Identity, ethnicity, politics, congressional districts, payback, hispanic caucus, black caucus, it's all here:

Black Caucus chafes at Latino who wants to join

Members are also upset that freshman Rep. Adriano Espaillat twice ran against the seat's former occupant, Charlie Rangel.

Rep. Adriano Espaillat wants to join the Congressional Black Caucus. The question for the group's members is whether he qualifies as African-American.

So far, the answer is no.

Espaillat, who in November became the first Dominican-American elected to Congress, identifies himself as a “Latino of African descent.” The CBC has a long-standing policy of limiting its caucus to African-American members, denying membership to white lawmakers in the past who have tried to join, even if they represent majority-minority districts.

The New York Democrat hasn’t formally asked to join but has been in discussions with CBC leadership. Espaillat has already joined the Congressional Hispanic Caucus.

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/02/congressional-black-caucus-hispanic-adriano-espaillat-234575

The real headline and story is:

Dominican man accepts African descent, may or may not be using it for political advantage

I don't know much about the CBC, but if they are limiting membership to "African-Americans" then what they mean are the Black folks that have no qualifier next to "Black."

on sabbatical.

does it really matter?

wonder what bin's doing?
http://i.imgur.com/phECCMp.jpg

Remember unlike real life these aren't civic but political orgs. Maybe the black caucus had some dust ups with the hispanic one...maybe they dont let white congressmen in because they literally and figurtively don't have 'skin' in the game and can report back to other groups the goings on.

>Identity, ethnicity, politics, congressional districts,
>payback, hispanic caucus, black caucus, it's all here:
>
>Black Caucus chafes at Latino who wants to join
>
>Members are also upset that freshman Rep. Adriano Espaillat
>twice ran against the seat's former occupant, Charlie Rangel.
>
>Rep. Adriano Espaillat wants to join the Congressional Black
>Caucus. The question for the group's members is whether he
>qualifies as African-American.
>
>So far, the answer is no.
>
>Espaillat, who in November became the first Dominican-American
>elected to Congress, identifies himself as a “Latino of
>African descent.” The CBC has a long-standing policy of
>limiting its caucus to African-American members, denying
>membership to white lawmakers in the past who have tried to
>join, even if they represent majority-minority districts.
>
>The New York Democrat hasn’t formally asked to join but has
>been in discussions with CBC leadership. Espaillat has already
>joined the Congressional Hispanic Caucus.
>
>http://www.politico.com/story/2017/02/congressional-black-caucus-hispanic-adriano-espaillat-234575
>
>The real headline and story is:
>
>Dominican man accepts African descent, may or may not be using
>it for political advantage

and he definitely doesn't look like someone who would walk around sayin he's black..... especially if he's Dominican.... imho

*******************************************************
i will not let finite disappointment undermine infinite hope
- Cory Booker

Football is a simple game; 22 men chase a ball for 90 minutes, and at the end the Germans always win
- Gary Lineker

"Get ready....for your blessing....."

if folks want some kind of unity, same for white. Otherwise pick a group based on whatever arbitrary criteria you like and shut up.

>if folks want some kind of unity, same for white. Otherwise
>pick a group based on whatever arbitrary criteria you like and
>shut up.

You can't go all in while maintaining a way out.

"Get ready....for your blessing....."

>>if folks want some kind of unity, same for white. Otherwise
>>pick a group based on whatever arbitrary criteria you like
>and
>>shut up.
>
>You can't go all in while maintaining a way out.
>
>"Get ready....for your blessing....."

dismiss their unique cultural experiences, and fall in with the Black struggle. So many of our issues come from the systematic breakdown of Black family, which started with slavery in America. Some of our people speak and behave with a special kind of purposelessness, an overwhelming sense of defeat that the children of immigrants are unlikely to have. I can't always be mad when they tell their kids "You're not like them".

Africans especially have a much more resolute, dignified visage more often than not.

We look hardened at best and defeated at worst.


(╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻

Some of our people speak and behave with
>a special kind of purposelessness, an overwhelming sense of
>defeat that the children of immigrants are unlikely to have.
>I can't always be mad when they tell their kids "You're not
>like them".

Damn that's just as bad as what the whites teach, if immigrants tell their kids to paint with a broad bush.

---------------------------
Signature

>
> Some of our people speak and behave with
>>a special kind of purposelessness, an overwhelming sense of
>>defeat that the children of immigrants are unlikely to have.
>
>>I can't always be mad when they tell their kids "You're not
>>like them".
>
>Damn that's just as bad as what the whites teach, if
>immigrants tell their kids to paint with a broad bush.

But I could show you, and you'd know what I'm talking about. You've probably seen it yourself. And you hear it all throughout the music on urban radio.

>>
>> Some of our people speak and behave with
>>>a special kind of purposelessness, an overwhelming sense of
>>>defeat that the children of immigrants are unlikely to
>have.
>>
>>>I can't always be mad when they tell their kids "You're not
>>>like them".
>>
>>Damn that's just as bad as what the whites teach, if
>>immigrants tell their kids to paint with a broad bush.
>
>But I could show you, and you'd know what I'm talking about.
>You've probably seen it yourself. And you hear it all
>throughout the music on urban radio.

I hear it, very ugly but I get your point.

---------------------------
Signature

_______________________________________

Adriano was born in the Dominican Republic >>>>black


"Get ready....for your blessing....."

>

I would think there's power in numbers in Washington, but I'm guessing the CBC has their reason for being restrictive in that manner.

How much damage could one non-black individual cause being a member in the caucus? **edit** Is it an instance where the CBC is worried too many non-black members would eventually try to join the CBC and would somehow outnumber actual black individuals?

"Sean sparks like John Starks, nah, Sean ball like John Wall" - Rest In Power Forever Sean Price.

Caucus. Identifies AS Latino....

Black folks don't have the luxury of dipping in and out of our Blackness when it's convenient.



"Get ready....for your blessing....."

**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

>Black and Latino are not mutually exclusive are they?

The way that we are using Black here (vs. black) makes them mutually-exclusive.

ask what it meant as many times as I have seen it.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

your ppl from America you Black.

your ppl from anywhere else in the diaspora you black.
_______________________

you're kiddin', right? you haven't picked up on that distinction? as long as you've been here?

>ask what it meant as many times as I have seen it.

distinction.

It's another variation of the "blacker than thou" arguments.

I point at Q-tip and he says "Black is Black".


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

descendants of slaves in what is now the United States.

It's a demonym. And it's our demonym. If I decide that I suddenly want to call myself Jamaican, then I'd be on some bullshit, because I'm not Jamaican.

distinction definition wise, but I still think the Distinction is counter-productive and needless. Let me give you an example:

My wife is of Caribbean descent. Her parents are both immigrants. Dad from Barbados. Her mom the Philipines. Her older sister was born in the Philippines. She here in New York. I was born in VA.

Is she black and am I Black? Is she Black and her older born in the Philippines black? Are my children Black or black?

Is Marcus Garvey Black or black?

My wife and my American experience are very similar and are very much based on the commonality inherent with being perceived as being black by the rest of America. The distinctions in our American experience we do have have very little to do with where her parents happen to have been born.

Distinctions between descendants of US Slaves and other black people is useful in certain discussion, but not in most discussions I see.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

It's probably not a good idea to argue about this with you because you seem to be basing your argument on your connection with your wife.

And in my mind, she's not Black. I was largely exposed to West Indians and Africans once I got to college and so many of them went out of their way to make sure everyone knew they were xyz and not Black, even though most of them were born in the US. And they were correct, in that.

That'd be like saying if you're Irish, but were raised in an Italian neighborhood, then you're Iralian. Like Tom Hagan, or something. Doesn't work that way.

Black enough?


I could take you more seriously if you answered all the questions I asked.

Because otherwise I can assume that you didn't really think this whole thing through.

Let me see the math add up. Show your work. Support your thesis.


BTW, are you Black or black? I thought you were spanish?


>It's probably not a good idea to argue about this with you
>because you seem to be basing your argument on your connection
>with your wife.
>
>And in my mind, she's not Black. I was largely exposed to
>West Indians and Africans once I got to college and so many of
>them went out of their way to make sure everyone knew they
>were xyz and not Black, even though most of them were born in
>the US. And they were correct, in that.
>
>That'd be like saying if you're Irish, but were raised in an
>Italian neighborhood, then you're Iralian. Like Tom Hagan, or
>something. Doesn't work that way.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

no one could take that from her.

however...she is NOT Black.

because she has that nationality to fall back on. that somewhere else where HER people lived and worked and breathed before coming here, the food they cooked, the music they listened to etc

that culture. for better or worse.

to be Black is to have nowhere to go. but here.

and what we made of it...here.

our music, and our clothes and our dances. we are a people too.

we get to have OUR own shit thats no one elses. thats our culture.

as soon as you say youre black and ______

or be at pains to say well my grand mother was from _________ we go there still

etc

youre black. we are ALL black.

but just as your wife can rightfully claim *also* being _________

but i cant?

then she cant claim what *i* am.

we can all still work together, have the same voting patterns etc

but yeah. you aint me & i aint you.

& thats ok.

look how dismissive you respond when even confronted w/ the idea.

people need Black people to be broken u & separated. National economy depends on Black people spending our resources in everyone ELSES industries and stores.

if we came together & supported each other, America literally doesnt have a template for that & might very well collapse. so i get your confusion and animus.

but we here now. we are a people. thats what ALLLL this shit is REALLY abt...imo. people waking up to the fact that WOW...we are a people.

What are my children?
What was Marcus Garvey?

What are the qualifications for Black?

Being born here and the descendants of slaves? There are a gang of folks whose parents are from the Diaspora that meet that criteria. (BTW, I use my wife as an example because it's an easy example, not because I am worried that you and Tek won't consider her truly Black.)


Is the argument she isn't Black because the slaveholders stopped off in the Carribean before she eventually ended up here? Cause she eat Curry Goat and Pancit?

Is the idea she isn't Black because she has a non-black parent? That distinction is a blurry line considering that she probably has more African blood than I do based on phenotype.


If you are making the argument that there is a unique African-American experience I can give you that. When I meet black people in New York and they ask where I am from I often joke that I am "regular black". All my grandparents are from the south and descendants of slaves.


But never in the history of Black People in America has the definition of Black, black, Negro or African American required that you have had 4 black grandparents who are the descendants of American Slavery.


The definition of black has never been that narrow. And I dont' see the value of doing it other than to divide folks within the Diaspora.






>no one could take that from her.
>
>however...she is NOT Black.
>
>because she has that nationality to fall back on. that
>somewhere else where HER people lived and worked and breathed
>before coming here, the food they cooked, the music they
>listened to etc
>
>that culture. for better or worse.
>
>to be Black is to have nowhere to go. but here.
>
>and what we made of it...here.
>
>our music, and our clothes and our dances. we are a people
>too.
>
>we get to have OUR own shit thats no one elses. thats our
>culture.
>
>as soon as you say youre black and ______
>
>or be at pains to say well my grand mother was from _________
>we go there still
>
>etc
>
>youre black. we are ALL black.
>
>but just as your wife can rightfully claim *also* being
>_________
>
>but i cant?
>
>then she cant claim what *i* am.
>
>we can all still work together, have the same voting patterns
>etc
>
>but yeah. you aint me & i aint you.
>
>& thats ok.
>
>look how dismissive you respond when even confronted w/ the
>idea.
>
>people need Black people to be broken u & separated. National
>economy depends on Black people spending our resources in
>everyone ELSES industries and stores.
>
>if we came together & supported each other, America literally
>doesnt have a template for that & might very well collapse. so
>i get your confusion and animus.
>
>but we here now. we are a people. thats what ALLLL this shit
>is REALLY abt...imo. people waking up to the fact that
>WOW...we are a people.
>
>


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

And I don't know why folks here keep thinking I'm something other than Black. I'm from that original Jamestown 1619 stock (I think). I'm on some Black original Chesapeake Bay blueblood status.

"Get ready....for your blessing....."

Why does this bother people so much? Particularly other black folks that get upset, yet at the same time MAINTAIN THEIR SEPARATE EXCLUSIVE CULTURAL IDENTITY.


Again, why can't we have our own cultural identity?

At least not the way it's been explained to me by folks here.

If any of the folks arguing in favor of it can walk me through how works, I am happy to hear it. They can start by answering the questions I pose.





>Why does this bother people so much? Particularly other black
>folks that get upset, yet at the same time MAINTAIN THEIR
>SEPARATE EXCLUSIVE CULTURAL IDENTITY.
>
>
>Again, why can't we have our own cultural identity?


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

...In order to best serve our communities and ourselves, we need to take that unique ancestry and history in this country into account. That is the reason that the distinction is necessary.

We ARE NOT immigrants (for example), and that is one HUGE difference between us and others.

We face a unique set of problems in this country, and it's been proven that no one will really understand or help us like we can. The distinction is to make sure that our unique needs have a voice.

It the above not reason enough?



On the contrary, why do black folks that moved here cling to "Hatian," "Nigerian" "Dominican" etc. so hard? Why can't *they* just be black?

as a solution to that identity crisis it ranks as less than shitty

co-opt the name of the diaspora and hope context and capitalization clears up any ambiguity along the way...eureka!!!

it's doing a consistent bang-up job so far

gotta love that

Let me sport my Air Hyperbole 2010s in peace. (c) ansomble

Building repetoires (c) spm since 1983

If we had a name to identify ourselves I wonder if this "issue" would even pop up at all.


The B/b stuff is just confusing.

we can't even focus on what actually qualifies you as Black

that's how bad it is

Qualifications:
Self-Identify
Born in America (very flimsy one FluidJ claimed)
Darker than almond milk?


I mean what else is there? anything cultural? The thing about identity in this case is that we were never in charge of approving/disproving the one drop rule...let alone the variety of other brown membership issues...

we have a specific history...diverse culture...but are those distinctions any different (or more distinct) from many of the other brown people's brownness?

Let me sport my Air Hyperbole 2010s in peace. (c) ansomble

Building repetoires (c) spm since 1983

concrete and fundamental qualifier there is.




"Get ready....for your blessing....."

a person with an African dad and white mom in fucking Bethel fucking Maine is Black to you

but the slaves originally brought here are not

Wyclef is not

birthplace has little to no impact on self-identification and especially culture

Let me sport my Air Hyperbole 2010s in peace. (c) ansomble

Building repetoires (c) spm since 1983

>a person with an African dad and white mom in fucking Bethel
>fucking Maine is Black to you

You on a state level and i'm on the Country of origin level. Why wouldn't they be Black to me?? Why aren't they Black to you? You sound like you wouldn't even embrace them as black. Are you on THAT?

>but the slaves originally brought here are not

Where did you jump to that conclusion. Black is a post slavery concept. Just like Christianity is a post Jesus concept. Let's just say that our slave ancestors were the John the Baptists of this whole ordeal.

>Wyclef is not

Clef black. There's nothing wrong with BEING black. Not sure why you and others seem to be bent on turning black into a negative.

>birthplace has little to no impact on self-identification and
>especially culture

In the instance of Black vs. black...it has EVERYTHING to do with it.


"Get ready....for your blessing....."

>>a person with an African dad and white mom in fucking
>Bethel
>>fucking Maine is Black to you
>
>You on a state level and i'm on the Country of origin level.
>Why wouldn't they be Black to me?? Why aren't they Black to
>you? You sound like you wouldn't even embrace them as black.
>Are you on THAT?
>

I'd embrace them as Black, black and part of the diaspora but would realize they'd likely not have much of cultural attachment which is fine if Black was just ethnicity or race but since it's not...it becomes just an arbitrary label about birthplace and skin color...if that's what the distinction means to you...cool...that's not nearly as popular an idea as you think and is extremely "personal"...why should personal ideas about Blackness be used to exclude people with potential dual cultural membership...i'll touch back on this

>>but the slaves originally brought here are not
>
>Where did you jump to that conclusion. Black is a post slavery
>concept. Just like Christianity is a post Jesus concept. Let's
>just say that our slave ancestors were the John the Baptists
>of this whole ordeal.
>

how is Black post-slavery? Slaves are literally celebrated during Black History month. Frederick Douglas...a freed slave didn't become Black in retrospect...why are you making up arbitrary rules just to fit your definition? the first Blacks even by your definition were born to the first wave of slaves...that's a long time before post-slavery

>>Wyclef is not
>
>Clef black. There's nothing wrong with BEING black. Not sure
>why you and others seem to be bent on turning black into a
>negative.
>
>>birthplace has little to no impact on self-identification
>and
>>especially culture
>
>In the instance of Black vs. black...it has EVERYTHING to do
>with it.
>
>

How? you've been asked this question about the relation of birthplace to culture and you've wholesale Trumped your way through it...be precise...what is EVERYTHING? why is birthplace central to the notion of Black people and particularly Black culture? don't dodge it with empty intuition...this is the crux of it

the point isn't that there is something negative about black...this is two-fold

Black Americans is a diverse story that has been told the same way in different countries with small yet distinct differences...much of it transmutable...either explain why birthplace is that so-called key to the distinction or display the critical thinking ability to examine that

a.) co-opting Black from black is confusing, ambiguous, and problematic
b.) a replacement is difficult because the distinctions are exponentially smaller than the similarities and diversity within even the narrow view of Black makes any consensus impossible
c.) that trying to make Black (and potentially the next best label/term) exclusive simply because you don't have dual membership is childish and often a way for people to other people the way we've been othered

Let me sport my Air Hyperbole 2010s in peace. (c) ansomble

Building repetoires (c) spm since 1983

We here.
We been here.
WE have nowhere ELSE to go.
This place is OURS.
WE are American.
I'm a very proud American. Why? Because my ancestors that were slaves built this place. My ancestors that were "free" built this. My ancestors that know nothing BUT American soil built this. My ancestors that were segregated fought for and built this.
I believe that those unique qualities deserve to be celebrated in a very straight forward and succinct way. In 2017, WE don't all think the same way. We don't all shard the same or even similar cultural experiences. What we DO share is a bloodline that started with Slavery. And yes, i'm well aware that bloodline predates slavery by thousands of years.... But that significant milestone in world history spawned this. It's a key component of this. And I believe it should be acknowledged and protected and celebrated.

All that other psuedo debate club stuff you're talking is not really relevant. The nuances are not relevant because ultimately they all serve to minimize the very significant fact that WE are a unique people within the diaspora. Just like all of the other unique groups that have formal name for themselves. Funny thing is, WE seem to be the only group that continues to reject and fight against owning up to what makes us US.

>I'd embrace them as Black, black and part of the diaspora but
>would realize they'd likely not have much of cultural
>attachment which is fine if Black was just ethnicity or race
>but since it's not...it becomes just an arbitrary label about
>birthplace and skin color...if that's what the distinction
>means to you...cool...that's not nearly as popular an idea as
>you think and is extremely "personal"...why should personal
>ideas about Blackness be used to exclude people with potential
>dual cultural membership...i'll touch back on this



>>>but the slaves originally brought here are not
>>
>>Where did you jump to that conclusion. Black is a post
>slavery
>>concept. Just like Christianity is a post Jesus concept.
>Let's
>>just say that our slave ancestors were the John the Baptists
>>of this whole ordeal.
>>
>
>how is Black post-slavery? Slaves are literally celebrated
>during Black History month. Frederick Douglas...a freed slave
>didn't become Black in retrospect...why are you making up
>arbitrary rules just to fit your definition? the first Blacks
>even by your definition were born to the first wave of
>slaves...that's a long time before post-slavery
>
>>>Wyclef is not
>>
>>Clef black. There's nothing wrong with BEING black. Not sure
>>why you and others seem to be bent on turning black into a
>>negative.
>>
>>>birthplace has little to no impact on self-identification
>>and
>>>especially culture
>>
>>In the instance of Black vs. black...it has EVERYTHING to do
>>with it.
>>
>>
>
>How? you've been asked this question about the relation of
>birthplace to culture and you've wholesale Trumped your way
>through it...be precise...what is EVERYTHING? why is
>birthplace central to the notion of Black people and
>particularly Black culture? don't dodge it with empty
>intuition...this is the crux of it
>
>the point isn't that there is something negative about
>black...this is two-fold
>
>Black Americans is a diverse story that has been told the same
>way in different countries with small yet distinct
>differences...much of it transmutable...either explain why
>birthplace is that so-called key to the distinction or display
>the critical thinking ability to examine that
>
>a.) co-opting Black from black is confusing, ambiguous, and
>problematic
>b.) a replacement is difficult because the distinctions are
>exponentially smaller than the similarities and diversity
>within even the narrow view of Black makes any consensus
>impossible
>c.) that trying to make Black (and potentially the next best
>label/term) exclusive simply because you don't have dual
>membership is childish and often a way for people to other
>people the way we've been othered
>
>


"Get ready....for your blessing....."

>We here.
true
>We been here.
true, but so have they
>WE have nowhere ELSE to go.
false
>This place is OURS.
debatable...Natives had dibs
>WE are American.
True...but so are Puerto Ricans...and i'll also note that the Americas is still a semantical cluster too

>I'm a very proud American. Why? Because my ancestors that were
>slaves built this place. My ancestors that were "free" built
>this. My ancestors that know nothing BUT American soil built
>this. My ancestors that were segregated fought for and built
>this.

You seem to think this is untrue for them...not my fault your knowledge of the West Indies thinks this is more unique than it is

>I believe that those unique qualities deserve to be celebrated
>in a very straight forward and succinct way. In 2017, WE don't
>all think the same way. We don't all shard the same or even
>similar cultural experiences. What we DO share is a bloodline
>that started with Slavery. And yes, i'm well aware that
>bloodline predates slavery by thousands of years.... But that
>significant milestone in world history spawned this. It's a
>key component of this. And I believe it should be acknowledged
>and protected and celebrated.
>

what makes it unique from the slave trade that occurred in the West Indies specifically?

>All that other psuedo debate club stuff you're talking is not
>really relevant. The nuances are not relevant because
>ultimately they all serve to minimize the very significant
>fact that WE are a unique people within the diaspora. Just
>like all of the other unique groups that have formal name for
>themselves. Funny thing is, WE seem to be the only group that
>continues to reject and fight against owning up to what makes
>us US.
>

cool Trumpian anti-intellectualism bro...we are unique but are we so unique that others within the diaspora should be excluded? Part of the "fight" is about finding a less ambiguous/arbitrary label with meaningful qualifications that serve the goal of celebrating and understanding our uniqueness...it shouldn't be done haphazardly

>>I'd embrace them as Black, black and part of the diaspora
>but
>>would realize they'd likely not have much of cultural
>>attachment which is fine if Black was just ethnicity or race
>>but since it's not...it becomes just an arbitrary label
>about
>>birthplace and skin color...if that's what the distinction
>>means to you...cool...that's not nearly as popular an idea
>as
>>you think and is extremely "personal"...why should personal
>>ideas about Blackness be used to exclude people with
>potential
>>dual cultural membership...i'll touch back on this
>
>
>
>>>>but the slaves originally brought here are not
>>>
>>>Where did you jump to that conclusion. Black is a post
>>slavery
>>>concept. Just like Christianity is a post Jesus concept.
>>Let's
>>>just say that our slave ancestors were the John the
>Baptists
>>>of this whole ordeal.
>>>
>>

WAT??!!

>>how is Black post-slavery? Slaves are literally celebrated
>>during Black History month. Frederick Douglas...a freed
>slave
>>didn't become Black in retrospect...why are you making up
>>arbitrary rules just to fit your definition? the first
>Blacks
>>even by your definition were born to the first wave of
>>slaves...that's a long time before post-slavery
>>
>>>>Wyclef is not
>>>
>>>Clef black. There's nothing wrong with BEING black. Not
>sure
>>>why you and others seem to be bent on turning black into a
>>>negative.
>>>
>>>>birthplace has little to no impact on self-identification
>>>and
>>>>especially culture
>>>
>>>In the instance of Black vs. black...it has EVERYTHING to
>do
>>>with it.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>How? you've been asked this question about the relation of
>>birthplace to culture and you've wholesale Trumped your way
>>through it...be precise...what is EVERYTHING? why is
>>birthplace central to the notion of Black people and
>>particularly Black culture? don't dodge it with empty
>>intuition...this is the crux of it
>>
>>the point isn't that there is something negative about
>>black...this is two-fold
>>
>>Black Americans is a diverse story that has been told the
>same
>>way in different countries with small yet distinct
>>differences...much of it transmutable...either explain why
>>birthplace is that so-called key to the distinction or
>display
>>the critical thinking ability to examine that
>>
>>a.) co-opting Black from black is confusing, ambiguous, and
>>problematic
>>b.) a replacement is difficult because the distinctions are
>>exponentially smaller than the similarities and diversity
>>within even the narrow view of Black makes any consensus
>>impossible
>>c.) that trying to make Black (and potentially the next best
>>label/term) exclusive simply because you don't have dual
>>membership is childish and often a way for people to other
>>people the way we've been othered
>>
>>
>
>

you dodged this again but understandable

Let me sport my Air Hyperbole 2010s in peace. (c) ansomble

Building repetoires (c) spm since 1983

coming from our home country and a historical denial of even considering us full citizens. I exclude Afro-Europeans from that because almost all of them are relatively recent immigrants who know exactly where their families came from.

But we're the only group that has a sense of shame/anger/unease about fully embracing our country's name. That's one thing about Afro-Latinxs: even in spite of similar types of oppression and a LONGER history of brutal slavery than us, they still ride hard for the countries in a full-throated way and don't hesitate to rock out withe their countries' names.

though.....




"Get ready....for your blessing....."

Not the other way around.
I believe self-identifying as black stated in America in contrast to all their other terms people used for black.
Could be wrong though.
___________________________________________________________


DJTB YOMM

a Black person and a black person?

Help me out with some concrete examples.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

Black folk are Black.. period.

black folk can cling to their home lands culture because they HAVE a home land. We can't go anywhere as Black Americans.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

Again, is the requirement that you have 4 black grandparents (and must those black grandparents all have 4 black grandparents)?


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

Cause they were born here?


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

it's like the one drop rule.

Once you got Black in you, you are Black.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

open the umbrella, let them all in and then watch our concerns and issues get pushed to the back of the line.

we just came up 50 years ago. That isn't a long time but some people swear we made it cause THEY made it.

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

to not be a united front.

If we think "us" versus "them" within our own community than we can never deal with the real "them".

Malcolm, Martin, Marcus, Federick, Booker, nor any of the other black leaders never made these distinctions. Don't see why we would start now.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

the issue is most of those black folk have reminded us countless times they aren't Black.

We those folks out marching with Malcom and Martin? I'm asking, i don't know the answer.

We have always been an inclusive, door open, have some food type of culture. Problem is as soon as we start talking about social issues and problems in our community most of those folks reminded us they weren't like that because they were from XYZ.. "back in our country we..."

ehh, we don't have that convenience to tap out like they do

****************
TBH the fact that you're even a mod here fits squarely within Jag's narrative of OK-sanctioned aggression, bullying, and toxicity. *shrug*

>Caucus. Identifies AS Latino....
>
>Black folks don't have the luxury of dipping in and out of our
>Blackness when it's convenient.

I've never had the option of "accepting Blackness".
And he's Dominican too, FOH

Just becuz u were born in a Spanish speaking country or South America doesn't make u not black if you are of African descent. These folks ancestors were brought over from African during the slave trade just like ours.

By the way, in regards to the CBC, there are now and have been since its inception black West Indians/Caribbean descent folks amongst its numbers

Black folks have wayyyyyy to many issues. We will be in the same place 100 years from now thinking like this

U talking about a luxury??? This dude is embracing all parts of his identity. His blackness and his latinoness. Which unfortunately is something many Dominicans don't do

And that's being hated on

prototype

stand ur ground, believe in urself,
believe in love, prepare urself for love, remove the negativity from ur life, and accept the love u kno u deserve

>Just becuz u were born in a Spanish speaking country or South
>America doesn't make u not black if you are of African
>descent. These folks ancestors were brought over from African
>during the slave trade just like ours.

Correct. you're still black.. but not Black.

>By the way, in regards to the CBC, there are now and have been
>since its inception black West Indians/Caribbean descent folks
>amongst its numbers

Do they attempt to simultaneously serve in the Latino Caucus? I doubt the CBC even subscribes to the b vs B guidelines being discussed here. But with regards to this particular story, it's very likely that their issue lies with him being an active participant in the Latino caucus.

>Black folks have wayyyyyy to many issues. We will be in the
>same place 100 years from now thinking like this

Thinking like what? A big issue that I believe we've had over the years is that we dilute OUR cause and OUR key issues within this system that has oppressed us for so many year. We dilute our cause by being so inclusive and bringing everyone ELSE'S cause into our umbrella of grievances.

>U talking about a luxury??? This dude is embracing all parts
>of his identity. His blackness and his latinoness. Which
>unfortunately is something many Dominicans don't do

This dude is making a political move plain and simple.

>And that's being hated on

Nah, what's being hated on is that his motives are clearly political in nature. He's been riding the Latino train all these years and now all of a sudden he wants in on our set?? Sound shady to me.

"Get ready....for your blessing....."

Shirley Chisolm was one for God's sake and she was one of the founders. Don't waste ur breath with me talking about B vs b, becuz that's not my issue at all.

prototype

stand ur ground, believe in urself,
believe in love, prepare urself for love, remove the negativity from ur life, and accept the love u kno u deserve