I mean, as a first-option wing, I had him at 25/7/5 and All-D. But at PG? *Patrice thinking about smashing drunk chick behind dumpster face*...he could be even better.

You gotta at least consider trading Lonzo and Lavar to Orlando, NY, Memphis, somebody and trying to land one of those bigs.

he looks pretty darn good.

Not trade Lonzo good, but good.


Anti-gentrification, cheap alcohol & trying to look pretty in our twilight posting years (c) Big Reg
http://Tupreme.com

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/22312048/lakers-need-brandon-ingram-point-guard-keep-thunder

on his own team.

I could care less about college agendas but Duke, Kentucky, and OSU fans have all gotten in their feelings whenever I talking about a Laker player from their school.

I like Ingram and I think he's a solid all-around player but I don't think he's a star. If he can prove me wrong I would be ecstatic.

you came talmbout kuz better.

so...support kuz through this trying time.

http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=8&topic_id=2629068&mesg_id=2629068&listing_type=search

“I like Ingram and I think he's a solid all-around player but I don't think he's a star. If he can prove me wrong I would be ecstatic.”

If you classify that as “hate” so be it.

all of which Truth has said about BI. why you think you helping tho?

Not his best position IMO tho

You keep both of them because they're both really good?

i mean, BI and Ayton or Lonzo and Ayton?

In his last 12 games he's shooting 42% from the field. Not great, not terrible, but that includes 40% from three (over 80 attempts). Is that good enough for you?

Besides that though... if BI is exempt from criticism for poor shooting his rookie season is Lonzo exempt too or nah? Why or why not?

Thing is, sharing primary ballhandling duties with Ingram helps BOTH guys. Lonzo's always been an effective off-ball player with a low usage rate and Ingram has a great intuition for reading defenses.

I've been saying someone else should initiate the offense since the season started.

So you gonna address my questions or nah?

>In his last 12 games he's shooting 42% from the field. Not
>great, not terrible, but that includes 40% from three (over 80
>attempts). Is that good enough for you?

no. this is not good enough for me to say his shooting troubles are gone.

>Besides that though... if BI is exempt from criticism for poor
>shooting his rookie season is Lonzo exempt too or nah? Why or
>why not?

BI was not exempt from criticism for poor shooting. in fact, he was fried by the vast majority of media and laker FANS, some of whom STILL don't believe in his ability.

your questions have been answered. they were tough.

>>In his last 12 games he's shooting 42% from the field. Not
>>great, not terrible, but that includes 40% from three (over
>80
>>attempts). Is that good enough for you?
>
>no. this is not good enough for me to say his shooting
>troubles are gone.

>>Besides that though... if BI is exempt from criticism for
>poor
>>shooting his rookie season is Lonzo exempt too or nah? Why
>or
>>why not?
>
>BI was not exempt from criticism for poor shooting. in fact,
>he was fried by the vast majority of media and laker FANS,
>some of whom STILL don't believe in his ability.
>
>your questions have been answered. they were tough.
>


Thanks for answering my questions. The reason I brought up BI's rookie season is because Lonzo's roughly on that same trajectory:

- rough shooting early in rookie season despite bringing other intangibles to the table
- second half of season showed tremendous growth in shoring up early weaknesses

If criticism was warranted for the first half of the rookie season, then praise is warranted for the second half. True or nah?



So... considering the possibility that Lonzo will show improved growth in his shot (which he has in the second half thus far, averaging over 40% on three's in 6.6 attempts per game)... and also considering the fact that he's already been MUCH better than expected in the other two knocks against him coming into the draft (defense and running the halfcourt)...

Do the Lakers still trade him? (nevermind the fact that his skillset is PERFECTLY complementary to Ingram's)

I'm all for a mature debate here. Facts, stats and actual basketball analysis are welcome.

So the proposal of your original post is rendered moot then, correct?

You know you're setting a double standard here? You defended BI's rookie season (and deservedly so) because, hey, it's the kid's rookie season. They're allowed to go through ups and downs while they're getting used to the pro game.

Yet you're desperately clinging on to Lonzo's full season's shooting splits despite the fact he's shown TREMENDOUS growth in his shot as some half-witted rationale for trading him. Like, seriously? You know what's hilarious though? Who else is hitting 40% on threes with over 6.5 attempts/game? Kyrie.... oh.

Lakers didn't draft him to be a scorer though. That three falling is just icing on the cake. I see you conveniently ignored his other numbers... He's averaging 10/7/7/1.5/0.8 in 33 mins and is already one of the best young defending guards in the league.



So, I reiterate... the proposal in your original post is rendered moot then, correct?

actual laker fans were throwing dirt on him and lamenting the pick ON THIS BOARD, twitter, laker sites like silver screen and roll and lakersground, etc. his rookie year wasn't much worse than PG's, Giannis, Kawhi, etc. I said that AFTER his rookie year was complete.

2. only one desperately clinging to anything is you about them 12 games. i saw the lines. i saw the wild variation. 3-6 and 3-3 back to back tend to cyse things. so, when (yeah...WHEN) he goes 1-7 again and that shit sinks below 30% again...then what?

you hung up on percentages. i watch shooting mechanics. his are trash.

3. lakers drafted him to be a leader. he ain't hittin there either.

4. in 2018, no one wants a PG shooting sub-40, sub-30 and sub-50...we'll see where he goes from here. the fact that there's a question about whether they could even get a lottery pick for him says a lot.

Either you stoop to the naysayers' level by jumping through hoops to throw shade on a rookie or, and I quote, "can we let him play a full second half first?"

It's notable how you're laser focused on Lonzo's shooting and conveniently ignoring all the other facets of his game when that was the same style of disrespect thrown on BI in his rookie season.

That’s why trying to have an honest conversation with him is a waste of time (same goes for the other “my guy” flunkies)

we'll see how this works out.

You said from day 1 that he wasn't as committed as he needed to be...I thought he would mature but it didn't happen (and he had 2 different regimes to prove himself under, neither were impressed with his commitment).

You will be Anthony Bennett level wrong on Lonzo - and he's on his way to proving that already.

but we all know i only cysed him because i was desperate for kyrie to have help.

i never gave any detail about that dude's game. i was wishing.

In games that he is active (38 games) - we have a def rating of 104.5 (3rd in the league)

In games that he is inactive (22 games) - we have a def rating of 115.2 (dead last in the league)

I wouldn't waste your time with Basa. He'll throw anyone in the bushes to prop up his "guys" and he's going to be dead wrong on Zo - the advanced numbers already show his impact and his offensive trend-line progression shows that he's coming along very positively.

and cutting down kuz minutes and giving Ju more.

but i know you wanna credit your guy. it's fine.

His defensive ability is obvious and can go back to the start of the season where I commented on it immediately. From 3rd in the league during his games to dead last when he's not active speaks for itself - there's enough of a sample to speak on it now.

The "my guy" schtick is played. These are Lakers and they are going to play together for a long time, with both complementing each other's games very well.

just saying i noticed. oh well.

The specific context being earlier in the year when the usual nitwits were talking about the Lakers and they had no idea how rare it is to have players this young be this good defensively. Addl context was how rare it is for a team this young, overall, to jump from dead last to top 10 in defensive rating.

Lol you “noticed”...you only notice what you want to notice and you’ve admitted as
much so your observations are irrelevant.

but, you can't. you've proven as much, nobody how many times we do this.

If you had come with the normal act (like with Wally above), I wouldn't have responded. Plus I had some time between clients.

Probably even Top 12, on the off chance one of those top eleven guys slips.

Bad year to be dealing, because the top of this draft is so goddamn strong, but the fall off once you get to late lottery is pretty sizable. I feel like in the past couple of years, the drafts have tended to be weaker at the top but stronger in depth-- I suspect this year may be the opposite. Or, rather, more of those mid-first guys won't be as polished as they've been in years past-- should be a very heavy OAD year.

But yeah, I don't think most teams would do that deal. Maybe the Clippers late lotto? Or if Phoenix gets the first overall, they'd trade Miami's pick for him?

I also don't think LAL would come off their #2 overall that quickly unless they got an obvious win-now selection, and I'm not convinced Lonzo for Robert Williams or Lonnie Walker is a trade that they'd be ready to make, just in case it blows up in their faces.

So yeah. May as well root for them to figure it out, cuz they're definitely both staying around for at least a couple of years.

They should give BI more run at PG tho. The potential is insane.

I don’t see what it matters. I don’t see Lonzo’s game holding Ingram back from anything, down the road.

It’s certainly been up and down this hear, but I think things will work out with both of them on the same team.

Lonzo and BI complement each other extremely well. Zo wants BI to be that dominant scorer and closer, he has talked about it so many times when asked about BI's potential.

multiple ball-handlers and players who can initiate from multiple spots on the floor.

That's a key advantage to have and each has their own key strengths at it - namely, BI is better at navigating PnR whereas Lonzo is better at starting the break with his hit ahead passes.

And yes, you're being obtuse. That's your schtick on here.

Player A: gifted creative scorer, collapses defenses, deceptive length, can hit from midrange and three, stellar vision, threat to pass or shoot

Player B: gifted creative passer, unselfish, can hit from three, stellar vision, passes players open


Like, I'm basically salivating thinking about future teams with these two running it.

.

underestimates nor ignores any of BI's game...

and nobody who is actually watching the Lakers play games would even consider the idea of trading Lonzo Ball....because since right before his injury....and currently...his game is drastically better than it was when the season started..

You should honestly leave Laker discussions to those of us who actually watch the games ....

and who doesn't have the desperate effort to legitimize duke players..

BI is a Laker...he's our guy...

just move on and speak on how folks are calling Bagley lazy and selfish....and how Justice Winslow is looking like a modern Byron Houston...or how Okafor can't even start on the worst team in the league..

you got plenty to concern yourself with bruh.... We got the Lakers...don't trip.