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Forum nameOkay Sports
Topic subjectBTW, LaVine gon be better than Wiggins
Topic URLhttp://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=8&topic_id=2357468
2357468, BTW, LaVine gon be better than Wiggins
Posted by Basaglia, Fri Aug-08-14 07:29 AM

the Jabari thing ain't enough. that's over. y'all know Ba gotta go big to give y'all a chance to fry me and to give myself a chance to take credit for something no one else saw coming.

so, there it is. Zach LaVine is better at basketball than Andrew Wiggins.
2357475, http://i.imgur.com/iQpaX3P.gif
Posted by Frank Longo, Thu Aug-07-14 11:54 AM
http://i.imgur.com/iQpaX3P.gif
2412217, incredible gif
Posted by astralblak, Sun Jan-18-15 12:26 PM
.
2705672, russ, you shoulda stuck with me
Posted by Basaglia, Sat Oct-26-19 09:26 AM
2705963, lmao you’re right
Posted by Frank Longo, Tue Oct-29-19 10:14 AM
2357479, You're like the Dick Cheney of Oksports
Posted by ErnestLee, Thu Aug-07-14 11:57 AM
kudos
2357511, and you're like...pressed.
Posted by Basaglia, Thu Aug-07-14 12:18 PM
2357480, We weren't wanting for chances to fry you, but thanks.
Posted by ConcreteCharlie, Thu Aug-07-14 11:57 AM
2357492, Haha
Posted by TheRealBillyOcean, Thu Aug-07-14 12:03 PM
2357497, and i ain't wanting for things i called first
Posted by Basaglia, Thu Aug-07-14 12:05 PM
not my fault i get scavenged and sharked more than anyone else here.

2459925, neither is skip bayless
Posted by ConcreteCharlie, Thu Jun-25-15 02:18 PM
2459927, go sit on someone's fence, you bullshitting exit-clause eval bamma
Posted by Basaglia, Thu Jun-25-15 02:21 PM
2357495, ^^ #1 Bruin rider ^^
Posted by Warren Coolidge, Thu Aug-07-14 12:04 PM
2357510, well, UCLA is putting out some good talent as of late
Posted by Dr Claw, Thu Aug-07-14 12:14 PM
Love, Westbrook, LaVine (?)....
2357532, speaking of, what happened to Bazz?
Posted by ThaTruth, Thu Aug-07-14 12:53 PM
2357535, sprained MCL but he did go to the D-League for a minute
Posted by Dr Claw, Thu Aug-07-14 12:54 PM
I don't think a lot of people ranked him -too- high though
2357541, Before his year at UCLA, he was the consensus #1 pick in the draft.
Posted by Frank Longo, Thu Aug-07-14 12:59 PM
Now, granted, a billion things change over the course of a season. Just saying, he *was* held in pretty damn high esteem by a lot of people for a while.

Whether that says more about Shabazz or about the nature of high school basketball player hype, you be the judge.
2357546, That's because he was 28 years old playing high school kids
Posted by Marauder21, Thu Aug-07-14 01:08 PM
2357556, lmao, cmon
Posted by Frank Longo, Thu Aug-07-14 01:16 PM
2357791, We'll call it OJ Mayo Syndrome
Posted by ConcreteCharlie, Thu Aug-07-14 06:11 PM
2357500, More pitbull tendencies
Posted by ShawndmeSlanted, Thu Aug-07-14 12:07 PM
Wiggins on that goofy.
2357507, I don't think this is that outrageous
Posted by Kungset, Thu Aug-07-14 12:12 PM
Wiggins will probably be a 2-way and better overall player. but on the offensive side, i think it's more likely than not LaVine will be better.
2357533, Is LaVine a 1 or 2?
Posted by ThaTruth, Thu Aug-07-14 12:53 PM
2357542, He's a 2 to me
Posted by MothershipConnection, Thu Aug-07-14 01:00 PM
He definitely handles it well enough to play point but he's more of a scorer to me. Didn't see him do a ton of playmaking a UCLA but that could just be the role they had him playing out here... he actually reminds me a bit of fellow Seattle-ite Jamal Crawford in that he's probably perfectly capable of playing the point for a bit, but if you want to win, you move him off the ball and away from running the offense.
2357545, Good question
Posted by Marauder21, Thu Aug-07-14 01:08 PM
One that I haven't seen anyone really answer, including Flip Saunders.

Though I think he's ultimately going to be a 2 in the NBA.
2357549, RE: Is LaVine a 1 or 2?
Posted by okayplayery, Thu Aug-07-14 01:12 PM
he's a prototypical two. not a tweener.
2357515, ***Bookmark***
Posted by TheRealBillyOcean, Thu Aug-07-14 12:23 PM
All the Lavine fans need to line up for this one.
2357544, so many ways to win!! HE SO GOOD BA!!
Posted by bshelly, Thu Aug-07-14 01:03 PM
2357696, lol that Ben McLemore shit ended up under the rug eh?
Posted by cgonz00cc, Thu Aug-07-14 03:43 PM
2357701, no, that's still in play
Posted by Basaglia, Thu Aug-07-14 03:51 PM
you know what i find funny, most of these dudes didn't fuck wit harden after his first year either and even doubled down after it, still shittin on his tourney performances.

SOON as he showed something...friendships formed.

NOBODY REMEMBERS how stuff goes down on this board.

Now I see it taking shape with Klay and how long did I have to wait on that one? Three years? but I actually nursed that one, after the way I got treated with Harden, Love and Blake.

EVERYTIME someone I cyse gets good, here y'all come...


"Thank you, Ba...thank you...I'll take it from here"

Buncha Dr. Leo Marvin ass bammas.
2357768, cant speak to what anyone else does
Posted by cgonz00cc, Thu Aug-07-14 05:02 PM
These guys do love them some Harden now tho
2389508, hi
Posted by Basaglia, Thu Nov-13-14 03:32 PM
2389523, Jabari is fat, Giannis better.
Posted by Orbit_Established, Thu Nov-13-14 04:03 PM

Hi

----------------------------



O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"




"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2389524, don't be mad at me 'cause Melo's wife told him what to do
Posted by Basaglia, Thu Nov-13-14 04:04 PM
2389528, Jabari throws deep dish pizza at the rim.
Posted by Orbit_Established, Thu Nov-13-14 04:25 PM

'Melo is rich, in the hall, and ruined the biggest sporting event ever with an jumper in the native son's eyeball

If the Cavs don't win, you know its cuz Carmelo broke
the spell right away, right? <---damn, I'm good.

Oh, and Carmelo won a scoring title dead in the middle
of an era with 3/5 greatest swing men of all time.

He can get fat now.

Jabari is fat from jump

----------------------------



O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"




"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2389539, well, all that said...no one's even paying attention to melo
Posted by Basaglia, Thu Nov-13-14 04:51 PM
i m perfectly fine letting you cringe after every knicks game, ancipating me leading the party time on melo and the knicks. i have no such desire. i made ONE thread about PG being better and you been aggy since.

Jabari at 11 and 6 just be being on the court. when he gets the directive to be an aggressive scorer from Kidd and 5 more minutes, he will quickly be at 18 and 8...just by being on the court.

i like that kidd is bringing him and giannis along slowly and tryna make the playoffs.
2389616, Jabari has tits.
Posted by Orbit_Established, Thu Nov-13-14 10:56 PM
>i m perfectly fine letting you cringe after every knicks
>game, ancipating me leading the party time on melo and the
>knicks. i have no such desire. i made ONE thread about PG
>being better and you been aggy since.

You actually didn't say PG was better. You're smarter than
that. You said the Pacers would beat the Knicks, and blamed
Carmelo.

But we already got to the roots of your Carmelo hate:

a) You're a DC nigga and he's a Baltimore nigga

b) You had an anti-Lebron agenda, secondary to your pro-Kobe
agenda, and you needed Carmelo to be Bird to Lebron's Magic
in order to buffer Kobe. It didn't turn out that way.

>Jabari at 11 and 6 just be being on the court. when he gets
>the directive to be an aggressive scorer from Kidd and 5 more
>minutes, he will quickly be at 18 and 8...just by being on the
>court.
>
>i like that kidd is bringing him and giannis along slowly and
>tryna make the playoffs.

Me too
2389630, yeah, i did...and i still believe he's better
Posted by Basaglia, Thu Nov-13-14 11:27 PM

>You actually didn't say PG was better. You're smarter than
>that. You said the Pacers would beat the Knicks, and blamed
>Carmelo.

you so mad you gotta sit through melo looking like trash in that triangle and bracing for a frying after every 8-23 night he has. nobody even trippin, dogg. he made a really poor choice going back to NYC. i actually feel bad for him.
2389634, Nah, Grantland already shot that one down.
Posted by Orbit_Established, Thu Nov-13-14 11:44 PM

PG had one of the worst in-season "star" collapses
in the history of the league

Grantland damn near stole direct quotes from me in
their article

He was legitimately the third best player on his team
the last 2/3 of the season

>you so mad you gotta sit through melo looking like trash in
>that triangle and bracing for a frying after every 8-23 night
>he has. nobody even trippin, dogg. he made a really poor
>choice going back to NYC. i actually feel bad for him.

Don't care

When he burned Lebron on opening night, that was pretty
much all I needed from him this season

Carmelo: imprinting himself into history when nobody
asks him too....Bwahahah...won that scoring title when
he had NO business doing so....karma for you talking
about patches




----------------------------



O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"




"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2389636, sorry, man. gonna be a tough season for y'all
Posted by Basaglia, Thu Nov-13-14 11:47 PM
but you ain't got nothing to worry about as far as me. i'm chillin.
2389527, I said that this summer Frank Longo "noted" it
Posted by ShawndmeSlanted, Thu Nov-13-14 04:20 PM
2389540, it has been noted. giannis ain't exactly exploding, dude.
Posted by Basaglia, Thu Nov-13-14 04:53 PM
2389547, Then what exactly is Levine doing?
Posted by ErnestLee, Thu Nov-13-14 05:09 PM
2389573, Playing well enough to up this thread
Posted by Basaglia, Thu Nov-13-14 08:28 PM
He's a lottery pick...OF COURSE HE'S good
2408879, co-sign
Posted by ErnestLee, Sat Jan-10-15 10:35 AM
2389543, It's still noted.
Posted by Frank Longo, Thu Nov-13-14 04:59 PM
If we're only using the first eight games of Jabari's season to determine who's better, then Brandon Knight is a future Hall of Famer.
2389581, I'd be at that ceremony Longo.
Posted by TheRealBillyOcean, Thu Nov-13-14 08:52 PM
2389626, You'd run on stage like Soy Bomb.
Posted by Frank Longo, Thu Nov-13-14 11:11 PM
2389633, lulz
Posted by dula dibiasi, Thu Nov-13-14 11:36 PM
2389512, Relevant? UCLA best pipeline to NBA (swipe)
Posted by wallysmith, Thu Nov-13-14 03:43 PM
http://online.wsj.com/articles/ucla-is-the-best-pipeline-to-the-nba-1415748673

The Best Pipeline to the NBA: UCLA
Bruins Have 14 Players Drafted Between 1999 and 2009 That Have Played More Than 300 NBA Games

UCLA is no longer the dominant power in men’s college basketball that it was under coach John Wooden in the 1960s and ’70s, when the Bruins won 10 NCAA titles in 12 seasons. But there’s one thing the school is still best at: producing successful NBA players.

Between 1999 and 2009, 16 players from UCLA were selected in the NBA draft, with 14 of them going on to play more than 300 games, the highest number for any school in Division I, according to Stats LLC.

Besides All-Stars like Oklahoma City’s Russell Westbrook and Cleveland’s Kevin Love, UCLA alumni that remain key NBA contributors include Jrue Holiday (New Orleans), Matt Barnes (Los Angeles Clippers), Darren Collison (Sacramento) and Trevor Ariza (Houston).

Over this same span, 17 players from Duke were drafted, but only 12 Blue Devils played more than 300 games.

The school with the second-highest NBA success rate is Kentucky, with six of the seven players taken between 1999 and 2009 playing at least 300 games. This doesn’t include recent Wildcats, such as DeMarcus Cousins and John Wall, who will likely hit the mark this season.

Coincidentally, Kentucky coach John Calipari was at Memphis from 2000 to 2009 and had nine players drafted during this span. Only one player, Tyreke Evans, has hit the 300-game mark. Derrick Rose, the No. 1 overall pick in the 2008 draft, remains seven games shy of 300, having missed a majority of the past three seasons due to injury

http://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/OG-AD077_COUNT_NS_20141111181042.jpg
2389537, oh, word?
Posted by Castro, Thu Nov-13-14 04:43 PM
http://www.basketball-reference.com/friv/colleges.cgi?college=uconn

2389542, 1999 to 2009
Posted by wallysmith, Thu Nov-13-14 04:56 PM
2389544, Convenient cut off date for those stats...
Posted by Frank Longo, Thu Nov-13-14 05:03 PM
... since for players drafted after the 2010 class and before the 2014 class, UCLA has two players still active in the league, whereas Duke has seven and UK has double digits.

So relevant isn't *exactly* the word I'd use.
2389548, lowering the bar a bit to say "on active rosters"
Posted by Warren Coolidge, Thu Nov-13-14 05:17 PM
just to get some of the Duke bench warmers some inclusion....

meanwhile.... lot of blue chippers and their families view UCLA to be a solid way to the pros...

which is why Alford's recruiting classes are improving so much...

2389549, lowering the bar a bit to say "on active rosters"
Posted by Warren Coolidge, Thu Nov-13-14 05:17 PM
just to get some of the Duke bench warmers some inclusion....

meanwhile.... lot of blue chippers and their families view UCLA to be a solid way to the pros...

which is why Alford's recruiting classes are improving so much...

2389550, How about I say "active All-Stars"?
Posted by Frank Longo, Thu Nov-13-14 05:23 PM
Since Duke has more.

Or "the more recently drafted All-Star"? Duke has that too.

Or "the next All-Star"? Duke has that too.

Where should we set the goalposts?

You also ignored the UK point, since UK is *obviously* the best pipeline to the NBA right now.
2389601, uh...Kyrie.....and who else a current all-star....
Posted by Warren Coolidge, Thu Nov-13-14 10:19 PM
because Westbrook and Love up to this season would both qualify and annual CURRENT all-star game attendees...
2389574, Arbitrary, I agree, along with the 300 games played metric.
Posted by wallysmith, Thu Nov-13-14 08:32 PM
Didn't look like WSJ put in a lot of time on that article though, just thought it was interesting.

I wasn't looking to make it a Duke vs UCLA post, but for what it's worth the article did point out that there were more Duke players drafted than UCLA in that time frame.
2389580, They're a hoops factory. So many stars. Word to M'bah Moute.
Posted by TheRealBillyOcean, Thu Nov-13-14 08:51 PM
2389625, GADZURIC IN THE HOUSE
Posted by Frank Longo, Thu Nov-13-14 11:11 PM
2389639, RE: GADZURIC IN THE HOUSE
Posted by Warren Coolidge, Thu Nov-13-14 11:57 PM
http://d2770i1y1fck5h.cloudfront.net/images/rectangle_606x/69e883a0d44aa2dac0478794a876041db2910838.jpg?1373907302
2389652, I read that in the tone of IT'S BROOKLYN IN THE HOUSE
Posted by wallysmith, Fri Nov-14-14 01:54 AM
2389678, *Big Fudge does the truffle-shuffle to this reply*
Posted by Bombastic, Fri Nov-14-14 09:56 AM
>
2389558, levine is pretty good..but i think wig will get the nod on D
Posted by LAbeathustla, Thu Nov-13-14 06:03 PM
2394986, true
Posted by Basaglia, Sun Nov-30-14 12:00 AM
2412152, RE: true
Posted by ErnestLee, Sat Jan-17-15 11:39 PM
2412153, still true
Posted by Basaglia, Sat Jan-17-15 11:40 PM
2412156, One's a lock for ROY, the other cant outplay Mo Williams
Posted by ErnestLee, Sat Jan-17-15 11:44 PM
Maybe next year champ.
2412157, maybe next year, as this IS a CAREER post
Posted by Basaglia, Sat Jan-17-15 11:45 PM

maybe one of these years y'all won't fall for it and then get mad when another agenda walks you down.

2412158, RE: maybe next year, as this IS a CAREER post
Posted by ErnestLee, Sat Jan-17-15 11:47 PM
so, there it is. Zach LaVine is better at basketball than Andrew Wiggins.
2412160, all relative...
Posted by Basaglia, Sat Jan-17-15 11:58 PM
because when zach was playing better for two weeks in late november/early december, nobody wanted to talk about it.

wiggins can't dribble. he's running fast and hitting open jumpers. shit, harrison barnes can do that and we know how those upped threads worked out. defenses will adjust.

when he putters out as a 18/7/4 uber-Batum, Zach will settle in explode onto the scene. and nobody will wanna talk about it.


2412185, Zachs never gonna be a sub-Batum
Posted by cantball, Sun Jan-18-15 03:03 AM

____________________

<================== Learn the name now before everyone gets dunked on
2412188, he's pretty close to batum RIGHT NOW
Posted by Basaglia, Sun Jan-18-15 07:08 AM
2412204, Explode on the scene as a the new Jamal Crawford prototype
Posted by TheRealBillyOcean, Sun Jan-18-15 11:57 AM
2412197, To be fair, Zach wasn't even supposed to play PG this year
Posted by Marauder21, Sun Jan-18-15 11:09 AM
He's FAR ahead of schedule. If this team was healthy, he barely would have seen any meaningful playing time.

But he'll never be better than Wiggins.
2412235, : - (
Posted by Orbit_Established, Sun Jan-18-15 01:53 PM
2412290, Bags got abandoned agendas blowing around like tumbleweeds, lol
Posted by ThaTruth, Sun Jan-18-15 03:48 PM
2412775, ....
Posted by JAESCOTT777, Mon Jan-19-15 10:11 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rNVcSIZyBuE
2431854, once this lambo gets its paint job, i'm frying y'all
Posted by Basaglia, Tue Mar-24-15 10:40 AM

shawty just need a teeeensy bit more polish.

this gon be worse than klay, ky, harden...SMH.

no friends next season. NONE.
2432324, RE: LaVine = worst +/- in the league
Posted by bentagain, Thu Mar-26-15 09:55 AM
did I hear that right?
2432331, he plays for the wolves...second unit. i have no doubt it's right.
Posted by Basaglia, Thu Mar-26-15 10:10 AM
2432343, Not second unit
Posted by Marauder21, Thu Mar-26-15 10:48 AM
He's been starting since Rubio's been out again.

Dude's not bad, just currently in a position where he has to do a lot more than he should. Ideally he's a 2 who can bring the ball up and facilitate when needed (like a younger Wade's role in Miami.) He's spent a good chunk of this season as a straight point guard.

As someone who was PISSED when the Wolves drafted him, he's had a much better rookie year than I imagined. Still not sure he'll ever be a PG, but for a teenager who's spent most of the season out of position, he's shown something.
2432359, why would you be pissed?
Posted by BrooklynWHAT, Thu Mar-26-15 11:48 AM
his ceiling is through the roof. yall just have to guide his development properly.
2432375, I was on draft day
Posted by Marauder21, Thu Mar-26-15 12:55 PM
Because I thought he was too much of a project who wouldn't be able to contribute in any meaningful way until at least year two or three. Also, I was confused as to what position he was going to play in the pros (which there doesn't seem to be a total consensus on.)

He's better than I thought he'd be.
2432362, well, that +/- stat is for the YEAR, dogg
Posted by Basaglia, Thu Mar-26-15 11:54 AM
2432376, He's a terrible defender; polar opposite of Wiggy
Posted by FILF, Thu Mar-26-15 12:56 PM
2459926, I mean naturally a player on the worst team was going to get it
Posted by ConcreteCharlie, Thu Jun-25-15 02:20 PM
I don't put a lot of stock into +/-, at least not in and of itself. Over time and in context, it can be informative, but in one season it mostly just reflects the quality of the team.
2459614, you still with this one or nah?
Posted by ThaTruth, Wed Jun-24-15 02:01 PM
2459628, yep
Posted by Basaglia, Wed Jun-24-15 02:30 PM
2482032, reminder...he better than that upright-dribbling human greyhound
Posted by Basaglia, Wed Oct-07-15 12:35 PM
2482094, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xrqGbJVrNgI
Posted by ThaTruth, Wed Oct-07-15 02:57 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xrqGbJVrNgI
2482138, Hes gonna be starting at 2
Posted by ShawndmeSlanted, Wed Oct-07-15 03:53 PM
2502329, WALK THESE BAMMAS DOWN, BA!!!
Posted by Basaglia, Tue Dec-15-15 10:34 AM
PER:
Lavine - 17.6
Wiggins - 15.9

MPG:
Wiggins - 34.9
Lavine - 24.9

PPG:
Wiggins - 20.6
Lavine - 14.7

RPG:
Wiggins - 3.6
Lavine - 3.5

APG:
Lavine - 3.6
Wiggins - 1.6

SPG:
Lavine - 0.6
Wiggins - 0.6

BPG:
Wiggins - 0.7
Lavine - 0.1

Field Goal %:
Lavine - .431
Wiggins - .429

3p Field Goal%:
Lavine - .365
Wiggins - .263

True shooting %:
Lavine - .540
Wiggins - .517

Free throw %:
Lavine - 90%
Wiggins - 74%

Offensive Win Shares:
Lavine - 0.8
Wiggins - 0.8

Defensive Win Shares:
Lavine - 0.3
Wiggins - 0.3
2502331, And BTW...i don't need credit...i can cyse my own Ws excessively
Posted by Basaglia, Tue Dec-15-15 10:42 AM
y'all party on my Ls way too much, so you can expect me to overdo these Ws.

only fair.

and when kidd turns jabari loose, this board gettin burned down.

2584378, it's almost time to burn this board down
Posted by Basaglia, Sat Dec-24-16 02:41 PM
Don't let Jabari make the AS game THIS season.!
2502333, Homophobe T, you wanna talk about this?
Posted by Basaglia, Tue Dec-15-15 10:44 AM
2502334, Rayon Rondo
Posted by ShawndmeSlanted, Tue Dec-15-15 10:46 AM
2502539, he's good but is he better than Wiggins?
Posted by ThaTruth, Wed Dec-16-15 09:53 AM
2502540, stats say yes
Posted by Basaglia, Wed Dec-16-15 09:55 AM
2502409, oh, hell nah...as much as them rivers and bennett threads were upped
Posted by Basaglia, Tue Dec-15-15 03:35 PM
you really hate talmbout it when i'm winning, huh?

y'all gotta grow up, man. win some and lose some.

2502458, You're BARELY winning this one...
Posted by Ryan M, Tue Dec-15-15 06:47 PM
And zero GMs would take LaVine over Wiggins right today anyway.

Those Bennett/Rivers threads are beyond Ls, this is a sort of W...temporarily.
2502477, He better
Posted by Basaglia, Tue Dec-15-15 09:02 PM
2502526, LaVine had lost some games for the Wolves playing PG
Posted by okayplayery, Wed Dec-16-15 03:56 AM
that's not his fault tho.

Overall he looks nice, especially for somebody who was so bad as a rookie. Can get separation any time he wants, but needs to clear up his shot selection and don't bail out the defense with lazy shots. Gerald Green seems to be his floor now.

As far as the comp with Wiggins, who knows? They play for the same team. One thing tho, when Wiggins plays good - Wolves usually win, when LaVine has nice numbers - Wolves usually lose.
2509324, Zach's coach gets on him for poor fundamentals, being a slow learner (swipe)
Posted by okayplayery, Wed Jan-13-16 04:24 AM
SM: You know I took Zach out of the game in Philly, because for three possessions in a row he couldn’t get the ball. Now, he was the point guard, right? But he just walked out there. What about setting your man up? What about taking two hard steps away, then stepping into your guy, holding off, then burst! You would think that’s just natural. But who coached him? I don’t know his high school coach. I don’t know his AAU coach. I know who his college coach was, but he didn’t start or play but 18 minutes a game in college.

People think that learning is easy. But if it is not a habit — OK, you watch Kyrie Irving. Every time he goes to get the ball, he steps into his guy and then breaks off — every time. That’s all he knows. It is a habit. I learned it when I started going to basketball camp. But back then, that was professional coaches at those camps, high school and college coaches teaching us. It wasn’t some guy that owned a car wash and had some money and decided he was going to start an AAU team and he was gonna be the coach because he read a book or he watched basketball, and thinking he can coach. No, I had professional coaches.

So, we’re trying to teach him and others about spacing; about timing; when to cut; finishing your cut

MP: Shot selection.

SM: Shot selection. Passing. Did you see that pass last night? switched Jameer Nelson on to G . Zach was at the top of the key. What pass do you throw, with Jameer Nelson at 5-9 and Gorgui at 6-11? He threw him a bounce pass. Not only a bounce pass, but he tried to throw a pass as though it is going to spin back to G miraculously. And I’m sitting there thinking, this is an NBA player. This is the 13th pick in the draft. And Gorgui has a 5-9 guard on him who is 34 years old . And our second-year point guard tries to throw him a bounce pass, instead of just throw it up there toward the basket.

Now people will say, “He should know that.” Well, we can’t take for granted that he does, because he showed last night that he don’t. So we have to teach everything. If we forget one thing, it bites us in the ass. If we forget telling our guy not to walk up but to step in and now break and get open, then we don’t get open.

We have to teach them how to set a proper screen at the right angle. We put in something today and the difference is the angle of the screen. I’m saying, “Now why would you set a screen that way when we want are trying to get to go the other way?” And they looked at me, so I said, “OK, let me show you how to set the screen.”

These are things that veteran teams just take for granted. We have to teach all of that. So, OK, people think, “Well you told them.” But how long does it take to break bad habits, habits that you have had ever since you started playing basketball? You can’t just do it by telling them once. If no one has ever taught you how to set a proper screen, I have got to show you Monday, I have got to show you Tuesday, I got to show you Wednesday, on tape Thursday, on tape Friday — until it becomes second nature.

So how long does it take? For every guy it is different. The great ones, like KG — . Man, KG just picked it up. Other guys, it takes a while. But that is the difference between winning and losing. That is the difference between you being able to get down here with your first dribble instead of your third dribble. It makes all the difference.

MP: Time wasted.

SM: Not just avoiding time wasted, but creating gaps and seams.

MP: I know it is only 35, 36 games into the season, but do you feel like they are picking up these fundamentals or do you feel like they are static right now?

SM: Not static, but it is like some guys learn at a different pace. I understand your question. Think about where G has come from. But I have coached G hard this year. G has made tremendous strides. Look at Bazz, how he is starting to move the ball. You’ve seen Bazz play — eyes on that rim all the time. But you can’t play like that . You have got to learn to play with others. But if you look at Bazz the last few games, he is moving the basketball.

MP: And his shot selection is a lot better, including squaring up for those corner threes.

SM: Getting a lot better, yes. And so now when he’s driving, instead of shooting floaters over those 7-2 guys, he’s doing this . Because that is a bad shot against those big guys. You may make one or two out of 10, but that is a 20 percent shot. We want to get you to where you have a 50 to 60 to 70 percent chance of scoring when we move the ball.

So when you look at G and Bazz, they’re getting it. Look at Andrew Wiggins, the progression that he is making, and look at Karl . Well Zach, everybody learns at a different pace. But now we’re also asking Zach to play a position he has never played before. So everybody picks up things at a different pace.

MP: The thing about Zach, you wanted him to be a two-guard in training camp and it quickly didn’t work out very well. Then later into this season, you again created space for him at the two-guard by cutting K-Mart’s minutes and again it didn’t work well. But when I look at Zach’s game, it seems like his natural skill set and progression are much better suited for shooting guard than point guard. He doesn’t have enough court vision or share-the-ball mentality to play the point.

SM: I agree, but when you look at him at the two-guard, look who he has got to guard. Tomorrow, J.R. Smith: 6-6, 230 . And the list goes on and on.

MP: I know. Frequent mismatches defensively.

SM: And so Zach hasn’t figured out that if you are going to give up size, he ain’t figured out how to use his speed. My thing used to be that if you are bigger than me and you are going to beat me up, I am going to run you until your tongue falls out of your mouth. But if you ask Zach right now — and you ask most second-year players — what is the best thing that you do? They can’t tell you.

Zach right now is just trying to play. When you start playing and thinking, that’s when you’ve got something, when you can do both. As long as you are just playing, you are just out there. And when I say playing and thinking, I am saying doing it without being hesitant. You are just reading as you go.

We are trying to teach Zach certain things that I just knew. I never worried about you guarding me if I was going to down-screen. Because I am going to set you up. I don’t care how shitty the screen is, I am going to make you run into that screen. I am going to take you where I want to take you and make you run into that screen. And then I’m going to come off. Now when I come off, and you are locking and trailing behind, now what is my next read? The big guy. Is he going to step out, or allow me to curl, and if I curl is he going to bump? Is the guy in the lane going to try and shoot the gap? But see, I processed all of that like that , whereas Zach still does this —

I told him today, when we were practicing. We’re running a play. He catches the ball. He does this and then he does that . I said “Zach … ”

MP: Don’t dribble.

SM: And he said, “Coach, I didn’t do that.” And I said, “Zach, do you think I would blow this whistle and say you just dribbled the ball before you passed it if it didn’t happen? You went from a live dribble, where you still have all your options, to doing this . Now what if that guy you are passing to is not open? you have already predetermined that you are passing the ball. What if he is not open? You’re my point guard, you just picked the ball up and now you are stuck. Rather than catching it, ripping it, being a triple threat, so that if a guy comes open, boom! Now if he isn’t open, you can come back off the screen with your dribble. But you just killed everything we are trying to do on this play because of that one dribble.

Now we are talking with Zach and working with Zach about this over and over.

MP: It seems as if he always goes into that dribble even when he catches the ball open behind the three point line.

SM: Thank you for watching. He’ll be wide open for a three …

MP: a catch-and-shoot three, where his accuracy is much better?

SM: A catch-and-shoot. And then he’ll do this , dribble towards the guy.

MP: after an unnecessary up fake …

SM: dribble closer to the guy and get to a contested shot.

MP: Often a long fade-away two pointer.

SM: And when you ask him — during a timeout, I’ll say, “Zach, why didn’t you shoot the ball?” He’ll say, “I didn’t feel like I was in rhythm or ready to shoot.” But then you dribbled into the defense and took a bad shot. “Was that a bad shot?” See, he doesn’t even realize that he dribbled and then did that. It is so ingrained in him from AAU, and we are trying to break him of that habit.

https://www.minnpost.com/sports/2016/01/qa-sam-mitchell-weighs-zach-lavine-andrew-wiggins-and-wolves-season-so-far
2509388, This is actually a fantastic little read. Sam Mitchell is good.
Posted by Orbit_Established, Wed Jan-13-16 12:34 PM

He is shitting on dude, but he gives examples and
knows how to communicate. And he REALLY wants him to
be better.

And there's no real reason that Lavine can't handle the point,
especially given how Russy made the transition.
2509392, agree it was great insight from Sam
Posted by ShawndmeSlanted, Wed Jan-13-16 12:56 PM
2509720, Have a 2nd helping then
Posted by okayplayery, Thu Jan-14-16 10:21 AM
https://www.minnpost.com/sports/2016/01/sam-mitchell-qa-part-two-kg-bazzy-and-why-kat-t-wolves-best-shooter
2509730, i don't even follow basketball like that, and these are informative
Posted by pdafunk, Thu Jan-14-16 10:50 AM
and entertaining reads.
2509772, This needs to happen regularly...these are FANTASTIC
Posted by Orbit_Established, Thu Jan-14-16 12:39 PM

I almost want to follow the team just because of this

----------------------------



O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"




"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2509862, good stuff. n/m
Posted by ThaTruth, Thu Jan-14-16 03:12 PM
2509874, thanks
Posted by Kungset, Thu Jan-14-16 03:40 PM
i want to give Byron the benefit of the doubt that something similar is motivating him to bench the young guys, but D'Angelo saying he had 'no idea'why he was being benched makes me think twice
2510034, Its working in Byron's case, though. So there's that.
Posted by Orbit_Established, Fri Jan-15-16 10:43 AM

D'Angelo is improving and has to earn his minutes.
2509961, Holy shit this quote is incredible:
Posted by Orbit_Established, Thu Jan-14-16 10:13 PM

"I tell our guys this all the time: Why would I ask you guys to do something that is going to screw you up, when my livelihood depends on your success? If I come to you and say, we need to work on these aspects of your shot, you don’t think I put in hours and hours of sleepless nights before I go to a guy and say that? Because if you start tinkering with a guy’s shot, that is the essence of their game, their livelihood. That is like taking a hitter and saying we need to change your swing. Heeeeey! You better know what the hell you are talking about."

----------------------------



O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"




"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2510021, This is LOVE. Real Love for the Game. Thanks for sharing.
Posted by Castro, Fri Jan-15-16 10:19 AM
2510056, Love this
Posted by auragin_boi, Fri Jan-15-16 02:02 PM
It ain't hard to tell who's learning basketball and who's just out there playing.

I wasn't a fan of free flowing offenses because I didn't use to trust the players to get it right but now I see that's only hinders a young team.

As you get older/wiser/deeper into the game, if you've learned it, a lot of it is instinct.

I think the best offense is freelowing with sets mixed in. I think some of what SA does is this. The constant ball movement on certain plays HAS to be freelance. Those don't look like 'sets'.

Man...I LOVE basketball.
2510161, coaches vs players 3-on-3 beatdown is an amazing anecdote
Posted by will_5198, Sat Jan-16-16 01:08 PM
2509837, why dre/shaun/kg are there
Posted by themaddfapper, Thu Jan-14-16 02:32 PM
and why I thought ZLowe Da Gawd shitting on Sam on his podcast was so unfair.

These kids having gotten to the highest level of basketball doing things you can't fathom they'd still be doing at this level or haven't learned by this time.

(that I run a car wash now I'm a coach line was cold-blooded and true as fuck)

Winning & Teaching at the same time in the league is pretty much impossible.

If the team is gonna invest in 2 years of teaching for the next 10, time well spent.
2509869, Yep, I say keep learning, lose, and get a Point Guard
Posted by TheRealBillyOcean, Thu Jan-14-16 03:26 PM
You got everything else.
2510163, SLOW DOWN, He ain't Russy. All they have in common is UCLA.
Posted by isaaaa, Sat Jan-16-16 01:25 PM

>And there's no real reason that Lavine can't handle the
>point,
>especially given how Russy made the transition.


Anti-gentrification, cheap alcohol & trying to look pretty in our twilight posting years (c) Big Reg


Get 25% off www.karmaloop.com w/ rep code JR9103 |
Nike, G-Star, Herschel, Adidas (Men's & Women's clothing)
2510165, Right, lol
Posted by ThaTruth, Sat Jan-16-16 01:43 PM
2509428, But "he run fast and jump high!"
Posted by DJR, Wed Jan-13-16 01:41 PM
2509438, as opposed to the ever-improving wiggins?
Posted by Basaglia, Wed Jan-13-16 02:03 PM
2509733, Jesus, what a gift to fans having a coach that candid
Posted by Walleye, Thu Jan-14-16 10:57 AM
The Twins are in a pretty similar position - really high-upside young talent that isn't nearly done polishing yet. I'd rather love to see Paul Molitor open up this much to a local spot like MinnPost. He doesn't seem to have quite Mitchell's level of open-ness, but he's a Hall of Famer managing his hometown team so maybe he could make up for that in having pretty much nothing to lose.

Here's hoping.
2509773, Don't know Molitor's personality, but I bet these would work
Posted by Orbit_Established, Thu Jan-14-16 12:40 PM

I think every coach should do these...these are fabulous

----------------------------



O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"




"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2509892, Absolutely every coach *should*
Posted by Walleye, Thu Jan-14-16 04:13 PM
I'm guessing the amount of coaches that are as thoughtful about their roster, the tension between winning and developing players, and the background of their athletes is lower than we'd guess. Mitchell doesn't just come off as smart here - he comes off as thoughtful and willing to approach problems with "what is going on here?" instead of "I know what's going on here!"

So, take the relatively small batch of coaches in any sport that are actually capable of doing something this free-wheeling and then divide that again to find the ones who are in a situation where this level of candor ("We are relying on him to shoot jumpers, we are relying on him in the post. It is a lot for a 20-year old. Welcome to my world.") wouldn't get them in hot shit with their organization, their players, and/or their players' agents. And you're really looking at only a handful of guys.

Since I brought up my team - Molitor has the first qualifications. I don't think he'd come by his liberty the same way Mitchell has, but the effect is the same and I think he'd also have this kind of freedom. Molitor got his by being a Minnesota legend in command of a shitty team that showed signs of life under him. He's got license. Mitchell seems to have just claimed his, which is more impressive but is freighted with more risk.
2509940, the reality is most players egos are too shallow for this, Zach is...
Posted by ThaTruth, Thu Jan-14-16 07:23 PM
probably somewhere curled up in a ball right now crying or either drinking himself silly.

Mitchell doesn't really give fuck though because he knows he's the typical black "rebuilding" coach and he knows he won't get a chance to coach these kids when they get good and they'll bring in a Steve Kerr to reap the benefits of all the hard work he put in.
2509951, ^^^^GODDAMN. Tha_Truth off to a good start in 2016
Posted by Orbit_Established, Thu Jan-14-16 08:21 PM
>probably somewhere curled up in a ball right now crying or
>either drinking himself silly.
>
>Mitchell doesn't really give fuck though because he knows he's
>the typical black "rebuilding" coach and he knows he won't get
>a chance to coach these kids when they get good and they'll
>bring in a Steve Kerr to reap the benefits of all the hard
>work he put in.


----------------------------



O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"




"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2509954, They did the same thing to Mitchell in Toronto, he knows how...
Posted by ThaTruth, Thu Jan-14-16 09:28 PM
this story ends.
2510025, You don't think he hears worse in practice regularly?
Posted by Walleye, Fri Jan-15-16 10:23 AM
I agree about the rest, though. He sounds like his particular brand of open-ness is the chatter of somebody who has resolved to do his job well but recognizes that his job security probably has nothing to do with his success.
2510158, I'm sure Sam probably cusses him out in practice every day but it's...
Posted by ThaTruth, Sat Jan-16-16 12:08 PM
different went a coach is that openly critical of a player to the media. Now it's out there for everybody to see.
2513874, That's a good point
Posted by Walleye, Thu Jan-28-16 10:50 AM
n/m
2510029, RE: the reality is most players egos are too shallow for this, Zach is...
Posted by Numba_33, Fri Jan-15-16 10:34 AM
>probably somewhere curled up in a ball right now crying or
>either drinking himself silly.
>
>Mitchell doesn't really give fuck though because he knows he's
>the typical black "rebuilding" coach and he knows he won't get
>a chance to coach these kids when they get good and they'll
>bring in a Steve Kerr to reap the benefits of all the hard
>work he put in.


Another aspect to what you said is that in the NBA, outside of a few top tier coaches, most front offices will choose a player over a coach if rifts occur, so I think most players realize they have the power in a sense to ignore or tune out a head coach, which contributes to the shallow ego you are referring to.

Interesting that Zach Levine could possibly have an inflated ego to be willing to ignore a head coach since he's only a second or third year player and hasn't seen much success outside of the dunk contest if I'm not mistaken, but I'm not in the man's shoes, so what do I know?
2513839, yup.
Posted by guru0509, Thu Jan-28-16 02:59 AM
>probably somewhere curled up in a ball right now crying or
>either drinking himself silly.
>
>Mitchell doesn't really give fuck though because he knows he's
>the typical black "rebuilding" coach and he knows he won't get
>a chance to coach these kids when they get good and they'll
>bring in a Steve Kerr to reap the benefits of all the hard
>work he put in.
2509741, Now that is a great interview
Posted by LA2Philly, Thu Jan-14-16 11:25 AM
Well spoken combined with great insight and details
2509927, love listening to coaches talk shop. i could read 100 of these.
Posted by dula dibiasi, Thu Jan-14-16 05:40 PM
2509935, you know Sam think about that bounce pass at random times too lmao
Posted by BrooklynWHAT, Thu Jan-14-16 06:13 PM
walking to the mailbox and it just pop in his head like "for real tho why the fuck did he do a bounce pass there"
2509937, right, with that classic middle-aged-black-man head shake + frown combo
Posted by dula dibiasi, Thu Jan-14-16 06:57 PM
"boy ain't got no sense"
2510071, Haha. He prolly look at Zack randomly sometimes and snicker
Posted by Orbit_Established, Fri Jan-15-16 03:33 PM

"This nigga here"

----------------------------



O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"




"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2513838, 35 points off the bench. Damn.
Posted by Dr Claw, Thu Jan-28-16 02:44 AM
2513843, I cringed when he took some of the shots
Posted by okayplayery, Thu Jan-28-16 03:39 AM
but his shot making is elite.
2513844, Zach is starting to get after guys
Posted by okayplayery, Thu Jan-28-16 03:47 AM
On the first possession he was in the game, Westbrook clearly shoved LaVine (no call was made) and said "Lift some weights" to the sophomore guard, who didn't take kindly to the advice.

And the game is slowing down for him:

"I was thinking pretty fast and making the right reads, but it slows down when you're on, so thank God for that. Just trying to learn the point and it's helping me at the two a little bit, too, because when I move to the two, I know what Ricky's looking for, at least. It's starting to build that chemistry more."
2573983, he better
Posted by Basaglia, Tue Nov-01-16 08:12 PM
2574591, at what?
Posted by isaaaa, Thu Nov-03-16 04:04 PM

Anti-gentrification, cheap alcohol & trying to look pretty in our twilight posting years (c) Big Reg


Just trying to share the world - www.JySbr.net
2573995, Trumpsaglia throwing Jabari in the bushes to ride a UCLA guy? Classic.
Posted by theeraser, Tue Nov-01-16 08:52 PM
2573996, you so mad
Posted by Basaglia, Tue Nov-01-16 08:53 PM
2574001, I call it like I see it. Sorry if that upsets you, Agenda Goggles
Posted by theeraser, Tue Nov-01-16 09:00 PM
2578530, Wiggins stock is sky high, so I want in on this agenda.
Posted by Orbit_Established, Thu Nov-24-16 09:49 AM

LaVine basically has no flaws.

I want in.
2578533, Gimme some of that Giannis. We can make this work.
Posted by Basaglia, Thu Nov-24-16 10:25 AM
2578545, *Plays 'Strickly Business' (Tommy Davidson) song*
Posted by Orbit_Established, Thu Nov-24-16 12:05 PM


2581296, welp
Posted by Basaglia, Thu Dec-08-16 09:36 PM
2581310, both are equally great
Posted by justin_scott, Thu Dec-08-16 09:54 PM
Lavine is slightly better, but Wiggins is no slouch.
2581317, Aka the "I'm throwing Bari in the bushes" post
Posted by theeraser, Thu Dec-08-16 10:04 PM
2581322, Mad Guy, Jabari is better than Wiggins. Worry about yourself
Posted by Basaglia, Thu Dec-08-16 10:23 PM

Wiggins literally does nothing better than Jabari. pay attention.
2582167, anthony bennett still in the league. anthony randolph isn't.
Posted by Basaglia, Tue Dec-13-16 10:27 PM
2582184, *blankstare*
Posted by thebadnegro, Wed Dec-14-16 12:54 AM
smh.















There's God and There's Flygod. Praise Both.
2582186, "the Jabari thing ain't enough" ???
Posted by theeraser, Wed Dec-14-16 01:46 AM
2582188, Bari was obviously gonna be better. Zach wasn't expected
Posted by Basaglia, Wed Dec-14-16 07:51 AM
Except by me
2582246, So why'd you throw Bari into the bushes for Zach? Bari > Wiggy rn??
Posted by theeraser, Wed Dec-14-16 01:31 PM
2582247, bari better than him...what's to talk about there?
Posted by Basaglia, Wed Dec-14-16 01:39 PM
that don't surprised people? zach being better is a surprise....except to me.
2582320, Coz Bari and Wiggins is far from over and you know it.
Posted by theeraser, Thu Dec-15-16 12:16 AM
2582192, this post has lots of gems
Posted by ShawndmeSlanted, Wed Dec-14-16 08:56 AM
2584291, .
Posted by Basaglia, Fri Dec-23-16 09:42 PM
2584452, FTR: I did get in on this just in time. You even acknowledged it.
Posted by Orbit_Established, Sun Dec-25-16 02:39 AM

So we good on this

And we made peace on Jabari-Giannis


----------------------------



O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"




"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2584453, Merry Christmas, bruh. We good.
Posted by Basaglia, Sun Dec-25-16 05:33 AM
2637953, Maintenance
Posted by Basaglia, Mon Jan-15-18 06:59 PM
2638076, LaVine better than Wiggins AND Jabari? This a W for Warren huh
Posted by theeraser, Tue Jan-16-18 03:41 PM
2638077, we'll see
Posted by Basaglia, Tue Jan-16-18 03:44 PM
2676802, Fascinating.
Posted by RandomFact, Wed Oct-24-18 09:33 PM
2676804, #blogboys lose again. that contact bout to be a steal.
Posted by dula dibiasi, Wed Oct-24-18 10:08 PM
2676817, Actually it's analytics nerds that hated Lavine. So there's that.
Posted by Orbit_Established, Thu Oct-25-18 08:09 AM



----------------------------



O_E: "Acts like an asshole and posts with imperial disdain"




"I ORBITs the solar system, listenin..."

(C)Keith Murray, "
2676820, Both a W and an L for Ba here
Posted by auragin_boi, Thu Oct-25-18 08:56 AM
LaVine is better than Wiggins...and Jabari.

Damn...the vision/nonvision here.

lol
2676822, Jabari done had 34 knee and foot surgeries in 4 years. leeme lone
Posted by Basaglia, Thu Oct-25-18 09:28 AM
2676828, True...I ain't hating, just saying
Posted by auragin_boi, Thu Oct-25-18 10:37 AM
Hell, I hope dude blows up and scores 25ppg this yr.

Him, LaVine and Lauri could be our 3 piece combo.
2705671, Jabari better than Wiggins, bro.
Posted by Basaglia, Sat Oct-26-19 09:15 AM
2705960, No argument from me there.
Posted by auragin_boi, Tue Oct-29-19 08:40 AM
Wiggins is a bust...extreme disappointment given his natural abilities.
2676833, ain't it?
Posted by LeroyBumpkin, Thu Oct-25-18 12:00 PM
I'll admit I wasn't expecting this.
2676807, https://twitter.com/TermineRadio/status/1055286541881352192?s=19
Posted by dula dibiasi, Wed Oct-24-18 10:15 PM
https://twitter.com/TermineRadio/status/1055286541881352192?s=19
2681351, revisiting this again.
Posted by Dr Claw, Sun Dec-09-18 05:34 PM
man, Andrew Wiggins may not even be better than Dion Waiters at this point.

I do think Collin Sexton will be better.

L for me
2689474, Best Walk Down agenda win yet.
Posted by Basaglia, Sat Mar-02-19 03:10 AM
2689536, Zach > Wiggins > Can of Corn > Jabari
Posted by isaaaa, Sat Mar-02-19 04:55 PM

Anti-gentrification, cheap alcohol & trying to look pretty in our twilight posting years (c) Big Reg
http://Tupreme.com
2705734, RJ Barrett overrated
Posted by Warren Coolidge, Sat Oct-26-19 06:38 PM
2705751, LMAO....no he not
Posted by Basaglia, Sat Oct-26-19 09:17 PM
2689537, PAD ON 'EM BA!
Posted by dula dibiasi, Sat Mar-02-19 04:57 PM
2689980, yooooooooooooooooooooooooo
Posted by RandomFact, Wed Mar-06-19 10:28 PM
2705670, Where my Chi-town niggas? Is we gon party or what?
Posted by Basaglia, Sat Oct-26-19 08:37 AM
2707140, Wait now, just hold up...eeeeh
Posted by auragin_boi, Fri Nov-15-19 11:58 AM
He keeps this up...
2707184, he ain't keeping shit up
Posted by Basaglia, Fri Nov-15-19 10:14 PM
2707188, Shit, Andrew, you back from the dead!?
Posted by okayplayery, Sat Nov-16-19 04:30 AM
https://images.app.goo.gl/QHWTZ8QREueWXmbG8

Wiggy crawling back from the grave last second, while Ba was going to put the last stone in place!