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Forum nameThe Lesson
Topic subjectIs K Dot the Greatest West Coast MC of All-Time?
Topic URLhttp://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=5&topic_id=2974837
2974837, Is K Dot the Greatest West Coast MC of All-Time?
Posted by Anonymous, Wed Oct-05-16 07:05 PM
Overly Dedicated
Section .80
good kid, k.A.A.d. city
To Pimp A Butterfly

Unless we're still holding on to Cube.

Y'all still got Snoop higher?

Discuss...
2974839, RE: Is no n/m
Posted by Nodima, Wed Oct-05-16 08:15 PM

~~~~~~~~~
"This is the streets, and I am the trap." � Jay Bilas
http://www.popmatters.com/pm/archive/contributor/517
Hip Hop Handbook: http://tinyurl.com/ll4kzz
2974841, Who is?
Posted by Anonymous, Wed Oct-05-16 08:40 PM
2974916, It's Ice Cube and Kendrick would have to do a lot to supplant him.
Posted by Nodima, Thu Oct-06-16 03:40 PM
And I'm saying that as someone who thinks it's clear Kendrick has the better discography - he has four releases better than Ice's second best (Death Certificate), but if we want to call OD his first real project that's about on Bow Down / Guerillas in the Mist status and it got there on ambition and potential, not necessarily quality songwriting. Those Cube records are more enjoyable to listen to.


And that's where the argument starts. We're talking about pop music here, and Kendrick hasn't made enough of it. When Ice Cube wrote a pop song, he wrote the best fucking pop songs you could while staying hard. "Today Was a Good Day" didn't need a singing hook to be catchy as hell, and he could get his point across on stuff like "Endangered Species" or "Once Upon a Time in the Projects" without being melodramatic. Ice Cube was a funnier guy, and brought levity to his serious topics that Kendrick often fails or refuses to match.


(All the below paragraphs are just wankery of me messing around with my Handbook stuff because I haven't taken a look at it in a while and I just felt like it so feel free to read the first sentence or two and then give up.)


Granted these are all subjective things and there are going to be people out there that value the high art of Kendrick's work, and one could certainly argue that Ice Cube played it safe by rapping over 'typical' hip-hop beats and making fun songs rather than actually antagonizing his white audience. There's also a lot to be said for how many great projects Kendrick has compared to Cube. I stopped running the Handbook prior to TPAB, but for sake of argument let's give it the same score as Good Kid. Personally, I think Good Kid's a better record by a significant amount (on my scale, 'significant' was about .5-1.0), but I'll concede to popular opinion for this conversation.


KENDRICK LAMAR
1. good kid, m.A.A.d city: 8.95
2. To Pimp a Butterfly: 8.95
2. Section.80: 8.94
3. Overly Dedicated: 6.65
___________________________________
Average: 8.37/10

I'm going to include Straight Outta Compton on Ice's resume here, but my rule was you had to rap on 75% of the tracks for a release to be considered part of your discography originally (aka The "36 Chambers Counts for Raekwon But Can't Artificially Boost the Discography of U-God" Rule) so on balance, while 10 releases would give Ice another 0.5 boost to his average, I won't let him have that here.

ICE CUBE
1. AmeriKKKa's Most Wanted: 9.40
2. Death Certificate: 8.88
3. The Predator: 8.19
4. Lethal Injection: 8.14
5. Straight Outta Compton: 7.91
6. Bow Down: 6.66
7. Guerillas in tha Mist: 6.62
8. War & Peace Vol. I (The War Disc): 5.54
9. War & Peace Vol. 2 (The Peace Disc): 4.99
10. Raw Footage: 4.76
___________________________________
Average: 7.61/10


Within this hypothetical, I'm also willing to argue that Ice Cube was the better MC despite Kendrick now having three albums in my Top 50 - at 44, 45, and 46, respectively - which isn't actually the case since I'm pretty confident TPAB would score a fair amount outside the Top 50. Part of it is the aforementioned enjoyable nature of Ice Cube at the height of his power even when he was calling me a total piece of shit, part of it is his ability to get a point across without any need for abstraction or dramatics. He loses a little for the misogyny and blatant racism (not just toward whites), but I think he gets a pass for the era he came out in.

But more than anything, I think Kendrick has to get the opportunity to have a Raw Footage or a War & Peace Vol. 1 & 2. We also have to see if this current era of production ever falls off - the west coast went from incredible to terrible in record time for a style of music, and the producers Cube worked with hurt his case as much as the work he was doing on their beats; I often wonder if he was really uninspired by the opportunities he had as a musician repping the west coast and it wasn't all Hollywood that doomed him.

Sometimes by the same token Kendrick comes off as, for lack of a better term, a try hard, doing too much just to prove a point about his talent and distracting from what he's saying rather than emphasizing it. I worry that it'll get the better of him at some point and he'll become a #woke Recovery-era Eminem, making gibberish sound good and handicapping his own concepts with bad jokes that took a PhD in rhyming to come up with but land with a thud anyway. I have to give him the opportunity to reach that stage of his career.

I can definitely see him surpassing Cube. Anyway, I'm just rambling because I don't have any assignments at work. One last Handbook thing, just on the raw discography numbers, a Top 10 WC discographies (not straight rappers, but I'll leave Madlib out since his is almost entirely production) list (minimum 3 releases reviewed).

Really helps put in perspective how much I ignored the west through my career, or how little work some of my favorites (like Twinz) ended up doing. I think if/when I rev the engine back up that'd be my first focus considering how hot the west is right now, it'd only be right. For example, DJ Quik is one review away from being on this list, and if it were on of his albums I loved, he'd likely have the #2 spot immediately.

1. Dr. Dre - 8.35
2. Blu - 8.24 (a lot of shit releases weren't reviewed)
3. 2Pac - 8.19 (AEoM not reviewed)
4. Kendrick Lamar - 8.18 (TPAB not reviewed)
5. ScHoolboy Q - 7.91 (Blank Face not reviewed)
6. Ice Cube - 7.52 (LNCL, I am the West not reviewed)
7. Snoop Dogg - 7.47 (Da Game..., Paid tha Cost..., 2015/16 stuff not reviewed)
8. Fashawn - 7.41 (just Boy Meets World and a couple tapes, really doesn't count)
9. Del the Funkee Homosapien - 6.78
10. Tyler the Creator - 6.74


~~~~~~~~~
"This is the streets, and I am the trap." � Jay Bilas
http://www.popmatters.com/pm/archive/contributor/517
Hip Hop Handbook: http://tinyurl.com/ll4kzz
2974918, K Dot got 4 releases better than Death Certificate?!
Posted by Nick Has a Problem...Seriously, Thu Oct-06-16 03:43 PM
TPaB is the only one I'd put above it. The other albums aren't even close.
2974919, You know, looking back at it
Posted by Nodima, Thu Oct-06-16 03:49 PM
I'm going back and looking at it and I'm lying. I'll take Good Kid, you take TPAB, and we'll call it 1 album either way.

never been as hot on TPAB as others, I enjoy untitled more but it might not hold up to critical analysis as well.

I was talking out of my ass.


Section.80 scored higher than Death Certificate but the only reason that happened was the subpar skits on Death Certificate.



~~~~~~~~~
"This is the streets, and I am the trap." � Jay Bilas
http://www.popmatters.com/pm/archive/contributor/517
Hip Hop Handbook: http://tinyurl.com/ll4kzz
2974993, Where's Kurupt?
Posted by 13Rose, Fri Oct-07-16 09:58 AM
SMH
2975010, Kurupt, Ras Kass, Xzibit, Too Short
Posted by DJR, Fri Oct-07-16 01:58 PM
I'd put all of them on there before Tyler, Fashawn, Blu, or Schoolboy Q.
2975030, X was easily my favorite from the west between 96-00
Posted by Anonymous, Fri Oct-07-16 05:43 PM
2975053, so would I, especially Too $hort
Posted by Nodima, Fri Oct-07-16 11:50 PM
like I said, as time passes the hole in west coast coverage on my lists stands out to me as its biggest weakness (besides the nerdy premise in general)


~~~~~~~~~
"This is the streets, and I am the trap." � Jay Bilas
http://www.popmatters.com/pm/archive/contributor/517
Hip Hop Handbook: http://tinyurl.com/ll4kzz
2974843, Cube and then Pac
Posted by DJR, Wed Oct-05-16 09:14 PM
Kendrick is putting together a great run though, and it's not over.

Straight Outta Compton, Amerrikkkaz Most, Kill At Will, Death Certificate, The Predator....it's still Cube.

Been on a 7 Day Theory kick lately. That album was so great.
2974844, RE: Cube and then Pac
Posted by Nick Has a Problem...Seriously, Wed Oct-05-16 10:46 PM
>Straight Outta Compton, Amerrikkkaz Most, Kill At Will, Death
>Certificate, The Predator....it's still Cube.
>
Agreed and I would take AMW and DC over any Kendrick project. Kendrick is top 5 though and moving up.
2974845, his style is akin to project blowed from the early to mid 90's
Posted by liveguy, Wed Oct-05-16 10:54 PM
He found a way to make that shit stick tho...20 years later!

So gotta say he is mos DEF up there just based on that alone.

Got dope output. Check.
Ridiculous flow. Check.
99% of the time, outshines other mc's on the same track. Check.

At the present besides your Aceyalones, Micah 9's, etc...I cant think of any MC's that could hang with him.

Cube was nice though in his hayday.

Casual is underrated also.

2974863, agreed
Posted by Heinz, Thu Oct-06-16 03:30 AM
2974870, Makes me wonder what might have happened if Dre signed the Fellowship
Posted by micMajestic, Thu Oct-06-16 08:20 AM
>He found a way to make that shit stick tho...20 years later!
>
>So gotta say he is mos DEF up there just based on that alone.
>
>Got dope output. Check.
>Ridiculous flow. Check.
>99% of the time, outshines other mc's on the same track.
>Check.
>
>At the present besides your Aceyalones, Micah 9's, etc...I
>cant think of any MC's that could hang with him.
>
>Cube was nice though in his hayday.
>
>Casual is underrated also.

and put some really great music behind them. I remember he did want to sign them at some point. For at least 10 years I believed that Fellowship didn't blow up because of the slightly off kilter rapping styles. Then here comes Kendrick....
2974935, Werd?? I thought that was Eazy that wanted to sign FF...
Posted by liveguy, Thu Oct-06-16 05:58 PM
...but for some reason that fell thru, and he ended up finding Bone Thugs.

Was always funny to me how STRIKINGLY similar Bone was to the Fellowship.
2974994, I could be wrong but I think it was both.
Posted by micMajestic, Fri Oct-07-16 10:01 AM
>...but for some reason that fell thru, and he ended up
>finding Bone Thugs.
>
>Was always funny to me how STRIKINGLY similar Bone was to the
>Fellowship.

Bone flipped some Freestyle Fellowship's style.

Just like Cube flipped some of Volume 10's style.

Organized Konfusion flipped some of Freestyle Fellowship's style on "Stress"... but very few people make the connection.
2975006, that crew low key had MASSIVE impact on west coast sound
Posted by liveguy, Fri Oct-07-16 01:10 PM
Project blowed is so damn underrated and were clearly way ahead of their time.
2975669, Eazy did sign Black Eyed Peas (Atban Klan)
Posted by j., Wed Oct-19-16 08:30 AM
whose first single was a Xerox of the Fellowship
The E is criminally underrated and looked over in terms of discovering talent (NWA, The D.O.C., BEP, Bone Thugs, Above The Law...of course he had some atrocious wackness too: Blood of Abraham and arguably started the cholo rap genre with Brownside)
2974847, cmon. like it or not, it's 2pac.
Posted by dula dibiasi, Wed Oct-05-16 11:16 PM
2974850, Cube,Pac, Snoop,DJ Quik,TOO SHort
Posted by mistermaxxx08, Wed Oct-05-16 11:31 PM
i got Kendrick behind Dr Dre, Sugga Free,Paris,
2974882, Dr. Dre ahead of Kendrick in the MC category?
Posted by KiloMcG, Thu Oct-06-16 10:45 AM
and i think MC in the context of this post is about rapping.

man, you must have really been on one last night.
2974892, lol...geez
Posted by Dstl1, Thu Oct-06-16 11:45 AM
.
2974953, DR Dre can spit and he could hang with most cats
Posted by mistermaxxx08, Thu Oct-06-16 11:09 PM
on the west coast tip he could handle his. now Dr Dre ain't seeing Ice Cube's run, however don't play him off like he is Celly Cell or Rappin 4 tay either
2974956, just say no to drugs ladies and gentlemen
Posted by justin_scott, Thu Oct-06-16 11:31 PM
or you'll post like this.
2974957, Celly Cell and Rappin 4-Tay both rapped better than Dre
Posted by DJR, Thu Oct-06-16 11:35 PM
2975007, lol...exactly...his points are becoming worse and worse
Posted by Dstl1, Fri Oct-07-16 01:29 PM
.
2974909, hahahahahahahaha
Posted by justin_scott, Thu Oct-06-16 02:07 PM
i just KNEW maxxx would be in this post replying with something brainless. and he even managed to misspell Suga Free's name.
2974920, Stick to pop & b turkey.
Posted by SP1200, Thu Oct-06-16 03:53 PM
lol
2974852, Yuck
Posted by BSharp, Wed Oct-05-16 11:47 PM
2974871, Master of Ceremonies? and what does greatest mean anyway
Posted by , Thu Oct-06-16 08:26 AM
If you are talking all around artistry, then no. - see 2pac

If you are simply talking MC - meaning (to me) stage presence and all around performer. Then no.

If you are talking lyricism - then yes, he is.


werd.
2974885, I'm talking entire package
Posted by Anonymous, Thu Oct-06-16 11:01 AM
And I'm simply asking the question.

If he isn't number 1, does he have a chance to get there?
2974893, Honestly I don't think he'll ever get there
Posted by Nick Has a Problem...Seriously, Thu Oct-06-16 11:49 AM
And it's not his fault. Those who came before him are just more important. Does he have an album as important as AMW, DC, Doggstyle, All Eyez On Me (even though I'm not a fan of that album), etc? He's top 5 though.
2974903, That's where the greatest title becomes unfair
Posted by Anonymous, Thu Oct-06-16 12:56 PM
artists aren't in control of their birth or the state of the musical landscape when they are actively recording.

Let me ask you this then...

Are those albums really better than his? You could argue that TPAB is a better piece of art than all of them.
2974908, RE: That's where the greatest title becomes unfair
Posted by DJR, Thu Oct-06-16 01:51 PM
>artists aren't in control of their birth or the state of the
>musical landscape when they are actively recording.

Agreed, but it's also reality that every genre has a "peak time" where the most influential and revered recordings happened.

>Let me ask you this then...
>
>Are those albums really better than his? You could argue that
>TPAB is a better piece of art than all of them.

I wouldn't be mad at that argument.....I wouldn't agree. But I could see the argument.
2974922, and they also have real sagging times
Posted by Nodima, Thu Oct-06-16 03:58 PM
like I alluded to deep in my wankery up top in #23, Ice Cube gets hurt not just because he got less interesting on the microphone, but because the fall off in west coast production by and large between 1996 and 2000 was EXTREMELY SEVERE. Everyone was hurt by the attempts to make cheap shit sound big budget, it hurt the east too and gave Atlanta their opening, but the west coast practically went into a coma over that shit.

Ice Cube spent his Kobe #24 years playing with Smush Parkers and didn't stay invested enough to wait for Pau Gasols and Lamar Odoms to come back around.

Kendrick Lamar benefits greatly from coming up at the same time as the west had a 2003 draft class like influx of adventurous, smart new producers.

~~~~~~~~~
"This is the streets, and I am the trap." � Jay Bilas
http://www.popmatters.com/pm/archive/contributor/517
Hip Hop Handbook: http://tinyurl.com/ll4kzz
2974937, nope, Ras Kass better
Posted by melmag, Thu Oct-06-16 07:11 PM
by a lot, too


>If you are talking lyricism - then yes, he is.

2974984, cause you dont understand him it dont mean that he nice
Posted by atruhead, Fri Oct-07-16 08:49 AM
it just means you dont understand all the bullshit that he writes
2974999, RE: cause you dont understand him it dont mean that others don't
Posted by Anonymous, Fri Oct-07-16 11:14 AM
That's some bullshit you just typed.

I'm not even a Ras fan like that but just because you don't like his style doesn't mean isn't nice and that others don't love him.
2974989, Kendrick > Aceyalone > Ras Kass
Posted by , Fri Oct-07-16 09:17 AM

werd.
2974997, Aceyalone is my nicca!
Posted by Nick Has a Problem...Seriously, Fri Oct-07-16 10:32 AM
2974894, potential is there
Posted by beatnik, Thu Oct-06-16 12:21 PM
TPAB is the album that gets him there, and he's an artist I won't even try to guess at how his next cut will sound at this point, I was expecting some stronger west coast sounds and he went full artsy

For the icons who get put up there like 40, Pac, Snoop, Cube I really think Kendrick does more on the mic flow wise, fast raps, singing, pitching his voice. I think he got all those top ranked guys in the variety department.

He almost in alter ego territory, so while those greats have the classic albums and great backgrounds/careers like one said above, we in the snapchat chat age where moving past shit is culture, so if his generation and younger people hold him up and he keeps putting out dope albums he can get there.

I don't want an environment where he has to make another "alright" for people to say his work mattered but dude just need more time.

2974896, I remember when "Top Five" came out, and everyone was naming theirs
Posted by -DJ R-Tistic-, Thu Oct-06-16 12:35 PM
And I listed like 20-25 rappers I felt were qualified of being in a Top 5. It was a month after TPAB had dropped, so that was still sinking in...but I remember saying Kendrick was still new and I wouldn't put him in a Top Five just yet. But then...my homegirl basically said "that makes no sense. He has 4 full albums, and he's been around for 6+ years. You say Biggie qualifies, but he only had 2 albums, and was around for four years. You even said Big Pun could qualify...Big fuckin Pun??? He was around for like two years with only one or two albums!!!"

And it made me think. It's a combo of things that make it difficult for us to put someone who's currently building their resume in a "Top" list, or even giving them a top spot, even if they've accomplished more than folks in the past did. It could even be that it feels impossible to place someone current above those that we grew up on, and those that obviously influenced and inspired that current artist.

With allllllll of that said......I still look at how much someone's impact mattered at the time of their prime. And with that, Cube may have fell off after 96, or even 93-94 to some folks...but NOBODY from the West and possibly even East could touch his 88-92 run at all, especially counting NWA. Pac's 93-96 run was very close...nearly equal overall, but the albums weren't as strong.

If Kendrick comes back with an album next year that's at least 85% of what his last two were...then I think he may really qualify to be the best we've seen from out here, and will even start qualifying for GOAT status.
2974910, He's definitely my favorite
Posted by Kosa12, Thu Oct-06-16 02:08 PM
At this point, he has been around and on top for like 4 years

He has the content and technical ability to out rap or at least hold his own against any west coast MC who has a comparable discography. With Section 80 - GKMC - TPAB - Untitled Unmastered has a run few (not just talking west coast MCs) can match. GKMC to me was an amazing record and then he managed to completely switch it up and do something even better, more moving and musically extremely interesting (I love jazz) with TPAB. Obviously Ice Cube will be the most brought up, Cube is dope, his solo stuff much more than the NWA record, but Kendrick has a run of 4 albums that I think are fantastic, whereas Cube has 2 (Amerikka, Death Certificate). Honestly, this may seem crazy to some people, but the only Tupac album that I like as much as Amerikka, Death Certificate, TPAB or GKMC is Me Against The World. Pac' has a solid discography, sure, but his highs (album wise, not individual song wise) outside of MATW aren't fucking with those two.
2974911, It's still Cube, then Pac, for me, but Kendrick is closing in
Posted by justin_scott, Thu Oct-06-16 02:13 PM
honestly, he's about two great albums away from legitimately being claimed as the greatest west coast emcee ever. TPAB holds up against the best west coast albums (hell, GKMC does too), but guys like Cube, Snoop, Pac have a longer track record still.
2974955, washed boards strikes again, only Pac greater
Posted by astralblak, Thu Oct-06-16 11:30 PM
and Ioneven fuck with Pac like that

yes Kendrick no. 2, already

Cube is three, and yes you must hold everything after Lethal Injection against him, and I'd still take Kendrick's albums (TPAB & GKMC) over Cube's best. cry

Micah9 is the most technically gifted rapper ever birthed not named Pharoah Monche. His music just never stuck with me, but he still 4

good day
2974959, I guess it's hard to argue with Pac
Posted by Anonymous, Fri Oct-07-16 12:04 AM
He was larger than life.

I guess with Pac the question is, is Kendrick better than Pac technically and has his output been better?
2974961, technically, hell fucking yes
Posted by justin_scott, Fri Oct-07-16 12:16 AM
that's without question. but Pac had a unique way of speaking on so many topics, and really connecting with everyone. Kendrick isn't close in that regard. Pac had so much output, most rappers will never match that. Kendrick could, but not yet definitely.
2974964, How is only Pac greater when he has 0 albums fuckin' with Cube's first 2 LPs
Posted by Nick Has a Problem...Seriously, Fri Oct-07-16 12:32 AM
And I fuck with Pac like that. We can also agree to disagree because AMW & DC are better and had greater impact than any album Kendrick has released. K Dot number 3 for now. We'll see what his next album sounds like.
2974965, but that's your opinion though
Posted by justin_scott, Fri Oct-07-16 12:37 AM
no hate meant of course.


but imho, cube, pac, and kendrick all have albums that can stand with each other.

amw=tpab=me against the world.
2974974, Everybody in here is posting their opinion
Posted by Nick Has a Problem...Seriously, Fri Oct-07-16 06:50 AM
We can agree to disagree. It's all good.
2974987, Me Against the World and 7 Day Theory are right up there IMO
Posted by DJR, Fri Oct-07-16 09:03 AM
I'd take AMW and DC over them, but I think those albums are on the same level, more or less.
2974990, Me Against the World is good
Posted by Nick Has a Problem...Seriously, Fri Oct-07-16 09:20 AM
I wouldn't call it great. I agree on 7 Day Theory though. That's easily his best album imo
2975042, Why does everyone forget Pac was a west coast trasnplant
Posted by imcvspl, Fri Oct-07-16 08:40 PM
At the very most he was bicoastal. But the only reason he was a rapper like that was from his time out east.

And I don't say this trying to claim him, but it's always weird to me that people like he wasn't living in the east for a grip of his life.

█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
Big PEMFin H & z's
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." � Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."
2975104, I don't think anyone forgets that.
Posted by tariqhu, Sun Oct-09-16 09:32 AM
the music he's known for it not east coast sounding. same with snoop and kurupt.
2975108, It's obviously about where you rep
Posted by Anonymous, Sun Oct-09-16 10:54 AM
Xzibit is from Detroit
Kurupt is from Philly

But they repped the west in their music.

X even sounded like he was from the East, so much so that I was like "why is this cat saying Cali" when I first heard Paparazzi. It that doesn't mean he isn't a west coast MC.

Pac made California Love and was shouting "West Side" during the beef.

Why on Earth would you be confused that he's seen as a west coast MC?
2975651, Same reason nobody talks about Primo being from Texas
Posted by Luke Cage, Tue Oct-18-16 06:45 PM
and he's considered the "Boom Bap" producer even though he was born, raised and college educated in Texas. His sound and style are identified as really being mastered on the East Coast so he is an "East Coast" producer in that sense.

Pac's the same to me. Sure he lived on the East Coast until he was a teenager but his style doesn't sound anymore NY than everyone else who came out at that time because everyone was influenced by the East during that era. In fact MC Ren lyrically and sonically has much more of an East Coast sound to me than Pac.
2975670, or Guru from Boston
Posted by j., Wed Oct-19-16 08:35 AM
I hear Guru and I think Brooklyn. Well the old Brooklyn, the place where we dwell and the planet
2975675, Talent wise I put Mikah 9 slightly higher than Pharoahe
Posted by micMajestic, Wed Oct-19-16 09:22 AM
>and Ioneven fuck with Pac like that
>
>yes Kendrick no. 2, already
>
>Cube is three, and yes you must hold everything after Lethal
>Injection against him, and I'd still take Kendrick's albums
>(TPAB & GKMC) over Cube's best. cry
>
>Micah9 is the most technically gifted rapper ever birthed not
>named Pharoah Monche. His music just never stuck with me, but
>he still 4
>
>good day

Pharoahe's music kills his though.

I'm going to say it again, and I fully expect crickets

"Stress - The Extinction Agenda" was highly influenced by the stylings of Freestyle Fellowship in general, and Mikah 9 in particular. That was Pharoahe's coming out party, but every style he flexed was previously heard on a Freestyle Fellowship recording.
2974985, no one has had this run ever
Posted by atruhead, Fri Oct-07-16 08:53 AM
>Overly Dedicated
>Section .80
>good kid, k.A.A.d. city
>To Pimp A Butterfly

people discredit O.D. with "it's a mixtape", people discredit Section 80 with "it's not an album"

whoever you think has the best catalog doesnt have 4 consecutive albums this good

I havent used the word "greatest", just stating facts
2975000, gotta agree here
Posted by , Fri Oct-07-16 12:32 PM
pac, cube, etc created albums before the mixtape era. To not consider Section 80 and OD as part of Kendricks overall musical catalog is ridiculous.


werd.
2975009, RE: no one has had this run ever
Posted by DJR, Fri Oct-07-16 01:56 PM
>>Overly Dedicated
>>Section .80
>>good kid, k.A.A.d. city
>>To Pimp A Butterfly
>
>people discredit O.D. with "it's a mixtape", people discredit
>Section 80 with "it's not an album"

Yeah, Section.80 is an album in my book. Great one too.

>whoever you think has the best catalog doesnt have 4
>consecutive albums this good

Overly Dedicated never grabbed me like that, but I admittedly haven't listened to it in a long time and didn't give it a lot of spins.

>I haven't used the word "greatest", just stating facts

2975680, RE: no one has had this run ever
Posted by go mack, Wed Oct-19-16 10:49 AM
>>Overly Dedicated
>>Section .80
>>good kid, k.A.A.d. city
>>To Pimp A Butterfly
>
>people discredit O.D. with "it's a mixtape", people discredit
>Section 80 with "it's not an album"
>
>whoever you think has the best catalog doesnt have 4
>consecutive albums this good
>
>I havent used the word "greatest", just stating facts



well just west coast, Cube

Straight Outta Compton
Amerikkka's Most Wanted
Death Certificate
Predator


I won't discredit mixtapes if you don't discredit a group album then where he wrote most the raps. Cube's early career still better but Kendrick coming for the spot.
2975741, Predator was trash
Posted by atruhead, Thu Oct-20-16 01:08 AM
2975824, disagree n/m
Posted by go mack, Thu Oct-20-16 03:07 PM
2975012, he will be very soon
Posted by Johnny, Fri Oct-07-16 02:23 PM
he's about 2-3 projects away

this post reminded me I need to get those early Ice Cube records

2975028, He's staking his claim, but for me he's not there yet.
Posted by Playa_Politician, Fri Oct-07-16 05:31 PM
Gotta get past Pac, and he's not there. i love the direction he's heading in tho, i didn't hop on the wagon until GKMC and still remember the first time i heard that album, i was shocked at how great it was.

That said I wonder how people's location affects their opinion on this. Growing up and living in Cali it's hard for me to say/think that he's better than Pac, Cube, Snoop or even E40 (i know 40 Water's output has watered down some of his legacy, but i'll be damned if he aint in my top 5 westcoast). IMO K Dot is definitely on his way to be one of the greats, another album like GKMC TPAB or Untitled will probably cement it for me.
2975031, Kendrick is only going to get better
Posted by Anonymous, Fri Oct-07-16 05:47 PM
He occupies a unique space achieving mainstream success while maintaining his artistic credibility.

I would say that the only other hip-hop that has achieved that to this degree was Kast.

And that's what make Kendrick so refreshing.

He has earned the leeway to release whatever he wants so I only expect him to put out more great material because he isn't trying to please anyone.

2975650, He's In The Conversation
Posted by Luke Cage, Tue Oct-18-16 05:54 PM
I still have Cube as #1 and Pac as #2 and then I have K Dot at #3 (although honestly I feel like it should be split up between best LA MC and best Bay MC because LA & The Bay are so different).

For Cube still has one of if not the best 3 album runs in Hip Hop history with Straight Outta Compton, AMW and Death Certificate. I like Section 80 but I wouldn't put it on the level of any of those Cube albums. If K dot drops another great album after TPAB (I'm not counting the untitled release as an album) then he can certainly make that claim. The tough thing for him and why some won't put him at number 1 is because we haven't seen the worldwide impact of his music just yet. Cube literally had a massive hand in changing Hip Hop and popular music and I don't know that K dot will ever be able to do that. Just in terms of music though I think it's a fair comparison and if

As far as Pac goes it's hard to imagine anyone surpassing his overall legacy as an artist but I do think both of K Dot's proper albums are better than Pac's most acclaimed album Me Against The World. I still personally like Strictly 4 My Niggaz over anything K Dot has done but I wouldn't be shocked to see K Dot doing an ever better album with his next release because he just seems to be in a zone right now.
2975678, no
Posted by Bblock, Wed Oct-19-16 10:22 AM
2975686, Snoop, Cube, Pac, Casual, Kurupt, Acey, Ras Kass, Planet Asia all better.
Posted by guru0509, Wed Oct-19-16 12:14 PM
i cant even make it 10 mins thru a kendrick lamar album or mixtape
2975707, Yeah but you've got shit taste though
Posted by Hitokiri, Wed Oct-19-16 03:23 PM
It is known.
2975781, So sensitive...
Posted by guru0509, Thu Oct-20-16 11:29 AM
hit that inhaler little boy...breathe in your brown paper bag.

its ok.
2975787, Yep.
Posted by Hitokiri, Thu Oct-20-16 11:52 AM
The sensitive one is the one with the simple, true, statement.
Not the one being all extra with the inhaler and paper bag bullshit.
Right.

You have shitty taste and a superiority complex.
The end.
2975794, Hitokiri = weeeeirdo.
Posted by guru0509, Thu Oct-20-16 12:28 PM
why do you let your feelings get so hurt over a music opinion?

this isnt the first time either.

http://board.okayplayer.com/okp.php?az=show_topic&forum=5&topic_id=2968882&mesg_id=2968882&listing_type=search

AND youre a charter member LOL. a 30+ year old acting like a 14 year old groupie. Shame.













2975818, Yep. The one in their feelings is the one who runs searches
Posted by Hitokiri, Thu Oct-20-16 02:28 PM
and analyzes old threads.
Keep going.
2975821, didnt have to search. I have an excellent memory.
Posted by guru0509, Thu Oct-20-16 02:38 PM
you however, are still a 30+ year old singling out ppl on a message board for not liking your favorite rapper in the whole wide world!!!

LMAO your only response in this thread is to what i wrote. Clearly I struck a nerve.





2975831, Nah you just have a long history of being an asshole with shitty taste.
Posted by Hitokiri, Thu Oct-20-16 03:26 PM
So here we are.
Keep reviewing my posts though.

2975836, Glad you think I'm an asshole. edit I dont even know who you are lol
Posted by guru0509, Thu Oct-20-16 04:10 PM
or your " history" other than the fact you're (allegedly)a grown man catching feelings over the INTERNET for a rapper a decade+ younger than you lol. That is the epitome of a Stan. Get a grip dude. Do you even realize how weird that is?

I *ALSO* have long ass history of giving away gigs of music here ..from my own hard drives. from way back when. Ask tone or hood.

*shrug*
2975856, Gu is easily one of the handful on this board...
Posted by TheRealBillyOcean, Thu Oct-20-16 06:21 PM
who's hip hop opinions I consider.
2975757, PLANET ASIA HAS BETTER?!?!?!?!??!??????????
Posted by -DJ R-Tistic-, Thu Oct-20-16 04:54 AM
Hell, even Ras Kass himself will tell you his albums and projects aren't as good as Kendrick's. What you listening to???
2975782, one of the worst rap voices ever
Posted by guru0509, Thu Oct-20-16 11:31 AM
lol & i couldnt care less what ras kass says or thinks.



kendrick voice is nails on a chalkboard.

*shrug*

>Hell, even Ras Kass himself will tell you his albums and
>projects aren't as good as Kendrick's. What you listening
>to???
2975795, Can you explain a bit more...
Posted by Anonymous, Thu Oct-20-16 12:35 PM
Not liking Kendrick's voice is a fair complaint.

But I feel if that is your main gripe with him then you should also be objective and fairly assess his other attributes as an artist.

Do you have other issues with Kendrick or just his voice?

Because if it's just his voice then you're being a bit extra in my opinion.
2975796, RE: Can you explain a bit more...
Posted by guru0509, Thu Oct-20-16 12:43 PM

>But I feel if that is your main gripe with him then you should
>also be objective and fairly assess his other attributes as an
>artist.
>
>Do you have other issues with Kendrick or just his voice?
>
> Because if it's just his voice then you're being a bit extra
>in my opinion.


the shrieking, high pitched voice change ups etc. i cant even bother listening to what hes saying bc of that shit

i never liked lil wayne for the same reason..or Sadat X (before someone starts bringing up rappers from the past with weird voices)

i dont want to hear cartoon characters rap.

i wont even TRY to attempt to listen to Danny Brown for the same reason

*shrug* this new era of weird voice rappers isnt for me i guess

(...neither are the sensitive rap stans that accompany them)

2975797, Oh so you haven't listened
Posted by Anonymous, Thu Oct-20-16 12:45 PM
I was basically just wondering where you stood with everything else...

Lyrics
Songwriting
Rhyme schemes
Beat selection
Album creation
Concepts and topics

Etc
2975799, i listened to section 80/GKMC...i tried. like i do w everyone
Posted by guru0509, Thu Oct-20-16 12:54 PM
(edit, only listened to them once..everyone said you have to give it multiple listens to pick up on everything but once was a chore. twice would be an impossible task)

all i could think was "damn he needs a ghost rapper"



>I was basically just wondering where you stood with
>everything else...
>
>Lyrics
>Songwriting
>Rhyme schemes
>Beat selection
>Album creation
>Concepts and topics
>
>Etc
2975826, Out of curiosity
Posted by Numba_33, Thu Oct-20-16 03:12 PM
are there high pitched rappers that you do like?
2975830, kendrick with his putird (multiple) voices
Posted by The3rdOne, Thu Oct-20-16 03:24 PM
did waaay better with whole albums and concepts than our "favorite voiced artists" could do on one consolidated EP
2975848, to each their own, but i don't understand this at all
Posted by justin_scott, Thu Oct-20-16 05:26 PM
danny brown i can definitely get, but Kendrick doesn't have any kind of irritating voice to me. i just don't hear it, but again, to each their own.
2975730, Cube, Pac, and then Kendrick
Posted by ChampD1012, Wed Oct-19-16 09:31 PM
and Kendrick can past both of them...

arguably the best 4 album/mixtape start ever from the West...but i want to see a few more albums...even though he kinda don't need it for his argument...
2975733, Mykah 9 is the best MC
Posted by javi222, Wed Oct-19-16 09:54 PM
.
2975736, I didn't ask who was the best...I said greatest.
Posted by Anonymous, Wed Oct-19-16 10:33 PM
2975840, I came into thread, skimming replies for Mykah 9. Took long enough.
Posted by Jon, Thu Oct-20-16 04:27 PM
I'm not saying he's def the best, but he should be on the super VIP short list in this discussion.
2975837, I'd probably go with Snoop. He's done it all.
Posted by BNueve, Thu Oct-20-16 04:12 PM
I'm not a fan of Kendrick. I understand why everyone likes him and I think he can definitely spit, but his voice bothers me a lot.
2978284, Boots Riley
Posted by DeepAztheRoot, Fri Nov-18-16 01:29 PM
is also better
2978325, He's certainly on pace to
Posted by cbk, Fri Nov-18-16 05:01 PM
The one-two punch of Good Kid and Butterfly is greater than most artists' entire catalogues.

But trying to overtake Cube (the GOAT/most influential), Pac (untouchable James Dean), and Snoop is no small task.

I'm excited to see what he does next.