an egomaniac. All true. But when the industry was putting her ass through the ringer, she had no one there to protect her, so the trauma we are seeing now is to be expected. Do like me- don't go see her. Play her music at home. And pray that she can heal.

------------------
One Hundred.

  

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
16595 posts
Tue Aug-14-18 01:50 PM

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15. "at this point though, Glasper career >>>"
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

and his impact in Jazz isn't all the way on LH's level...but he definitely made his own space

The not tuning your own guitar was unnecessary

I've heard stories that Jimmy couldn't tune his own guitar either

Still played the shit out of it

The point that will stand from MOLH...she never evah came close to producing a project on that level

She settled the lawsuit with New Ark for $5M

I agree with him...she ain't do ALLADAT to pull the shit she does now

also agree, MFers need to stop pretending she's that L-Boogie or ever will be on the MOLH level again

She and 'Ye should form a group and/or do a tour...we released ourselves on our own recognizance (or something like that)...so we can not go or buy it

They both have mental issues that none of this will help with.

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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exactopposite
Member since Aug 21st 2002
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Thu Aug-16-18 08:14 PM

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35. "Jimmy who?"
In response to Reply # 15


  

          

  

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biscuit
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251. "I think he meant "Jimi""
In response to Reply # 35


  

          

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

*Effasig*

  

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Heinz
Member since Dec 26th 2003
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Wed Aug-15-18 12:09 AM

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23. "Stop. "
In response to Reply # 14
Wed Aug-15-18 12:15 AM by Heinz

  

          

Unless you were there by her side at any point in her career to give some point of reference you are just talking to defend something blindly. Stop.

Stop. Who knows if any of the Marley's wrote that song with her. Nobody says she isn't talented. Thats not the argument.


----------

IG @h_n_z

  

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Case_One
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Tue Aug-14-18 03:12 PM

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16. "Glasper, "You Steal Music." LOL"
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Glasper is spitting the fearless truth about Lauren Hill


.
.
Current Favorite Song: https://youtu.be/8v_KFHnPImY

"I cannot see how nature could have created itself. Only a supernatural force that is outside of space and time could have done that. ~ Francis Collins

  

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Case_One
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Tue Aug-14-18 03:28 PM

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19. "Glasper - Entire interview is dope - Link"
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54WECf1ioeY


.
.
Current Favorite Song: https://youtu.be/8v_KFHnPImY

"I cannot see how nature could have created itself. Only a supernatural force that is outside of space and time could have done that. ~ Francis Collins

  

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dafriquan
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Tue Aug-14-18 09:26 PM

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20. "Lol. No lies detected but..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Glasper is being a bit "jazzist" with that whole "she can't tune her own guitar...lol" thing. That is neither here nor there. Lauryn Hill has never claimed to be a guitar goddess or something. From the little we've seen she probably only knows a few chords anyway.

  

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Heinz
Member since Dec 26th 2003
20759 posts
Wed Aug-15-18 12:10 AM

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24. "Is it?"
In response to Reply # 20


  

          

I thought it was clear he was adding on to the point of you got caught for not writing music and still doesn't really acknowledge it yet she can't tune her guitar because she's not a good musician. Def not good enough to write any of the music she sang on LOL


----------

IG @h_n_z

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79594 posts
Wed Aug-15-18 08:35 AM

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27. "I see both points"
In response to Reply # 24


          

he is pointing out how she disrespects musicians but can’t even tune her own shit

It ain’t that serious tho when t comes to her overall talent.

I wish she would rent her corner and get her shit together. I heard about the no eye contact rule and knew it was some wild rumor. This woman thinks she is a god? Wtf?

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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soulfunk
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Wed Aug-15-18 10:16 AM

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30. "That's not "jassist" at all though...honestly tuning a guitar is easier"
In response to Reply # 20


  

          

than playing any chords at all. It also added more context to the issue of how she treats her musicians, calling dude over like that as if tuning her guitar is beneath her.

  

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Case_One
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Wed Aug-15-18 10:31 AM

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31. "^^ This is part of the Core issue along with here lack of humility ^^"
In response to Reply # 30


          

>than playing any chords at all. It also added more context to
>the issue of how she treats her musicians, calling dude over
>like that as if tuning her guitar is beneath her.
>


.
.
Current Favorite Song: https://youtu.be/8v_KFHnPImY

"I cannot see how nature could have created itself. Only a supernatural force that is outside of space and time could have done that. ~ Francis Collins

  

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cal.25
Member since Nov 10th 2014
188 posts
Tue Aug-14-18 10:49 PM

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21. "What happened to the 'New Ark' after?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

After the mess and fallout of the Miseducation album, what did the New Ark members work on after?

I've read that James Posyer and John Legend did some work on the album, man I'd love to hear their take on it too...

  

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howardlloyd
Member since Jan 18th 2007
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Wed Aug-15-18 12:06 AM

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22. "RE: What happened to the 'New Ark' after?"
In response to Reply # 21


  

          

vada nobles worked on a bunch of stuff. he did “pon de replay” amongst others

che pope wasn’t new ark but worked on miseducation and many many many other joints

http://howardlloyd.bandcamp.com

  

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double 0
Member since Nov 17th 2004
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Thu Aug-16-18 10:17 AM

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34. "RE: What happened to the 'New Ark' after?"
In response to Reply # 22


          

And Che Pope runs mad things Good Music related

Double 0
DJ/Producer/Artist
Producer in Kidz In The Hall
-------------------------------------------
twitter: @godouble0
IG: @godouble0
www.thinklikearapper.com

  

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Khalil19
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Wed Aug-15-18 06:56 AM

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25. "From her actions over that last 20 years..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

How can anyone think Robert has some axe to grind? Her ego has BEEN out of control. I jumped off that ship decades ago and kudos to him for saying what other musicians felt they could not.

The "not looking her in the eyes"...that's something we've known about for a while but her supporters ignore how she treats people.


I'll say what I've said many times.....Fuck Lauryn!!!!




You don't impress me!!




RIP Reggie...I love you!! http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb449/Mynewstuff2011/RegLover.jpg



https://twitter.com/hawkcomedy

  

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tully_blanchard
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Wed Aug-15-18 07:02 AM

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26. "Trinity in 5....444.....3....."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


*************************************

Fuck aliens

-Warriorpoet415

https://astackofwax.com/

#2dopebrothersandastackofwax

https://www.instagram.com/thirtythree.three/


http://soundcloud.com/rayandersonjr

  

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KiloMcG
Member since Jan 01st 2008
27561 posts
Wed Aug-15-18 08:47 AM

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28. "RE: Trinity in 5....444.....3....."
In response to Reply # 26


  

          

haha, well done

  

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makaveli
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Wed Aug-15-18 09:54 AM

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29. "if lauryn's spiritualness is telling her not to pay people"
In response to Reply # 26


  

          

she shouldn't have to pay people. I mean if she doesn't FEEL like paying can we really expect her to pay? love you trin.

“So back we go to these questions — friendship, character… ethics.”

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79594 posts
Thu Aug-16-18 10:06 AM

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33. "I don’t understand, can you say it another way? "
In response to Reply # 29


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Trinity444
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Sun Aug-26-18 06:37 AM

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41. "lol. forget y’all..."
In response to Reply # 29


  

          

  

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mista k5
Member since Feb 01st 2006
16414 posts
Thu Aug-16-18 09:22 AM

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32. "okay this was actually a good interview"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

even without the lauryn stuff it was entertaining. before he started talking about lauryn i was wondering why the focus seemed to be on her. after listening now i see.

  

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c71
Member since Jan 15th 2008
13962 posts
Sat Aug-25-18 12:25 PM

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37. "Rolling Stone and OKP on the 20th Anniversay of "Miseducation""
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/inside-the-miseducation-of-lauryn-hill-252219/


HOMEMUSICMUSIC NEWS

Inside ‘The Miseducation of Lauryn Hill’

Lawsuits, Grammys, and a tiny attic studio in New Jersey: an oral history of the hip-hop classic on its anniversary

By LAURA CHECKOWAY


The Miseducation of Lauryn Hill was released in the final weeks of August 2008 and went on to sell more than 8 million copies, win five Grammys and earn a four-star review in Rolling Stone. Mary J. Blige hailed it as “one of the most incredible albums ever made” and the record influenced a generation of soul and hip-hop artists.

“Music is about to change,” Hill told Rolling Stone‘s Touré for his 1999 cover story. “I think now people feel a little more comfortable playing with the parameters. Writing more intensely.”
Miseducation‘s liner notes mostly credit Hill with producing, writing and arranging the entire album. It was, in fact, a huge group effort, as underlined by a lawsuit settled out of court in 2001 for a reported $5 million. To celebrate the album, Rolling Stone spoke with many of those responsible for making it: a then-little known pianist named John Legend, D’Angelo, engineer Commissioner Gordon, backup singers, New-Ark producers, Hill’s longtime companion Rohan Marley, and her Fugee bandmate Pras Michel.


The Beginning:


Jayson Jackson (former manager, Lauryn Hill): The Fugees were on the road in the summer of ’96 and Lauryn called me like, “I can’t believe these muthafuckers. I’ve been talking about making my solo record for the longest and they’re doing everybody’s solo record but mine! I’m leaving the group, I’ve had it.” I was like, call (then-Sony Chairman) Donnie Ienner. And she was like, “I don’t wanna fuck with them, I just wanna get a whole new crew.”

Vada Nobles (producer/programmer): My friend Kilo called and said, “Yo, bring some music, Lauryn Hill wants us to come to her house!” In her living room, Lauryn had on a brown robe, she was pregnant. She was saying she’s moving on from the Fugees and considering doing a solo record. She was looking to put together her own creative support team. She came up with the name New-Ark. Her mother said that Lauryn prayed for a situation like this.

Commissioner Gordon Williams (engineer/project supervisor): In the beginning, the New-Ark guys were the core who put the basic tracks together. Vada was a programmer who made drum beats, Kilo (Rasheem Pugh) would write hooks and lyrics, Tejumold Newton played piano and Johari Newton played guitar.

Rohan Marley (Bob Marley’s son/father of Hill’s five children): She took these guys New-Ark from out of the ghetto in Newark and created a team and taught them what she knew. Nobody else wanted to work with her because there was little feud going on and Wyclef was telling people, “You work with Lauryn, you don’t work with me.”


Che Vicious (formerly Che Guevera; producer): I worked with ‘Clef and Lauryn knew I wasn’t happy with some of the business with ‘Clef, so she asked me to come co-produce. She wanted me and (producer/keyboardist) James Poyser at her utter disposal. We gave her a price for that. That’s when she brought Vada and New-Ark in. I call it the A team and B team. We never really worked together. By the time the album was done I actually had to re-do their stuff and make it stronger.

Jackson: Music was always a collaborative effort with her. With ‘Clef and Jerry Wonder (Fugees producer Jerry Duplessis), they just kicked ideas and that’s how music got made. So when she started on her own, she was lonely. I remember her talking about the New-Ark guys like, they’re cool dudes and they’re young. The genius of that record, it began with her and it ended with her. She wanted it to sound muddy, like an old record scratching and her engineer Gordon was able to capture it.

Lauryn Hill: (I wanted to) write songs that lyrically move me and have the integrity of reggae and the knock of hip-hop and the instrumentation of classic soul. (My engineer and I worked on) a sound that’s raw. I like the rawness of you being able to hear the scratch in the vocals. I don’t ever want that taken away. I don’t like to use compressors and take away my textures, because I was raised on music that was recorded before technology advanced to the place where it could be smooth. I wanna hear that thickness of sound. You can’t get that from a computer, because a computer’s too perfect. But that human element, that’s what makes the hair on the back of my neck stand up. I love that.

Commissioner Gordon: My wife, Suzette, signed Lauryn as a songwriter and said, “Lauryn wants to talk to you about doing a solo record.” Lauryn said, “I want you to be my co-pilot.” The recording took about a year and a half. Sony never wanted her to make a solo record; they wanted her to make another Fugees record.

Marley: Lauryn and her mom took (early versions of) her album to Sony Records and they said, “This is coffee table music. What is this shit? Coffee table music.” She took her shit and walked outta there.

Commissioner Gordon: No one believed. She said, “I wanna make my own record, have the baby and use these unknown guys.” They’re like, you’re Lauryn Hill, why aren’t you with Track Masters? It took a lot of courage to go down that road and we all felt like soldiers in her army. Lauryn will push you to the tenth level to get something the way that she’s hearing it. The divinity of the scenario was always overwhelming to me because I could feel it all the time.

Nobles: There was a female group called Ex Factor signed to Arista and we did a song called “Ex Factor” for them. And then we started working on a song called “Loved Real Hard Once” — the title got switched (to “When It Hurts So Bad”). Those were the first two records that we worked on. We were making songs for other people and the songs started becoming too personal and we were like, wait a minute, this is your story. We were having a conversation about her relationship in the little studio in her attic in South Orange, and that’s how “I Used to Love Him” came about. It was about ‘Clef.

Pras Michel (founding member, the Fugees): Wyclef Jean, Lauryn Hill…Some of our frustrations have been let out to the press and some would argue that you don’t wash dirty laundry in public. But we’re all grown now and understand the impact we had on each other’s lives. The album emotionally grabs you because it was her true feelings of things that happened during that period of her life.

Hill: The album is not about me bein’ upset about a love lost. It’s not even really about bein’ upset about bein’ stabbed in the back.


“To Zion”


Jackson: She called me and sang a verse of “Zion” and I was literally in tears. I went through that with her as a friend, Wendy Williams blowing her spot about her pregnancy on the radio. No one knew! It was definitely a Where’s Waldo? moment ’cause no one knew who Lauryn was dating.

Marley: She ended up having a child from myself and ones telling her she need to abort the child. Those songs, it’s all her experience.

Che Vicious: I’d gotten into a bunch of Spanish records. I lived in a brownstone in Brooklyn and there was this little studio apartment on the top floor that didn’t have air conditioning. I could only go in there for 20 minutes at a time to make tracks because it was too hot. And one of those 20 minutes is when I made “Zion.” I came in with the track and Lauryn teared up and said, “I have this idea to do a song about my baby and I didn’t know what the music should sound like until I heard that track.”
Nobles: Out of all the records, “Zion” was her baby because it was about her child. Can’t nobody interfere with that right there. That drum roll inspired Kanye’s “Jesus Walks,” I know it did!

Commissioner Gordon: I remember the first time she sang “To Zion” to me I almost started crying on the spot. Che put together a drum loop and she came over right next to me at the board and started singing “Zion” in my ear. These circumstances she’s singing about I know first hand. I’m at the label hearing everybody say, “How’s this girl gonna get pregnant now?!” Then Carlos (Santana) played his guitar in Miami at Circle House Studios. It was a swap. She wanted Carlos to play “Zion” and she did a song for Supernatural.
“Doo Wop (That Thing)”

Nobles: There was a box set that said “doo wop” sitting on the floor — the title for her single “Doo Wop (That Thing)” came off that box. We were making a song warning women about slick men, but there’s some bad girls out here, so we gotta tell both sides. I thought the music was cheesy, it wasn’t hard enough, so I put a really heavy drum in there just to give it some edge, something hip-hop.

Lenesha Randolph (backup singer): In November 1997, I get a phone call asking if I was available to come to Chung King Studios. Lauryn came in eating spaghetti pomodoro and garlic bread and explained where she’s trying to go with this album and how she wants it to be a reflection of all of us. I was an 18-year-old girl that just wanted to sing. For “Doo Wop” she said, “I wanna play with ’50s and ’60s harmonies, like barbershop guys on the corner and then we all just jumped in harmonizing a cappella “whooo whoo whoo whoo.” She directed us and from there history was made.

Commissioner Gordon: When I mixed “Doo Wop” at Sony Studios, it was 128 tracks — two 48-track machines plus two 24 two-inch machines all running at the same time. When James Poyser came in for “Superstar,” we rented a harpsichord that was so old it fell out of tune really quickly so we had to have the tuner actually there. By the time James finished playing it once it was out of tune.


The Move to Jamaica


Marley: One time at Chung King Studios she was like, “I can’t do this, there’s too many people popping in.” I said, “Let’s go to Jamaica, you don’t worry about anything.” She needed to get away. She needed to get to the rock.

Nobles: We stayed way up in the hills and Rohan would take us to the studio. He would fly in that BMW around curves, he was messing with us. I remember being scared for my life. “Forgive Them Father” and “Lost Ones” were made at the Bob Marley Museum on 56 Hope Road. That’s why on “Lost Ones” she says, “I was hopeless, now I’m on Hope Road.”

Commissioner Gordon: That first day in the studio was a lot of pressure because we were late since all the equipment was held up in customs for two days. The lead engineer Errol Brown used to be Bob Marley’s engineer and the family — Stephen, Damian, Julian, Ziggy — were in and out. Vada set up his drum machine and got the beat rocking. He’d always do his little dance while he’s making his beats.

Nobles: Lauryn was in the studio room redoing vocals. Stephen and Damian Marley would play football at the museum and hang out. I had a MPC 3000 and an SP 1200 connected together, showing them the sounds and I said, “Wait a minute, this is hot, let me record that!”

Commissioner Gordon: Right as Lauryn walks in, she starts freestyling. A lot of Bob’s grandchildren were there, all these little kids jumping around. As she kept doing that rhyme pattern, Situation! Complication! Tion! Tion!, she would point to the kids and they all chimed in “Tion! Tion!” She put down the verses on a handheld mike ’cause she always had a different vibe when she would hold a mike.

Marley: The musicians, my brothers, the whole studio was filled with people, this place was moving. And she’s just walking around and dropped a verse on that, she gave everybody chills. Those lyrics, they cut through you.


“Nothing Even Matters”


Nobles: Lauryn was in the kitchen at the house up the hill in Jersey where she’d moved with her parents when we first played “Nothing Even Matters” for her. I was so excited but Lauryn didn’t get it musically. Sony started putting a lot of pressure on her to hurry and wrap the record up. She started scrambling, going back through the ideas and then the lyrics came together.

Che Vicious: I was messing around with these finger snap sounds for the D’Angelo song (“Nothing Even Matters”) and she started coming with the song out of her head. We built the record around this weird snap pattern. That’s how it was with her — the creative process wasn’t this strict environment.
Randolph: “Nothing Even Matters” I hold dear to my heart because I got to meet Mr. D’Angelo, himself.

D’Angelo: Collaborating with Lauryn was very cool. She was warm and sweet. Originally, we were going to swap tunes for each other’s projects because I was working on Voodoo at the same time and my keyboardist James Poyser was also working with her. I went to her house in New Jersey, she played a lot of songs for me and gave me a rough copy to listen to. When Lauryn and I went into in the studio together, I laid down my vocals in the course of an hour.


“Everything Is Everything”


Nobles: A friend of mine had a little studio in East Orange (New Jersey) where “Everything Is Everything” came about. Lauryn didn’t need to use fancy studios — she was down. The title concept came from Donny Hathaway. Then John Legend came by and played. He was trying to get his career off the ground.

John Legend: I was in the spring of my junior year at University of Pennsylvania. A friend invited me to give her a ride to Lauryn’s house in Jersey. Lauryn was working “Everything Is Everything.” I sang and played a couple songs for her. She asked me to play piano on the track. She guided me a little bit but it was pretty simple because I was playing along with a string part that was already there. I became known around campus as the dude who played on “Everything Is Everything.” It was my little claim to fame at Penn for my whole senior year.
Wrapping Up

Commissioner Gordon: “Can’t Take My Eyes Off of You” was never meant to be a commercial single. It was originally recorded for (the soundtrack for the movie) Conspiracy Theory and ended up on the radio, became popular, and that’s how it ended became a bonus track. She called me and said she was behind and had to get it done. She didn’t know how the arrangement of the song went, so we went and got a copy from Coconuts or Sam Goody. I had a little one-room 16-track studio in my apartment in Jersey. Lauryn was eight months pregnant, laying on her back on the floor, half asleep, holding a handheld mike. She did all of those vocals off the top of her head pretty much in one take, with the beat box and all of that. That blew me away.

Candice Anderson (backup singer): I came in during the last two songs. I had just auditioned at her house and they were like, come to Chung King. I had no clue what was going on but she told us what to sing. “Tell Him” took a while because she’s very particular about how she wants it to sound. We’ll keep going until it gets to exactly what she hears in her head and she won’t stop until she gets exactly what she wants.

Jackson: For the album title, she wanted something like The Education of Sonny Carsonand we were like, why don’t you make it more self-deprecating, like The Miseducation of Lauryn Hill? People heard it as her opus and what she was, but in hindsight I think it was more about what she aspired to be. And what else is art but the best side of who you are and who you wanna be?

Ras Baraka (poet, politician and teacher who served as Miseducation‘s narrator): I was running for councilman in Newark and was also an eighth grade teacher. I was just about to take two of my students home and Lauryn called and asked if I could come up to her house in South Orange. There were chairs set up in the living room and a bunch of kids were there. She told me she wanted to discuss the concept of love. There was a blackboard and I wrote the letters “LOVE” and we just went into the whole discussion.



Release and Reception


The Miseducation of Lauryn Hill was released on August 25th, 1998 and sold 422,600 copies its first week in stores — a SoundScan record for best-selling debut week for a female artist. In January 1999, Hill received 10 Grammy nominations. The following month she took home five trophies including the awards for Album of the Year, Best New Artist and Best R&B Song. She read from Psalm 40 during one of her acceptance speeches.

Jackson: Lauryn became an international superstar. She couldn’t go to the grocery store without makeup and I think that had an adverse effect on her. We had a huge year at the Grammys and then Carlos Santana had the big year next year and she presented for Carlos. It wasn’t so much the amount of records we sold but how we sold them — we didn’t put out six singles, seven videos, do every TV talk show and just milk it. We marketed and presented her as a classy, genuine person and that resonated and that’s why we’re still talking about it ’til this day.

Poyser: The lyrics of that record really struck a chord with everybody, it really touched a lot of souls. The best songs are testimonies of life that everybody can relate to. Everybody can’t relate to balling and drinking Cristal and running around with a million chicks and driving a Bentley. Everybody can relate to heartache and love.

D’Angelo: Churches were substituting God in the lyrics (for “Nothing Even Matters”). Whenever they make a gospel version from a secular song, that’s significant.

Commissioner Gordon: Knowing Lauryn was definitely a blessing and whatever time we spent together was all very significant and that is evident in the thing that we created. She was just gifted.


The Lawsuit


Jackson: After all that beauty, she hurt a lot of people that loved her because she got hurt.

Che Vicious: She gave me co-production (on “To Zion”), but I did the track on my own. There was label pressure to do the Prince thing — written and produced by. I still love you like a sister, but you didn’t do it on your own.

Commissioner Gordon: Sometimes when you have a really big blessing, you have a really big weight that comes along with that and some people can get weak along the way. The highs were super, super high and the lows were super, super low. She was like, “I’m releasing myself of the burdens of this worldly business and I’m going into my sabbatical.”

Nobles: Everything changed. It went from we to I. Everything started out genuine but somewhere down the line, something switched. Once it became clear that I wouldn’t be credited or compensated according to what’s fair, I had to voice how I felt. I had a wife and family. She barely credited me. She gave Che my credits. As God as my witness, that was in spite. I tried my best to resolve it without lawyers but it became impossible. The suit dragged on for about three years. They tried to discredit us that we were musicians trying to take advantage of her.

Jackson: Our mistake was Lauryn never wanted to do paperwork or formalize the relationship with them. She was like, “I don’t want them to feel like they work for me” and that came back to bite us. She looked at Vada as a drum programmer, like I want you to make a beat — take that out, do this. Kilo claimed to be an MC but early on it became clear that he wasn’t no MC. She was trying to decide between a line about Polos or Girbauds. I was like, Polo is more classic. So I could’ve claimed I wrote a fucking verse for her! Ain’t nobody write no Lauryn Hill song, them shits was way too personal. They sued Lauryn, Sony, Ruffhouse Records, me, Suzette — everybody. The case was dragging on and it just got really ugly.

Marley: A team of them ganged up against her. Of course she sits there like, Ro, give me a word that rhymes with rat. I say cat just to trigger something, Nobody writes anything for her. Because she’s a woman of the Almighty, she doesn’t wanna fight. It’s like someone telling a lie on me and I’m standing there defending a lie.

Che Vicious: I’m glad I was a part of it, the only thing that taints it for me is I wish it was properly credited. Maybe in retrospect I should have sued her. But it doesn’t taint the body of work because at the end of the day people loved the record. I felt like we could have made more than just one. I’m sad about that.

Nobles: Eventually Lauryn decided she didn’t wanna go on with it no more. The lawyers were mad that she wanted to quit. Kilo and I went to her house and made peace right after the depositions. I haven’t seen or heard from her since.

James Poyser (songwriter/producer): The business end of it got extremely, extremely messy. You chalk it up to experience. When you throw your heart out there, you gotta be prepared for it to not land somewhere soft.


The Aftermath: Hill’s Retreat


Jackson: It started to get strange, Bible study went from one day a week to three days a week to five days a week to I want you to come. I went to a couple of them but I was like, I completely understand if it’s your calling, but it’s not mine and I can’t force it. As that picked up we drifted further and further apart.

Nobles: The type of pressure, selling 18 million records worldwide, winning all these Grammys and people love you and then you wanna be outside the box, change up your hairstyle, express yourself, and people say, “No, that’s not you.” She ain’t the type of woman that you gonna box in. She’s Ms. Hill, that’s who she is. And there’s nothing wrong with that. She wants to be called Ms. Hill, fine. Maybe she feels that society has disrespected her, maybe she feels like you’re not entitled to call me Lauryn, you don’t know me and don’t pretend like you know me.

Pras: It’s not that Lauryn is crazy — if it’s not the orthodox way then people tend to say you’re crazy. People said Einstein was crazy. Lauryn had whatever she was dealing with personally, and sometimes people don’t know how to give you a break because she had such an impact.

Marley: They’ve been hating for too long, hatin’ on her for no reason. You got a guy like Wyclef talking about her on the radio. What the fuck, brethren?! Relax! That’s foolishness! Big man, what you doing? Let’s move on. We got children too, ya know?

Hill: I think, in our own sweet time, we’re gonna get into a room and talk to each other about all of our issues and make some music. But that can’t happen too prematurely or I think it would damage things. We all sincerely loved each other. And we still do. But in any relationship there’s ups and downs. People grow up, they grow apart. I have a huge amount of love for them, but I needed to learn some things about myself. I’ve found my sound, the sound which is distinctly me. I needed to become the woman that I’m becoming, and it was necessary for me to make this record. But I think, at the same time, this record may have revealed some insecurities in other people. And I think it made it a little difficult. I don’t think that everybody was necessarily that happy that I decided to do a solo project. I think that they thought the worst as opposed to the best.

But I know that (a) time reveals truth. And (b) time heals wounds. So I’m not in any rush to rip any Band-Aids off. Actually, maybe I am. Maybe I do wanna rip the Band-Aid. I think this album definitely ripped the Band-Aid off, because it helped the wound to breathe as opposed to fester. But I’d rather let the healing process take its own natural time than rush into a situation. I definitely do (miss the Fugees). We were a crazy bunch. We used to do some wild things. Not bad wild things — we had a lot of fun. But the funny thing about liberation is that once you get it, anything other feels awkward.

Commissioner Gordon: ‘Clef got a bad rap because being the ex-boyfriend, that must be who caused all the problems. But when he spoke about her saying she’s disturbed, it was more from a place of helping her than trying to hurt her because it was a long time after.

Jackson: One of the last things she said to me in a real conversation was, “How do I keep it so hot and good, Jayson?” And I was like, “I don’t know if you can. The only thing you can do is as you grow, just make records.” And if she wants to take the rest of her days and raise her family or write poetry or whatever she chooses, God bless her. And thank you for doing it when you did.

Commissioner Gordon: Lauryn was everybody’s favorite singer and you can hear it in so many singers now. She gave the world something. And if that’s all there is, maybe it was enough.

Legend: Lauryn had that blend of toughness and soulfulness, melody and swagger. She did it better than anybody still has done it. People are still trying to capture that moment. Jazmine Sullivan’s song that’s out now (“Need U Bad”) sounds eerily similar to Lauryn.

Nobles: (J Records A&R rep) Peter Edge called asking me to work on
Jazmine Sullivan’s record. She’s a talented girl but I made a choice that I wasn’t gonna do it. I don’t wanna spend my life trying to reincarnate Lauryn through somebody else. Lauryn ain’t dead, Lauryn is very much alive. That woman’s alive.

Randolph: I sang with her until 2006. One of my last conversations with Ms. Hill was about her feeling like there’s no room for her music and people biting and stealing the formula and making it into something dishonest. And my words for her were, “You changed my life in a day. Whoever you feel out there is mimicking you, the Lauryn I know would show these ho’s how it’s done.”

Hill: I just can’t do anything if I’m not inspired. I always sorta wait for the inspiration to come, and if the spirit doesn’t drive me to do it, then I won’t do it. ‘Cause I definitely know that what I’m doin’ is sorta bigger than me. It’s somethin’ that I’ve been assigned.



Cast of Characters


Candice Anderson: Backup singer, The Miseducation of Lauryn Hill album and tour

Ras Baraka: New Jersey poet, politician and teacher who served as Miseducation’s narrator; Baraka speaks to a group of children about love during interludes throughout the album

Che Vicous (formerly Che Guevera): Producer who worked on The Miseducation of Lauryn Hill

D’Angelo: Featured on Miseducation duet “Nothing Even Matters”

Lauryn Hill: Singer/rapper/songwriter/producer

Jayson Jackson: Music industry exec who met Hill when she was a high school student and served as her manager until February 2001

John Legend: Played piano on “Everything Is Everything”

Rohan Marley: The son of Bob Marley and father of Hill’s five children

Pras Michel: Hill’s Fugees bandmate

Vada Nobles: Producer and programmer who sued Hill for not being properly credited on Miseducation

James Poyser: Songwriter, producer and keyboardist credited as a musician on Miseducation

Lenesha Randolph: Backup singer, The Miseducation of Lauryn Hill album and tour

Commissioner Gordon Williams: Engineer and project supervisor, The Miseducation of Lauryn Hill


All new interviews were conducted for this story with the exception of Lauryn Hill, whose quotes are from her 1999 Rolling Stone cover story by Touré.

-----------------------------------=

http://www.okayplayer.com/originals/lauryn-hill-defense-legacy-20-years-miseducation.html


Ms. Lauryn Hill’s Last Reprieve: In Defense of Legacy

POSTED BY IVIE ANI



With the 20th anniversary of The Miseducation of Lauryn Hill, it’s time we examine how the artist’s superstar underdog story transitioned into an unfair tale of music’s hero-turned-villain.
Last month, LeBron James revealed his regret in naming his oldest son LeBron James Jr., citing the worry of imposing too much, too prematurely on the 13-year-old’s unformed legacy.

Perhaps his regret signifies the parallels between the personal pressure he hoped to not place on his son and the public pressure that was once placed on him, earlier in his career.

Writer and comedian Larry Wilmore and sports analyst Bill Simmons delved into the early career and real-time legacy of the athlete on an episode of the podcast Black on the Air.

They reflected on the period from 2003, when James joined the Cleveland Cavaliers as the first overall draft pick, to 2010 when he left the team to join the Miami Heat.

“LeBron was a superstar underdog — which is a great position to be in,” Wilmore said. “When you’re young, it’s fantastic because you’re going to have all the expectations in front of you. Now, he has the legacy in back of him that he gets to be a superstar underdog again. So, there’s more forgiveness for outcomes. Before, he was a prisoner of those outcomes. It affected the way he interacted with the press and everything. You’re going to see a more free LeBron.”

Wilmore was alluding to LeBron James’ early years in Miami, when he faced criticism for having left Cleveland — 40 minutes away from his hometown, Akron — without winning an NBA championship. In Miami, he created the Big Three, a superteam co-starring Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh. During this period, LeBron deliberately, but unfittingly, transitioned into a villain-like figure. He let Wade lead the way and take control during press conferences. In the 2011 finals against the Dallas Mavericks, he played terribly, averaging only 17 points per game, losing in six. (After this game he had one of his most memorable press conference appearances, defiantly saying: “All the people that were rooting on me to fail, at the end of the day, they have to wake up tomorrow and have the same life that they had before they woke up today.”

And then things shifted. He won back to back championships and the slate was wiped clean. He opened up again, appearing to be more honest and vocal. The LeBron James legacy had been solidified.

That framing is reminiscent of Lauryn Hill’s story — a 20-something-year-old mother at the crux of a messy schism between a successful run with ex-bandmates and her individual creative pursuits, navigating a period in rap music that was almost fully antithetical to her art. The Miseducation of Lauryn Hill exceeded the expectations that befell the inception of her solo career as she became the dark horse in the race that lapped past the finish line and into first place.

If LeBron James was able to come full circle, it’s a wonder if Ms. Hill be endowed with a chance to do the same. As we bear witness to the second iteration of her “superstar underdog” moment right now.

In recent, her career has been reduced to a talking point for believers turned skeptics turned critics caught up in one-dimensional analyses of her truancy to shows. Her artistry — the reworking of her classic songs— has been re-envisioned as not performing the coveted cosplay of what the former star was thought to be. Her business persona — firing and rehiring band members, rehearsals, and demanding to be referred to as Ms. Hill — is pinned as unreasonably high maintenance, with tinctures of racial and gendered double standards cloaked in a specific kind of vitriol. Her presence in music is being revisited with new eyes and ears, as antiquated social standard of the album’s time clash with our current cultural landscape.

So, in 2018, we hearken back to the sentiment of time when the visage of a fresh-faced singer and MC eclipsed her two male counterparts in The Fugeesto forge her own identity; in an industry set on deciding for her, we find ourselves asking again, who is Lauryn Hill?

The question prompts a more critical conversation on some of the attacks on Lauryn Hill. Since her retreat and then return to the public eye, her legacy has transformed from that superstar underdog story to an unfair tale of music’s hero turned villain. It’s time we rewrite that narrative.

In a 2016, Questlove suggested Ms. Hill may be facing “the embarrassment of now being a one album legacy artist and the possibility of not mattering anymore in this disposable society. People will kill something before it grows.”

But Lauryn Hill is more than a one-album legacy artist.

Legacies are like master recordings; ownership is an everlasting battle that sees one too many artists die as casualties before they ever get a chance to win. And if her career was facing death by the hands of fans and critique’s lack of faith, patience, or interest, let this moment in time be her latest reprieve.

The final day of the 2018 Pitchfork Festival last month marked the return of Ms. Lauryn Hill and a highly-anticipated performance, as part of her tour commemorating the 20th anniversary of her debut. But her performance that night — like the majority of the past decades coverage on her – was prefaced by doubt. Many questioned whether or not she’d show up on time, or whether or not she’d show up at all, and whether she was ever as talented of an artist and as paramount of a force in music as the world thought her to be.

Her performance that night in Chicago’s Union Park was a solid set. If perfection comes with time, Hill’s voice has aged to its zenith. The artist powered through over an hour of music with her strong vocals as the only constant that anchored her set of unfamiliar renditions of her classic records. During her set, she delivered a speech in which she explicitly defined her notion of legacy:

“Most people don’t know, but there was a tremendous amount of resistance when I made this album. It was my first time making a solo recording. It was my first time outside of (The Fugees)… People were skeptical. I remember, I ended up recording some of the album in New Jersey. I ended up recording of the album in Jamaica. But there was this pulse, there was this urge, there was this charge. I felt this responsibility. Because, yes, this album was about my life, it was about my experience, but it was also about sharing the love of music — of bridging a generational gap for an entire generation of people.”

“We have to remember that the people who came before us struggled to make music as authentic as they possibly could…. They fought hard. And I grew up with that legacy. I grew up with that musical tradition in me, and I felt a responsibility to soldier through the adversity to deliver to my generation a sound that said that we are part of a magnificent continuum. A legacy that can’t be bought, can’t be sold, can’t be compromised. And must, must continue on.”

With Miseducation, she was able to market her message without equivocation or posturing. This was Lauryn Hill, the artist, the woman, the mother, the student, in full effect. Of all her skill sets, singing, acting, songwriting, instrumentation, rapping was one of her most powerful. But she didn’t “transcend” hip-hop in that blanket, condescending way people use to describe black artists who soar beyond scope of view. At that time, she defined and defied what hip-hop was.

We know how seismic of an impact the album has made on the music industry as a whole. Its personal and political messages, its storied spiritual statements, its genre-uniting framework, and timeless tunes that have prompted its heralding by the highest of gatekeepers— from the National Recording Registry by the Library of Congress, to the Grammy Academy, to the prominent women in music who’ve succeeded Hill.

It’s clear that the project is one of the most celebrated and accoladed albums of all time. But, as its 20th anniversary arrives, what’s unclear is whether the artist is still as celebrated as the art.

It seems the world wants her to fall back in line, be on time, sound the same as she did 20 years ago, and to perform her allegiance, both on and off stage, to the daunting feats of fame that she sought to escape after Miseducation’s success. In 2001, when she performed “Adam Lives in Theory” off her live album, MTV Unplugged No. 2.0, she breaks to speak to the audience and says, “Fantasy is what people want, but reality is what they need. And I’m just retired from the fantasy part.”

Now, during her live shows, she’s been known to break down and rebuild the songs from Miseducation. Whether her opting to perform reworked versions of her songs stems from the infamous lawsuit surrounding writing credits and publishing rights for the album remains unconfirmed. But what goes unaccounted for is the very real possibility of this just being a choice by a mercurial musician invested in revisiting her seminal work with the fresh fervor of an artist pumping new life into an old vessel.

The festering frustration felt by fans over Hill’s maladjustment to criticism hasn’t vitiated the lasting effects of her music. Nostalgia just won’t allow for it. In the beginning, it was her message and magnetism that lead troves of listeners to love her. Now, it could be the power of nostalgia that permeates our collective minds and rewrites narratives of the past and present.

Or it could be that the public has an infinite amount of passes for her. Perhaps because her transgressions aren’t as heinous as those by the other public figures whose legacies are sanctified. Years from now, we may forgive and forget her faults, as the romanticized moments of our memories dictate we do so.

When a celebrity falls from grace — for whatever arbitrary reason that isn’t in line with our conditioned notions of how public figures should act, engage, and function with fame over time— the public’s pavlovian response is to assign the hero-turned-villain trope to their legacy. It’s tired and lacks the nuance needed to contextualize people, history, and moments. And with a figure as important, complex, and worthy of redemption as Ms. Hill, it’s time we eradicate that practice.

Aretha Franklin died days before the 20th anniversary of Miseducation. It’s been the latest death to apprise us of the reality that there aren’t many black living legends left in music.
And as the world waits on the next Lauryn Hill, as it does with most stars despite how singular, it becomes more apparent that she can’t be superseded. So stands the definition of Ms. Lauryn Hill, who has vocalized time and time again— in song, in code, in words, and in action— what she wants her legacy to look like.

Though we’ve seen what unfolds when one attempts to control their own legacy, maybe it’s time we close the book on our projected, pre-written version of that script. On the contrary, maybe it’s time we give the pen back to Ms. Hill.

  

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hip bopper
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38. "Man he trippin’"
In response to Reply # 0


          

He wish that he could half the artist that she is.

The hell he mean she hasn’t done enough?!!??!!!

  

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rorschach
Member since Nov 10th 2004
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Sat Aug-25-18 10:36 PM

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39. "I'd argue that Glasper is every bit the artist Lauryn is....."
In response to Reply # 38


  

          

On musicianship alone.
---------------------------------------


---------------------------------------

  

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hip bopper
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Sat Aug-25-18 10:56 PM

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40. "You can argue all you want.."
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it ain’t even close.

  

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Innocent Criminal
Member since May 03rd 2003
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Sun Aug-26-18 06:44 AM

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42. "You’re right, Glasper knows multiple chords. "
In response to Reply # 40


  

          

And shows up on time.

________________________________
There are dozens of us! Dozens!

  

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LAbeathustla
Member since Jan 24th 2004
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Sun Aug-26-18 07:00 AM

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43. "im pretty sure he can tune multiple instruments..while she cant tune"
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a fkng guitar..

------------------------------------
2019 CABG Survivor

2016 OK Survivor Champion

be about it or be without it

RIP GOATs

  

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mind_grapes
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Sun Aug-26-18 11:25 AM

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45. "let's not get ignorant in our disrespect"
In response to Reply # 43


          

Glasper talked about her not tuning her guitar to highlight how she treats other musicians. If you can play chords, then you can tune a guitar. It's not rocket science.

  

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mind_grapes
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Sun Aug-26-18 11:41 AM

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46. "Robert Glasper isn't half the artist of Ms. Hill"
In response to Reply # 40


          

I don't care how well he can play Maiden Voyage. His whole aesthetic is pretty limited and rehashes neo-soul cliches. Him and Common deserve each other. When I see him do some interesting stuff, like in his Smells like Teen Spirit cover, I will see him rehash it somewhere else. His contributions to R + R = Now are immediately recognizable in a bad way, especially when next to Christian Scott (who is way more of a genius than Glasper).

In the Nina Revisted album, he produced half and Lauryn produced the other half. They both had a month or two to work on it and everything she produced is far superior, aside from his work on Alice Smith's "I Put A Spell On You," which sounds more like it was produced by Explosions In The Sky than Glasper.

Does this take away from what he has to say about her treating her musicians like shit...not at all. But that doesn't make it okay for you to shit on the legacy of another artist and insinuate that she doesn't write her own work.

  

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Innocent Criminal
Member since May 03rd 2003
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47. "Was part of her settlement with “New Ark”"
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having them help her produce those tracks on the tribute album?

________________________________
There are dozens of us! Dozens!

  

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mind_grapes
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48. "lol, it was not"
In response to Reply # 47


          

but her involvement was caused by her former manager, and OKP CEO, Jayson Jackson:

"Jayson Jackson, who produced the film and worked closely with Hill during the Fugees era and on Miseducation, became familiar with Simone through Hill. “I met Nina twice while working with Lauryn,” he says. “It’s not a stretch to say that I learned about Nina through the prism and perspective of Lauryn.” Years later, when Jackson teamed up with Simone’s daughter Lisa to create What Happened?, he worked up the courage to approach Hill about the soundtrack, expecting her to decline the offer. He would have been grateful for a single track, he says, but when the process was finished, Hill had turned in six."

https://www.thefader.com/2015/09/30/lauryn-hill-new-album

  

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LAbeathustla
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200. "lol..FOH...glasper was on the road playin in herbies band.. "
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i dont think ms hill could EVER pull that one off.. first of all she'd have to show up on time..and prolly have to tune her own shit..

------------------------------------
2019 CABG Survivor

2016 OK Survivor Champion

be about it or be without it

RIP GOATs

  

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mind_grapes
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230. "lol, i don't see how playing for Herbie some how validates you as an art..."
In response to Reply # 200


          

also, Lauryn plays with some of the best musicians around, including Kamasi Washington, Eric Gales, and some of the members from Bad Brains. Miles Mosley used to be her formed MD and said "she was significantly more talented than everyone else in the room, like all the time."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2DPtKVzYoZ0&t=90s

  

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
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Sun Aug-26-18 09:15 AM

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44. "She doesn't have 93 albums in her discog "
In response to Reply # 38


  

          

"The hell he mean she hasn’t done enough?!!??!!!"

Now that we are 20 years out from TMOLH, it would appear the claims of her taking credit for others work are true, based on subsequent output

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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Cold Truth
Member since Jan 28th 2004
44843 posts
Sun Aug-26-18 01:44 PM

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49. "He's not trippin. You're just capin'"
In response to Reply # 38


  

          

  

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shygurl
Member since Oct 08th 2002
13361 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 01:07 AM

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50. "Ms. Lauryn dropped a response to Robert's accusations "
In response to Reply # 0


          

https://medium.com/@Ms.LaurynHill/addressingrobertgalsper-f08c20e02ffe

I’ve remained patient and quiet for a very long time, allowing people to talk, speculate, and project, while keeping my nose to the grindstone fighting for freedoms many folks aren’t even aware matter. The arrogance of presumption that allows someone to think that they could have all the facts about another person’s life and experience, is truly and remarkably… presumptuous.

People can sometimes confuse kindness for weakness, and silence for weakness as well. When this happens, I have to speak up.

I apologize for the delay in getting this posted, I was late in hearing about it. I understand this is long, but my last interview was over a decade ago…
‘Addressing Robert Glasper and other common misconceptions about me (in no particular order)’

By Ms. Lauryn Hill

-It’s not completely informed, but he’s entitled to his perception. Context certainly helps though.

-You may be able to make suggestions, but you can’t write FOR me. I am the architect of my creative expression. No decisions are made without me. I hire master builders and masterful artisans and technicians who play beautifully, lend their technical expertise, and who translate the language that I provide into beautifully realized music.

-These are my songs, musicians are brought in because of the masterful way that they play their instruments. I’m definitely looking for something specific in musicians, and I absolutely do hire the best musicians I can find. Not every band had that particular ‘something’ I was looking for. That doesn’t make them bad musicians, just different than what I needed in that particular moment.

-The Miseducation was the first time I worked with musicians outside of the Fugees who’s report and working relationship was clear. In an effort to create the same level of comfort, I may not have established the necessary boundaries and may have been more inviting than I should have been. In hindsight, I would have handled it differently for the removal of any confusion. And I have handled it differently since, I’m clear and I make clear before someone walks in the door what I am and am not looking for. I may have been inclusive, but these are my songs.

-I have come across the occasional musician who thinks they already know what I want, feelings and egos can be easily bruised when you tell them they actually don’t. I am never trying to intentionally hurt anyone’s feelings btw, but when people insist that they know you and don’t, you may have to be equally as firm to demonstrate otherwise.

-I am paying for a service, and looking for something SPECIFIC, which isn’t up to someone else’s interpretation or opinion. I have my own idea of what works for me. That shouldn’t offend.

-And I definitely don’t like to fire anyone. It did take me meeting a lot of people over a number of years to find the right musicians, but my current band has been with me for a long time, the newest members probably 2/3 years, some as long as 7/8 years now. I was looking for a similar natural chemistry with new musicians that I’d had with the Fugees and Miseducation bands. I’d literally grown up with some of those musicians. That isn’t easy to find.

-In 2008, I had only a young man helping me and my Mother, after disbanding my former support staff. No idea why any musician would have had knowledge of what I was being paid, not sure what he’s saying is accurate. Don’t have the details or recollection of cutting the band’s pay in half. If fees had been negotiated and confirmed without my knowledge, I may have asked for them to be adjusted. But I would never just cut a musician’s pay arbitrarily unless I had a legitimate reason. There are artists who do cut pay though, James Brown was notorious for docking musicians if they did something he didn’t like, I’m sure there are others.

-It was necessary for me to reestablish trust and cultivate a new environment. I was looking to challenge myself artistically. I was also openly challenging music industry norms. I’d left ‘the machine’. With ‘it’ went some polish, but the cause we were fighting for, creative integrity, was worth far more than a little polish to me.

-When you’re a popular artist or public figure, people can sometimes forget that you’re hiring them to perform a service, and that you’re not the one there to entertain THEM. I didn’t scream or yell. Maybe I didn’t provide the experience that a musician may have wanted or expected during that time, but I was straight-forward, direct, and about the business at hand.

-Making my art is a labor of Love, but it’s still labor, and can be labor-intensive at that. If a musician was looking for a cushy job filled with the same trappings I was purposely weaning myself from, we wouldn’t have been on the same page anyway. Make no mistake, addiction is a common snare laid to dismantle the integrity of artists. My environment, at that time, operated more like a rehabilitation clinic than an after-party.

-I don’t think most people, perhaps not even some celebrated artists, are aware of the battle it takes to be an artist and remain true to what you really think. I don’t even ‘practice’ small talk, so I’m never confused with someone who can be seduced. There are traps all around, what could look like a successful career in entertainment today, could be an addictive lifestyle of convenience attempting to control you tomorrow. I set the tone with every band that working for fame and accolades is a different walk than fighting for personal integrity and making art that doesn’t compromise itself for money.

-I’m confused as to why such a principled musician, who thought I ‘stole’ from his friends, would show up to work for me anyway. 🤔 If that was hypocrisy or opportunism instead of genuine interest, it would further explain why an artist would feel the need to put his or her guard up.

-No matter how incredible the musicians who play with me are, MY name is on the marquee. The expectation to make it all come together is on me. The risk and the financial losses are on me. Hence, MY VIBE, though not the only consideration, is the priority. Few people actually know what this road is like, but many want to judge and comment, having never done it. Try doing what I’ve done yourself. If nothing else, you will gain some insight into and respect for my process.

-During the time in question, I also believe I was playing a lot of new music with controversial content. FOR ME, rehearsal was about readying myself for the battle I knew I was entering into for simply not allowing a system to pimp me. If I was on edge, I had good reason to be.

-Perhaps my seriousness and militancy in the face of tremendous resistance was misinterpreted as meanness, or that I was unloving or uncaring, when my true intent was to protect. I wouldn’t be the first Black person accused of this. I don’t think of Harriet Tubman’s skills as those of a hostess, but rather her relentless dedication to helping people who wanted out of an oppressive paradigm. #IGETOUT

-People also unwilling to ‘play the game’ might have found that environment refreshing. Straight talk isn’t devoid of Love, it’s just devoid of bullsh#t.

-And just to clear up an old urban legend that somehow people still believe, I do not hate white people. I do, however, despise a system of entitlement and oppression set up to exploit people who are different. I do loathe the promotion and preservation of said system at the expense of other people, and the racist and entitled attitudes it gives rise to. The lengthy history of unfairness and brutality towards people of color, especially Black people, has not been fully acknowledged or corrected. The expectation is for us to live with abuse, distortion, and deliberate policies, meant to outright control and contain us — like we’re not aware of our basic right to freedom. I resist and reject THESE ideas completely. Like many Black people, I work to reconcile my own generational PTSD. I do my best to Love, pursue freedom in body, Spirit and mind… and to confront. To repress everything in the name of ‘getting along’ is to deny our right to healing. It’s an ugly, distorting and complicated history at best. We’ve been shaped by it for better or worse. I just choose not to pretend that it’s not there in order to maintain public approval and gain economic advantage. My true white friends and colleagues and I discuss these schemes and machinations, and the distrust that people of color would naturally have toward such a system and towards those who agree with it. We don’t run from those conversations, we run into them, which is why I can call them friends and colleagues. Within these relationships I can be my complete self, and not a splintered individual/soul repressing the truth about generations and generations of abuse.

-There were lots of issues both personal and in the world of entertainment during that period that needed resolve. I was definitely going through a significant transition. I no longer felt safe.

-There’s an entire album about that, it’s documented and called Lauryn Hill MTV Unplugged. For some, the Unplugged album provided useful insight during dark times, gave important context on some real but hidden issues, and helped people going through personal struggles, because I’d exposed myself in such a raw and vulnerable state.

-Who are you to say I didn’t do enough? Most people are probably just hearing your name for the first time because you dropped MINE in an interview, controversially. Taking nothing away from your talent, but this is a fact.

-The Miseducation was my only solo studio album, but it certainly wasn’t the only good thing I did.

-I was also a member of the Fugees, another groundbreaking, multi-platinum selling group, who bridged social and cultural gaps, and were ambassadors of hip-hop all around this planet. We laid important groundwork upon which an entire generation of artists and musicians still stand. We broke through conventions and challenged limited world views every time we played.

-The song To Zion gave encouragement to women during challenging pregnancies. There are children who were given a chance at life because their Mothers experienced moral and emotional support through this song.

-What about the image of Black women in hip hop? When exposure and sexualization of the Black female body was the standard, SOMEONE stood up and represented a different image entirely, giving a generation of young women options and alternatives of self-representation. #AMNESIA

-And let’s not forget that I am a mother of 6…

-Not only have I been instrumental in pushing forward the culture of live music in hip-hop for decades now, but I’ve been traveling with and employing a large band for many years, despite the economic challenges in doing so. Others have followed in my footsteps, seeing the value of live music.

-Show me an artist working now who hasn’t been directly influenced by the work I put in, and I’ll show you an artist who’s been influenced by an artist who was directly influenced by the work that I put in. I was and continue to be a door opener, even if the blind don’t see it, and the prideful are too proud to admit it. I lived this, you watched this and heard about it.

-97.9 The Box, feel free to not play my music if you agree that ‘I haven’t done enough.’

-I never told anyone not to look me in the eye, that may have been something someone said assuming what I wanted. However, I would understand why an artist would say that. It’s about reaching a level of vulnerability while making or playing your art, and not wanting to worry about being examined while you’re in that process.

-There are plenty of people, I’m sure, who THINK they know me. This can happen when you do anything that people Love or feel they can relate to. Their perception of me, however, doesn’t make it my reality. Sister Act II is a movie. Rita Watson is a character I played…in a movie, for those confusing that with real life.

-And yes, Ms. Hill was absolutely a requirement. I was young, Black and female. Not everyone can work for and give the appropriate respect to a person in that package and in charge. It was important, especially then, for that to be revealed early.

-I adore Stevie, and honor Herbie and Quincy, who are our forebears, but they’re not women. Men often can say ‘I want it done like this’ and not be challenged. The same rules don’t always apply for women who may be met with resistance. When this happens you replace that player with someone who respects you and the office you hold.

-My approach to making music is non-traditional, possibly non-linear, and more a product of my heart, soul, and experience gained through doing, than something I was taught in a formal school setting. Not much different than the genre of hip-hop itself.

-I never held myself out as some accomplished guitar player, I play to articulate better to seasoned players what I want. It’s an instrument I learned without any real lessons or instruction. I play in an unorthodox manner and use it as a writing tool. Couldn’t or didn’t tune my own guitar? That sounds like an assumption.

-I take rehearsal seriously, I take performance seriously, I take my art seriously. My particular preparation process suits me. To each his or her own. My goal is to feel confident and free on stage.

-I don’t think my process is for everyone, which is why band selection is so important. It’s not just about how well someone plays, but also their attitude. I’m not offended when people say it’s not for them, no more than they should be offended when I say this doesn’t work for me.

-Auditioning, btw, may have nothing to do with how good a musician is. If a musician isn’t accomplished, he or she wouldn’t have been called. An audition or meeting could be about whether we vibe well, whether they understood my particular musical vernacular or direction at the time. I could have a jazz beast on keys, who couldn’t necessarily play reggae or some other musical style I also incorporated into my performances.

-My sound is eclectic, I’ve been influenced by a wide variety of music. Like language, music isn’t always easily translatable. Someone could be a great player, but lack the ability to capture the feel or groove of a particular style.

-I’m attracted to musicians that are open and excited to try new things. When people think they already know what needs to be known, and aren’t interested in exploring what I’m into, that’s fine, but it doesn’t work for my band.

-A fair weather band is a complete impracticality, a liability even. I’m expected, through my art, to pour out the depths of my soul. Some days that’s easier than others. If the crew of people supporting me aren’t built for that walk, they shouldn’t be there. #Realtalk. Some people vibe well together, some don’t. It’s ok. Ignorant patriarchy is a b#tch though,

I could speak volumes…

-My standards are too high, and my process too idiosyncratic, not to work with people who really want to be there. When I don’t have that, I keep searching until I find them.

-I remix my songs live because I haven’t released an album in several years. There’s a ton of backstory as to why, but there’s no way I could continue to play the same songs over and over as long as I’ve been performing them without some variation and exploration. I’m not a robot. If I’d had additional music out, perhaps I would have kept them as they were. I didn’t, so I revise and rearrange them according to what I’m feeling in that moment. This way, my performances are heartfelt and authentic, not me just going through the motions. I can’t imagine why that would be a foreign concept to anyone who appreciates jazz.

-And the myth that I’m not allowed to play the original versions of my songs is…a myth (anyone who’s seen my current show knows this).

-There can also be an energetic or emotional transference when I perform, and it can be heavy/weighty at times. As an artist, I’m tasked with bringing a different vibration into the space that transcends this. Not an easy gig but an important one. I can imagine there are people who value this process and don’t mind waiting a little if it means experiencing something inspired.

-Me being late to shows isn’t because I don’t respect my fans or their time, but the contrary, It can be argued that I care too much, and insist on things being right. I like to switch my show up regularly, change arrangements, add new songs, etc. This often leads to long sound checks, which leads to doors opening late, which leads to the show getting a late start. This element of perfectionism is about wanting the audience to experience the very best and most authentic musical experience they can from what I do.

-I reject being pigeonholed or pinned down by someone else’s uninformed concept of me. I’m my own person, free to explore my potential like everyone else.

- Where I am in one chapter of my life isn’t necessarily where I’ll be in the next chapter. I reserve the right to be an honest artist in those moments and not a fabrication, fake or phony version of myself, because that’s what someone else likes.

-I don’t owe anyone self-repression. Some fans will grow with me, some won’t and that’s ok.

-Life is to be lived, it’s not a full-time performance you put on for others, so people won’t have bad things to say about you in interviews.

-Hip-hop was born through people who didn’t necessarily have traditional musical training, the best tools, and in some cases even instruments, but found a way to express themselves despite that. My art exists because it has a will to exist, like hip hop.

-The album inspired many people, from all walks of life, because of its radical(intense) will to live and to express Love. I appreciate everyone who was a part of it, in any and every capacity. It wouldn’t have existed the way that it did without the involvement, skill, hard work, and talents of the artists/musicians and technicians who were a part of it, but it still required my vision, my passion, my faith, my will, my soul, my heart, and my story.

__________________________________________

I hope you live a life you’re proud of. If you find that you’re not, I hope you have the strength to start all over again.

— F. Scott Fitzgerald

  

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Ray_Snill
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Tue Aug-28-18 01:53 AM

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51. "RE: Ms. Lauryn dropped a response to Robert's accusations "
In response to Reply # 50


  

          

https://i.pinimg.com/736x/e4/25/e0/e425e07d91ea50ffcfb876c5885e8c06--play-hard-gummy-bears.jpg


<=========================================
https://cdn0.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/PYzh4v9cSf4FDnq3yMQyqNqh79o=/800x0/filters:no_upscale%28%29/cdn0.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/4079674/jlio.0.gif

  

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KiloMcG
Member since Jan 01st 2008
27561 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 09:51 AM

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67. "^^^^"
In response to Reply # 51


  

          

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79594 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 09:59 AM

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71. "Bruh, after the second paragraph I FB scrolled"
In response to Reply # 51


          

and still didn’t get to the end of it.

Shit was longer than her last concert.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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mista k5
Member since Feb 01st 2006
16414 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 10:30 AM

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80. "i made it all the way through"
In response to Reply # 71


  

          

that was exhausting. mostly rambles, there were a few good insights scattered through it but a lot of fluff.

  

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mrhood75
Member since Dec 06th 2004
44717 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 02:20 AM

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52. "That’s a lot of bullshit to gloss over how she screwed over her band"
In response to Reply # 50


  

          

Which is what I objected to most in the first place. Getting to the day before the performance and then trying to halve the bands’ pay is bush league horseshit, and she plays it off with “I don’t remember...” Whatever.

-----------------

www.albumism.com

Checkin' Our Style, Return To Zero:

https://www.mixcloud.com/returntozero/

  

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
16595 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 06:07 AM

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54. "LOL@the late plea cop... sound check ran long...c'mon "
In response to Reply # 52
Tue Aug-28-18 06:09 AM by bentagain

  

          

Errytime...?

She's not wrong though. She's allowed to do whatever she wants with her art. Just like we have the right not to support it.

The Harriet Tubman James Brown she ain't.

Cue up some break beats and spit that diatribe, you've got an album right there.

20 years L, 20.

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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tully_blanchard
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6902 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 09:40 AM

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64. "That proves even more how selfish she is"
In response to Reply # 54


  

          

These poeple paid to see at *this* time..

But "I" want to change this up and do this...screw the time restraints, and screw the fans. They'll just have to wait 2 hours to get this perfection.

So, even when she has an opening band, and they come out on time, but youre still late? Whats the excuse then? Ya'll aint rehearsing in the back...smh

Fuck you even more Lauryn Hill.





*************************************

Fuck aliens

-Warriorpoet415

https://astackofwax.com/

#2dopebrothersandastackofwax

https://www.instagram.com/thirtythree.three/


http://soundcloud.com/rayandersonjr

  

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Teknontheou
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Tue Aug-28-18 10:48 AM

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83. "My go to is: I bet she wasn't late to Austin City Limits."
In response to Reply # 64


  

          

Presumably they're on a schedule. That's probably been her most broadcast and widely seen performance since either Unplugged or the Award show season back in '98/'99/2000. I'm guessing she knew better than to bullshit with that.

  

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tully_blanchard
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Tue Aug-28-18 11:45 AM

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90. "RE: My go to is: I bet she wasn't late to Austin City Limits.-NOPE"
In response to Reply # 83


  

          


*************************************

Fuck aliens

-Warriorpoet415

https://astackofwax.com/

#2dopebrothersandastackofwax

https://www.instagram.com/thirtythree.three/


http://soundcloud.com/rayandersonjr

  

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tariqhu
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Tue Aug-28-18 09:43 AM

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65. "prince changed his songs/arrangements"
In response to Reply # 54


          

all the time cuz he'd get bored. nobody misunderstands that. but that dude was rarely late and was also a perfectionist.

she's really on some bs about the lateness.

she didn't help herself at all with this diatribe. should've stay quiet like she normally does.

Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

  

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
16595 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 09:54 AM

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69. "Exactly what I was thinking, should've sent this directly to Glasper "
In response to Reply # 65
Tue Aug-28-18 09:55 AM by bentagain

  

          

I hate seeing us fight in public (c)

But she completely overlooked the fans

Glasper really didn't say anything fans haven't been saying since she resurfaced

Just some additional insight and context, to $hit we already knew

I would love to hear her address the elephant in the room, the allegations that she's only now touring because she's financially compromised

...and cancelled recent shows based on the Drake cake...

Honestly, at this point, however incredible her talent and material was, it will be completely overshadowed by the offstage/behind the curtain scenes

Her legacy is going to be a Hollywood cautionary tale

Nobody is forcing her to do this.

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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tully_blanchard
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Tue Aug-28-18 11:44 AM

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89. "But if he's doing the entire 1999 album, he's not changing them all"
In response to Reply # 65


  

          


*************************************

Fuck aliens

-Warriorpoet415

https://astackofwax.com/

#2dopebrothersandastackofwax

https://www.instagram.com/thirtythree.three/


http://soundcloud.com/rayandersonjr

  

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Trinity444
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Tue Aug-28-18 04:20 AM

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53. "well written..."
In response to Reply # 50


  

          

People will believe what they want but at least now, we have both sides...

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79594 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 10:04 AM

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74. "lol"
In response to Reply # 53


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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B9
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43124 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 11:08 AM

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84. "Yep, I believe she's delusional and we're suckers for still paying atten..."
In response to Reply # 53


          

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
24419 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 11:17 AM

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87. "Agree. The sad part is I think she's got some mental issues."
In response to Reply # 84


          

So I want to, in theory, sympathize with her. But her refusal to stop blaming others for her artistic/professional shortcomings makes it near-impossible to stay on her side. This rambling nonsense was just written proof of that.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79594 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 12:25 PM

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91. "This long ass response let’s me know Glasper wasn’t lying. "
In response to Reply # 87


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Trinity444
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Tue Aug-28-18 01:03 PM

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94. "How can that be your conclusion and you didn’t bother reading it all? "
In response to Reply # 91


  

          

y’all corny lol

everyone is entitled to believe what they want about the story; however try to be fair about it.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79594 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 01:54 PM

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103. "I read enough"
In response to Reply # 94


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Trinity444
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Tue Aug-28-18 01:26 PM

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97. "you may be delusional too..."
In response to Reply # 84


  

          

just because we don’t agree with someone message don’t mean they have mental issues. I hate how easy you all throw it around. Like y’all shit all the way together...

but yeah. She mentions in this letter and also back when she did Unplugged. Some fans will grow with her and some won’t.

I get why some of you are disappointed. Lauryn’s no longer a traditional artist.. dude didn’t have to drag her name like that. Like she said, if the rumors he heard about her were true...why did he even show up?

because he thought he knew her...

“How you know me and I’m just getting to know me?” (c) Ms. Hill

I could poke holes in all you niggas theories but y’all too delusional...

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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Tue Aug-28-18 01:36 PM

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99. "Well if she doesn't have mental shit going on then she's just an asshole..."
In response to Reply # 97


          

>just because we don’t agree with someone message don’t
>mean they have mental issues. I hate how easy you all throw it
>around. Like y’all shit all the way together...

An inconsiderate asshole out to get paid like a major artist while behaving like a minor one, in an effort to pay her taxes. Don't really think there's any in-between here.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Trinity444
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Tue Aug-28-18 01:44 PM

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100. "how can read all that and conclude she’s an asshole..."
In response to Reply # 99


  

          

that’s crazy, lol.
why is his truth so much more believable?


it’s her truth.,
it’s how things showed up for her
for God sake, she’s defending herself against allegations

say you don’t agree! don’t spit on an artist that’s touched many lives. Maybe you don’t get it because she hasn’t touched yours...in a way that inspired you.

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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Tue Aug-28-18 01:53 PM

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101. "How can you read that and NOT conclude she's an asshole ?!"
In response to Reply # 100


          

>RE: how can read all that and conclude she’s an asshole...
>that’s crazy, lol.
>why is his truth so much more believable?
>
>
>it’s her truth.,
>it’s how things showed up for her
>for God sake, she’s defending herself against allegations
>
>say you don’t agree! don’t spit on an artist that’s
>touched many lives. Maybe you don’t get it because she
>hasn’t touched yours...in a way that inspired you.

I'm not spitting on her - I'm saying I disagree. Haha. I called her an asshole because that's how things showed up for me.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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B9
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Tue Aug-28-18 10:14 PM

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112. "“Non traditional artist” like homeless are “non traditional outdoo..."
In response to Reply # 97


          

I only check in on the circus to laugh about it, but the few of you sycophants that are left and buy in to the bullshit justifications she comes up with for being whatever form of Messiah she thinks she are the ones keeping the myth alive.

  

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Innocent Criminal
Member since May 03rd 2003
14586 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 06:17 AM

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55. "Is this her first time apologizing for being late?"
In response to Reply # 50


  

          

________________________________
There are dozens of us! Dozens!

  

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dgonsh
Member since Aug 14th 2002
10693 posts
Wed Aug-29-18 11:40 PM

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171. "LOL you saw an apology in there?"
In response to Reply # 55


  

          

she apologized to HERSELF. "I'm late BECAUSE I RESPECT MY FANS and i'm a perfectionist"

damn, thats an apology? ok

********************************************************************




"I *always* quote myself. I'm the only reliable source on *most* subjects" - OKP's First Lady of Knowledge, Janey

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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180. "Ahahahaha right."
In response to Reply # 171


          

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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Tue Aug-28-18 08:10 AM

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56. "This is a rambling, defensive, self-indulgent mess."
In response to Reply # 50


          

Whole thing is devoid of self-awareness and personal accountability.

This only served to confirm Glasper's version of events in my eyes.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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GROOVEPHI
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Tue Aug-28-18 08:46 AM

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57. "man i aint reading all that shit"
In response to Reply # 50


  

          

lol

  

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GROOVEPHI
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Tue Aug-28-18 08:46 AM

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58. "man i aint reading all that shit"
In response to Reply # 50


  

          

lol

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Tue Aug-28-18 08:49 AM

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59. ""but the contrary, It can be argued that I care too much" Girl Bye. "
In response to Reply # 50


  

          


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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natenate101
Member since Apr 21st 2015
682 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 09:08 AM

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60. "Peeped a FB report on this and one comment stood out "
In response to Reply # 50
Tue Aug-28-18 09:23 AM by natenate101

          

"She wrote this backstage while a crowd was waiting for her to come out and perform". Lol.

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
24419 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 09:10 AM

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61. "Ahahahahahaha. Perfect."
In response to Reply # 60


          

>"She wrote this backstage while a crowd was waiting for her
>to come out and perform". Lol.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Oak27
Member since Apr 17th 2005
13192 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 09:35 AM

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63. "My favorite comment I saw was..."
In response to Reply # 60


  

          

"Lauryn responding 2 weeks later is so on brand"

  

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mista k5
Member since Feb 01st 2006
16414 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 09:52 AM

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68. "HA!"
In response to Reply # 63


  

          

  

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JFrost1117
Member since Aug 12th 2005
23882 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 09:12 AM

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62. "We gotta update her on how long “several years” is."
In response to Reply # 50


  

          

____________
Twitter & IG: @rulerofmyself
SC: rulerofmyself17

Yes! She's on the drugs. (c) BoHagon

  

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flipnile
Member since Nov 05th 2003
13573 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 09:48 AM

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66. "The word "My/Myself" appears 65 times"
In response to Reply # 50


          

Seems difficult to work with.

  

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Airbreed
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Tue Aug-28-18 09:55 AM

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70. "I stopped at Harriett Tubman. Robert Glasper was right after all."
In response to Reply # 50
Tue Aug-28-18 10:06 AM by Airbreed

  

          

The narcissism is clear and present. And she doesn't care what anyone thinks.





  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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Tue Aug-28-18 10:26 AM

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77. "RIGHT - I meant to notice the Tubman mention specifically."
In response to Reply # 70


          

My jaw legit dropped when I saw that.

>The narcissism is clear and present. And she doesn't care
>what anyone thinks.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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mista k5
Member since Feb 01st 2006
16414 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 10:05 AM

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75. "#hashtag"
In response to Reply # 50


  

          

  

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fontgangsta
Member since Sep 04th 2005
5467 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 01:09 PM

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95. "maybe folks would care..."
In response to Reply # 50


  

          

if she wrote a song about it instead.
but she doesn't do that anymore.

  

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justin_scott
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Tue Aug-28-18 06:01 PM

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106. "RE: Ms. Lauryn dropped a response to Robert's accusations "
In response to Reply # 50


          


>-You may be able to make suggestions, but you can’t write
>FOR me. I am the architect of my creative expression. No
>decisions are made without me. I hire master builders and
>masterful artisans and technicians who play beautifully, lend
>their technical expertise, and who translate the language that
>I provide into beautifully realized music.


True.


>-These are my songs, musicians are brought in because of the
>masterful way that they play their instruments. I’m
>definitely looking for something specific in musicians, and I
>absolutely do hire the best musicians I can find. Not every
>band had that particular ‘something’ I was looking for.
>That doesn’t make them bad musicians, just different than
>what I needed in that particular moment.


Cool.


>-The Miseducation was the first time I worked with musicians
>outside of the Fugees who’s report and working relationship
>was clear. In an effort to create the same level of comfort, I
>may not have established the necessary boundaries and may have
>been more inviting than I should have been. In hindsight, I
>would have handled it differently for the removal of any
>confusion. And I have handled it differently since, I’m
>clear and I make clear before someone walks in the door what I
>am and am not looking for. I may have been inclusive, but
>these are my songs.


Ok.


>-I have come across the occasional musician who thinks they
>already know what I want, feelings and egos can be easily
>bruised when you tell them they actually don’t. I am never
>trying to intentionally hurt anyone’s feelings btw, but when
>people insist that they know you and don’t, you may have to
>be equally as firm to demonstrate otherwise.


I kinda understand her point, but she isn't a good musician. great rapper, great writer, good singer, bad musician. i read this as musicians far better than her trying to give her advice she won't take, but i could be wrong.


>-I am paying for a service, and looking for something
>SPECIFIC, which isn’t up to someone else’s interpretation
>or opinion. I have my own idea of what works for me. That
>shouldn’t offend.


True.



>-And I definitely don’t like to fire anyone. It did take me
>meeting a lot of people over a number of years to find the
>right musicians, but my current band has been with me for a
>long time, the newest members probably 2/3 years, some as long
>as 7/8 years now. I was looking for a similar natural
>chemistry with new musicians that I’d had with the Fugees
>and Miseducation bands. I’d literally grown up with some of
>those musicians. That isn’t easy to find.


Ok.


>-In 2008, I had only a young man helping me and my Mother,
>after disbanding my former support staff. No idea why any
>musician would have had knowledge of what I was being paid,
>not sure what he’s saying is accurate. Don’t have the
>details or recollection of cutting the band’s pay in half.
>If fees had been negotiated and confirmed without my
>knowledge, I may have asked for them to be adjusted. But I
>would never just cut a musician’s pay arbitrarily unless I
>had a legitimate reason. There are artists who do cut pay
>though, James Brown was notorious for docking musicians if
>they did something he didn’t like, I’m sure there are
>others.


You aren't James Brown, and from what i recall, didn't cut pay due to band members showing up late or playing bad.



>-It was necessary for me to reestablish trust and cultivate a
>new environment. I was looking to challenge myself
>artistically. I was also openly challenging music industry
>norms. I’d left ‘the machine’. With ‘it’ went some
>polish, but the cause we were fighting for, creative
>integrity, was worth far more than a little polish to me.


Ok.



>-When you’re a popular artist or public figure, people can
>sometimes forget that you’re hiring them to perform a
>service, and that you’re not the one there to entertain
>THEM. I didn’t scream or yell. Maybe I didn’t provide the
>experience that a musician may have wanted or expected during
>that time, but I was straight-forward, direct, and about the
>business at hand.


Ok.



>-Making my art is a labor of Love, but it’s still labor, and
>can be labor-intensive at that. If a musician was looking for
>a cushy job filled with the same trappings I was purposely
>weaning myself from, we wouldn’t have been on the same page
>anyway. Make no mistake, addiction is a common snare laid to
>dismantle the integrity of artists. My environment, at that
>time, operated more like a rehabilitation clinic than an
>after-party.


This is just non sensical rambling.


>-I don’t think most people, perhaps not even some celebrated
>artists, are aware of the battle it takes to be an artist and
>remain true to what you really think. I don’t even
>‘practice’ small talk, so I’m never confused with
>someone who can be seduced. There are traps all around, what
>could look like a successful career in entertainment today,
>could be an addictive lifestyle of convenience attempting to
>control you tomorrow. I set the tone with every band that
>working for fame and accolades is a different walk than
>fighting for personal integrity and making art that doesn’t
>compromise itself for money.


Ok.



>-I’m confused as to why such a principled musician, who
>thought I ‘stole’ from his friends, would show up to work
>for me anyway. 🤔 If that was hypocrisy or opportunism
>instead of genuine interest, it would further explain why an
>artist would feel the need to put his or her guard up


You lost a lawsuit because you didn't give credit.



>-No matter how incredible the musicians who play with me are,
>MY name is on the marquee. The expectation to make it all come
>together is on me. The risk and the financial losses are on
>me. Hence, MY VIBE, though not the only consideration, is the
>priority. Few people actually know what this road is like, but
>many want to judge and comment, having never done it. Try
>doing what I’ve done yourself. If nothing else, you will
>gain some insight into and respect for my process.


Very true, but consistently showing up late or not showing up at all completely moots this point.



>-During the time in question, I also believe I was playing a
>lot of new music with controversial content. FOR ME, rehearsal
>was about readying myself for the battle I knew I was entering
>into for simply not allowing a system to pimp me. If I was on
>edge, I had good reason to be.


Am i missing something? None of her music has controversial content.



>-Perhaps my seriousness and militancy in the face of
>tremendous resistance was misinterpreted as meanness, or that
>I was unloving or uncaring, when my true intent was to
>protect. I wouldn’t be the first Black person accused of
>this. I don’t think of Harriet Tubman’s skills as those of
>a hostess, but rather her relentless dedication to helping
>people who wanted out of an oppressive paradigm. #IGETOUT



Harriet Tubman? WTF


>-People also unwilling to ‘play the game’ might have found
>that environment refreshing. Straight talk isn’t devoid of
>Love, it’s just devoid of bullsh#t.
>
>-And just to clear up an old urban legend that somehow people
>still believe, I do not hate white people. I do, however,
>despise a system of entitlement and oppression set up to
>exploit people who are different. I do loathe the promotion
>and preservation of said system at the expense of other
>people, and the racist and entitled attitudes it gives rise
>to. The lengthy history of unfairness and brutality towards
>people of color, especially Black people, has not been fully
>acknowledged or corrected. The expectation is for us to live
>with abuse, distortion, and deliberate policies, meant to
>outright control and contain us — like we’re not aware
>of our basic right to freedom. I resist and reject THESE ideas
>completely. Like many Black people, I work to reconcile my own
>generational PTSD. I do my best to Love, pursue freedom in
>body, Spirit and mind… and to confront. To repress
>everything in the name of ‘getting along’ is to deny our
>right to healing. It’s an ugly, distorting and complicated
>history at best. We’ve been shaped by it for better or
>worse. I just choose not to pretend that it’s not there in
>order to maintain public approval and gain economic advantage.
>My true white friends and colleagues and I discuss these
>schemes and machinations, and the distrust that people of
>color would naturally have toward such a system and towards
>those who agree with it. We don’t run from those
>conversations, we run into them, which is why I can call them
>friends and colleagues. Within these relationships I can be my
>complete self, and not a splintered individual/soul repressing
>the truth about generations and generations of abuse.



This might be the best paragraph, and totally on point.



>-There were lots of issues both personal and in the world of
>entertainment during that period that needed resolve. I was
>definitely going through a significant transition. I no longer
>felt safe.


Ok, understandable.



>-There’s an entire album about that, it’s documented and
>called Lauryn Hill MTV Unplugged. For some, the Unplugged
>album provided useful insight during dark times, gave
>important context on some real but hidden issues, and helped
>people going through personal struggles, because I’d exposed
>myself in such a raw and vulnerable state.
>
>-Who are you to say I didn’t do enough? Most people are
>probably just hearing your name for the first time because you
>dropped MINE in an interview, controversially. Taking nothing
>away from your talent, but this is a fact.


Who cares when they first heard his name. He's a far far more accomplished musician. It's a fact that didn't need to be typed, nor should it have been.


>-The Miseducation was my only solo studio album, but it
>certainly wasn’t the only good thing I did.



Very true.


>-I was also a member of the Fugees, another groundbreaking,
>multi-platinum selling group, who bridged social and cultural
>gaps, and were ambassadors of hip-hop all around this planet.
>We laid important groundwork upon which an entire generation
>of artists and musicians still stand. We broke through
>conventions and challenged limited world views every time we
>played.
>
>-The song To Zion gave encouragement to women during
>challenging pregnancies. There are children who were given a
>chance at life because their Mothers experienced moral and
>emotional support through this song.



What kind of bullshit is this? It is a great song, but miss me with all this arrogance.


>-What about the image of Black women in hip hop? When exposure
>and sexualization of the Black female body was the standard,
>SOMEONE stood up and represented a different image entirely,
>giving a generation of young women options and alternatives of
>self-representation. #AMNESIA


Yes, MC Lyte, Queen Latifah, Yo-Yo, and Bahamadia all did this too. Lauryn was not the first nor the only one.



>-And let’s not forget that I am a mother of 6…


Rambling.



>-Not only have I been instrumental in pushing forward the
>culture of live music in hip-hop for decades now, but I’ve
>been traveling with and employing a large band for many years,
>despite the economic challenges in doing so. Others have
>followed in my footsteps, seeing the value of live music.



This is extreme exaggeration. You are legendary for not showing up on time. That is only pulling the culture of live music backwards.



>-Show me an artist working now who hasn’t been directly
>influenced by the work I put in, and I’ll show you an artist
>who’s been influenced by an artist who was directly
>influenced by the work that I put in. I was and continue to be
>a door opener, even if the blind don’t see it, and the
>prideful are too proud to admit it. I lived this, you watched
>this and heard about it.



More "i'm so great" arrogance.



>-97.9 The Box, feel free to not play my music if you agree
>that ‘I haven’t done enough.’
>
>-I never told anyone not to look me in the eye, that may have
>been something someone said assuming what I wanted. However, I
>would understand why an artist would say that. It’s about
>reaching a level of vulnerability while making or playing your
>art, and not wanting to worry about being examined while
>you’re in that process.
>
>-There are plenty of people, I’m sure, who THINK they know
>me. This can happen when you do anything that people Love or
>feel they can relate to. Their perception of me, however,
>doesn’t make it my reality. Sister Act II is a movie. Rita
>Watson is a character I played…in a movie, for those
>confusing that with real life.



Who the hell is talking about Sister Act? Jesus, stop rambling.



>-And yes, Ms. Hill was absolutely a requirement. I was young,
>Black and female. Not everyone can work for and give the
>appropriate respect to a person in that package and in charge.
>It was important, especially then, for that to be revealed
>early.


Depending on how it's brought up, i have no qualms with this



>-I adore Stevie, and honor Herbie and Quincy, who are our
>forebears, but they’re not women. Men often can say ‘I
>want it done like this’ and not be challenged. The same
>rules don’t always apply for women who may be met with
>resistance. When this happens you replace that player with
>someone who respects you and the office you hold.


Very true here.


>-My approach to making music is non-traditional, possibly
>non-linear, and more a product of my heart, soul, and
>experience gained through doing, than something I was taught
>in a formal school setting. Not much different than the genre
>of hip-hop itself.



But you barely even make music anymore.



>-I never held myself out as some accomplished guitar player, I
>play to articulate better to seasoned players what I want.
>It’s an instrument I learned without any real lessons or
>instruction. I play in an unorthodox manner and use it as a
>writing tool. Couldn’t or didn’t tune my own guitar? That
>sounds like an assumption.



Well, did you? Because if you didn't, it's more fact than assumption.



>-I take rehearsal seriously, I take performance seriously, I
>take my art seriously. My particular preparation process suits
>me. To each his or her own. My goal is to feel confident and
>free on stage.


No, you do not. You consistently show up late and disappoint your fans. Miss me with this bullshit.


>-I don’t think my process is for everyone, which is why band
>selection is so important. It’s not just about how well
>someone plays, but also their attitude. I’m not offended
>when people say it’s not for them, no more than they should
>be offended when I say this doesn’t work for me.
>
>-Auditioning, btw, may have nothing to do with how good a
>musician is. If a musician isn’t accomplished, he or she
>wouldn’t have been called. An audition or meeting could be
>about whether we vibe well, whether they understood my
>particular musical vernacular or direction at the time. I
>could have a jazz beast on keys, who couldn’t necessarily
>play reggae or some other musical style I also incorporated
>into my performances.
>
>-My sound is eclectic, I’ve been influenced by a wide
>variety of music. Like language, music isn’t always easily
>translatable. Someone could be a great player, but lack the
>ability to capture the feel or groove of a particular style.
>
>-I’m attracted to musicians that are open and excited to try
>new things. When people think they already know what needs to
>be known, and aren’t interested in exploring what I’m
>into, that’s fine, but it doesn’t work for my band.
>
>-A fair weather band is a complete impracticality, a liability
>even. I’m expected, through my art, to pour out the depths
>of my soul. Some days that’s easier than others. If the crew
>of people supporting me aren’t built for that walk, they
>shouldn’t be there. #Realtalk. Some people vibe well
>together, some don’t. It’s ok. Ignorant patriarchy is a
>b#tch though,
>
>I could speak volumes…
>
>-My standards are too high, and my process too idiosyncratic,
>not to work with people who really want to be there. When I
>don’t have that, I keep searching until I find them.
>
>-I remix my songs live because I haven’t released an album
>in several years. There’s a ton of backstory as to why, but
>there’s no way I could continue to play the same songs over
>and over as long as I’ve been performing them without some
>variation and exploration. I’m not a robot. If I’d had
>additional music out, perhaps I would have kept them as they
>were. I didn’t, so I revise and rearrange them according to
>what I’m feeling in that moment. This way, my performances
>are heartfelt and authentic, not me just going through the
>motions. I can’t imagine why that would be a foreign concept
>to anyone who appreciates jazz.
>
>-And the myth that I’m not allowed to play the original
>versions of my songs is…a myth (anyone who’s seen my
>current show knows this).
>
>-There can also be an energetic or emotional transference when
>I perform, and it can be heavy/weighty at times. As an artist,
>I’m tasked with bringing a different vibration into the
>space that transcends this. Not an easy gig but an important
>one. I can imagine there are people who value this process and
>don’t mind waiting a little if it means experiencing
>something inspired.
>
>-Me being late to shows isn’t because I don’t respect my
>fans or their time, but the contrary, It can be argued that I
>care too much, and insist on things being right. I like to
>switch my show up regularly, change arrangements, add new
>songs, etc. This often leads to long sound checks, which leads
>to doors opening late, which leads to the show getting a late
>start. This element of perfectionism is about wanting the
>audience to experience the very best and most authentic
>musical experience they can from what I do.



No, it's because you don't appreciate and respect your fans. Stop calling it something it's not. An audience can't experience the very best if you don't show up and fucking play.


>-I reject being pigeonholed or pinned down by someone else’s
>uninformed concept of me. I’m my own person, free to explore
>my potential like everyone else.
>
>- Where I am in one chapter of my life isn’t necessarily
>where I’ll be in the next chapter. I reserve the right to be
>an honest artist in those moments and not a fabrication, fake
>or phony version of myself, because that’s what someone else
>likes.
>
>-I don’t owe anyone self-repression. Some fans will grow
>with me, some won’t and that’s ok.
>
>-Life is to be lived, it’s not a full-time performance you
>put on for others, so people won’t have bad things to say
>about you in interviews.
>
>-Hip-hop was born through people who didn’t necessarily have
>traditional musical training, the best tools, and in some
>cases even instruments, but found a way to express themselves
>despite that. My art exists because it has a will to exist,
>like hip hop.
>
>-The album inspired many people, from all walks of life,
>because of its radical(intense) will to live and to express
>Love. I appreciate everyone who was a part of it, in any and
>every capacity. It wouldn’t have existed the way that it did
>without the involvement, skill, hard work, and talents of the
>artists/musicians and technicians who were a part of it, but
>it still required my vision, my passion, my faith, my will, my
>soul, my heart, and my story.



A lot of this is rambling and just self deflection.

************************************************************

  

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c71
Member since Jan 15th 2008
13962 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 06:04 PM

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107. "James Brown was very well known for fines - most band leaders of that "
In response to Reply # 106


  

          

era as well - tyrannical


And yes, James fines usually centered around musical mistakes



>You aren't James Brown, and from what i recall, didn't cut pay
>due to band members showing up late or playing bad.
>
>

  

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Lurkmode
Member since May 07th 2011
5187 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 09:00 PM

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110. "Sounds like your mind was made up before you read her response"
In response to Reply # 106


  

          


>>
>>-There are plenty of people, I’m sure, who THINK they know
>>me. This can happen when you do anything that people Love or
>>feel they can relate to. Their perception of me, however,
>>doesn’t make it my reality. Sister Act II is a movie. Rita
>>Watson is a character I played…in a movie, for those
>>confusing that with real life.
>
>
>
>Who the hell is talking about Sister Act? Jesus, stop
>rambling.
>

https://youtu.be/54WECf1ioeY?t=35m24s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OaEH1e_DLm0


Based on this correction and the one by c71 about James Brown plus some of the other comments you made, nothing she said would be enough.

---------------------------
Signature

  

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justin_scott
Charter member
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Tue Aug-28-18 11:36 PM

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113. "not at all"
In response to Reply # 110


          

when she's on point, she's on point. when she's wrong, i will speak on that. simple as that. Lauryn isn't completely wrong here, and some of what she says i completely agree with, but what i don't i will not just be quiet about.

************************************************************

  

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soulpsychodelicyde
Member since Nov 18th 2003
12151 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 08:20 PM

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108. "So NOBODY gon' say nothing about this?"
In response to Reply # 50


          

"The Miseducation was the first time I worked with musicians outside of the Fugees who’s report and working relationship was clear..."

  

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dgonsh
Member since Aug 14th 2002
10693 posts
Wed Aug-29-18 11:38 PM

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170. "This reads like "I hit you *because* I love you""
In response to Reply # 50


  

          

FOH, Boogie

This was some seriously eye-rolling reading.

I accept that she's a monster, one that created or co-created some of the best music of the last 3 decades (all within one), but that whole "rebuttal" is some bullshit. "I NEVER DID ____....But if I did it's cause other artists have to, and im a perfectionist"

Oy, what a mess this rebuttal was.

********************************************************************




"I *always* quote myself. I'm the only reliable source on *most* subjects" - OKP's First Lady of Knowledge, Janey

  

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Stadiq
Member since Dec 21st 2005
4876 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 09:59 AM

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72. "Umm...why is OKP more upset about her than Ye?"
In response to Reply # 0
Tue Aug-28-18 10:00 AM by Stadiq

          

Y’all will go IN on L , but Kanye wearing
MAGA hats and repeating white supremecist
bullshit gets looked past real quick.

Dudes in here counting her words and shit. ?

Direct that energy elsewhere.

  

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Airbreed
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Tue Aug-28-18 10:03 AM

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73. "Most folks here don't give Kanye a pass, at all."
In response to Reply # 72
Tue Aug-28-18 10:05 AM by Airbreed

  

          

It seems pretty universal that folks can't stand the dude. I've seen very few folks in his corner on OKP.

  

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flipnile
Member since Nov 05th 2003
13573 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 10:08 AM

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76. "Kanye's Harold, bruh... homey's dead. We're leaving him."
In response to Reply # 72


          

L-Boogie's breathing tho. Still time to get her patched-up.

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
24419 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 10:27 AM

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78. "Literally not true."
In response to Reply # 72


          

Kanye was eviscerated on here. Only supporter of Kanye or Lauryn was Trin. Haha.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
16347 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 01:09 PM

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96. "lol"
In response to Reply # 78


          

  

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tariqhu
Charter member
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Tue Aug-28-18 10:29 AM

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79. "Ye wasn't let off the hook."
In response to Reply # 72


          

he's lost fans over his dumb statements.

Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

  

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Hitokiri
Charter member
22106 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 10:39 AM

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82. "Man shut up"
In response to Reply # 72


  

          

http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=4&topic_id=13252273&mesg_id=13252273&listing_type=search

http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=4&topic_id=13253141&mesg_id=13253141&listing_type=search

http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=4&topic_id=13254846&mesg_id=13254846&listing_type=search

--

"You can't beat white people. You can only knock them out."

  

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B9
Charter member
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Tue Aug-28-18 11:10 AM

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85. "He's not off the hook, but he admits he's crazy. And he makes albums. "
In response to Reply # 72


          

Hate him or really hate him, Kanye isn't out there milking the teat of a single album made two decades ago.

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
24419 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 11:15 AM

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86. "And he shows up on time and, at least used to, put(s) on good shows."
In response to Reply # 85


          

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79594 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 11:29 AM

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88. "You made all that up bro "
In response to Reply # 72


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Marauder21
Charter member
49516 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 12:25 PM

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92. "There are like 2 actual fans of current MAGA Kanye on here"
In response to Reply # 72


  

          

------

12 play and 12 planets are enlighten for all the Aliens to Party and free those on the Sex Planet-maxxx

XBL: trkc21
Twitter: @tyrcasey

  

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Lurkmode
Member since May 07th 2011
5187 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 12:58 PM

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93. "Because the board is full of Uncle Ruckus"
In response to Reply # 72


  

          

and the usual suspects.

Go in on Monique

Defend Kylie Jenner

Defend Bill Maher

Defend Louie CK

---------------------------
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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79594 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 01:53 PM

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102. "While I agree this place capes for white folks"
In response to Reply # 93


          

Most of the L Boogie hate is from people who were burned by her at one of her shows where she cared too much to start on time or show up at all.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Lurkmode
Member since May 07th 2011
5187 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 09:06 PM

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111. "Fair enough I can understand why people would be upset"
In response to Reply # 102


  

          

if they paid for a show and it didn't start on time, but some of these other comments like "mental issues" and "we are suckers for paying attention"

---------------------------
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BrooklynWHAT
Member since Jun 15th 2007
85073 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 03:54 PM

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105. "redirection FAIL"
In response to Reply # 72


  

          

<--- Big Baller World Order

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
24419 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 09:00 PM

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109. "Stadiq Huckabee Sanders over here."
In response to Reply # 105


          

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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cbk
Charter member
4535 posts
Thu Aug-30-18 10:34 AM

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205. "Kanye got the credits thing right"
In response to Reply # 72


          

Respect to him for being inclusive on who gets writing and production credits.

It definitely reflects the collaborative process of his works.

All that MAGA shit tho 😾


Happy 50th D’Angelo: https://chrisp.bandcamp.com/track/d-50

  

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Teknontheou
Charter member
32709 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 10:38 AM

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81. "Figures that it took a respected industry insider like Glasper "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

to instigate a real response from her.

  

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lightworks
Member since Feb 17th 2006
5818 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 01:26 PM

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98. "Some good points mixed with some bullshit (re her Medium piece)"
In response to Reply # 0


          

A) Oh Lauryn. That's fine you aren't a robot & didn't wanna play the orig versions of your Miseducation songs but clearly your fans wanted you to, & you shoulda adjusted, esp since you weren't legally barred from playing the orig version.

B) Also I don't buy your excuse that you're late because you care too much (you said you rehearse more so doors open late hence late start). But so then start your soundchecks much much earlier; don't embrace making your fans wait multiple hours.

C) I don't know yet how I feel about the audition clapback.

On the one hand she is right it isn't just about seeing if you can play it's about seeing if you can play what she needs and wants and can be versatile--and if you can get along together.

But also I could see how a person of Robert's stature could be offended by the term. Maybe she should have calling it a "meeting" and not audition.

  

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fontgangsta
Member since Sep 04th 2005
5467 posts
Tue Aug-28-18 03:36 PM

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104. "that soundcheck stuff SMH"
In response to Reply # 98


  

          

>B) Also I don't buy your excuse that you're late because you
>care too much (you said you rehearse more so doors open late
>hence late start). But so then start your soundchecks much
>much earlier; don't embrace making your fans wait multiple

She literally has no idea what she's doing up there. At Afropunk she's shouting at the soundman, mid-song, to "turn up the hi-hat"
that's not a joke.
the hi-hat wasn't loud enough in her monitor.
...the hi-hat.
FOH

  

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howardlloyd
Member since Jan 18th 2007
2729 posts
Wed Aug-29-18 04:54 AM

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114. "alot of y'all sound dumb as hell"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

i love glasper

yeah he can play piano

but lauryn can fucking sing. singers are musicians.

so fuck outta here talking bout she's not a musician

robert glasper probably cant hit a note an octave or two up out his range. anyone gonna shit on him for not doing it??

so no glasper aint a more accomplished musician

lauryn is FEATURED on, wrote on, sung on etc TWO OF THE LARGEST SELLING ALBUMS IN HIP HOPS HISTORY (but she didnt do enough...smfh)

NEITHER ONE OF THE ALBUMS ARE CONSIDERED POP BS

its only like a handful of other people who can say such a thing

did mike jax play (really play) an instrument?? is he a musician?

down low brainwashed white supremacists

and as far as controversial music... yeah the last couple of songs she was saying a whole bunch of shit. it wasnt MY tastes...but she damn sure was putting it down message wise

http://howardlloyd.bandcamp.com

  

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TR808
Member since Oct 24th 2012
2012 posts
Wed Aug-29-18 08:25 AM

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115. "Miseducation is an overrated album...."
In response to Reply # 114


  

          

Couple decent songs... she was part of a great GROUP... her solo career has only been this one album..

why is there no more music from her? The whole lawsuit they had on her was that she did not write on TMOLH.

Yeah I think Robert was hurt but I don't think what he was saying was wrong.

She contradicted herself she says "I never took money from a band member" but then goes on to say "James Brown did it so why cant i do it?"

You not james brown.

You take the blue pill, the story ends. You wake up in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe. You take the red pill, you stay in Wonderland, and I show you how deep the rabbit hole goes.

  

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howardlloyd
Member since Jan 18th 2007
2729 posts
Wed Aug-29-18 10:12 AM

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117. "use your same logic in her defense"
In response to Reply # 115
Wed Aug-29-18 10:24 AM by howardlloyd

  

          

the score sold over 22 million albums
miseducation sold over 19 million albums

neither of these were DOUBLE albums that count as two (like speakerboxx/love below and life after death)

i.e. she actually sold over 40 million copies

who is the common denominator?

wyclef never sold 20 million without her. be she did without him

and while nobles, new ark and che pope have been extremely successful

they aint been 20 million successful. and lest we forget she was ALREADY part of a 20+mil selling album that NONE OF THEM (miseducation folks) had to do with

so...

lets see the mental gymnastics performed to sidestep your own logic

and she never said james brown did it why cant I. she pointed out that men get away with what she has been accused of for decades. which was a part of her larger argument about patriarchy and safety.

http://howardlloyd.bandcamp.com

  

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tariqhu
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17890 posts
Wed Aug-29-18 10:01 AM

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116. "sure a singer's voice"
In response to Reply # 114


          

is an instrument. you prolly won't get any disagreement on that. although, I don't find her to be that good at singing. she aight.

the accomplishments from those 2 albums can't be argued either. good for her.

NONE of that matters as long as she continues to blatantly disrespect the fans. most folks couldn't care less about the behind the scenes crap IF she put oh a helluva show and didn't waste their time/money.

Glasper basically confirmed that she's not only unprofessional/disrespectful to us, but also to others in the industry.

for those asking why he'd join the band...sometimes you hear stuff and don't want to believe what others have said. I bet he went in hoping that stuff was just rumor. but he was able to see for himself and not have to speculate.

I don't think folks are rooting against Ms. Hill. but folks are tired of dealing with her antics.



Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

  

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howardlloyd
Member since Jan 18th 2007
2729 posts
Wed Aug-29-18 10:16 AM

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118. "RE: sure a singer's voice"
In response to Reply # 116


  

          

i see cats jumping through a whole lot of hoops

smh

first she aint a musician who cant tune a guitar

now she aint that good of a singer

how many people have sampled her work?

how many have made hits off her unplugged??

kanye sampled her and made a song bigger than anything glasper has ever done lol

yall all sound like sour grapes

http://howardlloyd.bandcamp.com

  

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tariqhu
Charter member
17890 posts
Wed Aug-29-18 10:31 AM

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120. "you don't have to be a great singer"
In response to Reply # 118


          

to make music that folks like. there's a lot of popular music from artists that are average or worse singers.

Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

  

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howardlloyd
Member since Jan 18th 2007
2729 posts
Wed Aug-29-18 01:15 PM

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140. "RE: you don't have to be a great singer"
In response to Reply # 120


  

          

smfh

was she a part of two albums that sold 20+ mil

who was the ONLY person to work on BOTH of those albums?

who else can say that??

is she a musician or not?

has she accomplished more that 99% of musicians? lol

ducking and diving ass mofos

http://howardlloyd.bandcamp.com

  

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tariqhu
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Wed Aug-29-18 08:03 PM

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168. "where did I deny any of this?"
In response to Reply # 140


          

>smfh
>
>was she a part of two albums that sold 20+ mil
>
>who was the ONLY person to work on BOTH of those albums?
>
>who else can say that??
>
>is she a musician or not?
>
>has she accomplished more that 99% of musicians? lol
>
>ducking and diving ass mofos

I never said she was trash. she's an ok singer voice wise. she emotes well. she's a better rapper than singer.

her legacy now is 2 huge albums and late for everything else. lol

I want her to have more success, but I also want her to do better with her fans. there's a correlation between how well her shows go and how people perceive her.

Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

  

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Marbles
Member since Oct 19th 2004
22290 posts
Wed Aug-29-18 10:31 AM

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121. "This boils it down right here..."
In response to Reply # 116


  

          


>NONE of that matters as long as she continues to blatantly
>disrespect the fans. most folks couldn't care less about the
>behind the scenes crap IF she put oh a helluva show and didn't
>waste their time/money.

>I don't think folks are rooting against Ms. Hill. but folks
>are tired of dealing with her antics.

^^^ That's what it comes down to. "The Score" & "TMOLH" are undeniable heavyweights. I can't take anything away from her for those 2 classics.

But all of the stuff she's put fans thru since then just shows a complete disregard for their time, money & support.

  

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lightworks
Member since Feb 17th 2006
5818 posts
Wed Aug-29-18 10:26 AM

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119. "I'm bothered now by Robert's quip he called her Lauryn"
In response to Reply # 0


          

Because she addressed him as Robert.

My issue was that is he was annoyed because if she's gonna call him Robert he shouldn't be required to call her Ms Hill but I know for a fact a Quincy was calling him Robert he wouldn't be that cavalier.

And he's doing it because he didn't respect her at that point, but if you don't respect her then leave the band don't not call her her preferred name.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79594 posts
Wed Aug-29-18 11:37 AM

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128. "That’s dumb. "
In response to Reply # 119


          

When folks are all “address me as” it’s bullshit.

Those folks usually give no fucks how they address other people too.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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mind_grapes
Member since Nov 13th 2007
957 posts
Wed Aug-29-18 10:51 AM

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122. "Reposting an earlier comment: Glasper isn't half the artist of Ms. Hill"
In response to Reply # 0


          

I don't care how well he can play Maiden Voyage. His whole aesthetic is pretty limited and rehashes neo-soul cliches. Him and Common deserve each other. When I see him do some interesting stuff, like in his Smells like Teen Spirit cover, I will see him rehash it somewhere else. His contributions to R + R = Now are immediately recognizable in a bad way, especially when next to Christian Scott (who is way more of a genius than Glasper).

In the Nina Revisted album, he produced half and Lauryn produced the other half. They both had a month or two to work on it and everything she produced is far superior, aside from his work on Alice Smith's "I Put A Spell On You," which sounds more like it was produced by Explosions In The Sky than Glasper.

Does this take away from what he has to say about her treating her musicians like shit...not at all. But that doesn't make it okay for you to shit on the legacy of another artist and insinuate that she doesn't write her own work.

  

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howardlloyd
Member since Jan 18th 2007
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125. "!"
In response to Reply # 122


  

          


>Does this take away from what he has to say about her treating
>her musicians like shit...not at all. But that doesn't make it
>okay for you to shit on the legacy of another artist and
>insinuate that she doesn't write her own work.

http://howardlloyd.bandcamp.com

  

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Lurkmode
Member since May 07th 2011
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Wed Aug-29-18 11:25 AM

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126. "Damn"
In response to Reply # 122


  

          

>I don't care how well he can play Maiden Voyage. His whole
>aesthetic is pretty limited and rehashes neo-soul cliches. Him
>and Common deserve each other.

You just shitted on Common.

---------------------------
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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Wed Aug-29-18 11:39 AM

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129. "Right? Just disrespectful "
In response to Reply # 126


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Hitokiri
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131. "You know that she had to settle a lawsuit back in 01, right?"
In response to Reply # 122


  

          

For not crediting people who wrote on Miseducation

--

"You can't beat white people. You can only knock them out."

  

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howardlloyd
Member since Jan 18th 2007
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Wed Aug-29-18 12:30 PM

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132. "she aint credit DJ premier "
In response to Reply # 131


  

          

either

it was all part of the marketing man

why preem aint bitching and complaining and why yall worried about business??

if cats had their paperwork in order.... or if she had her paperwork in order she wouldnt have had to pay the 5 mil

but thats between them. none of them ever sold 20 mil again ...right??

glasper out of line with "she aint done enough"

she did way more than most...

http://howardlloyd.bandcamp.com

  

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fontgangsta
Member since Sep 04th 2005
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Wed Aug-29-18 12:32 PM

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133. "NO ONE has done enough"
In response to Reply # 132


  

          

>glasper out of line with "she aint done enough"

to treat fans and colleagues the way she does
its called respect

  

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howardlloyd
Member since Jan 18th 2007
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Wed Aug-29-18 01:13 PM

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139. "i havent mentioned the word fan"
In response to Reply # 133


  

          

in any response

i'm in here for the revisionist history trying to repaint lauryn as a one hit wonder or as not having accomplished more than 99.9% of artists

http://howardlloyd.bandcamp.com

  

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fontgangsta
Member since Sep 04th 2005
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Wed Aug-29-18 01:24 PM

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144. "you said"
In response to Reply # 139


  

          

glasper out of line with "she aint done enough"

hes saying she aint done enough to treat people the way she does
i agree, and im saying NO ONE has done enough to treat people the way she does (or is accused of)

>i'm in here for the revisionist history trying to repaint
>lauryn as a one hit wonder or as not having accomplished more
>than 99.9% of artists

im not gonna call her a one-hit wonder by any stretch, but im also not gonna overplay her hand. She made 1 great album and 1 live record for MTV. Nah, that doesn't put her ahead of 99.9% other artists.

  

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howardlloyd
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Wed Aug-29-18 01:50 PM

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148. "RE: you said"
In response to Reply # 144
Wed Aug-29-18 01:50 PM by howardlloyd

  

          

>im not gonna call her a one-hit wonder by any stretch, but im
>also not gonna overplay her hand. She made 1 great album and 1
>live record for MTV. Nah, that doesn't put her ahead of 99.9%
>other artists.

she dont get credit for the fugees? pras was the man? wyclef?

do you remember how large wyclef was with the carnival? remember he was like i'm the talent...blah blah...put her in the studio...she cant make nothing!

the carnival sold 5. lol and she comes out and sells 20 without him

FOH

again...check the list of folks who have sold 20+ twice

prince never even came close

http://howardlloyd.bandcamp.com

  

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fontgangsta
Member since Sep 04th 2005
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Wed Aug-29-18 01:58 PM

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152. "if you listen to the first post-fugees records"
In response to Reply # 148
Wed Aug-29-18 02:03 PM by fontgangsta

  

          

from all three of them, i think its pretty easy to conclude that the fugees was a real collabo effort. Im not saying she doesnt get credit for being part of the group, but she was part of the group.

>again...check the list of folks who have sold 20+ twice

awesome. she caught lightening in a bottle. thats amazing. it's a great record. that doesnt give her carte blanche to treat people like shit. Thats the point RG was making.
and despite how successful that record was - it was still ONE record....OK so, make another Hov.

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Wed Aug-29-18 02:08 PM

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158. "99.9% of all artist? You sound like a stan "
In response to Reply # 139


          

She dope at rhyming but c’mon bruh. She sold a ton of records. So has Kate Perry and Hah and Brittany.

Selling records ain’t the end all to being a great artist.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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howardlloyd
Member since Jan 18th 2007
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Mon Sep-03-18 05:25 AM

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238. "RE: 99.9% of all artist? You sound like a stan "
In response to Reply # 158
Mon Sep-03-18 05:40 AM by howardlloyd

  

          

>She dope at rhyming but c’mon bruh. She sold a ton of
>records. So has Kate Perry and Hah and Brittany.
>
>Selling records ain’t the end all to being a great artist.
>
>

so katy and brittney write?? like did lauryn write her raps, did she write her songs?? i dont know who "Hah" is

katy and brittney both satisfy america's Ephebophilia. whole nother can of worms. plus katy never did what lauryn did. brittney did but to compare her to lauryn is either lazy or a reflection of a lack of understanding american culture

how many black women have sold 20 mil? saying what she saying? presenting herself in that fashion? even these last two points are insignificant. because whitney is the only other black woman to do it!

you call me a stan... i think you dont fully appreciate what Lauryn accomplished. did you see the list of people who have sold 20 million twice??? its a fact she did something over 99% never accomplished

http://howardlloyd.bandcamp.com

  

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Hitokiri
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Wed Aug-29-18 12:52 PM

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134. "# 1, i reponded to "insinuate that she doesn't write her own work.""
In response to Reply # 132


  

          

2. Che Pope has certainly sold more than 20 mil since the miseducation came out.

--

"You can't beat white people. You can only knock them out."

  

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howardlloyd
Member since Jan 18th 2007
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Wed Aug-29-18 01:16 PM

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141. "RE: # 1, i reponded to "insinuate that she doesn't write her own work.""
In response to Reply # 134


  

          

in one shot??

dont think so brother

i'm the 1 that brought his name into the post

i know very well how successful he is

he never sold 20 mil on any 1 album again

http://howardlloyd.bandcamp.com

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Wed Aug-29-18 01:21 PM

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142. "Ehhh. What has Lauryn done since Miseducation? "
In response to Reply # 132


          

There is no denying she was a superstar who sold a shit ton of albums with Miseducation.

But this ain’t about that. It’s about her actions AFTER selling these records.

and who cares if Premo didn’t air their dirty laundry. If he did, would he be wrong?

You are basically saying that since she sold a ton with her solo project she gets to be shitty for the rest of her life and folks just have to eat shit because she is awesome?


FOH. You really pointed out how she didn’t do right by Premo and tried to flip it like he is a man for not speaking on it publicly. She still did him wrong and that’s the whole reason for this interview. She has a history of doing people dirty and playing the victim.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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howardlloyd
Member since Jan 18th 2007
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Wed Aug-29-18 01:47 PM

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145. "smh"
In response to Reply # 142


  

          

do y'all know how the industry works? didnt yall watch the new edition story?

shit is ghost produced and ghost written ALL the DAMN time.

i'm saying preemo got his check and he knew what it was

i havent said anything about her treatment of fans...cant condone not showing up. i will say though, like doom if you get got you can only blame yourself

what has me in this convo is the fact that she aint done enough? the revisionist history

here's the list of artist to sell more than 20 mil copies twice
the beatles, pink floyd, micahel jackson, madonna, the backstreet boys, led zeppelin, eminem, brittney spears and whitney houston

http://howardlloyd.bandcamp.com

  

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Hitokiri
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153. "No one agreed to being a ghost writer. That's why there was a lawsuit"
In response to Reply # 145


  

          

Which she settled.
She was unwilling to fight the fact that these people did not write these songs.

--

"You can't beat white people. You can only knock them out."

  

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howardlloyd
Member since Jan 18th 2007
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Wed Aug-29-18 03:26 PM

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164. "nah brother..."
In response to Reply # 153
Wed Aug-29-18 03:27 PM by howardlloyd

  

          

the 5 mil was prolly cheaper than the lawyer costs/court fees

and i bet sony footed the bill

did lauryn have a MAJOR (she was everybody favorite fugee and by and far the best rapper and singer in the group) role in selling those 20 mil fugees albums. the biggest song didnt even feature pras and wyclef (unless u counting "1 time")??

were new ark and che pope there for that? no

so then she goes and does it again... and to hear che tell it. he re-did most of new ark's stuff. so who we believing here

but everybody is evading the major question

20 mil with fugees, 20mil w/ che pope and new ark

who is the common denominator? she can say she did it without clef. he cant say the same! she can say she did it without che... he cant say the same EITHER!

stop frontin

who flakes on MJ and says it was Quincy or rod temperton?

who fronts on whitney and says it was michael narada??

shit is laughable

http://howardlloyd.bandcamp.com

  

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Hitokiri
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187. "that a lot of words to completely miss the point."
In response to Reply # 164


  

          

well done.

--

"You can't beat white people. You can only knock them out."

  

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howardlloyd
Member since Jan 18th 2007
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Mon Sep-03-18 05:20 AM

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237. "i didnt miss any point"
In response to Reply # 187


  

          

if you working in the business and you dont have your business/paperwork straight
you could easily end up a ghostwriter

the way they word the contracts is "we will attempt to give proper credit" ...but its nothing you can do if they dont

its all about leverage

http://howardlloyd.bandcamp.com

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Wed Aug-29-18 02:09 PM

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159. "Hold up. If you get got? "
In response to Reply # 145


          

Nah fam. Sit down.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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howardlloyd
Member since Jan 18th 2007
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Wed Aug-29-18 03:21 PM

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163. "if u bought tickets to a doom show"
In response to Reply # 159


  

          

and a light skinned cat had the mask on...

would it really be a surprise?

ijs

http://howardlloyd.bandcamp.com

  

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flipnile
Member since Nov 05th 2003
13573 posts
Wed Aug-29-18 11:13 AM

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123. "Glasper doesn't need Hill. This isn't a rap beef to get his name up..."
In response to Reply # 0


          

This seems like a dude with nothing to lose in this scenario (he has his own successful career not dependent on Lauryn Hill), so he decided to put an old job/boss on blast when asked about it.


Who doesn't dream about this?

Dude essentially made a glassdoor review for Lauryn's band.

  

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Lurkmode
Member since May 07th 2011
5187 posts
Wed Aug-29-18 11:24 AM

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124. "What ?"
In response to Reply # 123


  

          

>This seems like a dude with nothing to lose in this scenario
>(he has his own successful career not dependent on Lauryn
>Hill), so he decided to put an old job/boss on blast when
>asked about it.
>
>
>Who doesn't dream about this?


People who are not petty.

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flipnile
Member since Nov 05th 2003
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Wed Aug-29-18 11:29 AM

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127. "She tried to cheat him out of money (cutting his pay)"
In response to Reply # 124


          

Almost everything he said reads like a bad review of an employer. That's not petty. Petty would be calling her names, or laughing at her while she struggles, etc. Lauryn seems like she's good.

  

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Lurkmode
Member since May 07th 2011
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Wed Aug-29-18 12:55 PM

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135. "She explained that"
In response to Reply # 127


  

          

>Almost everything he said reads like a bad review of an
>employer. That's not petty. Petty would be calling her names,
>or laughing at her while she struggles, etc. Lauryn seems like
>she's good.


">In 2008, I had only a young man helping me and my Mother,
>after disbanding my former support staff. No idea why any
>musician would have had knowledge of what I was being paid,
>not sure what he’s saying is accurate. Don’t have the
>details or recollection of cutting the band’s pay in half.
>If fees had been negotiated and confirmed without my
>knowledge, I may have asked for them to be adjusted. But I
>would never just cut a musician’s pay arbitrarily unless I
>had a legitimate reason. There are artists who do cut pay
>though, James Brown was notorious for docking musicians if
>they did something he didn’t like, I’m sure there are
>others."

It's petty because he was hurt she asked him to audition. He didn't have to name call since he was airing her out and reinforcing the rumors.

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Hitokiri
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Wed Aug-29-18 01:04 PM

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136. "saying "I don't remember" is not explaining, bruh"
In response to Reply # 135
Wed Aug-29-18 01:06 PM by Hitokiri

  

          

She said "I don't remember cutting anyone's pay, but if I did, I certainly did it with good reason"

--

"You can't beat white people. You can only knock them out."

  

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Lurkmode
Member since May 07th 2011
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Wed Aug-29-18 01:11 PM

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138. "It explains that he could be wrong"
In response to Reply # 136


  

          

Given this

"-I’m confused as to why such a principled musician, who thought I ‘stole’ from his friends, would show up to work for me anyway. 🤔 If that was hypocrisy or opportunism instead of genuine interest, it would further explain why an artist would feel the need to put his or her guard up."

she gets the benefit of the doubt.

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79594 posts
Wed Aug-29-18 11:41 AM

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130. "Hold up. She slashed his pay and told him not to look her in the eye"
In response to Reply # 124


          

It’s like only Hill gets to be petty because she sold a ton of albums.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Lurkmode
Member since May 07th 2011
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Wed Aug-29-18 01:04 PM

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137. "Nah she had a different side of the pay story"
In response to Reply # 130


  

          


"I never told anyone not to look me in the eye, that may have
>been something someone said assuming what I wanted."

"In 2008, I had only a young man helping me and my Mother,
>after disbanding my former support staff. No idea why any
>musician would have had knowledge of what I was being paid,
>not sure what he’s saying is accurate. Don’t have the
>details or recollection of cutting the band’s pay in half.
>If fees had been negotiated and confirmed without my
>knowledge, I may have asked for them to be adjusted. But I
>would never just cut a musician’s pay arbitrarily unless I
>had a legitimate reason. There are artists who do cut pay
>though, James Brown was notorious for docking musicians if
>they did something he didn’t like, I’m sure there are
>others."

>It’s like only Hill gets to be petty because she sold a ton
>of albums.
>
>

Nah Glasper is getting a pass because nobody is checking his facts so he can say anything.

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Wed Aug-29-18 01:23 PM

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143. "He’s getting a pass because of her history. "
In response to Reply # 137


          

If she was on time, didn’t short fans no one would give him the time of day.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Lurkmode
Member since May 07th 2011
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Wed Aug-29-18 01:48 PM

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147. "Ehhh I don't know"
In response to Reply # 143


  

          

>If she was on time, didn’t short fans no one would give him
>the time of day.
>
>


The rumor about her hating white people came out without anything to support it, so people would give Glasper the time of day if he was saying she cut pay and didn't want you to look her in the eye, before she showed up late to shows.

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
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Wed Aug-29-18 02:12 PM

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160. "I mean"
In response to Reply # 147


          

Not to be that dude but the hating white people is kinda... whatever.

I’m Black tho

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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Wed Aug-29-18 01:47 PM

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146. ""I don't remember that" is "a different side of the story" ?"
In response to Reply # 137


          

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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howardlloyd
Member since Jan 18th 2007
2729 posts
Wed Aug-29-18 01:51 PM

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149. "RE: "I don't remember that" is "a different side of the story" ?"
In response to Reply # 146


  

          

she also directly contradicted that people were instructed to not make eye contact

http://howardlloyd.bandcamp.com

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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Wed Aug-29-18 01:54 PM

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151. "Lurk's comment was specifically about the "pay" part of the story."
In response to Reply # 149
Wed Aug-29-18 01:56 PM by Brew

          

So was my response.

But ...

"that may have
been something someone said assuming what I wanted."

... I wouldn't necessarily call that a "direct contradiction." Why would someone in her camp "assume" she didn't want people to look her in the eye, unless she had asked for that either then or another time ? That's a weird assumption for someone to have made out of nowhere. I don't go around telling people my boss doesn't want anyone looking him in the eye all willy nilly.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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howardlloyd
Member since Jan 18th 2007
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Wed Aug-29-18 02:01 PM

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155. "RE: Lurk's comment was specifically about the "pay" part of the story."
In response to Reply # 151


  

          

why did you edit the 1st part of her sentence though

cats up in here using fox news tactics

smfh

"I never asked...."

http://howardlloyd.bandcamp.com

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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Wed Aug-29-18 02:03 PM

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156. "Haha that part was self-evident but OK add that in."
In response to Reply # 155


          

She still left room for the possibility that someone in her camp asked the band not to look her in the eye. So how, again, is that a "direct contradiction" ?

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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howardlloyd
Member since Jan 18th 2007
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Wed Aug-29-18 03:19 PM

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162. "I never told anyone not to look me in the eye"
In response to Reply # 156


  

          

is a direct contradiction

http://howardlloyd.bandcamp.com

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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182. "He never said she did."
In response to Reply # 162


          

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Lurkmode
Member since May 07th 2011
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Thu Aug-30-18 12:11 PM

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229. "What ?"
In response to Reply # 182


  

          

If Glasper never said that, what did he mean when he said the rumor was true after 31:35

https://youtu.be/54WECf1ioeY?t=31m35s

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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235. "Exact quote "MY FRIEND was like 'first of all don't look her in the eye'..."
In response to Reply # 229


          

I repeat: he never said she did.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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howardlloyd
Member since Jan 18th 2007
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Mon Sep-03-18 06:25 AM

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239. "RE: Exact quote &quot;MY FRIEND was like 'first of all don't look her in..."
In response to Reply # 235
Mon Sep-03-18 06:26 AM by howardlloyd

  

          

so HIS FRIEND is the one who made the assumption

smfh

the mental hoop gymnastics you cats will jump through

http://howardlloyd.bandcamp.com

  

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Lurkmode
Member since May 07th 2011
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Wed Aug-29-18 01:54 PM

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150. "The paragraph in context is a different side of the story"
In response to Reply # 146


  

          


"In 2008, I had only a young man helping me and my Mother,
>after disbanding my former support staff. No idea why any
>musician would have had knowledge of what I was being paid,
>not sure what he’s saying is accurate. Don’t have the
>details or recollection of cutting the band’s pay in half.
>If fees had been negotiated and confirmed without my
>knowledge, I may have asked for them to be adjusted. But I
>would never just cut a musician’s pay arbitrarily unless I
>had a legitimate reason. There are artists who do cut pay
>though, James Brown was notorious for docking musicians if
>they did something he didn’t like, I’m sure there are
>others."

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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154. "Not really."
In response to Reply # 150
Wed Aug-29-18 02:01 PM by Brew

          

Other than "I have no recollection of that" it's "I would never do that" and other fluff. You can believe her if you want but that's hardly "another side of the pay story." That's a "I don't recall" defense on the witness stand. "Another side of the story" would be "what actually happened was _______"

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Lurkmode
Member since May 07th 2011
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Wed Aug-29-18 02:20 PM

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161. "Sure it is"
In response to Reply # 154


  

          

>Other than "I have no recollection of that" it's "I would
>never do that" and other fluff.

No it's more but you can't use "fluff" to avoid it.

You can believe her if you

I didn't need your permission to believe her.

>want but that's hardly "another side of the pay story." That's
>a "I don't recall" defense on the witness stand. "Another side
>of the story" would be "what actually happened was _______"

In your world maybe but when she says

""In 2008, I had only a young man helping me and my Mother,
>after disbanding my former support staff. No idea why any
>musician would have had knowledge of what I was being paid,
>not sure what he’s saying is accurate.

it explains what happen and why Glasper might be incorrect.

another side of the story.


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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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183. "That doesn't, at all, "explain what happened""
In response to Reply # 161


          

>""In 2008, I had only a young man helping me and my Mother,
>>after disbanding my former support staff. No idea why any
>>musician would have had knowledge of what I was being paid,
>>not sure what he’s saying is accurate.
>
>it explains what happen and why Glasper might be incorrect.
>
>another side of the story.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Lurkmode
Member since May 07th 2011
5187 posts
Thu Aug-30-18 12:01 PM

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226. "Yes it does but"
In response to Reply # 183


  

          

>>""In 2008, I had only a young man helping me and my Mother,
>>>after disbanding my former support staff. No idea why any
>>>musician would have had knowledge of what I was being paid,
>>>not sure what he’s saying is accurate.
>>
>>it explains what happen and why Glasper might be incorrect.
>>
>>another side of the story.


whatever she says it will not be enough. You believe she has mental issues or she's an asshole. You admitted you can't sympathize with her.

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Hitokiri
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157. "Has anyone else gone back and listened to Talib's Ms. Hill since this?"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Came out 10 years ago!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRiX-ghsZbc

--

"You can't beat white people. You can only knock them out."

  

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Tw3nty
Member since Jan 02nd 2007
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Wed Aug-29-18 03:53 PM

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165. "I don't get the team player vibe from LH's response"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

  

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c71
Member since Jan 15th 2008
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Wed Aug-29-18 04:08 PM

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167. "She's sort of saying she came up with the lyrics and I'm guessing"
In response to Reply # 165


  

          

some of the melodies and then the musicians created the instrumental backdrop for it according to her direction:

"who translate the language that I provide into beautifully realized music.

-These are my songs, .. I’m definitely looking for something specific in musicians,...., I may not have established the necessary boundaries and may have been more inviting than I should have been. In hindsight, I would have handled it differently for the removal of any confusion. And I have handled it differently since, I’m clear and I make clear before someone walks in the door what I am and am not looking for. I may have been inclusive, but these are my songs."



So....to me the only way for that "....inclusive, but these are my songs" to be accurate is for the musicians to not have worked on the lyrics and vocal melodies as well, because we know they definitely worked on the instrumental music.


Glasper, as a musician, obviously believes that if a musician had to "come up with" a musical section of a song, then that musician "wrote" a part of that song, which is probably why the settlement was reached - because that aspect was undeniable.


So, of course she's going to not be big on "team player" because that would take even "more" away from saying those are "my songs" - which she obviously wants to say.

  

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Trinity444
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179. "your replies don’t go unnoticed..."
In response to Reply # 167


  

          

this is why his words are harmless. Those that don’t know much about the entertainment industry will hear something like, “she didn’t write” and assume she didn’t.

  

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Trinity444
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206. "^ I meant harmful..."
In response to Reply # 179


  

          

  

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c71
Member since Jan 15th 2008
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Thu Aug-30-18 11:56 AM

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224. "glad you liked what I wrote"
In response to Reply # 206


  

          

yes

  

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kfine
Member since Jan 11th 2009
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Wed Aug-29-18 11:23 PM

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169. "Hm. I actually feel like I... understand her now?? lol"
In response to Reply # 0
Wed Aug-29-18 11:32 PM by kfine

          

It's like ohhh... she's literally just an anarchist. A little selfish sure, and was deeply - if not irrevocably - traumatized as a young woman in her personal and professional life.

But the root of all the confusion is she's a passionate creative who literally just said fuck it one day and went full anarchist; and I believe her anarchism, PTSD, and selfishness are frequently misinterpreted for one another.

I don't think I'm reading too much into what she wrote with this assessment, either. She very clearly describes (and lives) principles that are fervently anarcho-capitalist:

-repeated declarations of self-ownership and self-regulation
-resistance to paying taxes
-preference for open market a la completely voluntary transactional (as opposed to contractual) exchange of money and services, etc.

and anarcho-feminist:

-crippling resistance to coerced social and professional norms shaped by patriarchy, industry, religion, and statutes
-desire for free associations relying strictly on love (i.e. her children) or compatible musical and political vibes(i.e. fans and colleagues), etc.

It's pretty unorthodox, sure, but she's living according to an ethos that a lot of similarly-oriented people only have the courage to talk/tweet/post quotes about.

I call her selfishness out only because of the impact her beliefs have on other professionals and her fans. I can respect someone having such a wildly unorthodox approach to life and work (and avoid them lol), but it would have served her better to clearly articulate the wavelength she's on earlier in her career so that fans and (potential) colleagues knew.

Other thing is, we shrug off far grander self-absorption from entertainers peddling content of worse quality (eg. Kardashians), so I don't get why Lauryn needs to be some anti-christ. At least her self-absorption has a philosophical basis. lol

Read it from top to bottom. I think it's made me like her more, tbh. Good for her for standing up for herself.

  

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howardlloyd
Member since Jan 18th 2007
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Thu Aug-30-18 04:23 AM

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175. "also this"
In response to Reply # 169


  

          


>Other thing is, we shrug off far grander self-absorption from
>entertainers peddling content of worse quality (eg.
>Kardashians), so I don't get why Lauryn needs to be some
>anti-christ.

http://howardlloyd.bandcamp.com

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
24419 posts
Thu Aug-30-18 08:37 AM

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184. "This is great analysis. Thanks for this."
In response to Reply # 169


          

>It's like ohhh... she's literally just an anarchist. A
>little selfish sure, and was deeply - if not irrevocably -
>traumatized as a young woman in her personal and professional
>life.
>
>But the root of all the confusion is she's a passionate
>creative who literally just said fuck it one day and went full
>anarchist; and I believe her anarchism, PTSD, and selfishness
>are frequently misinterpreted for one another.
>
>I don't think I'm reading too much into what she wrote with
>this assessment, either. She very clearly describes (and
>lives) principles that are fervently anarcho-capitalist:
>
>-repeated declarations of self-ownership and self-regulation
>-resistance to paying taxes
>-preference for open market a la completely voluntary
>transactional (as opposed to contractual) exchange of money
>and services, etc.
>
>and anarcho-feminist:
>
>-crippling resistance to coerced social and professional norms
>shaped by patriarchy, industry, religion, and statutes
>-desire for free associations relying strictly on love (i.e.
>her children) or compatible musical and political vibes(i.e.
>fans and colleagues), etc.
>
>It's pretty unorthodox, sure, but she's living according to an
>ethos that a lot of similarly-oriented people only have the
>courage to talk/tweet/post quotes about.
>
>I call her selfishness out only because of the impact her
>beliefs have on other professionals and her fans. I can
>respect someone having such a wildly unorthodox approach to
>life and work (and avoid them lol), but it would have served
>her better to clearly articulate the wavelength she's on
>earlier in her career so that fans and (potential) colleagues
>knew.
>
>Other thing is, we shrug off far grander self-absorption from
>entertainers peddling content of worse quality (eg.
>Kardashians), so I don't get why Lauryn needs to be some
>anti-christ. At least her self-absorption has a philosophical
>basis. lol
>
>Read it from top to bottom. I think it's made me like her
>more, tbh. Good for her for standing up for herself.

As I was reading I kept thinking to myself "she's rebelling against ... something" but couldn't articulate the common theme throughout. You just did that.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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tariqhu
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Thu Aug-30-18 09:27 AM

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190. "that's fine if that's her lifestyle,"
In response to Reply # 169


          

but she's including folks that are fans of hers and want to hear good music or see good shows.

the least she can do is be more timely. its comes off like she doesn't care about their time and money.

Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

  

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Teknontheou
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Thu Aug-30-18 09:34 AM

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192. "I can't bring myself to read her whole response, so I'll ask:"
In response to Reply # 169
Thu Aug-30-18 09:41 AM by Teknontheou

  

          

does she call herself an Anarchist/anarchist-feminist? I ask because if she doesn't call herself that, she might not know that that's a "thing", only that that's how she, herself feels. If she knows it's a philosophy that other people have also subscribed too, it might help her be more concise in explaining her thoughts (not posting novellas every few years), and therefore people would get her better, and there'd be less conflict overall.

  

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Heinz
Member since Dec 26th 2003
20759 posts
Thu Aug-30-18 12:12 AM

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172. "No opt ed can change the facts lol "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

There's lawsuits that prove it, remember that? Scroll to the bottom smh people acting brand new like we needed her response to facts not claims

http://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/inside-the-miseducation-of-lauryn-hill-252219/amp/

----------

IG @h_n_z

  

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spirit
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Thu Aug-30-18 12:48 AM

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173. "He offered ZERO new info and stands on shaky moral ground"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

One, he never even names his “friends” who she allegedly stole from (those in the know are left to presume he means New Ark, but who do you know who levels an accusation on behalf of friends they cant or won’t name?). Two, he alleged that she messed over a band he was a part of and he quit, then returned when it was clear that *his* money would be straight, without saying whether the rest of his band mates got what they deserved as well. So, we are to believe this guy would work for someone who steals from his friends and screws his band mates, as long as he personally gets paid? Even if what he is saying is true, that makes him a douchebag without principles. Three, he asks what Lauryn has done since Miseducation, but what have his (unnamed) friends done since Miseducation? And what did she “steal” exactly? HipHop producers have had session musicians under them, while taking all the production credit themselves, for years now. TF? If they produced that record from scratch, what TF have they produced since? It’s been 20 fucking years.

Lastly, what album has Glasper produced himself with the cultural impact of Miseducation? Oh yeah, not a one. So maybe he hasn’t done enough yet to comment on HER.

And that’s not to mention all the dope work Lauryn did outside of Miseducation. All those classic verses with the Fugees? The hook to If I Ruled The World? The hook on Retrospecr for Life and directing the video for that (as well as directing the video for The Sweetest Thing)? Producing for Aretha?

As for her not knowing how to tune a guitar, so what, even if that is true. Can Common tune a guitar? This is HipHop. That shit is fucking trivia over here.

Peace,

Spirit (Alan)
http://wutangbook.com

  

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Heinz
Member since Dec 26th 2003
20759 posts
Thu Aug-30-18 01:28 AM

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174. "LMAO"
In response to Reply # 173


  

          

Don't type all that just say you like her and will disregard her faults why waste our time LOL


----------

IG @h_n_z

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
24419 posts
Thu Aug-30-18 08:34 AM

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181. "Honestly."
In response to Reply # 174


          

And this part here ...

>So, we are to believe this guy would work for someone who steals from his friends and screws his band mates, as long as he personally gets paid? Even if what he is saying is true, that makes him a douchebag without principles.

.. OK, so what does that make her ?

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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spirit
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Tue Sep-04-18 08:55 AM

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241. "She denies his claim, but he thinks he's telling the truth"
In response to Reply # 181


  

          

If he thinks he's telling the truth, he's an amoral scumbag.

She denies his claims.

So there's that.

Peace,

Spirit (Alan)
http://wutangbook.com

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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Tue Sep-04-18 09:11 AM

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242. ""Even if what he is saying is true ..." © you"
In response to Reply # 241


          

>Even if what he is saying is true, that makes him a douchebag without principles.

... OK, so what does that make her ?

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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spirit
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Tue Sep-04-18 08:54 AM

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240. "I literally did not say those words. Your reading comprehension sucks"
In response to Reply # 174


  

          


Peace,

Spirit (Alan)
http://wutangbook.com

  

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Teknontheou
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Thu Aug-30-18 09:55 AM

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196. "I like Lauryn, but stop it with the hooks. Those were interpolations"
In response to Reply # 173


  

          

of classic songs: If I Ruled the World was from Kurtis Blow and Retrospective For Life was from Stevie.

You're right that Robert didn't dot his I's and cross his T's as far as naming names, but did he have to? What we already know about with New Ark was enough, and that has to be who he's talking about because she's only done one studio album. He wasn't talking about Clef and Jerry Wonder.

  

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bentagain
Member since Mar 19th 2008
16595 posts
Thu Aug-30-18 04:25 AM

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176. "All the L defenders, please post your experience below after attending h..."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

I'm assuming ya'll are out in full force supporting her recent tours

Let us know how it went...

---------------------------------------------------------------

If you can't understand it without an explanation

you can't understand it with an explanation

  

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Trinity444
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Thu Aug-30-18 06:36 AM

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177. "the opportunity hasn’t been presented..."
In response to Reply # 176


  

          

when it does, I may attend but my expectations differs from someone hoping for the old Lauryn. Now that she’s addressed the tardiness I know what to expect from that too.

Shit gets easier once you have context...


  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79594 posts
Thu Aug-30-18 07:01 AM

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178. "Translation: you ain’t going "
In response to Reply # 177


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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KiloMcG
Member since Jan 01st 2008
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Thu Sep-13-18 11:38 AM

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247. "Trin don't go anywhere though "
In response to Reply # 178


  

          

  

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tully_blanchard
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186. "Thats right, she cancelled Charlotte"
In response to Reply # 177


  

          


*************************************

Fuck aliens

-Warriorpoet415

https://astackofwax.com/

#2dopebrothersandastackofwax

https://www.instagram.com/thirtythree.three/

Greatest Post in OKP History

http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&foru

  

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tariqhu
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Thu Aug-30-18 09:22 AM

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189. "no one should expect old Lauryn."
In response to Reply # 177


          

she's 20 years and 6 kids away from that. she's in her 40s.

the expectation for most artist is to do a good show and not be so late that folks talk about how late you were.

she gives the opposite. the reasons won't matter to the folks that are waiting in the concert hall for to show up.

Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
24419 posts
Thu Aug-30-18 09:30 AM

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191. "Correct."
In response to Reply # 189


          

>the expectation for most artist is to do a good show and not
>be so late that folks talk about how late you were.
>
>she gives the opposite. the reasons won't matter to the folks
>that are waiting in the concert hall for to show up.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Trinity444
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Thu Aug-30-18 09:57 AM

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197. "I don’t believe you..."
In response to Reply # 189


  

          

what does that feel like? lol

Recently, I saw the Carters live and I couldnt imagine how they can keep the same energy night after night. But yeah. My point is not to compare The Carters and Lauryn; yet, to point out how exhausting it must be for an artist to keep the same strength while touring.

I get it tho...you paid for the service....you want yours! I’m just not a fair-weather fan! She owes “me” nothing.

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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Thu Aug-30-18 10:08 AM

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198. "This isn't about being fair weather though."
In response to Reply # 197
Thu Aug-30-18 10:08 AM by Brew

          

>I get it tho...you paid for the service....you want yours!
>I’m just not a fair-weather fan! She owes “me” nothing.

Yes she does. If you pay for a service you expect that service to be completed within a reasonable timeframe, especially when there's a set time for it. i.e. we all get pissed when the cable company says "we'll be there at 4" but they don't come til 7.

Entertainment falls under that same umbrella. Why can't we get pissed at Lauryn for telling us she'll be on stage at 10, then doesn't get on til 12:30 ? And only plays for 27 minutes ? If you paid to go see a movie at 7, and the theater decided to make you sit there playing big-screen-trivia for 2 hours then started the movie at 9:45, wouldn't you be bullshit ? Why does Lauryn get a pass for doing the equivalent of that ? People got shit to do. As a professional she should have more respect for our time. She'd only not "owe" you/me/us if she was playing for free.

All we're asking for is some professional courtesy. That's not being "fair weather" that's being a regular consumer who paid for something.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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tariqhu
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202. "simple as that."
In response to Reply # 198


          


>
>All we're asking for is some professional courtesy. That's not
>being "fair weather" that's being a regular consumer who paid
>for something.

if other artists can do it, why can't she?

Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

  

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tariqhu
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199. "you don't believe what lol"
In response to Reply # 197


          

her issue isn't energy level. I only mentioned age because its been so so long since the fugees and her first solo. she aint the same. and neither are we, for that matter. expectations have to be diff.

we now HOPE she'll show up. that's a terrible representation of how she' 'cares' about her fans.

I completely understand the pressure of putting on the same face every night, but again, that's not the problem.

I bet the Carters didn't waste your time or money.

this aint about fair weather fandom. obviously folks are still fans as they keep paying to see her and some folks are still waiting on new tunes. however, she'll continue to lose people unless she gets back on track.

Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

  

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Trinity444
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Thu Aug-30-18 10:28 AM

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204. "that you don’t have the same expectations..."
In response to Reply # 199


  

          

See. Theres a difference between your fandom and mine. As someone that has been inspired by her lyrics, I can contextualize her feelings.


before Kilo drag his behind in here to say I’m not listening...I am! I totally understand why some people feel the way they do about her. I’m just here to provide a different lens to look through.

  

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tariqhu
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208. "why would you not believe that? lol"
In response to Reply # 204


          

I expect her to be late. I also expect to be disappointed if I attend a show. so definitely not the same expectations as when I saw her at the fugees, good mob, and roots shows years ago.

there's an off chance I could see her in October. I'd rather not go, but my wife wants to. If we weren't getting in free, I'd veto going. even free, it might be a waste of time.

you can be inspired by her, but that gives her no right to disrespect you, especially if you're a ride or die type for her.

Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

  

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Trinity444
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211. "for the same reason you don’t believe Lauryn’s response..."
In response to Reply # 208


  

          

>I expect her to be late. I also expect to be disappointed if
>I attend a show. so definitely not the same expectations as
>when I saw her at the fugees, good mob, and roots shows years
>ago.
>
>there's an off chance I could see her in October. I'd rather
>not go, but my wife wants to. If we weren't getting in free,
>I'd veto going. even free, it might be a waste of time

>you can be inspired by her, but that gives her no right to
>disrespect you, especially if you're a ride or die type for
>her.

the point is, I wouldn’t feel disrespected lol. I’m not sure why you think I’m suppose to either. I’m not a groupthinker.

  

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tariqhu
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218. "groupthink? what?! lolol"
In response to Reply # 211


          

so when she's consistently not on time, if she even shows up, what do you call it?


Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

  

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Trinity444
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Thu Aug-30-18 11:27 AM

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221. "in regards to feeling disrespected..."
In response to Reply # 218


  

          

you implied that I should feel like that because majority of you do...

  

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tariqhu
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225. "yes, I did."
In response to Reply # 221


          

so what do you call it?

Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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Thu Aug-30-18 10:46 AM

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209. "This is fine. But the opposite view doesn't make the rest of us "fair we..."
In response to Reply # 204


          

>before Kilo drag his behind in here to say I’m not
>listening...I am! I totally understand why some people feel
>the way they do about her. I’m just here to provide a
>different lens to look through.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Trinity444
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213. " Brew..."
In response to Reply # 209


  

          

I can’t find the right words to have a productive dialogue with you. let’s agree to disagree

  

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Brew
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Thu Aug-30-18 11:13 AM

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216. "Was I rude or something ?"
In response to Reply # 213


          

I'm honestly not sure how to take that.

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Trinity444
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Thu Aug-30-18 11:24 AM

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219. "not at all..."
In response to Reply # 216


  

          

one of us has to let go, tho

  

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Trinity444
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220. "not at all..."
In response to Reply # 216


  

          

one of us has to let go, tho

  

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KiloMcG
Member since Jan 01st 2008
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Thu Sep-13-18 11:41 AM

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249. "hahaha"
In response to Reply # 204


  

          

>
>before Kilo drag his behind in here to say I’m not
>listening...I am! I totally understand why some people feel
>the way they do about her. I’m just here to provide a
>different lens to look through.


i'm just not getting back to reading this post. not sure why i even clicked today, i think because there wasn't much else to click on in here. thanks for the shoutout, though

  

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tully_blanchard
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Thu Aug-30-18 10:18 AM

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201. "She owes "you" a show if you paid your money"
In response to Reply # 197


  

          

Stiffing people cant be written off..




*************************************

Fuck aliens

-Warriorpoet415

https://astackofwax.com/

#2dopebrothersandastackofwax

https://www.instagram.com/thirtythree.three/

Greatest Post in OKP History

http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&foru

  

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kfine
Member since Jan 11th 2009
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Thu Aug-30-18 08:41 AM

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185. "Lol I'd be the perfect test case for this actually, because I haven't ye..."
In response to Reply # 176


          


I know what you mean, because a disappointing Mos Def experience back in the aughts broke my heart and changed the direction of my fandom forever, lol.

I'll remain a Lauryn Hill fan but like I intimated in #169... now that I know how strongly she subscribes to anarchism I would manage my expectations better if attending one of her shows.

The way to deal with somebody with her beliefs is to stop expecting adherence to any social and professional norms just because they happen to be status quo. She literally isn't on that type of time.

And like I said... sure it's a little selfish of her to prioritize her beliefs/comforts/freedoms so much higher than those of her fans and (former) colleagues but

a) she's far from the most megalomaniacal person around lol
b) I believe much of her anarchism emerged due to trauma but it has enabled her to cope/do all she loves, and
c) now that she's articulated her beliefs and way of life, fans/colleagues can make more informed choices about signing up for a "Lauryn Hill Experience".. which might involve some unorthodox events and timelines, but will also involve vibing with her spiritually through her art.

Another thing, too, is before deciding to support a certain show I might regularly track clips people post of recent performances to monitor what mood she's in musically, since she's explained how the different arrangements are supposed to be almost like a vehicle of how she's vibing at any given time.
The sped-up remixy thing might be her jam now but who knows.. maybe she will be inspired by some life experience or conflict or phase of life and have an entirely different sound next month, next year, next decade, etc. I actually find that kind of cool *shrug*


>I'm assuming ya'll are out in full force supporting her
>recent tours
>
>Let us know how it went...

  

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tully_blanchard
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188. "This is almost as bad as folk defending DOOM when he sent fakes"
In response to Reply # 176


  

          

DOOM IS A REAL VILLIAN!!! THATS AWESOME! HE'S GOT HIS OWN DOOM-BOTS!!


I was a HUGE DOOM stan, but when he started doing that shit? I feel waaaay off...

Have your moods, tantrums, whatever..but don't stiff your fans.



*************************************

Fuck aliens

-Warriorpoet415

https://astackofwax.com/

#2dopebrothersandastackofwax

https://www.instagram.com/thirtythree.three/

Greatest Post in OKP History

http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&foru

  

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howardlloyd
Member since Jan 18th 2007
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Thu Aug-30-18 09:39 AM

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193. "and you're wilding"
In response to Reply # 188


  

          

doom said "whoever got the mask"

he told you this lol

http://howardlloyd.bandcamp.com

  

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BrooklynWHAT
Member since Jun 15th 2007
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Thu Aug-30-18 09:43 AM

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194. "yeah doom was upfront w/ it. lauryn a con-artist basically."
In response to Reply # 193


  

          

<--- Big Baller World Order

  

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tully_blanchard
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195. "after he got busted...and people still defended it"
In response to Reply # 193


  

          


*************************************

Fuck aliens

-Warriorpoet415

https://astackofwax.com/

#2dopebrothersandastackofwax

https://www.instagram.com/thirtythree.three/

Greatest Post in OKP History

http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&foru

  

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mind_grapes
Member since Nov 13th 2007
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Thu Aug-30-18 10:39 AM

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207. "I went to a show in DC and it was great"
In response to Reply # 176


          

it was with a smaller band and lauryn was playing the guitar throughout the whole show. She didn't come on until after mid night, but the venue was a really nice, historic sit down theater with drinks and food. She did a lot of the songs off the unplugged and some rare covers. Her voice was excellent. And I appreciated being able to hear the Unplugged songs with a full band.

My favorite was a Roberta Flack cover she did of Hey, Thats No Way To Say Goodbye. She also did a killer version of Sade's Love Is Stronger Than Pride.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C02nSVHdr_8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R9Z232kXDg4

  

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kfine
Member since Jan 11th 2009
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Thu Aug-30-18 11:03 AM

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212. "When was this, and what venue?"
In response to Reply # 207


          



I think this is the kind of vibe I'd enjoy seeing her in too

  

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mind_grapes
Member since Nov 13th 2007
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Thu Aug-30-18 11:06 AM

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215. "Howard Theater, Small Axe Tour"
In response to Reply # 212


          

I want to say 2014 or 2015 around Valentines Day

  

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Trinity444
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Thu Aug-30-18 11:05 AM

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214. "damn. I wish..."
In response to Reply # 207


  

          

...

  

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tully_blanchard
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Thu Aug-30-18 11:43 AM

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222. "RE: damn. I wish...And THATS why mofos keep going...cause you MIGHT"
In response to Reply # 214


  

          

Get that,

But you'll prolly end up with heartbreak and disappointment



*************************************

Fuck aliens

-Warriorpoet415

https://astackofwax.com/

#2dopebrothersandastackofwax

https://www.instagram.com/thirtythree.three/

Greatest Post in OKP History

http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&foru

  

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mind_grapes
Member since Nov 13th 2007
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Thu Aug-30-18 12:06 PM

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228. "If you appreciate jazz and know the original versions"
In response to Reply # 222


          

then what's not to like? Aside from the sound issues that would arise from dealing with a 12+ member band

I love the rearrangements and I know better than showing up to a LH concert before 10PM. There are people out there that appreciate the work she and her band puts in with these arrangements. It's like damn, let others enjoy the show the way she wants to do it. If she was playing these songs like the originals, then I would be completely uninterested in going.

  

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tully_blanchard
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Thu Aug-30-18 10:23 AM

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203. "She's the "polite" version of GG Allin"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

You never knew what you were gonna get with dude.

He might come out butt nekkid, shit on the stage, punch somebody in face, warble through 4 songs then leave. And if you knew his reputation before buying a ticket, that's on you.

At this point, truthfully, nobody really, truly cares if she put out new music. Just respect the epople that still ride for you blindly by showing up on time and giving a show for THEM, not for you.

You're sick of singing "To Zion" the same way for 20 years? Shut the fuck up and do it the way THEY want to hear it.

Even as much as Prince said he wouldnt do "Purple Rain" anymore guess what...he still did it.

He changed the arrangement of Little Red Corvette, but not to where you had to wait until the hook to go "OHH!!!"





*************************************

Fuck aliens

-Warriorpoet415

https://astackofwax.com/

#2dopebrothersandastackofwax

https://www.instagram.com/thirtythree.three/

Greatest Post in OKP History

http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&foru

  

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kfine
Member since Jan 11th 2009
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Thu Aug-30-18 10:57 AM

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210. "I find the sheer intensity of the hate she gets very interesting"
In response to Reply # 203
Thu Aug-30-18 11:04 AM by kfine

          

Kodak Black literally raped a fan after one of his shows and no one talks about the lack of respect/danger posed by an artist like him.

>
>At this point, truthfully, nobody really, truly cares if she
>put out new music. Just respect the epople that still ride for
>you blindly by showing up on time

See now, I'd say I still like her/her music even in light of things we've heard over the years. And your assessment here wouldn't describe me.. I'd still check for her new music, I'm sure there are others who would too.

I guess I don't see the tardiness thing as that huge a deal.. hell, I'm late getting to shows my damn self.

I also think we're forgetting that folks' gripes with Lauryn Hill are largely first world problems.. lol. It's not like she's an OBGYN missing her patients' deliveries here.


>You're sick of singing "To Zion" the same way for 20 years?
>Shut the fuck up and do it the way THEY want to hear it.
>
>Even as much as Prince said he wouldnt do "Purple Rain"
>anymore guess what...he still did it.
>
>He changed the arrangement of Little Red Corvette, but not to
>where you had to wait until the hook to go "OHH!!!"
>
>

But.. she's an anarchist. They don't subscribe to what we view (and perhaps take for granted) as social order and norms. It's like yall want her to comply and she's just like "I don't believe in compliance though..."

The choice is ours, really. And she said as much.

  

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tariqhu
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Thu Aug-30-18 11:13 AM

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217. "I don't see this as hate."
In response to Reply # 210
Thu Aug-30-18 11:15 AM by tariqhu

          

I think folks want her to win. Iwant to root for her, but she's not helping me do so. I wasn't a fan of unplugged, but what artist has a flawless catalog? making an album I don't dig isn't the worst thing in the world.

aint nobody mad that she can't tune a guitar. its clownable tho when another musician brings it up. just do a good, on time show.


>Kodak Black literally raped a fan after one of his shows and
>no one talks about the lack of respect/danger posed by an
>artist like him.

this is a problem. I don't know anything about this guy. I'm an old head at this point, but my guess is that folks won't be checking for him in 20 years.

>
>See now, I'd say I still like her/her music even in light of
>things we've heard over the years. And your assessment here
>wouldn't describe me.. I'd still check for her new music, I'm
>sure there are others who would too.

I'm with you on the music. folks actually love Ms. Hill and want to hear new stuff. it won't hit 20 mill. not to say it won't be good, but its way harder to get those numbers nowadays.
>
>I guess I don't see the tardiness thing as that huge a deal..
>hell, I'm late getting to shows my damn self.

how much are tix to your show? lol how late are you tho? we all are late sometimes.

its a huge problem if you're asking people to come to your show. spend they're time/money on you and you decide not to show? if this was something that happened here or there, no biggie. this is now her rep. she
>
>I also think we're forgetting that folks' gripes with Lauryn
>Hill are largely first world problems.. lol. It's not like
>she's an OBGYN missing her patients' deliveries here.
>

>
>But.. she's an anarchist. They don't subscribe to what we view
>(and perhaps take for granted) as social order and norms. It's
>like yall want her to comply and she's just like "I don't
>believe in compliance though..."
>
>The choice is ours, really. And she said as much.

then stop asking people to come to your shows to support you. go take care of your babies and make music for them in your basement.

otherwise, that's just taking advantage of people.
>
>

Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

  

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kfine
Member since Jan 11th 2009
2218 posts
Thu Aug-30-18 11:53 AM

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223. "Lol, I hear you."
In response to Reply # 217


          


And I meant that I get to shows late as an attendee, not a performer.

Maybe that makes me her kind of people?? Lol I dunno

But again, I just think the most helpful thing she could do - if she doesn't subscribe to rules of expected conduct - is let fans and (potential) colleagues know about her beliefs. Which she's done with this essay.

That way folks who really care about the professionalism stuff can steer clear, and folks who are a bit more forgiving and more interested in her general vibe and music can manage their expectations.

The choice of whether to continue to sing and perform is hers.
The choice of whether to support her shows or music is ours.



  

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Teknontheou
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Thu Aug-30-18 12:05 PM

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227. "Timeout: did you just say "it's not like she's a rapist, or anything""
In response to Reply # 210


  

          

?

After the astute assessment of her as an anarchist (which is eye-opening and makes alot of sense), then this also part of your case for her?

  

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BigReg
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Thu Aug-30-18 12:32 PM

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231. "LOL"
In response to Reply # 227


  

          

Again, i can get the argument that her alleged business practices aimt none of our business/might be misplaced misogyny.

But when ya show up hours late to performances and play songs the audience don’t wanna hear, its gonna slowly erode the goodwill you got. They don’t care about Legend getting a co-writing credit. Bu if they spent xx money on babysitters, parking, and tickets just to be greeted with a hour and a half late start with a reggaeton version of “to zion”, i get it

  

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kfine
Member since Jan 11th 2009
2218 posts
Thu Aug-30-18 12:39 PM

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232. "No! Or at least, I didnt think that someone would interpret what i said"
In response to Reply # 227
Thu Aug-30-18 12:52 PM by kfine

          

that way.

I just noticed that a lot of folks' most impassioned critiques seem to center on the risks/costs/impacts of her behavior on fans.

And when I thought about it, I realized

a) I'd probably still identify as a Lauryn Hill fan
b) I haven't seen her live yet. Would/do I care about all these things people are saying her behavior inflicts on fans?? I kinda don't, lol
and c) If the real underlying gripe everyone has with Lauryn Hill is about the way artists' conduct can impact fans, then that's actually a broader and more serious conversation. And yes, sexual misconduct would unfortunately be part of that conversation and I would prioritize the risks in that behavior over unreliability/tardiness.

That's just me tho! Lol

  

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fontgangsta
Member since Sep 04th 2005
5467 posts
Thu Aug-30-18 12:45 PM

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233. "i think its warratned"
In response to Reply # 210


  

          

>I guess I don't see the tardiness thing as that huge a deal..
>hell, I'm late getting to shows my damn self.

when you're talking about HOURS tho? with no fucks given?
shit, she disrespected the fuck outta grace jones with this bullshit.
GRACE JONES.
im not gonna give her a pass
the "soundcheck" excuse is plain, verifiable BS too.
you can show up whenever you want to show - its not your job.
bottom line is she doesnt respect anyone, so shes not gonna get respect

  

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kfine
Member since Jan 11th 2009
2218 posts
Thu Aug-30-18 12:56 PM

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234. " I do see your point, lol"
In response to Reply # 233


          

  

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fif
Member since Feb 23rd 2004
1998 posts
Mon Sep-03-18 02:14 AM

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236. "she's similar to jd salinger"
In response to Reply # 0


          

the early stuff was more divinely inspired than the result of repeatable work. she can't recreate lightning from the scorched earth. she's a really good one album wonder. could be a personality thing. seems clear she is too rigid in her thinking to relax and let creativity flow in collaboration with other musicians.

  

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WarriorPoet415
Member since Sep 30th 2003
17895 posts
Tue Sep-04-18 09:39 AM

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243. "she's the rap Harper Lee. One really great work and out. "
In response to Reply # 236


  

          

her Fugees work is akin to Harper and Truman collaborating on In Cold Blood.
______________________________________________________________________________

"To Each His Reach"

but.....

Fuck aliens.

  

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Reeq
Member since Mar 11th 2013
16347 posts
Thu Sep-13-18 01:46 AM

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244. "looks like she booted nas and santigold off a show."
In response to Reply # 0


          

and didnt tell the attendees.

https://twitter.com/Santigold/status/1040092249743228929

  

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legsdiamond
Member since May 05th 2011
79594 posts
Thu Sep-13-18 05:25 AM

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245. "Jeff: oh, she did that thing, that thiiiiing to you guys? "
In response to Reply # 244


          

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

  

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poetx
Charter member
58856 posts
Thu Sep-13-18 07:19 PM

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252. "i LLOLed at that. props to jeff. nm"
In response to Reply # 245


  

          


peace & blessings,

x.

www.twitter.com/poetx

=========================================
I'm an advocate for working smarter, not harder. If you just
focus on working hard you end up making someone else rich and
not having much to show for it. (c) mad

  

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tariqhu
Charter member
17890 posts
Thu Sep-13-18 09:55 AM

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246. "damn, you can't even see opening acts"
In response to Reply # 244


          

at her shows. lol

wonder how her performance was.

Y'all buy those labels, I was born supreme

  

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c71
Member since Jan 15th 2008
13962 posts
Thu Sep-13-18 11:40 AM

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248. ""the employees of the year, yeah we're back to work...""
In response to Reply # 244


  

          

"I took time off, while other rappers got JERKED!!!" © Erick Sermon

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
24419 posts
Thu Sep-13-18 01:59 PM

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250. "I mean."
In response to Reply # 244


          

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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