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Subject: "Have you ever experienced racism arboad?" Previous topic | Next topic
Lardlad95
Member since Jul 31st 2002
66340 posts
Sat Mar-21-15 04:44 AM

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"Have you ever experienced racism arboad?"


  

          

My brother and his wife are in Italy right now on their honeymoon, and while things went great in Rome, Sicily has been pretty damn racist. He says that every time they're seated at a table the people next to them roll their eyes, scoff, etc. What's funny is most of the other tourists in Sicily are Greek and my brother and sister-in-law pull in enough money to buy half of their fucking country.

My brother is especially disappointed because he was born in Sicily and he wanted his homecoming to be special.

Personally I've got no interest in Europe outside of England and Ireland...maybe Spain. Really I want to go to Ghana, Nigeria, and Mali...and I'm sure whatever visions I have of returning to Africa will be shattered a few hours after getting off of the plane.

How about you?


"All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players:
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts..." -The Bard

  

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Topic Outline
Subject Author Message Date ID
i don't know what to call what we experienced in Morocco.
Mar 21st 2015
1
Man it sounds like you ran into every asshole in Morocco.
Mar 21st 2015
2
Were you traveling with the Starlord, by chance?
Mar 21st 2015
4
thats how some foreigners get treated coming here.
Mar 23rd 2015
62
Sicily pumpin that GOOD self hate. You get sickle cell too, Paolo.
Mar 21st 2015
3
They still mad at Hannibal
Mar 21st 2015
46
*dead*
Mar 21st 2015
47
LOOL
Mar 23rd 2015
63
in berlin
Mar 21st 2015
5
Yeah my mom said the same about Naples and my mom was light
Mar 21st 2015
6
Southern Italians really resent being conquered by Arabs.
Mar 21st 2015
9
i used to fuck with hostels pretty heavy when i travelled
Mar 21st 2015
7
Every Aussie women I've met has been cool. Every dude has been
Mar 21st 2015
10
YUP.
Mar 21st 2015
12
Funny, I've found Aussie's nothing but nice.
Mar 21st 2015
15
      back in my hostel days, I always kicked it with Aussies and Canucks
Mar 21st 2015
20
      Yep, Canucks too - really nice, friendly people.
Mar 21st 2015
23
      same here
Mar 23rd 2015
64
From traveling rarely
Mar 21st 2015
8
I might steal that technique.
Mar 21st 2015
11
When I went to Moscow, customs messed with me pretty hard
Mar 21st 2015
13
Moscow seems like it'd be MAD racist.
Mar 21st 2015
16
Only in mexico city
Mar 21st 2015
14
Chanate?
Mar 21st 2015
17
      Translates loosely to stink bug
Mar 21st 2015
24
           You're thinking mayate
Mar 21st 2015
27
                Aw, I mixed up the reference.
Mar 21st 2015
28
                lot of expats in DF from the States
Mar 23rd 2015
67
Yes, in Spain.
Mar 21st 2015
18
to be honest
Mar 21st 2015
19
went to france as a child
Mar 21st 2015
21
Id like to hear from more black women
Mar 21st 2015
22
racism? no. but the hollers can be much
Mar 21st 2015
26
      Your experience in Paris really stands out.
Mar 21st 2015
29
           maybe as a dude. lol. my brother had a much better time
Mar 21st 2015
30
                I really just cant believe that, that is actually a thing
Mar 21st 2015
32
                     varies
Mar 21st 2015
33
Sure, I swear racists have killer Jewdars, man. Austria, France, etc
Mar 21st 2015
25
What about the Gypsies? The Roma?
Mar 22nd 2015
53
      you mean racism by or against them?
Mar 23rd 2015
60
for me it was daily
Mar 21st 2015
31
Care to give a run down of your travels in Euroland?
Mar 21st 2015
34
      sure there's nowhere i really wouldn't recommend as a tourist
Mar 21st 2015
37
           tell me about berlin
Mar 21st 2015
42
                things have changed a lot
Mar 21st 2015
44
                     good stuff
Mar 22nd 2015
49
                          i'm too out of the loop lol
Mar 22nd 2015
52
Pretty much every place I've been.
Mar 21st 2015
35
Curious; are you darkskinned?
Mar 21st 2015
36
      Darkness
Mar 21st 2015
38
      I don't think it's just colorism
Mar 21st 2015
39
We treat our negros good
Mar 21st 2015
40
Everywhere except the Motherland.
Mar 21st 2015
41
In Trinidad
Mar 21st 2015
43
same shit happens in every former british colony
Mar 21st 2015
45
My best friend is from Trinidad
Mar 23rd 2015
68
      I'm from there.
Mar 23rd 2015
72
Paris has always been really good or bad, Dubai was horrible
Mar 22nd 2015
48
What happened in Dubai?
Mar 22nd 2015
50
      Lol umm I wish I had the link to my post
Mar 22nd 2015
51
           i remember that....glad you got home safe
Mar 22nd 2015
58
only the "wzup my nigGA" variety
Mar 22nd 2015
54
i've been assumed to be a hooker several times
Mar 22nd 2015
55
the examples: i was basically asked to leave a hotel
Mar 22nd 2015
56
Racism in China is weird and I know because I lived there in Beijing.
Mar 22nd 2015
57
don't sound that much different that living in San Francsico lol
Mar 23rd 2015
69
The racial fetishization I experienced in Spain was stunning.
Mar 22nd 2015
59
everyone tells me horror stories about italy
Mar 23rd 2015
61
Italy was fine for the most part, it's Naples that is on some other shit
Mar 23rd 2015
65
not personally.
Mar 23rd 2015
66
I thought so at the time, not sure in retrospect (Japan; I'm white)
Mar 23rd 2015
70
probably
Mar 23rd 2015
71

-DJ R-Tistic-
Member since Nov 06th 2008
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Sat Mar-21-15 04:53 AM

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1. "i don't know what to call what we experienced in Morocco. "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

It was just weird. Going there as a layover before Ghana was cool, and we left for a day and experienced the city. But coming back was a horrible day. Ghana customs were already being asses, and Morocco was even worse. We had an 8 hour layover, yet we tried to leave for a whole hour and weren't allowed to. Every person we asked would lead us in a different direction, then someone finally told us to ask the police. They were like "where are you headed? Oh you're American? What time is your flight? Seven hours from now? No, you can't keave, you don't won't have enough time to get back. And it's too expensive. So no, stay here."

We just wanted to leave to get good food, because the shit in the airport was hoooooorrible, and I didn't have much money to gamble and get more stuff since they weren't taking my credit cards. At one store, the lady was a complete ass, giving attitude about everything for no reason.

Customs was a joke, too. I remember them taking out my manager's iPod and saying "what is this? Is it real? Does it really play music?" and they for real plugged her headphones in and made her play a song. I was ready for them to ask what artist it was..dude really put the headphones on for five seconds.

So I feel it may have been more anti-American than anything, but it was just a weird day period.

------------------------------

50+ FREE Mixes on www.DJR-Tistic.com!

Twitter and Instagram - @DJ_RTistic

  

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Lardlad95
Member since Jul 31st 2002
66340 posts
Sat Mar-21-15 04:59 AM

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2. "Man it sounds like you ran into every asshole in Morocco."
In response to Reply # 1
Sat Mar-21-15 05:01 AM by Lardlad95

  

          

Yeah that sounds anti-American at worst or like a poorly run airport at worst.

"All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players:
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts..." -The Bard

  

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Doronmonkflake
Member since Jan 10th 2007
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Sat Mar-21-15 05:39 AM

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4. "Were you traveling with the Starlord, by chance? "
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

http://wac.450f.edgecastcdn.net/80450F/comicsalliance.com/files/2014/02/Screen-Shot-2014-02-19-at-2.33.06-PM.jpg

Da bayball, babeh. (c) Charlie Kelly.

  

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GirlChild
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Mon Mar-23-15 12:33 AM

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62. "thats how some foreigners get treated coming here. "
In response to Reply # 1


  

          

  

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Doronmonkflake
Member since Jan 10th 2007
11078 posts
Sat Mar-21-15 05:36 AM

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3. "Sicily pumpin that GOOD self hate. You get sickle cell too, Paolo."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Da bayball, babeh. (c) Charlie Kelly.

  

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Atillah Moor
Member since Sep 05th 2013
13825 posts
Sat Mar-21-15 08:21 PM

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46. "They still mad at Hannibal"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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guru0509
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Sat Mar-21-15 08:35 PM

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47. "*dead*"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

-------------------
I wanna go to where the martyrs went
the brown figures on the walls of my apart-a-ment...

  

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Government Name
Member since Dec 16th 2005
23190 posts
Mon Mar-23-15 08:21 AM

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63. "LOOL"
In response to Reply # 3


  

          

________
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http://instagram.com/aehorton

  

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Crash Bandacoot
Member since May 13th 2003
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Sat Mar-21-15 06:16 AM

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5. "in berlin"
In response to Reply # 0
Sat Mar-21-15 06:37 AM by Crash Bandacoot

          

lots of stares but, wouldn't call it 'cism. i think it was mostly
because they don't see many blacks in the area that i was
visiting. if they did say some shit, i couldn't understand what
they were saying because my german is limited. i've heard
stories about neo nazis in areas east of berlin, so i had to be
mindful when i was near those areas.

munich has many more blacks. overall, germany wasn't as racist
as i expected it to be in the time that i was there. i plan to go
back in the summer.

hell, in one of the museums that i visited in amsterdam, had a
an entire hall dedicated to the black power movement and
apartheid, never seen shit like that displayed before in the
states.

not saying that these countries, in general, are not racist but,
surprisingly i didn't experience any when i was there.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
instagram:
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"There is much temptation to use what has worked before,
even when it may exceed its effective scope."

"Roll me further bitch"

  

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blkprinceMD05
Member since Nov 29th 2004
41323 posts
Sat Mar-21-15 07:24 AM

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6. "Yeah my mom said the same about Naples and my mom was light"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Very light. I never went south of Rome and the only thing that happened to me is I got mistaken for gypsy in Florence once by this old lady. I don't recall experiencing any racism in France, Germany or the UK

prototype

stand ur ground, believe in urself,
believe in love, prepare urself for love, remove the negativity from ur life, and accept the love u kno u deserve

  

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Lardlad95
Member since Jul 31st 2002
66340 posts
Sat Mar-21-15 08:02 AM

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9. "Southern Italians really resent being conquered by Arabs."
In response to Reply # 6


  

          

They also probably feel bad about losing that war to Ethiopia.

"All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players:
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts..." -The Bard

  

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kayru99
Member since Jan 26th 2004
16105 posts
Sat Mar-21-15 07:32 AM

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7. "i used to fuck with hostels pretty heavy when i travelled"
In response to Reply # 0


          

Australian dudes ALWAYS had beef

I don't think they are used to large, assertive black people

  

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Lardlad95
Member since Jul 31st 2002
66340 posts
Sat Mar-21-15 08:03 AM

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10. "Every Aussie women I've met has been cool. Every dude has been"
In response to Reply # 7


  

          

a fucking prick. And there are a lot of Aussies in this part of TN.

"All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players:
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts..." -The Bard

  

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kayru99
Member since Jan 26th 2004
16105 posts
Sat Mar-21-15 08:11 AM

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12. "YUP."
In response to Reply # 10


          

  

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spades
Member since Mar 22nd 2006
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Sat Mar-21-15 09:25 AM

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15. "Funny, I've found Aussie's nothing but nice."
In response to Reply # 7


  

          

I know they have a rep for being assholes but I've yet to get any static from them.

********************************

Get Out The Room!
http://getouttheroom.podomatic.com
@fakewilliamkatt

"You probably wouldn't worry about what people think of you if you could know how seldom they do!" - Olin Miller

  

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John Forte
Member since Feb 22nd 2013
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Sat Mar-21-15 11:04 AM

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20. "back in my hostel days, I always kicked it with Aussies and Canucks"
In response to Reply # 15


          

  

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spades
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Sat Mar-21-15 11:19 AM

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23. "Yep, Canucks too - really nice, friendly people."
In response to Reply # 20


  

          

********************************

Get Out The Room!
http://getouttheroom.podomatic.com
@fakewilliamkatt

"You probably wouldn't worry about what people think of you if you could know how seldom they do!" - Olin Miller

  

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Government Name
Member since Dec 16th 2005
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64. "same here"
In response to Reply # 15


  

          

________
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http://instagram.com/aehorton

  

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dafriquan
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8. "From traveling rarely"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Or maybe I'm having too much fun or too busy exploring to really notice.
(I don't count staring as racism)

However, everywhere I have LIVED I have experienced overt racism at some point.
But it's never been unbearable. Just occasional flashes of ignorance. I learned how to say "Fuck your mother" in a few languages for that reason... Lol



  

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Lardlad95
Member since Jul 31st 2002
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11. "I might steal that technique. "
In response to Reply # 8


  

          


"All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players:
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts..." -The Bard

  

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MEAT
Member since Feb 08th 2008
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Sat Mar-21-15 08:42 AM

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13. "When I went to Moscow, customs messed with me pretty hard"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Trying to get into the country. Then at the hotel one of the "doormen" followed me all the way to my room one night, that sucked.

I think customs in Japan was ass about me leaving the airport too.

------
“There is no fate that cannot be surmounted by scorn.” -Albert Camus

  

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spades
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Sat Mar-21-15 09:27 AM

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16. "Moscow seems like it'd be MAD racist."
In response to Reply # 13
Sat Mar-21-15 09:44 AM by spades

  

          

I've always wanted to go for the women, tho. Them eastern Europeans, man....

********************************

Get Out The Room!
http://getouttheroom.podomatic.com
@fakewilliamkatt

"You probably wouldn't worry about what people think of you if you could know how seldom they do!" - Olin Miller

  

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spades
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14. "Only in mexico city"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Heard a couple of "Chanate"'s and such. One dude got slick w/the tongue behind my back - being able to check a mf in their own language really helps, tho. It's one of the reasons I keep my travels down to latin america and the ocassional trip to Thailand - being completely unable to communicate is something that kinda scares me.

********************************

Get Out The Room!
http://getouttheroom.podomatic.com
@fakewilliamkatt

"You probably wouldn't worry about what people think of you if you could know how seldom they do!" - Olin Miller

  

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Hitokiri
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Sat Mar-21-15 10:52 AM

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17. "Chanate?"
In response to Reply # 14


  

          

I've never heard that word.

--

"You can't beat white people. You can only knock them out."

  

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spades
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Sat Mar-21-15 11:20 AM

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24. "Translates loosely to stink bug"
In response to Reply # 17


  

          

Black, stinky .... you get the gist. It's a Spanish slur for negros.

********************************

Get Out The Room!
http://getouttheroom.podomatic.com
@fakewilliamkatt

"You probably wouldn't worry about what people think of you if you could know how seldom they do!" - Olin Miller

  

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Hitokiri
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Sat Mar-21-15 11:58 AM

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27. "You're thinking mayate"
In response to Reply # 24


  

          

which is a little beetle.
I'm a spanish-speaker. And I've never heard chanate.
google says it's a chicano prison term... so i doubt you heard that in DF.

--

"You can't beat white people. You can only knock them out."

  

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spades
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Sat Mar-21-15 12:02 PM

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28. "Aw, I mixed up the reference."
In response to Reply # 27


  

          

No, I definitely heard it in DF - not something I'd forget. I've heard Mayate as well - In San Felipe - but only once and I've been MULTIPLE times.

I just google searched it as well - now I know what the loose translation actually is, so thanks for that.

********************************

Get Out The Room!
http://getouttheroom.podomatic.com
@fakewilliamkatt

"You probably wouldn't worry about what people think of you if you could know how seldom they do!" - Olin Miller

  

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T Reynolds
Member since Apr 16th 2007
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Mon Mar-23-15 11:46 AM

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67. "lot of expats in DF from the States"
In response to Reply # 27


  

          

I had a few issues in DF with people who had spent time in the States due to 'looking like I was from LA'

  

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Hitokiri
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18. "Yes, in Spain."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Barcelona night life.
Jamboree does not let niggas in. Despite being a "jazz club" known for playing hip hop.

--

"You can't beat white people. You can only knock them out."

  

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wrecknoble
Member since Mar 15th 2005
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Sat Mar-21-15 11:03 AM

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19. "to be honest"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

the only racism i've really felt was when traveling to the United States (i'm Canadian), and even that has been mild

i went to Greece last year and the people in Crete were hella friendly, i loved that place

Athens was a different story but it wasn't anything overtly racist, they are just hostile because their economy is in shambles. It was still an overall good atmosphere though.
It was me and one homie on the trip, and we got turned down at ONE club, probably because we were darker skinned, but we didn't care, the area we were in is their entertainment district so we just went club hopping to other places that sounded/looked good.

i try not to be very touristy when i'm traveling but i usually wear a NOZO Toronto hat and that tends to diffuse people with the quickness. "Oh you're from Toronto? How is it there?" or you get the "I love Canada/ppl from Canada". And questions about Drake. "Do you know Drake???" lol. That's usually from the girls though haha

---

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SHAstayhighalways
Member since Sep 03rd 2014
3696 posts
Sat Mar-21-15 11:09 AM

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21. "went to france as a child"
In response to Reply # 0
Sat Mar-21-15 11:11 AM by SHAstayhighalways

  

          

was called a gorilla at this sleep away camp we went to with our cousins
(it was a day camp but they'd sleep away for a weekend and we tagged along).
my french wasn't so great so i didn't know wtf they were saying
my sister had to explain it to me
(long story she thought they were calling us oreos. nighttripper recently explained there were no oreos in france until recently so they were probably calling us gorillas)
she told the camp counselor the kids were calling us names and they got in trouble.

also people kept asking us if we knew michael jackson. i don't know if it was because we
were BLACK and from america or if they woulda asked any american person that but i thought
that was the dumbest question. we were definitely asked at least 10 times by different kids
during our stay in france that summer.

haven't really been to many places outside of the country
and the places i have been are filled with black folks (the caribbean)
so that's the extent of my experience with racism abroad.

www.royallegacy.org

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SimplyHannah
Member since Aug 09th 2009
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Sat Mar-21-15 11:10 AM

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22. "Id like to hear from more black women"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Ive never experienced any but then again Ive only traveled to countries where the population was still largely black or African. Ive always wanted to go to Europe but sounds like I need to stay the away from there cause Id be done cussed somebody smoove the fuck out and landed myself in jail somewhere

  

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teefiveten
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Sat Mar-21-15 11:55 AM

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26. "racism? no. but the hollers can be much"
In response to Reply # 22
Sat Mar-21-15 11:57 AM by teefiveten

  

          

not in paris though. no hollers.
i was looking to be chose too!

reg and i got turned down at a club but we just pretended that we were back in 1999 new york and kept it moving. but i'm pretty sure it was b/c we were black or american. it was a 'hip hop' club too but doesn't mean you want black folks in the spot. otherwise it was fine. we would go to areas w/ mad bars and just drink. even if you don't smoke, i'd carry cigs. helps break the ice. lol.

but in italy everyone was nice and the italian men were trying to holler. i went to rome, venice, and florence.

london wasn't bad but i was there for work and a prick ass coworker based in london declared all the women and minorities from the US were there b/c of affirmative action. a fellow woman, korean american, cursed him out better than i ever could

i've been to egypt and got fondled
jamaica, the men are super aggressive

all these scenarios i wasn't travelling alone but i anticipate taking more trips alone in the future

there are a lot of resources out there for persons of color who travel on the internet. there are A LOT out there.

*************************************
like.me
http://tinyurl.com/3z8486u

"if the children are not initiated into the village they will burn it down just to feel its warmth." - african proverb

  

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spades
Member since Mar 22nd 2006
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Sat Mar-21-15 12:05 PM

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29. "Your experience in Paris really stands out."
In response to Reply # 26


  

          

I've heard they don't really mess w/negros but once they find out you're and AMERICAN Negro, shit really opens up for you.

********************************

Get Out The Room!
http://getouttheroom.podomatic.com
@fakewilliamkatt

"You probably wouldn't worry about what people think of you if you could know how seldom they do!" - Olin Miller

  

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teefiveten
Member since Oct 02nd 2008
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Sat Mar-21-15 12:19 PM

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30. "maybe as a dude. lol. my brother had a much better time"
In response to Reply # 29


  

          

he was there on his own for a month and seemed to have a better time

i was cramping his style lol

but we still had fun and I DJed 2 events out there. i was just shocked to get turned away from the 'posh' shit because even in nyc at this point i haven't been turned away from a party in over a decade.

*************************************
like.me
http://tinyurl.com/3z8486u

"if the children are not initiated into the village they will burn it down just to feel its warmth." - african proverb

  

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SimplyHannah
Member since Aug 09th 2009
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Sat Mar-21-15 12:44 PM

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32. "I really just cant believe that, that is actually a thing"
In response to Reply # 30


  

          

thought it was only in the movies. So what do they say? Like what is their reasoning? Nah you dont meet the dress code? lol

  

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teefiveten
Member since Oct 02nd 2008
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33. "varies"
In response to Reply # 32


  

          

the easiest thing to say is that it's a private party
meanwhile folks they know are filing in. lol

*************************************
like.me
http://tinyurl.com/3z8486u

"if the children are not initiated into the village they will burn it down just to feel its warmth." - african proverb

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
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Sat Mar-21-15 11:42 AM

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25. "Sure, I swear racists have killer Jewdars, man. Austria, France, etc"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Austrians didn't seem crazy about black folks either, they will stare a hole in you over there.

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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Shaun Tha Don
Member since Nov 19th 2005
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53. "What about the Gypsies? The Roma?"
In response to Reply # 25


          

Rest In Peace, Bad News Brown

  

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ConcreteCharlie
Member since Nov 21st 2002
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60. "you mean racism by or against them?"
In response to Reply # 53


  

          

And you will know MY JACKET IS GOLD when I lay my vengeance upon thee.

  

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samsara
Member since Sep 15th 2002
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Sat Mar-21-15 12:29 PM

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31. "for me it was daily"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

but i lived, worked, studied, traveled in euroland for a long time

for black americans traveling
it often boils down to
where you are (how local you go vs. touristy)
how well/badly you speak the language
how "african" (or pick whatever local oppressed group you might look like) people perceive you as

living there though
i find it hard to believe that one can manage that
i know people do, say they do
i've met a bunch of them (i've been treated better here than... xyz)
but sometimes it seems they are living on the outside of the society and are more like long-term tourists/in closed circles

"i fear no fate" e.e. cummings
"No girl. No fried chicken. I'm going back to get some sleep." - Haruki Murakami

  

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spades
Member since Mar 22nd 2006
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34. "Care to give a run down of your travels in Euroland?"
In response to Reply # 31


  

          

I'm curious as to what you would and wouldn't recommend.

********************************

Get Out The Room!
http://getouttheroom.podomatic.com
@fakewilliamkatt

"You probably wouldn't worry about what people think of you if you could know how seldom they do!" - Olin Miller

  

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samsara
Member since Sep 15th 2002
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Sat Mar-21-15 01:57 PM

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37. "sure there's nowhere i really wouldn't recommend as a tourist"
In response to Reply # 34


  

          

even though i'm super critical about racism, neocolonialsm
i haven't been to an area where i've asked if they think it's more dangerous than nyc and someone says yes - they usually say no and figure well if i survived growing up in nyc i'll live

it's definitely a balance on how much racism you want to encounter on your own vacation, whether you want to spend your hard-earned money in certain places that don't want your folks there but really most of that you can google nowadays and find a way to make it work by making contacts with people who actually live there

in europe i've lived in (from a couple of months to years):
paris
berlin
a small town called montbazon in the tours region
oxford

major areas i've visited i can think of right now:
dublin, kilkenny
london/oxford
south of france - cote d'azur, carcassonne/ aix-en-provence toulouse, marseille etc. south of france - atlantic, alsace-lorraine/strasbourg, normandy, bretagne, lyon, tours region
milan, rome, venice
barcelona, madrid, toledo, sevilla
berlin, hamburg, cologne, munich, dresden
amsterdam
lisbon
copenhagen
helsinki
prague
dubrovnik, split
athens
and the USSR when it still existed (moscow, leningrad, zagorsk as they were called then)

that's what i can think of in europe

"i fear no fate" e.e. cummings
"No girl. No fried chicken. I'm going back to get some sleep." - Haruki Murakami

  

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Crash Bandacoot
Member since May 13th 2003
10119 posts
Sat Mar-21-15 06:01 PM

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42. "tell me about berlin"
In response to Reply # 37
Sat Mar-21-15 06:05 PM by Crash Bandacoot

          

and germany in general, what was it like living there?
i've been to berlin and munich. berlin (didn't see
many blacks) seemed very vibrant and munich (more blacks)
more docile. i could see myself living in prenzlauer berg.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
instagram:
http://instagram.com/0kayndc

"There is much temptation to use what has worked before,
even when it may exceed its effective scope."

"Roll me further bitch"

  

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samsara
Member since Sep 15th 2002
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Sat Mar-21-15 08:00 PM

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44. "things have changed a lot "
In response to Reply # 42
Sat Mar-21-15 08:03 PM by samsara

  

          

since i lived there

*** anyone interested in living in germany for a bit i recommend looking into the bosch fellowship for young professionals with work experience - you don't have to speak german before applying and it's a great opportunity
http://culturalvistas.org/programs-for-students-and-professionals/professional-fellowships/robert-bosch-foundation-fellowship-program ****

my neighborhood in kreuzberg is now berlin-gentrified (which isn't as bad as nyc gentrified) but it does mean that people have moved farther out, fewer turkish people in that area, people who were living in prenzlberg are now moving to my old neighborhood with their spawn and basically thanks to other europeans, real estate is all gone
and of course 1/2 of brooklyn is always in and out of berlin thanks to the ny times
i was never a fan of prenzlberg but i do get why people like it

my first time in berlin was 99/00
and i generally loved the city on its own because it was so different to me, the insanity of the history and culture that people live with, which i was fascinated about esp in terms of black people in germany, the laid back lifestyle, low key in terms of social life, going out, the arts, and a crazy mix of all kinds of different people
quality of life is tops
amazingly green city
cost-wise great in terms of rent, beautiful apartments, cost of going out for a euro city, food
super family friendly which i really miss

i did not like being so far east in europe - winters suck, no sun, grey - if i hadn't decided to move back to n. america in 2007 i would've gotten one of those UV lamps the next winter

it's a relatively poor city and coupled with the multitude of people living there with income from elsewhere who take more from the city than give to it imo -- not a good mix. the local economy pretty much sucks so there are so many ppl who are either just committed to berlin, or freelancing, on fellowships, studying, but i'd guess rarely because a job brought them there - which explains the difference between berlin and the demographics of many other main centers in germany that have a core economic base. all of the major economic initiatives for the city have failed miserably.

i could never get used to going to insert whatever ethnic type concert/festival and it being mostly white folk but there's so much going on -- i say if you have the opportunity to visit, live, work, study, i can't imagine it being not worth it in the short term. but long term it's easy to start missing the diversity of other cities. i loved all of the small venues where i could see folks that were major to me but not of major interest to the general population, and the club life when i was there.

black folk - there's definitely black folk, africans, black germans, americans - the longer you are there, you get to know different groups, people. and great politically active groups, like adefra, isd, refugee rights groups, african student groups at the unis

i hate munich - maybe illogically - one of my best friends from college has lived there for i don't even know how many years (5+?) and i refuse to visit him so i'm the wrong person to ask about it lol if i had to pick a second city i had to live in it would probably be hamburg. i'm just not into the money, exclusivity side of major euro cities and in my mind that's munich.

i own property in germany so i go back often but i did move as soon as i had a child so my kid(s) wouldn't grow up in that environment or have to see me constantly fighting racism as an outsider. germany can barely address its own anti-semitic past, anti-immigrant present, so confronting anti-blackness generally is not even on the agenda. i still think about moving back though. integrating into german society versus hanging out with random group of international people... germany can be really tough. or it was for me - having a close friends group and family who were germans and the blatant racism, xenophobia with limited outlets to change things is draining as hell. i volunteered for awhile with refugees out in potsdam - housed in old military barracks - so i'm sure i also have way more personal/past the surface experience with racism, xenophobia in the berlin/potsdam area than the average american living there.


"i fear no fate" e.e. cummings
"No girl. No fried chicken. I'm going back to get some sleep." - Haruki Murakami

  

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Crash Bandacoot
Member since May 13th 2003
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49. "good stuff"
In response to Reply # 44
Sun Mar-22-15 12:17 PM by Crash Bandacoot

          

especially the bosch fellowship reference.

got any leads on up and coming areas in berlin? is kreuzberg
completely out of the question now? do most people own or rent
there?

i need to research hamburg a bit more, maybe even visit
this year.

and i can totally see the disdain for munich, seems cool if you
have a spouse/family but, if you're single it's not too much to
desire. i do like the fact that it's close to many other
surrounding hubs and the economy seems to be doing well. it
reminds me a lot of the area that i currently live in now,
rockville/bethesda maryland.

this is all very useful info, thanks a bunch.

>


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
instagram:
http://instagram.com/0kayndc

"There is much temptation to use what has worked before,
even when it may exceed its effective scope."

"Roll me further bitch"

  

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samsara
Member since Sep 15th 2002
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52. "i'm too out of the loop lol"
In response to Reply # 49


  

          

as i was leaving people were moving from kreuzberg to neukolln as a trend but that's probably a trend that's done and gone as well. areas becoming gentrified there isn't as abrupt a change to the feel of the neighborhood as it is here imo - it causes lots of displacement but the main character of the neighborhoods don't turn over so quickly. when i think of gentrification, i think of people selling entire buildings, new development, small shops closing down, big chains, etc. - there it seems like that people/trends are driving the displacement rather than corporate interests.

berlin is just no longer a super deal for renting like it used to be - anyone looking for that has to go further into eastern europe probably. but it's definitely still great compared to other major euro cities.

i'd always lived in different parts of kreuzberg - there are so many green spaces in between the landwehrkanal, hasenheide and viktoriapark... i still love the area. depending what city you are comparing with it may still be a decent rent...

most germans in berlin are renters. there used to be deals in terms of real estate in our area but everything was gone by the time we left.
if you look for the mietspiegel (published yearly?) you can get a clear picture of what the rent is in each area. i don't know if it's translated but you can probably figure it out regardless.

all of the other major centers will have a better economy, opportunities than berlin - munich is definitely a great travel base. if you are a creative and hustle though, berlin still seems like a place where you can make amazing things happen. if you find a decent job in munich though, like my friend, you can be traveling to italy, switzerland, eastern europe like every weekend. definitely explore hamburg, cologne, frankfurt, munich if you are looking for jobs. if you find the right job, you'll have enough vacation to spend all the time you want in berlin lol

"i fear no fate" e.e. cummings
"No girl. No fried chicken. I'm going back to get some sleep." - Haruki Murakami

  

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AFRICAN
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35. "Pretty much every place I've been."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

And I've been around.
Never let it stop me from traveling or enjoying myself though.

http://perspectivesudans.blogspot.com/
instagram:@3rdworldview
Blessed be the Lord /who believe any mess they read up on the message board

  

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spades
Member since Mar 22nd 2006
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36. "Curious; are you darkskinned?"
In response to Reply # 35


  

          

I've experienced VERY little racism, but I know I'm on the lighter side (NOT lightskinned, but I'm not darkskinned either) I wonder if it breaks down further based on regular ol' colorism.

********************************

Get Out The Room!
http://getouttheroom.podomatic.com
@fakewilliamkatt

"You probably wouldn't worry about what people think of you if you could know how seldom they do!" - Olin Miller

  

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AFRICAN
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38. "Darkness"
In response to Reply # 36


  

          

Definitely a factor.

http://perspectivesudans.blogspot.com/
instagram:@3rdworldview
Blessed be the Lord /who believe any mess they read up on the message board

  

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samsara
Member since Sep 15th 2002
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Sat Mar-21-15 02:11 PM

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39. "I don't think it's just colorism"
In response to Reply # 36


  

          

i think it's more nuanced than that
it's more about whether you appear to be within the power structure of the country

do people perceive you as african, caribbean and/or muslim and/or arab?
do they think you are a refugee/asylee/benefit taker?
it's most often color + perception

there are lots of places past the point where they just won't blatantly take black americans' money but it still exists



"i fear no fate" e.e. cummings
"No girl. No fried chicken. I'm going back to get some sleep." - Haruki Murakami

  

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Musa
Member since Mar 08th 2006
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Sat Mar-21-15 02:49 PM

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40. "We treat our negros good"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

This was 2000 on a tour bus full of black people in Amsterdam.

Old white lady was about to get her ass whipped.

<----

Soundcloud.com/aquil84

(HIP HOP)
http://aquil.bandcamp.com

  

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guru0509
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41. "Everywhere except the Motherland."
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Some places more than other.

The most vitriolic was in Naples though.

-------------------
I wanna go to where the martyrs went
the brown figures on the walls of my apart-a-ment...

  

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RexLongfellow
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Sat Mar-21-15 06:56 PM

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43. "In Trinidad"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Indian dudes hated me, but loved my lighter female cousins...stunned the hell out of me

My cousins had to explain that shit...I was getting really heated. Apparently there's some racial tension between Indians and Blacks down there

  

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guru0509
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45. " same shit happens in every former british colony"
In response to Reply # 43
Sat Mar-21-15 08:11 PM by guru0509

  

          

They took Indian "indentured servants" aka slaves to all their colonies, Kenya, South Africa, Uganda, Trinidad, etc

Naturally, when a bunch of crackers bring a new "minority' to your country and give them ALL jobs and treat you like a 2nd class citizen in your homeland, it builds resentment.

That tension has been passed on through the years. i kinda dont blame em for being angry


edit, its especially bad in South Africa from what people told me when I was in Joburg and Pretoria.

-------------------
I wanna go to where the martyrs went
the brown figures on the walls of my apart-a-ment...

  

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The3rdOne
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68. "My best friend is from Trinidad"
In response to Reply # 43


  

          

and he told me shit REALLY got bad when the Indians assumed control in the presidential elections back in the early 80's I think. The black population vowed to themselves never again to slack off voting. Since then them presidents been black. LOL

  

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Monkey Genius
Member since Mar 04th 2005
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Mon Mar-23-15 01:37 PM

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72. "I'm from there."
In response to Reply # 68


  

          

Let's just say the tension ain't as one-sided as a lotta us black folk want to make it out to be.

It's resentment vs. resentment.

----------------------------------
I have a webcomic: www.watchthecomic.com

My webcomic has a page: www.facebook.com/watchyourheadcomic

  

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ThisIs_ATruthThang
Member since Nov 16th 2003
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Sun Mar-22-15 11:46 AM

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48. "Paris has always been really good or bad, Dubai was horrible "
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

Rome was horrible too.
Egypt was cool besides them yelling out Obama!
Greece was amazing no complaints and Turkey was too.




Somebody's lying...

@Atruelady Twitter/ @Sweetesttaboos Instagram

  

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SimplyHannah
Member since Aug 09th 2009
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50. "What happened in Dubai?"
In response to Reply # 48


  

          

  

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ThisIs_ATruthThang
Member since Nov 16th 2003
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51. "Lol umm I wish I had the link to my post"
In response to Reply # 50


  

          

Basically they don't really fux with the black women over there too tough unless you're rich. Black women there are mostly african prostitutes. So getting into clubs was pretty rough and I unfortunately got my wallet taken with my passport. Horrible experience getting home.




Somebody's lying...

@Atruelady Twitter/ @Sweetesttaboos Instagram

  

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double negative
Member since Dec 14th 2007
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58. "i remember that....glad you got home safe"
In response to Reply # 51


  

          

***********************************************************
https://soundcloud.com/swageyph/yph-die-with-me

  

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southphillyman
Member since Oct 22nd 2003
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54. "only the "wzup my nigGA" variety"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

ppl begging me to teach them the "new usher dance" and dumb shit like that

~~~~~~

  

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blackrussian
Member since Oct 17th 2010
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55. "i've been assumed to be a hooker several times"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

in different countries (Spain, UAE, Cuba)

when someone asked where i was from & i said the UK, they said i didn't look like the right colour to be from there (Canada)

had an n-word joke told to me, in a deliberate attempt to be provocative. (Sweden)

that's all i can think of off the top of my head, although there have been less explicit occurrences. none of these things would/have stopped me from travelling.

  

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samsara
Member since Sep 15th 2002
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56. "the examples: i was basically asked to leave a hotel"
In response to Reply # 0


  

          

it was really upsetting
because there was no construing it anyway other than just racist
we were told that patrons complained of noises from our room on an evening where i wasn't feeling well. we'd stayed in the room and watched tv and went to sleep early. especially since it wasn't a high season period it was so insulting.

the next morning, we got a speech about community, told of the other people complaining and that they didn't want us at there. i was worried we'd be out on the street because it was a major holiday but we found somewhere right away.

there's always the negotiating benefits from being american vs. racist crap - often a way of relating to a black american person euros feel free to let you know that they like your kind of people but will be blatantly racist about another group of people as a way of informing you they are cool with you

i was invited to a brownface party by french people who got REALLY and foreseeably defensive when i told them that i was glad i was notified beforehand because otherwise i would've showed up thinking it was a KKK rally. i was amused that they really thought that if they explained that they were just imitating our mutual friend (of indian descent) that it was OK and i was just being a sensitive american

blackface/brownface at arts events, private gatherings

i've been refused entry to all kinds of places - awesome when you are meeting other friends and they were already let inside

i've had nigger yelled out from a truck driving by in england; had people yell at me for random ass things for no apparent reason, received blatant discriminatory treatment where all of the white people/tourists are getting one thing and surprise i get charged/receive something different

i've experienced a lot of employment discrimination in france because of my first and last name name/resume - i was a queen of getting interviews but clearly people in france expected someone quite different (a french/english "bicultural" white person) and I would never put my picture on my resume.

i've experienced really terrible treatment in all kinds of bureaucracy (before people figure out i'm american). i remember this school ID that had my name printed wrong and when I asked them to change it the woman told me that the name that was there was a fine name. I cut a picture of a black woman out of a magazine and put it in the ID for the entire year, no one noticed.

having taught in the university making sure teaching materials and resources were not racist was a huge thing, especially realizing that i was probably the only black teacher any of those students from diverse backgrounds had seen throughout their entire academic career and maybe would ever.

my favorite was the man who told me i COULD NOT be american because i was not the color of whitney houston because that's what all black americans look like. after that he propositioned me with some sort of offer of an S&M experience.

my senile grandmother-in-law rambling about the time the african came to the village for my benefit

i'm sure this is all more than the average tourist's experience but it's certainly not really rare. the more politically active, interested in a society you are, and look the part, the better you speak the language, the more likely you are to confront racist bullshit. if you stick to the tourist spots, stay in the international scene, you're often good.

"i fear no fate" e.e. cummings
"No girl. No fried chicken. I'm going back to get some sleep." - Haruki Murakami

  

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Kira
Member since Nov 14th 2004
28845 posts
Sun Mar-22-15 07:40 PM

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57. "Racism in China is weird and I know because I lived there in Beijing."
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They have a very western (obsession with white) fetish in their culture that's kind of subtle but surprising. I remember one of my friends showed me a job description and it wanted only a white expat. Best believe they're calling you nigga in their native language especially the hotel cleaning staff. It got so bad that I had to get payback because I'm me. You'll be fine if you have enough bread to give a different perception.

How was your experience living in China?

  

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The3rdOne
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Mon Mar-23-15 12:47 PM

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69. "don't sound that much different that living in San Francsico lol "
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Goldmind
Member since Oct 28th 2004
27522 posts
Sun Mar-22-15 10:43 PM

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59. "The racial fetishization I experienced in Spain was stunning. "
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My friends and I, all black men, went to Madrid and Barcelona last year. I'd assumed that Spaniards would be better than other Europeans about race, but they behaved like they had never been around black people before. The way that the white gay men expressed their sexual curiosity and thirst for our black bodies was brazen and, many times, disrespectful.

I had a much less creepy time in Paris, where there was more of a visible black community.

  

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GirlChild
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56000 posts
Mon Mar-23-15 12:31 AM

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61. "everyone tells me horror stories about italy"
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But that wasn't my experience at all. I lucked out.

I didn't really experience racism but I think my husband would say that he did when we were in Mauritius. A lot of that was negated bc we are American but I did hear ppl say some racist/privileged shit while we were there.

  

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guru0509
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Mon Mar-23-15 11:38 AM

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65. "Italy was fine for the most part, it's Naples that is on some other shit"
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-------------------
I wanna go to where the martyrs went
the brown figures on the walls of my apart-a-ment...

  

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SoWhat
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Mon Mar-23-15 11:42 AM

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66. "not personally."
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and my homegirl got treated like a celebrity in the streets of Paris. i mean, she's good looking but...not like that.

fuck you.

  

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lonesome_d
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Mon Mar-23-15 01:08 PM

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70. "I thought so at the time, not sure in retrospect (Japan; I'm white)"
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Obviously there is a ton of interest, both the good kind and the bad kind and everything in between, to be experienced there. I had a few less pleasant interactions but qlmost never where I felt I was being discriminated against for not being Japanese, except one time.

Group of us went into a restaurant while we were traveling. We made a habit of visiting yakitori places most nights and found one, I think in Beppu.

Guy behind the grill says in bad English "No, no! No English! No speak English!"
We counter with 'That's okay, we all speak Japanese...' and sit down.
He goes on with 'Go next door! Next door soup soba! Soup soba next door!' and mimics eating noodles with his hands.
We counter in Japanese with 'But... we want yakitori, not soba...'
At which point, if memory serves, he gives us the Batsu symbol (http://img-cdn.jg.jugem.jp/6e3/699825/20150110_1763122.jpg).

Naturally, we assumed that he didn't want to serve us because we were us. I'm ashamed that I lost my temper and stormed out.

In retrospect, there's every possibility that the guy had just closed or was out of food or fuel or whatever. While it would be somewhat prejudicial of him to refuse to recognize that he could actually communicate with us, you can also chalk that up to getting nervous in the presence of foreigners - something that does happen to people.

Still if any of those were the case, that communication should have been made in a much more conciliatory manner, not in a broken refusal to serve us.

I dunno.

-------
so I'm in a band now:
album ---> http://greenwoodburns.bandcamp.com/releases
Soundcloud ---> http://soundcloud.com/greenwood-burns

my own stuff -->http://soundcloud.com/lonesomedstringband

avy by buckshot_defunct

  

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Atillah Moor
Member since Sep 05th 2013
13825 posts
Mon Mar-23-15 01:32 PM

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71. "probably"
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______________________________________

Everything looks like Oprah kissing Harvey Weinstein these days

  

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