This came up in a GD post recently, I believe; I'm sure that there is probably an excess of commentary written about this little piece that first was printed in an 1964 issue of Downbeat Magazine, but when I read it for myself, I couldn't help but LOL at some of the commentary:

link: http://www.forghieri.net/jazz/blind/Davis_3.html

3rd Blindfold Test Miles Davis

by Leonard Feather
Down Beat Volume 58 No. 12, December 1991, p.69
first published by Down Beat, June 1964

'You have to think when you play; you have to help each other - you just can't play for yourself. You've got to play with whomever you're playing. If I'm playing with Basie, I'm going to try to help what he's doing - that particular feeling.'

Miles Davis is unusually selective in his listening habits. This attitude should not be interpreted as reflecting any general misanthropy. He was in a perfectly good mood on the day of the interview reproduced below; it just happened that the records selected did not, for the most part, make much of an impression.

Clark Terry, for example, is an old friend and idol of Davis' from St. Louis, and the Duke Ellington Orchestra has always been on Davis' preferred list.

Davis does not have an automatic tendency to want to put everything down, as an inspection of his earlier Blindfold Tests will confirm (DB, Sept. 21, 1955 and Aug. 7, 1958).

The Cecil Taylor item was played as an afterthought, because we were discussing artists who have impressed critics, and I said I'd like to play an example. Aside from this, Davis was given no information about the records played.

The Records

1. Les McCann-Jazz Crusaders
All Blues
(Pacific Jazz)
Wayne Henderson, trombone; Wilton Felder, tenor saxophone; Joe Sample, piano; McCann, electric piano; Miles Davis, composer.

What's that supposed to be? That ain't nothin'. They don't know what to do with it - you either play it bluesy or you play on the scale. You don't just play flat notes. I didn't write it to play flat notes on - you know, like minor thirds. Either you play a whole chord against it, or else . . . but don't try to play it like you'd play, ah, Walkin' the Dog. You know what I mean?

That trombone player - trombone ain't supposed to sound like that. This is 1964, not 1924. Maybe if the piano player had played it by himself, something would have happened.

Rate it? How can I rate that?

2. Clark Terry
Cielito Lindo
(from 3 in Jazz, RCA Victor)
Terry, trumpet; Hank Jones, piano; Kenny Burrell, guitar.

Clark Terry, right? You know, I've always liked Clark. But this is a sad record. Why do they make records like that? With the guitar in the way, and that sad fucking piano player. He didn't do nothing for the rhythm section - didn't you hear it get jumbled up? All they needed was a bass and Terry.

That's what's fucking up music, you know. Record companies. They make too many sad records, man.

3. Rod Levitt
Ah! Spain
(from Dynamic Sound Patterns, Riverside)
Levitt, trombone, composer; John Beal, bass.

There was a nice idea, but they didn't do nothing with it. The bass player was a motherfucker, though.

What are they trying to do, copy Gil? It doesn't have the Spanish feeling - doesn't move. They move up in triads, but there's all those chords missing - and I never heard any Spanish thing where they had a figure that went

That's some old shit, man. Sounds like Steve Allen's TV band. Give it some stars just for the bass player.

4. Duke Ellington
Caravan
(from Money Jungle, United Artists).
Ellington, piano; Charlie Mingus, bass; Max Roach, drums.

What am I supposed to say to that? That's ridiculous. You see the way they can fuck up music? It's a mismatch. They don't complement each other. Max and Mingus can play together, by themselves. Mingus is a hell of a bass player, and Max is a hell of a drummer. But Duke can't play with them, and they can't play with Duke.

Now, how are you going to give a thing like that some stars? Record companies should be kicked in the ass. Somebody should take a picket sign and picket the record company.

5. Sonny Rollins
You Are My Lucky Star
(from 3 in Jazz, RCA Victor).
Don Cherry, trumpet; Rollins, tenor saxophone; Henry Grimes, bass; Billy Higgins, drums.

Now, why did they have to end it like that? Don Cherry I like, and Sonny I like, and the tune idea is nice. The rhythm is nice. I didn't care too much for the bass player's solo. Five stars is real good? It's just good, no more. Give it three.
6. Stan Getz - Joao Gilberto
Desafinado
from Getz-Gilberto, Verve
Getz, tenor saxophone; Gilberto, vocal.

Gilberto and Stan Getz made an album together? Stan plays good on that. I like Gilberto; I'm not particularly crazy about just anybody's bossa nova. I like the samba. And I like Stan, because he has so much patience, the way he plays those melodies - other people can't get nothing out of a song, but he can. Which takes a lot of imagination, that he has, that so many other people don't have.

As for Gilberto, he could read a newspaper and sound good! I'll give that one five stars.
7. Eric Dolphy
Mary Ann
(from Far Cry, New Jazz).
Booker Little, trumpet; Dolphy, composer, alto saxophone; Jaki Byard, piano.

That's got to be Eric Dolphy - nobody else could sound that bad! The next time I see him I'm going to step on his foot. You print that. I think he's ridiculous. He's a sad motherfucker.

L.F.: Down Beat won't print those words.

M.D.: Just put he's a sad shhhhhhhhh, that's all! The composition is sad. The piano player fucks it up, getting in the way so that you can't hear how things are supposed to be accented.

It's a sad record, and it's the record company's fault again. I didn't like the trumpet player's tone, and he don't do nothing. The running is all right if you're going to play that way, like Freddie Hubbard or Lee Morgan; but you've got to inject something, and you've got to have the rhythm section along; you just can't keep on playing all eighth notes.

The piano player's sad. You have to think when you play; you have to help each other - you just can't play for yourself. You've got to play with whomever you're playing. If I'm playing with Basie, I'm going to try to help what he's doing - that particular feeling.
8. Cecil Taylor
Lena
(from Live at the Cafe Montmartre, Fantasy).
Jimmy Lyons, alto saxophone; Taylor, piano.


Take it off! That's some sad shit, man. In the first place, I hear some Charlie Parker cliches. . . . They don't even fit. Is that what the critics are digging? Them critics better stop having coffee. If there ain't nothing to listen to, they might as well admit it. Just to take something like that and say it's great, because there ain't nothing to listen to, that's like going out and getting a prostitute.

L.F.: This man said he was influenced by Duke Ellington.

M.D.: I don't give a shit! It must be Cecil Taylor. Right? I don't care who he's inspired by. That shit ain't nothing. In the first place he don't have the - you know, the way you touch a piano. He doesn't have the touch that would make the sound of whatever he thinks of come off.

I can tell he's influenced by Duke, but to put the loud pedal on the piano and make a run is very old-fashioned to me. And when the alto player sits up there and plays without no tone. . . . That's the reason I don't buy any records.

You can find this blindfold test reprinted in Bill Kirchner's Miles Davis Reader, a collection of articles about Miles Davis and his music by various authors, which is still available (Smithsonian Institution Press, Washington and London, 1997)

I mean, that's not news to anyone, but it's so concentrated in this relatively short interview.

~Austin

"God is a concept by which we measure our pain."
— John Lennon
http://austintayeshus.blogspot.com
http://www.last.fm/user/Austintayeshus
http://twitter.com/Austintayeshus

That's some funny shit!!!!

With that said, I don't think today's artist can break it down the music in technical terms the way he did.
He just didn't say 'oh this is awful', dude broke it down as to why he didn't dig it.

In today's climate of music, that kind of article would never happen for two reasons
1) most don't have the music theory background
2) those that do are too afraid too truly express their thoughts

>With that said, I don't think today's artist can break it down
>the music in technical terms the way he did.
>He just didn't say 'oh this is awful', dude broke it down as
>to why he didn't dig it.

You could try to take him to task but you'd have to know what the fuck you're talking about.

>In today's climate of music, that kind of article would never
>happen for two reasons
>1) most don't have the music theory background
>2) those that do are too afraid too truly express their
>thoughts

Nepotism

________
Big PEMFin H & z's
█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am one thing, a musician." © Miles Davis

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

Amazing that he knew their "voice" without being told who they were.
As said above, you had to know your shit dealing with him.

I recall reading in his autobio his critique of Sly, something to the effect of he would be a real motherfucker if he learned to read music. He was right

>Amazing that he knew their "voice" without being told who
>they were.

the best thing an instrumentalist can do is make their voice/technique singular. so people know it's you.

.

I hate he dissed MONEY JUNGLE and Eric Dolphy. I dug both of those recordings.

Check out NEW Soul music at: www.myspace.com/starbeing

Bumpin in the STEREO:
Gladys Knight&The Pips
RGE-Black Radio
Esperanza Spalding-RMS
Georgia Anne Muldrow-Seeds
Darryl Reeves-Mercury
Terri Lyne Carrington-TMP

because my knee-jerk reaction to hearing criticism of Wayne Henderson as to the actual playing of his trombone is "GTFOOHWTBS"

then I put the track on, and he was right. That didn't even sound like Wayne usually does... it was as if he was trying to actually evoke "1924".

But yeah, he's mean as fuck. I can't picture anyone being that harsh about other musicians in 2012.

I wish they did like 30 more records like this!

http://cerealrecords.com/2803/

http://www.forghieri.net/jazz/blind/Davis_2.html

>http://cerealrecords.com/2803/

Miles would've had a very successful career in comedy.

~Austin

"God is a concept by which we measure our pain."
— John Lennon
http://austintayeshus.blogspot.com
http://www.last.fm/user/Austintayeshus
http://twitter.com/Austintayeshus

Not Europe!

~Austin

"God is a concept by which we measure our pain."
— John Lennon
http://austintayeshus.blogspot.com
http://www.last.fm/user/Austintayeshus
http://twitter.com/Austintayeshus

~Austin

"God is a concept by which we measure our pain."
— John Lennon
http://austintayeshus.blogspot.com
http://www.last.fm/user/Austintayeshus
http://twitter.com/Austintayeshus

________
Big PEMFin H & z's
█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am one thing, a musician." © Miles Davis

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

At work.

~Austin

"God is a concept by which we measure our pain."
— John Lennon
http://austintayeshus.blogspot.com
http://www.last.fm/user/Austintayeshus
http://twitter.com/Austintayeshus

No not the electronic Scott. The genius songwriter Scott.
________
Big PEMFin H & z's
█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am 1 thing, a musician." © Miles

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

I read these ones before but to mistake John Tchicai-who he must have been refering to since Shepp played Tenor-sax-for Ornette Coleman is really bad. One can not assume that Miles knew who an underground dude like Tchicai was but he should have ears enough to not mistake him for Ornette since they didn't sound similar at all, oh well, I think Miles just wanted to shit on Ornette here but Ornette got the last laugh since the general approach to solos on albums like ''¤Bitc4hes brew'' and ''On the corner'' was hea4vily indebted to the approach of ornette on the ''Free Jazz''-album (=collective improvisation but with the *emphasis* shifting from one4 musician to the next rahter than a serie4s of individual solos)...

That's why it's hard to take Miles serious; he dissed but at the same time had no problem taking ideas from the musicians he was dissing...

and I too like most of the people he dissed.

Miles never fails! ever! his asshole level is damn near incomparable and flawless.

Davis was cold...

Yet it comes off as more arrogant than bitter... sophisticated arrogance, lol...

-thebigfunk

~ i could still snort you under the table ~

"That's got to be Eric Dolphy - nobody else could sound that bad! The next time I see him I'm going to step on his foot. You print that. I think he's ridiculous. He's a sad motherfucker."

lol^
__
I don't like the beat anymore because its just a loop. ALC didn't FLIP IT ENOUGH!

Flip it enough? Flip these. Flip off. Go flip some f*cking burgers.(c)Kno

Allied State of the National Electric Beat Treaty Organization (NEBTO)

For those that don't know, this blindfoldtest was published right after Dolphy had died of diabetes in germany-a death many attribute to racism ("A black jazz musician with needle-holes in his arm searching for help? Let's treat him like a junkie!"). Needless to say, Miles "funny" opinions on Dolphy's style came across as extremely tasteless. Of course, the test was conducted just before his death but still... bad timing there.

As for the Cecil thing, Miles only seemed to dig pianists with a soft touch and Cecil didn't even have a touch I guess; he was about sheer FORCE so of course Miles hated him, I can't be mad at that even if Cecil is the GOAT...

you mad. and FOH with Cecil being the GOAT shit too

Because it's funny to say that someone sounds like shit just after their death?

As for Cecil, I don't know anyone who in *my* opinion made musikc as powerful in the past century...

it was done/printed before Dolphy died, and to some, not me, he sounded like shit

and ohh my lord at that second statement. not touching that. lets just say we DISAGREE!!!!

...and as a result, a lot of people found Miles statement disrespectful which was my whole point. Put it in the context of modern-day artists and you should get it.

As for Cecil, I will never back down-dude incorporated everything powerful about 20th century music in a chaotic stew that I love... Whatever....

smh.

what a twat.

>For those that don't know, this blindfoldtest was published
>right after Dolphy had died of diabetes in germany-a death
>many attribute to racism ("A black jazz musician with
>needle-holes in his arm searching for help? Let's treat him
>like a junkie!"). Needless to say, Miles "funny" opinions on
>Dolphy's style came across as extremely tasteless. Of course,
>the test was conducted just before his death but still... bad
>timing there.

it took the bite out of the comments... would have been hilarious, but that was some unfortunate timing for Miles.

>As for the Cecil thing, Miles only seemed to dig pianists with
>a soft touch and Cecil didn't even have a touch I guess; he
>was about sheer FORCE so of course Miles hated him, I can't be
>mad at that even if Cecil is the GOAT...

The Cecil comment really made me laugh my ass off though. He knew EXACTLY who it was w/o being told.

imo, he has the right to be an asshole (when it comes to music).


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"It is better to be silent and thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt"

"What's gotta come from Europe. We wouldn't play no shit like that. It's so sad. It sounds funny to me. Sounds like a 1935 arrangement by Raymond Scott. They must be joking – the Florida A. & M. band sounds better than that. They should record them, rather than that shit. They've got more spirit than that. That ain't nothing."

Why put that on record? What does that do? You mean there’s somebody around here that feels like that? Even the white people don’t feel that sad.





He shat on Sun Ra and mentioned the FAMU band. They had a good rep back in them days? If so cool.

________
Big PEMFin H & z's
█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am one thing, a musician." © Miles Davis

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

-------------------------
“The other dude after me didn’t help my case. It was just like…crazy nigga factory going on.”
Dre makes no apologies for his own eccentricities. “I was young, and searching, trying to find myself,” he says. “Never did.”-- Andre B

________
Big PEMFin H & z's
█▆▇▅▇█▇▆▄▁▃
"I ain't no entertainer, and ain't trying to be one. I am one thing, a musician." © Miles Davis

"When the music stops he falls back in the abyss."

Reading Miles quotes on this site reminds me of Maxx. Like 100%

thank you for posting. very entertaining. miles is hilarious!!!!

This shit never gets old....

Miles!!!!!!

"I remember one time, it might have been a couple times, at the Fillmore East in 1970, I was opening up for this sorry-ass cat named Steve Miller. he didn't have his shit going on for him, so I'm pissed I got to open up for this non playin' muthafucker' just because he had one or two sorry-ass records out"

"I've changed music 4 or 5 times, what have you done of any importance, other than being white?"