i saw him in concert this past Friday.

there was a disconnect between him and the audience. a friend who attended w/me pointed it out. she'd never heard of Van until i told her about the show and she'd never heard his stuff. she said she liked the show but could feel the disconnect throughout most of it. it felt like the audience didn't get the show they came for, she said. and i think she was right.

the 'problem' was VH had rearranged most of his earlier Funk/R&B songs into garage band/power Rock songs. and the rearrangements worked sometimes, but usually didn't. most times the rearranged songs were unrecognizable. i mean, i love 'Her December', but hearing a damn-near Thrash Metal version of it didn't do it for me. i didn't even know the song until he got to the chorus. he messed w/'Character' too, but i was determined to enjoy that 1 b/c that's MY JAM. it was difficult to get into it.

what's the deal? is this his thing now? is the new album like that too?

http://allmusic.com/album/what-were-you-hoping-for-r2295114/review

i want ppl's opinions/experiences. etc.

^TOKPR.

that had to be frustrating/maddening for you. him as well. i can't imagine what would make an artist with little relative success continue to forge on...especially when your new stuff isn't making a dent either.

he had enough sense to play his most-loved songs ('Dust' and 'Seconds of Pleasure') relatively str8.

i'm not 1 of those concert-goers who wants everything to sound just like the record. i like it when acts play new arrangements. i just want the new arrangements to work.

right?
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other than fans. the last part being the most critical. people like to give artists they like their freedom which is cool but let them know how you feel too. when fans become yes men its a wrap.
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i understand that some artists may change styles because the times change but, seems like he's trying to find his niche audience, which seems to be the alternative/punk white hipster...cause all in all most blacks don't even know who he is (which is truly sad). i saw him at rams head live in baltimore a few years ago, and he blew me away...one of the best performances that i've ever seen in my life. not sure i'm liking this change up, albeit i haven't recently attended his show. i like his new album though, it's different. a tad bit grunge/rock heavy. i want to hear more tracks along the lines of 'plum' and 'falls/violet'...i like his direction on those tracks, because i can't describe what type of music it is and seems like it could possibly appeal to a wider range audience.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"It is better to be silent and thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt"

majority if not all of em started out with punk tempos & rock guitars n shit. i interviewed the guy a few months back & he said tracks like "Seconds Of Pleasure" started out as punk, but all of it got toned & slowed down for his major label debut. and if that's the case then shitting on him (those in this poast) for changing his style doesn't make sense. according to him the punk scene was somethin he grew up on, same with his band.

so, no.
the audience just needs to recognise he's had a rock influence throughout ALL of his material, and adapt to the change. it probly just threw ppl off that he didn't perform those particular songs in their most well-known formats. me tho, i wish he'd punkify EVERYTHING lol.

V.

>majority if not all of em started out with punk tempos & rock
>guitars n shit. i interviewed the guy a few months back & he
>said tracks like "Seconds Of Pleasure" started out as punk,
>but all of it got toned & slowed down for his major label
>debut. and if that's the case then shitting on him (those in
>this poast) for changing his style doesn't make sense.

naw, it makes sense.

i was introduced to his songs in their Funk/R&B versions, not as Punk. i was introduced to him as a Funk/R&B musician, not a Punk musician. so, of course, when i went to his concert i expected to hear (mostly) Funk & R&B.

>the audience just needs to recognise he's had a rock influence
>throughout ALL of his material, and adapt to the change.

the audience needs to be told he's a Punk/Rock guy at heart. how else would we know?

if he'd showed up doing Big Band arrangements of his stuff we'd have had the same reaction. it would've seemed to have come out of nowhere. we'd have no context.

it
>probly just threw ppl off that he didn't perform those
>particular songs in their most well-known formats. me tho, i
>wish he'd punkify EVERYTHING lol.

i'm not interested. if that's where he's going i'm hopping off the bandwagon. lol

here's a bit from the interview explaining it (can read the rest @ http://www.fjordemagazine.com):

VK: We really didn’t get a taste of your rock leanings ‘til “On The Jungle Floor” & over the years I found myself constantly going back to songs like “Ride, Ride, Ride”, “At The End Of A Slow Dance” & “The Thrill Of This Love”. Then you got even heavier with it on “Popular” with “The Lowest 1 Of My Desires”. There was also “ATTENTION!” & “Man Of The Year” from “Use In Case Of Emergency”. So to me you were really building up a lot of cred as a rock musician. At this point I was secretly hoping you’d take it even further, & you completely flipped my wig when I realised about 70% of the new album was GRUNGEY & punky. Was this just a natural expression of a sound that was in on-going development for you? Or did you sit & plot out the soundscape of this album & decide for it have that punk/grunge/surf rock sound? And how much did the L.A. setting play a factor?

VH: That’s funny. If I had recorded the band I had before I did my first album, it probably would've sounded a lot like this record. "ATTENTION!" was that same band. We recorded that in like 2001 just before I started making the debut record which didn’t come out til 2004, though I had had the record deal for 3yrs. Many things turned out like that, but I'd say "ATTENTION!" was more early Prince, 'cept a little bit harder. As for the album's sound, all you hear in modern punk are the rhythms of those old negro spirituals & quartet songs. That’s how the band played. There would be bass & drums & I would play guitar, & I would put my influence in with their influences, which all came out sounding more like early Prince or 80s music & very old gospel music, nothing like southern gospel nowadays. It was almost tribal. There were a lot of percussive rhythms, & so that’s really where this all started. I loved the rhythm they (the band) brought. They sped everything up. For example, “Seconds Of Pleasure” was originally a punk song. We just cut it in half. I love Al Green, Marvin, Sam Cooke, Curtis Mayfield. All of that was beautiful, but I grew up in Dayton with Prince & 80s funk n' r&b, I was never really into old soul. That developed into more of a love for 80s pop music. And then I got into a little bit of The Clash, Bad Brains & some post-punk. With this record, sonically, there was just no way to escape that sound if I was going to be honest with myself.
--

V.

>I love Al
>Green, Marvin, Sam Cooke, Curtis Mayfield. All of that was
>beautiful, but I grew up in Dayton with Prince & 80s funk n'
>r&b, I was never really into old soul.

in essence, he isn't who i thought he was initially. that explains a lot.

thanks.

>I love Al
>Green, Marvin, Sam Cooke, Curtis Mayfield. All of that was
>beautiful, but I grew up in Dayton with Prince & 80s funk n'
>r&b, I was never really into old soul.

My reaction to this is much like my reaction to Lewis Taylor who originally came out selling himself as the new Marvin Gaye, talking about how soul culture is "his" culture and his roots in R&B and gospel and all that...

...and after he didn't blow up of off four soul records, he made a record that sounded like Fleetwood Mac and the Beach Boys talking about how *this* is the music he REALLY grew up on but he made the soul records because of the record company blah blah blah.

Shit just feels really dishonest and indecisive to me, and kinda contemptuous of the audience. And I'll admit that it's kinda worse in Van's case because he kinda has a track record of constantly contradicting himself and revising his story. I just feel like I can't get a handle on who he is as an artist. It's like he's always searching for some new contrivance to find acceptance.

I suppose none of that should matter as long as you like the music, though.... I just happen not to care much for the new album either.

i mean i thought this was clear after he lost his first label and turned in his blue note project.
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me and scorpion used to talk all the time about how phony he seemed, how it was like he was putting on an act and trying to fit all the notes but it just felt... hollow.

But I really decided to give him another chance after he replied to my post. But he keeps changing the narrative and it's frustrating.

>me and scorpion used to talk all the time about how phony he
>seemed, how it was like he was putting on an act and trying to
>fit all the notes but it just felt... hollow.

This trying to guess an artist's true intentions... we had this same discussion about Chromeo a few years back. I'm sorry but trying to get into someone's head you don't even know is going to be an exercise in futility 99% of the time.... and even when you get the 1% right what good does it really do you? You either like the music being made or you don't. Trying to justify liking or not liking something based on intentions means you're not approaching the music honestly in the first place.

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>Trying to
>justify liking or not liking something based on intentions
>means you're not approaching the music honestly in the first
>place.

which is worse in your opinion?

outside of a milli vanilli type situation how does an artist present something in a dishonest manner?

I guess if you buy into the imagery and character shit you can be fooled... but with hip hop being around for 30+ years I thought we all realized by now that creating a character is part of the game.
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>outside of a milli vanilli type situation how does an artist
>present something in a dishonest manner?
>
>I guess if you buy into the imagery and character shit you can
>be fooled... but with hip hop being around for 30+ years I
>thought we all realized by now that creating a character is
>part of the game.

AFKAP summed it up below though.

I didn't think it was as big of a deal as was made of it... especially the part where people destroyed their records and took back the awards they had won.

I mean, if you liked the record, you liked the record... does it matter whether or not those two cats actually sang on it?

because I was about the music

Most of it sucked so I didn't fuck with them... but the "Blame it on the Rain" 12" was dope before Milligate and it was dope after.

Still I can understand someone calling that dishonest.
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for creating an image... I actually love that too.

It's just that Van seems kinda bad at it.

Like with Prince and all his ambiguity and contradictory statements in the early 80s... It was exciting and intriguing.

With Van it's like he's awkward with it... and retracing his steps to admit that he was lying, and then pitching a new image... then back-pedaling to apologize for it and coming back to say "Okay, this really IS the real me this time!"

*shrug*

Ahhh... Let me shut up before I'm accused of being a hater of "out of the box" Black musicians again. I actually admire the brother's talent and I wish him well.

I just don't find him appealing to my own tastes.

"With Van it's like he's awkward with it... and retracing his steps to admit that he was lying, and then pitching a new image... then back-pedaling to apologize for it and coming back to say "Okay, this really IS the real me this time!""

A cat without a clear identity and looking for who he is. I think we've all known people like this is real life. I've known a lot of people that "discover" who they are after getting into some new belief system and a year later are on to something else completely.

That would explain something sounding "confused" but I still wouldn't call it dishonest.
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I personally enjoy following the artist's journey and watching the growth.

If you started out as a teeny-pop singer and then you matured into a soul man and then got into rock and then as you get older you start playing jazz... that's great.

What I don't like is the backtracking and the "that wasn't really me" stuff. That kind of hard course-correction feels unsure to me. And I think that a lot of people (or me, at least) admire confidence in our artists just like we do in our leaders.

If you start of playing soul and then you go on to play rock, that's okay. But when you step back and start talking about how you were never really into the soul stuff... It almost feels like a slap in the face of those who liked your soul records.

*shrug* That's how I kinda feel about it anyway.

In Van's case, you could argue that he was organically gravitating towards rock for the past couple of albums anyway... but I'm referring to the statements he's made defending it. It makes the audience feel like he was running a scam on them before all that time they were supporting him as the kind of artist he was selling himself as. And that's why I think there's that disconnect that SoWhat spoke about.

Listening to Van Hunt's last few projects I could tell dude wasn't sure where he wanted to go... and in turn the music didn't really move me like his earlier stuff did. Regardless of where he says his heart was or wasn't he made better music when he went in with an idea of what he wanted to do. That's why the whole "is it honest" thing makes no sense to me. the better question would be "is he acting professional"

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I don't need to be in the artist's head per se...

And you know that I generally don't care about whether or not an artist is truly expressing the infinite depths of his soul. And I have no problem knowing that an artist made this music for the sole purpose of it making money (I actually applaud that).

My problem with Van is that the music itself *sounded* confused and dishonest to me and that did mess with my enjoyment of it. If I had liked the music more than I did (because I did enjoy some of it) then his motives would have been irrelevant to me.

But given that it already sounded cynical to me and then I keep reading these statements from him that sounded cynical and contrived... It just adds up.

With Chromeo, I liked (and still like) their music but on their first album I sometimes got the vibe that they were being kinda jokey with it. And that's not a problem because I love a lot of comedy-oriented music (like Har Mar Superstar, who I think is great) but I just wanted to know where they were coming from so I can know if I'm *supposed* to be laughing at that lyric or that vocal.

>My problem with Van is that the music itself *sounded*
>confused and dishonest to me and that did mess with my
>enjoyment of it.

Are you saying because it didn't meet a certain threshold or sound it wasn't honest? How do you know it's not just the way the artist ment to spin it in the first place? Saying something is dishonest means you go in with an idea of what something should sound like. That sounds more like the listener's problem than the artist to me


>With Chromeo, I liked (and still like) their music but on
>their first album I sometimes got the vibe that they were
>being kinda jokey with it. And that's not a problem because I
>love a lot of comedy-oriented music (like Har Mar Superstar,
>who I think is great) but I just wanted to know where they
>were coming from so I can know if I'm *supposed* to be
>laughing at that lyric or that vocal.

I brought up Chromeo for a reason. Yeah I remember your concerns then ... now here we are years later and they seem more committed to the sound that ever before. That's a long way to go for one big joke. How does them having a sense of humor in any way devalue the type of music they are making? You've criticized a cat like Dam-Funk for not showing enough humor but now we're giving the Larry David stare to Dave and P because they like to have fun? Seriously if we did that with every act from back in the day George, Cameo, Rick and 95% of them would be in question.


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How does a used car salesman's pitch sound dishonest?
How does a politician's stump speech sound dishonest?
How did Chris Brown's apology sound dishonest?

Sometimes you just don't *believe* what you're hearing.

And you might be right that that is the listener's problem (I don't agree with you but I won't go into that now) but when the artist goes on to say and do certain things that put their artistic integrity in question, obviously the problem is NOT with the listener.


>I brought up Chromeo for a reason. Yeah I remember your
>concerns then ... now here we are years later and they seem
>more committed to the sound that ever before. That's a long
>way to go for one big joke. How does them having a sense of
>humor in any way devalue the type of music they are making?
>You've criticized a cat like Dam-Funk for not showing enough
>humor but now we're giving the Larry David stare to Dave and P
>because they like to have fun? Seriously if we did that with
>every act from back in the day George, Cameo, Rick and 95% of
>them would be in question.

Okay, I think you are deliberately blurring the lines.

There is a world of difference between having a sense of humor as presenting your music as a joke.

Stevie Wonder has a sense of humor (or at least he did for the first half of the 1970s)
Blowfly is making music as a joke.

Prince? sense of humor.
Weird Al Yankovic? Joke.

C'mon man.

>Sometimes you just don't *believe* what you're hearing.
>
>And you might be right that that is the listener's problem (I
>don't agree with you but I won't go into that now) but when
>the artist goes on to say and do certain things that put their
>artistic integrity in question, obviously the problem is NOT
>with the listener.

We'll leave this alone for now


>Okay, I think you are deliberately blurring the lines.
>
>There is a world of difference between having a sense of humor
>as presenting your music as a joke.
>
>Stevie Wonder has a sense of humor (or at least he did for the
>first half of the 1970s)
>Blowfly is making music as a joke.
>
>Prince? sense of humor.
>Weird Al Yankovic? Joke.
>
>C'mon man.

C'mon man right back at ya lol

Really though Weird Al makes no secret about the fact he makes parody songs. Creating an analogy where Weird Al = Chromeo isn't going to work. Your "hunch" doesn't equal something everyone knows.

That said, if you could give me examples of where Chromeo's humor is based on the type of music they are making I might give it some thought. But let's not talk like they're dressed up like some boogie (i know some of you hate that term) version of Turquoise Jeep. If anything I'd say the fact they've been doing this as long as they have and have become even more committed to the music proves their sincerity.... but even if they weren't they still make some great shit and put on one hell of a live show. Why think myself out of something that's enjoyable?
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because I actually like them and I don't recall ever dissing them or dismissing them as a joke. I just said I had questions about whether or not they were really taking it seriously.

I think you're representing my position on them as being a lot harder than it actually was.

Bring up another example and I'll discuss it... not with Chromeo, though.

>because I actually like them and I don't recall ever dissing
>them or dismissing them as a joke. I just said I had questions
>about whether or not they were really taking it seriously.
>
>I think you're representing my position on them as being a lot
>harder than it actually was.

I know you were on the side of those questioning their intentions but I don't remember just how fervently you defended that position. I'll take you at your word you were "soft" on the idea.

>Bring up another example and I'll discuss it... not with
>Chromeo, though.

Example for what? I forgot why I even brought them into this in the first place lol

guess i need to read back through this... sorry got a lot going on today man
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>Example for what? I forgot why I even brought them into this
>in the first place lol
>
>guess i need to read back through this... sorry got a lot
>going on today man

I can't even discuss this as fully as I want to because I'm doing like three other things at the same time and I'm concerned that my tossed-off responses are coming off like I'm just here to hate on Van... which is the furthest thing from my intentions.

because i feel like I'm short-cutting it too

sounds like we should just save this for another day

its a good topic though... and really deserves it's own post.

one of us can come back to it down the road
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I don't want to make it sound like I don't bring my own expectations in with some artists... but they are usually those with a deep catalogs and well established identity.

Hopefully we'll get back to this someday
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I'll admit that my expectations are somewhat shaped by the fact that Van Hunt... well, a relatively "unsuccessful" artist who has been grinding in the industry for about 20 years.

If a more established artist who had already enjoyed great success sudden turned around and changed course, I would probably applaud them as being incredible gutsy.

But when it's someone who seems to have been struggling for years to find an audience, all the course correction feels like flailing. And more than that, it feels counterproductive... almost like they're so desperate that they're willing to kiss off the few fans they've already made in the hopes of attracting a new audience.

One step forward and two steps back, y'know?

we'll dig a little deeper someday
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kinda unrelated but on some good music that ain't in tune shit. i think van falls into that category for the most part. you be fighting to find the key and shit. then its like oh aight. but for some that hurdle is unsurpassable, and i can understand why.
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don't miss the link i threw up in ya B' post over in gd.
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Back for 22 mo' -- January 2012

HAI HATERZ

I agree with this 100%. I enjoyed his first two albums but something about him always seemed contrived. "Highlights" is the perfect example. The song is going along perfectly and he all of a sudden starts talking about incest. It's like he felt he had to say something dirty to make the song feel dirty when it really had a sleezy feel all along. The vulgarity ruined it for me. And I have no problem with vulgarity. It made it seem forced. I felt like pretty much all of his soul music sounded forced (even when some of it was good). You can always feel when an artists makes his music dirty on purpose. One of the most difficult things for a pop artist to do is make a song sound sleezy without being overtly vulgar.

Bottom line with dude is he is a great producer/arranger but is silly as an artist. His voice can be like fingernails on a chalkboard to me at times. The shit he did for Rahsaan Patterson (Burnin, Too Late) was amazing, but it was because he used an amazing vocalist.

I thought his Blue Note album was atrocious. And I don't think it was coincidence that the last 4 or 5 songs on "OTJF" was the highlight of his career. That is the shit he should be sticking with.

Great live show when he was touring for his debut though.

>i mean i thought this was clear after he lost his first label
>and turned in his blue note project.

i had forgotten about that whole period. i thought the first album was decent/had some good moments, but upon hearing the second album, i jumped ship.

i haven't heard the last 2 (In Case of Emergency & Is This What You Want (or whatever)). maybe if i had i wouldn't have been so disappointed by the show. i would've gone in expecting what i heard.

>i haven't heard the last 2 (In Case of Emergency & Is This
>What You Want (or whatever)). maybe if i had i wouldn't have
>been so disappointed by the show. i would've gone in
>expecting what i heard.

Actually, "In Case Of Emergency" was more on track, of what he was doing on the last three albums.

silk.later Reunion radio with Old P. & Silk http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

"i'm talking about *Balls Deep*....In Love (c)Cleveland Jr.

He was cultivating a fine nigga farm (c)Goldmind.

i thought he was translating the Rock stuff into Funk/R&B, not the other way around.

if that makes sense.

when my friend asked for a description i said his stuff is like Lenny K's but w/more raw.

>when my friend asked for a description i said his stuff is
>like Lenny K's but w/more raw.

LOL

not sure if he's a tremendous talent which has fallen victim to cruddy industry standards or what. if you listen to his first album up until this point, they don't really have a consistent sound...kind of a hodgepodge. again, i know that artists change as the times change but, i'm not sure if the sound that he has right now is what he really wanted to begin with and is this who he truly is? if so, he needs to put the pedal to the metal 150%.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"It is better to be silent and thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt"

and so his slick talking lyrics and all that soul were supposed to his thing.

that was the 1st album though.

*shrugs*

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since the blue note album.
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maybe he is.

i'm not concerned w/his honesty though. i just want the music to sound good.

u could use the Lenny K criticism on his first two albums, but "Popular" was somethin else.

V.

>u could use the Lenny K criticism on his first two albums,
>but "Popular" was somethin else.
>
>V.

.......transitions,to me. And i find the new album's title,almost humorous. I mean, he's actually asking you,"What Were You Hoping For".

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"i'm talking about *Balls Deep*....In Love (c)Cleveland Jr.

He was cultivating a fine nigga farm (c)Goldmind.

though he then said that his dad was mostly a painter. But also a pimp.

Which is all good, I guess. It's a great story.

I just think he would be better off if he just made whatever kind of music he wants or even the music he *has* to without all the justifications and explanations.

neither does his music.

and it's never sounded like more than a hodge-podge of influences that he's far from transcended.

i don't know why anyone would listen to him, rather than the stuff he listens to.

>neither does his music.
>
>and it's never sounded like more than a hodge-podge of
>influences that he's far from transcended.

The part about why anybody would listen to his music? Well... I understand that. It's not really for me but I ain't mad at other people being into it. It's not BAD music... but for me, it just lacks... something. Some kind of coherence or purpose or confidence. Something.

I can't call it.

>though he then said that his dad was mostly a painter. But
>also a pimp.
>
>Which is all good, I guess. It's a great story.
>
>I just think he would be better off if he just made whatever
>kind of music he wants or even the music he *has* to without
>all the justifications and explanations.

chalked that up to an active imagination lol !!!

silk.later Reunion radio with Old P. & Silk http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

"i'm talking about *Balls Deep*....In Love (c)Cleveland Jr.

He was cultivating a fine nigga farm (c)Goldmind.

from our convo it SOUNDED like he was just rolling with the punches, and one could logically assume his sound changed/evolved/switched-up in reaction to his changing situation re: record labels. perhaps he just feels comfy enough now to fully express the music HE truly feels he was weened on? same would go for Lewis. both of em came out as one 'thing', a package. and i think the origin stories for those initial soul/r&b characters they were was just *amplified* & not completely fabricated. Lewis was a prog rock dude through-and-through, but he was only ever known as "Lewis Taylor" when he was a soul singer. pretty sure "Lewis" isn't even his real first name, i think its his middle name. so maybe he just FELT like making that kinda music? and wanted a persona to go with it? doesn't seem so disingenuous to me. just an avenue to express a certain type of sound.

u can see a clear struggle with Van trying to come to terms with his 'sound'. i love those 1st two albums much as i love the rest, but for compeltely different reasons. but it doesn't make me look cock-eyed at the dude for the constant search in attaining something even approaching a signature sound. isn't that what artists are sposed to do? i feel like he's been on nothing but an incline since his debut, music quality wise. each disc builds on the previous one but also adds something new. to ME, charting his sound convinces me he's being as honest as any artist can possibly be. cos he's wanting to build and do some new shit with each disc. a cynical eye would see that the way u see it, but i have no problem believing it.

and to answer the simple argument from OP: i love the music for what it is, contextless of everything else we're talking about. i think he's a legit talent that will only continue to get better with age. and i think he's released one of the albums of the year, and of his career. call me crazy lol.

V.

whereas mine remains mild and even-keeled lol. zealotry is too easy a path on okp. but u saying "i don't know why anyone would listen to his music" is extreme. clearly people do listen, he has fans, we have good reasons, u don't have to be mentally deficient to like or even love his music, bla bla bla.

V.

i don't know why YOU listen to him and love him so

and because i know that you are a man of taste and distinction

i have tried several times to hear what you do

alas, in vain

i'm not gonna say that i haven't heard elements that i've liked, but on the whole, dude just doesn't do it for me.

<shrug>

of all-time.
lol. a LOT of ppl question THAT one.
thing is, if i *am* perceived as a gentleman with 'taste', then it can't be altogether crazy, right? the music simply gets me. or i get it. watever. i can totally see the other side if someone were to criticise either Foos or Van tho. if u don't hear it u don't hear it, that doesn't bother me but getn labeled nutso for liking it kinda does.
sallgood.

V.

but they certainly do have some songs that kick arse.

and u haven't heard an album since #2?

V.

when i have NOT called you crazy, V?

http://youtu.be/ScfXgdawucU.

oh ye, shit, u call me a weirdo & crazy a LOT lol.
i *should* be offended. but i am weird. soooo...whatevs?

V.

>http://youtu.be/ScfXgdawucU.
>
>oh ye, shit, u call me a weirdo & crazy a LOT lol.
>i *should* be offended. but i am weird. soooo...whatevs?
>
>


silk.later Reunion radio with Old P. & Silk http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

"i'm talking about *Balls Deep*....In Love (c)Cleveland Jr.

He was cultivating a fine nigga farm (c)Goldmind.

>from our convo it SOUNDED like he was just rolling with the
>punches, and one could logically assume his sound
>changed/evolved/switched-up in reaction to his changing
>situation re: record labels. perhaps he just feels comfy
>enough now to fully express the music HE truly feels he was
>weened on? same would go for Lewis. both of em came out as one
>'thing', a package. and i think the origin stories for those
>initial soul/r&b characters they were was just *amplified* &
>not completely fabricated. Lewis was a prog rock dude
>through-and-through, but he was only ever known as "Lewis
>Taylor" when he was a soul singer. pretty sure "Lewis" isn't
>even his real first name, i think its his middle name. so
>maybe he just FELT like making that kinda music? and wanted a
>persona to go with it? doesn't seem so disingenuous to me.
>just an avenue to express a certain type of sound.
>
>u can see a clear struggle with Van trying to come to terms
>with his 'sound'. i love those 1st two albums much as i love
>the rest, but for compeltely different reasons. but it doesn't
>make me look cock-eyed at the dude for the constant search in
>attaining something even approaching a signature sound. isn't
>that what artists are sposed to do? i feel like he's been on
>nothing but an incline since his debut, music quality wise.
>each disc builds on the previous one but also adds something
>new. to ME, charting his sound convinces me he's being as
>honest as any artist can possibly be. cos he's wanting to
>build and do some new shit with each disc. a cynical eye would
>see that the way u see it, but i have no problem believing
>it.
>
>and to answer the simple argument from OP: i love the music
>for what it is, contextless of everything else we're talking
>about. i think he's a legit talent that will only continue to
>get better with age. and i think he's released one of the
>albums of the year, and of his career. call me crazy lol.
>
>V.
Lewis vocally can't get away from soul, though. Even he's admitted that he's suppressing his instincts when he sings straighter (as in on The Lost Album).

he had on Popular...... probably don't dig the new album as much.

I think I would include myself in that group. I don't think the new album is bad. I like it a great deal actually... But it's not like Popular...or on the jungle floor..... both of which i like better than the new album....

I think he could have struck a balance between the garage punk sound and the funk of the previous 2 albums....he didn't have to completely scrap that style....

i really liked Popular and Jungle Floor. and i like the new single but haven't heard the album.

to me with on the Jungle floor, and Popular.... plus even going back before that with the live session stuff he did on KCRW.... THAT Van Hunt was right in what I want to hear in music...soulful..funky...

I have no problem with him coming out of that box, but I think sometimes artists start to overthink stuff and throw out what is working for them to do something else.

like Theolonius Monk said "Do both"

on the new album.
the following songs are not punky and could be deemed "Popular"-ish material:

"designer jeans" (akin to "lowest 1 of my desires").
"falls (violet)" (akin to "n' the southern shade").
"moving targets" (akin to "bits & pieces", but is 'that' slow song he puts on every album beginning with "seconds of pleasure" & continuing with "daredevil, baby").
"it's a mysterious hustle" is the signature closing track that in mood is very much like "the night is young" and "finale (it all ends in tears)".

"plum" (which may be his best track to date) is an extra funky atmospheric cut that coulda fit well on "OTJF". & the title-track is somethin that he hasn't quite done on record before. so it's like 60ish% punky, & the rest not so much and at most, has some rock GUITAR in it, but thats all.

i know we're concentrating on his turn to punkdom, but let's not act like there ain't heaps of past Van Hunt styles on this album. this IS the mix/balance ur talking about, but it comes down to whether or not the average Van fan wants the punky element present at ALL.

V.

Feelings
Character
Her December
Down Here In Hell
At the End of a Slow Dance
Blood From a Heart of Stone
Priest or Police
The Night Is Young
Out of the Sky
Ur Personal Army

not that i need him to stay w/that ^ sound, but i hope the next sound(s) don't make me miss that stuff. i was kinda miffed at the concert b/c i only heard 3 of those songs and 2 had the Punk rearrangement.

>plus even
>going back before that with the live session stuff he did on
>KCRW.... THAT Van Hunt was right in what I want to hear in
>music...soulful..funky...



_________________________________
Reunion Radio Podcasts
Bringing Together Five Decades of R&B/Funk/Soul/Dance

http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

which to me would be the first 2 albums..... the 2 corresponding live KCRW performances.... the acoustic Napster set he did back then (with his version of Al Green's Simply Beautiful).... then of course Popular.... and a couple of jams of the one after that...

all that together I rank Van very high with his peers. All that is exactly what I'm looking for in a newer artist....

he's got to keep that core....and add to it....

cracks me up how a cat who is AARP card holder and yet plays 25 on tv and trying to forever Scott Baio a Career that never was gets even half the attention he does??

i mean he has Randy "Dawg" Jackson hook him up with two Token "Olive Garden" Grammy Awards for what we don't even know?

dude been around 20 years and sold like 200 copies that means he can't even go Hood Platinum in his own neck of the woods.

lets see the ain't gots

no Hit songs

no Hit albums

no memroable performances

no distinictive voice

no distintive hooks or Grooves

dude is a broke alley cat wannabe Neo Soul Hippie corny turkey version of Lenny Kravitz.


and dude is a Never was. he gives 2nd and 3rd tier acts a Bad name, even JourneyMen acts are rated highly than Him.

this turkey doesn't even have half the career of Bobby Valentino.

and him trying to re arrange his songs to Prove something? turkey Please, try having a memorable song first or sing something that we kinda know.

Van Hack is Stank and Wack. no idenity and nothing happening in his music.

thanks. now go away.

your boy just is known around these parts as "BlankMan"

>your boy just is known around these parts as "BlankMan"

maybe YOU can get a hit that way.

>maybe YOU can get a hit that way.

>maybe YOU can get a hit that way.


silk.later Reunion radio with Old P. & Silk http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

"i'm talking about *Balls Deep*....In Love (c)Cleveland Jr.

He was cultivating a fine nigga farm (c)Goldmind.

traffic sees Van hunt and avoid him, just like at the record store and the radio does. BlankMan stays Blank when BlankMan does his tax return and reports his record sales earning to his tax team, it stays blank.

people are checking for him..

lots of solid live stuff...

no lip syncing like R.Kelly...

because they were tired of BlankMan without any real hits.

Van Hunt can play small venues and perform live...no dats..no lip syncing..

at a small venue Kells would be acting out trapped in the closet like some cheap play staring cherly pepsi riley and stoney jackson..lol.

I'll take Van Hunt 8 days a week over Kells..

to each his own.

ain't like Randy "Dawng" Jackson just handed him a care package for attending the grammys and hooked him up with two grammys for being there. obviously somebody has spent some cheedar on that turkey or he wouldn't be getting no gigs.

Kellz has performed live with a band many a time and again Van Hunt on one of his shows mentioned that a label excutive at his label told him he sould ask Kellz for a hit and Van Hunt made a joke out of it.

yeah each and to there own, however to not think that said artist ain't looking for a hit is comedy to me, because if dude had a hit right now believe me his base wouldn't be looking at him sideways, crossed eyed and crazy for switching things up as he has recently on stage.

underground cats don't get handed out grammys.

if Kellz gets Cheryl Pepsi Riley and Stoney Jackson to act out "trapped in the closet" then I guess that means with Van Hunts budget he gets Mya and Sinbad to do a play on what was his hit song again????????? Laugh on that One.

>if Kellz gets Cheryl Pepsi Riley and Stoney Jackson to act out
>"trapped in the closet" then I guess that means with Van Hunts
>budget he gets Mya and Sinbad to do a play on what was his hit
>song again????????? Laugh on that One.

different music.

He makes the music he wants to make. More power too him.

R.Kelly may have more hits..but he has more cornball lyrics, and lip syncing performances over dats too..

bottom line he can't and if he was to come right on here now I'd say yo, stop wasting toliet paper and make a flush with a real hit song or a memorable song for a change and stop squeezing the Charmin!!

turkey been around 20 years and ain't even made a song as memroable as what Rome did back in 97/98.

even Me Phi Me got a better track record than Van Hunt.

Kellz did Van Hunt's aka BlankMan whole career on a song almost 20 years back. Kellz would sniggle that jive turkey off a stage and out of a studio.

gotta have talent and cuts to hang with Kellz.

Kellz be making tracks with our Brothers and sisters in the Motherland while your Boy Van Hunt aka Blankman is scratching Monopoly tickets at the local Mcdonalds after a gig in the back of the parking lot. and guess what Cool? He still comes up with a Blank because he is known as BlankMan.

i literally LOL'd.

>i saw him in concert this past Friday.
>
>there was a disconnect between him and the audience. a friend
>who attended w/me pointed it out. she'd never heard of Van
>until i told her about the show and she'd never heard his
>stuff. she said she liked the show but could feel the
>disconnect throughout most of it. it felt like the audience
>didn't get the show they came for, she said. and i think she
>was right.
>
>the 'problem' was VH had rearranged most of his earlier
>Funk/R&B songs into garage band/power Rock songs. and the
>rearrangements worked sometimes, but usually didn't. most
>times the rearranged songs were unrecognizable. i mean, i
>love 'Her December', but hearing a damn-near Thrash Metal
>version of it didn't do it for me. i didn't even know the
>song until he got to the chorus. he messed w/'Character' too,
>but i was determined to enjoy that 1 b/c that's MY JAM. it
>was difficult to get into it.
>
>what's the deal? is this his thing now? is the new album
>like that too?


silk.later Reunion radio with Old P. & Silk http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

"i'm talking about *Balls Deep*....In Love (c)Cleveland Jr.

He was cultivating a fine nigga farm (c)Goldmind.

if i'd been prepared for it i would've enjoyed it more.

you may not have my experience after having read this post b/c you won't be caught unaware.

>if i'd been prepared for it i would've enjoyed it more.
>
>you may not have my experience after having read this post b/c
>you won't be caught unaware.

I thought maybe he was doing a Miles Davis lol !!! But, for the most part, i'm psyched about this show tonight.



silk.later Reunion radio with Old P. & Silk http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

"i'm talking about *Balls Deep*....In Love (c)Cleveland Jr.

He was cultivating a fine nigga farm (c)Goldmind.

da hell does that mean?


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"It is better to be silent and thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt"

likes the packaged you more than the real you.

We've seen this play out with Kelly Clarkson or whatever her name is... when she did what she wanted her core audience wasn't feeling it.

Create a side band or new project if you want to do something different but don't complain when you sold out to get on and now you want to switch it up.

I would be pissed if I went to a Van Hunt show and he came out the punk/grunge closet.

to the contrary..

I think they just prefer the more soulful funkier version....

it's all really variations of his real self....

>to the contrary..
>
>I think they just prefer the more soulful funkier version....
>
>it's all really variations of his real self....


but Van Hunt comes off like the first album wasn't his real self in the interview.

Core fans like his debut sound... I don't think his core fans knew anything about those songs having a punk sound when he was creating them.

the actual album itself..

in fact his live sets from that time is what got me to really dig dude because I was a bit luke warm on the album..

the rawness and funkiness of the live sets....both the music and the vocals is what appealled to me from the live stuff.

>da hell does that mean?
>
>
>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>"It is better to be silent and thought a fool than to open
>your mouth and remove all doubt"

.......last night, that wasn't the case. Miles was known for not really interacting with the crowd.

silk.later Reunion radio with Old P. & Silk http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

"i'm talking about *Balls Deep*....In Love (c)Cleveland Jr.

He was cultivating a fine nigga farm (c)Goldmind.

I haven't listened to his last two projects, but it's interesting to read about your reaction to his show. I think the disconnect might be that a lot of his audience, doesn't really want to hear his tendencies towards rock.

Unfortunately, we had to leave before he came on when he came through, but from what I could tell, the audience appeared to be there to hear what he did on the first two albums. Not sure if he had an opener, but he had some Strokes-lite type band (Empress Hotel) open up for him down here and the reaction was polite.

Of course that might have had more to do with their mediocrity than anything, but their rock leanings didn't appear to go over well with the crowd. We had to bounce before VH came on, but the energy was kinda low when we did, and I honestly didn't care about leaving.

they got a polite response. lol

>they got a polite response. lol

.......chick, that was dancing in front of me. I mean, i wasn't that impressed by them, but hey, if she liked them, then i loved them.

silk.later Reunion radio with Old P. & Silk http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

"i'm talking about *Balls Deep*....In Love (c)Cleveland Jr.

He was cultivating a fine nigga farm (c)Goldmind.

>

I dug it,but i was annoyed by two songs, that he rearranged. Because i really liked the original arrangements (one was "Her December" and i can't remember the other song, at this time). But, for the most part, it was a great show. I like how the keyboardist was trying to give the show a spacey type vibe. He left quick as hell, once they were done lol !!! I was hoping to get a picture, at least.

silk.later Reunion radio with Old P. & Silk http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

"i'm talking about *Balls Deep*....In Love (c)Cleveland Jr.

He was cultivating a fine nigga farm (c)Goldmind.

not mad at ALL at the re-arrangements/live versions of the songs
that first album is 7 years old already!!!
& to be real, i was never into the second album (that wack ass producer they brought it in totally killed the vibe/sound to me)
so i was actually relieved to hear the new versions of those songs


shit, i'd even go as far as to say he needs to release a live album

ps - and his drummer?!?!?!
crazy.



www.FRESHselects.net

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everyone's been sayin she's off the chain.

V.

I honestly like his live sets better than the albums.

>not mad at ALL at the re-arrangements/live versions of the
>songs
>that first album is 7 years old already!!!
>& to be real, i was never into the second album (that wack ass
>producer they brought it in totally killed the vibe/sound to
>me)
>so i was actually relieved to hear the new versions of those
>songs
>
>
>shit, i'd even go as far as to say he needs to release a live
>album
>
>ps - and his drummer?!?!?!
>crazy.
>
>
>
>www.FRESHselects.net
>
>FRSH SLCTS - out now:
>Illmaculate x G_Force - The Green Tape http://bit.ly/frKjhn
>Hi-Res - Beats For The Ride http://t.co/MSY1IqaV
>Planet Asia x G_Force - Camouflage Jackets - OCT. 13th!
>
>@FRESHselects
>http://facebook.com/FRSHSLCTS


silk.later Reunion radio with Old P. & Silk http://reunionradio.blogspot.com/

"i'm talking about *Balls Deep*....In Love (c)Cleveland Jr.

He was cultivating a fine nigga farm (c)Goldmind.