>
>>Again, the word "sophistication" does no work on its own.
>
>I mean, in a perfect world, it shouldn't do it but I kind of
>think the word carries certain implications; lonesome_d's
>somewhat depressive definition above I kind of think mirrors
>most peoples-including mine-first thoughts when we hear the
>word (essentially about tasteful balance and BTW, "balance" is
>another overrated aspect of music to me-I can handle the
>balance myself by simply choosing to listen to different types
>of music that delivers different things, things that are often
>mutually exclusive. I'm more about a horizontal balance than a
>vertical one).
>
>In addition to this, I think the idea of a sophisticated
>person as a distinguished gentleman, presumably with a nice
>british accent with a taste for the finer things in life plays
>a part as well.

I get this --- by saying it does no work I primarily mean that its meaning is too loose and too contested to convey or describe anything concrete. You've given one rather specific view of what "sophisticated" means --- and I think the visual example you give of a distinguished gentleman is a good example of how problematic the word is, because it's mixing material indicators of class (or class aspirations) with music. Not to say that can't be mixed, or even shouldn't be mixed, but in this case it's a visual that I'm not sure everyone would agree with when the word is applied to music.

>For example, music that is more forceful, physical, sweaty
>etc. is rarely thought of as "sophisticated". Chic is often
>viewed as an act that brought an increased emphasis on
>sophistication to disco and how did they do that? By means of
>tasteful string-arrangements, "mannered" singing and wearing
>clothes in the style of the more sophisticated past.
>
>James Brown's music was sophisticated in many ways, yet, I'm
>pretty sure the adjective in the context of soul is more
>likely to be used in reference to Stevie or Smokey Robinson.


I'm actually with you on this and all of your other (very good) examples --- which is why I am saying that we probably shouldn't use the word, especially in trying to describe something beyond genre or beyond certain patterns.


>Basically, I understand what you are going for in saying that
>sophistication does no work on its own but I kind of think it
>actually does; there's a more-or-less lexical meaning which
>might not be fair but still very real...

I'm thinking through this now... I do think we're mostly on the same page here, but I need to think a bit.