at the end he was a little too wild but at his best he was incredibly fucking good.

shit bart starr was great, too, they only won TWO more super bowls with him? how paltry!

look at the browns, even in an era where players were way easier to get, they win a fistful of titles with otto graham and only *one* after he retires despite having many stars, including the greatest football player *ever*.

when both those franchises haven't had an elite QB, they have been totally forgettable, particularly the packers.

god this thread is dumb.