http://www.kansascity.com/2013/07/15/4345934/six-decades-later-rare-video-emerges.html

July 15

By RUSTIN DODD

The Kansas City Star


LAWRENCE — It’s been nearly 60 years since Wilt Chamberlain arrived on the campus of KU, an athletic phenom and grand curiosity from the Philadelphia basketball scene.

Six decades later, rare video emerges of Wilt Chamberlain’s NCAA tourney exploits at KU
Despite their history, former KU star Robertson has ‘zero hate’ for Mizzou
McCray establishing herself in WNBA, overseas
Juco offensive tackle Pearce Slater commits to KU
The bird returns as KU football team reveals new helmets

After sitting out his freshman year, in accordance with the rules of the day, Chamberlain averaged 29.6 points and 18.9 rebounds during the 1956-57 season, leading the Jayhawks to the NCAA title game, where they would lose in triple overtime to North Carolina at Municipal Auditorium in Kansas City.

Still considered one of the greatest college games of all time, Chamberlain would wear the scars of that game for the rest of his life. He’d play just one more season at Kansas before leaving school a year early. Nearly six decades later, most of Chamberlain’s legendary college exploits are just that — legend, without video to prove how dominant he was in his two seasons at Kansas.

But late last week, the YouTube user “Wilt Chamberlain Archive” posted a nearly 20-minute video of Chamberlain highlights from the Jayhawks’ NCAA tournament run in 1957. By Monday morning, the video had gone viral, recording thousands of hits in the process.

On a Monday morning in mid July, it’s worth a watch.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=S8JuK2dVky0#at=994

he had a really nice touch.

Why does it looks like white dudes from this era were super fast?

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Gumbo, gris-gris, plus my etouffee got em paying 20 bones

This is by far the most video I've ever seen with Wilt. Now I feel cheated I didnt get to see him play and live through that era. I feel cheated he was not around during better video technology.

The quickness and flat out speed was ridiculous. He was playing with a speed bust on the fast breaks, rebounds and blocks.

The turn around J was fluid.

I owe Sunny Hill an apology. I need to make a trip to the living room and confess this Sunday.


I thought what made Shaq so unique was that at his size he was able to move like a 6'5" guy at times. Wilt was moving like he was 6'1".

Although the post looked way more crowded than today's game, I'm curious what he would look like in an iso and a bigger 6'10" or better player was putting a body on him. They were just letting him squat and time his jump in the post.

Either way I'm permanently convinced off that video alone that he was top 3 and no worst.

You always wonder how the old greats' games would translate in different times. After seeing that, I fully believe he would dominate in any era. He was so ahead of his time. I bet that was MINDBLOWING to see him at the time.

He played against white guys nowhere near his size, take his numbers with a grain of salt.

Add another commentary on Big O too

35 year old Wilt was 2nd-team all-NBA in 71-72. He lead the league in rebaounds with 19/game and shot a league-leading .649 from the field. The NBA All-stars that year were:


East
Butch Beard
Archie Clark
Dave Cowens*
Billy Cunningham*
Dave DeBusschere*
Walt Frazier*
John Havlicek*
Lou Hudson
John Johnson
Bob Kauffman
Jack Marin
Wes Unseld*
Tom Van Arsdale
Jo Jo White

West
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar*
Wilt Chamberlain*
Gail Goodrich*
Connie Hawkins*
Elvin Hayes*
Spencer Haywood
Bob Lanier*
Bob Love
Oscar Robertson*
Cazzie Russell
Paul Silas
Jimmy Walker
Jerry West*
Sidney Wicks

Prime Wilt would have beasted in any era.

Not exactly small guys or scrubs, so with that, please STFU.

Cool.

Does not really tell us much about his professional career.

>Does not really tell us much about his professional career.

Let's find out, using your examples, Reed, Russ, Cap, Stokes, Hayes, et al.

(Wilt's listed at 7'1". His gaudy years were 59-66, let's look at those and a few more.)

Reed: Listed at 6'9", Wilt DOMINATED him......in Reed's rookie year. Beyond that, hit 50 on him once, couple in the 30's. Cool.

Russel: No numbers from their '59 - '64 battles, but Wilt never topped 37 after '64.


Stokes: Uhhhhhh, Maurice Stokes? 6'7" Maurice Stokes? More importantly, the Maurice Stokes whose career ended in 1958, a year before Wilt entered the league?

Cap: Met between '69 and '73, Wilt never topped 29.

Hayes: Listed at 6'8". Met from '68 to '73. Wilt never topped 36.



His earliest, ridiculousy DOMINANT years were against Bill Russel and a whole lot of 6'8" white dudes (Pettit, Dolph Schayes, Red Kerr) before Walt Bellamy came along.

His MOST ridiculous year was 61-62, when we had 9 teams. Your opposing centers?

Russell
Pettit
Bellamy (R)
Red Kerr
Wayne Embry
Walter Dukes
Darrel Imhof?
Jim Krebs?


From '66 on Wilt was a mid 20's scorer, probably no coincidence the league was getting bigger (and blacker) ((and better)) with Lucas, Unseld, Thurmond, et al.


I havent even mentioned the fact that Wilt AVERAGED 45.8 MINUTES PLAYED PER GAME....for his entire career. (His per 36 numbers are 23 and 18.)

There is ZERO chance if he played in the modern era his career is anything more than 25/12 type numbers, still very, very good, but not this shock and awe romanticism shit. He was ahead of his time tho, that's for sure.

No Walleye.

And of course he played every minute of every game at his peak. That is somehow a knock? How about the fact that he did not ONCE foul out during his career, despite those minutes anchoring a defense?

Further, there actually *is* some "coincidence" to his diminished scoring. You're making a fair assumption, but an inaccurate one. Read what Wilt said as his career progress and what Alex Hannum had him doing with the Sixers. He sacrificed tons of scoring once he had actual talent around him. Compare his rosters from 1965 onward with his early career. There is no contest, and he tailored his game accordingly.

You're saying 25/12? That is preposterous. What player with his size and agility have we seen? Hakeem potentially, Shaq arguably (sort of a different combo that may have been equivalent), and after that there are only a few arguables. and all of them were more productive than that.

Thurmond came into the league in 1963, and they battled plenty with Wilt getting the better. Against Russell, he grabbed 55 rebounds and had plenty of huge stat lines (the argument is not that he didn't, but that they were empty ... history is written by the winners though).

You're looking at guys 6'9" on that list, are we saying three inches is that huge of an edge? Among those nine centers, I saw a bunch of all-stars and at least three hall of famers. So your point is that they were short? That I was mistaken in saying Stokes, whose career was short, had one year of overlap with Wilt? Not really Walleye-ish.

If an old Wilt who had long since de-emphasized scoring in his game was putting up the high 20s on Jabbar, we can feel pretty confident he would have been more than formidable in his prime. Again, Jabbar's career lasted so long that goes a couple eras beyond Wilt's.

Adjusted numbers of that 61-62 seasons still had him at 35 and 19 or so, it was Elliot Kalb's book, and he was actually sort of making a case against Wilt as No. 1 (somewhat controversially, he had Shaq at the top).

You're bending overbackward here to knock down Wilt? Why? Jordanian allegiances are not for Pistons fans.

>
>You're saying 25/12? That is preposterous.

Literally noone ever has those numbers for a career. Those are EXTREMELY good numbers. He wouldnt do 30 and 22, tho, not even close.

>And of course he played every minute of every game at his peak. That is somehow a knock?

No, it's just typical of the era. Gene Shue once played 44.5 minutes per game. That make him a better athlete than Bron?

But really the 25, too. He was old and barely making an effort to score and putting up 25-ish. You named guys as the league got blacker who weren't any bigger (Unseld, Cowens, etc). Like I said, that had little if anything to do with it. If he's getting 20/20 against Kareem, I'm pretty sure he could handle Kendrick Perkins.

There is so much revisionism going on in this thread it's ridiculous. We are talking about Chamberlain, not George Mikan here.

>But really the 25, too. He was old and barely making an
>effort to score and putting up 25-ish.

Even more lol @ "barely making an effort to score". He was top ten in FGA and led the league in free throw attempts. Fact is, his numbers are skewed. He played in a different, slower era, when EVERYONE played far more minutes than they do today. If you really believe he'd be able to average 22 boards for an ENTIRE CAREER in todays game.....I dont know what to tell ya. He was ahead of his time. Doesnt mean he's not an all timer.

Almost nobody was expected to perform at a high level past 30 until the 90s.

To your made up point though, Kareem did just fine from age 30-34. Russells numbers stayed consistent from 30-retirement, Bob Pettit averaged 28 and 15 at 30 and 31, Mo Cheeks had some of his best years after 30, Artis Gilmore was a beast til he was 35, Larry Nance as well. Bernard King averaged 28 a game at age 34....you did say "almost nobody" though.

Are those numbers a little arbitrary? Sure. Someone with much more advanced training than two intro courses in stats can come up with something more precise.

Relative to earlier in his career, yes, he was not as athletic and he was shooting less. In today's game, he would have been used like Shaq, run through on every possession. The three point line would also open up new dimensions for him as both a scorer and a passer, which he was better at than pretty much any big to ever exist.

who's the GOAT center?

something you can't over look...

I would say that Wilt was a more dominant all around player.... Kareem though was a better offensive weapon....free throw shooter....

its close but Cap had a more accomplished career.

so his NBA greatness, to me, makes him the greatest basketball player ever when everything is taken into account.

I think you'd have a strong argument there. Russell won 2 NCAA titles and 11 NBA titles, loads of individual accolades, and he didn't hang on forever and ever. Wilt is the most dominant thing to ever touch a basketball court, if not any playing surface period. Jordan had a level of dominance that I'd argue was higher than Cap's. Tough comparison there.

time frame.

not because i don't believe he did it...i just can't picture it.

he was a big-time jumper. as competitive as he was, you know he was fucking with all the events in practice. probably the greatest athlete in history.

Wilt is the GOAT, I ain't gonna argue with them (even if I disagree). Yes, he played against midgets comparatively (most of those dudes looked no taller than 6'8" and these were elite college players in the Tourney) so his numbers are a bit inflated but what this video shows is that he'd be the best big man prospect in the NBA right today with that skillset.

Seeing him when he was stronger and even more polished (as a pro)...man, he'd likely be the best center we've prolly seen. Cap would be right there but man, Wilt looked amazing in college (faster and more athletic than Cap).

Javale McGee but with actual post moves, body control, a jump shot and a high bball IQ. LMAO

I have a whole new respect for Wilt.

The NBA really does it's fans a disservice by not having a Netflix type service to allow fans to watch old games of Wilt in real time.

i give Wilt the 2nd best Center title slightly over Kareem however Shaq in his Prime would eat him for breakfast.

Shaq didn't play on the kind of stacked teams that Wilt did either.

give Shaq Jerry West, Goodrich and Baylor and he has Rangs on his toes easily. and 4 rangs ain't nothing to sneeze at with 6 overall appearences and domiance as is.

just sayin..

Dude had an impeccable balance of strength & stamina ala Dennis Rodman. He would have Shaq sweating bullets like Pat Ewing in the 1st quarter of games.

Shaq could be unstoppable period.

like i said give Shaq Wilts teams and Shaq has jewelry on his toes.

they both are the two ultimate big men freak of nature, i'll concede that, however Shaq would be better.

shaq made free throws when they counted period.

Shaq's big career adjustment was developing a game all of 6-8 feet from the rim. Jackson had it easy on that one lol.

Put Shaq in Wilt's era, he fouls out constantly, and he also doesn't get as big. Put Wilt in Shaq's era, he benefits from playing a bunch of soft and/or past their prime cats as competition, plus he's even heavier than the 300-ish he finished his career at.

They've already done adjustments of Wilt's numbers for Shaq's era. It wasn't even close.

and Shaq was quick and could move. not to mention he could pass and was versatile.

Shaq played in a flopping era as well do you know how many more points Shaq might have had if the NBA didn't stand for the National Best Actor Association?

Shaq would have won more rings as well. wasn't as many rounds and lesser teams.

that to send shaq to a gone-by era, he'd have to be given a game to match.

he would have been phenomenal, but he would not have been better than wilt. a team with both of them would have been certifiably unbeatable. in any era.

>They've already done adjustments of Wilt's numbers for Shaq's
>era. It wasn't even close.

pretty good read. he had shaq no. 1. all the usual suspects were high. he had iverson at no. 29, and in the foreword he said he was "top 30 all time, maybe the GOAT."

the greatest athlete ever from a physical standpoint..


but the other thing..

even in college...he knew what to do with the ball...kept it high...passed out of the triple team...sure handed...

and no dunks...

and most of them were dunks were he barely grabbed the rim. He wasn't really bashing it...it couldn't really in that era...being the only Black man on the court ...or one of a couple..he couldn't play an all out power game...couldn't risk hurting an opponent like that....He spoke on that.... he had to restrain his physical dominance in college and not dunk with fury ...honestly at risk of his own safety as a Black man at that time...

he wasn't all finesse at that time but his power game was finessed out of necessity...which to me from a talent level puts him above all centers....and really players.

>and most of them were dunks were he barely grabbed the rim.
>He wasn't really bashing it...it couldn't really in that
>era...being the only Black man on the court ...or one of a
>couple..he couldn't play an all out power game...couldn't risk
>hurting an opponent like that....He spoke on that.... he had
>to restrain his physical dominance in college and not dunk
>with fury ...honestly at risk of his own safety as a Black man
>at that time...
>
>he wasn't all finesse at that time but his power game was
>finessed out of necessity...which to me from a talent level
>puts him above all centers....and really players.

remarkable stuff

unbelievable.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=S8JuK2dVky0#t=157s


I've never seen that sh*t.

nigga took selfishness to a whole 'nother level

just remember that if you compare Wilt to other centers...or try and place him in other eras..

you can't put the wilt you see in this video into a more modern era with bigger opponents....and NOT give him a modern game.

There are only a handful of dunks on this video.... what you see is a restrained power. Wilt could not play an all out power game with forceful dunks and power moves. He had to play a more finesse game because of the times...he was the biggest dude out there...a Black man..playing basketball in the Midwest. He spoke on how he had to restrain his power so to not hurt any of his opponents.

Put Wilt in a modern game ...a modern style...freely dunking...freely using his strength and power..

He would have destroyed Shaq and the like...lolol... Are you kidding me? Thats' a 7 foot 1 250 pound dude running the court like that.... Those times when he dipped and did finger rolls, or used the glass...if he was in an era where the dunk was the norm he would have been even more devastating...

The only guy who really could give him a challenge would have been Kareem in his prime because he could have come close athletically and would have been able to challenge Wilt with the sky hook....

but anyone else...it's not going down. Russell and the Celtics would team up on Wilt..if we're talking 1 player vs. 1 player.... nobody is fukkin with Wilt in any era...

peep the passing out of the triple teams....the rebounding....

can't fukk with him.

it's a close comparsion...

And Shaq the only comparable physical force.

Obviously they each have some strengths and weaknesses relative to one another.

Admiral is a legit 7ft dude while Dream is no taller than 6'10". Wilt's game was more similar to the Admiral's in that they both were great at running down the floor. Defensively, you can't go wrong w/ either Dream/Admiral.

in a modern context unfuckwitable


does it even matter?

how to properly catch the ball in the post..and how to successfully pass out of a double or triple team....

there are guys who never ever learn to do that properly.... yet still have a "successful" career.....(*cough* one just signed with Houston)

at such a young age Wilt had those 2 skills down ....

it always seems basic, but it's difficult for big men to do because of coordination issues....but when you threw the ball to Wilt in the post he caught it....and he knew what to do with it either passing or making moves to the basket....

say what you want about his shortcomings, i think we can all agree that jordan is one of the most athletic bigs and a guy who can run the floor. he is very close to wilt's size at 6'11" 265 (bigger than wilt in the vid, likely). he looked like a fat mongoloid in college compared with what's on display in this video.

I meant to look that up right after I saw the video. The way he was snatching rebounds in traffic and blocking on help D was ridiculous.

To me the video puts context around his dominance. He had an actual form to his jump shot and not that Dwight Howard or Shaq BS, more like Pat Ewing. Add to that his mobility and knowledge of the game. You can clearly see that he made the right plays with ease.


I had this argument last night with a friend but Wilt's teammate were ass compared to the HOFs that everyone else in the top 10 players of all time played with. Michael is the only one who had a similar but better weaker supporting cast. Russell, Magic, and Bird played with middle tier HOFs. Not the clowns Wilt played with.


Russell never avg 20pts a game. Was only the 2nd leading scorer on his team once. Most of the time he was 3rd or 4th at around 17pts a game.

Thanks for his competing against Kareem, you can do the man-who-beat-the-man thing all the way up to the Ewing/Hakeem era, and really from there to the present day.

The "inflated numbers" argument is deaded by era-adjusted numbers and later in his career he made a sport of even contributions. Who in today's NBA would even be capable of winning the NBA's Triple Crown? I don't even think LeBron could get terribly close.

You gon' live forever
Whether you want to or not
Some of us gon' end up holy
Some of us gon' end up hot.....

Wilt may be overrated by some - I mean the majority of his numbers came against short white dudes pretending they're centers - but I'll admit that for a dude 7'2", I've never seen a guy as fast or fluid moving like he did.

Still ain't better than Cap though.

Interestingly there wasn't much time separating Jabbar from Wilt, yet Jabbar never accomplished anything close to Wilt's individual dominance.

>Interestingly there wasn't much time separating Jabbar from
>Wilt, yet Jabbar never accomplished anything close to Wilt's
>individual dominance.


LOLOLOL

Wilt started his career a whole DECADE before Kareem did. The difference difference in the level of talent at the center position league wide in 10 years is significant. And LOL @ naming three black centers as if he played against them night in and night out. Funny thing is, there are a lot of unremarkable performances from Wilt against those 3. Wilts athleticism and skill level for someone his size is extraordinary. Kareem could have done the same numbers against the same level of competition. I stand by that.

He averaged nearly NINETEEN boards a game in his last year *while Kareem was in the NBA* & Kareem cracked fourteen once in his entire career.

Cracked thirty points maybe 2 or 3 times.

You don't just push Kareem back eight to ten years in history & say that's TWENTY extra points or TEN extra rebounds per game.

That's just silly, Kareem himself wouldn't even try to claim that.

You can make arguments for Cap for a lot of reasons, him winning MVP with a fifteen year gap in between is ridiculous-probably never see it again, he's the all-time points leader, he won a rack of titles, etc.

But to try to pretend that any point in his career he was as individually dominant even relative to his competition as Wilt Chamberlain just comes off as stubbornly riding for your guy in the face of facts & logic.

And the longevity thing is partly because Wilt, like Jim Brown, had gotten his taste of Hollywood, was bored, had dominated his sport, owned every record at the time & done what he felt he needed to do plus pro sports weren't paying like they were now so there wasn't even a financial motivation.

What guy is averaging 18.6 boards, shooting 73% from the field & coming off two Finals appearances then just retiring at 36 in this day & age?

he said wilt wasn't playing against the good black centers every night as if there were 32 teams in the league and not 10
sixers might have played the celtics 12+ times in a season (probably more since they often saw them in the playoffs)
same goes for the other centers concrete named
and like u stated there wasn't a seismic shift in the league between wilt and kareems era and wilt was still putting up monstrous numbers when kareem entered the league
just dumb arguments

And he shits all on Kareem Abdul-Jabbar.

plus you had excellent white centers, too.

chamberlain's competition was better than shaq's and, at various periods in his career, better than jabbar's. wilt played him head to head as an old ass dude and held his own. if they went head up, it would have been a decisive advantage. i don't get where you're getting this bullshit retro agenda, but it's mostly boring.

* had to get a shout-out for the lame-ass sport I happened to excel at back in the day.

Wilt's Philly public-school career points record at Overbrook (which he did in THREE years as opposed to four for damn near every other challenger after) stood for FIFTY years.

The man was unreal.

period.

>period.

so it's really not worth a discussion.

Wilt only won 2 rings because he choked away a handful of game 7's.

his teams just had to be extraordinary to break through.

the 2 times Wilt had a team capable of winning the title compared to the team they were playing...they won...... well..maybe 2 out of 3... Russell's last year the Laker coach benched Wilt in the 4th quarter of the deciding game for some crazy reason..

but the Celtics just always had better teams...more players...

in fact those Celtic teams had a higher percentage of the league's best players on them than any other basketball dynasty ever..

it's a team sport.

Wilt was 1-7 against Russell in the playoffs but 4 times the series went 7 games and Wilt went 0-4, and each one of those game 7's were close. he couldn't even win when Russell was 34 and his team had a 3-1 lead in the series.

it's not close.

Game 7 scores:

109-107
110-109
100-96
108-106

can't discredit russ and them for shit, they didn't even belong in the finals much less winning them on paper that year. still, a half healthy wilt means the lakers take that one. prior to that, you're right, the Cs had a big top to bottom advantage with the possible exception of 1968. the teams were pretty even, boston won in seven. all chamberlain did in the playoffs was put up 25 and 25.

>it's not close.

you should know your audience and not waste any more time.

forreal tho dude was knocking down jumpers, ft's. he must've really been the perfect center.

i see why he got a c-note.

being the GOAT on OKP is quite another.

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-Cm2c74za2GE/T0VbCzeMoOI/AAAAAAAAC_U/WJUvQ7BDBHk/s640/U%2520mad.jpg

Wilt played all 48.

extrapolate that 10% onto his score, he still isn't getting 100.

he'd have hit 100. he shot 46 times, if you extrapolate 17 more attempts at his 60% clip he's cracking triple digits, even if he only made 50% of those extra shots he's probably there.

but no one will ever shoot the ball over 60 times in a game, not even if it goes to 5 overtimes, that level of selfishness is incomprehensible.

FOH dude, there's no spinning it the way you want it to spin, like usual.

Even if he were able to do that, he'd BARELY scrape 100, and that's asking a whole lot. Where would he find the time and the openings to take that many more shots? It's not like he was sharing the ball as it was.

WOW!! at his size next to a young Shaq @ :33. jahlove was prolly right about him benchpresing 500

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=zukRbA3y0qo#t=51

Grantland did a thing on Arnold kicking it with Wilt and Andre the Giant. Arnold mentions how Wilt was lifting way more than the strongest dudes in the gym

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZPd4brXPfw

a 80's wrestling match between Andre & Wilt wuda been awesome..lol

>Grantland did a thing on Arnold kicking it with Wilt and
>Andre the Giant. Arnold mentions how Wilt was lifting way more
>than the strongest dudes in the gym
>
>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZPd4brXPfw

https://www.instagram.com/p/Bj-q1eWhXbv/?utm_source=ig_embed

time they’re talking about an NBA record being broken it’s his.

Yet outside of MJ, Kareem and Russell get mentioned in the GOAT convo before Wilt which is crazy.