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> >I mean, at least debate against the right people. > >Many fans of Bonds simply suggest the following:: > >a)If you want to talk about *asterisks* or "fake records" >because of steroid use, then to be consistent, all records >before Jackie Robinson(at LEAST) should be erased or >asterisked. There isn't a sensible way to debate that records >made when the league banned people from the league based on >skin color are any more valid than records set with performing >enhanching drugs. Don't try, because you'll look like an >idiot. Trust me.
absolutely. but this is a concept so shocking that literally, many whites can't even wrap their heads around it. the idea that segregationist stats should be asterisked is something that has to be explained in an approachable manner. But tirades directed at yt are only going to harden the anti-asterisk stance.
that being said, just because other things should be asterisked doesn't mean that bonds & mcguire shouldn't be as well.
> > >b)If you really want to look at players who benefitted from >steroids, the best place to look is not to the players who >were hall of famers BEFORE their power surge, but instead the >AVERAGE players who improved drastically. Bonds was already >the best player of his generation as of 1992 or 1993. Without >roids, its likely that he still would have reached 500-500, >when in addition with this glove work(one of the best >defensive Left fielders ever), makes him one of the 3 best all >around players to ever step on a field(arguable, but not by >very much). > >Again -- AS OF 1993. > >c)When you consider point (B), the implications for Bonds' use >of steroids are far, far, far, far, far, far less dramatic and >impactful on his legend than Palmeiro, Canseco, Giambi, Sosa, >Mcgwire and the dozens of others who haven't yet been caught. >All of the latter, save Palmeiro(who was a good all-around >hitter) made their money solely by the long ball, and the long >ball alone. There are few gold gloves, and no seasons with 50 >stolen bases amongst those other dudes(Canseco did have 40, of >course).
Bonds was probably my favorite player in the early 90's after anyone on the Orioles. From where I sit he basically had two parts to his career. the first part was with the Pirates (and a few years with the Giants) where he was one of the best all-around players in the league and of all time. he fielded, he ran, he hit for average, he hit for power, and he was a team leader on successful teams.
the second half of his career was no different from what Mcguire, Sosa and Giambi were doing. power hitting. steroids. not much else. Bonds is now a threat to break the all-time HR record and if he does, it will probably define his career. Knowledgeable baseball fans won't say 'oh he was a great all-around player', they'll say he's the greatest home run hitter of all time.
This is why I'm so hung up on his steroids. Not only would he have been an all-time great without steroids, but he completely changed his career arc and the type of player he was by juicing up and becoming in essense, a NL DH.
> >d)Despite this, Bonds' bad relationship with the media(as >brought up by B9) guarantees that the impact of Steroids on >Bonds' career will be conflated with the impact of steroids on >Mcgwire and Giambi's career, when they aren't comparable, at >all.
I firmly believe the steroids will unfortunately define the type of player he is remembered as: a power hitter.
> >3)(Warning, race dialogue to follow) Throw in the fact that >he's a notoriously defiant black man, and you have the recipe >for a witch hunt that is less about Steroids and more about a >vendetta against Barry Bonds. Surely, all players who have >exposed as using 'roids get blasted in the media, no doubt >about it(perhaps deservedly so). > >That said -- Might I make the humble point that one needn't be >Farrakhan to suggest that race has **something** to do with >his negative press? And that this coverage can be present even >when Bonds *did* so something wrong?
no question about it. agree 100%. many whites do too, but i understand that one of your schticks is railing against yt, so by all means continue
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