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Subject: "Adnan Syed gets a new trial (SWIPE)" Previous topic | Next topic
PROMO
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Fri Jul-01-16 01:48 AM

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"Adnan Syed gets a new trial (SWIPE)"


  

          

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/01/us/serial-adnan-syed-new-trial.html?smprod=nytcore-iphone&smid=nytcore-iphone-share

A judge in Maryland has granted a new trial to Adnan Syed, setting aside his conviction for the 1999 murder of his former girlfriend, in a case that was the subject of the first season of the hit podcast “Serial.”

Mr. Syed’s lawyer, C. Justin Brown, posted the news on Twitter on Thursday afternoon and confirmed by phone that the motion for a new trial had been granted by Judge Martin P. Welch of the Baltimore City Circuit Court.

The decision to grant Mr. Syed, 35, a retrial was a major victory for an inmate who has long maintained his innocence and has exhausted all other avenues of appeal. He was convicted in 2000 in the murder of his former girlfriend, Hae Min Lee, and had served 16 years of a life sentence.

“Serial” turned speculation about Mr. Syed’s guilt and whether he had received a fair trial into something of a national pastime in 2014. The show was downloaded more than 100 million times and won a Peabody Award for its role in illuminating flaws in the criminal justice system.

At a news conference in Baltimore, Mr. Brown was asked if he thought there was any chance that the retrial could have come about without “Serial.”

“I don’t think so,” he said.

On the possibility that Mr. Syed may eventually go free, Mr. Brown said: “I’m feeling pretty confident right now. This was the biggest hurdle. It’s really hard to get a new trial.”

Mr. Brown said that he had not been able to reach Mr. Syed to tell him the news.

The family of Ms. Lee has expressed pain and outrage at the attention surrounding Mr. Syed’s bid for a new trial. In a statement in February, the family said, “It remains hard to see so many run to defend someone who committed a horrible crime, who destroyed our family, who refuses to accept responsibility, when so few are willing to speak up for Hae.”

The Maryland Attorney General’s Office said in a statement Thursday night that it had a responsibility to keep pursuing justice and “to defend what it believes is a valid conviction.”

Mr. Syed’s brother, Yusuf, 26, said in an interview on Thursday that the family had high hopes for a favorable decision, based on the strength of the legal arguments and the outpouring of support.

“We really felt 100 percent that the judge would rule in our favor,” he said, adding, “We’ve been waiting 20 years for this.”

Rabia Chaudry, a family friend of Mr. Syed’s who introduced Sarah Koenig, the host of “Serial,” to the case, celebrated the decision online, thanking the judge and witnesses, among others.

A production manager for “Serial,” Emily Condon, declined to comment on Thursday.

The judge’s decision came after three days of postconviction hearings in February. Mr. Syed and his legal team had presented new evidence, including the testimony of a new alibi witness, and argued that his original defense counsel had been grossly negligent.

The post-trial proceedings were held before Judge Welch, a retired judge, who had granted Mr. Syed’s request for a hearing in November. Mr. Syed first filed a request for a postconviction hearing in 2010, but was denied.

Mr. Syed’s defense had argued in February that the decision by Mr. Syed’s lawyer in the original trial, Maria Cristina Gutierrez, not to question a state’s expert, Abraham Waranowitz, about the reliability of evidence relating to cellphone towers constituted ineffective assistance.

The judge’s decision to grant Mr. Syed a new trial turned on that issue. In a memo, Judge Welch wrote that Ms. Gutierrez’s failure to question Mr. Waranowitz “created a substantial possibility that the result of the trial was fundamentally unreliable.”

Judge Welch also said in the memo that the substantial public interest in the case did not affect his decision.

“Regardless of the public interest surrounding this case, the court used its best efforts to address the merits of petitioner’s petition for postconviction relief like it would in any other case that comes before the court; unfettered by sympathy, prejudice, or public opinion,” he wrote.

Ms. Gutierrez was a prominent Baltimore defense lawyer in the 1990s whose career crumbled in 2001 when she was disbarred by consent after a state commission uncovered financial improprieties involving her clients. She told The Baltimore Sun at the time that her legal practice suffered in part because of her severe medical problems related to multiple sclerosis. She died of a heart attack in 2004.

On Thursday, hundreds of fans of “Serial” took to social media, some of them to celebrate and others to emphasize that they still believed Mr. Syed was guilty.

The podcast recently ended its second season, which told the story of Bowe Bergdahl, an American soldier in Afghanistan who was captured by the Taliban in 2009 and released as part of a prisoner swap in 2014.

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
I'm lost
Jul 01st 2016
1
He was the subject of the first Serial Podcast
Jul 01st 2016
2
Rabia Chaudry is my hero
Jul 01st 2016
3
that's the ONE thing that bugs me about this whole thing...
Jul 01st 2016
4
      Chaudry actually credits Susan Simpson
Jul 01st 2016
5
Shoulda never been convicted but he did it tho
Jul 02nd 2016
6
but he didn't tho.
Jul 02nd 2016
7
^^^^^^^^^
Jul 02nd 2016
8
I'm curious what evidence you think points to that conclusion
Jul 03rd 2016
15
      Honestly, I've only listened to Serial and not since its release.
Jul 06th 2016
29
           Undisclosed pretty much destroys the case against him
Jul 06th 2016
32
congrats to that murderer
Jul 02nd 2016
9
question: how do you figure that he killed her?
Jul 02nd 2016
10
      here are my reasons:
Jul 03rd 2016
13
           yeah, you must not have read any links i posted...
Jul 03rd 2016
14
                Nobody still citing cell tower pings is worth discussing this with
Jul 03rd 2016
16
                     I don't think you're paying attention...
Jul 06th 2016
25
                          Uh - he was agreeing with you.
Jul 06th 2016
30
                          LOL. You should probably pay more attention. You're way off.
Jul 06th 2016
31
                               my bad. lol.
Jul 06th 2016
38
you know what convinced me he aint do it more than anything?
Jul 02nd 2016
11
they exist, but they are pretty rare..
Jul 02nd 2016
12
I feel like there is only one logical conclusion, Adnan did it.
Jul 05th 2016
17
nope. guess again.
Jul 05th 2016
18
There's a far more obvious and realistic reason for that.
Jul 05th 2016
19
Also, there's some thought that...
Jul 05th 2016
20
That's silly, and defense attorneys do it all.the.time.
Jul 06th 2016
22
      Defense attorneys. Not Adnan.
Jul 06th 2016
33
based off of the Serial podcast, i can see how you might say that
Jul 05th 2016
21
I can tell you didn't listen to Undisclosed
Jul 06th 2016
23
You mean if I listened to the Podcast produced by the Adnan Syed Trust,
Jul 06th 2016
27
      lol@"the only logical conclusion is that he did it"
Jul 06th 2016
34
      I read a summary of the information presented.
Jul 06th 2016
41
      so everyone who works for INNOCENCE PROJECTS is guilty
Jul 06th 2016
35
      Huh? That doesn't follow at all.
Jul 06th 2016
39
      the innocemce project is the wrong pillar of support
Jul 06th 2016
43
      right?! Undisclosed is complete bullshit
Jul 06th 2016
36
           yet they found all the evidence that actually got him a new trial.
Jul 06th 2016
37
                I think he deserves a new trial. Still think he did it.
Jul 06th 2016
40
                     that's where im at with it.
Jul 06th 2016
44
                          well he definitely deserves a new trial.
Jul 06th 2016
45
                               I've forgotten a lot of the detail. Here is a summary that kind of nail...
Jul 06th 2016
47
                               for me the smoking gun is Jay knowing where the car/Hae was at
Jul 06th 2016
48
                                    as i said, there's some indications that Jay just happened upon her car....
Jul 06th 2016
49
Jay did it, Adnan isn't going to point the finger for one simple reason:...
Jul 06th 2016
26
He deserves a new trial n/m
Jul 06th 2016
24
He does but how do you put on an adequate trial after 15+ years?
Jul 06th 2016
42
      i won't be surprised if the state tries to get him to take an Alford ple...
Jul 06th 2016
46
funny i know nothing about this and live/work 2 mins away
Jul 06th 2016
28
He did that shit.
Jul 06th 2016
50

infin8
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Fri Jul-01-16 11:40 AM

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1. "I'm lost"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          


I don't know what the fuck this is about...who this dude is...or why this shit matters.

I DID hear on NPR this morning, how it may bring about 'open source' prosecution/defense because so many fans are finding evidence, leads and discrepancies to either prove or disprove this dude's innocence.

That I find quite interesting. Where SoWhat at? How does this work/translate in court cases. Can the prosecution have this stuff admitted into evidence as long as it's shared with the other side.

IG: amadu_me

"...Whateva, man..." (c) Redman

  

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tomjohn29
Member since Oct 18th 2004
16802 posts
Fri Jul-01-16 11:57 AM

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2. "He was the subject of the first Serial Podcast "
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

the podcast rexamined his case and some of the mistakes in the investigation and trial
probably one of the most listened podcast series of the last few years

______________________________________

Navem nu, cuando sol
Tutu nu, vondo nos nu
Vita em, no continous non
Nos nu ekta nos sepe ta, amen

When the sun shades the ship
We sweat and life is not safe
To swim or to touch not
When we unite we hedge amen

  

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janey
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123124 posts
Fri Jul-01-16 01:13 PM

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3. "Rabia Chaudry is my hero"
In response to Reply # 0
Fri Jul-01-16 01:16 PM by janey

  

          

She bird dogged this for YEARS

And as much as I liked Serial, I loved Undisclosed, maybe because it was three lawyers discussing evidence & legal matters in great detail, rather than a narrative.

Also, if you listened to Serial and loved it, you owe it to yourself to listen to the parody WHICH IS THE BEST PARODY EVAR. http://tinyurl.com/gpmg36r


~ ~ ~
All meetings end in separation
All acquisition ends in dispersion
All life ends in death
- The Buddha

|\_/|
='_'=

Every hundred years, all new people

  

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PROMO
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Fri Jul-01-16 01:42 PM

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4. "that's the ONE thing that bugs me about this whole thing..."
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

i mean, credit Sarah Koenig for getting this exposure, but at the end of it all Serial was more or less like "well, we think he's innocent but he COULD be guilty, * shrug * "

Undisclosed did all the heavy lifting and actually uncovered the evidence that got Adnan a new trial (and if justice prevails he'll never be "guilty" again - although states hate to lose and they'll probably take him to trial again). However, when the media reports on this they rarely mention Undisclosed and give the credit to Koenig.

To my previous comment: i wonder if the state actually WILL take this case on again. not sure if they've commented on their intentions yet. i think the evidence clearly shows beyond a reasonable doubt that he didn't do it now that it's been properly purported and analyzed so i wonder if the state bothers again.

  

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janey
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Fri Jul-01-16 01:52 PM

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5. "Chaudry actually credits Susan Simpson"
In response to Reply # 4


  

          

https://twitter.com/rabiasquared/status/748616766557937664

I would have normally said that the prosecutor wouldn't just give this up (there have been too many cases of prosecutors digging their heels in after DNA evidence established *actual* innocence on the idea that actual innocence isn't legal innocence ARGH), but I gather that the ruling kills any possibility of conviction. Haven't read the order yet, but I intend to soon....

~ ~ ~
All meetings end in separation
All acquisition ends in dispersion
All life ends in death
- The Buddha

|\_/|
='_'=

Every hundred years, all new people

  

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Ryan M
Member since Oct 21st 2002
43743 posts
Sat Jul-02-16 06:03 PM

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6. "Shoulda never been convicted but he did it tho"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

------------------------------

17x NBA Champions

  

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PROMO
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Sat Jul-02-16 06:18 PM

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7. "but he didn't tho."
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

  

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Amritsar
Member since Jan 18th 2008
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Sat Jul-02-16 06:59 PM

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8. "^^^^^^^^^"
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

  

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Cold Truth
Member since Jan 28th 2004
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Sun Jul-03-16 12:40 PM

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15. "I'm curious what evidence you think points to that conclusion"
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

After listening to Serial, Undisclosed, and Crimewriters on Serial I don't see anything to form that conclusion, but an awful pointing away from him.

  

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Ryan M
Member since Oct 21st 2002
43743 posts
Wed Jul-06-16 09:14 AM

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29. "Honestly, I've only listened to Serial and not since its release. "
In response to Reply # 15


  

          

Didn't really have the time to get into the other stuff. I don't have specifics - just what I thought at the time I listened.

------------------------------

17x NBA Champions

  

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Cold Truth
Member since Jan 28th 2004
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Wed Jul-06-16 09:23 AM

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32. "Undisclosed pretty much destroys the case against him"
In response to Reply # 29


  

          

  

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Amritsar
Member since Jan 18th 2008
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Sat Jul-02-16 07:00 PM

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9. "congrats to that murderer "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

only feelings I have about this is for HML's family

  

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PROMO
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10. "question: how do you figure that he killed her?"
In response to Reply # 9


  

          

there's literally no evidence that says he did, and now he actually has an alibi for his whereabouts who should have been in consideration all along were it not for the shoddy (that's being generous) work of his lawyer.

http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/features/serial-subject-adnan-syed-4-key-pieces-of-evidence-explained-20160701?page=5

i mean, her new boyfriend, Don, killed her if anyone that's actually been brought up in Serial/Undisclosed/etc. did

http://www.thefrisky.com/2015-10-12/serial-update-we-need-to-talk-about-haes-boyfriend-don/

  

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Amritsar
Member since Jan 18th 2008
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Sun Jul-03-16 09:25 AM

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13. "here are my reasons: "
In response to Reply # 10
Sun Jul-03-16 09:28 AM by Amritsar

  

          

1. The Stats.

I read the comment below mine about how its rare to have a sociopathic charming killer in cases like this. I get that. But there's also the stat that over 90% of women are killed by someone they know - especially by an ex partner. By far, the most reasonable explanation about what happened to HML is an argument occurred between her and Adnan that escalated to him strangling her. I see people bring up Don. ANd I suppose that's also fair. But for known motives. Adnan is the most obvious person with motive to kill her.


2. Absurdity of a police conspiracy.

Without a doubt the police lead aspects of this case and interrogation. They had an uncooperative suspect (Jay) that they had to make cooperative. But to believe they coerced Jay’s testimony in its entirety, you have to believe they also coerced Jen’s testimony as well. You have to believe that something as substantial as finding Hae’s car was hidden from her family. You have to discount incriminating cell phone evidence, most notably the Leakin Park cell phone pings. You have to develop wild theories about how all corroborating testimony was incorrectly attributed as having occurred on Jan 13th. etc. Is all of this possible? Yes. We live in a multiverse after all. Is it reasonable? No. Any reasonable outside observer can see that the odds that Jay was not involved directly in the burial (and tangentially the murder) of Hae Min Lee are remote. And if Jay is involved, any reasonable person would have to conclude Adnan is by far the most likely perpetrator of the murder. Just as any reasonable person would find Jay and probably Jen, as involved as accessories after the fact.



3. Cell Phone Pings

Especially the Leakin Park cell pings. You know, when Adnan SAYS HE HAD HIS PHONE. Enough said.


4. Adnan's lies

Lied about him and HML getting back together.This was a lie Adnan told the School nurse on the day the news broke that Hae’s body had been found. He claimed to have spoken to Hae the night before she disappeared and told the nurse that Hae “had wanted to get back together with him, that she still loved him, but that he didn’t want to get back into the relationship in that manner — that they would always be friends.” What I find most chilling about this is thats probably what HML said to him before he strangled her. There are of course other damning lies. Lying about asking Hae for a ride on the day of the murder (witnessed by two separate credible witnesses and confirmed by Adnan to a police officer the same day). Lying about his car being unavailable when asking for the rid. Lying about how he wasn’t bothered by their breakup. Lying about where he was and it not matching up with cell tower evidence. Stealing from the community Mosque donations. etc.


5. HML's letters and diary entries describing Adnan not taking the breakup well.

6. Adnan claiming no memory of the day.

Okay this one I'm willing to give a bit more leeway on. But something about it still troubles me. I would like to think getting a call from the police about a close friend and ex lover disappearing would be cause for that day to stand out. Adnan claims he remembers pretty much nothing about that "ordinary" day. Suspect as hell that he never tries to contact her from that point on. Obviously because he knew she was dead.

Other things that would make the day memorable: One of his best friend's birthdays. His first full day of having a cell phone (in the 90s). Honors student 40 minutes late to class.


7. The Nisha call

Yes. Yes, I know butt dial. Thats reasonable to believe in and of itself. Its also reasonable to believe he made that call as an alibi for his whereabouts.



For the record, I was in the Adnan is innocent camp my first listen to the Serial. But the more I looked into it and considered everything - I swung toward guilty. One more thing:

It takes an astronomical leap by Jay to put himself with the fucking body but accuse Adnan of killing her. Think about it for a second.
Why 6 weeks later would he admit to a damming connection to the murder and randomly accuse Adnan with the risk of him having an alibi and completely screwing himself over. Jay knew Adnan had track after school. Adnan was a popular guy who people would remember if he were around, if he went somewhere with security cameras there's an easy record of that. Jay either had to A) be with Adnan B) know Adnan was the one that killed Hae or C) threw an 80 yard hail Mary pass that somehow worked that one of the most popular kids at school with an extra curricular activity that day can't be confirmed to be with anyone after school when the murder happened. One solid alibi witness and Jay has just screwed himself with a slam dunk murder charge, but not one has ever materialized. Which of those choices are likely?

  

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PROMO
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14. "yeah, you must not have read any links i posted..."
In response to Reply # 13
Sun Jul-03-16 11:48 AM by PROMO

  

          

or done any research post-Serial.

as i said, there's literally no physical evidence that says Adnan did this, and he now has an alibi who would have been an alibi the WHOLE time had his lawyer done her job.

you're right, a large number of women are killed by lovers, ex-lovers, etc. and that's true in this case as well. Don, her boyfriend at the time of her disappearance, killed her and if you don't think that after the conspiracy he and his moms (both of them) cooked up then i don't know what to tell you.

i mean, i'm not trying to be dismissive of you but if you're still talking cell tower ish and diary ish then i'm not gonna waste time debating you because you aren't playing with a full deck (i mean you literally aren't using the full facts). the cell phone tower evidence as they used to convict him has been thrown out because the police/prosecution lied about it AND completely didn't know how to read it and was a violation of Adnan's rights.

the reason Jay put himself in the crime is because he was scared and the police fed him the story and he repeated it (as many people do with false confessions), and if you'd do the research you'd know this as well.

  

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Cold Truth
Member since Jan 28th 2004
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Sun Jul-03-16 12:55 PM

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16. "Nobody still citing cell tower pings is worth discussing this with"
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

On any level.

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
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Wed Jul-06-16 08:45 AM

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25. "I don't think you're paying attention..."
In response to Reply # 16


  

          

the cell phone tower pings is like 75% of the reason why he's getting a retrial. So are you saying it's not worth discussing to the judge (who looked at THIS particular evidence and vacated the conviction) or the lawyers who have to defend or support this evidence on the cellphone pings?

Jay completely lied the WHOLE entire time. If anything, I'd believe Jay did it by himself because he loved Hae and wanted her for himself. But NO one talks about the crush Jay had on Hae. Nothing he said was truthful and I don't know why anyone buys it. There was no evidence that Adnan did it and him not remembering the day is because there was nothing remarkable to him about the day. If ANYTHING a murderer would work harder to remember a day they killed someone so they wouldn't get caught up.

  

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Brew
Member since Nov 23rd 2002
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Wed Jul-06-16 09:20 AM

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30. "Uh - he was agreeing with you."
In response to Reply # 25


          

>the cell phone tower pings is like 75% of the reason why he's
>getting a retrial. So are you saying it's not worth discussing
>to the judge (who looked at THIS particular evidence and
>vacated the conviction) or the lawyers who have to defend or
>support this evidence on the cellphone pings?

----------------------------------------

"Fuck aliens." © WarriorPoet415

  

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Cold Truth
Member since Jan 28th 2004
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Wed Jul-06-16 09:22 AM

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31. "LOL. You should probably pay more attention. You're way off. "
In response to Reply # 25


  

          

I don't think you've read anything I've said nor read the string of comments I was replying to.

Amristar cited cell phone pings as part of his reasoning for believing Adnan is guilty.

Since you’re clearly not paying attention, here’s his comment:

“Especially the Leakin Park cell pings. You know, when Adnan SAYS HE HAD HIS PHONE. Enough said.”
Promo responded. Since you’re obviously not paying attention, here’s his comment:

“If you're still talking cell tower ish and diary ish then i'm not gonna waste time debating you because you aren't playing with a full deck (i mean you literally aren't using the full facts).”

To which I responded, again, since you’re definitely not paying attention:

“Nobody still citing cell tower pings is worth discussing this with on any level”

Further up I asked Ryan what his reasoning was for believing Adnan to be guilty. Since you’re not paying attention to anything, here’s my comment:

“After listening to Serial, Undisclosed, and Crimewriters on Serial I don't see anything to form that conclusion, but an awful pointing away from him.”

I’ve followed the case with the three aforementioned podcasts, think a lot of the evidence points away from him, and don’t think it’s worth discussing this case with anyone still citing cell phone pings as evidence against Adnan….. and I’ve said as much. You should pay a little more attention next time.

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
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Wed Jul-06-16 03:34 PM

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38. "my bad. lol."
In response to Reply # 31


  

          

  

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dba_BAD
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Sat Jul-02-16 07:57 PM

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11. "you know what convinced me he aint do it more than anything?"
In response to Reply # 0


          

i forget who the interviewee was, some cop maybe, but they were making the point that 99.99% of the time, the ones who did it are either real insane, or real dumb - that the idea of the super smart, charming, perfect sociopath liar is largely a fiction. That resonated hella strongly with me

__

fairweather

  

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PROMO
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12. "they exist, but they are pretty rare.."
In response to Reply # 11


  

          

and they typically do a lot more grandiose murders than just choking their high school girlfriend and dumping the body.

look up the Luka Magnotta case, for example.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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Tue Jul-05-16 03:46 PM

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17. "I feel like there is only one logical conclusion, Adnan did it. "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

We know Jay was involved because Jay lead the police to the car. Jay implicates Adnan. If Adnan knows he didn't do it, he would have to conclude that Jay either did it or is involved.

And yet, Adnan says he doesn't know why Jay is implicating him or even suggests that Jay is the perpetrator.

There is no way an innocent Jay could take that position. There is only one reason Adnan wouldn't point the finger at Jay, because it would implicate himself.



>http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/01/us/serial-adnan-syed-new-trial.html?smprod=nytcore-iphone&smid=nytcore-iphone-share
>
>A judge in Maryland has granted a new trial to Adnan Syed,
>setting aside his conviction for the 1999 murder of his former
>girlfriend, in a case that was the subject of the first season
>of the hit podcast “Serial.”
>
>Mr. Syed’s lawyer, C. Justin Brown, posted the news on
>Twitter on Thursday afternoon and confirmed by phone that the
>motion for a new trial had been granted by Judge Martin P.
>Welch of the Baltimore City Circuit Court.
>
>The decision to grant Mr. Syed, 35, a retrial was a major
>victory for an inmate who has long maintained his innocence
>and has exhausted all other avenues of appeal. He was
>convicted in 2000 in the murder of his former girlfriend, Hae
>Min Lee, and had served 16 years of a life sentence.
>
>“Serial” turned speculation about Mr. Syed’s guilt and
>whether he had received a fair trial into something of a
>national pastime in 2014. The show was downloaded more than
>100 million times and won a Peabody Award for its role in
>illuminating flaws in the criminal justice system.
>
>At a news conference in Baltimore, Mr. Brown was asked if he
>thought there was any chance that the retrial could have come
>about without “Serial.”
>
>“I don’t think so,” he said.
>
>On the possibility that Mr. Syed may eventually go free, Mr.
>Brown said: “I’m feeling pretty confident right now. This
>was the biggest hurdle. It’s really hard to get a new
>trial.”
>
>Mr. Brown said that he had not been able to reach Mr. Syed to
>tell him the news.
>
>The family of Ms. Lee has expressed pain and outrage at the
>attention surrounding Mr. Syed’s bid for a new trial. In a
>statement in February, the family said, “It remains hard to
>see so many run to defend someone who committed a horrible
>crime, who destroyed our family, who refuses to accept
>responsibility, when so few are willing to speak up for
>Hae.”
>
>The Maryland Attorney General’s Office said in a statement
>Thursday night that it had a responsibility to keep pursuing
>justice and “to defend what it believes is a valid
>conviction.”
>
>Mr. Syed’s brother, Yusuf, 26, said in an interview on
>Thursday that the family had high hopes for a favorable
>decision, based on the strength of the legal arguments and the
>outpouring of support.
>
>“We really felt 100 percent that the judge would rule in our
>favor,” he said, adding, “We’ve been waiting 20 years
>for this.”
>
>Rabia Chaudry, a family friend of Mr. Syed’s who introduced
>Sarah Koenig, the host of “Serial,” to the case,
>celebrated the decision online, thanking the judge and
>witnesses, among others.
>
>A production manager for “Serial,” Emily Condon, declined
>to comment on Thursday.
>
>The judge’s decision came after three days of postconviction
>hearings in February. Mr. Syed and his legal team had
>presented new evidence, including the testimony of a new alibi
>witness, and argued that his original defense counsel had been
>grossly negligent.
>
>The post-trial proceedings were held before Judge Welch, a
>retired judge, who had granted Mr. Syed’s request for a
>hearing in November. Mr. Syed first filed a request for a
>postconviction hearing in 2010, but was denied.
>
>Mr. Syed’s defense had argued in February that the decision
>by Mr. Syed’s lawyer in the original trial, Maria Cristina
>Gutierrez, not to question a state’s expert, Abraham
>Waranowitz, about the reliability of evidence relating to
>cellphone towers constituted ineffective assistance.
>
>The judge’s decision to grant Mr. Syed a new trial turned on
>that issue. In a memo, Judge Welch wrote that Ms.
>Gutierrez’s failure to question Mr. Waranowitz “created a
>substantial possibility that the result of the trial was
>fundamentally unreliable.”
>
>Judge Welch also said in the memo that the substantial public
>interest in the case did not affect his decision.
>
>“Regardless of the public interest surrounding this case,
>the court used its best efforts to address the merits of
>petitioner’s petition for postconviction relief like it
>would in any other case that comes before the court;
>unfettered by sympathy, prejudice, or public opinion,” he
>wrote.
>
>Ms. Gutierrez was a prominent Baltimore defense lawyer in the
>1990s whose career crumbled in 2001 when she was disbarred by
>consent after a state commission uncovered financial
>improprieties involving her clients. She told The Baltimore
>Sun at the time that her legal practice suffered in part
>because of her severe medical problems related to multiple
>sclerosis. She died of a heart attack in 2004.
>
>On Thursday, hundreds of fans of “Serial” took to social
>media, some of them to celebrate and others to emphasize that
>they still believed Mr. Syed was guilty.
>
>The podcast recently ended its second season, which told the
>story of Bowe Bergdahl, an American soldier in Afghanistan who
>was captured by the Taliban in 2009 and released as part of a
>prisoner swap in 2014.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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PROMO
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18. "nope. guess again."
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

  

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Cold Truth
Member since Jan 28th 2004
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19. "There's a far more obvious and realistic reason for that. "
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

It would do him little good to implicate Jay unless he could carry the entire theory out from start to finish with compelling evidence. Otherwise it simply would look like he’s just trying to finger someone else.

There’s absolutely no merit to the notion that the “only” reason for Adnan to choose not to point the finger at Jay is that he’s somehow implicated. That’s nothing more than deductive reasoning with no real substance behind it.

The more logical reason is plainly obvious: there’s no real benefit to him unless he can make a significant case. What’s the point of offering something with no real benefit that could then only due harm to himself? If he points the finger at anyone up to and including Jay he’ll have to prove it but then that assumes he has the information to do so, which would have made all of this mute to begin with, which also means the other possibility is that he simply doesn’t have information to implicate Jay.

  

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PROMO
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20. "Also, there's some thought that..."
In response to Reply # 19


  

          

the reason Jay knew where her car was is simply because he stumbled upon it, not because he was involved.

And, if you believe he called the tip line for the reward (and the evidence seems to show this like 95% likely), then he simply said Adnan's name for the money.

Jay is like, one of the most coerced, constantly changing the narrative people i've ever seen. Nothing he says can be believed, unless you just wanna throw all logic and evidence out and believe him just because.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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22. "That's silly, and defense attorneys do it all.the.time. "
In response to Reply # 19


  

          

>It would do him little good to implicate Jay unless he could
>carry the entire theory out from start to finish with
>compelling evidence. Otherwise it simply would look like
>he’s just trying to finger someone else.
>
>There’s absolutely no merit to the notion that the
>“only” reason for Adnan to choose not to point the finger
>at Jay is that he’s somehow implicated. That’s nothing
>more than deductive reasoning with no real substance behind
>it.
>
>The more logical reason is plainly obvious: there’s no real
>benefit to him unless he can make a significant case.


No. He doesn't have to make a signficant case. He doesn't have to prove anything. All he has to do is create reasonable doubt. He doesn't have to know how he did it. Why he did it or any of the details.

All it would take is point out all the inconsistencies in Jay's stories and point out that Jay had information that only a person involved with the killing would know.


Watch what they do in this retrial. It's going to be all about Jay.


What’s
>the point of offering something with no real benefit that
>could then only due harm to himself? If he points the finger
>at anyone up to and including Jay he’ll have to prove it but
>then that assumes he has the information to do so, which would
>have made all of this mute to begin with, which also means the
>other possibility is that he simply doesn’t have information
>to implicate Jay.
>


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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Cold Truth
Member since Jan 28th 2004
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33. "Defense attorneys. Not Adnan. "
In response to Reply # 22


  

          

He could do that until he's blue in the face but it wouldn't have changed anything. His attorneys need to lay the groundwork for that.

Jay's testimony has no credibility whatsoever. The retrial will obviously focus a lot on Jay but Adnan himself pointing fingers at Jay wouldn't do him any favors.

  

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GOMEZ
Member since Feb 13th 2003
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21. "based off of the Serial podcast, i can see how you might say that"
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

but i've been catching up on Undisclosed, and I put the odds of Adnan being the one who did it as pretty low - like less than a 5% chance that it was him. And if it was him, then I have no idea when and how he did it - and neither does anyone who actually thinks he did it.







In a generation of swine, the one-eyed pig is king.
-Hunter S. Thompson

  

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DVS
Member since Sep 13th 2002
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23. "I can tell you didn't listen to Undisclosed"
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

it's impossible to come away from that podcast and thing Adnan was the murderer. It just isn't. Too many facts are completely broken down to the most minute detail.

D

vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv

Waldorf and Statler Vol 4:CONAN IS OUT NOW!!!: http://waldorfandstatler.bandcamp.com

and don't forget to check "DVS 4 ALDERMAN"

http://windimoto.bandcamp.com/album/dvs-4-alderman-bandcamp-exclusive-expanded-editio

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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27. "You mean if I listened to the Podcast produced by the Adnan Syed Trust,"
In response to Reply # 23


  

          

I'd be convinced he was innocent? Go figure.


>it's impossible to come away from that podcast and thing
>Adnan was the murderer. It just isn't. Too many facts are
>completely broken down to the most minute detail.
>
>D


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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Cold Truth
Member since Jan 28th 2004
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Wed Jul-06-16 09:32 AM

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34. "lol@"the only logical conclusion is that he did it""
In response to Reply # 27


  

          

There's nothing sillier than a conclusion based on silly deductive reasoning that didn't include all the available information as you mock a credible additional source of information.

It's telling that you dismiss it based on it being the "Adnan Trust" and not based on the actual information it presents.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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41. "I read a summary of the information presented. "
In response to Reply # 34


  

          

I couldn't see myself devoting another 10+ hours to this case than I already have so I checked out this summary.

http://www.ew.com/article/2015/08/24/5-key-finding-undisclosed-serial-adnan-syed

It was stuff I had all seen in different places. None of it really convinced me that he didn't do it (more than anything in pointed to a sloppy investigation). Is there something else to consider?

However, I imagine that if you listen to 10+ hours of advocacy that Adnan Syed is innocent you are 1) probably inclined to believe he is innocent and/or 2) will by the end conclude that he didn't do it.



>There's nothing sillier than a conclusion based on silly
>deductive reasoning that didn't include all the available
>information as you mock a credible additional source of
>information.
>
>It's telling that you dismiss it based on it being the "Adnan
>Trust" and not based on the actual information it presents.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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DVS
Member since Sep 13th 2002
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35. "so everyone who works for INNOCENCE PROJECTS is guilty"
In response to Reply # 27


  

          

....I mean...if that's the reasoning we are using, why the hell did they let Rubin Carter out of prison?

Have fun with that.

D

vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv

Waldorf and Statler Vol 4:CONAN IS OUT NOW!!!: http://waldorfandstatler.bandcamp.com

and don't forget to check "DVS 4 ALDERMAN"

http://windimoto.bandcamp.com/album/dvs-4-alderman-bandcamp-exclusive-expanded-editio

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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39. "Huh? That doesn't follow at all. "
In response to Reply # 35


  

          

The more apropos comparison would be deciding that a person is innocent only after hearing an Innocence Project defense without at all hearing the case against a defendant.




>....I mean...if that's the reasoning we are using, why the
>hell did they let Rubin Carter out of prison?
>
>Have fun with that.
>
>D


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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shygurl
Member since Oct 08th 2002
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43. "the innocemce project is the wrong pillar of support"
In response to Reply # 35


          

They supported Justin Wolfe who very recently came out and confessed his part in a murder that they were championing against.

  

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Amritsar
Member since Jan 18th 2008
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36. "right?! Undisclosed is complete bullshit "
In response to Reply # 27


  

          

I tried listening, but was done after that the episode 3 "Tap tap" shit


lol at anyone taking that seriously.

  

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PROMO
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37. "yet they found all the evidence that actually got him a new trial."
In response to Reply # 36


  

          

man, y'all sheeple are real.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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40. "I think he deserves a new trial. Still think he did it. "
In response to Reply # 37


  

          


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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shygurl
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44. "that's where im at with it."
In response to Reply # 40


          

75% leaning towards he did it, but I do think he deserved another trial.

  

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PROMO
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45. "well he definitely deserves a new trial."
In response to Reply # 44


  

          

i just don't understand the logic of the "i still think he did it" group.

like, what would lead you to still think he's the murderer? lack of another suspect? gut reaction? nothing factual supports that idea, so i'm curious.

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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47. "I've forgotten a lot of the detail. Here is a summary that kind of nail..."
In response to Reply # 45


  

          

"Hae was likely killed in her vehicle after school before she could get to her cousin's school. Her ex-boyfriend Adnan has no credible alibi for this period of time and claims he can remember nothing about it. But we do know from his own words on that day that he at least intended to be in her vehicle for a ride at that time. Then he lied about that to detectives twice in the weeks to follow, distancing himself from what he said that day with two different lies. On the day Hae was murdered, Adnan lent his car and phone to a guy who later admitted involvement in burying her and ditching her car (which required a second person), and he and Adnan were together or in touch off and on from about 10:45 a.m. to after 8 p.m. that day."

Like I said, we all know Jay was involved. We know Adnan spent the day with Jay. Adnan says he doesn't know anything about Jay's involvement. That equals to me Adnan was involved and is lying about it.





>i just don't understand the logic of the "i still think he
>did it" group.
>
>like, what would lead you to still think he's the murderer?
>lack of another suspect? gut reaction? nothing factual
>supports that idea, so i'm curious.
>
>


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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shygurl
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48. "for me the smoking gun is Jay knowing where the car/Hae was at"
In response to Reply # 45


          

The pings, the Nisha call, Best Buy telephone, none of that concerns me. If he didn't do it, how did Jay know where the car was at?

And I guess most would say why isn't Jay the focus then, but why would Jay kill Hae? Motive matters, and while I could definitely see Jay as an accessory to the murder, the motive is not there for him to take her life.

  

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PROMO
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49. "as i said, there's some indications that Jay just happened upon her car...."
In response to Reply # 48
Wed Jul-06-16 05:28 PM by PROMO

  

          

which is why he was able to tell the cops where it was (although if memory serves me he got the street right but the EXACT location wrong and if that's right that's definitely more of an indication he ran across it vs. being involved - probably not gonna forget that if you just helped bury a body then ditch the car).

as far as Jay knowing where the body was: it's not like he led the cops to the body. once the cops got to the body, everyone knew where the body was.

everything he told the police about what he and adnan did to ditch/bury the body is factually incorrect.

  

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StephBMore
Member since Sep 11th 2014
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26. "Jay did it, Adnan isn't going to point the finger for one simple reason:..."
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

He doesn't know 100% for sure Jay did and his faith won't allow him to indict someone without knowing the truth.

Adnan the whole time doesn't blame anyone for his current situation at all, which is why he's not putting anything on Jay. Even if he thinks it's Jay, it's no benefit to him to say it's him because it still looks like they both did it.

  

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stattic
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24. "He deserves a new trial n/m"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

  

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Buddy_Gilapagos
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42. "He does but how do you put on an adequate trial after 15+ years?"
In response to Reply # 24


  

          

I feel like all witness testimony would be useless now.


**********
"Everyone has a plan until you punch them in the face. Then they don't have a plan anymore." (c) Mike Tyson

"what's a leader if he isn't reluctant"

  

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PROMO
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46. "i won't be surprised if the state tries to get him to take an Alford ple..."
In response to Reply # 42


  

          

or just does a nolle prosequi motion.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nolle_prosequi#Notable_cases

because, according to Undisclosed most recent episode, if they retry Adnan, his lawyers are going to call the former prosecutor as a witness and utterly destroy him. the state won't want that.

  

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ambient1
Member since May 23rd 2007
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Wed Jul-06-16 09:05 AM

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28. "funny i know nothing about this and live/work 2 mins away"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

from all of this

I only heard bits n pieces....

but I skimmed thru this post and seen something about Leakin Park


if that's where they found the remains then indian yo ain't do it

=======================================
Coolin...

  

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bski
Member since Jun 09th 2002
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Wed Jul-06-16 07:17 PM

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50. "He did that shit."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Deserves the new trial though.


http://twitter.com/collazo

  

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